Are Bethesda Games Too Buggy?

The Canada Examiner writes: Bethesda among all the developers producing games for consoles also holds the reputation for consistently releasing the buggiest, glitchiest games. No one will argue that Bethesda games aren't top class entertainment experiences... when they work. But the question then becomes, should gamers forgive the increasing malfunction of Bethesda games because of the fun they offer, or will there come a day when Bethesda has leaned on the good will of forgiving gamers for too long and have crossed a line?

[TheHater]

But most reviewers and the media in general give them a free pass every fricken time. I have never played a game with as much problems as Fallout 3 ever. That game was unplayable at times because it freezes every 5 minutes. No reviewer seem to mention this in their reviews and Bethesda has done nothing to fix these problems.

[Mr_Bun]

Fallout 3, you mean FreezeFrame 3.

A bunch of us thought our consoles were on their way out, until we realized that it was happening to all of us...and on different consoles.

[gamesR4fun]

still i got thru oblivion so the bugs were annoying but the game was still great but fallout goty ed is way 2 buggy to b on the shelves.

no doubt the fact they got a free pass on their previous games helped the decision to release a fatally flawed product. Still i hope they get sued into making sure future games work.

[TheHater]

The only reason I finish Fallout 3 was because of that platinum trophy. If it was not for the trophy, I would have taken the game back after about an hour into it. It froze about 7 times for me in the first hour and I was about to lose it.

[Mr_Bun]

Oblivion wasn't as bad as Fallout....you would think that Fallout would have been an improvement (in terms of bugs)...not the other way around

Edit: @Hater

If that game wasn't so fun I wouldn't have made it out of the first vault...I soon learned why you were able to have infinite saves!

[ThanatosDMC]

Yeah, it freezes a lot. But great game though. It's just too big a game. I'm playing Fallout 3 GOTY on the PS3. I hate it when i fall/jump on something i cant get out off and need to reload my last save.

At least the GOTY version doesnt freeze up as much as my PC version of Fallout 3 when it came out. Also, Walter and other people dont disappear or randomly die as far as i've played in the GOTY version. In the PC version Yao Guia spawn in Catemberyburg (sp?), you know the place with the Antagonizer, the machine guy, and the Traders? Yeah, they killed everybody except the kid but then i never saw him again after i slept in Porter's bed..

[gamesR4fun]

Ya totally agree like i said i finnished it and it was great still is with the mods XD but its still pretty buggy n was even worst at release.
Jus saying that the reason they thought they could get away with that fallout release was cause they got away with so much on their previous games.

[Pennywise]

FO3 took the crown from GTA4 as the game to freeze my PS3 the most. What a turd of a game. Bethesda better work on their glitches before their next game releases. It would freeze AT LEAST once an hour.

[Megaton]

Fallout 3 is the buggiest game I've ever played, by miles. I've never even played a beta that came close to the amount of freezes, bugs and glitches Fallout 3 has.

That being said, I've dumped an easy 400 hours into it across several saves. It's the only WRPG I've ever finished, and one of my favorite games of all time.

Love/hate relationship with that game.

[Cold 2000]

I had Fallout 3 on my 360, played it for 8 hours and never had a problem with it.

[ThanatosDMC]

I think the game freezes more and more as you progress or screw around in the game. Also, the save file is getting bigger and bigger. It used to be around 3mb but now it's 6mb.

I think, they're keeping track of everything the player has disturbed in the game rather than respawning junk that have been pillaged or moved or destroyed.

Also, one thing that scares me is the sound that my PS3 makes before it freezes... the fan begins blowing really hard even though i just turned it on and played for less than ten minutes.

If it gets more and more infuriating i'll go and buy Borderlands for my killing adventures.

Also, big question. In the GOTY edition, do i still get trapped in main quest ending???

[GodsHand]

I find it freeze's often with the expansion packs. I've had very little problems with the game itself, and My save file is at 17MB. The reason it gets so big is that they have it remember every little thing you do in the game, who died, where the body is, what car/bus you blew up etc. As for if they make the buggiest game, would not know, but you could include a list of other companies in that category. *under breath* 2K.

[Serial_EDX]

??? I'm lost, I beat both oblivion and Fallout 3 and never had any of these bug issues you guys seem to be rambling about.

