Does the Wii U’s ‘horrible, slow’ CPU mean that it is a weak system?

NE:

"...My understanding of it is that every single gaming system is unique and must be understood for itself. You can’t point to one single aspect of a system and expect it define the entire capabilities of the system. The Wii U may have a more limited CPU, but then again, it has more powerful GPU. In order for developers to really utilize the Wii U they will have to work with it, understand it’s distinct flavor, and then create an engine that will take full advantage of what it has to offer. I think that once we see developers fully taking advantage of the Wii U with games built ground up for the system by a team who has already had experience with the system, the graphics will be better than what we currently see on the Xbox 360 and PS3. But, for quick ports of games originally made for other system’s hardware, it probably is merely adequate. It has the latest features in the industry and there won’t be any major obstacles to porting a game unless the specific engine was designed in a way that conflicts with the Wii U’s tech."

[DeadPixel]

A really good article, but prepare yourself for the backlash of the Nintendo bashing brigade, as i'm pretty sure they will already be preparing their next onslaught...

[Blastoise]

Lol, slightly irrelevant but these pictures of Reggie always make me laugh

[fr0sty]

Considering the CPU is responsible for things like Physics, audio processing, input/output, etc... It does make it a weak system. Like the guys at DICE saying that they won't be able to get as many players on Wii U versions of future COD titles due to it having a weaker CPU. When you are having to cut things from a game due to the limitations of a hardware component, it does indeed mean that the system is not up to par as far as power goes. Everyone expected Wii U to be the weakest of the 3, but when you look at games like Black Ops 2, and the Wii U version not having things the PS3 version had in it such as HDR bloom, some shadow effects, and normal mapping, that does not bode well for a system that is supposed to compete in the next generation.

When 360 first launched, there were some games that came out for it that didn't look any better than their original Xbox version, but you never saw a game come out on Xbox or PS2 that looked better than the 360 version. And you didn't have developers saying it's CPU sucked the day it launched either.

With Wii, nintendo got away with the motion control fad, so they were able to release a console that didn't even compete with the previous gen (some xbox games, like chronicles of riddick, look better than anything I've seen on Wii). This time, they're releasing a system who's gimmick is available, at least in some form, on both of the competing PREVIOUS gen consoles, and will likely make it's way into some or all of the next gen consoles as well if that style of dual screen gameplay starts to take off for nintendo.

As such, this time around, Nintendo is in nowhere near as good of a position as they were last gen. The weaker system that uses a gimmick to sell itself approach is not going to work the same for them this time.

[Klonopin]

lol! Gotta love that picture of Reggie. For some reason I always picture a caption that says "I fucked up".

[metroid32]

Ill say it again the individual who said such rubbish was basing his opinion on the wiiu when it first got announced ?? Very first dev kits Hmmmmmmm its ignorant at best.

[killatia]

@ fr0sty you do know that DICE make the Battlefield Games and not COD right?

[SilentNegotiator]

The most important component is weak according to DICE, 4A, and the Warriors developer.....but NOOOOOOOO, of course that doesn't mean the Wii U is a weak system!

Now commence telling us how teh cell is magic....I mean, gpgpu!

[ShinMaster]

.

http://n4g.com/news/1126540...

[kupomogli]

@killatia. I'm sure he/she is aware of that, but he's using CoD as an example because he/she starts talking about Black Ops 2 comparisons. Battlefield 3 isn't on the Wii U so it's not like they can compare the two. It's rumored it's been cancelled.

[WPX]

Nintendo Bashing Brigade, ROFL
almost spat my coffee into the monitor from the laughter.
+bubbles for you sir.

[N4g_null]

To understand the whole CPU is slow thing do some reading on directcompute and opencl cards like amds APus which are rumored to be in the next ps4.

This is a different core design. More will be addressed come gdc time. Two next gen consoles will have these radical new chips.

This is going to be a fun ride! Major development on this front will finally start.

[dedicatedtogamers]

I think this guy is being a bit of a wishful thinker.

Yes. Agreed. The articles about the WiiU being "crippled right out the gate" are exaggerating. The WiiU will be able to play some nice-looking games.

However...

