Why PlayStation Move Will Beat Project Natal And The Wii

GameBrit writes: "The Nintendo Wii has shown the masses that motion controls are popular. Not just for those who already class gaming as a hobby, but also for people who have never even played or enjoyed a games console before. This has led to the Wii being the current leader in sales followed by the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3. Naturally both Microsoft and Sony have seen this success and now want a piece of the motion based pie. This has culminated in Project Natal, a camera based option, and the PlayStation Move combination from Sony, featuring a camera alongside Wiimote and Nunchuck style devices. So with both vying for the crown of the motion controlled world, which one has what it takes to topple the Wii? My money is on Sony's offering, and this is why."

[qface64]

i don't see it happening

[dangert12]

Yes no 1 would have a wii unless its the zelda mario etc fans
and natal lagged up plus a RROD PRONE 360 would of killed ms prematurely this gen

but thats not the case so know i think

some people will see 'move' and think im not buying a ps3 and then move or hw mch they will cost bundled when its liturly a wii

project natal will seem new to casual no mater what the ps3 eyetoy can do its never been marketed in the sense natal will be or described as a console

[mabreu]

It's like playing Gran Turismo 5 with a racing wheel and foot pedals. Sure it cost around $100 bucks but it's worth it. Also, look at Rock Band and all of the equipment needed to play it. Motion control doesn't need to be released with a system like the Wii, It can do just fine as an optional way of playing current games.

[WIIIS1]

My prediction is that Move will be the LEAST successful of the 3, for the simple reason that it is the most optional device of the 3 console systems. For Wii, the whole console concept is defined by the Wii Mote, so the success of the console will as much ensure the success of the Wii Mote as vice versa. Natal is a periphery to the 360, but it appears to be a dedicated system to motion control games as much as it is also an optional device, and there will be games designed specially for Natal rather than just support it, or at least that is my impression. Move however seems to be simply an optional accessory, and if so, I don't see why people will buy into it.

[Christopher]

These type of articles are only intended to flame the idiotic console war and nothing else. There's nothing we can say that will truly shine a light on who will 'win' or if anyone will really 'win' in the end, other than Nintendo who are already winners.

I refuse to give these sites any hits for putting up articles that really have no purpose or use other than twisting words to get people to comment on them on their site.

[Montrealien]

it just is, don`t do it kids.

[Death2494]

this and then reply on this article.

[Danny Dan]

Playstation Move could overcome Natal as far as motion functionality goes and even sales. The way I'm thinking of it is pretty logical, the PS Move isn't revolutionary but it does base off something already successful, the Wii. First thing is first, A LOT of Wii games are going to be ported to the PS3, quickly try to upgrade the graphics and boom! More games on the PS3. After a while... games will start to be created FIRST on the PS3 then ported to the Wii. So now all 3rd party companies working on only Nintendo platforms will bring their games to the PS3, making the Wii not only graphically obsolete but their "exclusive games" will all be multiplatform, leaving only Nintendo games exclusive. This alone will greatly increase sales for the Move and all Sony has to do is just sell the peripheral. Capitalizing off of Nintendo and stealing market share. Sony wins at its goal.

Natal is unproven, we don't know much about it and we haven't seen any working games, so I really can't say much about it but just be optimistic about its potential. Assuming it works like its intended, it can be great but there's so much doubt, hardly any news, a developer speaking out negatively, it all kind of worries me. Who knows, MS can really surprise us this E3, and just drop a bomb on everyone.

[Bigpappy]

Because Sony said so!

[King_of _the_Casuals]

What a classic Fanboy article! But as I may agree that Move will be the best of the bunch tech wise....it does not have a chance to win. Why???

1.It has NOOO Hype. Since it was first introduced the Media has labeled the MOVE as a Wii wanabe. You and I may know it's not but the casual gamer won't/ They'll see wand, nunchuk, videogame = Wii. Compare that to Natal which is being promoted as this NEW great technology and it stands no chance. Like it or not but the Mass Media LOVES Natal and there excitement will generate sales. Just like Hype worked for the Wii.

2. It has NOOO Market. Our PS3 is a technological monster...better then the other 2 systems. But with all these Bells and whistles came...a higher price point. So when it came time for parents to buy a system for there kids, they chose the cheaper system. And Motion controls are aimed at kids and casual gamers....who wouldn't pay that much more for a PS3. We mock the 360 about "Xbox Live" being full of kids. Well these kids are the ones that are gonna get motion control...not us hardcore gamers. It's not for us!

3. It will be the most expensive. Wii already has an established share of the market so there prices are now cheaper. Natal is a camera and will not require any additional control purchases. But MOVE is the newest tech and will require Wand and Nunchuk purchases. Matter of fact, fighting games will require 2 WANDS (not nunchuks) WANDS! To fight another person in front of your tv you will need 4 WANDS!!! now that's expensive!

4. Sony doesn't know how to market.

[Fierce Musashi]

You see, these simple motion controls is what gets the eye of the casual/non-gamer broader audience. Keep in mind, they don't care for power if all they are looking for is a simple gaming experence. When it comes down to it, the Wii is the way to go for them when prices start getting compared. Why pay extra for pretty much the exact same experence? If (IF) Sony is indeed trying to steal the Wii's thunder then they are going to have to give the PS3 a price cut as well as bundle the controller and a game or two in order to compete, considering that the controller (to my knowing) is sold seprately.

If you started gaming and were just looking for a machine to pick up and play, would you buy a high price console as well as the motion add-ons or the more accessible console at a far lower price?

