Xbox One: Microsoft doesn’t care if you can’t share or resell games

The Xbox One has had a problematic reveal, not least of all because Microsoft can't decide what to tell consumers about DRM and second-hand games. In the end though, they have the tech to ensure every user is paying to play and they will be using it.

[GalacticEmpire]

So the basic gist of this article is that, if you're poor and can't afford all your games new, Microsoft hates you.

[PirateThom]

To be entirely fair, I don't think any publisher likes you if you can't afford all your games new, since they aren't making money off you.

It's just that Microsoft seem to be making it very consumer unfriendly, especially after people complained that online passes were awful.

[GalacticEmpire]

Of course, we're just numbers to them. I still expect to be treated with a modicum of respect since, after all, I am a paying customer.

The problem is that buying new or buying used are not mutally exclusive options and Micrsoft are punishing not just people who ONLY buy used but also paying customers who SOMETIMES buy used.

[Mario20]

What is this college school? How can they even say that. Im telling you last time he was in my office he disagreed that chocolates are made our of pineapples. that is when his hair took control of his toppings wink wink

and also where do you get your information private thom

[pkb79]

Publishers must hate me. I never pay price for new games. I will wait 6 months, a year, or whenever till the price drops to $20-$30 or grab it on sale.

Its not that I can't afford new games I just think they are way overpriced. I will pay full price for a nice long RPG but as I don't play online $60 for a 10 hour single player campaign is a rip off.

I may have to break this rule for Last of Us but then I have a huge backlog of games to get through so probably not.

[Godmars290]

Then they shouldn't be making games with higher and higher production costs.

@GalacticEmpire:
Not to mention the whole internet things. Whether because you can't afford it or just have a bad provider.

[Retroman]

x1 is the hot topic of the century to hate on but in reality. i'm worry about future events with hackers trying to break in ps4 an x1 causing psn and xboxlive to possibly crash again. hope Sony and MS has a solution announcement by E3.

[rainslacker]

Thing is, there are still a lot of people who buy BOTH used and new. It's not a one or the other type of proposition. Gamers especially, like the ones speaking out now, often recount times where they have brought used just because it was the only option, and other times where it gets them into the series, and many other benefits of the used game market. But many of them still buy a lot of new games as well. These same people are the ones who are upset, just because it goes against their principals, and it seems like these companies are trying to control us(which I find to be a different topic).

I think a great majority of the people just like having the choice. I know sometimes I pick up a used game that might be $10, and any new sale of that game would be irrelevant to the publisher by then. Does that discount the many many new game purchases I buy each year?

There will always be people who just buy used. But cutting out used just takes them out of the market completely, or pushes them towards a competitor, where that person builds up brand loyalty to that competitor. In the future, when they decide to buy more new(which happens for many young people as they get older), it just means that now the original console that drove them away has to try and win them back.

To this end, I find the whole blocking of the used game market a short term fix(possibly to something that isn't a problem), with long term ramifications to any company that decides to support this agenda. On top of this, MS apparent solution of handling trades/sales looks to be more a way to monetize the used game market, which to me is doubly insulting.

[3-4-5]

Yea but I just got a 3DS+PSP after not owning one ever, or owning a DS.

I've now discovered about 10 series of games I'm not a fan of, because I was able to purchase 10+ games for $5-20.

Those dev's now have a new fan willing to pay full price for their new games.

Sometimes it's a long term decision and those are usually the best and more intelligent ones for the company to make.

[fermcr]

And what about those gamers that buy new games, play them and resell them to help purchase more new games... like me. The result is that gamers like me are going to buy far less new games.

[BlmThug]

In the same boat as you. I buy games new and those that aren't great, I sell quick in order to recoup most of my money which is used to buy more new games

[T2]

Your dead on the used market drives the new one ... Theres a bunch of games ive bought new that were sequels to games I tried used to guage my interest first

[T2]

Oops dbl post oh well - Its quite simple you make a quality product you reap the rewards ... You dont see top auto companies wage war on the used market . Its bad business ..
I hate to pick on madden good games but no way in hell they can justify a new game every year when its obvious an update would suffice

[rainslacker]

You're not the only one. GameStop reported that over 70% of trade ins are used to finance the purchase of a new game.

