Microsoft discloses details on Xbox One and Kinect chips

Microsoft disclosed details for the main processor and the Kinect image processor in the Xbox One video game console today at a chip design conference.

Those details are critical for the kind of experience that consumers will have with the Xbox One when it launches this fall. The guts inside the box will determine what kind of quality games the consumers will see and whether the machine will be prone to failure, as the Xbox 360 was when it debuted in 2005.

[greenpowerz]

Makes you wonder who's spec NDA was being enforced. MSFT's? or AMD's? Or both?

One of the better articles about this. I'm just glad I now know what I pre ordered LOL

Games is all that matters but I lean audiophile videophile and like to know what I'm getting.

Disagree? LOL

LOL @Neogaf guy says: "Huma(n) After All" http://i.imgur.com/vdsVDpc....

[LordMaim]

@Starbucks_Fan: It means that the Xbox One is at 1.31 TFlops vs 1.84 TFlops for PS4. That overclock really didn't do much for the Xbox.

Edit: Not sure why the disagrees. It's not like it's an opinion, they're facts. Look at the picture for the proof. Prior to the overclock it was running 1.23 TFlops, now they're at 1.31. That's not a massive increase. Microsoft needs to give people the complete picture.

https://semiaccurate.com/as...

[iamnsuperman]

It is N4G. You will get a disagree for saying we live on the Earth. Honestly, I have no idea what a TFlops. Is that a big difference. Would anyone realistically notice that difference. Again TFLops are alien to me (and I think to everyone on this site judging by some of the ridiculous things being said in the other article)

[FlameBaitGod]

What is this earth u speak of ?

[bromtown]

For anyone that's wondering what a difference of 0.53TFlops means, its a difference of just over 2 PS3's worth of power. Not inconsiderable.

[KRUSSIDULL]

@iamnsuperman

FLOPS FLoating-point Operations Per Second and the T = Tera (Billion)
It is a measurement how powerful a system is (But in reality it's not that accurate)

Below specs does not include CPU FLOPS data.

Xbox 360 Xenos GPU = 0,240 TFLOPS
Playstation 3 RSX GPU = 0,176 TFLOPS

Xbox One = 1,31 TFLOPS
Playstation 4 = 1,84TFLOPS

For further comparison
Nvidia GTX580 (2010 HIGH-END GPU) = 1,58TFLOPS
Nvidia GTX680 (2012 HIGH-END GPU) = 3,09TFLOPS

The GTX680 is almost twice of powerful but doesn't render twice as many FPS (Frames Per Second) but closer to 35% faster than the GTX580.
So the difference between the Xbox and PS4 is not gonna be very significant when we're talking about graphics as it looks right now.

Hope that explains some for you, cheers!

[marchinggamer]

Honestly this whole teraflops comparison is a load of bullshit. Teraflops measures compute performance not graphical power. For example a radeon 7979 has about 1000 more gigaflops than a gtx 680 yet a gtx 680 beats it in most benchmarks

[Swiggins]

Thank you Krussidull, that was very helpful in explaining that to me.

Bubbles for being helpful.

[EVILDEAD360]

Nice post & +bubz @ Krussidull

The FLOP talk is cool pre-launch but post launch it's going to be great to finally have the games in our hands.

Evil

[sorane]

@iamnsuperman

"It is N4G. You will get a disagree for saying we live on the Earth."

So true and so funny :P I'll give ya +bubble for that one :)

[iamgoatman]

@marchinggamer

"For example a radeon 7979 has about 1000 more gigaflops than a gtx 680 yet a gtx 680 beats it in most benchmarks."

No it doesn't. When compared to a 7970Ghz (pretty much all can manage that) it's the other way around.

[mistertwoturbo]

"For example a radeon 7979 has about 1000 more gigaflops than a gtx 680 yet a gtx 680 beats it in most benchmarks"

That's correct if you compare a Radeon to a Geforce, you can't directly compare them to each other because the architectures are different.

But since we're talking about Radeon vs Radeon, 530GFLOPS more is an apples to apples comparison.

[ThanatosDMC]

I disagree with iamnsuperman because you live in Krypton.

