Tokipost.com on Sony Trophies: How They Can Trump Gamerscore

By now most everyone is aware that the hit PS3 game Uncharted has recieved the trophy treatment adding over 40 trophies for collectors (It even came early!). Several upcoming games games have been confirmed to have trophies while a few old ones are also going to recieve patches to support the system as well. While Sony believes that "Gamer Level" in trophies is enough to sway the crowd, some believe the system needs something more to really give it that "umph" over Live's established and more wide spread gamerscore system.

[Silogon]

The thing I noticed with Uncharted was, and I hope this doesn't carry over to new games that I haven't beat yet, the urge to not so much experience the game as I did the trophy. I ran through Uncharted in under 5 hours and got every trophy but 3 and then went back and got those within an hour on level 4.

Keep in mind I've been uncharted over 13 times now, but still... It seemed like I wanted to speed through and get the trophies and not really experience the game fully again. Great game, but the trophy support for it was lacking since I had already done everything it had asked multiple times over.

As for new games that support the feature I wish it wouldn't activate the trophies until after you've beat the game 1 time all the way through. That would be an incentive to play it again, if you ask me.

As for what we can get out of trophy support, well I'd love it if Sony was going to issue something in way of a reward for our troubles cause right now it really is just to collect them and the sad thing about it is... I might have more than the next guy cause I buy more games than the average guy and it's a bit unfair in that respect cause not everyone can buy/rent these games to obtain these trophies.

Just my two cents.

[CViper]

"The thing I noticed with Uncharted was, and I hope this doesn't carry over to new games that I haven't beat yet, the urge to not so much experience the game as I did the trophy."

Wouldn't it be theoretically impossible for that feeling to carry on in a game that you haven't beat yet? If you've beaten Uncharted 13 times already?

And your logic isn't a Sony specific issue. Its any game with achievements or trophies or medals. If you beat the game several times, how are you NOT going to know whats going to happen, where things will be etc?

I agree with you on 1 thing, you shouldn't gain access to trophies until you beat the game once, But i'd have to think most non "hardcore" gamers, which make up the minority of gamers, would more than likely ignore trophies/achievements and beat the game. Trophy/Achievement whores are always going to just blow through the game to make sure they have a higher score than their buddy.

So are you a trophy whore? Or someone that wants to enjoy a game for what it is?

[The Wood]

i agree with both of ya

hi clone morganhell (Below)... remember it starts off like fun and ends up like single white female

[DavidMacDougall]

Yeah i would have never done "Uncharted" on crushing if there weren't trophies but it was fun after chapter 8 its was straight sailing

[red_ring_of_death]

yea right

[MazzingerZ]

Yeah, the attractive for me would be that they were really really secret...I never cared about achievements on the X360 in a way that I would interrupt playing just to go and collect some stuff to unlock a 10 points achievement...that for me is a turn off

What I liked was to play like nothing, never checked the achievements list, I just played as they didn't exist so it was really fun to hear that sound informing you about you just had unlocked an achievement...I accumulated 15,000 points so you can imagine how many games I played....some buddies bought Avatar, TMNT, etc just for the achievements, there's no way I would play those games not even if I got payed for that.

I see trophies in the same way, I don't care about them I just care about playing great games.

[proArchy]

After beating Uncharted so many times without the intention of clearing all the medals, it was really fun to kinda meticulously blow through it with specific intent. I went for all trophies in one play through, but realized I would come up short one anyways because I had to go through again on crushing. Even still, after the 10 or so times I beat it before the Trophy patch, they managed to get me to drop Eden and Battlefield:BC to play through it 2 more times just for a couple trophies. I say that's pretty impressive. I applaud any developer that has decided to patch their game, and boo/hiss most that have declined. To ignore this new feature is to shun new or reignited interest in your product, and that( unless you have an inferior product) is never a good idea.

[harv052]

@ CViper

"I agree with you on 1 thing, you shouldn't gain access to trophies until you beat the game once, But I'd have to think most non "hardcore" gamers, which make up the minority of gamers...."

