'For how good ID@Xbox Is, it's awful' - Vlambeer slams Microsoft's indie parity clause

"We're not going to launch on Microsoft first because they have that clause," Vlambeer's Rami Ismail told Dealspwn. "We like Sony and want to reward them for having the best terms. We're not going to reward Microsoft with an early version because they have the worst terms, right?"

"I've been talking to Microsoft about that. We've been negociating and I hope that they will drop it. It's my hope that they will drop it."

[Death]

Who is more arrogant, Vlambeer or Microsoft? I respect indie developers, but they are bringing a product that could run on a tablet or smart phone to the latest generation of consoles. It's not quite shovelware, but it's far from using the consoles hardware in any relevant way. I get that they want to self publish and reach the millions of customers on both platforms, but when they want to punish Microsoft, they are also punishing the millions of people that bought the Xbox One and might have been interested in their game.

The attitude some of these indies have towards any consoles manufacturer are insane for a company trying to get off the ground running. Some of this should be done behind the scenes or atleast with a little tact so they don't risk alienating themselves with their potential customers. This goes beyond biting the hand that feeds you.

[WeAreLegion]

I'll take integrity over money any day. That's what Vlambeer is doing here.

[Gazondaily]

Pretty much this

[nukeitall]

Arrogant or not, Vlambeer can keep their game. I don't want their sloppy seconds.

MS is protecting Xbox gamers and if we aren't worth your time, then I don't want your future games either.

[Outside_ofthe_Box]

Really? Really? Really!?

You don't want their sloppy seconds? Are you really that much of a hardcore ride or die fan of MS? Seriously... you talk as if the game coming out on PlayStation first somehow degrades the game's quality if it were to come out on Xbox later.

Did you even read the article? This isn't about Xbox gamers not being worth their time. They simply just don't have the man power to release on both platforms at the same time.

It is not a sin for them to want to release on PlayStation first if they feel that's the best option they've got from a pure business perspective. Not everyone is going to feel that releasing on PlayStation first is the best option and not everyone is going to feel that releasing on Xbox first is the best option. But with MS's parity clause indie devs are essentially forced to choose to release on Xbox first despite what they think which console is best for them to release first if a mutiplatform release is their overall goal. They are either forced to do that or choose Sony out of morality as in this case with Vlambeer.

Also don't you usually say that 90% of indie games are crap anyway? So it shouldn't even matter to you whether or not a "crappy" indie game comes to Xbox first amirite?/s

[KwietStorm_BLM]

Protecting? Lol now I've seen it all.

[ziggurcat]

how is their parity clause protecting xbox gamers?

and by the way - as i said before - it's not a parity clause when it's a one-way street.

[Seafort]

No Microsoft just want control over everything to the detriment of their company, their reputation and their customers.
Same old MS for me as a PC gamer. We had to put up with their crap for over a decade now it's the console gamers turn :)

They don't give a shit about the Xbox gamers. Why would they think to add draconian DRM to their system if their customers were valued?

[XabiDaChosenOne]

"MS is protecting Xbox gamers"
The irony....

[Jury]

Did ms also protect 360 gamers from first party exclusives over the last few years?

[georgeenoob]

What's up with these arrogant indies and their low budget games. They're lucky they're even given the opportunity. Try developing a real AAA then you can complain.

[GarrusVakarian]

Wow. What an ignorant attitude.

R* and Naughty dog were once indie devs, did you know that? There is nothing wrong with them pointing out a crappy policy, i fail to see how that is "arrogant", it's simple observation. They aren't sitting there saying "screw MS, they aren't worthy of out game with those policies!"...they even said they want MS to change their policies so they can get their game on the X1...."I hope that they will drop it. It's my hope that they will drop it".

So while you may not care about this particular indie coming to X1, what about future titles with much higher budgets that are only available on consoles/PC? I guarantee you will care then. Or do you ONLY play AAA's?

It's amazing how nothing is ever MS's fault with you guys. MS can do NO wrong.