[DonFreezer]

Shut your freaking mouth.Name me one graphics card retailer who mentiones teraflops of a grpahics card.Just one. PS fanboys you should realise that if something so big on a gpu isn't even mentioned in shops why the hell does Sony advertise it so much?I haven't seen Nintendo nitpicking specs that the Gamecube had over the first Xbox so they could feel more powerfull.

[SITH]

BOOM!

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaahaha hah all win!

[kewlkat007]

" For example a radeon 7979 has about 1000 more gigaflops than a gtx 680 yet a gtx 680 beats it in most benchmarks"

Wtf..I got the 7979..sh!t I was lied to.

[Bigpappy]

Seems to me a lot of people are misunderstanding band width affect on speed as opposed to clock speed. If clock speeds are similar, RAM with a narrower bandwidth can actually have the bus addressed in parallel. So it all come down to the design. in particular, how the processor accesses the RAM. If they both access the RAM directly form the processor PS4 wins speed. If MS is using the internal 47MB of RAM link a front end bus, it would increase the data and address bandwidth of the DDR3 RAM in a flexible manner, depending on how much is used for address and how much for data cache.

[JunioRS101]

THUMBS UP IF YOU'RE AS DUMB AS ME! :D

[PraxxtorCruel]

...but how dumb are you? We gotta know your power level!

[JunioRS101]

I tried to go Super Saiyan once and pooped my drawers.

[XboxFun]

Now there's a God level Super Saiyan, so we have to know if this can be achieved by you.

[JackOfAllBlades]

It's over 9000

[cyclindk]

Yal are funny :)

[Kayant]

Frigid where are you..... Xbox one uses Jaguar like PS4.
It looks like the leak specs from earlier where true.
More info ---> http://www.neogaf.com/forum...

[Metfanant]

poor frigid lol

[pyramidshead]

Let's not tease him too much........maybe. :P

[MasterCornholio]

I remember some people were saying that Microsoft would change the specs by a huge amount in the last few months before release.

I guess they were wrong because the specs barely changed anything.

Motorola RAZR i

[M-M]

I don't know where the disagrees are coming from, Frigid would always go around saying that the Xbox One will have a Kaveri chip. Like EVERYONE said, it doesn't have one. Even Greenpowerz said yesterday "people will be in for a surprise tomorrow", where's that surprise at?

[ziggurcat]

he'll probably start spouting off nonsense along the lines of, "since it's the same, then PS4 definitely doesn't have hUMA or HSA blah blah blah" even though that wouldn't be true.

[badz149]

no...it's just that they are now all saying "it's all about the games"

[MRMagoo123]

the surprise is that the xboners after seeing 100% fact that the ps4 is more powerful still deny it, i was surprised i thought they would just go hide back in their caves but it seems the denial is strong and they dont even believe MS' own spec sheet lol.

All we know after this is the ps4 has the same gap on the xbone as we thought it was weeks ago.

[n4rc]

I love this.. I almost can't believe it!

Nobody has EVER said the specs you throw out aren't true.. Yes when you measure one aspect of a component.. the ps4 is ahead in a bunch of them..

Why people argue with you is the other bullshit you include.. Usually something along the lines of xbox sucks and it cant compete blah blah blah...

That is why people ignore you.. You refuse to accept arguments based on effiency or anything else.. Just "look at my .5 tflop! Screw xbox"

Games are what matters... Not a number...

Funny tho... Thats exactly what ps3 owners always said when the roles were reversed.. And i wasnt here bashing ps3 so i dont give a crap what someone else said to you years ago..

[MarkusMcNugen]

@n4rc

Its okay man. Most of the hate these guys come up with they dont even understand themselves. I can guarantee you that 98% of all the people who post GPU specs (i.e. ROPs) or Teraflops have absolutely no idea what they are or how they correlate to the system architecture as a whole. These are just fanboys picking a few small pieces of information and spouting it as the end-all be-all of Xbox One without understanding how it all works.

And yes, in the end, as much as people think PS4 specs are the most important thing. They are not. It will be features and games that sell the systems to the masses.

[vigilante_man]

Read the article but it made little sense. Your link was way more useful so thanks.

Not sure what the true picture is yet for both. We will find out nearer the time. Guess it also matters how the hardware is utilised.