I will have to disagree 29.62 million times with you...number of Wii sales worldwide as of 30th of June...Most of them are NOT hardcore gamers. As for PS3 and Xbox360 players, nothing shows every single one of them is a hardcore gamer. Most likely half and half...

Also, one of the biggest PS3 game this year, Little Big Planet, is definitely aimed at the "Casual" crowd. So they're definitely not a minority, they just don't make themselves heard as much as "hardcore" gamers...

[Kleptic]

I may go off the deep end with this...and this is more related to Uncharted (which seems to be the topic anyway) than trophies...but anyway...

this update created the first time since 2007 that I have even played Uncharted...I bought it when 'that store' broke the release date...and really enjoyed it...found the AI great...the graphics still unmatched in a lot of ways...and the presentation of the story still up there with the top 5 games of this gen so far...

but after beating it twice, that was kind of it...not through any fault of the game itself, it was just that I spent much more time playing CoD 4 and UT3 online from then on...

since the update I am about 2 hours in on it again on hard...and I think I like it more now than ever before...the trophy thing actually gave me a surprisingly addictive need to search the areas and find all the little treasures, of which I never cared at all about...and the skill trophies giving incentive to try all the expert awards is a lot of fun...

but aside from that...its the games pacing that I have found so relieving...I have around 100 hours into MGS4 and MGO and GTAIV...and while MGS4 is hardly similar to Uncharted...there was one thing that always drove me crazy about both...I can't stand how slow snake is to pop around a wall or from cover...and the exact same problem exists with combat in GTAIV (to an even more annoying degree, let alone the ridiculously stupid lock on function)...Uncharted seems to have some how perfected that...the speed with which drake runs is perfect and balanced...the intensity is crazy...and the blind fire/pop out mechanic is nearly flawless...I know some will say 'well gears already did that'...not imo...Gears is a tps, yes...but but doesn't have a free floating camera...Gears plays much more like a slow paced fps in the sense of aiming and camera control...the cover mechanic also works well...but it never feels like a true third person action game...that is not a dig at Gears...i am just saying the two games play very very differently...MGS4 and GTAIV both play much like Uncharted in the mechanics...but Uncharted trumps both without question in terms of combat...

Uncharted is a truely great action game that, because of its near flawless cover system and insane enemy AI, can be completely different each time you play it...I am having every bit as much fun playing through it again as I did playing through MGS4 multiple times...I wouldn't say its an equal game to MGS4, because on the visual and presentation side, MGS4 most likely won't be matched for a long time (although the water is still better in Uncharted)...

if Uncharted 2 has an online multiplayer that is paced like the single player game...and that MGO has shown that a free camera TPS more than works in the online sense with the PS3...it could turn out to be one of the best games of this generation, fitting nicely along side the other huge successes...

[morganhell]

Achievements FTW!!!!

[Eiffel]

Just like Sony they Copy.

[Bangadoshish]

Just like Microsoft they're now playing catch up ;)

[Surfman]

its not copy, fans wanted them.

[ShinMaster]

Achievements are only numbers added to your "score".

Trophies are about different ranking goals, Bronze, Silver, Gold, and the PS3 exclusive "Platinum".

Your gamer-level increases faster as you obtain more trophies of higher ranking as they are of higher difficulty.

Trophies have an RPG-like system.

While Achievements use the most basic of number scoring systems.

[dazzalfc]

Both sets are good, as they help give a game an extra few hours, and anything to increase the amount of time you play a good game is always worth it.

I prefer the trophy structure, but in truth they arent much more than a virtual penis, when it comes down to it. Great at extending the life of a game, yes, but thats about it really.

What they should do with trophies, and achievements, is allow you to unlock hidden stuff in other games, or in the PS3's case, Playstation Home. I believe this feature does exist in a few games on the market, but it would be nice if more developers started doing this too.

[dazzalfc]

If your gonna disagree, at least be a man and explain why. I can see why this site gets frustrating for alot of people

[MazzingerZ]

Yeah, true. what I liked of games like LIAR, HeavenlySword, Uncharted, etc is that you unlocked "make of" videos, manga chapters, art galleries, etc, etc...stuff that usually you only get in an collector's edition was there included in these games (BR magic) so I found more value in that than in any achievements/trophies out there

Actually the ONLY game that has implemented "achievements" in a interesting way is not on the X360 nor on the PS3 but on the Wii

Metroid 3's achievements allowed you to "buy" stuff in the game so you chose what to unlock, MP3 tracks, galleries, etc...you could even send a VOUCHER to your friends if you unlocked certain "achievements" called Friend points....with that voucher(points) your friend could unlock stuff even before beating the game

Nintendo got it right!

