330°

Has Xbox really lost the console wars?

Microsoft’s Xbox chief discussed the state of the Xbox business.

Read Full Story >>
theverge.com
Christopher308d ago (Edited 308d ago )

I think the meat and potatoes of this whole thing are whether you agree with him on this or not. Do you think his talks about Starfield being the first in their big plans to grow their platform (GamePass) which is console-specific and requires hardware for the mass majority of people that utilize it, or is it solely a long-term plan for subscription models and streaming, which then CMA would be absolutely right about in how they saw it.

***
FTC: If Microsoft is going to grow, particularly in a business like console, it can grow by taking share from its competitors

Spencer: There’s no console growth in our [Activision] deal model.

FTC: Do you have any intention of this deal helping you climb out of the number three spot?

Spencer: In console, we do not.

FTC: So that’s just a write off?

Spencer: I don’t understand how that’s a write off?

***

----
FTC: Can you swear under oath that without looking at any future terms that need to be hashed out, you’ll ship all the versions of Call of Duty that may exist on all the versions of PlayStation that make exist in the next 10 years?

Spencer: That’s my goal, yes.
...

Spencer: That’s my goal, yes. If what you’re trying to propose is that Sony might change the terms of how we ship games on our platform then that would prohibit us from shipping on their platforms.
---

The skeptic in me sees this as 'If PlayStation doesn't align with our GamePass plans, then it would prohibit us from shipping on their platforms.' I can't see any other way that PlayStation would change the terms of how they ship games otherwise. It's a pretty-established concept and hasn't seen any change.

Lightning77307d ago

Why would Sony have say if the game releases on gamepass or not? The same game could release on PSN+ same day MS did offer that to Sony.

Jim Ryan was threatening to withhold PS6 dev kits. Which means next gen future cod games wouldn't run natively on the new Series consoles. While the game would run BC on PS6 but no native PS6 version. In turn making the new Series consoles run the same BC. Everyone won't get the true optimized next gen versions at all because MS has to have parity.

They even said the same thing with Minecraft why it only run BC because Sony didn't ship them PS5 dev kits. Which means Xbox versions arent optimized either.

Maybe that's what they mean changing the terms? Not sure but it sounds like a petty situation to me if that was the case.

4Sh0w307d ago (Edited 307d ago )

I said this yesterday, Xbox lost the console war, so?

The sun still rose today and exactly what prize did anyone win? ---->NOTHING. Both consoles are still thriving, just like McDonalds & Chic Fil-A.

VariantAEC307d ago

@4Sh0w
"Both consoles are still thriving..."
Which two? PS5 and Switch is what you meant, right?

Xbox Series S/X (technically one console despite their significant differences) is going from flop to flop with their most recent upcoming game Starfield also looking pretty weak as the days go on and the game isn't even out yet... 30FPS, level-based stages with only middling visuals for LAST GEN plus RT (supposedly) and the more we hear the less interested people are getting especially when NMS is clearly the best option in today's world... When Haven: Call of The King was a 60FPS open solar-system space epic with multiple highly detailed for-the-time planets and no loading screens all running on a PS2 and NMS is the best we can get 19 years later, you know we've fallen on hard times, but I digress.

Seriously though you have Star Citizen which looks like it will never properly release along with Squadron 42 - their single player version of Star Citizen - which also doesn't appear it will ever show, Elite Dangerous which just disappeared from consoles due to lackluster performance, the game is just not doing well with gamers it's like EVE: Online plus planets you can land on... WHY WERE WE ABLE TO DO THIS SEAMLESSLY 19 YEARS AGO IN A STORY-DRIVEN SINGLEPLAYER GAME!?

Sorry, I'm just not sure why Traveler's Tales was was actually far better than Bethesda and everyone else who's ever attempted to make an open world space opera. Yes from what we've all been told by the devs themselves we can say from a technical perspective there's several things Haven: Call of The King will do better than Starfield, not just running at 60FPS, but also having land vehicles, traversing seamlessly from underground to underwater to ground, air, the upper atmosphere and of course eventually space all to warp to another planet and invert that process while being 100% interactive the entire time... no loading screens though warping to other planets is masked loading, thinly-masked loading. That's as a slight against the game because the entire time you're warping to the planet its just getting bigger on screen until you can eventually zoom in without warp descending onto the surface as it slowly spins on it's axis no joke.