Hardware is hardware. Videogames are made using code and mathematics and hardware, and hardware limitations are still going to be limitations, regardless of what sort of "magic" the developer does.

The author wants the WiiU to have some sort of hidden power. I doubt that will be the case. Instead, what will happen is we will get games like Metroid Prime 3 and Mario Galaxy (in the sense that we'll nod and say "Yeah, that DOES look really good....for a Wii game"). But any hopes of the WiiU being some sort of off-the-charts next-gen super-powered system should be left to die. It ain't happening. The WiiU is "current gen" right out the door.

[N4g_null]

Who has all the gpgpu experience? Understand they don't make games. The CPU does compression for free! Because it is a gpgpu with edram. Now if you ignore that then it would seem like magic.

Plus these are people that have not played with final kits in most cases. This is brand new tech that even the tech people havnt grasped yet. This tech will also be in another console, and have the same issues.

[Legend_Killer]

do you think they're fools at Nintendo? they're developers as well. Will they make a console less powerful than current gen and then claim it'll fend off next gen? What you've seen WiiU do so far is it's worst, believe me.

You know what? hold on to your "WiiU is current gen" for me and let's monitor future games.

[Bronxs15]

@dedicatedtogamers
That is a very rational view to take.

@scissor_runner
what's so "radical" about these "new" chips?

[N4g_null]

The community is way cooler didn't know there where so many artist out there.

Oh if you want to be disappointed Go ahead I'm enjoying this hardware even though I have a high spec pc... I think all of the angst is from uk gamers. When you truly get to try this over someone's house you'll see the potiential.

What is so radical is this CPU is slower but can still produce hd console content with our being fully exploited.

I understand you guys are in full fanboy warrior mode so just go and read up on things like open cl and direct compute. I got games to rip into. I'm out of the studio and boy does this system display clear as fuck! Guess I'll get dark siders also, they need the funding!

The game developer conference should be very very good next year. We will have lots of talks on this gpgpu hybrid and why it matters. You won't have to listen to me about this stuff. I'll just let them sit back and prove it.

It's weird how it is ok to talk about other techs potiential but not Nintendo here. It's really too bad I don't have as much free time to post here. Oh well. Good luck on hating the wiiu the picture messaging is pretty fun.

[Computersaysno]

Its not that good an article. Suggesting that developers are going to create loads of dedicated engines for Wii U to utilise it best is surely a pipedream.

The only way that will happen is if nintendo manage to keep huge third party dev support on board. Which they just cannot do, and they just wont when the other consoles arrive in a year or so.

So expect to be stuck with the same old generic multiplat engines like UE3, and engines that were originally created on 360/Ps3 just ported across even for use on newer games in the future. FIFA 15? Assassins creed 4? Mass effect 4? COD MW4? All on wii U?

Yeah, probably, but they will all still be on engines originating from the Xbox 360/Ps3 era.

Partly for the other reasons I said, and partly cos the machine itself is so close in performance to Ps3/360 then devs won't see the point when they have something that will about work anyway. On top of that you'll still have less than 30m Wii Us even selling like mad (talking original wii mad here) after 18 months. Ps3/360 will be 80m+ EACH.

Sooooooooo Wii U will never be a lead platform for anything other than its nintendo games and big budget third party exclusives.

Which as i have just said, will hardly exist in a couple years.

Keep on dreaming peeps.

This brutal truth brought to you by me, sponsored by reality check incorporated

[Donnieboi]

The "U" in Wii U stands for "Underwhelming".

[Theyellowflash30]

Im guessing you don't have one, cause if you did Donnieboi you would not be saying that. Everybody that I know that has one or played one loves it.

[pennywhyz]

Just got popcorn.

[animegamingnerd]

i got the soda's can't wait to watch fanboy's waste their lives defending plastic

[DeadPixel]

I think the same could be applied to the people bashing it, i'm not a fan of Nintendo at all but i think peoples reaction towards them is just sad and pathetic...

[MegaLagann]

Same can be said for fanboys who waste their lives bashing plastic.

[Legend_Killer]

Like it or not, debates have been part of what makes us gamers. we know it's just plastic, it's just as irrelevant as any other thing called "entertainment", but we still love it :D

[megamanX2]

yeah well not like these low life idiots have anything to devote to a real life anyway lol. Pc still will kick consoles asses for generations to come, so they are wasting their time really.

