Creator of Celeste Confirms Fan Theory That Madeline Is Transgender

Over 2 years after the indie game's initial release, creator Maddy Thorson confirms fan theory about Celeste's main character's gender identity.

[neomahi]

Lame. This isn't necessary.

[RpgSama]

Really? Somebody had to make this "announcement".

"No, Madeline was not always intended to be trans, in fact, Thorson themself only came to realize the character’s true identity after the game was released."

So the game was not created with a trans character, but after 2 years they now "realize the character's true identity" so they can score rainbow points.

[Princess_Pilfer]

She was revealed to be trans in the DLC that came out more than a year ago. Which you'd know, if you'd played it and paid any attention at all. The 'confirmation' is just telling people what we already knew.

[RpgSama]

@Princess_Pilfer

You have a direct quote from the developer, where they said it was decided after the fact, it might have been "revealed" on the DLC or the sequel, it doesn't change the fact that the character didn't start as trans, it was decided after release to make the change.

[Princess_Pilfer]

You're claiming they 'made an annoucement' 2 years later. beacuse they 'wanted rainbow points.' That's wrong. She's been trans for a while, end of story.

Also, have you ever written anything, ever? Or roleplayed a character you created, ever? Or seen interviews with like 90% of writers out there, ever? They *absolutely* do not plan everything out and know who the whole character is when they start out, or even after the first couple books. Many of them talk about how their own characters surprise them or develop in ways they did not expect. They didn't just sit down one day and go 'we're changing this,' that's rarily how character writing is done.

[MWH]

@Princess_Pilfer Sounds like an attempt for a trend, ND did it with TLOU and now these guys. I've said it many times before and I'll say it again; subjects like these should not feel forced, the developers should either be straight with their plans from the start or give the player the choice.

[-Foxtrot]

It does feel like that...like seriously

The game was never created with a trans character, the creator just discovered themselves to be trans, WHICH IS TOTALLY FAIR, then decided to turn their creation trans to relate to their transistion.

I don't agree with that, you released the game as it was, you created that character, all they've done here is went with a fan theory.

Now if they created a new game which reflected on their transition and made the character trans, then fair enough, but to go back and change an established character? No...sorry.

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

I find it hilarious that so many get genuinely offended by these kinds of stories.

The creator of the game is transgender so it's inclusion in the game is not random. It's not a big deal and certainly not something worth complaining about. In most sequels, there are plot points and twists that were never thought of when the original entry was made. Demanding that these "lame" stories not be reported is asking for Political Correctness.

[Welshy]

If we found this out in a sequel naturally via gameplay or in game cutscenes then I'd 100% agree with you.

But just throwing this info out there long after the game released when you wouldn't know it from actually playing the game is stupid.

[NecrumOddBoy]

Lucas,
We also don’t need website authors getting up in arms in the comments being asshats at the community because they don’t want your social identity politics.

[RgR]

Not offended. Shocked by the immense stupidity of some and outright deception on display.
It was not included in the game. That was decided afterwards.

It is something worth complaining about if you give a damn. I certainly dont want my children being told they should start chopping body parts or that they can get a sex change if they want.

A child knows absolutely nothing about the consequences of such actions or thinking. IF we dont trust them to drive or drink alchohol then why would we entrust them or force them to go through something tremendously more important. Something that will change them for the rest of their lives whether they like it or not.

Making a disorder the new fashion is not a good idea for next generations' mental health. Imagine telling schizophrenics that what they see is real for them and they should act on it. Not very healthy considering they need to be reminded of reality vs their hallucinations. They may think they're so important, maybe the president. This kind of mindset agrees with telling them that they are and feeding their mental illness. It will only end badly for them.

Agreeing and feeding someones mental illness is not compassion.

[Princess_Pilfer]

@Welshy
It *does* happen natrually in the game. There's a trans flag on her desk int he DLC, that released over a year ago. You can see her pills on her bedside table. Just beacuse *certain people* didn't notice doesn't mean it wasn't there.

[Welshy]

J K Rowling eat your heart out.

I have zero issues with whether a character is male, female, black, white, LGBT etc in games. It's this silly retconning of adding random LGBT identities to these characters when it literally has no mention or any influence on the the game that's stupid.

