VR Devs Pull Support for Oculus Rift Until Palmer Luckey Steps Down

Will Oculus Rift lose support from game developers because its inventor supports Donald Trump?

[Overload]

It's not just for Trump, he is backing a white supremacist organization.

http://www.thedailybeast.co...

"Along with Luckey, Nimble America was founded by two moderators of Reddit’s r/The_Donald, which helped popularize Trump-themed white supremacist and anti-Semitic memes along with 4Chan and 8Chan. A questionnaire to become a moderator at r/The_Donald posted in March had applicants answer the questions “Is there a difference between white nationalism and white supremacy?” and “Was 9/11 an inside job?”

[antikbaka]

everything is called whitesupremacist these days.

[Giru017]

This is correct. They've been trying to spin the issue into a political one when it has NOTHING TO DO with the presidential race. It's about Luckey backing the racist Nimble America organization (with much more than the reported $10,000 if leads are to be believed).

[DragonPaw]

Fail. Now that the propaganda laws have expired and not reinstated, the whole media is against facts. There you are citing an article that doesn't even directly reference an action of Trump. I don't see him funding rioters.

Pound the war drums to the beat of Hillary Clinton, puppet of George Soros. All this turmoil in our country right now is orchestrated by this agenda. Ignore facts and listen to proxies to form your opinions. In the age of information, ignorance is a choice.

This is a favor from this flavor of the entertainment industry. I don't care about Occulus anyways, and big business operates within big politics.

[Overload]

You realize what Nimble America is right? And that he is one of the founders.

[DragonPaw]

@Overload Milo Yiannopoulos is the only name you can put behind Nimble America, and he is not Donald Trump. You are wrong. I don't think Milo has any authority over Trump, so you are either making assumptions or believing what you were intended to believe.

Side note: Milo is a self proclaimed homosexual who prefers black men. HMMM.

[kparks]

Guy can back and do whatever the hell he wants.. hope he tells them to shove it! He's free to live his life how he wants. Wether you agree or not with him does not matter...and if this company refuses to do business that's there choice also.

[Overload]

Of course he can back whatever he wants, but people can also choose to not support him because of it.

[brianunfried]

You may be a bigot if you discriminate against someone for their political views, religion, race or sexual preference.

[Christopher]

Typically bigotry is only for those things that you show a bias towards in which someone else has no control over. Politics and religion do not fall in that arena, sexual preference is up for debate. I think you may have meant to use a word such as intolerant instead of bigot.

[TFJWM]

A bigot is merely someone who judges someone else in a group that they do not fall under. It is not contained to just something someone can not change.

Edit: Actually you can be bigoted against a group you even fall under it really just judging a group based on them being members of that group.

[mogwaii]

Sexual preference is a ridiculous term, a gay person doesnt prefer to be gay, they just are so bigitory isnt up for debate at all.

[cl1983]

Hypocrite may fit in better.

[donthate]

definition of bigot: a person who is intolerant toward those holding different opinions.

Sounds like every person condemning Oculus/Palmer in here.

[Eonjay]

Welcome back Chris! Well actually yes you can be bigoted against someone for almost anything that can be used to classify someone into a group. Not just color. It is stupid but true.

[Ogygian]

The definition according to the OED: "a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.".

Etymologically, it emerged from the French insinuating that the Normans were religious hypocrites. Having its basis in faith, the word solely refers to people holding different opinions. Intolerant is a bit broader, as it comes from the Latin "tolerare" (to endure), hence it can be used to refer to anyone who refuses to "endure" things they don't like (hence you cannot tolerate things you like - only those you dislike, which for some people can mean race or sexual preferences).

I apologise if I come across as a smart arse (that's not my intention, and I had these definitions very mixed up myself not too long ago!).

[Psychotica]

Can you be a bigot against bigots?

[TFJWM]

@donthate umm no you can't be a bigot to objects...

[NicSage]

Everyone here is a bigot for their opposing views to those who agree with Palmer. Everyone is a bigot in some way. Freedom doesn't stop at feelings.