Wonder how many people will be trading in their old games to finance the purchase of a next gen system. There will be some good deals on the massive influx of used games by the end of this year. Many of them being games that the publisher's no longer care about getting money off of. Now imagine what happens when the next next gen starts, and there is less money to purchase all those new systems because you can't trade in older games or you get less for them. Short-sightedness is the word of the day.

[bigrob904]

you know let me say this, i understand why developers would want to have people buy their games new. i understand that they would want to limit you just letting your friends borrow games because that could have been a potential customer and that is money they could have had. i know that games need to sell so that more games can be made, i know everything that needs to be known about it. But here is the thing, once you buy a product it is yours to do with it as you please. i i buy i car i don't have to pay a fee every time i let somebody else use it. i can let as many people borrow a movie as much as i like. i could go on on on, so knowing that why should they get to treat games any different? my thing is if you make great games people will buy them because they know that if they want more great games from that developer than they need to buy knew. most people can only buy a few new games a year, they get to experience more games because they can get used games at a reduced price. when you go out of your way to destroy that market, you are destroying gamers opportunities to play more games. all thats gonna due is make people not want your console or hack your system.

[faysal]

LOOL check this out...
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

[colonel179]

My most important concern is not the used games. Is the borrowing part.

I have 75 PS3 games and I have bought all of them new, but I have shared a lot of games with friends. Sure, MS could come up with an idea to sell or trade games with a partnership with Gamestop or whatnot.

The problem is if someone wants to share the game with a family member, a friend, a roommate, etc. For me that is the biggest issue.

[NewZealander]

its sad that its come to this.

i should be able to buy or sell what ever i want, sure i think EB games etc suck, they rip people off, but at the end of the day game developers/publishers should not have the right to tell people they cant sell games that they legitimately bought, its really sad that we have come to accept this!

i am still waiting for E3, theres far too many conflicting stories at the moment its like overload trying to decipher this mess!

[Darrius Cole]

The guy that wrote this article is an idiot, either that or he was paid by Microsoft. Microsoft should care very much about the second hand market. The second hand market lowers the entry price of games and brings more money into the gaming industry. Moreover very few people are exclusively new game buyers or exclusively used game buyers. Most of us buy some of each and sell some games back and keep others.

This guy is arguing that Microsoft is going to succeed in taking away gamers rights and that gamers should just accept it. He wants Microsoft to just come out and say that this is what they are going to do. Well Microsoft did say it, and it doesn't look like the gamers are accepting it. I know this gamer is not. As long as they ban or restrict used games, as long as the great eye of Kinect is always watching, as long as their consoles have to check in with the internet every day, I'll never accept it. If they succeed they will do it without my money.

[KillrateOmega]

Not surprising considering that its MS we're talking about here...

[Knightofelemia]

A company that doesn't care about their bread an butter isn't a good company. There are people out there who do game on a budget. A single mother who scrimped and saved to buy her kid an XboxOne with a used game the kid can't play is nothing more but a paper weight. Mother sells the XboxOne and gets the PS4 with a used game and her kid can play and enjoy with a smile is a great to her. Microsoft lost out on a customer and Sony gained one. Microsoft won't do that. No one knows what the used games will be like on the XboxOne I doubt anything that Microsoft even knows. If anything they might run damage control on the speculations and the rumors and announce what they might do with used games. If anything it would be what we are doing with used games on the current consoles. Play the single player campaign and when I want to play online I buy a product key for that game.

[Darrius Cole]

There is no way in hell that Microsoft doesn't know what the business model for the Xbox One is going to be 4 to 6 months before launch. They know exactly what the used games policy is going to be and they told us. They just meant to hide it because they fear the blow-back from the gaming community if everybody knows the truth. That's why are giving none answers. They don't want to tell us the truth.

