Final Fantasy VII Remake's Decision to Drop Its Turn-Based RPG Combat is Sadly Ironic

The much-anticipated remake sacrifices a part of its history.

When Final Fantasy VII first came out out more than 20 years ago, RPGs were still struggling valiantly to break into the American console gaming consciousness. Raised on Super Mario Bros. and arcade games, the majority of western console games rejected RPGs in all their forms. Final Fantasy VII famously broke through that barrier, helping to open the door for all manner of JRPGs.

The Final Fantasy VII Remake would seem to be a tribute to that period. Midgar has been lovingly recreated in all of its Steampunk glory, and Cloud, Aeris, and Barrett look much as they did in the original artwork. By all appearances, it's just the game fans have been begging for all these years.

This is not the game we played back in 1997 though. The classic ATB gauge is gone. It focuses more on setpieces. It looks like... gulp... an action RPG game.

[CaptainOmega]

It could have just done a type of FF13 ATB system and I would have been fine with it. If I want to play running around button mashing action FF id rather play FF15.

[TheGamez100]

Id hate it even worse if had anything "ff13" in it....
From the trailers, its looking good so far tbh. I mean yea, Id definitely prefer if they just remade the original ff7s turn based gameplay but this one looks much more like the original ffvs13s 2011 trailer gameplay which is great.

[Army_of_Darkness]

If they don't allow us to use all the characters like the original, I'm gonna lose my shit... The episodic thing is already bad enough...

[RizBiz]

I hope it has FF13-level voice acting. 🤣

[indysurfn]

I agree I'd perfer it be a turn based game.

[AnthonyDavis]

Turn Based > Crappy action RPGs.

Games are not good enough yet to be action RPGs.

[PhoenixUp]

FFXIII’s battle system was the CSB and it didn’t allow you to play as anybody other than the party leader

FFVIIR’s battle system will still retain aspects of the ATB, unlike FFXV’s which didn’t at all.

[indysurfn]

? huh really? Not fare your pulling my leg!

[Lord_Sloth]

Real Time doesn't automatically equate to button mashy.

[fr0sty]

Unless you don't know what you are doing and are desperately trying to make something happen.

[Lord_Sloth]

^ That doesn't always help and will get you killed in a lot of real time games.

[-Foxtrot]

It could have done turn based

Lost Odyssey
Persona 5
Dragon Quest XI

Just a few examples that turn base is still popular today. Just Square being backward again.

[indysurfn]

Your being too nice! They are not being backwards they are being CHEAP. In 1998 the new CEO (at the time) said that it cost 4 times more to make a turn based than the same game being action based. This is WHY square started off making action rpg's (dragon slayer 1 and dragon slayer 2) when they was going at of business they released a last game RIGHT before and was saved that game was FF(1). It saved them with sales.

But he said they needed to smooth out sales! In instead of taking 120 people 6 years to make a turn based he was switching over to 50-60 people 2-3 years to make a action rpg. So to me that means CHEAP! Look at the trails of cold steel games that are MUCH bigger than FF turn based games and are starting to make a following.

FF15 sold over 10 million but look how many consoles there where. FFVII sold way more than that with less people owning consoles. So they are just reducing risk and smoothing out sales, and being cheap on investing into each game.

[Juusterey]

Yeah
Making combat you dont want is obviously backwards

[indysurfn]

I agree with the overall part of your message. But I'm sure people are pissed about the FF15 reference because of negative feelings on wasting money on that one.

[Runechaz]

Yep FF 7 is now an hack n' slash game…

[indysurfn]

People will disagree until it comes out just like they did with FFXV until it came out then they was like ops....yeah I wasted my money!

[kayoss]

Down, diagonal, right = Omni Slash
Back (charged), forward = meteor rain
Up, up, down , down, left , right, A, B, select start = extra lives.

[pietro1212]

If they don't right it doesn't have to be. I.e Nier Automata, Bloodborne, The Soul Franchise

[Juusterey]

Don't think you know what a hack n' slash game is

[pietro1212]

Juusterey
Judging by their remarks it doesn't seem like it.

[shaun mcwayne]

Streets of Final Fantasy. Grand Uppah.

