Square Enix Reportedly Lost $200 Million on Avengers and Guardians of the Galaxy

The two Marvel games lost Square Enix $200 million in a little under two years and were responsible for the sale of western studios to Embracer, according to an analyst.

[phoenixwing]

I'm sorry but if guardians of the Galaxy didn't sell enough they paid too much for royalties to Disney I'm thinking. In any case square is a terrible manager if their dev cost and marketing cost isn't offset by how well gotg sold.

Edit: I did some research and it sold at least one million five hundred thousand as of last October. Not to mention 5 to 10 million dollars from Microsoft for game pass. Square is crap at budgeting imo after finding this out.

2nd edit: I fear for the final fantasy franchise and square as a company if they're this incompetent

[Eonjay]

The cost of making AAA games has skyrocketed. 1.5 million copied is not enough to cover the cost of production, and advertising. Yes 100 million is pretty standard (if not low) for a AAA game. And selling 1.5 million won't even cover the cost.

[VersusDMC]

And i remember the game was half off in Canada for Black Friday. One month after release. So most of those sales aren't even at 60.

[FinalFantasyFanatic]

After years and years, many years, I'm just more convinced that SE is just incompetent at time management and development.

[GoodGuy09]

Well I've been fearing for the ff franchise since xiii lol.

[Traecy]

FFXIII was fabulous!!!

[Michiel1989]

ahhh, a microsoft board member, good to see you here lad.

[chronoforce]

1.5m is pretty bad for a game that probably exceeded 100m in development costs. It is a shame as GOTG is good a game. Given how often both CD and Eidos underperformed according to SQNX their sale was inevitable.

[AuraAbjure]

GOTG seemed pretty cool, better than Avengers.

[Blackcanary]

If I remember correctly they have been losing money on FF games after ether FF10 or 12. It's the main reason why they doing the FF7 remake which cover's practically every game that is connected with FF7. Its the one of the main games in the FF franchise that made the most money for them. Not including FF11 and FF14 i think thats done quite well for them financially.

[EvertonFC]

Guardians of the galaxy is a great game but sadly 90% of gamers only play f2p, GaaS games these days.
So of course games will suffer. I've said it many times "be careful what you wish for". And in a few years gaming will be shite full of nothing but GaaS and f2p nonsense and gamers will wonder where it all went wrong.

[thesoftware730]

5-10 mill from MS? is that a factual #?

SE is becoming a shell of their former selves, they need to sell to Sony and get some direction.

[shinoff2183]

Ive feared for final fantasy since 12 came out. All down hill imo

[-Foxtrot]

Well maybe Guardians would have sold more if people weren’t put off with how shit the Avengers was

[Godmars290]

Designs closer to the movies/actors probably would have helped too.

[senorfartcushion]

It never does. People moan about all sorts of things nowadays. The same people would have moaned about them looking too much like the actors.

[1Victor]

@godmars you have to understand guardians even on the comics is a obscured comics and it got to a small spotlight by the movie they thought that since the movie did good the game would too but the truth is that marvel space opera is very niche in the comics with multiple cancellations over the years and returns with different members same for the avengers comics

[-Foxtrot]

I liked how the Guardians looked more like the comic book designs

[anubusgold]

The avengers should have used the comic book character looks instead of the butt ugly ones they used trying to copy the movie look. It works well in the cartoons and no one complains about it.

[VivaLaManual]

I actually really liked how the characters weren't like the movie ones.

[Vader82]

The games voice actors were as good as the movies in their own right. The interactions were wonderful.

[CrimsonWing69]

I actually prefer the game characters over the actors for Guardians, but I’m sure I’m in the minority on that one.

[Profchaos]

It wasn't clear what it was either. Was it a action game was it a online only clone that killed it into and turned me off the game until it was out for a year and appearing on countless goty lists

[DaleCooper]

This, for sure. I avoided Guardians after playing Avengers. I did eventually buy it on a sale due to the great reviews. Way better than the monotonous Avengers live-service game.

[Seraphim]

while I agree there is more to it. I think a large part of the problem is simply that Guardians doesn't have the same following as your typical Marvel hero/groups. Personally speaking many of my friends who game have never even watched the two movies. I sent one friend a copy of the game free of charge and he hasn't even bothered checking it out. I love the IP, the movies, characters, etc, but it simply doesn't have the broad appeal nor does it have time on market like other super hero's. Though dropping what was Avengers was undoubtably a major blow to any success Guardians may have had otherwise but there's more to it. I picked Avengers up for $10 after playing Guardians and good grief was it mediocre at best and the live service/leveling/rewards system was disgusting.

Lastly, I do have a feeling Disney is charging too heavy of a price for use of their IPs but that is obviously just a guess. I would be interested to know what kind of money Disney requires for use of their IPs though. But look at, say, Good Smile Company and their Nendoroid line of figures. Venom is something like $95!! Most, if not all Marvel characters are quite a bit more than most other nendoroids. And something tells me Goodsmile isn't setting the prices higher simply because they can.