[InMyOpinion]

They need to actually get them into the games before they start comparing to achievements.

[CViper]

And its up to developers to add them to their old games. Did you not notice that Uncharted has trophies? So now the comparisson can be made between what both achievements and trophies offer?

[InMyOpinion]

Uncharted and SSHD. That's only two titles. The trophy update was released some time ago and by now they should have had support for more games. As it looks right now I don't think many developers will bother with trophy support.

Sony tried to copy Microsoft but couldn't implement the feature as well.

Achievements are a universal feature in games, trophies aren't. You could easily collect all trophies in a days work if you'd want to. IMO they are not comparable.

[VampHuntD]

PJ Eden, Monsters is confirmed to have them soon as is Warhawk, Not to mention upcoming PS3 games such as Bioshock also have them coming. Your point is true, gamerscore and achievements are more wide spread, but they still mean nothing. Trophies could change that, but the question is will they?

[InMyOpinion]

I think most of us expected them to be supported in the majority of the PS3 games library when they were announced, not a few selected titles.

I don't go by what's been confirmed, I go by what's actually there.

If they keep adding them at this pace nothing will change and they will ultimately become a failure. When 80% of the PS3 titles support trophies we can start comparing.

[CViper]

The only aspect thats not comparable, is the amount of games that support trophies.

If you read the article, which it doesn't even seem that you did... Its about the differences between the two, not the # of games that support either. To which the game system that was out with a full year head start, would have more of. Isn't that obvious? What you can readily compare now, since there are games that support them, which I doubt you even knew about since you only named the ones discussed on n4g... Is the leveling vs the a general score.

Heres a better question. How can you NOT compare trophies and achievements as far as the way they are setup right now? By simply trying to squirm out of your nonsense by saying "Buh buh there should be more games out with it now." Is utter BS. They have been out for maybe a month, Your first comment suggested there are no games with trophies to even compare in the first place. There are, and since they are here all at once instead of spread out over a wide amount of time. People are actively going out and getting them right now with all of the games you and others have mentioned.

You make a stupid comment about there being no trophies, then after you get confronted on that.. you change it to "Well.. there should be MORE!" and that has absolutely nothing to do with the article. Since its making the comparison, which everyone else seems to be able to do except you. How you cant see the basic features of GS vs Trophies being comparable is beyond me. Because you literally just have 2 lists of features. Its quite easy to compare the two.

Your logic about catching up to XBL is flawed as well. I guess there has never been a time in gaming history to where a more recently released console has ever out grown a console with a timeline edge? lol. I'm convinced you do believe that. You are probably part of the same camp that keeps reducing their formula for the ps3 to catch up to the 360. Remember when it was 10 million? lol. "At this exact rate..." yeah. Unfortunately its not at an exact rate, its at an accelerating rate.

I think your contributions would make more sense if you didn't try to sound like you aren't a troll all the time, and just come out and say what you meant to say, and what you said in your second response. Just say the typical, Sony sucks, they failed, they copy microsoft etc. You can't pull it off the other way, when you cant even put a decent response together. Then we could just openly ignore you, and tell you to take it to the fanboy section over that-a-way. ===>

[SlyGuy]

need to FIX the trophy system to work properly.

It is a bit buggy in Uncharted for very few people (my unfortunate self included).

For some reason I did not get my trophy (but got the medals) for my 40th treasure and 60th treasure. I had to load an older save file and do it over. This also happened when I beat the game the 1st time.

Maybe they will patch it soon (I hope).

