Editorial: Should Microsoft's Kinect Be Delayed? (Gameplaybook)

Gameplaybook explains why a delay of Microsoft's motion controller wouldn't be a bad thing...even though it wouldn't do it in a million years.

[Wizziokid]

yes until they fix it's issues

[ingiomar]

if they can fix more issues by a delay then yes it should be delayed

[R2D2]

Yes.

I tried it out at MACY'S and it crashed.

[-Alpha]

I'd think MS would be smart enough not to rush a product out after RRoD.

Thing is, MS isn't directly trying to compete with the Move. Despite promises of including the hardcore the product has thus far been advertised exclusively for the casual/light user. They can release whenever they want to, but it'd benefit if they took their time. I'm not sure that they are trying to compete with Sony, but rather, they seem to want to try pushing their brand past the audience they already have. Thus the Times Square broadcast, appearing on talk shows, etc. It's a product I can see Oprah giving out.

Assuming that the products demoed are the latest models then it seems that MS has some kinks to work out.

[Lou-Cipher]

"I'd think MS would be smart enough not to rush a product out after RRoD."

I dont think Microsoft launched the 360 before it was ready because they were unaware that it was a broken console, they launched it before it was ready because they dont care about their consumers. They wanted to beat Sony, so they were willing to sacrifice the most important thing. Quality

If you have followed Microsoft since the 70's or 80's you will realize that they truly dont care if their product works right, they only care about the money it can pull in.

They wont delay Kinect, because they simply dont care if it works or not, they know that they can spend money advertising it, and still make money. Who needs it to work properly when they can still make money on it?

[kneon]

I don't think they can afford to delay, if they delay they miss the holiday sales season and without Kinect the PS3 will overtake the XBox pretty quickly. That just wouldn't look good for them, especially as the XBox had a 12-18 month launch lead in most territories.

[iPlayGamez]

im not really interested in kinect at all but i think they should wait for cost to go down and make it how NATAL was last year kinect has obvious issues, not to say natal wasnt laggy but wasnt natal more advance than kinect? i dont see why people want the simplified version.

[mrv321]

I would say it should be dropped but too much money has been wasted now. C'mon look how much time, money and resources Natal has used. You have Microsoft studios making games, R&D and countless millions while Microsoft could do with a first party or two.

[D4RkNIKON]

It's true, they could use some more first party studios. They should at least delay Kinect to get all of the quirks worked out before it releases because it is just getting a lot of bad press with all of these fail videos on youtube.

Just goto youtube.com and search "Playstation Move Fail" and see what comes up, then try "Kinect Fail"

[IRetrouk]

yes

[btk]

Would it help?
If they stay with the camera without wand / glove / controller it will most likely not matter if it is delayed.

[Omega4]

Why would they need to, the hardware is fine all they need to do is optimise the software and that can be done right up until launch and patched with an update.

You guys worry too much, if you think MS is willing to put out a product which is not ready after the whole RROD incident you are stupid. Just look at the quality of the 360S MS learnt and they know what they are doing.

[mrv321]

Oh so it's all softwere then... lucky then. It's what like 4 months until Natal launches right, it's been in developement for 2 years now, maybe more. Microsoft licensed some stuff from Gyration way back in '08 and BTW, Gyration does gesture based stuff.... um you know like the stuff Natal does. If you don't believe me check here

' http://www.1up.com/news/rum... while the rumour varies some of the details match up like Rare's heavy involvement. A $199 arcade system... kinda Deja Vu like.

'You guys worry too much, if you think MS is willing to put out a product which is not ready after the whole RROD incident you are stupid. '

Vista was broken at launch, and Zune suffered some pretty big problems.

So will you buy Natal then on Launch Omega4, since your so confident it will have no problems... and they'll fix the LAG.

[Bigpappy]

There are some minor qurks with Natal software, but there are some who want to make a mountain out of a mole hill. You can go to youtube and search Kinect Demo, not Kinect fail. You will find that most of the demo's and hands-on's worked very well.
Yes, I believe Omega has stated many times that he will be buying kinect. I have already ordered 2 and would be highly upset if M$ delays due to minor qurks. We are not alone by the way. If you go to any major retailer, who offer Kinect and Move for pre-order, you would notic that Kinect is by far ahead of the Move in pre-orders. The Move is perfect and ready for primtime, yet the faulty Kinect which needs to be delayed, which will be released 2 months later and is way overpriced, is kicking some serious Move butt. This is the reason for all the histeria. They are many that are hoping and praying for the day M$ falls from grace. It is not just here on N4G, the hate has been there for many years. You may get that wish one day. But, it wouldn't be because Kinect fails. That I can assure you.