[Michiel1989]

ahum, Fantasy May Cry of course...
swords and guns

[indysurfn]

LOL

[Miss_Vixen]

In my opinion the last great traditional Final Fantasy game was FFX. The series kind of went downhill after. Subsequent titles just doesn't feel the same anymore.

The visuals looks nice for the Remake, I’m not too keen on the combat though which looks almost identical to FF 15 which I’m not really fond off. The game being episodic doesn't help either.

Call me old school but I actually still prefer the classic turn based combat system when it comes to JRPGs.

[chris235]

some say X was already abysmal. i thought it was horrible to follow these protagonists around in X and x-2 ... the last good FF in my opinion was indeed 7.

[FalconofLucis98]

wow i find you really rare @chris, as for @vixen I agree

[RizBiz]

I couldn't agree more, X was awful. Rikku was hot as f*ck and absolutely fappable, but the game was pretty bad.

[FalconofLucis98]

X was one of the best, it had a great story, characters, music and combat system like the previous games. All it was missing was a world map. Truly Squaresoft's swan song. Plus, it got 92 on metacritic same as FF6 and FF7 as well as a 9.0 userscore. Its very well received by boths fans and critics. You are just in the minority, not to disregard your opinion. It just has a few amount of haters like you, who are really vocal.

[Nade7456]

Dunno what you're on about FFX was awesome. The highlight of FF of the PS2 generation. I think it had the one of the best and most emotional stories in all of gaming. I cried at the end of that game.

[RedDevils]

Christ is just one of those rare breed

[LightofDarkness]

Absolutely agreed. X's story was poorly executed, filled with an unlikable cast and some of the stupidest villains the series has yet seen. VIII was the chilling vision of things to come, unfortunately. VII and IX were great, and XII had some great new ideas (along with an admirable attempt at maturing the tone). But it's been dead for a long time. I want this remake to be good, but I'm not holding my breath.

[Nade7456]

12 sucked monkey balls. 12 was the death of the franchise with its mediocre story and forgettable characters.

[LightofDarkness]

And you think X's juvenile, plot hole addled groan-fest was better? No accounting for taste, it seems.

X had a great battle system though, I'll give it that.

[indysurfn]

If your wondering why all the disagrees there are people that like 8 better so your slapping them in the face. And there are people that liked 9 and 10 too. If you had said 7 was the BEST and not last good you would not have gotten as many disagrees.

[Lord_Sloth]

Whether you liked X or not is irrelevant. I cannot abide somebody saying VII was the last good FF game when IX exists!

[modsrhypocrite]

I agree that X was the last traditional feeling FF, but I didn't like it. It was okay as far as JRPGs go, but just sorta there. The english voice acting was terrible (though that's to be expected with most JRPGs and anime), characters were forgettable, super linear gameplay...

[indysurfn]

haha I agree even though x was starting to go down hill it it was still good. After X they fell off the hill. Now they are cash cowing off the name of FFVII.

[indysurfn]

You should try TRAILS of cold steel. It is becoming more and more like the original final fantasy's. And it's S-crafts are becoming more and more like SUMMON spells, this game has it ALL. Even mechs
https://www.youtube.com/wat...

[pietro1212]

Final Fantasy XII and X-2 has the best gameplay of the entire franchise

[warmachine92]

X-2s gameplay was its redeeming factor

[pietro1212]

warmachine92
Pretty much. Lol

[BlackDoomAx]

Didn't play XV, won't play this one neither.

[ShinRon]

as long as they make it easy enough for non relex oriented gamers who enjoyed the original, whats the problem with real time action combat? atb was the active time battle system, seems like a natural progression

the original game had a strong focus on set pieces as well

[Imortus_san]

Turn-Based RPG Combat is still my favorite.

[Chexs1990]

There still is an atb system.
All actions in combat, outside standard attacking, is ruled by an atb bar.

[NovusTerminus]

Looks like an evolution of Crisis Core, so I think I will be fine with it.

[meep316]

Basically it isn’t final fantasy vii, just some other game retelling it’s story.

[Juusterey]

Yeah
Clearly ff7 was defined by its combat alone
And you're right
It isn't final fantasy 7
Is final fantasy 7 remake

[meep316]

Yes the core gameplay of the game is an important part of what the game is, how can anyone argue otherwise? Unless you aren’t being sarcastic, then a remake still isn’t something where the game becomes a different genre lol.