The gaming community can define their machine and kill it before it launches. And that looks to be happening, or in the early stages of happening. The hardest of the of the hardcore Xbox fans are jumping ship over this. Judging from the feedback and assuming that both console launch within on month and $50 of each other, the hardcore looks to be ready to buy the PS4 over the Xbone by 8 -2, or maybe even 9 - 1. If that happens it's a wrap. It'll be way down in Wii-U territory.

[rainslacker]

Wii U is seeing a surge in sales. I know it's only been a week, but as a Wii U owner I would like to see it continue.

So long as Sony doesn't come out with the same stupid nonsense as MS, it looks to be a PS4/Wii U next gen for me. Too bad, because I was ready to give MS my money if they managed to impress me with the games, now the games don't even matter. Never in my life did I think I would make that statement.

[Moonman]

WTF are they smoking at Redmond?

[00]

money laced with cocaine.

[badz149]

And think it smells good!

[Jek_Porkins]

I'm confused, I thought it came out the other day that you could share games and buy used games? Even their official statement said they designed Xbox One with that in mind....

[kwandar]

Watch Angry Joe's rant and you'll begin to see what is going on.

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

[UNGR]

An angry tired man crying about things we don't have all the details about? The reveal might have been bad but for the love of god give them some time. Who know's, maybe they'll pull the good guy card and ditch all of the customer unfriendly crap. Some people really lover to jump the gun, especially the fanboys on the internet. The reveal wasn't everything, you should wait for the rest of the details or you're just being ignorant.

[cyguration]

I don't know why people keep repeating this like it's not true, because yes...you can SHARE AND BUY USED GAMES.

What they keep skipping over is the license fees. When you buy a used game you still have to pay a license fee to actually play the game, otherwise you got a disc that's just good for a coaster.

"The bits that are on that disc, you can give it to your friend and they can install it on an Xbox One," he said.

http://kotaku.com/you-will-...

"They would then have to purchase the right to play that game through Xbox Live."

"They would be paying the same price we paid, or less?" we asked.

"Let’s assume it’s a new game, so the answer is yes, it will be the same price," Harrison said.

EDIT: I'm just posting this info here and I, in no way, support the death of used games. But a lot of people seem to be buying into MS's PR spin posts as they try to find a way to convince people that there are no used fees for sharing. Yes you can share, and yes there are fees for sharing. It's a lose-lose for gamers.

[SexyGamerDude]

Unless you go over your friend's house and sign into your account on his Xbox, your friend will have to pay a fee. There is no sharing. MS has said this.

He can't go home and try to play it on his account.

[Jek_Porkins]

You've got old information my friend.
http://www.theverge.com/201...

" Xbox One games will phone home to Microsoft servers on a regular basis to verify that their users own the games. If you buy a used title, however, Polygon claims that you won't have to pay Microsoft for a fresh license to the game.

Simply popping in the game disc and installing it will reportedly establish lawful ownership as far as Microsoft's servers are concerned. When you install the game on your Xbox One, you'll be deauthenticating it on the previous owner's account, according to Polygon"

[SexyGamerDude]

Jek, this is from your article.

"Does the Xbox One actually require an internet connection? Will used game buyers or sellers have to pay an extra fee? Microsoft hasn't made it clear, but a report at Polygon now claims that the answers are "yes" and "no" respectively."

This article is just more speculation. I watched someone who works at MS say that I would have to sign into my friends Xbox for him to play the game. I'll take his word for it.

[ShwankyShpanky]

@Jek:

"You've got old information my friend.
http://www.theverge.com/201... "

How many different ways to people need to debunk that article before you stop reposting it? It's not even the actual source article from Polygon.

[cyguration]

"Simply popping in the game disc and installing it will reportedly establish lawful ownership as far as Microsoft's servers are concerned. When you install the game on your Xbox One, you'll be deauthenticating it on the previous owner's account, according to Polygon"

So then what would be the point of authenticating in the first place if it's just the same as before?

And how would Microsoft know your "friend" from some guy you gave the game to? Or a pawn shop owner? Or a mom & pop outlet that has used games? Or the Salvation Army? That doesn't make any sense how Microsoft will be able to tell "friends" from everyone else.

