Belgium's Gaming Commission declares loot boxes are gambling, wants them banned in Europe

PowerUp! - "Belgium’s Gaming Commission has been investigating whether loot boxes in video games constitute gambling. Today, we can report that the Gaming Commission has decided in the affirmative."

[chrisx]

This is just awesome news. fcuk ea and corporate greed. A win for Gamers and hopefully more victories against this type of evil ahead.

[thekhurg]

Yep. Wish stuff like this would hit the US as well.

[_-EDMIX-_]

Well US defines gambling a little bit differently. I was listening to an IGN podcast and they were saying because you're actually getting something from those loot crate's the United States can't actually Define it as gambling because something is actually being received.

I think based on Disney likely not wanting to be linked to this controversy you're likely not going to see Electronic Arts continue this on Battlefront.

As for other game publishers, who knows I was reading earlier that Activision as like these crates for Call of Duty World War 2 where people could buy them with real money.

[fiveby9]

This is great news. I live in the U.S. but I'm sorry I just don't agree with the ESRB's use of the legal definition of gambling. The dictionary definition is more appropriate to consumers.

Gambling - the activity or practice of playing at a game of chance for money or other stakes.

It's dishonest on EA and other publishers parts to use some supposed loophole of getting something of value which you perhaps didn't want at all as recourse for considering it not gambling.

[badz149]

Blizzard has been doing it differently in China. I can see similar things happening elsewhere if this becomes a law. if lootboxes are deemed as illegal, they will find another way to implement it.

[tehpees3]

It will. When one leads the others follow. I've told you guys for quite some time that people need to stand against software laws as we can get them altered. It isn't a case of "entitled gamers". People need to stop that line and wake up. These multi-million dollar corporations are truthfully the entitled ones.

We call them out from our computers and they claim to monitor our feedback but they've never listened. Now they'll listen and they'll start saying how "its not fair" but you know what = it is. Anybody who is going along with the "entitled gamer" line is either being paid or is just a corporate sheep and should be ashamed of themselves.

These corporate suits DO get reincarnated into serious poverty problems in their next lifetime and anybody who stands and defends it will also get that payment because whether it is legally right it still isn't morally right. It is people with serious money and power abusing it. If you are among those people you are breaking moral laws and you will get paid back for that negatively one day. Its just a matter of time. just don't think to yourself "why me?" in your mid way next time because the chances are you are the reincarnation of Andrew Wilson. If you join him it is because you called out innocent buyers who had to put up with their tactics.

Karma effects everybody involved in this morally wrong corrupt market. Whether you are involved with this practice or defend it you will get paid back. So if you are defending this of your own free will just to insult somebody behind your computer you should think about what you are doing because karma has you in it's sight.

[kyzer1978]

Nah Disney doesn't care about gambling. Think MGM grand in Las Vegas.

[nitus10]

@_-EDMIX-_

Here is a snippet of the US legal definition of gambling: https://definitions.uslegal...

"A person engages in gambling if he stakes or risks something of value upon the outcome of a contest of chance or a future contingent event not under his control or influence, upon an agreement or understanding that he or someone else will receive something of value in the event of a certain outcome."

Under that definition loot boxes are gambling. Of course, I am quite sure it can be spun in such a way that the opposite is true especially if you use legalese to define what "something of value" is.

[UltraNova]

Excellent news, now lets see how long it will take them to turn this decision into a EU law (if it reaches the parliament) and then how long it will take them to enforced it.

[arkard]

@Edmix of course is gambling. If I put a dollar in a slot machine and get a guaranteed penny back I'm not gambling? Someone should tell the casinos they'd be able to open up to kids.

[Magnes]

Are the card packs that you buy with random cards in it illegal in Europe?

[rainslacker]

If a publisher can't do it in the eu, then likely they wouldn't do a separate implementation elsewhere. They'll think of new ways to screw the customer over

[ArmrdChaos]

"Well US defines gambling a little bit differently. I was listening to an IGN podcast and they were saying because you're actually getting something from those loot crate's the United States can't actually Define it as gambling because something is actually being received."

This really is BS logic. The only way this would be true is if you were always guarantied to get something back you currently do not have. When someone spends money just to get back the same item he already has ten of then effectively he has received nothing. I have seen some models where you are re-credited for items you already have, but the credits you get back are always less than what you put in forcing you to buy more.

[G3ng4r]

As much work developers have to put into a modern aaa game these days I can see the price for them jumping a bit without pay to win bs. These aren't little ps2 games anymore. Not defending corporate greed but as games get bigger and sharper loot boxes were likely a way to compensate.

[-Foxtrot]

Holy shit...this could start something.

Imagine an Overwatch where you just gain coins after a match in the future and everything is in a store menu you can select what to unlock. It would keep Blizzard on their toes and make them quicker in creating content.

Kind of funny since they are the ones who started this...how....poetic

[Parasyte]

Blizzard didn’t start the loot box trend. Call of Duty was doing it before Overwatch.

[notachance]

card-games with card-packs already started this long ago though

and most valve games been doing that since the start, TF2, CS:GO, Dota 2.. although they're cosmetic only, so pretty much no one cares because they didn't affect gameplay at all

it's EA with their hilarious full-priced pay-to-win shenanigans that stirs shit up for publishers lol

[_-EDMIX-_]

I was just about to say that Call of Duty actually did supply drops years before OverWatch release.