Also@ Nuketail

My god.....

"MS is protecting Xbox gamers"

.......seriously?........ Protecting gamers by not letting the widest possible variety of games onto their console to appeal to the widest possible margin of people? Such protection! /s That is one of the most ridiculous things ive read in here in a while.

Yeah sure, the majority of indies are the sort that are sold and loved by "casuals" on tablets and smartphones, but what about games like Planetside 2, Warframe, Resogun, Warthunder, Blacklight, Don't Starve, No Man's Sky....games like those are really great games and future indies games like those could end up having large audiences and end up being very profitable, but because of a stupid, spoiled brat-like policies like this, they may never get the chance to shine.

[FunAndGun]

What's up with these arrogant comments ^^

edit...not you Lukas, george

[GribbleGrunger]

Just how far will you go to try and shine light into the dark recesses of the company you support? We're not the monsters ... everyone else is.

[Pain]

Indie games are like a throw back to the 80's arcade games that were just fun to play.. that's the problem with the fanboy kids these days that think Indie games are some crappy games and unimportant devs that make them but bitch and scream when there favorite toy doesn't get there share of the pie.

[Death]

Rockstar was formerly DMA Design which was an established developer with ties to publishers. DMA was originally an independant developer, but not self published.

Naughty Dog had a contract with EA to publish their games when both founders were only 17 years old. Once again, they were an independant studio, but they relied on a publisher to fund and promote their work.

You are confusing an independant or third party studios with todays self published "indie" developers. Indies are relatively new to the gaming scene since in the past you needed a publisher to get your games out. Now that digital distribution is available, traditional publishers are not needed.

[elninels]

Death is correct. He or she has a lot of disagrees, however he or she is correct.

[Minipandaninja]

they probably hope that people will side with them and tell M$ to drop the clause.

I think they do the right thing, if they can get to release on both platform then dont do it, if M$ dont want to live with it then dont have it. Fans will get it on PC or PS4, the game may be good or it may be bad but if it happens to be good MS will be mad and it will be only their fault

[GribbleGrunger]

Yes, and what people don't understand is that a lot of Indie devs are working constantly at the fringes of their budget. If they have a PS4 version already running, why shouldn't they be able to earn money while they're finalising the X1 version? It's not their fault that MS chose to make the X1 more complicated to programme for and it's rubbing salt in the wound to ask them then to sit on revenue, or in this case (with the parity clause) 'force' them to sit on revenue.

What matters is you get the game, not that you get the game at the same time or before someone else. Fun doesn't deplete over time.

[3-4-5]

What is the reasoning for the clause ?

Any honest person would be able to give a full and detailed answer.

Has Microsoft done that?

They love NOT clarifying things.

Good people with integrity don't do the things that Microsoft does.

They hire " That Guy", to lead most of their varies parts of the company.

You know, the guy who will "go there", or who will do what he wants, "because he can".

The stereotype Shyster Businessman.

THAT ^ IS Microsoft.

Their only help in getting people to trust them is that gamers still respect Phil.

[MoveTheGlow]

This isn't some standoff between the company Vlambeer and the company Microsoft. It's Rami Ismail having a problem with some of the administrators keeping the highly inventive ID@Xbox guys from making a great, cost-effective program for often cash-strapped independent developers. EA fails, programmers get laid off. The two-person Vlambeer fails, they're personally SOL and broke. There's no "punishing" Microsoft from this perspective. He even said in that same tweet thread that he knows plenty of ID guys, and they're amazing, and they have a vision for a much better indie environment on Xbox. The higher-ups just need to change that contract.

re: arrogance: What you might not know about Rami is that he's basically the business guru for that entire industry, not just some rogue dev. Ask the Exploding Rabbit CEO, for example, exactly how interrelated management skills and programming skills are (he recently came out as botching a $50K Kickstarter game). They're not. That stuff doesn't come to creative types naturally all of the time. Rami's the guy you'd ask about your project before you start, the guy who reads and provides insight on publishing contracts, advises publicity actions, helps small devs promote their stuff. When he said those things on Twitter, he didn't say them for himself - he'll have plenty of fans buy his stuff, believe me - he said them for developers who are just getting started and don't want to be Phil Fished by Microsoft for years. Indie devs are even less organized than the already non-unionized AAA devs. They're nearly powerless against multi-billion-dollar publishers. Rami provides them with at least a connected leader in the field.