It's just trying to score browny points on the Internet and is totally unnecessary.

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

What evidence do you have that it's just for brownie points? The creator of the game is transgender which is the obvious reason why this decision was made.

Be honest, if this character was revealed as being transgender in any context, people would be extremely offended about it and complain about "PC Culture" while they are the ones getting offended (cognitive dissonance).

[RpgSama]

@LucasRuinedChildhood

Luke Cage was created by John Romita Sr. A white guy, so because of that he can make the decision that Luke Cage was actually white all along? /S

[RpgSama]

@LucasRuinedChildhood

"The creator of the game is transgender which is the obvious reason why this decision was made."

There you go, even you admitted unconsciously why this happened, not because it served the story or because it was planned all along, but because of "the obvious reason"

[camel_toad]

"Thorson themself" and Thorson being referred to as "them" elsewhere in the article. Geez the pronouns. "Them" is plural so I guess Thorson identifies as having a multiple personality disorder.

[RgR]

I wouldnt be surprised if that is the next disorder to be normalized. IT would make getting their pronouns right tremendously difficult.

[moriarty1889]

agreed. VERY lame indeed.

[GrizToof]

Why do people give a shit about what a video game character is packing under their shorts. I never gave a shit about this, I find it very silly. Let me guess, the parents removed his penis at 8 years old and poured hormone blockers down his throat just because he happened to like the color pink. Can the developers clarify this for me, its so important. If this isn't the case then I no longer think the game was good and want a refund. With such a high suicide rates among trans people its no wonder why he died so many times climbing up that mountain. I feel bad for the fella now, what a tragedy. I don't give a shit if a few pixels has 10 dicks and a vagina mouth, its a video game, stop trying to make everything fit your far left narrative. Let me guess if it turned out the character was a biological female, you would now hate the game and the devs are transphobes...

[DaGR8JIBRALTAR]

This agenda has taken over music and media , only thing left is video games.

[RgR]

Theyve also taken over schools. Who wouldve thought that instead of science our children would be taught ideaologies. Individuality is all gone and its all about what culture or skin group you are part of...white kids will have a tough time since white children oppress simply with their skin color.

BEfore you know they'll claim that if we disagree we are being violent...wait..they already are.

[phoenixwing]

If you read the article you would find that the dev who made the game is transgender. Basically taking the argument that if you want a game about something make it yourself. Also the dev didn't come out as transgender until later and feels the main character story/theme is like the devs.

Also the fact you no longer like the game and want your money back shows a level of closed mindedness. I'm sure you enjoyed the game before so I don't see why you'd fight an ideology war over it.

Edit: the main theme of the game according to the dev is fighting your own evil self. For the dev that takes the form of being trans but the idea of fighting to be a better person can be something everyone relates to in some form

[XabiDaChosenOne]

Being open minded is not synonymous with being intellgent; its just means your mind is easily exploitable and susceptible to recieve any dogma thrown your way granted there is enough peer pressure from society behind it to accept it.

[phoenixwing]

As opposed to being super judging by being closed minded? The dev didn't do anything to harm you so why get mad over the private parts of a fictional character that's so unabtrusive that you need clarification later on to even know the gender of the character.

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

@XabiDaChosenOne
I can't believe someone is actually trying to argue that close-minded people are smart. haha. Thanks for the laugh, mate.

Most of the greatest thinkers in human history were open-minded people who could think outside of the box that their close-minded colleagues occupied. The crap you can read in the comments on this site is amazing. haha

[XabiDaChosenOne]

@Phoenixwing What does it mean to judge? according to the definition, Judge: To form an opinion or estimation of after careful consideration.

What is wrong with forming an opinion after having careful consideration for the information presented to you?

@LucasRuinedChildhood
"I can't believe someone is actually trying to argue that close-minded people are smart."

WHERE do you see in my comment a defense for being closed minded? I am not an extremist, there is a middle ground, you understand that right? How about carefully assessing information presented to you before "opening your mind" to it? Which ALL the great thinkers did. Alot of these people claiming to be "open minded" are actually just buckling to peer pressure from the current narrative of society. So you're accepting of all lifestyles.....oooooohhh so brave and stunning, so out of the box, so against the grain....except the sentiment is plastered on every corner of mainstream media so actually where you thought you were a revolutionary mind, you're actually just a lemming.

