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New PS5 Backward Compatibility Patent Filed By Sony Tries To Emulate Bus Operation Of Legacy Devices

The patent was published yesterday and is registered to Sony Interactive Entertainment. It further lists one of the inventors to be Mark Cerny, the lead architect of the PS4. Cerny is assumed to be leading development of the PS5 as well.

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1180d ago Replies(5)
ArchangelMike1180d ago

I hope it means we'll get 4K enhanced backwards compatible PS2 games. I would love to play Herdy Gerdy again! https://www.youtube.com/wat...

GaboonViper1179d ago

I wanna play the Getaway again.

Lore1179d ago

Yup also waiting for that 8 Days Re-reveal

SkatterBrain1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

Midnight Club 3 Dub Edition Remix, this ,i need This in 4K

Godmars2901179d ago

Can you even do several upgrade levels of graphics from a base of 480p?

Kribwalker1179d ago

The OneX does and it’s prefty amazing

Atticus_finch1179d ago

Krib I don't think the x can run Ps2 games.

solidossnakos1179d ago

Atticus
Pretty sure he means first xbox

ILostMyMind1179d ago

No, you would need a remastering treatment like MS does in XB.

ZeroX98761179d ago

after seeing what MS did with the Xbox One BC of the first Xbox, I'm seriously hoping that Sony can do something similar to it. I don't have big hopes for PS3 titles being BC on PS5, but just PS4 titles and I would be happy. PS2 and PS1 shouldn't be too hard to implement with the extra hardware performance they'll gain with the next gen console.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 1179d ago
fr0sty1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

Rendering a ps2 game at 4k would look like a blurry mess unless than re-created every texture for the game for 4k resolution. The geometry will be 4k (though blocky by today's standards), the textures, not so much.

UltraNova1179d ago

Without new textures the image will look like a soup gone bad..in 4K.

tontontam01179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

The good thing is if you actually read the article before talking like you know everything, you would've seen that a possible solution regarding the textures is stated in the article.

fr0sty1179d ago

The good thing is, I did read the article, and HD texture packs have been talked about many times before, however they will only get released for the most popular games, most will still have sub-SD textures.

starchild1179d ago

It still looks better than running those games at low resolutions. Using PS2 emulators on PC I'm able to play my PS2 games at very high resolutions and it definitely makes them look a lot better.

traumadisaster1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

Where do you get your first hand experience from this? I've been 4k gaming for years on pc and one of my hobbies is getting old games to render at high resolution, so I've seen a lot.

These old games will never compete with new games, surly you understand this. Old games at high resolution gives a little bump for fans of the original, it is better. Textures and extra processing from the system are also nice.

It's already a blurry mess, but increasing resolution helps, not hurts as you seem to say not to give us better resolution if we can't have better textures??? Take what you can get man.

Cobra9511179d ago

Just take a look at what has been achieved in the 8-16-bit-console emulation scene. There are a multitude of upscaling filters which range from simple softening to CRT emulation to smart sharpening through interpolation. And those creative people aren't even pros. Do you really think Sony will let upscaled old games look like "a blurry mess"?

rainslacker1179d ago

They filed a patent about 6 months ago which allowed for upgrading without changing the original code. Basically acted as an intermediary to a new set of assets whenever an original set was used from the storage medium.

That said, could just be a simple matter of upscaling, and not every game would need to have tons of enhancements, because you'll get more support if you don't require work to actually release a BC title, assuming publisher approval is needed. I play DVD's sometimes, and the TV has no problem upscaling them, and often even makes them look better, so it's not absolutely vital that work be put into them. Same thing when you watch over the air TV which still might broadcast older shows in 480.

tontontam01178d ago (Edited 1178d ago )

"The good thing is, I did read the article, and HD texture packs have been talked about many times before, however they will only get released for the most popular games, most will still have sub-SD textures."

I don't get what you are trying to point out.

Are you trying to say you want devs to do extra work for you on all of the games you have for free?

or you don't want BC and prefer remasters or remake?

or do you know some secret hidden technology that can magically upscale all the assets of an old game?

or you are just trying to shit on what sony is doing?