And to my understanding OverWatch crates are just cosmetic stuff

[Testfire]

@Foxtrot, CSGO popularized loot boxes well before Overwatch and there have been controversies tied with them and gambling for years already.

[fiveby9]

I think you're right, the solution from publishers will be to remove the element of chance and just make it a store where you can buy what you want. If you want a game of chance in your game then don't bring real-world money into it or it's gambling.

[Aenea]

and then you can throw real money at it and buy those in-game coins!

also means people will probably spend less money, wonder what companies will do to recoup that lost income...

[nitus10]

@notachance

While I do agree on principle to what you said the main component of gambling is the "chance" of getting a particular item or items but not necessarily the ones you would like only after making a purchase.

You are quite right in pointing out the cosmetic nature of earlier loot boxes which IMHO are still a form of gambling but they are not "pay to win" (err. "Accelerated Experience" 😎) and on this many gamers are now drawing the line.

Other methods of purchase such as what you will find in microtransactions and in-game shops are not chance since you can see what you are buying.

[Kosic]

Nah, blizzard would just go the route of World of Warcraft and have the unique, sweet looking items behind a cosmetic pay wall/store.

Nothing in the gambling rules of having cosmetic dlc everywhere.

[InTheZoneAC]

How poetic? They started this? Smdh

If games remove the lottery rolls for loot boxes and allow you to directly buy cosmetics I guarantee you each tier will be even more expensive than it is now. I actually like overwatch's system, I just don't support whales who dish out money on every event hoping to get everything.

[mochachino]

The less money Blizzard gets from the whales spending on loot boxes just means less free content for the people that were not spending anything on loot boxes and riding on the backs of whales who funded the devs to support the game long term.

Your're more likely to get more sequels requiring that you spend another $60 instead of more support and content for the original game.

Cosmetic loot boxes only are good thing if you want your original purchase to be relevant for years. A small number of people fund your free content.

[Malacath]

More likely you wouldn't get games like overwatch any more. GTA Online would probably be shut down, Free to play games would either switch to a subscription model or shut down.

Seriously it astounds me how no one seems to realise that servers cost money to run. Multiplayer only games that keep getting updated just wouldn't exist if it wasn't for microtransactions. Games like GTA online would have it's shark cards system banned so development on the game would stop and servers would get shut down.

If you don't like microtransactions ignore them. You can still play the game without buying a single lootcrate, sharkcard or whatever other variation of them there is. You'll know what I mean when people are complaining their favourite multiplayer games are getting shut down due to lack of money

[Mikey94]

Well remember its not just EA and to be fair Activision started loot crates before anyone everyone else just jumped on board cause they saw the money they were making by robbing people.

[mkis007]

Well they could just raise the standard price of games by 50, or institute subs for all games go get around ..... I don't think this is going to end up favorably...

[Testfire]

Yep, fuck EA, Activision, Blizzard, Valve, MS and anyone else who puts these in games

[threefootwang]

Forgot Sony as well...but I'm sure that was accidental of course 😉

[Testfire]

Why would that not be accidental? I'm not aware of any PS games with loot boxes.

[UCForce]

@threefootwang True, but you just defending MS more than ever. After all, Sony,MS and probably Nintendo and major third publishers will have to learn not to mess with consumers. @Testfire Well, PS games like Uncharted 4 MP have MT but it isn’t that lot. And yes, I did read John Kodera is the new CEO of SIE will explore more about MT. But like I said, recent events like EA Battlefront 2 MT fiasco, this will cause Sony, MS and others major publishers will think twice about messing up with consumers.

[threefootwang]

"defending MS more then ever?"

Lol please UCForce, get real.

I'm simply stating that Sony is also responsible for this, and to not include them would incite a bias against the other companies, while they continue to look innocent...which would just be crazy on N4G of all sites lol.

You can accuse me of "defending" MS, but the truth is you've been here much longer then I have and you've spent way more time then I have defending Sony.

[Liqu1d]

@threefootwang

Who cares who he forgot? His point was clear so stop being so sensitive just because he brought up MS.

[ZeroX9876]

As much as I hate micro-transactions, we know what's coming next. They'll want more money for their games for sure to cover for the loss in MT.

increase game price is on the way if this passes.

[InTheZoneAC]

Loot boxes only maximize profits, which are plentiful regardless. Games will continue to be sold at $60 or they won't sell at all.

[jrshankill]

Well, we have you crybabies to thank when software prices hike up. Thanks.

[Krysis]

While I agree with your sentiment and this is a victory, what scares me is this leads the way to government bodies meddling in the gaming industry and that's not what any of us want.

[mochachino]

Well there goes all the long term free Overwatch content. Get ready for annual sequels in everything and more paid DLC.

[Malacath]

You wont be saying that when your favourite online games whether free or paid for stop receiving updates or get servers shut down because no more money will be coming in.

It astounds me how a high proportion of the gaming community think that gaming is some sort of charity and that developers spend millions developing games and running servers to get nothing back.

If you don't like lootcrates don't buy them but people who do buy them are keeping the servers running for some of their favourite games.