[frostypants]

Ah yes, the old "being discriminatory against bigots is bigotry" line...

[XXanderXX]

Good for those developers but their decision is not swaying me from trying both big HMD units.

[Majin-vegeta]

Good if he wanta oculos to survive he'll do it.

[mahmoods26]

There's a big difference between supporting a candidate politically or through donations, either of which is fine. The issue is that he is actively supporting hate speech through funding. I don't care if he wants to support Trump, that's not my issue. But the organization he is supporting shows that he is of poor moral judgement. Sponsoring hate speech is wrong. Make no mistake creating and circulating stories, memes and images through social media to reinforced stereotypes and negativity with allowing for reasonable discourse is hate speech.

[DefenderOfDoom2]

I watched a bunch of interviews and podcast featuring Palmer Luckey talking about the video game industry and i think he is not a good spokesperson for 'Oculus Rift '. If i worked for 'Facebook' i would use JOHN CARMARK for future interviews promoting 'Oculus Rift'.

[Perjoss]

John is an excellent speaker, you could even say he's a bit too good, but from a business stand point he's a bit too honest as he has no problems pointing out a products weak points before its even released. I can listen to John talk all day but I think the last thing a company wants is someone on stage telling people about flaws in the hardware that might improve in the next iteration.

Obviously for the fans its perfect, we got an honest person telling us exactly what to expect and zero corporate marketing speak.

[DefenderOfDoom2]

Reply to Perjoss , yes i agree he is honest and most of the time he does not talk in layman's terms, but it is very entertaining . That is why John Romero did most of the promotions and interviews for orginal DOOM . I would like to see John Carmark do a few interviews for 'Oculus Rift',but not be the official spokesperson . I think Palmer Luckey at times comes off as being pretentious and sometimes can be negative when he talks.

[Red_Renegade]

good to see developers standing against things like this. trump is one thing, but to support people with racist agendas is another. luckey should go.

[TheColbertinator]

Vive and PSVR are the winners in this political boycott.

[Majin-vegeta]

Anyone else think Oculuos is gonna blow up??First you got carmack being sued for allegedly stealing from zenimax about oculuos then now you got this.

[Perjoss]

I think the thing most likely to kill off the rift is its £550 price tag, and now those £200 controllers.

[rainslacker]

I think since it has Facebooks money behind it now that they're going to have a lot of people trying to get something from it. Not going to speak on the merits of potential theft of patented tech or copyrighted ideas, but it's not in any way uncommon for successful products to have this stuff lobbed at them. I'd imagine all the VR manufactuerers will. OR, being one of the bigger contenders in the field will certain cause them to be targeted more.

I don't think this particular issue will really hurt OR for the long term. It'll die down at some point, and Lucky will either continue the way he has, or simply be less in the forefront of it's promotion, while the average user(mainstream where it will be successful anyhow if it gets that far) will be clueless to it all.

This all kind of reminds me of the founder and CEO of Chick-Fil-A who made anti-abortion comments, and how everyone acted like it would ruin CFA. While they got some ire, it really didn't amount to anything. He of course wasn't really supporting something that involved a hate group, nor do I feel he was unreasonable in his views or disrespectful in expressing them, so it could mean more here. However, I don't think OR in general is anywhere near as recognizable outside gaming/tech markets, so it's unlikely to ever blow up in the mainstream.

[donthate]

It seems if you are against something, then you are hateful these days. Hate used to have a different meaning from held a different opinion, or dislike.

[Gaming4Life1981]

damn this hurts oculus rift badly that devs are leaving the platform but I like that they are standing up for something they believe is wrong.

[FreeSpeech69]

This is crazy and fact people support Punishment for political disagreement is even more crazy. Stand up for your freedoms or yours will be lost as well.