+ Show (5) more repliesLast reply 1178d ago
Dirtnapstor1179d ago

I would prefer to stick with the b/c of PS4 games. My issue is rendering resolutions onto a 1080p or 4K TV. I can play PS1 & 2 games on my PS3. They look like crap on my big TV, whereas if I plug into a small 24”er, they look pretty good. I would expect similar visual quality issues stepping down from the P5 to the PS3 or 2 level.

Cobra9511179d ago

That's one of the multiple issues 4K has. Very little content that we care about was designed for that many pixels. Personally, I think if you must have a 4K screen, then it needs to have stellar upscaling algorithms baked right in. (If lower resolutions "look like crap", it doesn't qualify.)

remixx1161179d ago

Klonoa 2 luteana's veil for me, can't wait!!!

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 1178d ago
Razzer1180d ago

Pretty much confirms BC for PS5, imo. PS4 at the minimum, obviously, but the real question is what "legacy" consoles will be "emulated" as the article suggests? I'm not suggesting PS3, but PS1 and PS2? Will it allow to run from disc? Still a lot of questions.

badz1491179d ago

the PS2 would be nice. and they can sell those PS2 classics again on PS Store for $10 each or something. I don't reckon they are gonna make the PS5 reads PS2 discs natively

UltraNova1179d ago

3.99/ps1, 6.99 /ps2, 9.99 /ps3

solidossnakos1179d ago

I think its more of licensing the game again problem
For example most music in games is licensed for couple of years

TheRacingX1179d ago

Why not? SONY fanboys have been rebuying PS1 & PS2 games over and over again since the PS3....remove back compat on PS3 , buy them again........added "acheivements" on the same games for the PS4...buy them again.....added PS5-ness to make them playable ...... buy them again..... SONY has become a cash grab.... free online play, now incorporated into PS+ for $60....back compat PS3/2/1 games... worked into PS now for $20 or whatever a month..... among other things

remixx1161179d ago Show
rainslacker1179d ago

@TheRacingX

And if the option was available on 360 last gen, Xbox fan boys would be doing it as well. Very few games were released through PS2 classics, and work had to be put in to add achievements, so it's not exactly like you are describing. Also, PS1 games were playable without having to buy them on every PS3, so if they were rebrought, that was either because people didn't have them, or just wanted a digital copy.

This gen, there haven't been enough remasters or re-releases to really say it's something that Sony is milking the customers on, because realistically, Sony would make more money if they offered up BC through digital, because they'd make money off PSN sales. But that big of logic often is lost on those who claim Sony is trying to use PSNow for BC, or insinuate that Sony is releasing tons of remasters, which they really aren't.

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TheUndertaker851179d ago

If PS4 is any indication this is likely not for disc based support. PS4 chose to eliminate out the CD diode in its Blu-Ray drive resulting in no possibility of PSOne disc based compatibility. DVD support was also an afterthought on PS4, not added until after launch.

Razzer1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

This isn’t about PS4 so none of that is even relevant, now is it?

darthv721179d ago

@razzer, it means if Sony uses the same lasers in the 5 as they did the 4 then it would have limited scope of BC support for PS2 (DVD only) games. And no CD diode means no PS1 disc games at all.

TheUndertaker851179d ago

@Razzer: Yeah, right? The removal of the CD diode to cut costs over having more functionality with the current console definitely holds no relevance to the next console. /s

Plus PlayStation fans such as yourself have been going on about not needing “old content”, even disregarding the fact PS4 has no CD diode for physical CD playback. The same CDs that PSOne titles were pressed on. Further DVD wasn’t available on PS4 out of the box showing how much priority they put on DVD.

PS2 titles were pressed on DVD discs.

So please do tell me. How is it irrelevant to point out that 1) Sony moved away from CD and fans chalked it up to “old games” 2) Sony was already shying away from DVD early in the gen and 3) That if PS5 has no CD diode like PS4 doesn’t and they choose to get rid of the DVD diode as well to cut down costs again as they’ve done then physical content will literally be impossible

And if that’s not enough:
“I'm not suggesting PS3, but PS1 and PS2? Will it allow to run from disc?”
Sure not relevant to questions you yourself asked. 🙄

rainslacker1179d ago

You make assumptions that it will be digital with nothing other than one case of the CD Diode not being included in the PS4's laser assembly, then criticize others who also make an assumption that they might include it.