Seems PS4 could of gone the ESRAM route for super fast speeds at certain times but thought the best option with less bottle neck was the unified fast GDDR5.

Microsoft have gone with the small cache system. Both are vastly superior to what we already have. How much cheaper would the XB1 be to make/produce? We know the Kinnect 2 costs almost as much as the XB1. Does this make the XB1 cheaper without the Kinnect 2?

[SkippyPaccino]

I wonder if lays is making their chips?

[LackTrue4K]

Has to be Frito-Lay!!

[Swiggins]

We all know that Sony uses superior Pringles technology in the PS4.

[SkippyPaccino]

I thought Nintendo used the power of Pringle? The Pringle mascot is a picture of Marios dad? I believe Sony also uses lays but they add onion dip

[kneon]

Yes the pringle technology is far superior. There is much better consistency and few broken chips :)

[Xsilvermist]

Hmmmmmmmmmmm yes hmmmmmmmmmmm yup as i thought this means nothing to me

[sincitysir1]

This exactly what I told Microsoft to use. I talked to them and told them that this was the best route =]

[LackaJaKane]

Cark Merny? is that you?

@Sincity

[sincitysir1]

Haha u made me laugh so bubble up! Spread ur word my friend spread it

[ma1asiah]

Ok has the X1 had another power boost????

"The graphics section of the main processor has 15 special processors that can handle things like graphics or physics processing. Data highways can transfer bits at a rate of 200 gigabytes per second or more across different parts of the chip. The audio subsystem has two dedicated vector cores."

Wasn't it previously 170.3 Gb/sec (68.3 Gb/sec (8 DDR3) + 102 Gb/sec (32 MB Esram)) and then 196 Gb/sec now 200 Gb/sec.....nice

and umm was the 32MB of Esram increased as well

"The chip covers an area of 363 square millimeters and is built in a 28-nanometer state-of-the-art manufacturing process. It has 5 billion basic components, known as transistors, on a single chip that combines a microprocessor, graphics processor, and 47 megabytes of memory."

So am I reading it wrong or is it now 47 MB of Esram

In respect of the following:

"The central processing unit (CPU) has eight 64-bit Jaguar cores designed by AMD."

If you surf the net, you will find almost everybody with exception to MS themselves stating that it is a Jaguar. The offical MS statement is that it is a 64-bit custom 8 core CPU.

So this article doesn't do enough to prove that it is a Jaguar well at least not at this stage.

[imt558]

You know what MS listed on their presentation? This :

The PS4 GPU is listed like a DX 11.2+ and OpenGL 4.4 compatible... the Xbox One a DX 11.1+.

+ OpenGL 4.4 for PS4. Fuck yea! So, DX 11.2 is not exclusive for XO, or maybe doesn't exist on XO.

Or this from tweeter :

Msoft XBox One supports shared coherent memory between 8 AMD Jaguar cores and DX 11.1+ GPU like @hsafoundation

[ma1asiah]

ummmm link please as many articles like the following show that directx 11.2 IS exclusive to the X1 and Windows 8.1

http://www.tomshardware.com...

[PFFT]

Thats what i want to know as well. Isnt DX 11.2 exclusive to both Win 8 and Xbox One???

[imt558]

@PFFT

No, it's not exklusive to Windows or XO. Who knows if XO at all has DX 11.2

Link by ma1asiah is old news. This is new from presentation ( on the top of the picture )

http://i.imgur.com/LkCN75O....

[rainslacker]

It has been confirmed that DX11.2 is being released for X1 and Windows 8 by MS. The hardware in the X1 supports some(not sure about all) of the stuff that DirectX 11.2 supports, most notably pointed out was tiled resources.

Some current PC cards(not most current) do not support these things in hardware, but can implement them on the software level.

The DirectX API however is free to use on any device if someone wants to implement it. Details on rights of use are on MS own webpage about DirectX.