[Juusterey]

Never said it wasn't important, you made that up yourself
If you could read what i said before replying, that might help

[FalconofLucis98]

Jeez the amount of whiners in this comment section of N4G, the battle system has been well recieved as of yet. Its nothing like FFXVs, so stop making that comparison. Secondly, action RPG is better than turn-based if its done right. This looks like it. Sit down oldboys.

[-Foxtrot]

Yeah that action RPG really worked in FFXV

...not

[Question_Mark]

Your opinion isn’t fact, so stop thinking it is.

[-Foxtrot]

And you act like I’m the only person who thinks that

The battle system was shit compared to the others

[Juusterey]

Oh sorry
I was going to disagree
But if you're not alone in you're opinion that makes you right I guess

[raWfodog]

I love both action-RPG and Turn-based so I'm looking forward to this remake of FFVII. I don't believe one is objectively better than the other one though. The recent FFVII remake footage looks very good though and I can't wait to see more.

[SegaGamer]

Both turn-based and action RPG's are excellent, saying one is better than the other is just stupid, there are no facts with that kind of statement, only personal preference.

I personally hate that Final Fantasy has moved away from it's roots. It's main line games have been turn-based since it began, I see no reason why it needed changing.

[mixelon]

Action RPG is not better than turn based. They’re incomparable.

That’s like saying Tekken is better than Chess.. I mean, you might prefer it but they’re nothing alike. It’s not surprising fans of FF7 would prefer the FF7 remake to be like FF7.

[Butters360]

Cry me a river.

[Traecy]

They could have went in the vein of the FFXIII style battle system to keep it turned based but fast & furious & able to switch party leaders on the fly but from what I saw in the latest trailer the action battle system looks fiercer than FFXV. I like what I see so far, can't wait to see more next month at E3!

[RizBiz]

And sh*t? Because FF13 was sh*t.

[Traecy]

The same could be said about your comment which is your opinion & your opinion is not facts.

[Elda]

Agreed.

[l33t_haxx0r]

Should just leave it turn based, made the combat more tactical, action based is just mindless bashing.

[Nacho_Z]

At this point without having seen any significant gameplay and so pretty much being in the dark I would have preferred turn based, but I came to terms with it ages ago that they weren't going down that route and it's left me with an open mind about it. It helps that the recent trailer looks really good.

It's not like I don't enjoy ARPGs so there's a chance it might work and I'm prepared to wait and see rather than write it off.

[phoenixwing]

Square Enix is basically saying they would have made the original an arpg if the technology at the time could support their vision. Which I'm okay with. I like both. However, I think since they know and we know we'll all be buying it they could have done the courtesy of doing both gameplay styles within their episodic games.

[Chriswynnetbh]

Speak for yourself. You are the reason why the game industry is the way it is today. These companies think they can put out whatever garbage they want and just expect people to buy it because of the name. You are the exact person they are banking on to buy this trash.

[Wolffenblitz]

...I'm not a fan of the episodic thing, but I don't think the choice for going non turnbased isn't that bad

[phoenixwing]

@chris

you haven't even played it but you call it garbage. Aside from being episodic i can't think of one wrong thing with it besides the turn based style which is a style of play not an end all be all measure of quality.

[Chriswynnetbh]

Square hasn't put a good FF game out since X. Hell even X-2, with as terrible of a story as that game had, was better than XII, XIII and XV. You wanna know the reason why they haven't stuck with a battle system after X-2? It's cause they're all trash. They all are not enjoyable to play and more of just something you have to deal with to get through the story. It's a shame too because the turn based games they do put out are fantastic. People love Dragon Quest XI and Octopath and even their indie ones are good too like I Am Setsuna and Lost Sphere. It just makes no sense why they feel the need to change the genre of the remake because clearly people are still interested in turn based games. On top of the fact that it will be released in episodes? I'm gonna steer extremely clear of that fucking mess.

[Juusterey]

So you say speak for yourself
Then your next comment you proceed to speak for others

[Kane22]

looking what happened to ni no kuni 2 all for the sake of action combat. they literally got rid of the Pokemon system to turn the sequel to another generic action game...its not a bad game but its nothing like part 1. loved part 1 for what it was. part 2 sacrificed so much to please people who weren't going to get ni no kuni 2 from the start.