"It's far from using the consoles [sic] hardware in any relevant way."

Relevance to you may mean pushing high-count polys at 1080/60, but there's room for inventive, tightly-controlled smaller games, such as the Xbox's own Dust: An Elysian Tail, or the PS3's Everyday Shooter and Sound Shapes. Some people still like playing those types of games on their TV's. I sure do - it's why I have a PC hooked up to my TV at this point. Maybe if ID@Xbox were a bit more fair with parity, that indie community would thrive, and gamers who aren't like you would also flock to your system. *That* is still relevant, even toward MS's bottom line.

[UnHoly_One]

Agreed, Death.

So many of these indie guys make themselves look like such jerks that I wouldn't buy their games even if they weren't crap. Which they usually are.

I understand that the "in thing" right now is the "stick it to the man" attitude of the indies, but I'm just not on board with it.

I like Microsoft. I like Sony. Hell I even like EA. They are big corporations that make beautiful and fun games for me to enjoy.

They are the companies spending big bucks in order to sell me a product that will provide me with hours of entertainment, so I don't hate them just because that's the cool thing to do.

All the indie guys can throw their little tantrums and withhold their games from me, meanwhile, I'll be playing good AAA games and not caring one little bit about their indie titles.

[DigitalRaptor]

@ UnHoly_One

You're really showing your sweeping generalisation, bias, and general ignorance, yet again...

"So many of these indie guys make themselves look like such jerks"

So many... being a handful of vocal devs out of thousands. Do you think you have just made a valid point there?
------------

"I wouldn't buy their games even if they weren't crap. Which they usually are."

Your loss, because you've neither played enough indie games to make that assessment, nor by the sounds of it, do you really understand what an indie game is or can be.

Is Resogun crap?
Is Dead Nation crap?
Is Outlast crap?
Is Fez crap?
Is Guacamelee crap?
Is Don't Starve crap?
Is Awesomenauts crap?
Is Towerfall Ascension crap?

Are the majority of indie games on PS4 crap?

Answer to all of these is an industry resounding "NO".
------------

"I understand that the "in thing" right now is the "stick it to the man" attitude of the indies, but I'm just not on board with it.

Nope. They are just talking sense about pointless, unreasonable, greedy and damaging policies. The "in thing" right now for Xbox fans is to defend said policies. In fact, it's been that way for years. You are so lost in your personal anti-indie crusade of ignorance that you can't see that he praised ID@Xbox as much as he criticised it.
------------

"They are big corporations that make beautiful and fun games for me to enjoy. They are the companies spending big bucks in order to sell me a product that will provide me with hours of entertainment"

You just admitted that you are a shallow gamer. Why? cause indies offer hours worth of fun and entertainment too, and offer heaps more diversity and creativity than the majority of AAA games. and so... you like AAA games for "teh shinys".

It's ironic, it really is. The big corporations are the ones jumping on the stale, safe ideas on a continual basis, and the indie development community is the bastion of unique, creative and original game design.
------------

"All the indie guys can throw their little tantrums"

Yes. ALL the thousands of indie guys are throwing tantrums, when it's only been like 2 or 3 vocal ones. Even still, they have the right to complain and discuss about how Microsoft's awful policy is affecting their business, because that's what it is. Awful.

"withhold their games from me"

THEY aren't witholding the games from you, you moron. They can only afford to make games for one platform at a time, and because of that, MS STOPS them from releasing the game if it goes to other platforms first.

So, you are quite literally blaming indies for a problem Microsoft has established. You are blinded to reason by your hatred for a handful of indie developers who have said bad things about "poor little Microsoft".
------------

"I'll be playing good AAA games and not caring one little bit about their indie titles."