Seems kind of hypocritical of you.

Plus, there is nothing to say they didn't include the proper laser spectrum in the laser itself, because all BR diodes should be capable of it. They just didn't enable it on the hardware level, and to date, there has been no verification if the PS4 laser could read CD's or not. I thought it wasn't for a while, which is why I said PS2 BC may also be troublesome, because some PS2 games were released on CD.

You may be right that it may be digital only, but it's still assumption about what Sony might do. It's even an assumption that Sony will bother with BC in the PS5.

TheUndertaker851179d ago

@rainslacker: “You make assumptions that it will be digital with nothing other than one case of the CD Diode not being included in the PS4's laser assembly”
Uh, where once did I say anything about digital only? The Blu-Ray diode will likely still be present for PS4/PS5 games. PS3 games will likely remain a pain. However if Sony includes backwards compatibility for PSOne they either have to include in a diode they chose to leave out to keep costs lower or they can offer digital only. With Sony also shying away from DVD at launch one could gather they really didn’t take the DVD format seriously either for current gen. As this gen has advanced too PlayStation owners in particular have said they don’t need nor use such old content or formats anyway. So to cut costs again there’d be no reason not to remove the DVD diode from a corporate perspective.

“Plus, there is nothing to say they didn't include the proper laser spectrum in the laser itself, because all BR diodes should be capable of it.”
Yes, there is. Check components listed as being a part of PS4. There is no CD capability in the PS4 Blu-Ray drive. Again, simply to cut costs. Plus did you just try to tell someone how things are then say “should”? Should does not equal do and if you look up Blu-Ray drives you will find out that some variations support CD, DVD, and Blu-Ray. Some support all those and 4K. Some, however, drop CD support or DVD support. Some drives support strictly Blu-Ray. That’s not how it should be, that’s how it is.

I don’t find it hypocritical to point out Sony’s choices so far as a basis for their decisions going forward. They prioritized cutting costs a little and it cost them physical CD support along with any physical PSOne titles. As you said as well it cost them more because even some PS2 games were pressed on CD.

Not to mention the message has been it’s more lucrative and profitable for them to stick with a “remake”, “remaster”, or “classic” kind of model.

I do agree with you on that however. I don’t see a single guarantee of backwards compatibility on PS5. Fans have said they don’t want it or use it. Then it’s better for Sony to stick with the model they have now from a corporate perspective. The fans are saying they’re happy without it, the company gains more profits.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 1179d ago
Mystogan1179d ago

I thought PS fans don't want to play old games? 🤔

Foxhound9221179d ago

Don't think anyone ever said that but keep trying to move the goal posts. PS fans have been saying that playing old games is a nice feature but a very insignificant compared to having new, exciting exclusives.

Elda1179d ago

Personally for me BC is a plus but not needed,when the PS5 releases I'm buying day one with or without BC.

Dark_Knightmare21179d ago

I don’t think that’s what ps fans said but you knew that. I don’t care about playing older games really but it will be a nice feature to have in the beginning of the gen when game releases are few and far between.

tontontam01179d ago

I play old games once in a while when I feel like it, xbox fanboys play old games because they have no other choice.

TheSaint1179d ago

Going to need you to prove that.

badz1491179d ago

TROLL much? all I heard from the most vocal PS fanboys, at least on this site, is "BC is not a selling feature for PS4", "BC is not going to make the xbone outsell the PS4" and "BC is good to have but far from a must-have".