[Jek_Porkins]

It wouldn't be just for friends obviously, it'd be used for rental services and things like that. Once I have it installed and activated, if I lend it to my brother or whoever else, when they activate it in their console, it deactivates it in mine.

So if I rent a game from Gamefly and activate it, it will deactivate it from who had it last ect... It really isn't THAT hard to grasp in my opinion.

[rainslacker]

If this is true, then it's just to make sure that only one active instance of the install is valid at a time. That in itself isn't a bad thing, and not unlike it is now with discs. It could be achieved by having to insert a valid game disc from time to time, but among friends it means just swapping discs when need be. Internet authentication prevents that.

It still doesn't solve the issue of what happens when MS takes down the authentication servers one day. So 20 years from now retro X1 gaming may not be possible, unless MS issues a firmware update to remove the DRM.

[a_bro]

speaking about DRM, it looks like GAF is tweeting the hashtag
#PS4noDRM, they're trying to get the message across the executives at Sony so that they dont do it. dont know if that will make a difference if sony does it.

[MikeyDucati1]

Sony is doing it. Why else do you think EA capitalized on the opportunity to broadcast that they're really not the bad guys by saying "No online passes next gen"? They said that because they know both Sony and MS will be eliminating the usage of used games on their consoles.

[wishingW3L]

if Sony allows used games then they win by default. If they wanna win then, #PS4noDRM please!

[a_bro]

that's why i was so surprised when i heard that they were killing the online pass. it was too good to be true.

Sony used Microsoft to talk about these plans, keeps them with their hands clean for the time being.

this is just plain scary for both sides.

I think it is time for these companies to come clean. this is a major issue, since these are suppose to be consoles.

Consoles are suppose to be easy to use for gaming, not a cluster***ks of paywall to play.

i think this would encourage piracy in my opinion. not a smart move.

Edit: well according to someone at gaf who has knowledgable information, they have put their plans on hold because of the Microsoft backlash

[NewEra7]

I highly doubt they are for two reasons. Firstly being the massive if not historic backlash Microsoft has received by the game community and devs they wouldn't dare follow suit and secondly they aren't making online connection an a requirement so how would they implement it ?

[kneon]

How do you propose Sony will do it when they have said that no internet connection is required?

[MariaHelFutura]

"Are all of those things optional, though? For people who have broadband data limits, for example? They can customise everything?

"Oh yes, yes, you can go offline totally. Social is big for us, but we understand there are some people who are anti-social! So if you don't want to connect to anyone else, you can do that."

If the PS4 can go entirely offline, they can't watch you or block used games.

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

[wishingW3L]

true, just tweeted using the tag, everybody with a tweeter account should do it too!

[MikeyDucati1]

@a_bro

I couldn't agree with you more. I want these companies to outright say it and let it be done with. Honestly, are people really going to abandon the video game industry if they do? As much as I don't want it, I still want to play the next gen so I will have to deal with it.

@wishingW3L

Your name is appropiate. The sad truth is, corporations can do what they want and no matter what people say, they will still buy it. Just like the Xbox One. The whole wide internet is in a uproar but I wouldn't be surprised if Xbox One does significantly well.

@NewEra7

At the same time, Sony isn't saying anything either to make us feel otherwise. Right now my best bet is that they are analyzing the best way to talk about to the community since they see the backlash.

How will they implement it? Well when it comes to this area discussion where we are talking about what corporations proposed, you have to really digest what they saying. They often like to spin words to make it sound one way but it means another. So yes, it wouldn't require constant internet connection...if you were just buying new games. But if you buying used, it must be verified or you must pay a license fee. That's what I think. DRM is really trying to place a footprint in the industry. It's apparent the industry wants it in place, it just hasn't been perfected yet.

[NewEra7]

Hmm you have some valid points Although I remember reading somewhere that they would leave it up to publishers and 3rd parties if they wanted to then they could but they wouldn't necessarily do it on the console/1st party (it was from a credible source Google it). Also I just wouldn't make sense for them to do it as their whole approach this Gen has been so pro-gamer then for them turn around and do anti consumer policies cause they couldn't afford to lose that appeal/audience but I guess we'll just have to sit back and see.