Like i said, it's your loss. You're clearly living in your AAA bubble of denial and bloated budgets, missing out on fun, diverse, creative experiences.

You are also choosing to shut out the talent that will become the AAA developers of tomorrow, over cheap grudges and ignorance. That choice is yours alone.

[elninels]

You're missing the point. Most indies have not expressed hatred toward sony nor microsoft. They just don't want restrictions; its natural to resist.

Microsoft and Sony are massive corporations, its natural for them to want control and look out for their respective bussiness.

Its called a relationship, and each one has nuances.

Don't hate these entities. Disagree or agree with them, support or don't support them.

[UnHoly_One]

Digital raptor, I'm not going to bother to answer most of your post because you spent most of it attacking me or calling me a moron.

But all the "are those games crap?" questions.... The answer to those questions are yes. They are crap. To me.

Not saying a couple of them weren't fun for an hour, but that's about it.

Different opinions, buddy. You didn't see me calling anyone a moron or a "shallow gamer" for liking indies, did you? All I did was express MY taste, not condemn anyone else for theirs.

You've just made yourself look exactly like these indie devs. You think you're right about everything and these indie games are god's gift to gaming. Of course anyone that doesn't agree must be too stupid to be a real gamer, right?

You're Jonathon Blow, aren't you?

[malokevi]

low-budget indies? There appears to be absolutely zero part of my being that gives even the most remote and infinitesimally small part of half a hoot.

Who the hell is "Vlambeer"? Does he have anything to do with Halo 5? No? well alright then. Carry on.

https://www.youtube.com/wat...

[RadioActiveTwinky]

What if I told you Bungie started out as an Indie. Also what if Halo was actually an indie idea before Microsoft picked them up. What if I told you Marathon is Halo's father.

What if I told you what I just said is true.

Guess what it is true.

Bungie was an indie studios since 1991 until 2000. Then again after 2007.

[elninels]

@radioactiveturkey

Good information, but poor delivery.

[ipach]

Wonder how you would've felt about Marathon when it came out...

[GTgamer]

@Death
"The attitude some of these indies have towards any consoles manufacturer are insane for a company trying to get off the ground running."

Funny the best way for indies to get off ground is to be on as many consoles as possible but if they don't have enough man power they can tackle one console at a time but with MS parity clause they can't do that (•ิ_•ิ) so why are you calling the DEVs arrogant again? For making a decision that's beneficial to them :/.

[Pogmathoin]

This guy is just announcing himself to the world, thats all..... Probably for good reason, building hype, as I guess his game may not be that good...

@dazzrazz, you typify N4G.... You also, get many agrees, which really shows the mental age of many on this site.....

[lelo]

What indies and fanboys fail to understand... Xbox is Microsoft's console and they can do what the hell they want with it. If they want to add a parity clause, then they will. If you are a indie developer, you have two choices, accept Microsoft's rules or don't accept Microsoft rules. Simple as that. It's business.

If Microsoft annuls this parity clause, they are screwed. All indies will release their games firstly on the PS4 (because of their larger install base) and release it secondly on the X1... and quite frankly that would be bad business for Microsoft's X1.

What's perceptible is that all this whining made by indies, is to promote their games. Free publicity.

[DigitalAnalog]

Death, the saddest thing about your post is that you believe you are entitled to every game that releases. Indie as in IN-DE-PEN-DENT developers are capable of delivering the games whomever and whatever they see fit.

You don't get to say in the matter, you do not get to make decisions that punishes them for releasing the game how they see fit, if it means depriving X1 owners because of this bullshit parity clause, then so be it.

[Death]

Which would be great if that was what an indie was. Independent developers and indie developers are not the same thing. Indies are small operation that typically consist of a couple people. They are more like hobbyist or home brew developers. XNA was a great example of hobbyists or "indie" as we are now calling them. These are the guys that do not have the financial resources to make bigger games. For any of these guys to get published they would have needed to make a deal with a publisher to get their work out.