*edit*

After reading the rest of the comments, the issue is with the ps3 versions of the game, no wonder I had no issues, I was on 360 for both.

[Perjoss]

dont blame the game, fallout 3 never froze my 360 single time.

It does not surprise me to hear that it had problems on the ps3, most multiplats do in some way or another. Thats why I only use my ps3 for playing MGS4, Uncharted and watching HD films. My real gaming machine is the 360.

[Megaton]

All versions of the game are loaded with bugs. I've witnessed them on both PS3 and 360.

http://fallout.wikia.com/wi...

[Elvfam511]

people saying that it doesn't freeze on the Xbox 360 doesn't mean it doesn't exist

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

and on PC too

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

[walken7]

I got Fallout 3 for ps3 on release, it froze up on me about the same amount of times Uncharted 2 has frozen up on me. In both cases it's been 3-4 times. Just thought I'd throw that in for comparison. Of course, maybe Fallout just didn't give me as many problems as you guys on this thread.

[CrippleH]

I agree when other games get scrutinized for minor flaws such as screen tearing or aliasing, Bethesda get off with a free pass with bugs and tons of them at that.

It even won game of the year with this bug riddled game.

[heroicjanitor]

I had it on ps3 and it froze more than any other game, but about 10 times in all which was once every couple of days. That was annoying and I've never had a game like that, but you guys must have digested the disc before you played it or something.

[Sarcasm]

Well considering the scope of their games, the QA team probably cant find everything because of the massive amount of hours it will take.

But that's still no excuse I suppose. And yes, Fallout 3 AND Oblivion were buggy as hell.

[DarkTower805]

I really can't fathom the issues people had with Fallout 3, I played through the game twice and got my Platinum on it. Not once did the game EVER freeze on my. The only bug I found in the game was in the Mill area where one of those huge beasts (forgot name) are. I was up between a rock and a mountain and I went under the map, other than that, the game was a glitch/bug free awesome experience.

What I find wierd is how some people (like me) have no issues while others find the game unplayable. To me, that doesn't sound like it's something on the devs end, but who knows?

[Shepherd 214]

both oblivion and fallout 3 have worked fine for me. i have put over 400 hours into oblivion in the past 3 years, so i know. oblivion is one of the greatest games ever made, and a bug every once in a while is very forgiving considering all that the game offers; no other game comes close to the amount of re-playability, detail, and vast freedom that oblivion offers. Fallout fell short a bit but was still great.

Reviewers let the bugs slide because oblivion and fallout are simply too fantastic to nit-pick at their occasional flaws.

[frostypants]

THANK GOD someone wrote a piece about this. I've been complaining about Bethesda for years. The same sorts of bugs have been popping up in every game they've made in the Elder Scrolls series (from a design standpoint I'm treating Fallout 3 a de facto part of that series...the gameplay is basically the same). How do they get away with this?

And now that they develop for consoles as well, every freaking platform has to deal with it. The sadly hilarious thing is how the PC, 360, and PS3 are all equally buggy, but all in totally different ways. I for one suffered through the PC version. Stupid thing would completely freeze my PC. No other game in recent memory would ever lock up so bad that I couldn't even kill it in Task Manager. Just horrible.

Awesome article. Best N4G submission I've read in weeks.

[reintype]

But I've read many horror stories concerning their games.

One of the reasons I've not gotten FallOut, not only because it's buggy but it has a level cap of 30.

For someone who loves power levelling, small level caps is something I definitely consider on games that I buy. But the most rage-inducing controller-hurling thing in a videogame for me, has to be the lost of progress through no fault of mine bec. the videogame is buggy/broken.
That's why I stay away from a game if it has bugs.

[GodsHand]

Level CAP of 30 if you buy the Broken Steel expansion pak. If not then it's only 20. The only buggy stuff I found is when you play the expansions, the game itself works pretty good for me. I have it for the PS3, so I really could not tell you if it has the same problems on xbox.

[Feral Gamer]

I've never had problems with Bethesda games. I'll wait and see once I get to the DLC in the Fallout 3 GOTY.