It beggars belief that we had that nearly 20 years ago and so far NO ONE has made a game that can do even these small things. Imagine MSFS, but now you can visit Earth's Moon, Mars and Venus just to make things a bit more even with the number of planets in Haven all in high fidelity as they orbit the sun (and the moon orbits Earth which orbits the sun), Haven was that complete with a fully dynamic sky ToD replete with all the other planets visibly spinning in space from your position on any other planet... ALL RUNNING AT 60FPS ON THE F●●●●●● PS2! I just can't...

Xbox buys entire publishers with dozens of IP and devs each and stays alive coasting on MS' mighty monetary sails, but you think Xbox is "thriving". GTFOH!

-Foxtrot307d ago (Edited 307d ago )

“Jim Ryan was threatening to withhold PS6 dev kits.”

The thing is why would you?

It’s a rock and a hard place situation involving COD

If they have a deal then they will need to give Activision a dev kit to help a future COD game

However

If they give a dev kit to Activision then Activision will tel Microsoft everything they know about the PS6. Either that or MS will just walk in and examine it. I’m sure they could even get a rough estimate of price based on potential specs.

What can they do?

Why would anyone give a developer owned by your biggest rival an early dev kit of your brand new under wraps console.

wind79307d ago

Sony withheld the latest dev kits as it might provide inside knowledge of their upcoming console before its released. I don't think its about being petty or not, but more of protecting their IP or R&D assets. Imagine if Microsoft have full knowledge of the PS5 hardware, it can basically come up with the same hardware with slightly improved specifications and sell it at either the same or cheaper price. Microsoft has way more money than whole of Sony put together and buying Activision just proves the point. I don't think Sony withheld the dev kits now that the PS5 has been released and Microsoft can always optimize it now via updates if they are really concerned about this.

4Sh0w307d ago (Edited 307d ago )

VariantAEC
-OK let me expose your BS:

"Starfield also looking pretty weak as the days go on and the game isn't even out yet."
-OK yeah, you're not unbiased at all, so I'll take your word for it, lol Nope. Meanwhile on youtube, twitter & tons of gaming sites its receiving by far more positive reaction & attention than negative. IGN, Gamepsot, Eurogamer, etc and the only hands on so far, really enjoyed what he played...bu, bu n4g. No.
https://www.reddit.com/r/St...

"When Haven: Call of The King was a 60FPS"
-So what? Are you telling me fps= better game, lol here are some ps5 4K 120fps games:
Centipede Recharged
Gunborg
Knockout City
Monster Boy And The Cursed Kingdom
Rogue Company
The Touryst (*8K, 60fps)
https://www.mejoress.com/en...
So I guess these are all better games than Starfield, FF16 and GoWR, right? No and I'm not saying they are bad games either the point is you seem to believe the specs of a game alone determines its value. No because any dev with just a slight bit of talent can make a lame game that runs at 4K 120fps or higher. In fact every dev will tell you it's actaully easier to make a status qou game whether it's a standard shooter, standard open world game, action, fighting etc, and target 4K 60fps, its typical for games that are actually more ambitious to struggle to meet the highest spec the console offers because they are literally trying to do more than the hardware can handle at the highest settings.

Again if all that mattered was fps then we might as well crown the Xbox Series X since it has far more games with 120fps support compared to PS5:
https://www.techradar.com/n...
Does that make it a better console?

EVE: Online plus planets you can land on... WHY WERE WE ABLE TO DO THIS SEAMLESSLY 19 YEARS AGO IN A STORY-DRIVEN SINGLEPLAYER GAME!?