[CyberSentinel]

Don’t celebrate just yet, EA has plenty of options, they could raise game prices or release games through a digital distribution only model.

They could even do a combination of both, digital games $60 (with a one week early exclusive access incentive) or a “limited” (pre-order only) physical release for $100+

[OnionThief]

Finally we're seeing a step in the right direction for the industry. Maybe one day we can go back to the days where the price you paid for the title offered you the full experience without having to pay any additional installments.

[NotoriousWhiz]

Yep. One price. You get the whole game. No more free updates aside from bug fixes. I'm okay with that.

[jrshankill]

It will never happen, and if it does, you will pay more for the base game.

[OnionThief]

@jrshankill But it does happen. Mario Odyssey released with no season pass, no DLC, no microtransactions and even the amiibo content could be unlocked for in game currency after beating the story...

[arkard]

@jrshan they can charge more, doesn't mean I have to buy it. I have no problem waiting till something reaches a reasonable price to buy it.

[XisThatKid]

@OnionTheif that's probably because they were preparing that to be the last Mario game on a dedicated Nintendo console. The content and quality and timing screams "we may not be able to do this ever again".

[TargusX]

Yup totally, well said.

[XiNatsuDragnel]

Yes this is a win for gamers

[Juvia]

Juvia agrees. This is absolutely a step in the right direction.

[XiNatsuDragnel]

Juvia why aren't you with Gray? Yes all wins is you need.

[XisThatKid]

Juvia you should come over without Gray.

[XiNatsuDragnel]

Xikid

Dang man about to tap!?!?

[Mr-Dude]

Very good

[slate91]

Awesome

[datriax]

Belgium. The first country in the world to show it has the brains, and backbone, to stand up to this bulls**t.

[Leeroyw]

Fantastic news.
I'm sick of semantics and people trying to argue what does or doesn't constitute gambling. This is a great result.
It's anti consumer.
Bring back one fee, one game.

[badz149]

http://www.gamesindustry.bi...

in China

[TankCrossing]

Oh wow, did not expect that. Chin chin, Belgium!

[Seraphim]

No shocker there. To bad American Gov favors corporations these days.

[Nyxus]

Oh boy! I'm very amused right now.

[00]

it begins.

[jrshankill]

Yup. Can't wait for those ads to appear in my single player experience!

[Mikelarry]

Hhahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Majin-vegeta]

Too bad this wont happen in Murica cuz of corporations...

[-Foxtrot]

Still...if it gets more serious they might have to develop their online structure different in Europe...and honestly can you imagine how frustrating that's going to be in development. In the end they might just go "f*** it, we're working extra hard here, lets just get rid of lootboxes all together so we can follow Europes laws, it's easier on us"

[mkis007]

Devils advocate here...i think you're looking at the positive solution, but forgetting where most of the sales happen...suffice it to say I don't think the 60$ price will last much longer.

[TankCrossing]

^^The $60 price tag isn't at risk. Publishers have already established that if they increase the price it hurts sales to the extent that they make less money. That is the only reason prices haven't gone up already, and that truth isn't changing.

Lower budgets, less risky projects, more incentives for customers to go digital. These are more likely ways they will try to apply the squeeze. That and more micro-transactions.

[Bobafret]

God please F off with that "Murica" garbage.

[Mikelarry]

it has

https://www.youtube.com/wat...

thank me later

[Majin-vegeta]

VIVA LA REVOLUTION!!

Thanks EA for making all this happen

[LandoCalrissiano]

Go listen to the ign podcast with the creators of cuphead. They were literally pouring concrete and web designing before they made it. Those are the type of people who own corporations. Not every corporation is McDonald's. (plus, their family concrete business is also a corporation)

[TheColbertinator]

Very proud of the Belgian courts for taking a logical concise stance.

[UCForce]

Just don’t forget about Dutch Authorities and French Senator and Haiwai Government. They are also against this gambling.

[OhNoes]

Bap, bap, bap!

[Prubar]

This might be a little short sighted. I mean you guys want games but aren't willing to pay for em and this might further lead to developers shutting down. Like everyone says it costs way more to make games but the prices have stayed the same. You guys complain about loot crates, season passes, the idea of games going up in price, DLC, hell you even complain when a free game comes out and you already purchased it. The fact that some of you think Battlefront 2 should be ftp shows how entitled you are. Clearly that game has a massive amount of work and polish put into it. But ah well. I still pay for the things I enjoy (like music) to support the people creating content I enjoy. If developers can't make a profit this will surely be the end to AAA games other than GTA.

[OnionThief]

I want games and I'm willing to pay for them. Hell I'll buy collectors editions if they come with nice things.
I don't believe AAA games manage their budgets reasonably. I don't see why gaming should cost that much that make, I would rather games return to cheaper and more humble budgets while focusing on gameplay, content and soundtrack all while offering a bug-free experience.

Falcom is one of my favourite developers because even though their games look like they're made for the PS2, they have fun gameplay, tons of content and incredible soundtracks. I'm willing to pay upwards of £60 for old games (I just recently spent over £100 on a single retro game) because they offer a full and fun experience.
What I'm not willing to pay is £50 + £40 season pass and then have the game have little content, tons of cut features for microtransactions and pre-order bonuses, and then in addition to this content locked behind a gaming mechanic.