[Muigi]

Guardians got the short end of the shtick, all thanks to the shit show that was The Avengers.

[ClayRules2012]

For real, it’s a darn shame too because Guardians has some of the best and most entertaining in-game dialogue (while you’re just walking around with your crew mates in different areas) that I’ve seen since Uncharted and the Last of Us. Avengers was crap.

Not even just that, the story overall is so freaking great, with tons of laughs and emotional moments throughout the well done campaign.

[VersusDMC]

I agree... but the gameplay was so meh to me that i finda wished it was a telltale type game. It was a chore.

[ClayRules2012]

@VersusDMC

I understand that, I do. The gameplay is the one area that I felt needed A LOT more work! It got stale quickly and if the story was just “OK” I honestly wouldn’t have kept going, but I really came to like these characters early on and for story I felt was neat and headed somewhere interesting, and my goodness it all shocked me with how much I came to love the characters and story as everything progressed.

I love telltale and their past games, but I love the game how it turned out, for the most part lol. But I get what your saying. But I’m glad it wasn’t made in that form of style. Did you play the telltale Guardians of the Galaxy game?

A real blast and gem of a game.

[WGAF]

Gotg combat section would have been much more entertaining if you can switch to other party members like tails or tri-Ace games. Their combat repertoires are already limited (just 5 members total) and unable to switch make it even more repetitive (you hardly notice others effect when u just focusing on your own attack). I guess they going more like Mass Effect types of combat? Either way, everything else were actually pretty solid, especially all the quarrels between parties members were brilliantly hilarious.

[SinisterKieran]

Please let ffxiv be safe o-o

[AnotherGamer]

FFXIV is their biggest money bank right now, I think the game is fine.

[PapaBop]

It is, they have already said they have already finished the story for post Endwalker and now working on the story for the next expansion.

[Gardenia]

Looks like FFXV, so not that good. They should make JRPG's games like they did back in the 90's. But quality and creativity has been long gone from gaming with a few exceptions.
Games nowadays are made by money an investors who tell developers what to do. Sad really.

[peppeaccardo]

Got on the hype band vagon of Guardian and I surelly enjoyed its writing and story, which I thought was quite convoluted and fun overall. The excution was a little MEh even thought the models were alright and the environments not bad at all. Movements felt a bit tiff but ok overall. It was a decent game with a big budget soul. I did not play Avengers but I guess it felt into the "wanna be AAA at all costs" trap !

[kikicub]

I love everything about the game, except the combat that got stale.

But it sure is a gorgeous game, especially with ray tracing on.

[ClayRules2012]

Yeah, the combat was stale (got that way rather quickly) but man, that story, the characters, that helped me push through the gameplay and at times, the dialogue in the combat at points in the campaign had me enjoying certain fights again and again, regardless of the repetitiveness, put a little spark back into it’s diminishing flame in that one specific weak area in the game.

[dumahim]

I bought into the hype. Everyone was talking it up like it was such a great game. Got it and felt very underwhelmed. Didn't really care for the combat at all. Everyone just felt so underpowered and like you said, it felt a bit clunky. Allowing you to pick who you played as in combat would have helped. Drax just didn't feel like the Drax from the movie very much and I tired of Rocket's whining. The story didn't hit with me. I mentioned it somewhere a couple months ago and someone commented "oh, wait until chapter X" and that was still like 3 chapters away from where I was, and way past the halfway point. With all the other games that came out recently, I just never went back.

[peppeaccardo]

Totally understand. As for the story I guess it can be fairly subjective to personal taste. Overall teh game has decent to good production value. I can tell a decent amount of time was used to create the models of everything in the game; locations, characters, objects etc. Texture work is also quite nice with lighting that could use a bit of improvement. My biggest problem are the animations which are fairly robotic. I loved the fact that the characters talk among themselves during teh gameplay and make the whole thing a little more beliavable, nad jokes included. I personally liked tha game despite these minor issues, I don't think I would go back to play it again to get all the collectables like I would do with Spidermand or Ratchen and Clank for example. Too bad the dev and publisher lost money as we might not see another iteration of these game anytime soon. Take care

[Snakeeater25]

Well if they want easy money they should release ff16 soon and not in 2023

[Blackcanary]

It makes more sense for them to release FF7R 2 before 16 since that will make more money back than 16 will.

[jeromeface]

or it will fail miserably because people don't like waiting 3 years between "parts" of games

[FinalFantasyFanatic]

I think it's more than just the licensing costs, I think it's a combination of incompetence and poor marketing, Guardians of the Galaxy was good compared to SE's last Marvel outing (The Avengers game). It's not like Square-Enix hasn't shown how terrible their time/budget management is.

I thought the reviews and streamers would have helped save this title, but apparently not.

[MIDGETonSTILTS17]

Guardians would’ve sold better if it didn’t look so much like Avengers, and if the Avengers didn’t suck THAT hard.