Stop lying? You're so desperate to downplay Starfield you're comparing MMO's. -Eve Online, and just making up things about the game= you CANNOT land on planets, much less seamlessly. Its a shipbased game. The scope is nothing like Starfield. You lie about what it has that Starfield don't and also completely gloss over all the Starfield rpg elements not present in EVE online & the fact that they are completely different games, the only thing in common is they are set in space, either way why lie? Are you seriously that desperate, embarrassing.
https://steamcommunity.com/...
https://m.youtube.com/watch...

VariantAEC307d ago

@4Sh0w
"OK let me expose your BS"
This ought to be interesting...

"OK yeah, you're not unbiased at all, so I'll take your word for it, lol Nope."
You got that from me saying something you can plainly see? You're a bit slow and this is a sad start, just an FYI I never said you should take my word for it.

"So what? Are you telling me fps= better game, lol here are some ps5 4K 120fps games:" [Lists games] "So I guess these are all better games than Starfield...?"
As far as technical prowess of the devs is concerned given the HW limitations of the time? Yeah Haven: Call of The King was very under appreciated and punched well above its weight at the time. Bringing things into better focus the HCoTK is much more detailed than GTA:SA and it was larger with each "stage" existing on the spherical planets and all the planets eventually being traversible once you commandeer the Sun Surfer about halfway through the story.

"Stop lying? You're so desperate to downplay Starfield you're comparing MMO's. -Eve Online, and just making up things about the game= you CANNOT land on planets, much less seamlessly."
The quote you took wasn't about EVE's exploration, it was about how Elite Dangerous' exploration compared to EVE and how neither game had what HCoTK had.
Me: "Seriously though you have Star Citizen which looks like it will never properly release along with Squadron 42 - their single player version of Star Citizen - which also doesn't appear it will ever show, Elite Dangerous which just disappeared from consoles due to lackluster performance, the game is just not doing well with gamers it's like EVE: Online plus planets you can land on... WHY WERE WE ABLE TO DO THIS SEAMLESSLY 19 YEARS AGO IN A STORY-DRIVEN SINGLEPLAYER GAME!?"
You can now see I was saying Elite Dangerous is EVE: Online plus the ability to land on planets. Meanwhile Haven: Call of The King (HCoTK) is Elite Dangerous with a story. I can't remember EVE's scope as far as the scale of its map, but Elite Dangerous covers the Milky-way Galaxy. I'd assume the Milky-Way is bigger than 1,000 planets in size, no?

HCoTK was a more tightly scripted experience with only around 7 planets to explore, but you could swim, sail, ride in a vehicle and on a train and fly all in a multitude of ways as well (on top of walking). All things you won’t be doing in Starfield except by jet-pack which HCoTK also featured.

And there we have it, your points were completely refuted. Maybe look at the game I'm pointing you at... HCoTK is no Starfield but it managed to look better than some of the more "demanding games" of the time such as GTA:SA and it ran twice as fast without a single loading screen. What is Starfield doing? Levels will be like those you see in R&C.
Mining like you see in NMS.
Ship to ship combat like you also see in R&C (most likely as was seen on PS2 - just better looking in Starfield).
No fishing, no driving, no flying (except by jet-pack) and most importantly there are no seamless transitions between ground and space like we had in HCoTK 19 years ago on PS2 at 60FPS.
Face it dude... Starfield is looking like NMS lite with better visuals.

4Sh0w306d ago

VariantAEC
"As far as technical prowess of the devs is concerned given the HW limitations of the time? Yeah Haven: Call of The King was very under appreciated and punched well above its weight at the time."

-How? because it had landing on planets? because it had alot of variety? -which from what I saw through the YouTube reviews was either bland or terrible
https://m.youtube.com/watch...
https://m.youtube.com/watch...