[Ludakriss]

Yo, I'm honestly not even sure why I'm commenting right now, further more why I'm even still playing the game...but I know that the reading of this article is surely unnecessary. Bethesda - great ideas, but c'mon. Current generation and so unfinished. Must be embarrassing for you as Developers.

[The Matrix]

WELL ITS HARD TO NOT be buggy when you make games that are the size of 10 normal games. It's like making a Halo game with a 100 hour campaign and complaining that it's not perfect. Duh, it would take a couple extra years just to iron out the bugs.

[Redempteur]

So what making huge games should allow them to continue ?

NO .. there are a lot of sand box games ... of course you can't get every bug .. ( gta had some , infamous had some , crackdown had some too ) but at fallout level ..this is just lazy work ...

You what ..they should had deleyed the released by 2 or 3 months and increased the size of their testing team ( if they had one ...because i'm having doubts )

When you release an expansion pack ...and it's not working .. You HAVE to wonder if there is a quality check at some point ...
Bethesda are just lazy ...and some people don't care ..i Do ..care Fallout game of the year SHould have been ironed of some bugs ...yet there are still there ... this is unforgivable ....

[The Matrix]

My point is that Fallout 3 is 5x BIGGER and more complex than GTA IV and Crackdown put together. More complex in that if you kill someone the program has to account for that for the rest of the game so there is a constant avoidance of paradoxes etc.

[Redempteur]

NOt an issue ..

If you know your game is big , spend a lot of time testing it ..

This simple thing wasn't done .. Fallout 2 was great huge for it's time and yet , beside 2 localised bugs ... it's was nearly perfect ( even with permanents death and the like ).

The testing , the basic testing wasn't done ...and it's bethesda fault .. is it so hard to hire a 30 or 40 people team during some months to iron the game ? I mean you're already blowing your budget out by making a Open sand box rpg ... money shouldn't be an issue .... YEt ... THEY didn't .. Most of the bugs aren't here because the game is huge ..but due to the lazyness of the devs ...

Some bugs some disapearances are on the F-ing main quest ... did no one see them ? And why instead of releasing dlcs .. most of the little bugs remains ?

[frostypants]

@2.3, the world might be big (though it's only a tiny fraction of the size of the Bethesda games of the 1990s), but the gameplay and engine aren't that much more complex than many other games. I don't see how a big world has much to do with most of these glitches. Some of the fundamental stuff people have experienced, like losing items, are inexcusable. These are problems that should have been discovered before they created the world map.

[Lucreto]

Yes Fallout did have a lot of problems. You can actually see the frame rate dropping one frame at a time. I learned to save every 10 minutes out in the wasteland. I say in about the 80 hours I played it must of froze at least 65 times.

They better learn from these errors.

[frostypants]

LOL!!! Yeah, don't count on it. Bethesda's been pulling this EXACT same s**t in their PC games since 1994. It's like clockwork. It's just new to the console realm.

QA is a foreign concept to them.

[mattygamefreak]

They're not just buggy. They're incomplete games. I refuse to buy them because I want a reliable product kthxbyebethesda.

[Aclay]

Yes, Bethesda's games are pretty damn buggy, but I guess I was one of the VERY lucky ones because I put around 60+ hours into Fallout 3 (PS3 version of the game) before I stopped playing it, and the game froze on me only about 2 times in that entire span of time... despite it's issues, I still enjoyed the hell out of that game.

Never beat the game before I stopped playing it, but I'm definitely going to get the GOTY version eventually... but it won't be anytime soon, because other newer games have my priority, and I'm already getting prepared for the onslaught of games during the first half of 2010.

[sajj316]

Fallout PS3 patch is up to version 1.6.1. Does it resolve a majority of the game breaking bugs? I can deal with frame stutters but not if the game freezes to the point of a PS3 restart.

[koehler83]

I have no idea what they improved in the latest patch. Probably nothing. It was likely entirely for the implementation of the DLC. The game still freezes as much as ever. Even more so in the DLC areas.

[Azures]

Never had any issues with Oblivion.

[1Excelsior]

correct me if im wrong but arent huge open world games going to be buggy anyways? the constant issues i had with fallout on my ps3 were numerous but the one that stood out the most was whenever i went into a building and got the loading screen it just froze there.
STILL it is a GREAT game if you can expect stuff like this to happen and save it more often from time to time.

