Toshiba's Questionable Commitment to HD-DVD

Toshiba is selling the HD-A1 at unsustainable loss, and company President Nishida is calling for format unification. Is Toshiba really in to win?

[Islandkiwi]

From what I've been seeing in the news and reading about the quality/cost of both blu-ray and hd-dvd, there won't be a winner in these format wars. People will stick with dvds.

[achira]

you have read something wrong, you should not read all the sh!t in the internet. go buy one and you will see the next gen movies ! the quality is unbelievable!

[shotty]

It's going to end up like DVD+-R. Where both formats exist and we have duel players. Where the majority will be on HD-DVD since it's cheaper but ever the extra space is needed and sony ever finishes the 50Gb then they will release on blu-ray

[TheMART]

In a few years time it isn't nescessary to own a next gen drive.

All will be streamed and downloadable. HD video, games, all. Like demo's on marketplace and arcadegames already are.

No need to distribute fysical media/games/movies. Cut costs. Deliver cheaper. No scratches on media.

I think neither format will really be sold. It's not worth the money at this time for sure

[The BS Police]

I don't undestand it whn people say Next Gen DVDs!

It's ust old DVDs with a tad better picture and sound quality with more disc space, who really gives a sh!t!

I think most people are good with DVD anyway!

[ScorpioKyle]

by the time the mass market accepts replacing standard DVDs, there will be a format much better than blueray or HDdvd

[shoota33]

haha toshiba knows what coming to them. blu ray is going to own.

[The BS Police]

How much of the owrlds population cares about HDDVs like 8%!!!!!

Both formats are going down if you ask me!

[shoota33]

WoW all of a sudden next gen formats are useless no one will buy them.You xbots are some funny charactors.

[THELANDSOFSAND]

bluray uses mpeg2 compression, which sucks.

i have a hd-dvd player and the quality is awesome.

[The BS Police]

I am not for HD-DVD because unlike you who would waste your money on something you don't need I am catious on buying most products!

The world doesn't need HD-DVD's and thats a fact, just because I'm an XBOX fan doesn't man I share the same vews as all the other XBOX fans!

I'm not purchasing any of the HD-DVD formats!

[dantesparda]

Um, BS Police? do the math, 8% of the worlds population is 512 MILLION!!! HELLO!!! thats alot of people! thats more people than theyre in America and Canada combined.

And p.s. its got 15GB's to 50GB's (HD-DVD is 15GB or 45GB if triple layered and Bluray is 25GB & 50GB Dual-layered) therefore with that extra space you can run the movies in 1080P (which is 1920x1080 non-interlaced [or progressive if you prefer] non compressed. (well supposedly). The pits on it are much smaller than current DVD's and thats how they get higher capacity on them and you need a much higher wavelength (smaller/shorter waves ) laser. Hence the blue laser (just look at the electromagnetic spectrum ultraviolet/blue is shorter wavelengths and red is a longer wavelength.

Right now on standard DVD's you have 480P (640x480 non-interlaced) and its MPEG-2 compressed

[The BS Police]

Wow that is alot of people, okay let me rephrace that, 1% of the population cares about HD-DVDs!

[Cyclonus]

BluRay vs HD-DVD remind me of the SACD vs DVD-AUDIO thing a few years back.

Both audio formats' sound quality were vastly superior to cd, but consumers ended up not giving a sh!t about either one.

[ACE]

they should just work on big hard drives would work out cheaper

[Moostache]

At their best, both BD and HD-DVD produce a picture equal to the best High-definition broadcasts you have seen. It can be stunning, but usually it depends on the camera used - if the camera was also a high-def camera, the images look better. Some films and clips I have seen look real nice....but others....

At their worst, they look barely better than DVD and are not worth the price. Since neither HD-DVD or BD looked beter than the other when viewing "WOW" images (the kind that make you double take and stare at the display) I would have a real hard time buying a stand-alone BD at 2X the price of the HD-DVD stand- alone.

PS3 buyers will be happy with theirs (if they use a game machine to watch movies that is) and anyone interested can get a cheap add-on for XB360 if they want to go that route.

The format "war" and the console "war" will have about the same resolution - people who like to waste cash will go the Sony route and pay more to have the same performance as everyone else gets for about 1/2 the price.

In the end, high-definition movies is a great thing for HT entusiasts, but for main-stream folks who don't even have an HDTV yet, it is a complete waste of money. They are both going to be niche products for at least the next 5 years. When stand alone players hit that magic $199 price, then the race is really on. PS3's added Blu-Ray player won't be enough to ignite a mass adoption of the format (IMO).