It's true games cost a lot more than they used to, but they're also a lot easier to make than they used to thanks to newer software and languages. They're a lot cheaper to distribute thanks to no longer using cartridges but discs and digital downloads. Games don't NEED to be this expensive, publishers choose to make them expensive.

[arkard]

Everyone compares games to having budgets of Hollywood movies. Yet Hollywood movies survive on a 10$ theatre ticket and selling retail for max 30$. Games sell for 60$ and CA t break even? Something is wrong

[notachance]

it costs way more because they put ads in the goddamn super bowls

and I only consider microtransactions if the game was built to last for years, like Overwatch, CS:GO, Dota 2, LoL... with these games it's clear that the MT is designed so that the game can be maintained and regularly updated even though we only ever pay for it once

not some fucking annual $60 cash-in where it's obvious they're planning to make you cough-up a full-price for a re-skin next-year, and they want to put in some pay-to-win shit on that?? it's pure greed, through and through.

and let me tell you something, the initial $60 is more than enough to turn profit. It's just that they already know what number the MT brings in, add to that the fact it's basically cost them nothing to add MTs in, they simply won't be able to go back from it if they want to see year-to-year increase.

[fenome]

C'mon dude, it's not our fault they're spending like $200 million on games that are barely different than the last one. They use the same engines and assets repeatedly, it's not even like they build it all from scratch every single time. Maybe they should spend a little better.

Call me cheap because I expect more? Seriously. I'll pay top dollar for quality product but I'm not spending extra for a run of the mill shooter, those things are a dime a dozen right now.

[TacoTaru]

Let's not forget that the companies that produced and sold games in the past didn't have to support the enormous multi-million dollar salaries of corporate executives and bunches of investors that demand large returns on investments. The guys in charge now have spent their lives in pursuit of profit, not just making a living producing games. It's what they do.

[zivtheawesome]

It just means developers needs to be more efficient and take notes from companies like Sony where most of their AAA games cost about 40M$ which is definitely affordable without loot boxes.

[Many-hat5]

Not everyone says it costs way more to make games. I don't for one. Sure, many are spending more, because they can, but that doesn't mean it necessarily has to cost more. Games may go up slightly, but that would be an upopular move, and players would simply walk away or buy used.

[Sonic_Vs_Mario]

Misleading
This title is wrong. They are not banning games with loot boxes, they are going to PROPOSE a law to possibly ban games with loot boxes.
Here is the translated Dutch Article:

"Minister of Justice wants to prohibit purchases in video games, if you do not know what you exactly mean with that purchase. "Mixing gambling and gaming, especially at a young age, is dangerous for the mental health of the child." The fuss arose last week around the new game Star Wars: Battlefront. In it you could first buy so-called 'loot crates', virtual boxes that could provide certain benefits for the game. Only you do not know in advance what the content of such a lootcrate entails. "The mixing of money and addiction is gambling", the Kanspel Committee then ruled. VTM NIEUWS brought the news and a few days later removed maker Electronic Arts the function from the game, including after criticism from Disney, which has the rights to the Star Wars merchandising. Geens now wants to prevent such functions from being able to occur in games at all. "But that takes time, because we have to go to Europe. We will certainly try to ban it. "
Edit: Added article with translation

[yomfweeee]

Uhhh there's nothing misleading. Title says "wants them banned", it doesn't say they are banned.

[EatCrow]

I cannot believe it!!!!
GOOODDDD!!!!

Truth will win always.

[yomfweeee]

I honestly don't find it that big of a deal. All these companies have to do is take the chance out of it. Instead of paying 99 cents for a 20% chance at the item you want... they'll just make you pay $5 for that item.

[ocelot07]

Well that will take the gambling away at least which is the main issue for me. MT can be done right in paid for games such as Rainbow Six Siege.

[TheColbertinator]

I dont mind that. Give me what you advertised and I buy it depending if I want it.

[Liqu1d]

I'll accept cosmetic microtransactions for free DLC. I don't like the predatory mechanics of loot boxes. If I want a cool skin then let me buy it instead of gambling for it.

[Elda]

A possibility Blizzard will start charging in that part of the land for the future characters & maps as paid dlc.

[jokerisalive]

Hell yeah! Finally people with balls not putting up with the BS greedy practices of companies like EA who are trying to milk gamers for all they can get. Best news I heard all day!

[ZehnDrachen]

Great news

[Artemidorus]

Excellent news, ban it.

[BenjaMan64]

It may not mean the end of microtransactions. Instead of selling loot boxes, they may just sell in-game cash to purchase the desired items. Blizzard already did something like that in China:

http://www.gamesindustry.bi...

[SegaGamer]

Yep. The only thing that could possibly change in the future is the way loot boxes are handled. We will still be asked to use real money to buy items in the game, the difference will be that we will know what it is we are buying rather than it being a gamble.

It's great that it seem's there are steps being taken to stop this gambling crap in gaming, but in the grand scheme of things, things wouldn't be that much better off for us.

[Muzikguy]

I wish that the government here in America wasn’t so corrupt and would do things like this. Stand up for their citizens, block monopolies, stuff like that. Awesome news here!