Seriously, Haven is the hill you're gonna die on? Bawahhhaaa

First I never heard of or played Haven so I'm not trying to hate on the game but its you who's trying very, very hard to hold it up over & over as some sort of GOTY example of how other open world games should aspire be like. So I took a look read & watched some reviews= Hell nah, LMFAO its NOT an open world game, at its core its a 3D platformer with added gameplay mechanics from other genre's WHICH IS COOL BUT in practice this is where the game falls apart:
*Game is described as mechanically flawed
*Bad graphics even for ps2 era
*Suffers from control issues
*Very ambitious but everything besides the platforming seems tacted on and is very tedious & not fun
*Budget Animations that look far behind *R&C for its time
*Bad camera
*Character models are flat out ugly
*Voice acting is horrible
*Utterly devoid of charm...after this the Midway dev only made Lego games, lol I'm not joking, game was so bad, it ended the promised sequel & multiplats dev, they moved on to Lego games for kids. lol bu, bu it was 60fps, bu, bu you could fly to a few planets, bu, bu it had terrible vehicle gameplay. Sorry I dont care, and neither did ps fans, which is why the game flopped hard= 69, https://www.metacritic.com/... & sold 5 copies, 4 not counting you. lmfao

So just please just stop throwing every game you can think of against the wall, against 1 game. lol, Thats what's so funny, you're so desperate to downplay Starfield you gotta add up Haven + pc games like Even Online, Star Citizen, + NMS +E&D, literally all of 'em together and say oh look Starfield don't have this or that, haaahhaaa so transparent & weak.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 306d ago
RpgSama307d ago

What that means is that if Sony (or anybody else) do not agree on the 100% revenue of the game going to MS as they originally offered on their first 10 year deals, then that qualifies them to not release the game on that console/service.

Crows90307d ago

Yeah. So they get no money and that affects bottom line which affects competition.

LG_Fox_Brazil308d ago

If we are talking about numbers, it had a pretty decent start with the original Xbox, a honorable defeat in the 360 days, a horrible death in the Xbox One days and is walking a path that will probably lead to a less terrifying loss with the Series X and S, but one that maybe won't be as bad as last gen. If we are talking about games, then I would say that it did a great job in the first half of the 360 life and that was it, it was average at best in every single other generation that it took part of

jznrpg308d ago (Edited 308d ago )

Series S/X sales are tracking very near Xbox One sales. Slightly above but it’s taken a downturn lately and Xbox One is catching up . 50 million is about as much as they can sell give or take a few million.

kneon307d ago

A not insignificant portion of Xbox sales were due to the fact that it was near impossible to get a ps5. As soon as the ps5 became more readily available Xbox sales dropped. That's not just a coincidence

jznrpg307d ago

Downvote away but numbers don’t lie

lelo2play307d ago (Edited 307d ago )

If we take a look at Sony's and Microsoft's exclusives games in this generation of consoles so far, that will explain a lot about the discrepancy of sales between PS5 and Xbox Series.
In these 2,5 years, Xbox Series have 4-5 exclusives worth mentioning. PS5 like has 3 or 4 times that number.

Microsoft need a constant stream of exclusive games if they want to compete with Sony. Without exclusive games, they won't sell consoles.

ApocalypseShadow308d ago (Edited 308d ago )

They lost by their own hands because of a lack of effort. They have the money, they have the resources, they are a software giant. Yet put out less content than their competitors every time. Why would that be deserving of a generation win? And in later years, almost purposely tried to lead the market into digital territory and online which is where they are strong in. Even lobbied against physical media like Blu-ray as a dead end until they needed it to store games on. They lobby now about cloud over consoles and reaching billions of casuals who are fine with their games on cellphones.

Jim probably saw that it would be against Microsoft interest to pull COD because of the money it generates on PlayStation. But seeing the final offer of hosting the game but getting zero revenue was the straw that broke the camel's back. Buying publishers knowing it would systematically strip Sony of revenue each time they bought a publisher. Even said they weren't done making acquisitions. Who else would be next and large enough for Microsoft to take more money out of Sony's pockets?

They keep saying they were scared of not getting games like Star Field which we know would have been timed just like Ghost Wire and Death Loop. But have money hatted many times to keep games away from PlayStation. Timed or exclusive. They also made it seem that they needed to protect gamers from Apple, Amazon and Google by buying these publishers. How was that supposed to protect us? Just more lies and misleading statements they make.

Stadia failed because Google didn't put in the effort like many of their creations. Dismantled their development teams and made no games. Of course it was going to fail. Offering games to buy that you don't actually own. Physically or digitally.