[phoenixwing]

@xabi
let me clarify,
1. the person made a snap judgement and obviously didn't read the article yet you zoomed to his defense because you're of a differing opinion. That's all that happened so don't act like you're being high minded.

2. You don't understand that peer pressure is from peers and more people than not are anti transgender not for it as the media paints it. so no we're not conforming to peer pressure.

3. You don't even know me. I voted republican even though i'm pro lgbt because I can't side with abortion. People are more than just party lines that have to follow the dogma of their democrat or republican party.

[XabiDaChosenOne]

"With such a high suicide rates among trans people its no wonder why he died so many times climbing up that mountain." LMFAOO🤣🤣

[ExBee]

If it isn't a main part of the story, I believe it isn't necessary to add. But I guess it's a little bit of extra fun towards the lore.

I call this the J.K Rowling additions

[NotanotherReboot]

As a diehard supporter of the LGBT I was able to identify her as trans just based on the cover art

[RpgSama]

Wut?!

[RgR]

There is absolutely nothing trans looking about her...wait..did you mispronoun her?

YOu could identify her as trans but used the wrong pronoun....hmmm

[Rebel_Scum]

hahaha nice one calling out the diehard.

And I mean that in a nice way, I'm not picking on NotanotherReboots beliefs. :)

[CrimsonWing69]

This is the world I live in.

[Gardenia]

And sad it is.

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

How could this story offend anyone enough to say "This is the world I live in"? haha. How could you be any more melodramatic about nothing?

[RgR]

Children are blocked from normal development. Operated on and told they are right to feel the way they do.
By the time their old enough they grow out of it but its too late to fix it. Then theyre on anti-depressants for the rest of thier life and will likely commit suicide.

I dont call that nothing...Parents are even forcing their kids through this because, either the like the attention or they've been brainwashed. Probably money is involved.

This is an age of pedophilia, and the torture, physical and mental, of little children. It's only going to get worse and silly crap like this promotes this outcome.

Horrible reality is that there is actual treatment for this that has been demonized. They can barely get help if they want to.

[CrimsonWing69]

Tip of the iceberg, my man.

[LincolnHawk]

What man you don't like how the world panders to 0.000000000001 of the population. Chromosomes don't lie, it's a mental issue.

[fitofficial]

Sigh.

[EmperorDalek]

Was there any dialogue in the game that confirmed this? I don't recall. Or is this just another Overwatch case where they make this up after they released it?

[Welshy]

They realised her "true identity" 2 years after launch. It literally has no mention or has any bearing on the game.

[Princess_Pilfer]

This is wrong. If you'd played the DLC, and paid attention (it's over a year old BTW) there's a trans flag on her computer desk. (along with a rainbow flag) and you can see her pill bottles on her bedside table.
It is there.
You just didn't pick up on it. LGBT people did.
Big difference there.

You didn't even read the article, where the 'announcement' is them confirming a *pre existing* fan 'theory.' I wonder why they would have gotten that impresson it's not like there's anything in the game OH WAIT.

[Battlestar23]

Awesome glad more games include trans characters.

[gold_drake]

crazy in what world we live in atm huh.

[Sciurus_vulgaris]

How on earth does a creator suddenly realize the identity of a character they themselves created ?

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

A bit like when Darth Vader was retconned as being Luke's father (not in the original outline at all). Or that Leia just randomly became Luke's sister after being his love interest.

How could Lucas suddenly realize the identity of these famous characters that he created?!? This is outrageous! I'm offended and he has ruined my childhood all over again!

[Sciurus_vulgaris]

No, Lucas was the creator of Vader (who was not always known as Vader during concept). Vader, or better stated the concept character that became Vader changed during the conceptual stage of Star Wars, not after the film released. Plus, Vader means father in Dutch , the character once finalized for a New Hope was given a name-pun.

[SyntheticForm]

Lol.

Feels like a cheap ploy.

[mastershredder]

#1 It’s a flipping shitty 2D platform template engine game that a 12 year old could have slapped together.