[dannylilley]

A very good point indeed and one which outlines the reason why the Wii has been so successful so far.
On the other hand the PlayStation 3 could offer a full package of entertainment i.e. motion controls for the whole family (with the casual games), a hardcore gaming console for those who want to sit down to play games with a standard controller, a blu-ray player for movie watching and of course PlayTV + BBCiPlayer for TV watching. A higher price for sure but adding all that in it could satisfy a wider range of uses.

[ChickeyCantor]

"Keep in mind, they don't care for power if all they are looking for is a simple gaming experence. When it comes down to it, the Wii is the way to go for them"

I think you are wrong.
Its not that they dont care for great looking games and the things it can do.
Its Nintendo who captured them with their marketing.
I wont be surprised if they see Move and say : " Wait isn't that like the Wii? ".

Nintendo is leader with the motion controls, People associate Motion controls to Nintendo.
If sony did it first and they succeeded people would say " casual gamers dont care for SD GFX".

And anyone loves simple games, thats why MW is selling so well...

[Fierce Musashi]

The controller itself as well as the primary the controls are simple to understand, making the experience easy and accessible for anyone. I'm not saying marketing has little to do with anything, rather what gets the eye of them and is more accessible.

The Wii console comes with the Wiimote as it's primary controller and a game, all while remaining the least expensive. The simple controls, along with other elements, makes it the most accessible. Are they, just looking for a simple accessible gaming experience from a home console, serious going to pay more just to have better graphics? I'm not saying the broader audience aren't always going to see it like that, some might want extra features and what not, but the majority of them wouldn't really care.

I know they are the leader when it comes to MC. They made it the primary controls. The move is obviously going to get compared to the Wiimote by anyone who knows anything about the Wii, because it's final design looks clearly like somewhat of a rip.

[Michael Myers]

if playstation move beats natal the wii will be next, but im not for motion...to purchas a hd gaming system like the ps3 for motion control would be...insane

[matey]

look guys the ps3 want doesnt even do as many things as the wiimote the wiimote has infared camera in the controller itself and can detect where it is pointing all the time with out the need for IR,or the sensor bar silent hill/fatal frame 4 uses this for the tourch plus the wii is 1on1 accurate for IR pointing in fps games ign said that the socom ps3 demo was poor and has way too much lag i dont think the early wii attemts have any lag what so ever infact u can even fine tune the experience on the fps controls to suit ie conduit,metroid prime 3 has the best controls because its 60frames per second,plus the ps3 wand looks stupid and can only be detected through the camera the wiimote is leaps and bounds above this ps3 controller ign even said that the ps3 1st party attemts at the show were not even on par with 3rd partys 1st gen attemts on the wii that says the wiimote is better the new tigerwoods has truview on the wii because its using the motionplus and the infared camera as far as i know this mode isnt present in the ps3 version due to technical issues sorry guys but the truth at the moment is that the wiimote is alot more advanced and SONY and MICROSOFT are finding out the hard way fact lets see how tigerwoods 2011 turns out that should prove my point that the wii has the superior motion controls lets see the wiimote has alot going on and has proved itself in every sport game out there even PES 2009/2010 have amazing controls made possible by the wiimote with out motion plus yes alot of people forget the wiimote alone is very powerful look at the original wii sports bowling,tennis,golf,ect wow is the expression i heard out of peoples mouths when playing this can ps3wand do the same i dont think so natal has no chance so forget that device there is very little promise for ps3 wand

[cyborg6971]

Surely you can't be serious the wiimote more powerful. Motion is for old folks and noobs. But to quote ign is stupid socom was an alpha build and lag was minimal and can be worked out.

[kneon]

The design of the wiimote is backwards in that it is very easy for the wiimote to point away from the TV which causes the Wii to lose track of the position. The Move is designed the other way around so it doesn't matter which way the wand is pointing, it will still be detected as long as you are in the field of view of the PSeye. And if you aren't in the field of view then I guess it doesn't matter as you probably can't see the TV anyway.

[n4gno]

You are leaving in a world of illusions and dreams and repeat bullcraps you are believing, ps move is the perfect wii controler nintendo has never had, simple fact (1/1, no battery, etc)

[matey]

the wii will deliver the full gaming experience because it will have classic pro for games like tatsunoko vs capcom,pro evo,smash bros brawl,ect and has the best motion controls for games like ZELDA wii ect plus ur in the land of nod if u think that any game ps3 put out will top Wii ZELDA with full motion plus support,plus online is getting a boost this year with moster hunter 3 the online has been put next to world of warcraft yes try reading what devs say about there games the online in that game will be full on more in line with a pc infastructure read this in official nintendo magazine and capcom have some more games that are as big as MH3 coming to wii this year maybe even better graphics because they now have wii version of MT Framework

[n4gno]

You are for sure a casual gamer in a delusional world, not a single real gamer can be satisfied with the mediocre motion control and really poor library of the wii, when ps3 has the best games, and way more games, since 2 years and for a long time, like the ps2 vs gamecube was (i don't even talk about graphic gap, technic gap, variety and adult games, bluray, and all the stuff the wii can't compete, it's a nice toy, in a different league)

[Kakkoii]

This guy doesn't seem to be aware of the fact that Natal isn't just using a camera like the PS Eye. Natal also has an infrared sensor and an infrared light emitter. It doesn't matter what's going on with the light levels in your house, it's not operating on that wavelength. It's only looking at infrared wavelength light, which it's also controlling the amount of.