Independent or third party developers that do not have close ties to any of the console manufacturers to qualify as second parties are larger professional studios. They typically rely on publishing partners to fund development of their games and then later get them released. Publishers can influence the creative process and recoup their investments when a game is released with a percentage of each sale.

Todays "indie" developers are self funded and the games are much more simple compared to traditional console offerings. Both Sony and Microsoft are allowing these indies to self publish which simply means Sony and Microsoft are actually publishing them digitally at reduced or no costs to the developer.

If indies release their games on Xbox first, the parity clause is irrelevant. If they release on both consoles at the same time, the parity clause is irrelevant. If they choose to release on Sony's console first and have an exclusivity agreement, the clause is irrelevant. The only ones that feel the clause is an issue are the ones that feel they should be able to what they want, when they want. My advise to this small group of devs is to build and release a console. Once this indie fad dies down, most will be going back to their day jobs anyway. The amount of people wanting to play budget games on their new consoles isn't as big as many want to believe.

[SilentNegotiator]

You don't respect indie developers. Now that MS doesn't have dominion over them, you xbox fanboys seem to hate indie developers at every opportunity; ESPECIALLY when they have the "audacity" to not get co-operation from MS.

That's what fanboys do; you love things when they benefit your favorite system and then hate them when they disadvantage them.

[GribbleGrunger]

It's good to see Indie developers standing up for themselves. And of course the X1 gamer benefits because they get lots more games too.

[raWfodog]

Maybe the parity clause will change/go away with the new guy in charge since everyone says that he's all about the games...

[GribbleGrunger]

I believe it will eventually. Out of all the execs I've seen over at MS, he seems the most genuine.

[MCTJim]

So, then dont publish your game on the X1...If MS drop that clause...they will still whine. I'm sorry and I am sure I will get many disagrees, but I feel SOME indie devs have an entitlement attitude.

[aerisbueller]

X1 owners have the antonym of an entitlement attitude (whatever the word for that is). You guys will just eat any old sh!t MS throws at you. It's a cancer on the industry that these companies that do stuff like this have an army of followers ready to defend and praise every crappy move they make.

[SamPao]

If there is a problem for anyone. Stand up against it. When they change it. Good for everyone.
The end.

Stop whining, you can only profit

[Death]

All they need is a signed excluisivity agreement for a period of time from Sony if they want to release on the Xbox later. This has been the work around for other indie devs that don't have the resources to launch on both consoles and choose Sony first.

What is Microsoft asking? Sign exclusively with them, sign exclusively with us or launch on both at the same time. Unless Sony is refusing exclusive deals with indies, I don't really see what the issue is.

@AirisBueller,
That's a pretty foolish thing to say. Just because you believe and stand up for anything Sony may say, that doesn't make Microsoft or Xbox fans wrong. I don't recall ever seeing a Playstation fan say paying to play online is awesome. Most said they would never pay a subscription fee. Sony made PS+ mandatory to play online and suddenly it was a brilliant idea since the money would be used to make online gaming better. You rolled, you took it and you said thank you. How exactly does that make you or Sony any different?

[aerisbueller]

Actually if the comment history here or at youtube lets you search back far enough, I was one of the few people criticizing Sony for the same thing. I don't own any next gen consoles yet, but I'm more excited for Oculus and Star Citizen, and everything about to happen on PC, so my only dog in this fight is what I think is right for the industry, and historically Sony is a lot closer to the mark.

As far as the paywall, what makes Sony different is that they're only screwing you out of retail games being played online. You can still browse the web, watch netflix, hulu, play free-to-play games online. Completely different level at MS where they lockdown even the tiniest drop of internet access. Also, PS-plus offers games people actually want.

Lastly, this discussion isn't about the paywall (though it was good of you to notice that's yet another crappy MS invention), it's about their indie program. Even when they copied Sony, and tried to pander to indie-devs and their supporters, they had to go the extra mile to add in anti-consumer, anti-competitive, bullying the little guy policies. Typical MS bull.