[Cyclonus]

Hi def is GREAT, hi def DVDs are even better, but I think its too soon. SD-DVD has only recently buried VHS for good, to become the defacto format; its an obvious step-up in PQ over VHS tapes - REGARDLESS of what TV you have.

Next-gen DVDs, however, require an HDTV for ANY improvement over DVD, and an 1080p HDTV to see either format at their best.

They should've waited until HDTV had at least 40-45% market penetration to release a brand new format.

IMO, Microsoft was VERY prescient to use the tried-and-true- DVD-9 in 360, very smart.

BTW, I have a 300 dvd collection and I'll be damned if I'll replace them all for a looooong time.

[shoota33]

Ms was stupid to put a dvd drive into xflop PERIOD. Its stupid and they are going to pay for it.

[TheMART]

Well I guess putting a non standard BetaBluRay drive into a PSZero is a more stupid. It's of no use and you know what

YOU PAY FOR THAT 600 dollars/euro's and no system seller game at selling prime time Christmas

Now that's funny

[Xtrm L1481L1TY]

Holographic Disks can hold terabytes. HD DVD and Blu-ray are obsolete.

[DG]

As much as I would love one of those and roumours that its more consumer friendly (as in cheaper) than most think I dont see it coming out in the next five years or at least me affording it so BR/HD can hold me over for now.

[Cyclonus]

and how long until THAT becomes the mainstream standard? 2012?

[DG]

I just want a way to record my HD shows and watch it in 1080i on my 1080p compatable TV. Is that too much to ask for...huh Sony/Toshiba? I dont care who wins just give it to me. NOW! Not tommorrow not October NOW!

PS anybody that can honestly say there is no significant difference between DVD and HD is on some serious drugs!

[Grown Folks Talk]

don't think it's a matter of the difference, but how many people actually care about the difference enough to spend so much money.

[DG]

I understand that FQ but the point being is that there are people willing to spend the money (PS3 asides) look at HDDVD all unit are sold out. I dont mind paying $500 to record HD content, mind you thats not possible yet but I think it will be by the end of the year.

[Grown Folks Talk]

i'm not downplaying your desire. i was talking about your end statement. i work for direct tv now. i actually just installed an hd setup today. you can surely tell the difference (unless you have a tiny tv), but still the majority of people don't own hd sets, and might not anytime soon. i think progressive scan on my 17" lcd monitor is just fine. i could care less about blu-ray, and i'm not getting the add-on for my 360. i don't speak for everyone, but the #'s show there are a lot of homes with no hd tvs. direct tv worked a deal with microsoft to where you will be able to stream content, on demand content, and hd content, so i would think your wish may come true soon.

[benihya]

360 will never need more space for it's games because HD cut scenes are what require a lot of space but a lot of games these day are going to be made with out cut scenes ( Half life 2), and if they still used them I do not think people will mind changing the DVD once during the 15 hours game play ( games are getting shorter and shorter)

[Grown Folks Talk]

realtime cutscenes use less space than cg cutscenes. i think the only issue is japanese developed games since they prefer generally to go the cg route. if rumble in the controller isn't a big deal, then why should people care about switching a disc? they're both old school, and i had plenty of 3 and 4 disc playstation games. you have to switch the disc every time you play a different game, it's the same amount of time. they just place the switch in a place where it doesn't drastically affect the experience.

[JIN KAZAMA]

Toshiba seems to be backing down, Blu-Ray is about to be the next gen format, hands down. Its gonna be so awesome watching movies on my HDTV in high def. You guys are forgetting about the High Def audio that will be available on the disc, not just visual enhancements. Also, they will be able to put much more content on the discs therefore making it a much more interactive experience with the movies. For all the people that say, DVD is good enough, you were probably the same people that said VHS is good enough.

[TheMART]

Nobody is winning as long as consumers don't buy the thing. Like it was with Betamax, as will go with BetaBluRay

[AuburnTiger]

You just don't want to Sony to succeed do you? I mean don't you want competition for your 360?

[E Man]

Gametime is dumb

[shotty]

Toshiba is not backing down. It's that they would rather have a unified format so that customers will start buying it. With HD-DVD and BD customers will be catious on which one to get since either one might be gone in a couple years. Sony on the other hand has a lot riding on Blu-ray, they are losing a lot of ground in the A/V field because of Samsung so they need a sure way to make money. And thats where blu-ray comes into play, sony gets money for every blu-ray disk that is sold since they created the format. HD-DVD on the other hand is pretty much open like the DVD format.