[Kleptic]

Viper good post...

there is no arguing that the trophy system seems a lot more robust in what exactly it offers, if this home stuff ends up being true...and also seems to be far more logical (you level up...rather than getting some arbitrary number that is absolutely meaningless at a glance 1000 points per game?...whatever)...

but because its a brand new service and isn't in every game yet...its not worth discussing?...I don't understand this place sometimes...

also...yeah...I have seen some of the bugs with it too I think...for some reason your score card or whatever will not update until you physically go into your trophy collection and click on them (look at them or whatever you want to call it)...they then seem to go to your score card, even though they were already unlocked...SSHD didn't seem to do this, but I definitely have that problem with Uncharted now...after you look at them, it seems to stay updated...but you have to do that each time something is unlocked in order for others to see them on your card I think...

thats a minor problem though...the 2.42 update made the service much faster, which was easily my biggest problem at first...I wasn't going to sit there for 30 seconds to see others scores very often...

[SlyGuy]

I understand that some people THINK it is not working properly until they synchronize with their profile.

However the problem I am referring to is a bit different and is in fact a bug. I have read about some other people experiencing the same, but very few.

Anyways, I know that these things will be ironed out and soon the trophy system will be excellent.

[Omegasyde]

At 11 I unlock Duke Nukem Forever Beta with MC Hammer Ps3 Theme.

Accomplishments/trophies don't mean jack, Microsoft/Sony needs to reward players for trophies/achievements i.e. clothing for avatars/ furniture or hell get a gamer level of 25 or 1 billion achievement points and you get a free XBL/PSN game.

I know I didn't make up the idea, but damn Software would swing away to Sony/ Microsoft whomever gets the idea first.

[zo6_lover27]

Thats what sony plans to do with Trophies, you can use them to buy stuff in HOME as well as the PS store.

[VampHuntD]

That's exactly the point, right now it means nothing, but if Sony is wise they can implement a rewadr for getting a higher level.

[Kleptic]

I find it humerous how many people make it blatantly obvious that they never read the article in which they feel the need to post in...

[Cajun Chicken]

In my opinion the idea of Achievements and Trophies are sort of underused...
My logic being I don't really like Achievements or trophies for 'completing sections of a game' or 'learned something' the best use of achievements or trophies so far has to be Dead Rising where an achievement is something worth pointing out, such as photographs, combos etc.
Achievement and Trophies should be like Ratchet and Clanks Skill Points scheme. In my opinion, it you don't deserve a medal if you just completed a game, it should be more about insane things to do, things to find, a bit like the Wheres Wally checklist at the back. There's just FAR too many points/trophies just for completing a section/level/chapter of a game or defeating a boss...Things like that are pretty much killing the way both these 'scores' work.

[Kleptic]

I kind of disagree...while I think it would be dumb to only have trophies for completing games...I do think there should be some awarded for exactly that...

that is what I like about how the 2 games awards are layed out so far...you get a trophy for simply completing a planet in SSHD, but you don't get all the trophies for that game by doing it...same for Uncharted...

but there will be people that simply beat a game and thats it...they should get at least a couple trophies for that...you can then sync your stats and see what games they have beaten and stuff...which imo is the only reason I find any of this stuff mildly fun...its just a little extra information you get from the people on your list that you will never meet...

[Viktor E]

I will have to congratulate Sir Kaz Hirai when I next see him,he successfully terminated a 2 year old Online System with a single Firmware Update in a single Day

[Eiffel]

Take that sony C0ck out of your mouth before you speak.

[Bangadoshish]

I remember thinking to myself "And there goes Xbox Live".

Now Microsoft can only boast about how many times a demo was downloaded :'(

[DavidMacDougall]

Bubbles for Viktor E very nicely put

[InMyOpinion]

Yeah trophies rock! All 2 games that incorporate them...

Hours of fun to be had, not days or weeks.

[RawPowah]

This isn't Pokemon ya trolling bastard : )

Edit:LOL you think you can stealth Edit your trolling XD

http://img378.imageshack.us...

[InMyOpinion]

I remember when you Sony fanboys went "Who needs achievements anyways? I play games because of the story not to collect silly points" etc. Now you are all praising trophies even though it's a gimped copy of achievements and it's only supported in 2 titles.

Talk about being a f#cking wh0re...

[RawPowah]

Who's the whore in here:The people praising Sony for getting their Reward system right,or the person who's trying to grab every ones attention by spitting cum out of his mouth?