Another fact critics seem to be missing is that you aren't forced to stop using your controller when Natal is plugged in. This seems to be one of the biggest points critics try to make, even though it's epicly flawed. If a game requires precise movements and/or a controller, then you can use your damn controller in conjunction with Natal. Natal will merely be there to ENHANCE the experience.

Oh and if you hit disagree, please leave a comment stating what part you disagree with and why.

*PC Gamer, own neither the 360 or PS3*

[dannylilley]

It seems I stand corrected about the light side of things.

As for NATAL being there to enhance the experience, I do agree with you, however there will likely be games that can only be controlled by NATAL and that's where it may fall down in terms of accuracy. Naturally there's plenty of time for it to become more precise and I look forward to not being able to say that once I have a go on the finished product.

[plb]

^^ The thing about Natal is that it can get firmware updates same as xbox live to work out bugs, add features, etc.

[360fanboi]

Natal has Infrared?
nuuu nuuu nuuuuuu! it haz lazors! /s

[plb]

Please stop stating facts in your posts, this is n4g afterall. BTW, Natal also has voice and facial recognition capabilities something which most people seem to leave out also. MS has slowly gotten me to regain faith in them. Had this been 10 years ago I'd never believe MS's word but MS has been on quite the role lately, Windows 7, Windows Phone 7, all the great xbox exclusives this year. etc etc. I'll wait until E3 to cast judgement but it's ridiculous to say Natal is just eyetoy lol. Did anyone see the eyepet video at gametrailers..the pet was just walking over people...that thing is just a webcam. no sense of depth and 3d objects like Natal.

[Parapraxis]

PSEye also has voice and facial recognition capabilities something which most people seem to leave out.

[Nicaragua]

All the things you list as plus points for Natal can already be done on other devices.

Any device which has a microphone has voice recognition. Voice recognition is all software and has already been done on games like Endwar and Hawx - its nothing new. Furthermore the PSeye already has a microphone so it too can do voice recognition.

Facial recognition - same as above but substitute microphone for camera. Oh look PSeye has a camera too.

You point about using a controller in conjunction with Natal is reasonable but what kind of purpose would Natal serve then ? If its just head tracking then PSeye can do that too.

The only thing that Natal does that the PSeye cant is full body skeletal tracking but we've yet to be shown this working in anything other than lame tech demo's. Once i see it working in a real game then i'll be convinced - until then its just an eyetoy with a few whistles and bells.

[ATLGAMER]

Comment of the year...

[Kakkoii]

@Nicaragua:

I didn't deny the PS Eye could do facial recognition or voice recognition. And sure any microphone can technically do voice recognition. But does that make all microphones equal at doing it? Hell no. The PS Eye and Natal have multi-array microphones, which are better at breaking down the sound for voice recognition. Who has a better microphone for it is unknown though.

Facial recognition is same as above but quality of camera comes into play instead. Natal supposedly has a higher resolution camera, allowing for more precise measurement. Not to mention it's able to use it's infrared sensor to see the depth of facial features, and the true 3D outline of a person. Thus it doesn't have to worry about trying to properly find the outline of a person amidst all the surrounding colors.

And yes PSEye can do that to an extent. But Natal can do it better for the reason I stated above. And it's not just head tracking. Say your playing a game like Halo. Well you could throw a grenade with your arm and have Natal track the speed of your arm movement to judge throwing distance of the grenade. Which would enhance the experience.

But for FPS games, motion capture game-play is a bit limited in usefulness in it's current form. And probably will be until the day we have full body/sensory immersion virtual reality for games.

So because you have not seen the full body skeleton demo working in an actual already release game, you brush it off as marketing fluff? That's a bit stupid. The tech demo's it's shown off in are "games". Sure, their not AAA titles from a big developer. But they are games none the less, showing that it works. There's no reason to say it can't be implemented into future games from other developers.

In the end, Natal is just about opening up new gaming possibilities. Not trying to replace the controller in every single scenario.

[Biggest]

Kakkoii, you seem to be lost as to what you're trying to say and what others are saying. You started off by saying that Natal does all of these wonderful things. It's supposed to be controller free control, according to Microsoft. But then you point out that you can still use the controller. But then you say that you can play Halo and throw grenades with your hands. But then you say FPS games won't really work with motion yet. You point out voice and facial recognition as if they are new. You point out depth in the 3d space, but then discount the fact that other systems do it better. You finish by saying that the Natal is there as a choice. You do realize that all of what you said is right now being perfected by the competing console team, right? The GDC presentation showed every part of what you and others can only speculate about on the Natal. I'm not saying anything about the Move beating anyone right now. I just hope that you and others are completely ignoring what it has proven it can do and hoping for something equal. Hope is great sometimes. But when there is someone already doing what you hope for, why waste the wishing stars?

[Nicaragua]

Sorry but i just dont get where you are going with your post.

You acknowledge that both devices can do voice and face recognition so why are you using it as a plus point for Natal ? You seem to think that Natal will somehow do it better than the PSeye due to its infrared sensors, i think that its mostly software based so they will both be as good as each other - honestly though facial recognition is such a niche feature that who cares if one does it slightly better than the other ?

As for your grenade throwing example then its ridiculous. Who would choose to do a full whiplash arm gesture rather than press a button on a pad ? Its pure gimmick and something that nobody in their right mind would choose as a viable gameplay mechanic.

And yeah, i havent seen the skeleton tech used in a game or even how it potentially might be used in a game. So its not that im brushing it off as mraketing fluff - IT IS MARKETING FLUFF, and it will remain so until they show a realistic working application.

