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PS3 Has “Tight memory, Poor IO Performance” – John Carmack

RAGE has been criticized on all platforms since its launch on October 4th, especially the PC version of id Software’s shooter. John Carmack, technical director of the game’s developer, has now said the studio can’t improve the PlayStation 3 ‘s performance much more, as well as saying the platform has ‘tight memory’ and poor ‘IO performance’.

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R4MBO2920d ago

Carmack needs to stop dissing the PS3, and just focus on his games.

raytraceme2920d ago

The ps3 is truly a challenge the "coding genius" has failed at. I thing he mad.

BattleAxe2920d ago

Thats why I like to call RAGE a "Carmack", or rather a "Car Wreck".

Elwenil2920d ago Show
Sunhammer2920d ago Show
VvKILLAGOOSEvV2920d ago

This is why I don't buy anything he says anymore, yet a good majority of you are still willing to think everything he touches is gold...

Last I checked, Rare was also once a top tier developer, and what are they doing these days?

raytraceme2920d ago

Oh god I remember when I read an article claiming that carmack got 60fps from an intergrated intel gpu. What hype and no substance. High end amd cards are having issues with framerate and no freakin advance graphics options. Guess what folks, this is the crysis 2 fiasco all over but in this case worse.

malol2920d ago

well he is right
PS3 do have “Tight memory, Poor IO Performance”
but what about PC ??
does that have “Tight memory, Poor IO Performance”
oh i got it its the "beta drivers" falut
o im sorry :)
now here is a song for you mr carmack
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

Godmars2902920d ago

Thing is Rage is a multiplatform title. Not Just PS3.

Then again, we're five years into one console cycle and talking about another. With rage being talked up around the beginning, there's no real point in complaining about developing now.

NukaCola2920d ago

RAGE will not take any awards this year, and I am sure Uncharted 3 will take quite a few. Maybe you should learn to PS3 and quite dissing it.

wicko2920d ago

Wow. Sounds like all you commenters are mad. People asked his opinion about the consoles and he answered. If you think the PS3 has no faults, then you know nothing about hardware.

evrfighter2920d ago

mad troll props to carmack.

xPhearR3dx2920d ago

RAGE looks better than Uncharted 3 and runs at 60FPS. I know you're in denial because you can't accept the fact that a multiplatform title looks better than your precious exclusive Uncharted, but get over it. It's not a big deal.

JBaby3432920d ago

Did I miss something? I admit I haven't followed Rage at all because it doesn't interest me but I thought it was supposedly phenomenal from the previews and comments that have come out. Did it get downgraded or something? I thought it was supposed to put all other games to shame running at 60fps and all. What happened?

hiredhelp2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

WOW just login to N4G see this caught my eye.
Well thats the final nail in the coffin Spend more time to study ps3 youll realise you can do good with it like many others.

Get your head out of ms A** Soz guys way i feel to think he had my respect and his company ID for long time.

Bad enough hes chosen to not work on his lead platform like he has done for years. its even worse you gota start talking trash AGAIN" to another big company.

JaredH2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Is everyone on this site a troll or something. He's not dissing the ps3 he just answered a question honestly. The ID tech 5 is made for next-gen consoles not current ones. It's not that he doesn't understand anything about the ps3. I'm pretty sure if he was given the Uncharted 3 engine he could put out a game just as good looking as Naughty Dog can.

The fact that he actually explains why the ps3 version is not perfect isn't like Gabe Newel at all who just said he didn't like the ps3 for no reason. He doesn't say he dislikes the ps3 at all actually he just gave technical reasons for why the game runs worse.

For the id tech 5 engine with megatextures, 60 fps, physics and ai that aren't from ps2 gen like half of you are saying the ps3 has a problem running it with the reasons he gave. It's not like it's an engine that was made for ps3 or even 360. It's for the 720 and ps4. None of you realize that though.

SilentNegotiator2920d ago

I can't believe people call him a "Coding genius".

There's nothing groundbreaking about RAGE. They gave the game muddy textures and no AA with plenty of pop-in, and thus were able to make it 60fps. TA-DA! More talented developers have done things more amazing than that. If everyone else used the same "technique", then most console games could probably be 60fps.