I still use Vista. I am using it right now. It runs smooth and quickly with my dual core AMD processor, with 3Gig of RAM.

[acky1]

Why have you ordered not one, but two broken devices? Seems like you have more money than sense. I don't understand why you'd do that? If you're buying it for someone else let them buy it. Why not get one then see if it was worth the money then if you want, buy another. Sheesh. One for the xbox in the living room and one for the xbox in the bathroom? Seriously, i just don't understand?

I hate idiotic consumerism...it just breeds products of lower quality.

[Bigpappy]

You obviously have no children. I am fortunate enough to be able to afford to buy what the heck I want. You are acting like I am spending MY money on YOUR mother. I do not come to N4G looking for advice on how to spend my money or get your advice on what you or anyone else here think I should like. I am a grown man who walks and talks and does WTF I please. Now, as you were.

Dude I think the IPAD is a piece of useless junk. I think Iphone and the orinal PS3 were way over priced. The PS3 had software issue that made most of its early game run like clunkers and 30FPS. Yet you can not like in my history and see any comments from me calling people names and trying to black list those products. I know what I like but I am not stupid enough to think that everyone else has to have my point of view. I am even Man enough to say, if I had a PS3 I would buy the Move and give it a wirl with Socom or Kill Zone. I still don't think it has anything right now that would make casuals concider it over Kinect or the Wii.

[acky1]

Am I worth less than you because I dont have kids and don't have a full time job? Still seems I have more appreciation of money than you. Im sure you weren't born on this earth with wife and kids and a full time wage packet. You obviously worked hard for it so have the right to spend it on anything you want.

My comment seemed reasonable considering you wont fully know what the product is like until you've had it for a couple of months. Surely you can see the benefit of waiting 'till you buy another?

[Patrick]

lol.. its not the software thats the problem.. Its kinect... it just doesnt work yet, not like its supposed to. And I believe if people actually see how it works, they will not buy it. The problem here is that as MS has already proven, they will have ads that make it look like it works PERFECTLY.. When it doesnt.. and I hope people turn around and take it back the store when they see it doesnt. Its time we teach MS that we dont buy junk. Unfortunately some people will buy anything their fav company makes, no matter how shabby. As for me and mine, We buy the best.... and its called the MOVE.

[Hallmark Moment]

True.

I think this question comes from angry and paranoid PS3 campers. Nice homemade site/blog

Desperate...

It should be delayed because that comforts PS3 fanboys knowing Microsoft won't blow Sony out in sales and popular opinion before they can condition the tone and opinions of these products in the masses minds. PS3 fanboys trying to pin performance of the hardware and system software based on the launch game code of launch titles lol. Like claiming PS3 performance before launch based on its launch tile game code lol.

[Biggest]

Ps3 has buttons and movement controls. It's not so hard to imagine that games can be made to do what games do. It is very hard to imagine moving around in a 3D plane while performing intricate actions, which is a lot of what gaming is today, while using the Kinect. I am so very angry that the Kinect is what what we thought it was. I would have been happy if it was actually good.

[punisher99]

@Omega4: Yeah they eliminated the RROD and replaced it with the "RDOD" Red Dot Of Death. :) But anyway. I think they should delay it until they can come up with some Core games that uses Kinect and only Kinect. I dont see the point in using both Kinect and a controller. You might as well just use the controller.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

I don't see any reason why they should delay it. When I tried it, it worked really well. You just build an experience that is suitable to the hardware, not the other way around. Unfortunately, that is a luxury that doesn't exist in the real world.

If it is a success, more money will come in to continue research it until it gets better.

By the way, I had no issue with Vista like the myriad of complainers do. Vista's problem wasn't the OS, but the press!

Now I would like to hear what problems everyone is talking about with Kinect? The few corner cases and glitches it has every now and then? Mind you it is motion capture with no additional equipoment and no green screen for $150!

[Agent-86]

Sorry, but Vista was a joke and a complete processes hog. There are 50+ processes going on before you even get to installing programs. Oh, and installing and using programs was such a joy with all those annoying permissions that have to be given.

[jneul]

IF YOU USED XP BEFORE IT, YOU WOULD HAVE GONE BACK TO XP BECAUSE VISTA WAS REALLY BAD, OBVIOUSLY YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT SOFTWARE...