[MikeyDucati1]

This article is all over the place. Pick a side...

[stage88]

If your not a mindless sheep then they don't want to know about you.

[PrimeGrime]

How is the used game our problem anyway? Isn't that more related to the gaming stores that sell them without giving any cut to these developers that make them?

Not being selfish but it isn't the consumers problem how used games are affecting others. If that is the case Microsoft needs to be targeting these gaming stores instead of expecting the consumer to fix the problem with their money.

We didn't start the problem, I don't see why we are expected to pay for it like always. I guess it is nothing new in America eh, isn't that what our taxes do everyday.. I mean we are charged random fees enough that go to nothing.. taxes that go to bullshit.. now were expected to solve the used game crisis by using our money?

Go to hell Microsoft.

[palaeomerus]

Whatever Microsoft cares about doesn't matter. I'm simply not going to buy a product that is not what I want. I don't buy it then I won't be buying ANY games for it. Ever. That's fine with me if it's fine for MS. It worked out so well for WebTV, Win ME, Vista, and Zune after all.

[Bathyj]

Do they care if I dont buy any at all?
Probably not, many others will.

Heres what I dont get.

How can they justify not being able to lend a game to your friend for them to try out, (unless they sign in with your profile in which case you wont be able to sign in simultaneously) but Sony is allowing anyone to connect to you online and play whatever your playing, potentially meaning if anyone has a game on your friend list, you can play it.

Not an ideal way to play the whole game, but it at least means you can try any section of any game they might be up to at the time and not simply be limited to demos or trials. One seems like incredible value while the other seems like an incredible thumb to the eye.

[The_Blue]

"Sony is allowing anyone to connect to you online and play whatever your playing, potentially meaning if anyone has a game on your friend list, you can play it"

Where did you find this information?

[Bathyj]

It was in the reveal.

David Perry, head of GaiKai said friends will be able to spectate while you play and if you let them, actually play your game for you if youre in a tough spot or having trouble.

http://www.computerandvideo...

Its no secret, I dont know why people arent talking about this more in relation to MS's strategy. They seems to be worlds apart.

[ShwankyShpanky]

But they can only play it if you've got the game running, tying up your system from doing or playing anything else. I believe it's supposed to be streamed, so there's still actually only one instance of the game running, on your console, so it's not quite the same as "borrowing." They're telecommuting to your house to play your game on your console. (and I'd assume they couldn't earn any trophies or save any progress for their own profile)

[The_Blue]

Yeah, i'm sure this will be a PSN+ feature though.

[josephayal]

Simple, Don't buy xbox one

[Bathyj]

I think many have already reached that conclusion.

[Supermax]

Poor babies cry cry cry ill never do this ill never do that put a sock in your puss and be done with it go buy a wii u or something

[PrimeGrime]

I don't care about the Xbox One.

So have fun with that attitude Microsoft, cause all your fake pre-orders and payed for advertising isn't going to save this thing.

Enough said.

[rataranian]

Im way past caring about that pos system. Im gonna take a dump on one if I ever see it in person.

[Loki86]

What a terribly written article, why does trash like this get approved.

[IBleedXbox]

since when microsoft cared. they give us shitty apps on the 360 and barely any games. they basically said COD will feed their needs while we continue to charge them for online. They get $ 2,880,000,000 a year for they 48 million people online. and they dont provide us with games. fuck microsoft

[UNGR]

15 exclusive games, 8 of them new IP's within the first year of launch. Ignoring that is flat out ignorant.

[The_Blue]

I know. This website isn't for gamers.

Every article is about the next Xbox and why you hate it. I get it, you obviously love Nathan Drake and that emo kid with electric powers and skinny jeans.

[IBleedXbox]

now. what about the 360. nothing. i been a xbox fan since the first xbox. i remember playing halo and halo 2. remember when halo 2 had millions and millions of player online. that game rose the xbox to what is was. the 360 started focusing on apps and barely giving people games. all i play is Halo, Battlefield, and once in a while COD. and battlefield 3 came out 2011. microsoft sort of said COD and battlefield will satisfy their needs as we focus on putting more apps on the 360

[Vegrad415]

The article mentions how these new games are fully digital and 'in the cloud' and last forever, but that couldn't be more wrong.