What impressive things has he done in the last DECADE? Pretty lighting in Doom 3? Whoop de doo. iD are has-beens.

da_2pacalypse2920d ago

meh I kind of agree... even Gabe is still not a big fan of PS3, the only reason he prefers it to the xbox is because of the fact that he has more freedom on the ps3.

Brosy2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Carmack knows more about the PS3 than any of you. So Carmack is no longer crediable because he isn't bowing down to you Sony worshipers. I'll tell you this Id take his words over any of yours. You guys need to grow up and stop acting like spoiled children. The PS3 isnt some magical machine that spouts rainbows and unicorns out of its ass because of its limitless power. If you want to be mad at somebody be mad at sony for building their processor around their house owned blu-ray format.

2v12920d ago

lolol that was funny

Objective2920d ago

Typical fanboy response. PS3 proven by THE technical expert to be the weakest link and suddenly he has no credibility! HA! Sorry but it is you guys who have no credibility to any rational observer! How many times have we seen this? The best looking games on consoles perform better on the 360 (Crysis and Rage etc) and everyone here vociferously and repeatedly DENIES it and DISSES the developers. And then they go back to their usual driveL about Uncharted or Killzone being better...

But the truth is NO your exclusives are NOT better! I have both consoles and agree that the production value of PS3 exclusives are good and have superior artistic style, BUT they are NOT technically better. Even if you disagree with this, at the very least they are NOT, as many of you like to claim, significantly better than other good games, be it multi platforms or 360 exclusives. It was said from the start of this gen that the architecture of the 360 is better suited for gaming and, no surprise, that is still proving to be true. Your relentless denial, false logic and siege mentality won't change that fact.

kramun2920d ago

Oh dear, it seems some of you have had your feelings hurt by Carmack talking about your dear little ps3. Oh diddums, grab a tissue and wipe away your tears.

I think he knows what he's talking about more than you lot. He was just answering a question, nothing more than that.

meetajhu2920d ago

Coding genius failed? You mean he didn't deliver 60fps and high quality graphics on PS3?

ApplEaglElephant2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

He previously said that PS3 MORE POWER, but it requires tons of work to get them because it is hard to code for. Also, cause it lacks development tools. and etc.

this is the same "TECHNICAL EXPERT".

Also, you shouldnt say Crysis 2 and technical at the same time. you just proven your self an obvious- rtard- troll.

Crysis 2 suffers from tons of technical issues. SUB HD, Frame rates, Pop ups. low poly counts and etc. go read it on DF or LOT. it looks good, but it is not "technically" better. no where close.LOT did a comparison on this. KZ3 and UC2 looks better than C2. I lol at your denial.

Also, i laugh at how you get off at tiniest difference between multiplat games. With 360 not having any exclusives, i guess fanboys need something to get excited about.

Also, Rage isnt the best looking game on console. it lacks too much polygon, lighting, and jaggfest on consoles.

JokesOnYou2920d ago

He's just stating his professional opinion it happens to be unfavorable for ps3 and now of course you kids want to slam him. lol, John Carmack, credentials include Respected dev/ genius coder, Father of the FPS, recently made Rage, which although had issues is still 1 of the best ever looking games on consoles, with very good gameplay.

So when it comes to creditability its not even close.....John Carmack>Infinite fanboys.

Sarcasm2920d ago

It's 5 year old hardware, and older if you consider the development of the actual system and he's complaining?

What the hell does he want? The PC version which is basically unlimited, cant even run properly on most people's rigs.

itsallgud2920d ago

It's amazing how the ps3 people on here think they know more about game development and hardware than the legendary John Carmack. Wow. Where is this place? Is it the ps3 twilight zone or something?

WrAiTh Sp3cTr32920d ago

Seems Carmack's wisdom has these birds' wings flustered. The guy has more tech know-how in his finger than all of you put together but the drones hive mentality wants all hands on deck--typing criticism about the good sir for stating facts. You all should save some of that venom for Doom 4, when that RAGE engine drops down to 30fps and crush every competitor out there and make you believe your money wasn't wasted on that plastic you worship, lol....