[Eonjay]

He should make it clear that his viewpoints aren't held by his company. You see the problem with being a spokesman for a product is that you become the face of that product and you don't want people avoiding a product because of your own personal views. This is basic. You don't want to give people a reason not to support you. There are too many people working hard on the Rift and so much invested that it becomes selfish on his part to draw this kind of negative attention to it. If he wants to step down from his post and go on a world hate tour that is his right but don't involve the whole team.

[Notellin]

"I am deeply sorry that my actions are negatively impacting the perception of Oculus and its partners. The recent news stories about me do not accurately represent my views.

Here’s more background: I contributed $10,000 to Nimble America because I thought the organization had fresh ideas on how to communicate with young voters through the use of several billboards. I am a libertarian who has publicly supported Ron Paul and Gary Johnson in the past, and I plan on voting for Gary in this election as well.

I am committed to the principles of fair play and equal treatment. I did not write the "NimbleRichMan" posts, nor did I delete the account. Reports that I am a founder or employee of Nimble America are false. I don’t have any plans to donate beyond what I have already given to Nimble America.

Still, my actions were my own and do not represent Oculus. I’m sorry for the impact my actions are having on the community."

He already did.

[andresegr]

Doesn't sound good for the Oculus Rift.

If Palmer doesn't steps down, the PSVR should have a free way with all the devs.

This is indirectly a good news for Sony.

[S2Killinit]

I think Sony, Oculus, and HTC are not so much competitors than they are partners in pushing VR forward. Even Oculus and HTC benefit from each other's success.

But of course i see your point.

[S2Killinit]

Im proud of the gaming industry today.

[immabadguy]

What the hell are you talking about? Luckey has every right to support whatever candidate he pleases, and the fact that you're cheering on discrimination based on political views is disgusting.

[ITPython]

More power to them, that is one of the perks of living in a free society. But this freedom is a two way road, as we are free to not purchase their games based on their political beliefs.

[opinionated]

That group of developers is pathetic. They are master projectionists, "they reject intolerance" lol. These fools are the epitome of intolerance and it would be funny if they weren't deathly serious. I hope they fail miserably and go out of business for their dumb ignorant actions.

I'm not even buying an oculus, I have no intention to and this affects me in no way whatsoever. I'm not even pro-trump. The only thing that has changed is that list of devs being ignored by me. Congrats on your activism douchebags.

[Eonjay]

So twisted. If Luckey has a right to be an activist (and he does and he is) then so do they. Welcome to freedom opinionated. Rights don't just protect hate speech, it protects your right to not tolerate it.

[rainslacker]

I feel people make it too much about these devs being anti-Trump. I think that's rather incidental, as they seem to be boycotting it based on Luckey's affiliation to a group which supposedly promotes hate and discrimination, which also happens to be very pro-Trump, which Trump himself is somehow connected to.

You may note at this point that I don't seem very informed on who believes what, because honestly, I don't care to really look too far into it. However, the first article on this(maybe this one with a new heading, I dunno) made it about it being anti-Trump, as opposed to boycotting due to the CEO supporting a negative groups.

That being said, these companies made a decision to not support OR because they don't want to support hate groups, or those that support them. That's not really intolerance on their part, just them saying they don't support such things, and giving their business to those that fall more in line with their own personal standings on such matters. It's not uncommon in business, however, it's rarely made into such a big ordeal. The idea of doing business with others that you simply like is pretty ancient in the world as a whole. It's not always a sound business decision, but it's their decision to make none the less.

[opinionated]

Retweeting a couple posts is not an "affiliation". That's what kind of a joke world we live in now. Twitter is our moral compass now? The tweets in question weren't even hate speech, they were legitimate.

[rainslacker]

@Dragon

I'm referring to the original article which had a headline implying it was because he was a trump supporter, and the description and title made no mention of the tweets or actual reasons they said they were removing support. People went with that, and then still use it while commenting since the article was reapproved, or resubmitted.

@opinionated

Maybe not an affiliation, but certainly indicates support to some degree, at least when not retweeted to show disdain for it. Won't care to speculate on just how far he supports such things, but generally, I feel Trump is pretty bigoted towards a lot of things.