[FalconofLucis98]

NNK2 ARPG system is different, when you switch characters they teleport to you. Weve not seen enough of FF7s combat to make that comparison, plus your not forced to switch characters in NNK2, youll probably be forced to switch characters in FF7R because of the ATB bars, allowing you utilise all the characters unlike NNK2.

Its healthy to be worried, but to also have hope.

[Flewid638]

Any game that isnt turn based is mashing?

What? lmao.

[EliteComments123]

lmao

[bluefox755]

Even though I'd rather it be turn based, I'm not opposed to real time, just hope it's better than FF15's battle system, which I wasn't really a fan of. But yeah, not a dealbreaker for me. I love the combat in the Tales games for instance, so I wouldn't be opposed to something like that.

[AK91]

In Nomura original vision for FF Versus 13 (which ended up becoming FF 15) the combat was meant to be more like the fight scenes in Advent Children but in gameplay format I can tell from the gameplay it’s more action orientated like FF Versus 13 was meant to be, I just hope it controls as good as it looks.

[maximumspidey]

if you don't wanna play ff7 remake because it's not turn based then good. maybe they could've made it something else like ff13 but no one's trying to do boring old turn based anymore

[Acecalibur]

I would have preferred FFX style. My personal favorite.

[pietro1212]

That would be regression. The original FFVII used an ATB system why on earth would the remake use a CTB system?

[Lexreborn2]

Purest always think Progress is a bad thing

[Jalapeno]

I thought FFXV's combat system was decent enough and it was probably released like this so they could improve that combat system in time for FFVII.

I loved FFVII in 1997 when I was 18 years old and had plenty of time to kill. Today, I wouldn't have that much time and that is why I appreciated FFXV.

[Bleucrunch]

why not have both, I believe FFX-2 had both options. NO need to reinvent the wheel since this is just a remake.

[pietro1212]

Wait and active mode in an ATB based system isn't the same as being an action rpg. Who knows though maybe Square can learn from their mistakes from FFXV and KH3 battle and actually incorporate some depth to the gameplay

[Bleucrunch]

Square has disappointed this Gen more than excite so I am confident that they will screw this up royally some how. Kingdom Hearts is a great example, who the hell made the decisions at Sqaure for a franchise like Kingdom hearts to be so forgotten like it has been.

They been losing their mojo for over a decade now since their peak during the PS2 era...damn shame but I do not feel sorry for their silly decisions, they will screw up this remake for sure with foolishness or trying to appease causal fans....,

[gamertk421]

Good, can't stand turn based games. This will be much more enjoyable for me.

[AceRimmer302]

Cuz you're a moron.

[Pedantic91]

And yet the original still exists. It did not magically vanish with the announcement of this remake.

Keeping it turn based would not have prevented the articles from lambasting SE for not letting go of a 20+ year old combat system and appealing to nostalgia.
And it wont prevent so called opinion pieces when it reads far more like a sensational hit piece like "Final Fantasy is dead to me and Persona sits on its grave" designed to pull in clicks.

That to me is rather ironic.

[EliteComments123]

I just need to be able to play as all characters, also keep it true to the original.

[bananacrust]

Idk man everyone I knew in the upper midwest loved RPG's and super mario RPG was sold out at all the stores back then so idk wtf this fools talking about.

[quent]

so is everyone excited and hyped for this ff7 remake that's not ff7 ?

[quent]

Final Fantasy:Sonic Edition

[kayoss]

Be nice if they give the option for turn base or action. But again, I’m day dreaming.

[Npugz7]

Turn based is fucking stupid!!

[thwolf94]

We haven't even been shown the battle systems yet.

[thwolf94]

We haven't even seen the battle systems yet. What is in the command menu?

[Artemidorus]

Need to see how detailed the story is, hope it's not a rushed cash grab.

[loxim]

I really hope it doesn't play like FFXV combat. That was already bad/boring enough not being able to control every and choose when things happen. All they needed to do was update the graphics and leave the rest alone, maybe add some new content like I've heard rumors about.