Look, i like games and so if Natal turns out to be sh1t hot then i will buy it. However what i have seen so far is lame so im not going to suck up Microsofts PR speel until i see something that lives up to the hype.

[Kakkoii]

@Biggest:

No, you're merely misunderstanding. You're splitting apart my paragraphs sentences into individual statements instead of reading them as a whole and in the context of a response to what Nicaragua was saying. When I said you could throw a grenade, that was in the context of Natal enhancing the experience. In a situation where you're still using your remote to play Halo, but you could quickly lift one arm and throw to throw a grenade. And I was agreeing that with FPS games motion tracking like Natal can't replace remotes. That we would need a more advanced far away in the future system like I explained.

And I didn't point voice and facial recognition as if they were new. I was pointing out that Natal has employed extra technology to do the facial recognition BETTER. And as for the voice recognition, I was neutral on that one, as they both have multi-array microphone setups.

On depth in 3D space, what "better systems" would you be talking about? Yes there are better 3D space camera systems out there that have been invented. But that's not what were talking about here. We're comparing the PSEye and Natal, that is all. Nobodies arguing that Natal is using the most advanced camera technology ever invented, but merely the best a console has used yet.

And I'm not denying that the PSEye can do body tracking and facial recognition. That wasn't at all what my post was about. The point I was making is that Natal has the hardware to do it BETTER and more precisely.

And it has nothing to do with hope. I don't own a 360, nor do I plan too.

[n4gno]

like eye toy..

*ps3 games, goty 2008, 2009, 2010, own pc games*

[Nicaragua]

Look, your starting to ramble random stuff now – I don’t mention 3d depth sensors and more advanced camera’s ANYWHERE in either of my posts so if your going to reply and argue back then at least argue back against points that im arguing for.

You think (assume) that Natal will do facial recognition better than PSeye due to it having a infrared camera – I say, they both do the same thing so who is to say that one does it better just because it accomplishes it via different technology ? The end result is identical so having all the infrared technology in the world dosnt change the fact that it can be achieved just as well on a normal camera. That aside it’s a total gimmick – Pseye has been able to recognize faces for years so why hasn’t it featured in more games ? Its because it is an utterly useless feature so Natal being able to do the same is nothing to get excited about.

I’ll say again that your grenade throwing example is ridiculous – if I was throwing a grenade by thought control then that would be something to get excited about, throwing a grenade by letting go of a pad and whiplashing my arm at the TV is just a gimmick which dosnt add precision and control – it actually takes away control by making you release the pad ! So what use is Natal plus joypad if you have to keep letting go of the pad ?

Stop speculating about Natals possibilities based on Microsofts PR hype – show me the tech being used in real life applications and then you have an argument.

[Kakkoii]

@Nicaragua:

Did you not read the @biggest part at the start of my last post? It means it was in reply to biggest, not you. So obviously there was stuff in the post being replied to of which you never talked about.

Now onto your second paragraph:
Who is to say it does it because it's different technology? Lol? Really? Did you even think that through at all? That's like saying "Who is to say Core i7 can do a better job than Pentium 4 just because it's different technology?" Sure, if you have no knowledge of how CPU's work, that might seem like a valid statement to you. But if you actually do have some knowledge about it, you understand why this "different" technology can do it better. The differences that allow it to do a better job. I guess I'll try explaining to you why an infrared camera can help do the job better, hopefully you will be able to understand.

Normal facial recognition with a normal RGB camera like the PSEye has is done completely through software. The software has to guess based on the jumbled mess of colors in the image where the outline of every part of you is. The ability of such a system is very limited, especially based on light levels, environment and the colors of the persons body and cloths. Now when you add an infrared camera to the mix in combination with the original camera, you have an extra image-set for the software to extrapolate the bodies edges from. Since the infrared doesn't see colors but merely infrared light decay values for sensing depth, the computer is then able to get an EXACT outline of the person. It then takes the outline shown in the monochrome infrared image and cuts it out of the RGB cameras image. And VOILA! You have a perfect cutout of the person to use for perfect tracking and facial recognition.

That is why this "different" technology is better than just an RGB camera.

Now onto the grenade example.. I was just using that as an example of a situation were Natal could be used in conjunction with a remote. It's up to developers to think of interesting ideas. But on the subject anyway, you say it doesn't add any precision or control, which is wrong. In most FPS games, you throw the grenade and it goes a set distance based on how high you aim. But by throwing with your arm instead, you would have control over the power of the throw depending on the speed of your arm. So you could easily lob it over a wall, over hurl it over a building. It adds more interactivity to the game. And your only letting go of the controller with one hand, for a couple seconds at most. Usually in an FPS it takes you that amount of time, if not more to plot out how your going to throw the grenade with the games trajectory system.

"And yeah, i havent seen the skeleton tech used in a game or even how it potentially might be used in a game. So its not that im brushing it off as mraketing fluff - IT IS MARKETING FLUFF, and it will remain so until they show a realistic working application."

Ummm, have you not seen any of the Natal tech demo videos? The most popular one around being the Richochet game?

It being played on Late Night with Jimmy Fallon:
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

Project Natal channel with many more celebrities and whatnot trying it out:
http://www.youtube.com/user...

http://projectnatalgames.or...

Popular Science article on how it actually works:
http://www.popsci.com/gadge...

Someone who worked on Project Natal:
http://procrastineering.blo...