[StrangerX]

Sorry to burst your bubble but in regard to the PS4 hardware being compatible with direct x 11.2+, you are right but only in the hardware level but in the software level it's exclusive for XBOX One and windows 8.1. That's why it Microsoft posted it for being compatible but again on the hardware side not the software side. Hope you understand that. :)

[Nekroo91]

your reading it wrong and you dont know math because the image shows the 8g ddr4 + 8mb+8mb+8mb+8mb making a total of 32mb of esram ...with a peak of 204gb/s and 109 min.

and we all know you can achieve that all the time thats why cerny choose not to add edram making a total of 1000gb/s for 176

[ma1asiah]

Dude are you serious is it now DDR4 I can't make that out in the image

Friggen awesome if it is

and no bro I was referring to the following:

"The chip covers an area of 363 square millimeters and is built in a 28-nanometer state-of-the-art manufacturing process. It has 5 billion basic components, known as transistors, on a single chip that combines a microprocessor, graphics processor, and 47 megabytes of memory."

Right at the bottom it states 47 MB.....my question was is this Esram and if so does this mean that the Esram has been increased.

[rainslacker]

47 MB is an odd number for memory usage. It may actually be 64MB, but some reserved for OS functions, or cut back on usable ammount for the redundancy talked about in the article. This would line up with some of the ESRAM fabrication problem rumors that came out a couple weeks ago. Sony did a similar thing with their Cell chips by making it so only some of the cores had to pass inspection to be considered a good chip(can't remember the exact number).

It could be this isn't all ESRAM though, although I'm unsure why they would have two separate caches on the chip.

Actually stating 47MB instead of 64MB is a rather odd marketing approach though. Usually they state what the number is on chip, regardless of what is available to use.

So who knows, maybe more details will come out later.

[MarkusMcNugen]

Im assuming that they combined the eSRAM and the CPU L1, L2, and L3 cache memory into one single number. Which would explain the weird single number they stated.

Seems a lot more feasible than a random increase to the eSRAM with some reserved for OS, or limiting the number due to fabrication issues.

[imt558]

No, ma1asiah, there is no power boost except GPU minor upclock. DDR3 bandwith is shrinked :

http://i.imgur.com/LkCN75O....

...Wasn't it previously 170.3 Gb/sec (68.3 Gb/sec (8 DDR3) + 102 Gb/sec (32 MB Esram)) and then 196 Gb/sec now 200 Gb/sec.....nice...

You are just like MS, combine all numbers. You can't add numbers like that. eSRAM is not bidirectional and bandwith is not 204 GB/s for eSRAM, it's 102 GB/s because is NOT BIDIRECTIONAL or it can't do read/write at the same time.

[hyperfire21]

@imt558

You sir are misinformed

[LordMaim]

Duplicate post.

[ma1asiah]

Did you read the article dude or dudett????

Show me where it says 1.31 TFlops

It says a friggen lot but nothing about TFlops

[imt558]

Link from tweeter???

https://twitter.com/rickbme...

Well, on GAF, they who watched the presentation said that it was shown a slide whith OpenGL 4.4 and DX 11.2 for PS4.

[Metfanant]

well...

https://semiaccurate.com/as...

right there smack in the middle of the top row on the slide...

"1.31 Tflops for Graphics and GPGPU computation"

would you like me to warm your crow before you eat it??....

[LordMaim]

Everyone should have the whole picture. Microsoft needs to be straight up with the consumer, and let them make an informed decision.

https://semiaccurate.com/as...

Edit: @Ma1asiah: This is not an old article. The pictures were posted *today*. Look at the original article at SemiAccurate that has all the data, and not just the one picture that this site cherry-picked. You deserve to know all the facts, just like any customer.

http://semiaccurate.com/201...

[ma1asiah]

@ Metfanant

Why are you linking an old article when this one has just come out and the information is fresh of the press.

The 1.3 TFlops was in respect of the 6% overclock to the GPU so sorry dude try again.

Back when your article was relevant then that info was deemed correct.

But if you read my question to the original poster I was asking where it states that in THIS article.

[hyperfire21]

Duplicate post.

[XabiDaChosenOne]

Finally, now the denial can stop. The PS4 stomps the Xbox one in raw processing power and now we have documented facts supporting the rumors. No more excuses.

[Death]

Which specs did you see? The documented specs give the XboxOne more processing power than the PS4. Realistically speaking, both systems are the same base hardware with custom tweaks by Sony and Microsoft. Software will define both systems much like it has on PS3 and Xbox 360. No one is stomping anyone as far as specs go.