[moparful99]

Honestly, you think that microsoft can make a true motion capture device that utilizes nothing in the way of sensors on the body or reflective lights for $150 and have it displayed in real time in the game? Come on use some common sense. I'm not doubting that kinect can do motion cap but most of the "magic" microsoft wants you to buy into is gesture based gaming. Look at that hurddles game, if you watch closely you will notice that the character doesnt match the player. Its all pre-canned animations that are triggered by certain gestures by the player. Kinect in its current state is nothing but a hands free variation of the games we've all seen on the wii so far.. Thats it.

[Biggest]

Vista's problem was the press? Oh sweet Jesus! You really ARE in love with Microsoft.

[Patrick]

Huge Lag issues
Extremely casual game issues with very little interaction
NO precision whatsoever
High price for what it does
MULTIPLE issues with its ability to track which causes glitches.
Every game so far which requires forward or reverse movement.. is on rails (which isnt 3D)
No rumble feedback.
Nothing to actually hold in your hands which is in fact (despite what yall say) natural. (most every weapon or item in real life, has a handle)
Issues with MS trying to falsify how it works or in this case.. DOESNT.
Only works with 2 people.

Geez I could go on and on.. but I have to eat.

I wish it worked... but as is.. it doesnt and I have issues with that.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

@agent-86
The permission issue, which is designed to prevent people from spawning new processes without your knowledge is actually a pretty useful feature. The number of permission questions is few and far between and in fact is very quick to just click by.

@jneul
If you upgraded to XP back in 2001, it ran dog slow as well. Hardware had to catch up to the software, but people got used to XP for so many years the gap just seems bigger now. It really wasn't!

@moparful99

It is definitely not a high end mocap device. I mean do you expect one for $150? It certainly is able to capture your motion and do it well. Lag is noticeable, but not as bad as some would like to have everyone believe.

@biggest

I'm still currently on Vista even though Windows 7 is availble.

Can anyone actually cite what the problems are with Vista? Other than it runs slow (get a faster machine) and those annoying permission pop ups (not recommended, but you can disable those)?

Almost everything in Vista is an improvement over XP....

@patrick

"Huge Lag issues" -> Yes it is there, but not huge.

"Extremely casual game issues with very little interaction" -> nothing wrong with casual games, but I would hardly say it is "little" interaction. If anything it has huge amount of human interaction i.e. your whole body. Wii is little interaction with a waggle.

"NO precision whatsoever" -> yes, for some experiences it would not be suitable. For others, nobody can replicate what Kinect can!

"High price for what it does " -> I wish it was cheaper too, but nobody has given us a $150 mo-cap device that can track 2 people.

"MULTIPLE issues with its ability to track which causes glitches." -> High end mocap devices that cost 100k has issues as well, even when you use a green screens. In fact, often times they go in an manually change stuff afterwards. This isn't possible with Kinect for obvious reason, but tells you how advance this stuff is.

"Every game so far which requires forward or reverse movement.. is on rails (which isnt 3D) No rumble feedback. " -> see above, but yes it is not suitable for all types of games.

That is like complaining about how the original NES controller doesn't have 2 analog sticks to help you move around in 3D when it was conceived. Give it time and people will figure out what to do with this device.

"No rumble feedback.
Nothing to actually hold in your hands which is in fact (despite what yall say) natural. (most every weapon or item in real life, has a handle) " -> No, it is controller FREE gaming. That is not an issue, but the advantage. However, if you must I'm sure somebody will release a vest you can wear that rumbles or give you vibrations when you get shot!

"Issues with MS trying to falsify how it works or in this case.. DOESNT." -> You can try it yourself all over the US. Nobody is hiding anything. I can't say the same about the competition except for the Wii.

"Only works with 2 people." -> That is better than one, and most games don't have four people on screen at the same time. That said, it is capable of tracking up to six people at once with 2 active players.

The only real issue is lag, which hopefully is being reduced, but even then it doesn't detract from casual friendly games being fun. For hardcore games, there are tracking modes that doesn't use as much processing power.

[btk]

Omega Omega Omega...
Try and work for a massive corporation. You will realize that the momentum inside a corporate and all the politics make them do crazy things. Like forcing a product out when it is not ready - because the pressure is on and the thing must hit the market - and going to the big man's office and telling him that you are not ready to meet your arch enemy armed with nothing more than a malfunctioning water pistol just does not impress them. They will throw money at it - and if the corporation believes they are invincible - then so much more the pressure. Logic tells any one in tech that Kinect is ill-advised. Corporate pressure means that a year after this fiasco people will look back and wonder just how the hell did MS think they could fool everyone with this joke. Because this one is going to tank big time.

The hardware is cool - but not suitable for the market they want to take on. And it a wee bit - well OK - it is damn well so far overpriced that it is going to be a hard sell to begin with. Oh a million or so people will be fooled into buying it - but the backlash from this is going to take MS out of this gen.