Also, you seem to be projecting some sort of attitude onto me. Replying as if I'm hyping Natal and saying it will revolutionize gaming. That's not what I'm doing here at all. The only thing I'm doing here is defending the fact that Natal has hardware for doing these jobs better than the PSEye can. I'm a tech enthusiast who likes to defend the facts of technology.

[Nicaragua]

OK lets roll with your CPU example.

An i7 CPU is better than a P4 – that’s a no brainer and when you come to things like video games or HD video editing then you will see a massive difference in performance between the two. However if you were to use a program that wasn’t particularly intensive then you wouldn’t see much of a difference between the 2, say something like internet explorer. In both cases you would be browsing the internet in seconds with zero noticeable difference between the two pieces of tech.

So now we have Natal which has its newer tech which when it comes to voice and face recognition is still only accomplishing the exact same thing as a pre-existing piece of tech with zero notable advantage for all its supposed technical superiority.

So now our conversation goes something like this:

“Natal is Better”
“they do the same thing”
“but Natal has better tech”
“they do the same thing”
“but Natal does it better”
“the end result is the same”

I 100% agree that Natal has the better tech with its infra-red camera’s but my point is that it dosnt accomplish anything that the PSeye dosnt already do so to me its just an over-engineered gimmick. You can argue all day about light levels etc but until both units capabilities can be judged side by side then its all speculation. What I can tell you is that the PSeye works fine for all those things your mention except full skeletal tracking.

And yes I had seen the ricochet demo – I’d already acknowledged that Natal does skeletal tracking and to be honest I find that demo cringeworthy due to the lag and also that such a lame concept is one of the only demo’s that MS are using to promote what is being touted as a gaming revolution.

Also you need to give it up with the grenade example. No FPS gamer is going to let go of a pad mid-game for a few seconds, its simply ridiculous. You’re a PC gamer right ? would you let go of your mouse for a few second to hurl something at your screen and then proclaim that a revolution in control and accuracy ?

[Kakkoii]

@Nicaragua:

Actually you are able to see difference between the 2 processors on non intensive programs. Because the i7 is capable of doing the operations quicker than the Pentium 4.

And no, the conversation seems to be going more like this:

“Natal is Better”
“they do the same thing, because I said so!”
“but Natal has better tech”
“they do the same thing, because I said so!”
“but Natal does it better”
“the end result is the same, because I said so!”

You make claims that Natal does it no better, with no proof to back up your claims. Whereas I explain why Natal CAN do it better, by explaining how the sensors work and why it would be able to do it better. And not once have I said Microsoft has shown off facial recognition demo's that outshine the PSEye's past examples. But I've merely been saying that Natal is capable of doing it much better. (Microsoft hasn't really shown off much facial recognition demo's yet.)

And no, the PSEye does not work that fine for facial recognition, and especially cutting a person out of an image properly. I've seen their demo's. There's a ton of massive jaggies (which they usually blend out, leaving a huge gradient sort of glow around the person), and parts being cut out that aren't part of the person. This is because the PSEye only has the RGB information to go off of, and has to do mostly guess work. Whereas with the infrared outline of the person in Natal, there's no guesswork needed to be done. Your provided with a precise outline to cut the person or object out of and track much easier.

"Also you need to give it up with the grenade example. No FPS gamer is going to let go of a pad mid-game for a few seconds, its simply ridiculous. You’re a PC gamer right ? would you let go of your mouse for a few second to hurl something at your screen and then proclaim that a revolution in control and accuracy ? "

Actually yes I would, because the time my hand's away from the mouse isn't much different than the time it normally takes to hide and line up your throw in the game. It's not like my mouse goes wandering off somewhere. I lift my hand, throw, then place my hand back down on the mouse. Pretty damn easy, and adds a new level of INTERACTIVITY to the game. Maybe it's not your cup of tea, maybe you have no imagination, I don't know. But I'd be all for it.

[Nicaragua]

My own PC is an i7 and to say that there is a noticeable difference between an i7 opening IE and a P4 opening IE is laughable – there is zero noticeable difference to the end user despite the massive difference in technology. With any hardware and software application there is a point where increase in performance is negligible, despite increases in hardware technology.

As for Natal then I am specifically talking about the facial and voice recognition – I have said in pretty much every one of my posts that I acknowledge that Natal does full skeletal body tracking better than the PSeye could, so try and stick with the conversation at hand because we are only talking about face and voice recognition.

PSeye can do what Natal does just as well despite Natal having a fancier infra-red camera.

Now you say I have no proof of my claims, that’s fair enough since I don’t have a Natal unit. So you prove to me (don’t preach at me or speculate based on specification, show me proof) that all Natal’s extra whistles and bells do a noticeably better job of face and voice recognition than the PSeye and that this will impact the end user experience. Ive seen all the tech demo’s, all the smoke and mirrors concepts from last years E3, and all the various appearances since and I have seen nothing that validates your claims.

Your grenade analogy really is becoming seriously silly – no serious gamer in their right mind would do what you are suggesting. If you think its such a good idea then simply map your grenade throwing button away from your mouse to your F1 key, and lets see what happens to your Kill Death ratio on your FPS of choice.. Why do you think gamers buy a mouse with more than two buttons on it ? Oh yeah – its so they don’t have to move their hands away from their mouse to perform actions !

You think I have no imagination – no problem. I think your talking utter sh1t in defence of a device which brings very little new to the gaming world and is a pure gimmick. Still, im looking forward to your response which will prove me wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt – unless of course you just keep repeating the same old jibberish.