[ClayRules2012]

Ugh, for real, it did suck so badly. What a joke of an attempt that game was.

[senorfartcushion]

Guardians probably sold fine.

Avengers is another story.

Make sensible projections next time. For once. 😅😅😅

[Stanjara]

Probably Avengers lost $190 mill and Guardians the rest.

[HeliosHex]

Movie based games rarely if ever do well. I would have thought companies would steer away from these types of games or at least make sure they don't over pay for the license. In an effort to ensure at least a small profit if sales tank.

[Azurite]

Many games counted with the Avengers game would be in negative numbers, doesn't give you a clear picture how it went for the other game.

[lellkay]

Making Avengers a live service killed anyones faith in Guardians even if it actually turned out pretty good

[moriarty1889]

I supported Guardians of the Galaxy by buying a copy and I have enjoyed it a lot. Great game.

[CrimsonWing69]

I strongly believe had Avengers been a traditional style game where you went to unique locations fighting all kinds of enemies familiar to the Avengers series it would’ve done so much better.

I’ll be honest, the game starts off brilliantly. It’s not until you get to the point where you’re constantly fighting the same enemies in the same desert with only giant robot beetle bosses that something smells rotten in Denmark.

[Profchaos]

Still losing money they are under contract to support avengers for a while longer despite it costing them

[Starman69]

Tried tapping into insomniacs success with Spiderman. Close, but no cigar. Insomniac best do a good job with wolverine, or the risk equal egg on de face lol

[FlavorLav01]

And what was the last bad game made by Insomniac? I’m sure they’ll do more then fine with Wolverine….or anything for that matter.

[MADGameR]

Not surprised...I'm sorry but it is not my type of game...and I heard it ran horribly.

[Germaximus]

They're both just money grabs. Avengers has a great campaign but the live service aspect of it ruins a lot. Guardians just has really bad, unfun gameplay.

[repsahj]

...i hope this didnt happened. Guardians is an awesome game, I'm really hoping for part 2.

[darkrider]

Of course many aren't buying games... Only renting... This problem will only get bigger.

[Rainbowcookie]

I think a combination of paying too many royalties, panic and the dreadful start of the avengers game skrewedbthem over. Game development is expensive , but if you need to pay super royalties that's a bad start... then most average joes would be remembering the bad disappointing start of the GAAS Avengers and most won't be able to know the difference between the two...even sub continously most would be scared for life by GAAS avengers. It didn't sell as some have hoped and boom put it on sale at half price on black friday. Every 2 copies sold equals one...it was the perfect storm for a fairly decent game.

[Nacho_Z]

Oops.

[Inverno]

With how hot Marvel is right now this is a massive failure on them to capitalize on that popularity. Same with EA and Starwars, you only got yourselves to blame. Practically easy money and you blew it

[JEECE]

People have a really hard time with understanding that game success is relative to production costs. People are really locked into the idea that if a game "sold millions" it is a success.

[CrimsonWing69]

What bothers me is I felt Guardians was actually a fantastic game and I was one of those that was quick to take a massive dump on it from what they showed at E3. Crazily enough, it ended up being my Game of the Year for last year.

I was really hoping we’d get another installment, but Square being Square pretty much farted that out of existence.

[Garethvk]

When people say E3 is dead and the last couple of years show we do not need in-person conventions for games to be a success; I have said wait until big-budget game tanks or does not meet expectations. This is a good example as a case can be made that if there was E3 and if they were at PAX West and people could see the game, play the game, and generate some gameplay video and images from the show; perhaps they would have done better. A few million spent on shows, booth props, swag, etc might have cut that 200 million loss way down.

[Garethvk]

They had Avengers at E3, cut scenes only I believe. We got it at PAX West and it was off-site in a hotel that was not open to the public. We got a bit of gameplay and then a presentation. No pics, no video. Public was not given much to see and go on.

[Agent75]

Knock it out for something like £19.99 or £24.99 and it’ll generate so many sales, they’d go dizzy. Look at sales figures of even Nintendo games. Knock those cards out for under £29.99, pull in more money. Too many people buying used games that hammer new games sales also. Many AAA games hit low figures. Why can’t games hit 20 million plus? It’s not rocket science.

[TheColbertinator]

Gaas is full of failures

[FlameWater]

Titanic was a successful movie, you didn't see them make a video game adaptation of that.

[Eviltattoo]

Guardians of the Galaxy was an awesome game. Unfortunately my hopes for a sequel are probably squashed now.

[TheDreamCorridor]

Good.

[Bobertt]

It's a shame Guardians of the Galaxy was a great game and much better than Avengers. But Avengers was such a disaster since they insisted on making a games as a service that people didn't even bother with Guardians because they connected it with Avengers even though they are very different games.

[isarai]

Maybe dont make it a soulless cashgrab with monetization ruining even the tiniest aspect of the game. Also probably make an actual satisfying gameplay loop, game is just bland grinding for the sake of grinding.