[PS360PCROCKS]

agreed if toshiba was so into hd-dvd why do they want unification? It's rediculous

[shotty]

What did you agree to? I think sony should stop being alittle greedy and go with toshiba and work out a comprimise. As of right now HD-DVD is winning. And there is no point in both companies throwing money into 2 products that are basically the samething. What toshiba wants is consumers to get into HD, what sony wants is people to buy blu-ray so they can get a cut of all the profits. Sony also has made offers with companies like samsung, pioneer and panasonic to reduce royalties if they make only Blu-ray players. LG left the pack and said they will make HD-DVD players same with HP. NEC is also making PC drives. Microsoft said they fully back HD-DVD which is why microsoft's supiorior video codec VC-1 (Mpeg 4) is in HD-DVD and Blu-ray is using Mpeg 2. Vista will also support HD-DVD natively. Honestly everyone put there diginities away and resolve this fued and make a comprimise format.

[dantesparda]

actually mpeg4 doesnt have superior image quality to mpeg2 its just has better compression than it. as matter of fact mpeg2 should look better, but it all matters on how its encoded. but i dont know about that variant (VC-1) and also i think that bluray is suppose to start using h.264 which im not sure of the specs but i think maybe better than both in both image quality and compression

[ScorpioKyle]

both formats are going to flop. the market isn't ready for it. Tech junkies are creamin for them, but the average consumer could care less and doesn't have an HDTV to begin with yet.

Laserdisk 2.0

[dantesparda]

well if they can price them right then, they make great storage mediums for PC's, besides you need the extra space in order to fit true uncompressed 1920x1080 res movies you cant do that on current size DVD's unless they can come up with an even better compression scheme than what they have now

[Schmitty07]

It's pointless

[TheMART]

The format that is most sold (I don't say it will be huge, but the largest seller) will be the one that is bought by the PC users that use it to put data on.

These revolutions always start with PC users that buy cheaper then standalone burners. Also with DVD, now again with these drives probably.

What do they prefer? Data storage capabilities compared to price.

HD-DVD is the cheapest option. So those will end up in computer systems. There you go

[OutpostCommand]

To be honest, once the PS3 comes out, we will see a massive increase in popularity.
It would take you 5 DVDs to make one movie in HD.
Now lets not even get into next-gane games...
Toshiba had a massive jump start on Sony and strangely didnt use this to their advantage.
Just follow the damn link next to the article for the full story, and it looks like Toshibas' chances of prevailing with HD-DVD have slashed totally.

[TheMART]

For games it's totally nonsense

PS2/XBOX games (last gen)

98% of the games where between 2 and 3 GB (max 4 GB's)

1% was between 4 and 5 GB

1% was over 5 GB, but never one reached the full 8,5 GB.

SO don't expect the majority of games to reach the 8,5 DL DVD capacity soon. Unless Fony is putting too many CGI movies on every game disc just to make it more then 8,5 GB and try to 'prove' it's claims

[zonetrooper5]

PC's will not be using the new formats for a long time, some games for the PC are still using CD's but most are using DVD's which will last for another few years. As for HD, some people are ready for it, while most are happy with what they got. I think i will wait another 2 more years then get a HD-TV. As for now DVD's are doing me fine. No need to change. As for the Xbox 360 using DVD 9, its cheap and people are still using the format so gametime be quiet and shut the hell up. There is also hybrid DVD's which can store up to 13GB but that is what i have heard.

[96impala]

MS did the right thing by using regular dvd drives. I mean it's tried and true. Also the new systems will be out in the next few years where the new format of disks will be better suited. But in a few years when all this hd stuff takes off then you'll see both companies take interesting approaches. Im not even nor have i ever been interested in watching movies on my consoles, but i like the fact that i can if i chose to. I love my 360 and was never caught up in all the hype of either the ps3 or the 360. I knew that the 360 would have the harddrive that i can utilize for music playback and that was all i needed. I like movies as much as the next guy but i love music and the 360 was perfect for that so thats the one i went for. I love mine.

[YoJ1Mbo]

I don't care for either hd format atm, I really think they came out with a necessity but with the wrong marketing plan. Its great that we have the option of watching movies in hd, but whoopie, most of the world doesn't own an hd tv yet.

This is a necessity for next-gen games though b/c they'll hopefully require so much more space. That's how they should be utilized and not this hd home movie crap. Too much hype everywhere for something that will fail.

I think compression is the key, we shouldn't focus on expanding our disks, but shrinking them, it's like we're heading in the opposite direction of innovation right now.