Proof please or STFU.

[Kakkoii]

@Nicaragua:

»"My own PC is an i7 and to say that there is a noticeable difference between an i7 opening IE and a P4 opening IE is laughable – there is zero noticeable difference to the end user despite the massive difference in technology. With any hardware and software application there is a point where increase in performance is negligible, despite increases in hardware technology."«

Have you benchmarked the performance of IE on your i7 system compared to a P4 system? No? Well then, you have no idea what your talking about. The faster RAM speed alone brought on by the use of DDR3 allows for IE and any application to run noticeably faster.

And of course there is a point where increases become negligible. But we are far from that point haha. And you obviously have basic knowledge about computer hardware, so don't even try to act like you're an expert on this.
----------------------------- ------------------------------ - -----------------------------

»"As for Natal then I am specifically talking about the facial and voice recognition – I have said in pretty much every one of my posts that I acknowledge that Natal does full skeletal body tracking better than the PSeye could, so try and stick with the conversation at hand because we are only talking about face and voice recognition."«

You must have quite poor comprehension of the English language then, because I stuck entirely to the topic. Replying to each part of your post.
----------------------------- ------------------------------ - -----------------------------

»"PSeye can do what Natal does just as well despite Natal having a fancier infra-red camera.

Now you say I have no proof of my claims, that’s fair enough since I don’t have a Natal unit. So you prove to me (don’t preach at me or speculate based on specification, show me proof) that all Natal’s extra whistles and bells do a noticeably better job of face and voice recognition than the PSeye and that this will impact the end user experience. Ive seen all the tech demo’s, all the smoke and mirrors concepts from last years E3, and all the various appearances since and I have seen nothing that validates your claims."«

Again, I've explained why that's not true. This sort of thing doesn't require a benchmark or side by side demo to prove. All it takes is a fair understanding of how facial recognition and image processing software works. The extra infrared image source provides the software with a much better image to work with, this is simple computing fact, there's no video proof needed. Sadly I cannot make you understand this, as it would take quite some time to teach you all the required tech knowledge.
----------------------------- ------------------------------ - -----------------------------

»"Your grenade analogy really is becoming seriously silly – no serious gamer in their right mind would do what you are suggesting. If you think its such a good idea then simply map your grenade throwing button away from your mouse to your F1 key, and lets see what happens to your Kill Death ratio on your FPS of choice.. Why do you think gamers buy a mouse with more than two buttons on it ? Oh yeah – its so they don’t have to move their hands away from their mouse to perform actions!"«

Please try thinking about what I said before you go off on your little rants. That argument is completely fallacious for the very fact that merely reassigning the key doesn't add any more functionality or interactivity to the gameplay. All that would be doing is delaying button press time. Whereas when throwing with your hand, you're given more finite control over the trajectory and speed of your grenade. So you're trading the ease and speed of a mouse, for the better interactivity and control of physically throwing. And at least for me, throwing a grenade in this way would make the game more fun.
----------------------------- ------------------------------ - -----------------------------

»"You think I have no imagination – no problem. I think your talking utter sh1t in defence of a device which brings very little new to the gaming world and is a pure gimmick. Still, im looking forward to your response which will prove me wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt – unless of course you just keep repeating the same old jibberish."«

Sorry that something becomes jibberish just because you lack the knowledge to understand it.

[Nicaragua]

Yup, just like i thought - no proof.

Keep telling yourself that you know best and that you just cant explain it to someone as ignorant as me, because your superior technical knowledge wouldnt translate well to my uneducated ears.

The fact is your speculating with zero (other than Microsoft hype) to back it up.

[Kakkoii]

@Nicaragua:

Wrong. I explained why the infrared camera can do the job much better from a technical standpoint. But you fail to understand it, writing it off as "jibberish". Or perhaps you're too blinded by ignorance to accept it.

And I don't know best, but I do know better than you when it comes to the subject of technology. It's been a passion of mine since I was a young teen. I also do 3D modeling, animation, rendering, digital art, and dabble in some programming of various languages. I have been what one might call a super nerd for about 8 years, for 4 of those years I was even in deep depression and spent all of my time on the internet just doing research on new computer technology, how the architectures work and participating in debates such as these. So it's easy for me to understand why the infrared image data is a big help to the computer in doing facial recognition and body tracking.

And it's not about dumbing it down, but merely about you lacking the software/computing knowledge to truly understand the advantage that extra data set gives. And there's sadly nothing I can do about that. Especially for someone who is so ignorant and immature with their replies. You tell me I think I know best, when in fact that is exactly how you are acting. Unwilling to try and understand since your views are already set in stone.

[plb]

These articles are the worst. There is no way the PS3 or 360 is catching up to the wii. Consider this also, even if we assume the PS3 beats out the 360 by a million units per year which isn't likely to begin with, it will take over 5 years just to get to the same point as the 360. Next gen will be out long before anyone beats out the Wii.

[n4gno]

All the analysts are saying the contrary (ps3 beating the wii, and without a single doubt xbox), but who knows :)

by the way "by a million units per year which isn't likely to begin with" : last year ps3 do better tahn that, and it will continue (if people are not to dumbs : same price, better hardware and games, no reason to do an another choice)

[360fanboi]

I like to move it! move it!

[Trebius]

The PS3 is a Wii x 2, and it's a 360 x 1.5. Haha.

It does Wii better than the Wii does lol.

PS3 is officially the best investment one can make for an entertainment center.

Natal's controller-less gaming is not going to take off like they hope it does.