[cfc83]

Well done Koen Geens. Hopefully you and your fellow Belgians can lead the charge against these loots.

[Bobafret]

Next up: $100 games.

[ianyoung3]

It's like people think they can continue to ask for more and more in video games without having to fit the bill in some manner. The price of games is going to increase if you want loot boxes gone all together. As long as they are ok with that. The developers should not be slaving over games that are 2x, 3x the size scope and ambition and COST and the consumers see no effect in the pricing structure.

[Bobafret]

Games have also been the same price for how long now? While production cost has sky rocketed for the AAA games.

[AnubisG]

You people keep forgetting something very important. Gaming has gone mainstream and more and more people play now than ever before. In fact, ir has been proven that game development cost has not skyrocketed at all. In fact, it has gone down in the past few years. Stop defending companies like EA.

[Bobafret]

@anubis-I am not defending EA, and please show me where costs have gone down, real proof not heresay.

[AnubisG]

@Bobafet,

Sure my guy, look at this video or a complete and in depth explanation on why costs are actually gone down than up:

https://www.youtube.com/wat...

[ianyoung3]

Yeah at the end of the day I think the industry needs to re evaluate the pricing structure. I am not saying that every game needs to be $80 going forward. But to me it seems to make sense that if a game like Senuas Sacrifice is $30, then a game that requires double or triple the effort should cost double the price. Those premium AAA experiences would be justified in charging $79.99.

[PowerUpAU]

Welcome to Australia

[AspiringProGenji]

Collectors edition already cost $100
Some other editions are also $80 and even $90

Wake up!
Games rised above $60 long time ago :;)

[Bobafret]

I always buy the base game and get any add ons when they are either dirt cheap or free.

[Liqu1d]

Games have also increased in price in countries other than America as well.

[Imalwaysright]

Bobafret

How about fox engine allowing to reduce development costs by 1/5? http://www.metalgearinforme...

This is not a bad looking game by today's AAA standards or at least I don't think it is https://www.youtube.com/wat...

It has been selling for €30 since day one and without DLC and it is profitable http://www.ign.com/articles... crazy right? I don't know how much it sold but I think we can both agree that it didn't sell nowhere near as much as SWBF1 with its more than 14 million copies sold. If a game like Hellblade is profitable selling at €30, without season passes and DLC and selling nowhere near as much as SWBF1 can you think of a reason why SWBF1 wouldn't be profitable selling at €60 with season passes and DLC?

[fenome]

Let them try it, they'll change that quick too when nobody buys it. They're not trying to stay competitive, they're just trying to get more money for less work. Why wouldn't they? They've been heavy rewarded for doing the bare minimum since last gen. There are still plenty of other options available.

[ianyoung3]

To be honest I never pay any mind to loot boxes nor have they ever ruined a gaming experience for me. This appears to a be a win in the short term but when the price of games goes up from $59.99 to $69.99 we will see how the industry takes it. And I am talking about the base game.

[HyperMouse]

they talk about raising prices, honestly it wont work id say, if they did i (and id say others) would take less chances on games that im not sure on and would wait until they came down or not buy something at all, and piracy would probably increase if thats even possible

[ianyoung3]

For any industry I believe in fair pricing. There is a fair expectation to have on both sides. As consumers the expectation cannot be push the medium forward, give us more immersive sandboxes to play in but oh by the way we don't want to pay for it.

[Aenea]

it will also mean publishers will stick to things that they know will work and sell...

I just hope that if this gets pushed through that the wording is clear enough that only the uncertainty part is considered bad and not that all microtransactions will be disallowed...

[Mikelarry]

They certainly can try to increase it but they will sell less. also i was reading an article a couple of days a go where EA informed investors that turning of MTx (microtransactions) would not affect anything to me that means all this "games are too expensive arguments to make" and somehow that charging for MTx is the only way to publishers can keep creating games just goes out the window and the $60 we are paying is more than enough

Also with Senua sacrifice happening that argument of games being too expensive just seems like a tale these AAA publishers have spread so that they can implement this anti consumer crap

[ianyoung3]

There is certainly room in the pricing structure for games of all prices. For a game like Senua, I believe based on what we got in that game the pricing was fair. But for games that take double or triple the man power to create it makes sense that game would be double or even triple the price and the same works in then other direction as well

[KTF26]

from $59.99 to $69.99!!!
last one cost $109.98 if you buy the game with the season pass
and if you buy the DLCs separately it'll cost even more

[HyperMouse]

Thank you someone else gets it too

[ocelot07]

If they don't put any MT or Lootboxes in there titles then raising the RRP by $10 is fine by me.

[HyperMouse]

Hells yeeahhh one down lets hope the rest follow suit

[Stevonidas]

Hell yeah.

First Europe, and then... THE WORLD!!!

[Tsuru]

Only a matter of time till this spreads to other things as well. Trading card games will end up being effected, because they are no different then loot boxes. Only a matter of time till this gets reversed when players are outraged they can't get extras anymore, while the rest of the world gets to get them.

[UCForce]

Hell yes !

[ocelot07]

This is great news.

[Relientk77]

Omg yes sounds good to me!