[Bangadoshish]

The person spitting cum out of his mouth LMAO XD

[chrisnick]

umm........jenzo......one thing to say about what Raw just said...........OWNED.

[InMyOpinion]

If you call responding to my comment with nothing but childish remarks 'owning' I guess you are right. The truth hurts sometimes. Nobody likes to be gimped.

Trophy support in 2 titles + 'getting their Reward system right' = blinded by Sony cum.

You guys are practically bathing in jizz by now.

[InMyOpinion]

Yeah trophies rock! How long does it take to get all of them? 2-3 hours?

How long does it take? 5?

[Bangadoshish]

I'm a Ps3 fanboy but damn,you're trying so hard to be 'the enemy' that you're just looking pathetic at this point

[InMyOpinion]

I'm just having a bit of fun. I usually don't hang out in the mental ward of N4G like you guys.

It's funny that you see me as 'the enemy'. Just goes to show what a demented freak you are =)

[Bangadoshish]

No.

[Eiffel]

I love the fact Jenzo was able to stick it to you Sony Fanboys and you can't reply in a well or even decent manner, And you deny claims by going on a in a bit of a mental break down CAP's included. Face it you got pwned.

[AllroundGamer]

thx for the proof, i always knew there is something wrong with Jenzo, RawPowah bubble+ ; Jenzo bubble- .

[Sir_Ken_Kutaragi]

And soon we will be saying...the PS3 has successfully terminated the xBox 360!!! ;-D
A few more updates and it will be Perfect;) i.e even better than
'xBox-You got to PAY to stay a-LIVE'!!! ;-D

Saying that i find PS3 perfect now anyway for me!;)

[ThatCanadianGuy]

Well jenzo.I dont care for achivements,at all.
Woooo! i have 100,000 gamer points!! im the best no?
I'd rather just say im level 10.You know..that addictive RPG levling system that all gamers love?

2 games that have it? No,there's Uncharted,PixelJunkEden,SSHD and buzzquiz t.v in Europure.But you know that? i love the fact there's only a few games that support it.Makes trophies all that much more rare and hard to get,whereas you can play any game and get them.
doesnt that take the "YES i got it" feeling out of it when millions of other people already have it?

Im the one of the few on my list who has trophies! others dont know where to get it,it's a huge advatage to me.Besides..95% of all games coming out in the next few months and afterward will have them.

Not just "points" but four different trophies.And soon in 3D in HOME

[PoSTedUP]

i agree yo. but check this.... ur right that it makes it more fun cause they are rare and w/e but wait till home comes out cause that is the root of the PSN and that will bring everything together, and get this.... from what i understand trophies will be worth something! you will be able to trade them in or w/e for content and that right there is better than a gamer score that means nothing, if sony can do it better then count me in!

[InMyOpinion]

And if you don't own one of those two titles you can't enjoy trophies. A shame really. Achievements are for everyone.

What trophy level can you reach right now? Level 2.5?

Sony messed up and it will be evident when major developers opt to not add trophies. I heard rumors Fallout 3 won't have any. Hell, MGS 4 doesn't have any yet and that's the biggest title of the PS3. Goes to show the failure of it.

Sony is having a bukkake party and you are all invited to sit in the middle with your mouths wide open.

[PoSTedUP]

iight but trophys and achievements arent gunna sell systems are they.

trophys just came out so their arent gunna be that many and future games will gave them. so are you disappointed with achievements??? why dont you go rack up some gamer points so you can cash them in for nothing!!! (maybe a T-shirt that says MicroSoft on it) ; )

[BigKev45]

Well, at first they would need incorporate the trophies into their games. Now, that would be a good start, Sony.

[TheColbertinator]

You guys are sick.Get help

[lagunatom]

Can't we all just get along?

[JEDI WOLVERINE]

" That would encourage me to play a few more trophy games (even if they suck) to gain some freebies."

This is where the whole article falls down.

You play games for the fun and if you unlock something then cool, its a bonus.

Playing a game that 'sucks' just for achievement/trophy bonuses will be a chore and thats not what gaming is all about surely.........