If I wanna move around and lose a few pounds i'll go to the gym.

[Comet]

PS Move + PS Eye + High Definition + 3D > Project Natal + Wii

[Dance]

How the hell did N4G approve of this?

[DelbertGrady]

Look around and ask yourself that question again. :)

[bobrea]

Meh, I have a feeling they will both be very "meh" although playing LBP with Move looked pretty fun, but I still prefer a controller.

[Raoh]

oh god, please no more..

everyday i find it harder and harder to come here..

cant these silly kids just join a forum instead of creating blogs when they want to say something?

[dtalon3]

FLAMEBAIT ARTICLE! /ignore please

[kingme71]

Absurd article. Natal and Move will never "beat" the Wii(mote) due to one very critical fact: They are addons. The Wiimote is standard with every Wii.

I'm not sure what the article means by beating the Wii. In sales, in popularity, in precision, in interest?

[OSIRUSSS]

True. And a good point.

[dannylilley]

In terms of potential technology and therefore a better experience. I do see how the title may be misleading though.

[dredgewalker]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, we should wait and look at the games it will come out with and then decide which is the winner. It is too early to judge which device will come out the winner. It's like waiting for a boxing match, the fight starts when both boxers are on the ring.

[Rowsdower]

we could filter articles by website and/or contributor to see if these folks actually add to the community or if they are consistently providing flamebait. If they are only providing flamebait perhaps the mods could suspend them.

[dannylilley]

Most of my personal posts are reviews so the answer to that will be no. Plus it's not meant as flamebait but rather an opinion on how it could be better technology-wise.

[Fishy Fingers]

The only thing I like about Sony and their 'move' is the fact they have enough resources to support it while maintaining a solid offering for people like myself who aren't over interested in motion controls.

I find it ironic that one thing many 360/PS3 gamers agreed on was their disapprovel of motion controls (when the wii was the sole option), now suddenly they're all the rage and we're arguing over who's is better.

Stick either logo on the box, I'm still to see anything that would get me to cough up the cash.

[DarthTigra]

QFT! It's crazy, 10 months ago motion controllers were dumb. Hardly play my WII and until I see something different I wont be buying Move (Wii-Mote) or Natal (Eye-toy no matter what anyone says)

[edhe]

Hm, i don't want waggle, or movement. I want the facial & voice recognition & alternate methods of control offered by Natal. Anything else can taste my testes.

[Yomiro]

Well, after seen socom 4 being played with the move, I think it has a chance.

[Foxgod]

I cant comment on Natal, as i wait till E3, but the wii is already a succes thanks to the Nintendo franchises.

The move however, looks just lame, cant see it working out well.
Unless they somehow come out with triple A games that cant be played without Move.

[thehitman]

Socom 4 is AAA and if Move proves to be more precise or just as precise as a DS3 then I think Move will be an automatic success.

[AliTheBrit19]

Lets see

Natal = Huge backing from pretty much every Publisher/Developer out there and general critic aclaim from the tech world.

Move = Laggy, doesn't work, utter failure and Wiimote rip-off

[Godmars290]

Natal = Not BC with most, if any, high profile 360 title. And it is laggy.

Move = BC with with many PS3 high profile title. Not as laggy as Natal and apparently not as 1:1 precise as first shown.

Both = Copying the Wii who's biggest title is Wiispots, which is shovelware. That's what this whole fu*king argument's about: which of the two can best copy the success of fu*king shovelware!

[Oner]

"Natal = Huge backing from pretty much every Publisher/Developer out there and general critic aclaim from the tech world."

Say what now?

PlayStation Move Publisher Support:

505 Games U.S.
Activision Publishing, Inc.
AQ INTERACTIVE Inc.
ARC SYSTEMS WORK CO.,LTD
ATLUS Co., LTD.
Bigben Interactive
CAPCOM CO., LTD.
CCP
Crave Entertainment
CYBERFRONT Corporation
Disney Interactive Studios
Electronic Arts Inc.
FromSoftware, Inc.
Game Republic, Inc.
GUST CO., LTD.
HUDSON SOFT CO., LTD.
IREM SOFTWARE ENGINEERING INC.
Koei Co., Ltd.
Konami Digital Entertainment Co., Ltd.
Majesco Entertainment
Marvelous Entertainment Inc.
NAMCO BANDAI Games Inc.
ONGAKUKAN Co., Ltd.
Oxygen Games
PAON CORPORATION
Q Entertainment Inc.
Q-GAMES, LTD.
SEGA CORPORATION
Sony Online Entertainment
Spike Co., Ltd.
SQUARE ENIX GROUP
TECMO, LTD.
THQ Inc.
UBISOFT
Warner Bros. Interactive Entertainment
Zoo Entertainment, Inc.

Xbox Natal Support

Activision Blizzard
Bethesda Softworks
CAPCOM
Disney Interactive
Electronic Arts
Konami
MTV Games
Namco Bandai
Sega
Square Enix
THQ Inc.
Ubisoft
BioWare
Lionhead Studios
EPIC Games

"Move = Laggy, doesn't work, utter failure and Wiimote rip-off"

There is no end to your misinformed, false and biased claims. You ain't fooling anyone.

Lag = False
Doesn't Work = False
Failure = False
Rip-off = False

This people is the definition of a fanboy. False information based off biased opinion with no truth ANYWHERE to be seen or proven.