#2 When the “creator” has a tiny tiny audience of 350 followers...why is this even news?

#3 Holy hell. In case you did no know this game, He’s the main character’s sexual orientation......for a 2d plat-former in its shitty amateur cartoony graphic form.

Deep. Real deep. Please stop awarding stupid and Chis Chan level crap.

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

You, or any 12 year old, would not be able to make Celeste. That's like saying that a 12 year old could have slapped together any famous 2D game. You just don't have a clue.

[mastershredder]

“ You just don't have a clue” Pure gold, you almost made sense.

The game is not famous (maybe to the small group of fans) and yes unless you are a drunk or a butt hurt tween OR have no fing clue what you are talking about, it is clearly and factually composed of everything cheep, easy and free. Why do I say a 12 year old can do it? because we literally train kids how to code, make games with different engines both 2d and 3d. Yeah, I have seen kids make better strides than this, and this is pathetic, particularly the tag-on announcement.

[PhantomTommy]

The game is pretty much universally praised as one of the best 2D platformers ever made. In my opinion, it's in the top 5 for sure. It's got one of the most complex movesets of any 2D platformer I've ever played so no, a 12 year old wouldn't be able to "slap it together". I don't believe this update on Madeline's gender was necessary -- pretty sure a lot of people already found the character relatable regardless of their gender, but the game is still brilliant and you're still a moron.

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

"Yeah, I have seen kids make better strides than this, and this is pathetic" You are a pathetic liar.

I'm a programmer and I know that you truly don't know what you're talking about here. A team of game dev college students in their final years (certainly more experienced than 12 years old but not full-time employees) would struggle to make Celeste (fully polished, good collision detection, satisfying physics, animations, well designed, complete, bug tested, good artwork) on any sort of deadline, and it would require skillsets outside of programming itself like game design, sound, music, and art.

How do you think a 12 year old could achieve this? It's like saying a 12 year old could easily just make a complete, fully-featured 2D Mario game. You're a fool and you're proud of it.

[jznrpg]

It’s actually a good game but I don’t need to know the sexual identity of characters if it isn’t part of the story. I do feel like the dev is trying to get more publicity out of this and made the DLC for press/recognition/money but if it doesn’t bother the people they are using for pub/$ etc then whatever.

[Batnut00]

Awww that’s lovely.

[Chaos_Order]

Pure virtue signalling.

The game has been out for, how long? Almost 3 years? And the creator didn't think to bring this up until long after fans came up with this theory?

This is not progressive. This is a pathetic attempt to score brownie points. If Madeline was always trans, it should've been known since the game's release.

[LucasRuinedChildhood]

The creator is transgender. This is not a "pathetic attempt to score brownie points" and there's no need to get so offended. The creator doesn't even have many Twitter followers and could just be making changes to the character while developing a sequel.

[IanTH]

So here's the deal. If they brought it up in the game, people would have said "keep this out of the game! It doesn't have any baring on the story & it's just SJW crap". They may have always meant that to be the case, but left it out because of...well, look at this trainwreck of a comment section. It's a confirmation of something well after the fact, that you can choose to ignore and changes nothing. I cannot fathom how this bothers people so much. It's truly disheartening.

[DaveZero]

TV shows, films, games who cares about gender so long as the characters are good.

[MWH]

Characters in Movies/Shows and Video Games are received in different ways basically, one medium is more interactive than the other therefore many would care about the kind of interaction they have with these characters.

[Rocosaurus]

Well, it is his game. If he says the character is transgender then so be it.

[isarai]

If your going to make a LGBTQ character, MAKE ONE!, dont retcon your character into one after the fact, it's stupid and just makes you look desperate for clout.

[cerpintaxt44]

makes sense a woman could never have climbed that mountain \s

who cares?

[Docknoss]

Get woke go broke

[whitbyfox]

Vader wasn’t Luke’s father in the original, it was only in the sequel that George decided it.

It’s all fictional.

[MeteorPanda]

this guy has a weird fanbase. like they go mental every time its played at speedrunner charities

[Oywee]

Coming up next: Creator claims Celeste loves jazz-music, baking cupcakes and is a devoted rightwing republican too! LOL