[Metfanant]

WHAT!?....

on pure specs alone the PS4's GPU is roughly 40% more powerful than the Xbone's...

[vigilante_man]

The consensus seems to be that the PS4 GPU is more powerful and GDDR5 has better performance with less overheads than the Speedy ESRAM as the faster peak cannot be sustained all the time.

It does seem from a technical point of view that PS4 has the grunt advantage over XB1. One of the consoles has to be more powerful. That's life.

But you are correct that it also matter how the hardware is utilised. Both are way above what we have so does it really matter? Play the games you want on the system you want.

[XabiDaChosenOne]

Reading is your friend,
http://m.neogaf.com/showthr...
http://m.neogaf.com/showthr...
I'm sorry it hurts you but unfortunately you're just going to have to......wait for it......#dealwithit

[MRMagoo123]

LOL death nice try on the trolling there lol you nearly had me for a second but after looking at the actual facts the ps4 has a 40% power advantage overall, i am not gonna even ask if you are serious because anyone with eyes can see via the known 100% proven specs the ps4 is more powerful.

[Death]

Known proven specs?

Show me another CPU using GDDR5. It doesn't happen. GDDR5 is graphics ram which is very fast for GPU's that compute in a very non-linear way. You can't simply take a 7870 and say "here's the specs" without taking the CPU into consideration. AMD created both systems, that is the bottom line. Sony has a more simplistic architecture this time around with Micrsosoft being a bit more creative in getting from point a to point b.

As for trolling, I am simply commenting on the article here that shows the XboxOne having greater theoretical power than PS4's theoretical power. I don't personally care either way since I believe both systems to be close enough to being equal that it will come down to the software. If Sony exclusives are your thing, the PS4 will be the better choice for you. Anyone basing their choice on the tflops is gaming for the wrong reasons.

[StrangerX]

Has ANYONE! notice that apart from the 8GB of DDR3 memory and 32MB of eSRAM there is actually a 8GB of flash memory added in the system?

[solidworm]

All those figures mean nothing. What will mean something is ps4 games looking way beyond BONE games in 2 years from now.

[thexmanone]

WHY

[imt558]

I see the DDR3 bandwith is shrinked from 68 GB/s to 56 GB/s

http://i.imgur.com/LkCN75O....

[QuantumWake]

It's still 68 GB/s. I think the image quality made it look like that because I too thought it was 56 GB/s.

http://www.pcworld.com/arti...

[QuantumWake]

I hope that the people who disagreed with my post were disagreeing because I said image quality wasn't so good.

Because if we're disagreeing with facts presented with links now... *facepalm*

[PFFT]

Yeah its 68.

[Bundi]

I has a stupid, don't know what any of this means!

Do it run Forza 5? Then I want it!

[Spoons]

I couldn't care less all I know is that Ryse and Forza look sweet and I like that.

[thetruthx1]

The Ps4 can be 1,000 times more powerful than the Xbox One and it still wouldn't mean anything if the developers don't know how to optimize to get the best out of the hardware.

I'm more impressed with Forza, Dead Rising 3, Ryse, Quantum Break, and Fighter Within (Yes even though you Sony ball lickers hate it still looks good) than anything I've seen on the Ps4

[M-M]

Trolls like you make Xbox fans look bad. Before you people disagree with me, look at his username. He just made the account to pretend to be an Xbox fan since almost anything Xbox related on here gets a negative response.

[thetruthx1]

What's so bad about being a xbox fan? I don't like most of the games Sony puts out and the ones I do want are already multiplatform

[Foxgod]

Theres nothing bad about it.

[ZHZ90]

There's nothing wrong being fan of Xbox or PS but there's definetly wrong about being a fanboy bot.
You like MS's games more than Sony's then fine, state facts and opinions not lies.

Btw you have acted as an Xbox fanboy in every PS4 article.

[xc7x]

interesting but not going to say no more to make fanboys fight lol

[maniac76]

Who cares,i want 60 fps at least at 720p even and no fukn jaggies around everything lmao.

Like most gamers arnt gonna have both systems at some point lol