Bayonetta 2′s “Over-Sexualization” Complaint: A Perfect Example of What’s Wrong with Modern Reviews

Yesterday the first reviews for the Wii U exclusive Bayonetta 2 were published, and most were extremely positive, with Platinum Games’ latest labor of love soaring with an extremely flattering 91 on Metacritic. Yet, among all the joy for a game that really makes Nintendo’s home console shine, also bringing something radically different from the usual Mario’s and Zelda’s, there was a discordant voice.

[DanielGearSolid]

That review was from the great minds that brought you the Mario Kart Pie Chart

[Abriael]

Had to google it. I lolled.

[Ezz2013]

i would not give this game 7.5/10 because “Over-Sexualization”

but i would duck points out of it because the uneven and very bad story and the framerate drops for very fast game (This is what the reviwers are saying not me)

why reviewers didn't ignore the bad story in MGSR/DmC/GOWA/Lord Of shadows 2 etc even though those games have great gameplay too and took points out of them because of the story
while this game is getting free pass?!

that's just my honest opinion
this just seemed odd to me nothing else

[Aery]

That guy (the polytroll's reviewer) is a selfish hipster with illusion of grandeur.

He is the lowest point of the gaming journalism and ... an idiot.

[herbs]

Very well written article.
Ezzz games need to be judged by there gameplay first and foremost and it is important to keep that the focus especially when story is not the focus of the game in the first place. This game is about tight controls and mechanics, over the top set pieces and action and it delivers on both these fronts. The wierd story is just there to piece it together. I have played the demo the game has no pacing issues with framerate its fast and smooth and there is no negative effect on the controls and that's why reviewers haven't made an issue out of it especially considering the majority of PS4 and Xone games run at 30fps.

[N4g_null]

@Ezz2013 because reviews where backwards those days and still are. Many gamers are not on the same page. Some want story, others want game play, while others still would rather have the best graphics and last but not least is others just enjoy the social aspect of it.

You have 4 very different gamers there and these reviews only try to cater to what they think the majority will like for hits good or bad.

Now what we are missing is away to tell what type of gamer a person is who is reviewing the title? The "is this person like me" test needs to apply. Does this gamer or reviewer agree with what I like? Yet we all fell for the core gamer label or the gamer or casual yet we never really associated our selves with genres anyone to describe our taste. This is how gaming use to organize it self until certain genres where simply killed off for possible pr reasons I won't get into.

Some sites change there position so much that every one ends up hating them.

At least at a pro ms or sony or nintendo site they will try there best to put up the good news. Go there first then checking out the bad might work better.

For example this is a dual shocker site.... they may not mean for their site to sound bias but that is a ps brand controller so it isn't a leap to believe they are going to have a negative slant on a subject which is true something is wrong with reviews. Yeah I believe they maybe missing the point. I understand why it won't change for various reasons yet because of those reasons I don't believe this site is qualified to talk about this subject.

[Ezz2013]

@scissor_runner

That's a pretty good post
very good points
and i agree with every thing you said

[ShinMaster]

@ scissor_runner

"I don't believe this site is qualified to talk about this subject."

Why not?

Just because their name is associated with a PS controller? Is someone not allowed to help or defend another because they're not part of the same [group]?
Dualshockers has been less biased than other supposedly neutral sites(e.g. Polygon) that cover multiple systems.
They're speaking positively of the game and defending Bayonetta 2. They've given positive ratings to Nintendo games like Mario Kart a 9.5.

[miyamoto]

The tried to murder Dragon's Crown down with these sexual sensational stuff too but it backfired on them only to find that their sensationalist tirades gave the game the unexpected exposure and this "niche" game went to sell more than one million copies.

How about that?
Hope the same goes for Bayonetta 2.

I love Hideki "RE2, Devil May Cry" Kamiya and the great talents at Platinum Games. MGR Revengeance was extreme crazy fun no western developer can match and they got even better with Bayonetta 2.
Kudos to Japanese developers!

[Fireseed]

Yeah! The thing that's wrong with modern opinions is they care too much about things that other people don't care about!

Listen people if you don't like what a reviewer is saying... find another reviewer. Find someone who gives a shit about the things you care about and ONLY the things you care about. Got a problem with how one critic talked about a game? Get the hell over it. If you find them un-credible... then you don't have to take their word for it. This idea that those who don't agree with us need to be silenced is immature and frankly disgusting behavior.

[Abriael]

Translation of the above: "critics should be immune from criticism."

Sorry mate. Doesn't work like that.