I play old games all the time despite the PS4 having no BC. the millions of PS3 sold didn't just stop working after Sony launched the PS4, you know. If I'm THAT poor that I don't have big enough space to fit 2 consoles, I can't afford gaming to begin with where I live. the PS3 is still the better media player than the PS4 too. so there's still a reason to keep it turned on aside from playing its games.

personally, I will keep the same narrative with the PS5. BC is nice to have and it's looking like Sony is seriously considering it now with all these patents, but it's definitely not one of the features that will tick me off from buying if it's not there day 1. PS is about the games and I haven't been let down since the PS2.

p/s: I can't wait for Medievil.

starchild1179d ago

Actually, Foxhound922, some people did say that. That they don't care about playing old games. Others tried to downplay it by saying "just keep your old console" or a variety of other silly things. The overall message from them was it's basically an unimportant feature that does next to nothing to make platforms like PC and Xbox One more attractive.

I'm not saying every PS4 owner was saying those things because there were a number of PS4 owners, including myself, who were saying it's an important feature that we would like to have. But the majority of hardcore Sony fanboys on this site most definitely were downplaying it to the point of insignificance. To say otherwise is pure revisionist history BS.

DerekTweed1179d ago

@Foxhound922

I've seen lots of people say exactly that in articles about Xbox Backwards Compatibility.

Z5011179d ago

If PS fanS said that. You would surely have links to sources.
...i'll wait

Razzer1179d ago

"But the majority of hardcore Sony fanboys on this site most definitely were downplaying it to the point of insignificance. To say otherwise is pure revisionist history BS."

There is no way you can actually back that statement up so how can there be "revisionist history" of something you haven't even established to be true other than just pulling it out of your ass?

Mystogan1179d ago

I love how yall are acting stupid now. As if you didn't agree with this guy.
https://thekoalition.com/vi...

Mystogan1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

Comments here, most are defending him. Those that are for BC get disagrees.
http://n4g.com/news/2066596...

And look at the disagrees to those that are against him.
https://n4g.com/news/206509...

Razzer1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

lol....what point do you think you are making exactly? Just generalizing PS fans? Posting a link and yapping "look at the agrees/disagrees!" is just silly and ignorant.

salmonade1179d ago

Not PS3 or older. But PS4? Of course we want to play PS4 games. Now get lost

Outside_ofthe_Box1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

@Mystogan

The links you provided actually proves foxhounds922's point.

No one is saying that they "***don't*** ***want*** to play old games" like you are saying/generalizing.
They're saying exactly what Foxhound922 said "playing old games is a nice feature but a very insignificant compared to having new, exciting exclusives"

If you want to say that is 'downplaying' it, I guess you have a point, but to say that they are saying that they 'don't want it at all' is false.

@starchild

***"But the majority of hardcore Sony fanboys on this site most definitely were downplaying it to the point of insignificance. To say otherwise is pure revisionist history BS."***

How about this, I'll agree that it is revisionist history if you admit that 'the majority of hardcore MS fanboys on this site most definitely were downplaying exclusives to the point of insignificance and to say otherwise is pure revisionist history BS' too.
Because I could literally take exactly what you wrote in your first paragraph about PS fans and BC to say the same about MS fans and exclusives to paint the same picture and I would be using your own words and not mine to prove the point, so you'd have no choice but to agree lol.

Smitty20201179d ago

i play loads of old games n my sega n snes get used alot

chiefJohn1171179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

PS fans did say that exact thing y'all can't deny it. Lol look at nightmare he said ps fans never said that then his very next sentence is "I don't care about playing older games" 😂

I'm not letting y'all getting away with this I said it before, when the ps5 announce BC I better not see y'all celebrating lol. surprise surprise look what I see. 🥞 flipping that pancake lol "just keep your old console" "who wants to play old games?"

darthv721179d ago

@salmon... then play them on the PS4. Like many other PS fans have said in respect to BC (or lack thereof).

shinoff21831179d ago

Pretty sure no one said that. I think alot was pointed out that the only reason x did it was to try and underhand sony, and the fact they didnt have much else going for them this generation. They didnt listen to fans, they were losing their asses so they hail married.

Razzer1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

"PS fans did say that exact thing y'all can't deny it"
"Like many other PS fans...."

Oh....since we are generalizing like morons then Xbox fans said exclusives don't matter, now didn't they? And yet MS has all these new studios that "ya'll" brag about. So "ya'll" seem to be flip-flopping just as much, huh?