[N2G]

it should be CANCELLED.

they should go back to the drawing board & come up with something useful for hardcore & casual gamers.

[TheColbertinator]

Here is what Microsoft should do

Purchase Epic(Gears,Shadow Complex)
Purchase Remedy(Alan Wake)
Purchase Mistwalker(Lost Odyssey)
Purchase Obsidian (KOTOR 2,Fallout New Vegas)

Return these franchises

Crimson Skies
Age of Empires
black and white
Conker
Killer Instinct

All much better paths to explore instead of promoting Kinect

[MajestieBeast]

You want them to purchase those studio's just so they can close em when they release another failed phone or zune.

[PandemicPrawn0]

Epic might be a bit too big for Microsoft to just snatch up.

But the other three studios you have mentioned would be absolutely perfect for Microsoft's first party.

Obsidian is a good developer they just need better support and a firm hand to guide them.

[Bigpappy]

Core gamers have one of the best controllers ever made and Xboxlive. What M$ needed to do to expand, was to get casuals to buy 360. Kinect is the solution to that problem. If you are unhappy with what M$ is doing, all you need to do is get a PS3. That way you would not have to worry about casuals get some attention that you need so desperatly.

When M$ has good implementation of Kinect that it believes will work well with core games, or when devolopers have the time and ideas for building great game from the ground up to use Kinect, I am sure they will put them out there to pull that cash out of your pockets. Until then, use a controller or buy a PS3 with Move. Simple decission making here folks. You make this seem so complicated.

[moparful99]

OPINION. The 360 is not "the #1 console for core gamers" that is just your opinion.. Fact of the matter is that both the 360 and ps3 are serious contenders for the core gamers dollars. However the ps3 has far more casual offerings then the 360 and kinect is microsofts attempt at expanding their casual offerings. But they also know that if the core dont adopt kinect and accept it as a part of the 360 experience then it will fail...

[btk]

@N2G
Yep - you hit the nail on the head there. They should look for something different. Kinect is a fun R&D project - it is not going to make it in the consumer market. It is overpriced - and it is going to suck for gaming. It might compare very well with the PS Eye - but it is going to compete with the Wiimote and Move. It is just not suited to take those two on. And compared with the PS Eye - it is just too damn expensive.

[xavier-tooth]

microsoft is in so much hurt right now. it would be lessen if they just scrap it totally and rethink harder about their next plans.

[kazman]

how do you know this?? all knowing one ?? please do tell us??

[ChronoJoe]

No. They made there decisions on the devices hardware, the only means they're going to fixs problems like lag and detection problems would be to use different hardware.

(for example, fix the lag with a processing unit in the device, rather than relying on the 360) however. This has always been an option, but they've opted to cut costs over performance (a decision I agree with considering the device is already at £150).

So I don't see how holding it back could help. Maybe tweak the hardware (fixing the lag, and getting it closer to 1:1) then sell at a loss rather than profit... as most consoles do on launch.

[Roper316]

MS doesn't care about releasing a quality product or waiting till a product is ready to be released, just look at the 1st few years of the 360 due to rushing it to market. The better question is are people dumb enough to be bitten twice by the same company under the same circumstances.

[jack_burt0n]

You bet they are ;) they will line up for something they dont really want, need or end up using very much and functions nothing like the smoke and mirror displays that were natal and they will take it again and again and again.

I never mention the hardware difficulties the 360 has had but what it has created is a breed of gamer that will go through 7+ failed consoles and still be loyal it is quite a MS achievement.

[ActionBastard]

They will not delay. There are people that would be shit in a box if it said Microsoft on it (Sony and Nintendo too for that matter) and they know it. With as many FW updates, game patches and everything else Internet connected consoles has proved to us, if anything, they'll patch it.

[jneul]

We all know the next version of kinect is in the works, MS already know that the current version is a fail, yet still want to release it, what does that tell you all, MS wants a smash and grab, and you are giving it to them all to easy!!

[kazman]

yeah. glad you cleared that up!! N4G is the hub of the universe with the smartest fanboys around!! LOL

[tiamat5]

Rule 1: never agree with Omega about anything. He babbles on about nothing sensible. Also we are are only giving our opinion Kinect defenders. If you want to go through another 2-3 years of broken hardware with Microsoft constantly saying 'we'll fix it, we'll fix it' I have no qualms about it. But be assured that I will still be playing with my solid 10 year tempered Move Wand long after the first Kinect recall or mass repair drive by Microsoft.