[nerdkiller]

real gamers cant argue which girl is better in bed cuz there still virgins, so they argue which console is better

[Grimhammer00]

Yes

[Griffin4871]

It has begun.

[Abdou23]

I was on the fence right up to this moment.But i made my decision. I'm going to get me a delux one of these along with ME3, as i still yet to play it and i heard that the Addition of the second screen is making life easier.

[StraightedgeSES]

No if we were going by this logic that would mean the PS3 is weaker then the xbox 360 because the GPU inside the ps3 is weaker then the GPU inside the XBOX 360.

[fatstarr]

yes when you bring up actual factual logic you will get mass disagrees,

means its true man.

*claims wiiu has a horrible slow cpu*

*wiiu's cpu is faster than the 360...*
-_-

[hennessey86]

You should never judge a console on its launch games, it will take at least another 6 months before we see what the Wii u can really do.

[Griffin4871]

Confused as to why you have one bubble. You speak truth.

[MegaLagann]

What is this logic you speak of?

[AlucardFury]

Well excuse us for creating a ruckus but the guy from A4 said the CPU was "horrible". Why didn't he mentioned the GPU as being better than whats on 360/PS3 to counter-balance his statement?

[N4g_null]

Because he got alot of flake over how they used apus which are similar to the wiiu gpgpu combo. They are not crytek. Hell even epic out classes them... Metro does not have a strong programming a debugging team. To be fair they are a small team that's frustrated with their experiments.

It is horrible to him since his funding is counting on him to fix what teams would fix. It's the price you pay when you take the crown.

[SilentNegotiator]

That's a cute way of trying to justify it, except that DICE said essentially the same thing.

[TUGA]

Or maybe he isn't a fanboy and he was just giving his opinion about the new console that was released a few days ago. Fanboys are the ones that must turn every lttle detail into a competition.

@ below It's not his fault that fanboys on the internet turned what he said into ammunition. He his a developer and he gave his opinion about the new console that was released a few days ago. He isn't a PR and he doesn't have to sugarcoat his opinion. Also It isn't his job or obligation to give us the detailed specs of the Wii U.

[AlucardFury]

He was specific about a component of a new console, the internet was set on flames and a representative had to come out and say the GPU was good to offset what the A4 employee had said. This isn't about fanboyism, its about giving half-assed information.......

[AlucardFury]

He gave his opinion on the CPU, read slowly........ C.......P........U.....

[Menashe]

He is not a fanboy therefore his opinion is automatically correct? That's a funny sort of logic.

[TUGA]

@ AlucardFury That doesn't invalidate what i said.

@ Menashe There are no correct or wrong opinions. Opinions aren't universal facts. This developer might think that the Wii U cpu is underwhelming, others might think that Wii U cpu is more than enough. Neither of those opinions is wrong/correct.

[wiiulee]

it obviously doesnt..the developers clarify that...and besides..they will be able to get it up and running at full speed once they get use to the system..but haters will hate....in either case i fully expect wiiu to win next generation base on innovation and games alone

[Grimhammer00]

CPU is vastly more important than GPU.
And Dice dev today collaborated Metro devs statement. So it's safe to say its legit.

[chcolatesnw]

i agree. gpu's have to rely on cpu to manage the streams of data. everything passes through cpu multiple times. if you have weak cpu then you can have a tri sli 690's in there and they'll perform the same as a gt640. ram also is very important. bad ram means bad performance all together. gpu comes after.

[liljimmy]

u cant do tri 690 u can only can have two in sli and none of the system are coming with a gpu thats going to be anywhere close to a gtx 570 for that matter.

[fatstarr]

and secondly you cant compare console hardware to PCs

wtf is the cpu on a gaming console doing all day.
Nothing

meanwhile the pc is running the os and tasks and programs
a pc cpu has infinitely more things to do.

and
ps3 = good cpu shit gpu
xbox = decent cpu decent gpu

look at the results, buy your logic the ps3 should be infinitely better than the 360 just based alone off of having a good cpu but thats not the case.