Beyond that, I don't really care to discuss the politics behind the candidates, or what they support. My comment was more about the case at hand, and why the developers have every right to do what they did, and how from a business perspective they're leveraging that business to show support for something. Agree or disagree with them, they have a right, and to assume it's due to intolerance, instead of distaste for the support at hand is short sighted. Beyond that, I was merely pointing out how people have made it into something else by bringing Trump into it, since from what I can tell based on my admitted limited understanding of the issue, that doesn't have anything to do with it.

[opinionated]

I never said they didn't have a right to do what they did though. I said it was intolerant and pathetic to essentially bully a man out of his job because he retweeted something they disagree with. I can see a bunch of twitter nobodies utilizing this activism but not a professional business. Their intolerance is not acceptable to me. I'm just one man in a sea of thousands but that's my opinion and that's my business. They don't have it anymore, plain and simple. I reject their ideology, tactics and demonizing activism. It's a pathetic joke but they are free to express their intolerance. No argument from me.

And nothing against the hardworking people in those studios, I will buy their games again when the top players who made these decisions step down.

[rainslacker]

On that case I agree with you. Saying he needs to be fired or else they won't give support is the wrong tactic. It's one thing to say they disapprove, and the reasons they are pulling support, and quite another to demand another company to bow to their wishes.

If it was something that was a big enough issue, and caused many developers to withdraw, or in the case of other similar instances people to be upset for some reason, then the company in question would have to decide where they stand on the issue, and if that person should be let go....although I also think that for companies it is made into such a black and white issue that also suppresses a persons ability to have free will, but that's kind of another topic from what you are discussing, and comes down to what is ethical and right in terms of employment law.

Setting ultimatums for opinions, regardless of how distasteful they are is just petty, and IMO unprofessional, and using political pressure of vocal outcry, negative press, or removing support to try and demand a person's livelihood to be put in jeopardy is indeed petty and misplaced, and a real problem with social media which I have personally lamented on quite a few occasions.....most recently during the whole GG/SJW stuff where it was quite common.

Personally, I wasn't addressing that matter in my original comments, so sorry for the misalignment of our discussion.

Edit @below

"aren't we being bigoted right now, because we are intolerant of Trumps opinions?"

Some may be. For me, it's not so much that I'm intolerant of his opinions, although I mostly disagree with them, it's more that his opinions are being used to shape his campaign and his policy, so I'm saying, and I assume others may wish to say it this way but can't form it in such a way, that Trumps bigotry is a negative because it will have an effect on everyone should be elected and allowed to enact such policies.

[donthate]

rain:

I'm not a Trump or Hillary supporter, and think we are doomed either way.

That said, aren't we being bigoted right now, because we are intolerant of Trumps opinions?

It is quite ironic that the people screaming for Trump being bigoted are themselves bigots.

[Eonjay]

I totally get that you only think opinions that support your view should be supported and going against that is something inappropriate. But you dou get to do that. I already said he gets the right to believe what he wants. You can't bully me into submission. Deal with it. I'm saying your bias has clouded your judgements. I'm saying you are as bad as thouse you speak of. I'm saying you have no right over people's actions. I'm saying if your lack of control makes you cry (and you are) that it is pathetic and small and unnecessary. But I respect your right to do so!

[opinionated]

Your projection and mimicry is hilarious bro. The difference is that I'm not a professional business and I don't care what people support. Im crying over tweets? No, you're wrong and my arguments don't work in reverse to your favor. I can tolerate pretty much anything, including your dumb views. I can't tolerate intolerance though which is what these devs display. I'm not trying to bully you into anything, I simply told you the truth. Your mockery doesn't change that, it just makes you look ignorant and incapable of coming up with a real answer. Have a nice day.

[stalepie]

It's disappointing to see these developers do this, but glad to see the quote from James Green at least.

[Codedan]

He said he supports Gary Johnson, and will be going for him. These developers are idiots, and are being hypocrites from doing this.