Ser2920d ago

@xPhearR3dx

You wish, guy. The textures in Rage are child's play when compared to Uncharted 3's.

The_Con-Sept2920d ago

What year is this? Oh yeah its 2011... for a half minute there I thought this was another lost Gabe Newell rant that somehow resurfaced on N4G....

If KillZone can show us realistic dynamic lighting then why can't rage?

I don't mean to insult the creator of First Person Shooters... But why is Carmack the only one complaining now? Looks like someone is 5 years to late to the PS3 hate party.

Space_cancer2920d ago

Sorry mates, kind of ot noob, but i just got PS3 and i´m thinking can i sign in two gamer profiles at the same time (like 360 style) and earn trophys for both while playing split?

After 5 years only with 360 and now shitfaced with "little" vodka snaps on while trying to learn PS3 OS is pretty hard lol, maybe I just need some more juice. But ty for the help anyway =:P

Drinks on me!

kaozgamer2920d ago

@Objective

"i own both consoles" yeah what a load of crap. pretty much every 360 fanboy says that. tell the truth, you have NEVER played killzone or uncharted.

MaxXAttaxX2920d ago

Why don't we just let our games do the talking?
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

Anyway, as I recall, he said the PS3 had MORE peak power/performance than 360. BUT it is harder to utilize.

Have any of you fanboys even seen RAGE on PS3?
Both versions are virtually identical. So I don't see why people are getting riled up when the 360 version is really no better:
http://www.lensoftruth.com/...

ProjectVulcan2920d ago

PS3 is a tricky old thing to master no question. What he says about the platform is also technically true. However, what most people seem to be annoyed about is that RAGE has not really lived up to the hype as a technical tour de force.

What is worse for him is that the PC version was bodged to start with. There is NO valid excuses to be had for the problems on PC, no moaning about technical limitations.

Unfortunately when he says his studio can't improve on the games performance that is really a comment on the lack of ambition, ingenuity and expertise on hand inside the developer surely?

Sounds like somebody else needs to go cap in hand to the first party sony studios to learn how to build games better for PS3.

Perjoss2920d ago

Carmack is not the first person (no pun intended) to complain about the PS3, when it comes to programming for games hardware he knows what he's talking about, he's also a rocket scientist in his spare time so I'm going to go ahead and trust his judgement.

PS3 is a great machine with some very nice exclusives, I just hope Sony learn from their experience and makes the next Playstation easier to develop for. After all, who cares which machine has the better multi platform games as long as they just keep making good games for us to play.

Sony3602920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

lose the positive connotation of the Ps3 being a pain in the ass to code for already. He isn't the only dev to touch on it either.

Saladfax2920d ago

Yet again, Gabe Newell, though not tactful, wasn't wrong about his criticism of the PS3 at the time.

Sony had a lousy first couple of years, and Newell pretty much said flat out that the architecture was needlessly obtuse and the development tools weren't all that great.

The PS3 was not the most worthwhile system to own back then. It's obviously improved, which was why Newell, who is very very good at the business side of things, didn't shy away from what amounted to a solid market for Portal 2.

Legion2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

@malol

Actually the problem with PCs is making the game work across multiple configurations... which is a nightmare compared to making for a console with a single configuration (for the most part).

You have to think of being able to work with Vista and 7, and sometimes XP and what about those that have Mac? You have to work with multiple drivers and issues with each in respect to what they can or can't put out.

I've had to revert back to old drivers for some games because new drivers give me a fault with a certain game.

How many chipsets and graphic cards do we have to deal with? It almost gets to the point where you have to have multiple games on each disk and then just choose which version works with your system. And no matter what you are always short handing one PC configuration over the other.

I remember the days were I had to have a specific graphics card just to play a game. Not to just play it well... but to actually play it. PCs have their advantages but their disadvantages are just as many when you deal with all of them together.