[Dixiedevil]

In celebration, tomorrow morning I’ll be having a Belgian waffle.

[King_Lothric]

Here in the US we gamers must take justice in our hands and fight our own battles. The government is not going to help us.

We must teach Casino Arts a lesson and show them who is boss here.

[kevinsheeks]

Yep we legit have to shout and tear down corporate greed ourselves because the corruption is too deep

[rocketpanda]

That is definitely a positive step and publishers only have themselves to blame. I only hope this sets a trend and followed up by other EU countries. But knowing publishers they will find ways or loopholes around loot boxes to keep them in-game via other methods. Blizzard did something similar in China finding a loophole to keep selling loot boxes.

Meanwhile the ESRB did nothing and said it wasn't gambling because I guess they didn't want to go through hassle of having some form of regulation on it or even lobbied. I can imagine if there were no social media outlets and platforms that publishers would have free reign to do as they like without much problems. The two things gamers can do is vote with their wallets and heavily criticize their practices on social media(not death threats). Buying the product and saying you won't buy and MT means nothing to the publishers, they still got your money and preying on the vulnerable.

[Mikelarry]

My fellow americans it seems we have a new chanllenger.... HAWAII

https://www.youtube.com/wat...

[AnubisG]

This is great. Now look for people still trying to justify loot boxes.

This is a huge blow to EA and all these shitball publishers pushing this garbage.

[UCForce]

Don’t forget about Haiwai Government. They are also against this BF 2 gambling.

[ClanPsi1]

Oh sweet Jesus, yes!

[MetalNCarnet]

Well then, that's that.

[MetalGearAlex]

https://www.youtube.com/wat... in regards to "US" (specifically Hawaii) looking into Star Wars Battlefront II gambling/lootbox practices. a win! again and again against evil and EA.

[lociefer]

F YEEZZ

[Cy]

Stupid. If Loot Boxes are gambling then so are those quarter machines that give you a random prize. Terrible precedant, but I'm not surprised it's coming from Europe.

[jojo319]

I’m sure the lobbiests will make this disappear. If I’m reading this correctly, the Gaming Commission “wants” it, but actually passing a law is a whole different story.

[plmkoh]

I hope this gains more momentum, it's a big finger to gaming's plague: EA, Activation-Blizzard. Valve.

[NeoGamer232]

People are saying this is awesome.

But be careful what is wished for... Its replacement may be worse.

[mafiahajeri]

Lmao EA spoiled it for everyone 😂😂 if anyone should be sending death threats its all the other companies who adopt the same practice.

[houyi111]

Way to go Belgium!!

[BlackDoomAx]

Great news. Sure they will find another way to tax us, but great anyway.

[Damthatsword]

Yessss!! Go fk yourself EA!

[zerocarnage]

Finally a country with sense way to go belgium.

Those who say it isn't gambling all because you are not obtaining money are complete daft heads incapable of seeing what makes gambling what it is.

Loot boxes were actually born on free to plays on the pc, all those free mmorpg's about a decade or 14 years ago..

[ILostMyMind]

Well done.

[ILikeGamesYeah]

Seriously though, who on here actually buy loot boxes? We N4G folks are pretty clued up on it and assuming a very low percentage of people getting angry in the comments actually buy them. Do people realise that it is not a bad thing to have added content and that developers don't work for free?

The choices they have so far is paid DLC or optional crates or currency. Pay to win is awful and should never be put in games. But who cares about cosmetics if the idiots which actually fund them give us free content for more years. Just look at Rocket league, Halo 5 and Overwatch. All still have more free content being made after 1-2 years coming out.

Even CD Projekt RED who on N4G can do know wrong had an incredible DLC for The Witcher 3 which people had to pay for. Imagine if they had a multiplayer game which they wanted to keep going. Paid DLC would split the community, or they could add optional currency or just let their game die. For the people who mention instances of a free map after release date it's a marketing technique. Notice how it's always just after launch not a year after? To give people promise of more to come.

[lellkay]

Do it!!

[DrShoe]

Thank you based Belgium!

[lio_convoy]

Great news!

[Imalwaysright]

I'm really curious to see Disney's reaction to this.

[Many-hat5]

Really wasn't that complicated. If you use real money to purchase unkown items in loot boxes, it gambling. Nobody should be surprised at this decision. Well done and congrats to everyone who stood strong against not only the Publishers invovled, but all the nay sayers,too. However, it's not over yet, this is just the start. There's along way to go before it's law,but If this goes through Europe, I'm pretty sure US will follow, eventually.

[TrialNterror]

Wait, did the belgian government actually did something positive this year, this is truely astounding. All in all it's good news if this law is "contagious" and spreads throughout europe. If it's not, it's possible this could have negative ramifications for us Belgian gamers as it seems rather unlikely developers will implement adequate measures to counter-balance deeply rooted gameplay features just for the sake of one country the size of Belgium. Ultimately resulting in lesser or dumbed down experiences, I wouldn't blow the horns of victory just yet but at least it's a step in the right direction.

[WickedLester]

Question, how are loot boxes any different than say, buying a pack of Pokemon cards where you dont know which Pokemon you're getting? By that criteria wouldn't that be considered the same form of gambling?