[Fireseed]

Not saying they're immune to criticism at all. Kinda hard for me to say "Listen people if you don't like what a reviewer is saying... find another reviewer." Without having people be critical of what the reviewer says... but this genreal says of X people are ruining gaming is immature. There's a difference between

"I don't like this person, I find their focus on sexualization to be tripe."

And

"People who listen to this person over sexualization are ruining gaming and will change the games I like."

One is criticism the other is sensationalized crap a la Fox News.

[Abriael]

You're doing quite a lot of personal interpretation right there.

There's a large difference between showing one of the negative trends of game reviews and "ruining gaming."

No one will "ruin gaming." That's beyond the combined power of all the pundits that have been given leave to write on a website.

[Visiblemarc]

Abriael, you nailed it.

Live by the sword, die by the sword.

[EdMcGlone]

Polygon is free to assign the review to whomever they want and that person can score that game however they want because it's their opinion. If you don't like how Polygon reviews games or disagree with their points, then you are free to disregard their review and/or don't visit their site anymore. There's nothing wrong with modern reviews.

[Bimkoblerutso]

In a way I agree with Fireseed. There are other places to get more objective information on a game. Reviews are purely subjective articles. Meaning, when you read a review, you are literally reading it for the opinion of that reviewer. It is a way to gain perspective.

What people continually misunderstand is that even reading a review that you wholeheartedly disagree with (which we have a prime example of from Polygon) doesn't necessarily make it invalid. The Polygon critic clearly does not like sexuality in his video games. If you know that you do not have a problem with it, then guess what? You have just gained perspective on the game. Eventually it would be nice if gamers could just start looking past the scores.

That being said, when you routinely get preachy, whiny reviews like these, people tend to not want to read them anymore. And it is our god-given right to do that if we want to. It's not about "silencing" anyone. They can talk all they want to. We just don't have to listen.

[gman_moose]

I agree that as consumers we are free to read, agree with, or disagree with, any review we please. If we don't like Polygon's reviews, we can simply avoid their site.

The developers on the other hand, have no recourse for unfair journalism. Like it or not, that magical number written at the bottom DOES mean something to them, because it will affect sales positively or negatively, even if only by a bit.

In that vein, it saddens me that Polygon still has enough traffic to stay in business. For a site that has been mired in controversy, ignorance, and elitism since they started up, it boggles my mind why so many gamers still go to their site. I didn't even give them the click for this article.

[Godmars290]

The problem with that, because of the way the review steams works online for game sites, site with negative views often gets more hits and more money. Meaning that in a reverse of common sense bad sites, sites who's opinions you don't agree with, have greater staying power.

[annoyedgamer]

You don't realize that these people are slowly taking over all aspects of entertainment. Before long if they say something is "sexist" "misogynist" racist" "homophobic" "transophobic" or whatever other ist or phobe they add to the list tomorrow it gets shut down. Ignoring it simply won't work anymore.

[Fireseed]

And thank you SO very much annoyedgamer for providing the very "sensationalized crap a la Fox News" that I was talking about. My sincerest thanks to you.

Anyway that reasoning you have behind those points... it's called fear. The fear that your games may FOREVER change by what you thought was a minority. It must be a really crappy feeling to think you're the minority now and games aren't made to include y... HEY! WAIT A MINUTE! That sounds familiar. Hmmmm

But as much fun as it is to mess around with proof that you don't like being on the receiving end of the same crap. Games are not changing, there will still be people out there making games with protagonists like Bayonetta, and Lara Croft, because that's just what they want to do. And that's perfectly fine, but the idea that games will become nothing but emotional quests like Gone Home and stuff is just baseless paranoia and fear. My advice... calm down.

[HighResHero]

@annoyed.
Prepare yourself for some tired ad hominem attacks.
Their methods are also tired. This is 2014 and their cover is blown. Now there is the predictable reaction where they try to destroy everyone trying to expose them(wouldn't want to lose any followers). In doing so they expose themselves further and then go back to hiding in the shadows, planning their next attack. The trick is to recognize them after they change form.

@Fireseed: You felt compelled to write quite a lot. What is it YOU are afraid of here?

[Godmars290]

@Fireseed:
games are in a process of changing. Have been since HD when many devs declared that as many types of games became "outdated". Now a gen later we're both looking at a reto craze and VR.

And through all that those with a SJW mindset have been inserting themselves into the industry. Already effecting how games are made. Dominating the indie market and review community especially.

[Dunban67]

Fireside- didn t the same guy and or website give GTA a 95 score which is a game that has people shooting prostitutes for fun? One of the many problems people have with reviews like the one we are discussing is the inconsistency and convenience with which these self appointed SKW s operate

The guy is full of it and most everyone knows it- he s just getting called out for blatant pandering for his own agenda at a well respected game/developers expense

[randomass171]

The great thing about Polygon being entitled to their opinions is that we are allowed to analyze and decide whether or not to ignore them for it. I never click on Polygon reviews because I already know what the writers on that site and their agenda stand for.