BlindGuardian2919d ago

maybe he should apply for an internship at Naughty Dog

strifeblade2919d ago

i thingzz you learn need to spellz properly.

dantesparda2919d ago (Edited 2919d ago )

He's is basically saying that the HDD is to slow to stream the textures to the RAM (hence the poor IO performance comment). And he is also saying that if he had more RAM he could have also have fixed the problem that way. Hence why he says that its got "tight RAM". If you's use a Solid State Drive it'll get rid of all, if not, almost all the texture pop-in/up. Sony and MS should also implement a defragmenter, as that might help situation out some

+ Show (39) more repliesLast reply 2919d ago
iamnsuperman2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Lately it has become more so. Every other multiplat out their seems not to have such a big problem. The PS3 has shortcomings like every other console but its no excuse. The best developers work within the boundaries. Rage was a disappointment. Blaming the console isn't going to hide this fact. What he should be saying we did bad and our next game we will improve not blaming the console. Carmack look at every other multiplat out there (note didn't say exclusive because they tend to be better as more work is done on one console). They do very well and you didn't do as well.

BrianC62342920d ago

There's no excuse for third party developers to not push the PS3. The PS3 is so powerful and the 360 ports are better than if they made the game for the 360 first. Or at least as good. I think the real problem is these people want to make the game for the PC/360. Stop with that.

StanLee2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Megatextures are a new technology which is admittedly limited by the fixed architecture of consoles. It's Id's multiplatform development strategy that has hampered the PC game's development. He's not making excuses, he's saying what the limitations are for the technology on the PS3 console. To say Rage is a disappointment is your opinion. Many frankly love and are enjoying the game so speak for yourself.

gamingdroid2920d ago

Except Rage is one of the, if not the best looking multi-platform game. It runs at 60fps and is capable of full 720p.

Not many multi-platform games can do that especially an open world esque one.

raytraceme2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

more like 5% 720p and 95% sub hd there is "dynamic resolution" for ya.

gamingdroid2920d ago

That depends on the platform you are on:

"The top shot is just a cut-scene showing your new buggy inside the Hagar settlement garage. It seems to be running at 640x720 on PS3 while Xbox 360 is in the region of 896x720. In the bottom shot, we're again seeing 640x720 on the PlayStation 3, while 360 renders the same scene at 1152x720."

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

... that said, there is still no other game I can think of that is multi-platform, runs 60fps and looks better than Rage.

Sarcasm2920d ago

Graphics or not, the gameplay is actually kinda boring.

Saladfax2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Well, as much as I can respect what id has brought to gaming in terms of the technical stuff...

I've never really been uber-thrilled by their gameplay or (especially) narrative.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 2920d ago
BrianC62342920d ago

I bet the people at Naughty Dog are cracking up over this nut. Does Carmack even do any programming anymore? I bet he does nothing but push paper now. The PS3 is a powerful system. Just stop making games on it like they make 360 games.

2920d ago
kikizoo2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

If they can read n4g jokes, is better than carmack : "RAGE looks better than Uncharted 3 "

LOL, how delusional are the poor xfanboyz.

facts :

ps3/Xbox = same amount of memory, but ps3 faster memory (rambus)
Ps3 = way better cpu
xbox = gpu has a little advantage (but when cell help ps3 gpu, no competition)
ps3 : bluray

JAZZZ new (delusional account said :
" I do feel the 360 could easily handle a game like uncharted as there is nothing special or realistic about it. The seris is great fun but its linear and cartoony. Its seems ps3 has problems with games that use highr physics and more realsitic and ope"

LOL, just buy a ps3, and stop spreading stupid lies, your imagination is ridiculous.

GearsOfWar2920d ago

@kikizoo

Hey, how about you grow up before ranting about something you can't comprehend? It's obvious you're a child, or a retarded adult.

palaeomerus2920d ago

I bet the people at Naughty Dog would hire Carmack in a heartbeat if they could get him, and I suspect they look down on you silly ignorant PS3 fanboy types and the obnoxious idiotic stuff you post with a sad sense of disgust and contempt. I bet they think Rage looks and runs amazing and are proud of Carmack for his role in it and looking forward to Doom 4.

