Diablo 3: Why skills are in, attributes are out in modern role-playing games

Joystiq: It took four or five levels to realize something was different. I was playing the Diablo 3 open beta last weekend, merrily leveling my monk up, when I noticed that half the time a gained level just happened, without me needing to do anything. Sometimes I could choose new skills, yes, but I wasn't given five points to distribute to my core attributes like Strength, Vitality, etc. There's a little bit of text that notes which attributes have improved, but that's all. Diablo 3 isn't the only major recent role-playing game* to downplay the importance of its characters' core attributes. Mass Effect 3 and The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim, both released within six months of Diablo 3, avoid core attributes entirely.

[jrbeerman11]

"Skyrim and Mass Effect 3 don't include attributes at all"

Skyrim has three actually: health, stamina, and magicka.

It doesn't discredit the entire point of article, but just wanted to clarify.

[JsonHenry]

They wanted loot to be the new "stat". Why? So they can make money off of the auction house through micro-transactions.

This way instead of being able to tweak your char through stats you have to get the best gear available to have an edge in PvP. The only way to do that is either get really lucky and get all the ultra rare drops yourself or be forced into buying it with real money.

Remember blizzard is going to get a cut from both the buyer and the seller. I know it may not be much of a cut but do it a couple million times and you've got some decent money.

[Baka-akaB]

"Diablo 3 seems to be built on a model of giving the player fewer choices, but making those choices more interesting and relevant than the cookie-cutter builds of Diablo 2."

Oh god could journalists be even more whipped ? I get that d3 is still going to be a riveting game , but could you at least stop rpetending everything is rosy ? I can get that from someone working on the game , be it at PR or development , but "journalists" ?

How is having less choice that matter going to help having less cookie cutter builds ? You just removed half the chance of creating something unique , for the sake of not being able to screw up .

"Unlike core attributes, skill systems allow for consistent player adaptation and character growth. The player can take an active role in how their character grows stronger, instead of simply watching. "

Bullsh*t . For starters it was never core attributes OR skills points , the game had both . Dumping one means you are even less active in the choice , and will like before most likely just follow the currently popular and known to be efficient builds for your classes .

You are even more a spectator than an actor now .

Just admit that stats are dumped because the masses dont like looking and wrapping their heads around numbers (while ironically they do it all the time and increasingly more in sports games) and be done with it . Instead of trying to convince that it's all for the better

[RonXD]

It's funny how you try to argue that stats give the player a choice, yet you openly admit at the end of your comment that most people simply followed popular and known efficient builds for your classes.

That's exactly why the system was scrapped. Not because the masses couldn't handle it.

Instead of permanently screwing up your character because you didn't follow the most efficient build on a forum, you're able to customize your stats via gear and other things in game.

[Baka-akaB]

It's simple why i argue that . In both case most people follow the herd , but difference is , in one case you can actually try to do something else , wich some people did .

it was an extra available choice , and actually led to many uniques builds you wont find now .

"Instead of permanently screwing up your character because you didn't follow the most efficient build on a forum, you're able to customize your stats via gear and other things in game. "

That argument rest upon some notion that before you werent customising via gears and stuff on top of the rest . Wich isnt true .

One less option is just that , one less option .

"Instead of permanently screwing up your character because you didn't follow the most efficient build on a forum"

You know very well that since then , most of those games added a feature to reset stats , be it for free or an ingame fee of sort .

And i dont see the point or reward , in everything you do being a surefire win

[Gohadouken]

Stats in d2 were awesome, some of the builds people came up with were absolutely amazing .

We won't see anything for d3 nearly as interesting or unique as we were able to in say, d2.

The risk of screwing is actually what drove people to find the proper loopholes for build to work and be amazing .

We actually have an example of what D3 could lead to with WoW , the great uncle . It got builds , but nothing even remotely close to Diablo 2 , or Guild Wars .

There is customization there, sure, but in comparison its nothing. People fell in the ranks and followed the easy builds in WoW way faster than in D2 or guild wars , where people actually had to work for a while to figure things out . And soon it just became a matter of reacting accordingly to patch and balance changes .

It also just wont have a fraction of the staying power d2 had for most players . It was a tinkering and pvp machine . Many , hell almost all of the old guard will pop in D3 , but dont expect them to stay nearly as much and as long .

But i guess that's the point , making a simpler and not even better diablo for a new generation .

[jsslifelike]

Yay! It's the era of the Lowest Common Denominator!

[jakethesnake]

I'm withholding judgement on this until I get my copy and play, because I hate to make a big deal out of things that I don't know. However, I'm happy that they are trying to solve the problem of the stats effectively being pretty meaningless. Since most people went for the cookie cutter build with their stats to get 'optimal' builds, it actually discouraged experimenting. I don't know if this will work or if I will like it, but I'm glad they are trying something.

[Mythicninja]

You guys check out grim dawn yet? It's one of the good contenders to D3