[v1c1ous]

as Bethesda is bound to have a few hiccups here and there.

i mean, you are talking about oblivion/fallout 3, games whose worlds are immense compared to every other game out there.

you can't expect them to catch every single small goof when you make games as ambitious as oblivion/fallout 3.

luckily they r one of the few companies who update and fix things fast as soon as they r discovered.

[koehler83]

Granted, but if they're gonna keep doing it, then they should friggin' learn to do it right!

They keep repeating the same damn mistakes and in fact seem to be getting worse over time. They keep increasing their scope while never going back to square one to clean up the mess. With every other developer constantly improving their technology with every release, I don't get how Bethesda keeps it up.

[Eiffel]

Does no one know how BIG Bethesda's games are? And I've had less bugs experiences with Fallout 3 than most BIG open world titles.

Buy really every game has bigs. Some you just have to look hard for.

[frostypants]

The world in GTA:San Andreas was pretty effing huge...I'd say it was comparable, you could just move across it faster. It didn't have half the issues Fallout 3 has.

The world size means nothing when the bugs are engine related.

Edit: Looked it up. GTA:SA was 14 square miles. Fallout 3 is 16.

[Figboy]

my wife stopped playing Fallout 3 alltogether because ever since we bought the DLC (PS3 version), the game has been crashing every 10 minutes.

we deleted the DLC and re-installed it, and it fixed it for a bit, but it still crashed regularly (though not every 10 minutes).

not to mention the fact that some quests are bugged and cannot be completed (there's one quest in the Pitt where an NPC's body doesn't appear, so she can't collect the letter he has on his body so she can give it to his lady, thus, the quest can't be completed).

at this point, we're ready to forgo Bethesda games altogether until they get their act together. yes, their games are fun, granted they are working correctly, but there are a lot of other developers with more complex games (and really, when you boil it down, Bethesda games aren't that complex - the worlds are huge, and there are a lot of quests, but the gameplay is rather simple and straight forward) that run smoother, and look better.

but since people still buy their games, they aren't learning anything, and now console gamers are experiencing what the PC folks have been experiencing for years now.

their efforts this generation have been inexcusable, and they should be taken to task for it.

[Kushan]

I'd like to answer that question with a resounding YES!

[bjornbear]

oui

[mrv321]

No, their gameS ARE just fi... damn it crashed.

They didn't even product test the PS3 version I mean c'mon how can you not realise when someone goes online or offline on PSN the game freezes.

[Imallvol7]

I have tried both Oblivion and Fallout 3 because of the glowing reviews. I have never understood how they could get such a good review with the amount of bugs. I stopped Oblivion within about 2 hours and Fallout 3 within a few hours of getting out of the vault. Blows my mind that bugs like these are ignored and not factored in to scores when games like Uncharted 2 get docked points for being unoriginal, lol. Just makes me angry when I think about it. Rant over.

[PirateThom]

I think "ambitious but buggy" would more or less sum up a Bethesda game. Not bad games, but there is definitely something lacking when it comes to quality control. They build amazing worlds and then something stupid takes you out of the experience, ruining the hard work.

[Serial_EDX]

After reading all of the comments, its the ps3 version of the game thats buggy, not the 360, so its really a system thats the issue is it not?

and I'm not talking the ps3 itself. I'm talking the engine isn't compatible with the ps3 all that well.

[PirateThom]

The PS3 had a major issue where whenever anyone signed in, the game would freeze when the notification was on screen, and only move again when the notification went away.

There was other things, but I don't think it was any worse than Oblivion, for the most part.

[Serial_EDX]

Yea, I think the reviewers for most of the games were on the 360 version weren't they?

I mean if they weren't then the game would have had way lower scores for being buggy.

[Skizelli]

I dislike how journalists review a game based on a single platform, such as GT's review of Borderlands. They seemed to have based their review on the Xbox 360 version, making note of the slow loading textures, but failed to mention that it only happens on the 360 port (which I have). I think if you're going to mention flaws in a game, that one should at least do a little more research before coming to the conclusion that it's the game and not the limitations of the platform it's on. But I guess that's why there's comparison videos and junk.

[Serial_EDX]

Yes I agree, I saw the comparisons for the 360/ps3 version of that * I have the 360 version* and I noticed that the ps3 version had less load time for its textures. They really should mention those kinds of things.