[kayoss]

@MCTJim
If no indie developers are happy with MS and its policies then MS wouldnt have indie games on their platforms therefore there is no need for a "parity Clause".

MS wants indie games, but they are pushing small indie studios back into a corner. The ID@Xbox is very good and benefits Indie studios. However, that one parity clause is what needs to go. Its similar to that stance that Microsoft had with Xbox 360 games
If the 3rd party games releasing on multiplatorm. The Xbox 360 version have to identical or better if not it will not be allowed to be released on their console.

[GribbleGrunger]

So how far would you suggest MS let this go? It's already at 250 Indie devs on the X1 and 1000 Indie devs on the PS4. That's bad enough but it could get much worse if more devs decide to make a stand like this. The longer MS wait, the more the PS4 becomes the go to console for Indie gaming. The clock is ticking and MS are running out of time.

[maniacmayhem]

If you don't like the clause then don't put your game on Xbox One. If devs want the clause to be changed this badly then make it known you will not port the game to the Xbox One.

It has already been established that MS will go on a case by case basis with each game. I don't see any reason to keep complaining about something that has been established.

I also heard through some people that this clause only applies to indie devs who get a free dev kit and Unity license through MS. Don't know how true that is, but would sound reasonable if it was.

[ziggurcat]

"If you don't like the clause then don't put your game on Xbox One"

well, you're in luck because if devs happen to put their game out on any other system first, they wouldn't be able to release it for xbox anyway since the clause won't allow them.

[DigitalRaptor]

This attitude is just what MS is hoping for.

Their anti-consumer, industry-damaging decisions that they reversed for the Xbone were "already established", and look how we helped change them for the better. Stop justifying something that would be better and more reasonable if it came without senseless restrictions.

What does Microsoft (a MULI-BILLION dollar corporation) stand to lose from dropping this clause? All this does is hurt indie developers working to a strict budget, throws out any good will that they're trying to build with ID@Xbox, and ensures less games for Xbone.

[maniacmayhem]

"What does Microsoft (a MULI-BILLION dollar corporation) stand to lose from dropping this clause?"

They don't stand to lose anything, but what it does ensure is that their user base gets the game first or at the same time as any other console. A good win for the gamer, which most of us on N4G are.

If it truly ensures less games as you mentioned then MS must be really worried and would be quick to drop the clause. This is obviously not the case since they are so adamant on keeping it. Which is why there must be something else to it than what you are stating.

Which leads me to the free Unity and dev kit rumor I heard through the grapevine.

[DigitalRaptor]

A good win for the gamer?

You mean a good win for the fanboy who hates the fact that the more successful, easier to develop for console is getting the game first because the developers have their own financial limitations?
--------

"Which leads me to the free Unity and dev kit rumor I heard through the grapevine."

See and this is the issue we have here. If that were true, Microsoft would save themselves the hassle and the criticism and come out and clarify that were the case. It's not.

In the exact same way that if the family game share policy was all it was cracked up to be, they would've come out and cleared the waters. They wouldn't have cancelled post-conference interviews and would have clarified a LOT of other things. I'm sorry, but that isn't enough, when developers have already been interfacing with the policy and found it detrimental to their way of making money as a small business.

[BitbyDeath]

@maniac, they can't afford to release on both platforms at once, that is the issue. They need a return investment to get started on the next platform.

PS4 has roughly double the userbase so of course indies will go their first. As it means they will get a larger return.

Indies aren't rolling in cash, they take risks that could cost them with every title, they need to be smart about how they deliver.

[maniacmayhem]

@Digital

"You mean a good win for the fanboy who hates the fact that the more successful,..."

No Digital, a win for a Xbox user who is now guaranteed that their system will get a game at the same time as PS4 or even an exclusive.

As I have said before it is an inconvenience to some developers but obvious not enough because there are still more than enough devs signing up to put their games on Xbox One.