[ocelot07]

At least with Pokemon cards you can sell them to gain some or all of your money back or trade them. With items you get in lootboxes can you trade or sell them? No

[gamer7804]

While I think it borderlines on gambling, I'd rather let the free market dictate. The less government intervention the better. Look what is happening to Star Wars Battlefront, the market spoke with sales, bad press, and consumer feedback.

[victorMaje]

Boom!

[Chexs1990]

Nice! That's good news indeed. Haha I imagine every other publisher in the world right now, going:"f**k you EA, you ruined it for us!" xD

[iofhua]

Kudos to Belgium for daring to call a duck a duck.

Hopefully we can get this common-sense law in the United States too.

[TargusX]

As thousand tons of pure pwnarge. Excellent news.

[LandoCalrissiano]

2 things for it to be gambling. 1, there's a guarantee you'll get something in return/no risk. 2, you're not doing these loot crates for more money.

[Nodoze]

LOL Now EA has screwed up revenue streams for Activision and WB Games. Nice work EA. I am sure they are really happy with you now as well.

Gamers are PISSED
Disney Corp Overlords are PISSED
Competitors revenue now jeopardized and they are PISSED
Also as a bonus the GOVT is now engaged and involved (NEVER a good thing)

EA hit this one outta the park. This is what happens when pure greed and customer exploitation drive business decisions. They could not have screwed this up more.

The real shame here is that underneath all of EA's BS is a fun game. That ship has sailed and sadly I think it will now be abandoned similar to Mass Effect.

[Malacath]

Governments should keep out of gaming. The last thing you want is governments to start dictating what is allowed in games.

I don't like lootboxes either, I just don't buy them. Governments wont stop on lootboxes they will start dictating things like how much violence should be in games.

Seriously anyone who thinks its a good thing for the governments to start interfering is an idiot.

Stop buying lootboxes and stop buying games with lootboxes. That's how they should be stopped. Not having the government interfering.

[Nyxus]

Doesn't work. I've never bought that stuff and they're still there, because there are always other people who'll buy it.

[Malacath]

So what if they are there. Ignore it. No one is putting a gun to your head and telling you to buy it;.
And if other people want to buy it so what. It's their money they should be able to spend it how they choose.

[Nyxus]

@ Malacath: except they affect the game. The progression system is made in such a way that it encourages the use of micro transactions.

[KTF26]

Government should interfere
Sane grown up people don't buy lootboxes
but do you know how much kids spend on FIFA ultimate team?
this madness must stop

[Malacath]

Then parents should set up the parental controls. It's not hard.

[2cents]

Finally some common sense has been employed to decide what is obvious to all us gamers.

I hope action is swift and meaningful.

[DarkKaine]

This is good. I rather have no games at all than pay to win garbage with RNG on top.
Now if only murica would follow.

[Felsager]

This is a great beginning and recovered soil for gamers. EA needs to change their practices and focus more on quality, delivery and performance instead of focusing their attention on our wallets with micro transactions. Guerrilla Games continue selling Horizon Zero because they committed themselves to top quality, delivery and performance.

[RedKnightOH]

EA/DICE and Activision can't fix SWBF2. Even if microtransactions and loot boxes were totally eliminated... it wouldn't make a difference now.

The major game coding is set in stone. They can't rewrite enough game code now to save the game and make it great. Grinding is all that's left to advance in the game. It will take you hundreds of hours of your game play to get you to a decent level. If you don't have the time to play and give up all your free time to do it... you're screwed.

Now we wait for Battlefield 5 next year or early 2019... and see how bad EA/DICE screws up that game!! It may be time to give up on EA/DICE for good. From reading the Wall Street business websites... Disney may drop them too.

[FernDiggidy]

Amazing!!!! Suck a fat one EA!

[BenRC01]

This is the excuse publishers (not devs) need to bump up the prices. Then we're all screwed.

[Malacath]

Of course and you can say goodbye to free to play games as well as they are funded by microtransactions

[ocelot07]

Microtransaction's are not the issue here. At least not the main issue. It's the loot boxes and the pay to win that is the issue.

Warframe is free to play. Yes it has Micro transaction's but this is how they make money. They release content updates every few months. You can use micro transaction's to buy resource's to build weapon's armour faster. Just like Shadow of War however the difference being Warframe is a free game Shadow of war is a $60 game.

Warframe does not have lootboxes and it does not need them.

[Malacath]

@ocelot07

I do agree that lootcrates should not be pay to win. They should be cosmetic only but governments wont see the difference between pay to win and cosmetic. They wont even care. A lot of games use a random card based or lootcrate type system. Even if these systems were cosmetic only they would still be banned. Once the EU gets involved you can guarantee it wont stop at lootcrates. They'll start seeing other forms of micro transactions as a problem too just because some kid somewhere spent thousands on micro transactions in a game on their dads iphone. The EU just loves to meddle in things.

Once they have their grubby paws on the gaming industry you can say goodbye to games like Warframe because the EU wouldn't give a shit whether the game was funded by the micro transactions or not.

Government interference is not the way to go.

Besides just to keep making money you could find that instead of lootcrates which are random they could just start selling pay to win items directly.