[mastiffchild]

Go look at the Nethesda fan boards and you aee it isn't a PS3 versin issue at all.TePC version has a list of bugs even longer than the PS3 and the 360 a similar number to Sony's version of FO3. And as this runs on the TES4 Oblivion engine, which ran arguably better(in the end) on PS3 for that game why would it be an incompatible engine??

I think you're geting a very false picture of what's going on with FO3 here!

Fact is , yes, it's a buggy game and so was Oblivion too but the engine isn't a platform issue-and the bugs are a proper issue dor every Bethesda release beit full game or DLC. The size of the worlds aren't an excuse either as other big area games have way fewer bugs AND that wouldn't account for the DLC anyway-which has been even worse for bugs.

We keep paying for thr right to do QAfor them and they need to pull their digit out and sort this pronto. I wasted three attempts at Oblivion because I got the Vampire curse bug , couldn't fix it and had to start again! FO3 was a mess too with reezes all the damn time without worrying about getting caught up on incisible crap or scenery. It/they chouldn't have shipped inm this stae-other devs don't so why do we forgive Betesda?

Personally , I'm also miffed at them for spoiling the Fallout series for me(and a few others I know at least)with a weak pair of shooting mechanics(beither really work very well with the aiming shonky in FPS mode even with the better weapons and VATS sometimes feeling totally arbitrary! Also they changed the atmosphere and lost a lot along the way. Sure they werem't total dealbreakers in themsleve but, to me, FO3is an OK gane-but a terrible Fallout. The bugs just make it even weaker than it akready is.

I realise that noone ever knocks FO3 and that Bethesda often get soft or preferable treatment in reviews and such like but despite me not rating the game that's irrelevant to what Bethesda are going to do about this serial weak performance - in tech terms natch. Thing is they get so much respect nd if they want to merit that they really shouldn't shipunfinished games and DLC. It's amateur but, also, they're just not the world beaters people make them out to be in my eyes. I they really were would we be reading this king of article yet aain?

[NecrumSlavery]

Fallout 3 is the only Bethesda game that is buggy.

But it's so amazing that's those errors never make us break the game. Love/Hate

[AliTheBrit19]

What are you serious?

Dude Oblivion was buggy as hell, SO many things could go wrong which would mean you couldn't finish a certain quest line.

[Skizelli]

I think the buggiest games I've ever played have come from Ubisoft.

[P33OnUAndHopeUDie]

I have played both Fallout3 and Oblivion, and yes I have ran into some bugs such the item duping and etc... but should we condemn Bethesda for it; I think not.

Fallout and Oblivion have given me hours of entertainment and both games have great replay value. You argue that they keep getting buggier and buggier, but in truth fallout has had significantly less bugs than Oblivion, and the programmers at Bethesda are constantly working, looking and patching bugs.

[Ninjamonkey]

The worst part of the article:

"Fallout 3 is Bethesda's most recent--and best selling--title."

If fans of the Elder Scrolls series is wondering why weve not gotten any confirmation for the next game in the series heres the answer:

Its becuase Bethsda realised that instead of slaving away with a 300+ hour game bursting at the seams with content, they can make so much more money making games nearly a tenth shorter and even with tons of glitches.

Just slap a little grey paint on there and guns and theyve got their sales... Oblivion got GOTY, it was an incredible game though Bethsda blatantly dont want, theyd much rather make games with far less work and more money involved...

They took the bar oblivion set and lowered it for Fallout. Yes the story was great but Id much rather that such storytelling went into a proper RPG, the way they should be, much longer.

[P33OnUAndHopeUDie]

That would be true if Bethesda didn't announce Elder Scroll V is back in development.

[devilhunterx]

Playing Fallout 3 right now. Not all glitches are bad. e.g. I just killed one of the Big Ugly Green Hulk without any issue - Thanks to the AI glitch.

[Bigpappy]

I played both on 360. Never froze once. They need to patch they engine to work on PS3. Xbox owner who played this game can tell you that it was almost or totally bug free. I remember, when it was released, there were reports of the PS3 version freezing, but I thought it was resolved.