[chcolatesnw]

@liljimmy - i was using trimsli 690's as an example, an exaggeration to prove a point

@fatstarr - you are wrong. First of all you are talking about cpu idling during non gaming tasks. Of course its not doing much when its sitting on dashboard. But in game its always 100% load. Whether that 100% is used well by dev is another story. Why would you even mention that cpu is doing nothing all day on a console when the conversation is about performance of hardware for games. Second, from what you said, since when is good infinitely better than decent (ps3 vs 360 cpu). You don't even seem to know what you are talking about. But yes, PS3 has better cpu, and that is shown with games like Uncharted, where the cpu takes the load off of gpu. And it seems you think i said that great cpu ok gpu is infinitely better than decent cpu decent gpu. I never said that, i said if you have good cpu then your gpu wont be limited. Again it can be seen in uncharted. And xbox cpu is more than decent. Just because it doesn't have 7 cores doesn't mean its decent as opposed to good. Architecture of xbox is a hell of a lot better than ps3, making it it the preferred choice for developing.

[liljimmy]

t

[metroid32]

No one said the wiiu cpu is less powerful just slower.

[metroid32]

Both these devs havnt even seen the second dev kit let alone the final ones ? These verdicts were based on a very early look read the original source.

[PopRocks359]

I saw that article. DICE didn't "collaborate" shit. A member of DICE said he had heard people in the industry who said the CPU was weak.

This means two things; the information he passed was based on someone else's experience, not his own. This also means that he may not have had any actual experience with the hardware itself.

This kind of misinformation is always what irks me the most about this community.

Oh by the way, THQ retracted the statement about the CPU, which of course the people who keep bashing the Wii U (and its owners) will surely ignore and disagree with this comment anyway. Here's the article.

http://www.destructoid.com/...

[chadboban]

Sony fanboys answer: "Yes, yes it does."

Nintendo fanboys answer: "No, No it doesn't."

Sony Fanboys: *Glares at Nintendo Fanboys* "hurrrr"

Nintendo Fanboys: *Glares at Sony Fanboys* "durrrrr"

All: AAAAAAAHSJSDHJDHDJDHOWHWLANAMN DBDLAPKAPKKLJ!!!!!!!!!!...

Me: *facepalm* "How did we come to this?"

[StrawHatPatriot]

That wasn't very funny

[chadboban]

I know it's not funny. I just wonder why we have to always argue over stupid shit instead of just enjoying gaming.

[chadboban]

Actually the more I read it the more I realize that not only is it not funny, it's just a flat out terrible comment, probably the worst one I've ever made. I usually don't make bad comments like this. But hey, we all have our off days right.

What I'd give for a delete button right about now... :(

[Picture_Dancer]

What about Xbox fanboys? :/

[Shnazzyone]

I wish nintendo would just release the specs so we can all see it's a tricore 3.3ghz processor and everyone can shut up and pretend like they never thought it less powerful than the ps3 already.

I like how everyone is ignoring it's already got more ram then either systems and the gpu blows both of the other consoles out of the water.

[N4g_null]

The problem is a cell like issue. No one has coded for a mass produced gpgpu like this. There is a lot of new stuff in this puppy. Sony will have similar problems if they use a apu setup. In the end it will be a good thing.

It is easy enough to port 360 code yet complicated enough to leverage future coding principles. I've never seen developers pulled kicking a scream do bad into new tech. This is the opposite of the 16 bit days or maybe fanboys are just worst.

[Heavenly King]

the can not do that because people will realize that the specs are quite outdated.

If nintendo had nothing to fear, they would release the specs to shut everyone up, and to convince some tech lover to buy their console.

[MsmackyM]

like it or not Nintendo is in competition with Sony and Microsoft, with both companies having yet to even announce their consoles, it makes sense for Nintendo to keep some of their cards close to their chest. After all we all know how Microsoft and Sony loves to copy Nintendo.

[liljimmy]

really it comes down to programming and if they want the game to be cpu or gpu depended. ask anyone that builds gaming rigs if they get better fps by upgrading there cpu or gpu. i have a i7 950 Cpu in my rig with a gtx 670 and if u compare that in a benchmark with a new 1000 cpu the gains are very minimum. now if your running a sli setup then you'll see better gains when it comes to fps. when its all said and done if they make the games more gpu depended then the wii u will look good. facts are facts do a little bit of research and u will see what im talking about.