[vetebd]

doesn´t make much sense. belgium has the euromillion and lotteries. that falls under the same principle, and i don´t see them aplying the same rule. the problem is not the existence of loot boxes or gambling in general, the problem is that there are peolple falling for it. don´t want it, don´t buy it, it´s as simple as that.

[Eiyuuou]

It's because you have to be 18+ to gamble in Belgium and there is no legal age restriction on games.

[vetebd]

well actually there is. its almost like in everything else. there is age restriction for lots of things, but (almost) no one apllies those rules (at least in most countries). Having no way to implement microtransactions just means that the games you now buy for 60 bucks will cost you 90 in the near future. As simple as that.

[Mr_Writer85]

Corporate shill.

[jojo319]

Again, this is a very small step in the right direction. However, just like the "EA removes micro transactions" story, it's not all it appears. You have a commission that "wants" this to happen. It's far from actually being implemented by the government. You can bet that the game companies are going to throw tons of cash at this to make sure it doesn't.

[ocelot07]

You need to be 18 to play euromillions. At least with that you have a chance of winning money. With Star Wars BF2 it's 16 rated yet allow teenagers to gamble with lootboxes and get noting in return.

[Malacath]

No 16 actually. While you have to be 18 in the UK to gamble in the bookies or a casino you only have to be 16 to play the lottery including the Euromillions and 99% of the time you win nothing.

[Ittoittosai]

If it has odds its gambling.

[opinionated]

There are no odds of losing though, it’s not gambling. This isn’t going to change anything, games are just going to get banned in Belgium.

[Ittoittosai]

Yes it will. Disney isnt going to like this news. Its gambling period defend it all you want. If its not gambling it doesnt need odds and it has loss odd because it doesnt give what you want in every pack then you're gambling you will get what you want in the next pack thats why they like loot boxes it gets you to spend more money than just selling you packs, thats why loot boxes was added to Rainbow Six. If it isnt gambling it doesnt need percentage and odds.

[Malacath]

No for lootcrates to be gambling there would have to be a chance they are empty. Lootcrates are never empty. You always get something. Even if you already have the stuff you won in the crate you get you exchange them for points, coins scrap or whatever ingame currency is used.

[opinionated]

Retards lol. They don’t realize they just f***ed Europe.

[Ittoittosai]

Yeah its a ashame corps cant just fleece people all they want....tard.

[opinionated]

They fleece dumb people all of the time and that’s going to change because of Belgium. Other gaming commissions have already weighed in. The Belgian response of “the mix of money and addiction” can literally be applied to anything, it’s asinine and ignorant. Just like your explanation of why it’s gambling (it’s not). There are no odds to be lose.

[lildudexst]

Yes the Final blow to this trash lootbox crap. Most likely U.S will be next. By making up some new law like always. Forcing gaming company think of a new way to get money of you.

[DJ]

Good! Ban this sh!t as soon as possible, because it’s poisoning the gaming industry.

[NobleRed]

In your Face Craptivi$ion.

[LoveSpuds]

Great news indeed however, as someone who deals with a huge European organisation on a daily basis, I can tell you from experience that getting a consensus amongst all member states to enshrine something in law will take decades, particularly where governments like the UK have a different opinion on the matter at hand.

[CodeNameTBW2]

FUCK YEAH!

[THE-JAGON]

it was at this moment that ea knew...they fucked up!

[Juvia]

This makes Juvia entirely too happy. <3

[Mr_Writer85]

Well done Belgium, here's hoping the rest of the EU show a spine and back them up.

First EA back down..

Now a government backs us....

Gamer power!

[vetebd]

You realize that now, you only spend money if you want, right? And that, if developers stop introducing microtransactions in games, that means that those same games instead of costing you 60 bucks, will then cost you 90. Right? You do understand that don´t you? :)

[Mr_Writer85]

Got some proof to back that up?

[Malacath]

Say goodbye to free to play multiplayer games. Without micro transactions funding them they will all disappear.
If you honestly think they will only ban them for AAA games like Call of Duty then you are delusional

[MaxiPower90]

amazing. Such a win for gamers.

[QUIMICOMORTAL]

Hell yeah!

[dolfa]

YES PLEASE!

[MetalGearAlex]

Supposedly this is incorrect info. Check "Pretty Good Gaming's" video addressing this. https://www.youtube.com/wat...

[marusiek91]

GOOOOOD! I hope that the rest of european countries will follow this idea!

[Kamuze]

How about enchanting that break,unchanged or degraded your item that you can buy materials for with real world money

[BABY-JEDI]

Belgium 🇧🇪The land of Tin Tin. Now a land of Heroes that FIGHT against cheap practices that rob gamers 🙌

[Richhard1]

EA not only screwed us, they’ve screwed worldwide gaming development, and themselves. maybe adware isn’t so bad after all.

[Eiyuuou]

Hold your horses people. The commission still has NOT decided yet.

Geens just expressed his desire to ban the lootboxes.

[jojo319]

It's amazing how it would appear almost every comment is just a knee-jerk reply to the headline. It's almost as bad as the "EA removes micro transactions" headline. Which STILL hasn't added the word "temporarily".

[SameOldx2]

Loot boxes are here to stay. This isn't going to change that. Funny as hell anyone thinks otherwise.