[That_Guy2u2]

yea! except, almost every channel/site has multiple reviewers, i would take to much time to only follow one reviewer and stalk him until i can find out his views on life. just like some reviewers on ign, i havent heard from them in months, should i not watch any review until he does another one? your not solving the problem. its hard to just "find a reviewer"

[Debaitable]

They got problems with this but some journalist don't have problems with taking sexual favors. They trippen.

[drgkngx]

Oh, good. Think pieces on a Bayonetta 2 review.

It's embarrassing how everyone is foaming at the mouth over this. Polygon has every right to give Bayonetta 2 a 7.5--which isn't even a terrible score to begin with. Reviews are opinions and if the review didn't like a certain aspect of a game, he or she has the right to dock off points. Just because other publications gave the game a highers score that doesn't mean Polygon is obliged to do the same.

Quite disappointed to see some try and make an agenda out of this. All because a reviewer didn't love Bayonetta 2 as much as everyone else. And I say this as someone's who loves Bayonetta.

[jambola]

i do't think anybody is saying they don't have a right to give it a certain score, it's easy to make a long post when you argue against something that was never even said.

Nobody is trying to make an agenda because he didn't like bayonetta 2 as much as everyone else, it's because of the reasons he's taking points away from it.

[spicelicka]

Although I haven't read the review, I don't think there's any problem with someone not liking the over-sexualization aspect of a game. If it's in my face and is affecting my enjoyment of the game, and yes over-sexualization can be bothersome after an extent, then I see it as a negative.

Nobody minds seeing nudity, but sometimes we can see right through it, it's a cheap way of getting your interest and if it's there to cover weaker aspects of the game then it can be criticized.

[InTheLab]

If this review came from anywhere but Gamespot, kotaku, or Polygon, I'd agree with you.

[Summons75]

From every review I've seen so far the reviewer throws in "Over Sexualization" simply to have it in there when there isn't any. The way the character moves and acts is part of her personality and the humor of the game. If we are throwing this in here and trashing this great game than we better start doing this with GTA who does over sexualize the women in that game or any other game that shows the slightest sexualization of males or females.

[lemoncake]

Problem is there are to many journalist who have come into game journalism as an easy way into the industry and don't care about games. They just look for those sensational stories that might help them up the ladder. There are also those sites that will post about anything to get a bit extra ad revenue so they go hand in hand.

[ToneDeezy]

This is ridiculous. An easy way? Do you even write? The pay is non-existent and the job is thankless. Get real.

[psvitamanfan]

"There are also those sites that will post about anything to get a bit extra ad revenue so they go hand in hand." - fits perfectly with this "article"

[ToneDeezy]

psvitaman, I agree with you. I thought the comment I was responding to was talking about Polygon.

[krouse93]

It's disgusting isn't it. It's also derogatory to women that actually look good too. Not many people realize it, but it's not over sexualization if a woman is naturally big breasted, or naturally good looking. A lot of the motivation for this "over sexualization" claim is like you say: to get page hits, but it's also driven by the fact that many of these so called journalists are pathetic little dweebs who couldn't get a good looking woman if she fell into their laps.

I mean has anyone actually watched a video by the polygon team, they're anemic, awkward little piss bags who's only hope at any notoriety in life is achieved by writing a "controversial" piece of news.

They often use the false defensive measure of feminism and women's rights, etc., whilst forgetting that many women that are naturally endowed with a nice body and nice large breasts, and that they do exist in reality.

The reason video games depict women with large breasts is the same that they depict men with large chests and big muscles, because it's aesthetically pleasing and often the ideal human form. A woman with large breasts indicates fertility and the ability to nurture a child, all this gamer gate nonsense, and feminism in games shit is getting to my head.

The journalism in this industry is out of control. I want to get back to the forums where we used to all just have fun, play games, check out press releases and watch game trailers.

[jambola]

i stopped reading after i realized you talk like a 16 year old douche, which i discovered 2 lines in

[krouse93]

@jamnola.

I can't capitalize my I's or spell properly, but that doesn't make me a douche. Are you a saline solution bag?

Oh right sorry I added an extra "that" after women in my third paragraph.

I also forgot to say "same reason", rather than just "same", in my fourth paragraph.

I'm sorry I offended you @jamnola, but that doesn't give you the right to slander me.

I'm a 21 year old University student with an opinion, not a 16 year old boy.

I hope you have a good day. I play games for their entertainment value, not for their political correctness.