[EliteAssassin81]

how can we judge which one is better until we see them both in action, they might both be great and they both might suck. I dont think I will buy either one for a while after after release anyways since I would rather spend my money on games

[tiamat5]

Even if both work, the Move will still win. 360 owners aren't close enough in personality to Wii owners to want this. PS3 owners however prefera variety of games so might be more open to the Move

[makingdamage]

I think it will be interesting to see if people will want to play games without a controller as with Natal. Personally I dont think its an funny experience but maybe a lot of people think it is.

But I might be persuade to play games using that move controller, at least that one has a real connection between the player and the game.

[divideby0]

I really dont care for any of these thangs...We have the Wii and thats fine..
To me its way to early to tell.
We know Sony is going to be expensive if you are buying 2 or more setups.
I still think by MS removing the chip from the camera, is going to hurt the performance. We have seen software emulation is not as good as native hardware implementation...no debate

[GiantEnemyCrab]

Yes, everyone has been waiting for the Move. Motion Control gaming doesn't start until Sony says..

I can already here the soccer moms throwing their Wii's in the river and dropping $299 plus the additional monies for multiple controllers.

I have my doubts about both Move and Natal.

[DarthTigra]

Agreed.

[ATLGAMER]

But not likely..it will be head to head with natal..(just because natal has showed no games) I see t far behind ...and the wii is way to far ahead...and the move price needs to be dropped

[dannylilley]

After seeing the majority of these comments I feel I should clear up a few points:

1) This article is not meant as flamebait but rather one persons opinion on how the PlayStation Move has the potential to beat the Wii and Natal based on videos and other people's experiences.
2) This article is mainly talking about the comparison in terms of technology and how it could translate into superior gaming experiences. I'm by no means saying that the PlayStation 3 will beat the Wii or 360 for console sales.
3) As I put in the conclusion the whole thing will ultimately depend on the games, publicity and how they operate once they are finally released.

So obviously feel free to air your opinions on here or on our forum ( http://www.gamebrit.com/for... but please read the full article as there is far more to say than what's simply in the description.

Have a great day :)

[Tomkar]

PS3 tells 360 to MOVE over...

[RagTagBnd445]

While move might beat Natal, beating the Wii depends on what you mean by "beating". Also Sony is not that experienced on the casual area, so they are not going to spit out awesome casual motion control based exclusives.
It its going to be good, yes, and more precise than wii also. But it is not going to sell systems, just giving more possibilities to the ones who already own a PS3.

[PhoenixDevil]

I think i will if
Some sort of sports game package (will prob b included, casual)
a RTS game that can b played lyk a PC RTS
Somthing lyk demon souls, sword & shield block attack and free movement
If it has these things on it then i think im gona have to get it, for now just wait on the hype train

[mayberry]

I bet a lot of 360 owners play in bedrooms, (younger owners-low h.d. t.v. ownership is documented). ps3 owners use their systems in the main entertainment areas of their homes i bet. my point is, it seems natal needs more room and light than move!

[skare13]

Maybe the point in the story isn't what everyone is talking about, but I would like to make a few points.
1. The wii sold about 70m and the others are around (PS3 30m) and the (360 35m) something like that.
2. The PS3 remote (2 remote and button layout) is a rip-off of the wii's remotes.
3. 360 project natal is a rip-off of the wii by ripping off the PSEYE/eyetoy.
back to 1
No mater what you do, your not going to catch that number of 70m
back to 2
Maybe Sony had a remote in 2004 (it didn't like the move) Nintendo has bend working on there remote before the wii came out, and build a system around it. So nintendo did something Sony didn't, which is release a system with motion base control out of the box (not a add-on). To me that is a 1st.
So by making something that looks like and plays like, that would be copying. I know why they did it, they are in last and want some of that money.So for everyone who says that Sony has been working on this for sooooooo long, why in the end does it look like a wii remote.
now for 3.
For all the XBOX fans, I know I know project Natal is soooo much more than a eyetoy. And it just may be and for eveyone who already owns a xbox 360 it may add so much more. (like a gun to a on-rail shooter). But as for new sales, I don't think it will help that much.
Let's take my dad (he is in his 60's) and he wants one of those new motion control systems, he will look at project natal the same as he would with a eyetoy. (they are both camera) But dad that one works so much better (this guy tock forever to go to DVD (and he only has a few of them). So most of that type of person will not enter the gaming world because of project natal (he didn't run out and get a eyetoy and isn't getting that)
That also goes for the Sony Move, hey dad you wanted to get motion base system. (well what do we have son). We have a wii and PS3 (well all my old friends have a wii) But the ps3 controller is better. (how much is it) PS3 with move set-up $400 wii is $200, what would you think will come next.

I want to make a few more (short points)
1- I know that the wii's games don't look as good as ps3 and 360 games *those system have more power.
2- Eyetoy is older than the wii (was out longer)
3- Move is not a eyetoy (so by show the eyetoy was out before the wii does not prove the wii copy the eyetoy)
4- Power glove was out before Sony ever though of making a system. look it up

[firerock91]

there is a Natal controller coming out this fall. It goes with the game Squeeballs wich was deleted off of gamestop's site last june when it was for pre order. The game is now in extended development and will be the first game out on the 360 with natal.

[pcz]

Sony never change. I remember Michael Jackson complaining that Sony didn't do enough to market/advertise his Incredible album, which completely flopped. It's obvious it had a lot to do with politics and Sony didn't help. The latest news is that now he is dead (and more profitable,)Sony have bought the rights to all his music... I think it says it all about Sony.

[Def Warrant]

Oops...

double post

[Def Warrant]

Only one reason: It works!