If it was truly as painful as you and others are making it out to be I think there would be close to zero devs working on the Xbox.

And in no way am I defending this policy. I have no idea why its in place other than the rumor or that MS wants their system to have the game first or at the same time as other consoles which is a benefit only to the Xbox gamer.

@Bitby
You can say that about any business. Trust me I know, I've been at a few that went under due to underperformance.

But just because a system has a larger install base doesn't mean a bigger return or huge success. One look at mobile can tell you this. One might find success and a bigger "buzz" on a smaller platform.

Like I said, if a dev wants to complain about the policy then they shouldn't be putting the game the Xbox One system.

That's like me complaining about how bad McDonalds food is while I'm ordering a double quarter pounder with cheese. What's the point.

[XabiDaChosenOne]

"I don't see any reason to keep complaining about something that has been established."
Thankfully no one pissed about the X1 drm had the same complacent mentality as you.

[maniacmayhem]

Thank god for patriots like you then.
Because for me, I just would have went with a PS4/WiiU combo from the jump.

[Julion0715]

Exactly if you dnt like having ur weak ass indie title on a system bcuz of a clause for it to be released on both systems at the same time then gtfo that's a weak ass complaint, now if ur being mistreated or forced to give up ur ideas then that's different voice that but not this weak shit

[MoveTheGlow]

Jesus tap-dancing Jones, if you haven't played Super Crate Box or Luftrausers or the early-access-but-still-amazing Nuclear Throne and you have the gall to call a Vlambeer game "weak," just go play one first.

Heck, Super Crate Box is 100% no-BS free. http://www.supercratebox.co...

Maybe it's not your cup of tea, and maybe you couldn't last a second in SFMT mode, but good lord, do NOT trash these games out of ignorance. There's a community of gamers who would play that over just about any AAA game.

[yewles1]

Holy crap these comments...

"WAAAHHH!!! Don't put your game here if you don't like it"

They JUST ANNOUNCED they're not going to, and explained why. LMFAO!!!

[MasterCornholio]

Shows how intelligent some posters on N4G are.

Jeez when will those people learn how to read.

[Grimhammer00]

I think you miss the point.
If MS was a small time publisher you might be ok.

But they are huge part of the industry. Their policies effect the minds many industry publishes and developers.

By the way....parity clause is not simply "release at same time". Geez

A parity clause hampers competition. Why bother to push for excellence when you can force devs to downgrade their game elsewhere? Rather than find innovative ways to compete with ps4 (or lesser degree PC), just force parity!

Its bad business practice and it hurts the art of gaming.

Defending nonsense like this really shows how good big corps are at manipulating us.

[MasterCornholio]

In my opinion Microsoft needs to stop hurting their consumers and abolish these draconian policys that only a mindless zombie would accept.

[jnemesh]

Why? They haven't backed down on the anti-dev/anti-consumer policies with Surface, Windows Phone or Windows 8! What makes you think they care about their Xbox devs/customers?

[jnemesh]

Xbox fanbois always point out how many "great" exclusives they are going to have on their underpowered console, but the TRUTH is, Microsoft is ACTIVELY alienating indie devs! No devs = no games...it's as simple as that. Sony has THREE TIMES the devs as Microsoft, so that should tell you which platform is going to have more exclusive games right there!

(Cue angry retorts that XBone doesn't need "Crap" indie games)

[incendy35]

I understand why they want launch parity, but it is time for MS to just open up the store and get out of the way, similar to what they do with Windows Store.

[bleedsoe9mm]

if there ia an indie game i'm interested in buying and its out on steam weeks before the console thats where i'm going to play it , the fact it comes to the consoles later is meaningless but maybe thats just me

[Kingoftherodeo]

this is stupid if any one of us was head of xbox we would want the games to launch with us first or at the same time as other consoles. indie developers feel like they are making AAA tittles and are entitled to their own terms.

[Julion0715]

Who cares jus release a damn game both systems need more and better games that's why we come here if we had good games no one would be here