Pre-owned increases cost of games, cannibalizes industry, says Dyack

Used games are a constant irritant for many in this industry - they're at best tolerated and at worst despised with a passion. Frontier Development's David Braben recently lashed out against the used games business, saying that it's effectively killed off single-player titles, and now Silicon Knights boss Denis Dyack has weighed in with his thoughts as well.

[Stinky_Fish]

hes a nobody

[morganfell]

He is another dev that doesn't understand that great games + replayability = best protection against used games. As usual, it's someone else's fault.

Hey Denis, crappy games create used games.

[Bathyj]

Good Point.

I keep all my games and I buy them new. I might play them again in years to come.

I wish I had kept all my SNES and PSOne games.

[BattleAxe]

Can somebody please tell me how Silicon knights is still in business?

[NYC_Gamer]

Now he's gonna blame the used market for the failure of his latest projects

[Bathyj]

I dont know why people buy pre owned anyway. At EB games they're only like 5 cheaper than a new one.

In some cases, if the game is older and has gone platinum for example, the used copy is more expensive than the new copy since the prices of new games drop all the time, yet they dont seem to keep used stock up to date.

[Brawler]

depends on how new the title is I usually buy off kijiji.ca or ebay.ca usually save $20-$30 buying used.

[kevnb]

but its gamestop/eb games thats the big problem. They are the number 1 place for games and they stock 75%-80% used. They also push used sales on people, since they are ripping us off big time.

[Kenshin_BATT0USAI]

I'd have to disagree about eb pushing used sales on people, often they try to sell me a new copy because it's only $5 more. When I went to buy FF13-2 for example they told me that I might as well get it new since it was still dirt cheap.

[vortis]

I used to get five used games for $25 in a bundle package at some places.

You have to shop around.

[Enigma_2099]

And what the hell makes you think that's the ONLY place to buy preowned? You're not looking hard enough. I wouldn't even buy a NEW game from EB games. F*** 'em.

Game developers need to realize that people buy games used if there's a significant price difference, or the only copies of a game you want are used. If a $5 difference is enough to get you to buy from EB Games/Gamestop, then you need an IQ check. Plenty of people buy new... as long as the game is worth it. But if you can score a used copy a bit cheaper, then why not? Because apparently someone didn't think it was worth the money they paid for it.

@Bathyj

Then I strongly suggest you look into it before making another misinformed comment like that again. Don't accuse me of being obnoxious just because I hurt your feelings by telling the truth.

... and I came over to the dark side because of the cookies.

[Bathyj]

Relax guy, hate leads to the dark side.

I dont buy used so thats why I haven't looked hard into it.

No need to be obnoxious about it.

EDIT.
I dont need to look into it. I buy my games new.
And I was simply commenting on the topic from my point of view. Sorry for not fact checking an opinion and exhausting all avenues of 2nd hand goods. My apologies if my misinformation deterred anyone from buying used.

And misinformed or not, you were still being pretty obnoxious, but I'm sure that was just a rare lapse in character and I wont hold it against you.

Enjoy your cookies.

[SnukaTheMan]

better then gamestops 5 dollars off newer games....

[thebudgetgamer]

Because I can have thirty bucks in my pocket + a little fore-thought I can walk home with three maybe four games(more if there is a buy two get one free sale)that I never got a chance to play.

There's no way I'm passing up Halo O.D.S.T. and Forza 3 for twenty bucks.

With that, If I'm only saving five bucks I will just buy new.

[Kaos_Vll]

that's a load of bull. stop with the $5 dollar difference already. Most used games are WAY cheaper than a measley 5 bucks.

[johnnyvegas]

lol, dyack is such a turd monkey trying to stay relevant in this world.

[Baka-akaB]

So after the govt it's used games ? I'm not fan of the used market and its profitereers (i'd find it more healthy and worthwhile among users themselves , but we they've created store credit addicts) , but i dont think i wanna hear from Dyack about it

[ChrisW]

I think a small percentage of used sales should go directly to the developers (skipping the publishers).