Because like I said, I play games, not politics.

Oh and I'm comfortable around sex and sexual thematic elements, I don't only enjoy violence like these gamers gate journalists seem to, games need a little variety, otherwise they tend to dull.

[CorndogBurglar]

THis is really annoying me for some reason.

One character in a game, or one game in general, does NOT represent all women.

Thats like saying you saw a stripper in a strip club, so now you think all women are like that.

Lets not be stupid here....

[Spotie]

Oh it's FAR too late for not being stupid.

[Scatpants]

I actually add points for over sexualization

[Imalwaysright]

If this is the direction some reviewers and publications want to take so be it but now, I'm expecting them to go all the way. If they stop at over-sexualization, I'm going call them hypocrites. I'm fully expecting them to dock points from many games because they're too violent starting with GTA5 for PC/PS4/X1.

[arbitor365]

gotta love the cognitive dissonance of modern day feminists.

"you dont want to see women dress provocatively? you slut shaming misogynist!"

"you do want to see women dress provocatively? you woman objectifying misogynist!"

the only way for a male to win, in the game of feminism, is not to play

[JoelT]

This comment x 1000.

It really really sucks when you can't read a review that doesn't have the extra undertone (or message) being displayed. Why can't we just read about the damn game anymore.

[ShaunCameron]

Modern-day feminists? Feminists always acted this way. What more did you expect from a movement founded by a bunch of self-absorbed, elitist, over-privileged, snobby, stuck-up, sanctimonious, entitled and bored princesses with daddy issues?

[Rachel_Alucard]

I was shocked to see destructoid review senran kagura SV for the vita (a female reviewer I'll add) and l never once did she apply her personal beliefs into the review and she focused on the gameplay the entire time. She was very open minded about what audience the game was targeted at and never said "X should cater to these other people instead" and she gave the game a nice score despite all the easy feminist bait about it. I have to give destructoid a thumbs up for actually doing what they are supposed to do and just REVIEWING GAMES.

[j0ncap125]

>review by polygon

Welp, into the trash it goes.

[Amorist89]

Let's imagine Bayonetta had a couple well known flaws, for example a gripe with the mechanics and the odd glitches that impaired the gameplay,

Does anyone actually believe if Polygon took them into account that their review score would be effected? Pick any additional flaws besides my examples and consider whether Polygon would have given Bayonetta a 6//10 or around that figure as a consequence.

Now let's face the harsh reality that reviewers dock a ridiculous amount of points based on nothing more than a personal grievance or arguely a misinterpretation of the style/design.

If Polygon found a genuine reason to lower the gamescore it would have not have changed the outcome. Universally it's praised as a solid game, throwing 7.5 is controversial to harvest attention, but they could not state a lower number because that would appear far less credible.

So yes welcome to 2014 where reviewers get funny with female characters being presented in a flirtatious manner. A time where reviewers take their role way to seriously and try to make a massive issue out of design choices in the name of political correctness.

[OB1Biker]

If only there were more guys like Giuseppe on the internet maybe the gaming community wouldnt be like the constantly whining spoiled children they seem to be.
Gaming news should focus on whats exciting and entertaining for gamers.
Great article 'The problem is deeper and is starting to take deep roots in modern reviews. Authors are departing from the idea of giving their readers a fair assessment of a game’s quality, and are increasingly using reviews as their personal soapbox, or as a high horse on which to sit to educate the allegedly unschooled gaming masses on whatever personal agenda they happen to support, and to “punish” those game developer that happen to produce games that don’t fit said agendas.'

[Loadedklip]

A Polygon review is not being objective and controversial?

What a "dual" shocker!!!

[Djkmilo]

#WeWant#fatalFrame

[ipach]

I know there's lots of strong opinion about topics of sex/gender, so I'll try to be careful here. But the overarching theme of this article (not the polygon one) is a strange one to me. When did reviews that put a grade/score on a game ever become more than about an editor's editorial opinion? Why does it need to be anything but a critic's personal opinion?

If a food critic says he thought a restaurant's food was overseasoned, that's his/her opinion and one that is 'fair' to say. If a games critic says he thinks a game developer's artistic choice to portray a lead character in an overtly sexual way is unsavory, then that is 'fair' for the critic to say, just as it is fair to say that the gameplay is satisfying or that the level design is good. It is also fair for any of us to disagree.

I know many of us are wary of hidden agendas and what not, but I don't think the answer is to remove all personal subjectivity from the review pieces and scores that we all enjoy reading and commenting on. I always thought the whole POINT of reviews was about subjective and critical opinion. I wouldn't find them worth reading if all they did was relay objective information, to be honest.