That kind of talk is just so ignorant. All these broad fanboy generalizations. Somehow you actually believe all PS fans are 100% against BC entirely, huh? Well.....that is just your own ignorance on display.

Yui_Suzumiya1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

Bet you also think all PS fans throw their old console out the window or down the stairs the minute they buy a new console. Lol

S2Killinit1179d ago

I think you xbox fans are confusing issues. Its nice to have BC (especially for a library like PS4’s) but its not a replacement for quality games.

rainslacker1179d ago

I thought MS fans kept repeating your argument and being corrected on it for years now too only to act ignorant the next time the topic comes up to try and insinuate that PS fans are hypocrites because they have no better argument about the topic than to try and insult PS fans.

Only one of us thought right though. And it isn't you.

Juvia1179d ago

No one ever said that, dummy.

Thundercat771179d ago

You don't understand. BC is a good feature AT THE START of a new console because it helps the transition. Once that console have a strong library. BC doesn't matter.

starchild1179d ago

@razzer

I'm not interested in trying to prove anything to people like you. No weight of logic or facts could ever convince you of anything. Ideologues already have their mind made up. Rational, open-minded people will want to know the truth and they'll go dig up the previous articles themselves or probably have already noticed it themselves anyway. Many people have.

And yes, we're speaking in general. That's obvious. The majority of people that go around hyping up everything Sony does and bashing other platforms were generally the same people trying to downplay backwards compatibility as a nearly worthless feature. There certainly weren't very many of those people in there telling the other fanboys they were wrong and that it is indeed a great feature they would like to see. There were a few that did, but the majority downplayed it or upvoted those comments.

@S2Killinit
"I think you xbox fans are confusing issues.
Its nice to have BC (especially for a library like PS4’s) but its not a replacement for quality games."

I'm not an Xbox fan. Don't own an Xbox and don't plan to own one. I argue in favor of backwards compatibility because it's a very desirable feature to me. I love it on the PC and I would love to have it on the PS5 too. I always try to stand up for what's right, regardless of platform preferences or any of that.

Your comment is a red herring anyway. I want backwards compatibility and it has nothing to do with what Microsoft is or isn't doing. There's no relationship between having BC and not having good exclusives. It's not like if Microsoft does away with BC they'll suddenly have good exclusives. Their problem in that area is unrelated. And if Sony adds BC it's not like they'll suddenly stop having good exclusives. A person can easily want and value both.

Trying to make excuses for your downplaying of one feature just because you want to arbitrarily pit them against each other as if they were mutually exclusive doesn't make it any better. I want good games (including exclusives) and backwards compatibility. There's no reason we can't have both.

When somebody says something like "backwards compatibility is nice but it's not a selling feature for a platform" they're just trying to talk out of both sides of their mouth. It's a kind of doublespeak. They want to downplay the feature as much as possible in the here and now but still insert words that they can later point back to as proof that they always thought it had value as soon as their favorite platform gets it. But any rational person would recognize that if something is "nice" it has value, and if it has value it most certainly can help sell a platform.

The fact that the PC has backwards compatibility is one of the aspects that sold me on the platform and continues to bring me back to it. I would never call something "nice" and then turn around and say it's basically insignificant and has no bearing on my purchasing decision. That's just contradictory gibberish.

derek1179d ago

I'm a ps fan and I never play old gen games once I get the latest console, which I'll be getting day 1.

+ Show (24) more repliesLast reply 1179d ago
Profchaos1179d ago

Theoretically it would be capable of PS3 emulation

conanlifts1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

The other question is will they allow you to port your digital catalogue for free, or will they charge you.

JackBNimble1179d ago

Why would they charge you to play games from your existing library?
It would surely hurt the brand to pull a stunt like that.

MrVux0001179d ago

"Will it allow to run from disc?"

This is the main concern for me aswell. While i do have a fair share of digital games for my PS4, the majority of games are still physical.

ILostMyMind1179d ago

I think so for PS4 games. For others, just digital.

thexmanone1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

There will be BC, but it will be through a paid service. That's why there is PSNow.

Razzer1179d ago (Edited 1179d ago )

PS Now is transforming into a service like Game Pass so nope.