[vortis]

SwitchGames does this.

And I agree.

It saddens me how much publshers have their hand in a honey pot they didn't make.

[Godmars290]

The industry is how old with used games apart of it for about as long, yet the issues only come up within the past 5-6 years.

Taking into account DRM, DLC and the overall failing quality of games - sorry - but I don't feel much pity. To Dyack especially as he blames everyone else for the failures of his games.

[vortis]

Agreed.

You didn't hear Sega and Nintendo complaining about Funcoland during the 90s (that's GameStop to all you young'ns).

Devs these days are either polluted with publisher PR spiel or are trying to wedge a gap between themselves and gamers, which makes no sense to me whatsoever.

The industry is as big as ever and there are billions upon billions of dollars flowing into this ever increasing market, yet all we keep hearing about is how studios aren't making enough from used game sales.

[Bathyj]

In their defence, games cost 100 of times more to make than they used to, but thats not reflected in the cost for the gamer. They are virtually the same price as they were 2 decades ago. In fact they're even cheaper with so many deals going around.

But you're right, they are awfully whinny. They have DLC and incomplete games now to nickel and dime us to death. They need to accept people are always going to try and save money and its not really any of their business if we wish to buy 2nd hand.

I wonder when the next game crash will be.

[Godmars290]

Well, part of that was Sony lowering production costs with the move to CDs. Then they only increased costs with DVDs, and now again with HD - at a time when HD was just starting vs DVDs were more established. Things just happened too quickly.

As for the crash, I think its happening now. Devs like Dyack complaining about sales is only a symptom.

[gamer7804]

Oh really, then why are games priced lower than last generations?

[SnukaTheMan]

Someone needs to buy them new..what a moron....if games were cheaper people would purchase more new products.

[2pacalypsenow]

No they dont pre-owned has been around for years.. Only now devs are bitching and that's because of the crappy economy not pre owned sales

[sypher]

Just another guy who doesnt know much about economics.

Used games are a new thing? lol not at all, there has always been a used market. I even remember visiting my local games shop back in the SNES days and there being rows and rows of used SNES games. i'll admit there was no market leader back then i.e. a gamestop. But person to person transactions or independents filled whatever void was there. The used market has only grown with the gaming market. Obviously when gaming got bigger, so did the demand for used games.

But as has been said time and time again, the used market is directly connected to the new market. And the used market is also the only place which dictates the true value of a game. As we all know there are standard prices set for games (here in UK its either 39.99 34.99 or 29.99) this is a blanket pricing across the industry. Meaning value isnt set depending on the worth of the actual game. The same happens at cinema. The ticket price is the same whether the movie is crap or brilliant.

But when the used market kicks in, thats when you see the true value of the games. If the game is totally crap or they have printed too many copies for such a low demand then you will see that Used price plummet (usually within the first week) this in turn affects the New game price. Hence why you have a game like Fifa worth 95p in the bargain bin from 3 years ago but still have an obscure RPG title worth its new price. Supply and demand at work.

This is a basic law of economics, there is no getting around it other than 'gaming the system' i.e. making all products win even when they shouldnt. You see this in movies, when a company makes a really bad movie spending hundreds of millions on it then it tanks at box office. They blame it on pirating and try and legislate for more laws on cracking down on it. Rather than looking at successful films that make tons of profit regardless of 'pirates'. Its just someone to blame.

And the used market is the gaming industrys go to guy for blame. Publishers want their games to succeed regardless of quality. The market shows them otherwise, so they complain and blame everyone else. Nothing new here.

[KMCROC54]

I buy all my games new or hunt the internet for deals , will never buy an used game & will never trade my games away for Gamestop rigged value price scam.

[InTheLab]

Let's see..

Xmen Destiny was terrible.

Too Human was terrible.

MGS The Twin Snakes was watched over by Kojima, copied gameplay from MGS2 and the original MGS, and was essentially a graphical update...so it was decent.

Eternal Darkness was the last good game this dude made and he has the nerve to talk about cannibalizing the industry?