No matter what Microsoft says, it doesn't stop Microsoft from creating games and studios to compete. It doesn't stop them from entering the mobile market. They can do these things at any time. Activision could have offered their own cloud service using Microsoft servers. They don't need Microsoft owning them to do it. This is all a ploy to choke Sony of revenue and force gamers to a platform they don't want to use or they would be using Xbox worldwide at the same level as Nintendo and Sony right now. It's bad enough with all these mega corporations owning everything no matter what you buy or use. To allow a mega corporation like Microsoft to buy up the industry and dictate terms is so bad for the industry, that it makes their DRM 2013 attempt seem tame in comparison.

307d ago
FallenAngel1984308d ago

Who would’ve ever guessed in the 51 years of videogame console industry that a company would legally say they lost ‘the console war?’

Whereas former titans like Atari and Sega bowed out because they couldn’t financially compete anymore, Microsoft who has all the funds they can manage still act like they’re the underdog here.

Yet we’ve seen would happen if they did ‘win’ with the always online DRM and locking so many console features behind a paywall. Hard to root for a company that’s so willing to screw over its own consumers. Never forget that Xbox Live price hike they had to go back on because of backlash

wind79307d ago

He is just saying that so he can get the approval for the acquisition of Activision. Notice that he didn't really admitted to losing the console war, just that the Xbox is in 3rd place and the console war is a social construct.

Rude-ro307d ago

Microsoft’s bread and butter is owning.
They see threats to their system and they go after them.
Sure gaming can produce money, but hardware design for computing is their threat.
Either control Sony or remove them(not sure if this is their goal… unless Sony does not play along ever)

We have to remember Microsoft was in huge danger at the turn of 2000.
Apple, google and Sony with Linux.

Why does Microsoft want these deals? To control the market. Control the market, you control designs.

Spence said it himself…
Paraphrasing…
He does not plan to take cod away unless Sony makes it happen by going against the design of the game.

Show all comments (57)
70°

Embracer CEO Lars Wingefors: "I deserve a lot of criticism."

Embracer CEO demonstrates a masterclass in mental gymnastics in latest interview.
"I'm sure I deserve a lot of criticism, but I don't think my team or companies deserve all the criticism. I could take a lot of that blame myself. But ultimately I need to believe in the mission," he said.

Read Full Story >>
gamesindustry.biz
on_line_forever3d ago

OK give us Kingdoms of Amalur 2 with AAA budget and we will accept your excuse

kaos893d ago (Edited 3d ago )

The king of the studio asset flip scheme that failed.

60°

Chatting Shadows of the Damned: Hella Remastered with Suda51

CGM Writes: While we were over at PAX East, we were able to sit down with Goichi Suda (Suda51) and talk about the upcoming remaster of Shadows of the Damned

Read Full Story >>
cgmagonline.com
60°

Sega Franchises That Deserve a Comeback

We explore the Sega classics that are ripe for revival! From Panzer Dragoon Saga to Virtua Fighter, discover why these legendary games deserve a comeback on next-gen consoles. Dive into a nostalgic journey and see which Sega titles are set to captivate a new generation of gamers in 2024.

Read Full Story >>
finalboss.io
ZeekQuattro8d ago (Edited 8d ago )

Turned based Phantasy Star and Shinning Force remain at the top of my list of Sega IPs that need to return. At the very least I'd take a Shining Force collection that has 1,2,3, CD and the Game Gear entries.

FinalBoss7d ago

I was hesitant to put these two on. I've personally played more PSO than the RPG version. And shame on me, I don't remember much about Shining Force to talk about it properly.

That said, so many Sega licences deserve their place in this list.

jznrpg5d ago

A new Phantasy Star in the numbered series would be amazing. Shining Force too. But I’d settle on some collections as that’s probably the best we will get

anast7d ago

I don't trust Sega to do a proper comeback. The games will be just remastered and/or monetized to death.

gold_drake6d ago

shining force.

but indont see that happening unfortunately.