Because unlike the typical N4G nerd herd Naughty Dog is not made up of angry, small minded, dishonest bitter, little idiots with an axe to grind, who have NO IDEA what they are spewing crap about 95% of the time (including now).

Naughty Dog like John Carmack are respectable, educated, highly skilled game devs with a record of excellence who know good stuff when they see it and respect it.

Naughty Dog have far more in common with a John Carmack than they do with the babbling chumps who muck up this aggregator site that mostly just posts bad lists and opinion pieces from kids with barely updated blogspot sites, who pretend to be game journalists, in a sad quest for occasional free review copies, trade show access, and swag from naive, uncaring, or distracted PR types.

BrianC62342920d ago

Grow up moron. Why in the world would Naughty Dog hire Carmack? He hasn't made a great game in years. Doom 3 was pretty bad. Rage is nothing special. He just isn't keeping up.

andibandit2919d ago

@BrianC6234

quote:

"The PS3 is a powerful system".

Right on brotha, my PS3 is a supacomutar it has 8 SPU's running at infinite LolloHertz, and a dynamic hardware that gets faster as time passes by.

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 2919d ago
shinrock2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

where was the diss at in what he said? help me here.because all i heard was a technical reason why he prefers working on the 360.

Vega752920d ago

there wasn't one. he basically answered a question someone tweeted and the article and fanboys spun it into him dissing the ps3. instead of the title saying "Carmack explain why he can't fix the ps3 version" you have this for hits and to anger the fanboys.

Thatguy-3102920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Mad because rage didn't get critically aclaimed like he wanted...can careless less when developers diss the ps3.. especially when you see the quality of the games that have come out of it

Ducky2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

... his game didn't get universal critical acclaim, so he's decided to diss one specific console?

Yea, that makes sense. >.>

His comments state two things, one of the issues is acknowledged by Sony themselves (i.e. the tight memory) the other, I don't really know much about.

JaredH2920d ago

No he just answered a fans question honestly...

Persistantthug2920d ago

Carmack in an interview, he even says he hopes the next PS4 doesn't have Cell Architecture.

As it turns out, Old dogs don't learn new tricks very well it seems.

http://www.pcper.com/review...

Saladfax2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Amazing.

As usual, an ignorant fanbrat takes one tiny quote from one tiny section of a very long interview, completely ignores any context, and uses it as some kind of completely stupid proof of something completely stupid.

The "Old Dogs/New Tricks" thing is especially funny when much of the article discusses much of recent and future trends in graphics development, like voxels and ray tracing.

Oh, and for you people still on the fence, here's the actual quote:

"I hope that they don’t try to push Cell architectures again because there are a lot of reasons why peak performance is great... and there are cases in Rage where a PS3, if you are in an instance level where you have a lot of main memory (so a lot of things are cached in RAM), the extra horsepower of the Cells will let them transcode it into graphics memory much faster than the 360 and faster than all but the most extreme PCs, but its a pain in the ass to take advantage of it that way. For the cases when we didn't have all that buffered in memory, it winds up being more problematic."

Gamer19822920d ago

Hmm I remember a certain Gabe Newell dissing the PS3 at one point and look how that turned out? Does anybody ever listen to these guys and actually say to themselves "hey that guys right i'll not bother releasing my game on that console now thanks mate!" or whatever?
I guess not..

mendicant2920d ago

Gabe only "apologized" because he was told to do so.

kikizoo2920d ago

No, because 2011 is not 2006, and only blind fanboyz can deny factual evidences (like best graphics on consoles : uc3, gow3, kz, etc)

pedo_across-the-road2920d ago (Edited 2920d ago )

Hey! John Carmack why dont you go say that to Tetsuya Nomura and Hideo Kojima face.

AO1JMM2920d ago

And what would those 2 "nerds" do if Carmack did that?

pedo_across-the-road2920d ago

L0L! Carmack is probably BIGGEST nerd out of the three you dimp.

Eiffel2920d ago

@pedo_across-the-road

You so mad bro. No need getting angry about what you don't understand.

pedo_across-the-road2920d ago

I'm sorry, but can you tell me what i don't understand.