[crinale]

I think the current situation is the backlash of the optimistic assumptions that WiiU was supposed to steamroll PS360 performance wise in ALL aspects.

[RFornillos4]

the real reason devs find it easier to code for xbox360, is that the architecture closely resembles that of the PC. and like it or not, the PC architecture is generally "multi-purpose". so if you're a sloppy programmer it doesn't matter how de-optimized your code is, a faster machine can always handle it. it's a different story for consoles. you're stuck with the hardware for the next 5-7 years, and you have to do with what the machine offers.

here's the thing, early on devs were having trouble developing for PS3 given it's architecture. Six years have passed, and now we have spectacular games utilizing the hardware's capability, as devs eventually worked around the difficulties of the machine, now you have Uncharted, God Of War, etc. Games that are undeniably very good.

fast forward to the present, we have Wii U. similar to the case of the PS3, the CPU is underclocked, thus slower than Xbox 360 and even the PS3, but has a remarkable GPGPU component. And by the way, it was mentioned that Nintendo opted to underclock the CPU, perhaps for reasons of hardware efficiency. the main difference here is that, when compared to the PS3, devs have already mentioned how easy it is code on the Wii U and how they were able to port the game easily in terms of running it. in short, come 2-3 years we can expect devs to work around the CPU issue, and have similarly amazing games.

now there's the factor of the nextbox and ps4 obviously being more powerful than the wii u with the rumored 8GB RAM alone. but again, as development costs get too high, Wii U will become the fallback hardware for more devs. and if Wii U sales are good, you can expect devs would not be turning a blind eye to a potential market, so 3rd party support will be there. with it's revised management of eShop, going steam-like, indie devs are also having more interest to work on Wii U or include Wii U in their projects.

[madjedi]

"now there's the factor of the nextbox and ps4 obviously being more powerful than the wii u with the rumored 8GB RAM alone. but again, as development costs get too high, Wii U will become the fallback hardware for more devs."

And do you think devs will also ignore a 140-160+ million ps3 and 360 install base, if the wii u is more powerful than the current gens it isn't a night and day difference.

Yeah till the games are account tied like psn and marketplace, no one will touch nintendo's digital store. Seriously hilarious how backwards nintendo is on that. But that is what you get for essentially ignoring online gaming for 2 gens.

So other than epic's saber rattling to promote the use of their middleware tools, got any real proof that dev costs will get too high next gen.

[RFornillos4]

first of all, i NEVER said that devs will ignore the PS3 and 360 install base, nor did I mention that the Wii U is significantly more powerful than the current gens. in fact, I did mention that the Wii U has been known to be underclocked compared to the two. the statement you quoted above, is referring to games for PS4 and 720. note that it is not guaranteed that a current PS3 user will automatically be a PS4 user. nevertheless, what I meant was the in the future, more and more games will be multiplatform and yes will include the Wii U.

as for Nintendo's digital store. obviously they made a mistake with the old Wiiware Shop, which is why Nintendo is making amends with the new eShop, and the change process is continuous, so naturally you can expect some hiccups along the way (it's not as if Sony and Microsoft got it perfect the first time). on the contrary, Nintendo is gaining interest of more indie devs, because of the steam-like guidelines they are implementing. Devs are free to set the price for their products (abiding certain guidelines), offer unlimited number of patches and/or DLC's without paying Nintendo. Nintendo is learning.

if you don't believe that dev costs are getting high, then its up to you. but expect that prices for games for the nextbox and ps4 to be around $70-$80, $65 the least.

[Shok]

1 aspect, of one component, and people are judging it's power lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

[PopRocks359]

All the hate is based on THQ's one comment. Which they later retracted. http://www.destructoid.com/...

Yeah, they'll bring up DICE, but the guy at DICE said it based on what he had heard, not because he himself had any idea what the hardware was all about.

[PygmelionHunter]

Dude, Xenoblade music, awesome.

Seriously, I can't believe you had to upload a whole 11 minutes video just to explain that to trolls, even though I'm sure you realize that it's not gonna change much, at this point, we should just wait to see what Nintendo is cooking up, because, by then, the comments around here are gonna be priceless.