When(if) the next xbox after X1 comes out, all your digital licenses for X1 are gone when Microsoft decides to shut the servers down. They are basically selling you a long-term rental.

If you buy a launch title for $60 on the first day, and the servers stay up for 10 years, why should I pay full price if I buy the game 5 years later? At best, I get half as much use out of the same purchase. This WILL happen eventually. Microsoft will only keep the old servers up for as long as it financially makes sense.

[00]

they want the consumers to literally pay for the publishers/developers mismanagement, stop spending so much damn money making those AAA games so when they sell 4 million within a month they can actually make a profit.

shrinking your consumer base and charging more is not a good plan and they'll find out when people start buying less game s.

[RiPPn]

I've been seeing this a lot since yesterday, but has it been confirmed that you can put the disk in another machine, it with auth it on that machine and remove auth from the original machine?

This just seems silly, what is the point of having this system in the first place? Just so you can load it onto a hard drive and play it without the disk in the drive? It doesn't prevent passing the game around or even reselling the game infinite times, so it just makes little sense to have this system in place just so you can remove the disc from the system and still play the game.

[C-Thunder]

They required playing from the hard drive because they wanted drm and didn't want to pay for the quicker blu-ray drive. There's still a license fee if your not buying from an authorized reseller. For example, if you borrow your friends game.

[SOULJER]

WOW. Most of my friends would never buy an X-BOX they call that the bum system Now Microsoft doesn't give a damn about the poor people who loyalty purchase their system. That's F-up.

[Corpser]

Never cared about used games, so this won't affect me one bit. Can't afford a game at $60? Then wait a few months or a year, most games are down to 20-30 new.

I support developers

[C-Thunder]

People who buy used still support developers, like when they buy dlc or the next game in a series new, etc.

[Mikeyy]

More like you support Publishers. I doubt the developers will get much out of this deal with the devil.

[ShwankyShpanky]

Can you explain what makes video game developers/publishers unique among all industries in that they should receive returns on subsequent sales of previously purchased products?

[ShaunCameron]

With all this, I'd be surprised of the XBox One isn't region-locked.

[ScubaSteve1]

then they better start making games cheaper. and no BS DLC i am sick of wasting 60 dollars on a short game where if i rent it i save money

[gamingisnotacrime]

Is there one positive thing to say about the Xbox one????

looks like Sony will be going solo with a console for gamers

[Bathyj]

I thought Bonnie Ross looked hot.

[DivineAssault]

M$ dont care about gamers anymore.. We're just a small portion of what their going after.. They want the casual crowd the wii got this gen.. @ least nintendo didnt have all these restrictions with the wii & they released good 1st party.. M$ thinks kinect games & multiplats will be good enough for us & will focus on apps, movies, etc..

[horndog]

Just give me my xboxone ms. Nevermind all these bs childish posts.

[cyberninja]

If its the case then gamers don't care xbox anymore unless they are plain retarded.

[KontryBoy706]

they don't care if you want games or a game console either

[tweet75]

loaning games to friends is part of gaming fun. All the way back to nes days and many times I have bought a game new once i borrowed it and tried it.

[dethpuck]

Finally somone who gets it. Sony and Microsoft don't care about the used game buyer. You make them no money. GameStop loves the used gamer, while studios close. none if this bothers me. Where is the outrage on steam?

[demonddel]

At Sony and Nintendo cares about us I'm getting loads of new games for my Vita and my Wii U Microsoft hates the hardcover gaming with they gimmicks

[Prcko]

i don't care about consoles either

[Tzuno]

I'll wait for E3 to hear some answers, if they prove to be insanely wrong then i already know what i need to do. Upgrade my PC like hell.

[Master of Unlocking]

"Xbox One: Microsoft doesn’t care if you can’t share or resell games"

Then I don't care if they can't sell their xbone, period.