[EliteGameKnight]

Or, you know, we could just get over some petty 'once every four years' hatred and just make good games. No? Alright then....

[antikbaka]

the only thing they do - is censoring poilitical views

[BlindMango]

God forbid you have the "wrong" (Wrong = Conservative) political views in Silicon Valley!

[Errorist76]

So supporting racist hate trains and Internet trolling is being conservative these days?! What a sick world we live in.

[baelfyrekse]

This is unfortunate. I know that many developers, are pretty liberal people and I think that is fine. I don't want to live in a world where everybody agrees with me. Having said that, when my game developers become political and it affects the games, I get annoyed. I like Irrational games, because they make good games, not for their politics. They are as qualified to discuss politics as anybody on the street and I rely on them for games, not the news. This New millennium trend of drawing a line where you believe there is the truth (your side) and then the wrong side is terrible. Now if somebody disagrees with you, they are hateful or racist. Reminds me of 2003-2004 where anybody who spoke out about the war was unpatriotic and didn't support the troops. Nobody liked that characterization, nor should they.

[2cents]

Why is politics being mixed with gaming?

Oil and water.

[MCTJim]

Developers need to just make freaking games and keep their personal agendas out of gaming. Whoever you are going to vote for..just vote for. Just because he supports Trump doesn't make him a bad person.

[R6ex]

Its ok. I'll just quit supporting these devs who place politics before gaming.

[_LarZen_]

The developers are doing the right thing.

[x_BlackRose]

I understand the White Supremacy part, but backing Trump? So the f*** what! Why should it matter, Jesus H Christ!

[Godz Kastro]

So devs are trying to infringe on the man's right to vote for whoever he sees fit? Wow. Devs are sad.

[Muadiib]

Good to know which developers to boycott in future, these regressive's are hypocrites.

[Neonridr]

Pretty sure a person has the right to believe and support whatever they want. If you don't like that or align with those views, then fine. But by then saying that what they are doing with their free time or money, outside of the organization, is wrong or against your beliefs, is in itself being discriminatory. HTC was accused of using child labour to manufacture their phones in the past. Who knows, they may still. Does that mean that this dev supports child labour because they are willing to align their product with a company like HTC? See how ridiculous that sounds in the end?

Politics and religion have no placed being used as a measuring stick in any part of the world.

[NarfleGarthok]

It's a bluff! They wouldn't pass on all that extra income from Oculus sales of their games. Potentially millions lost, I don't see that happening.

[TheDivine]

Wow citizen spends his own personal money to make funny Hilary gif's and the interwebs equates this to supporting the KKK. Hope he stands his ground and Oculus doesn't give in to this witch hunt. His views are his own and his contributions are his own. Before you even start its not a racist organization. Its a anti Hilary organization. Just because BLM is rounding up whites and beating them half to death daily and burning businesses to the ground doesn't mean the whole organization is a racist organization. Only the ones who are committing the hate crimes and violence. Just because some in Obamas circle advocate civil war and killing off a hundred million amaricans doesnt mean Obama is a traitor and terrorist. It means those people are. Luckey didn't seek out this element. This element latches onto anything pro Trump or anti Hilary. He is a private citizen who donated money to an anti Hilary pac so they could make funny billboards. Its hilarious. You guys are borderline facist. Neogaf is actively banning people for supporting Luckey. Free speech is dead. I stand by Luckeys right free speech and freedom of expression. If it was offensive or racist I would deplore him but still support his right. Luckily Luckey did nothing offensive nor racist. This is how America is these days. Anyone who supports a conservative is automatically a racist bigot who is goose stepping in a white sheet.

[BlahFlahNo]

I believe in freedom and while I think developers should be able to choose what to do I don't like that anytime someone has a different opinion they are being pressured to step down from their jobs. So he likes Trump, might be stupid, but should he be forced out of a job for it? Seems rather insane.

[S-Word]

Great, now I just need a list of these devs that are being retarded so I can never buy a game from them ever again (assuming I ever did in the first place).