[rhood022]

It wasn't "almost totally bug free" on the 360. The technical issues for both games were just as heavily documented for the 360 than they were for the PS3. Just look at the articles for the DLC released on the 360. It became a running joke that you had to wait a week after it was released before it could be downloaded.

Even the main games, both Oblivion and Fallout, had some serious issues. Oblivion was especially buggy on launch and Fallout had similar problems. Fallout, for example, would freeze for me every time there were more than 3 people on screen.
'
The worst though was in the Deathclaw Sanctuary and in Raven Rock. I almost couldn't finish the game because of the technical issues.

[bjornbear]

Played 10+ hours on Oblivion on PS3, not one freeze or problem. Yes theres the occasional NPC glitch but hey =P its bathesda.

[frostypants]

I have the PC version. It's buggier than a roach motel too, and I have a pretty common hardware config. ALL versions had problems.

And people talk as if the game was so great that it doesn't matter. Sorry, no freaking way am I buying that argument. There would be no excuse for many of these bugs even if it were such an amazing game, but frankly I find it a bit overrated. Just when the plot started getting mildly interesting and I recruited my first NPC companion...game over 1 hour later. Wtf...

And I don't care what anyone says, travelling around a 16 square mile map trading scrap metal isn't "replay value".

[Vortex3D]

Reality is gamers today keep saying can't wait, must play now, etc. Many gamers rather play buggy games than willing to wait for several months longer for the game to fixed until it's less buggy.

If gamers are willing to buy broken and buggy games, then game publishers will release them quickly to make the money. Why not if the consumers are dumb enough to buy the broken product.

This generation games are the buggiest. It's because of easy online patches. Game publishers know they can sell first and fix later. Some games remain buggy because the game publishers didn't care enough to fix the bugs.

Of course each game publishers are different as far as quality control. Games like Fallout 3 has high demand and they don't need to ensure it's less buggy before released. Gamers already can't wait to buy and play the broken product. Fallout 3 GOTY came out a year later and it's still buggy especially on the PS3. Why? Because PS3 gamers have been waiting for so long to get all the DLC expansion packs and can't wait to get it. PS3 gamers keep asking for DLC expansion packs but didn't ask for GOTY edition to be not buggy.

Before we keep complaining about why game publishers keep releasing buggy games, we have to have self control of not buying games that are buggy because they are released before it's done right.

If we continue to can't wait, then we just have to accept buggy and broken games.

I got to the point refusing to buy any new games no matter how popular or good the game is until I know the game publishers have fixed most game bugs. That's the only to ensure when I play a game, the bugs are not part of the game "experience".

[crazyturkey]

There are a lot of games that have many problems........Sometimes it looks like these publishers or developers have no testing done on the games. This is probably because now developers have the option of just patching all their games after they've been released, so they choose to get their broken products out to the market like that. Back in the N64 era, I remember playing OoT and I don't remember ever encountering a bug/glitch, even in Twilight Princess last gen I don't remember any glitches........so does that mean that, this particular developer has higher quality control than bethesda? probably(then again in this gen games are much bigger and complicated so they need an even higher level of testing their games).

[Tormento]

they do make great games but they are buggy as hell if i ever meet the QA team i would slap each and every one of their mouths closed fist ofc.

[00000000000000000001]

Uncharted 2 is by far the buggiest game that I have played so far this year. Screen would go blank, but never locked up completely, sometimes it would come back. One time I saved and when the game was reloaded I was at the next chapter!

[Thoreau]

i get stuck on tiny ledges, npc act weird....yeah bethesda games are buggy.

[Grandreaper9999]

To save all you guys some breath.

Short answer: Yes.

[Avery]

Want to see buggy take a look at what they did to Star Trek: Legacy - broken multiple from day one.... Messed up patch = disaster.

[Ps_alm3k]

some body have to tell em!!!
otherwise they will get away with it...right....????
I hate it how some people have low standard in the product they buy............

[59]

"Waaaaaa My crapbox 360/ piss sh-t 3 cant play fall out 3 because it was made specifially for PC's & their superior preformance"

Sorry, stop being cheap & get the real gaming platform.

My 4 year old processor handled fallout 3's terrain so good I actually edited to game to handle even MORE than the max limitations. Seriously guys, stop buying bad consoles.