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Project xCloud is a faulty solution to a problem Switch has already solved

— Nintendo Enthusiast:

Microsoft's upcoming Project xCloud game-streaming service sounds interesting, but can it really be more convenient than the Nintendo Switch?

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Godmars2904d ago

MS's doing what others have done before, yet its being hyped as an "innovation".

AspiringProGenji3d ago

Lol sounds just like Apple nowadays

Eidolon3d ago

Who's saying it's innovative?

Godmars2903d ago

The ones insisting that what MS does will bring a new era to gaming while ignoring that streaming has been a thing for years.

DeadManMMX3d ago

Because they are using new tech to do it. They’ve been working on this for years and waited to release it until they thought it was ready and doable. Sony bought gai kai branded it and launched it within one year to pretty subpar results. Now PSNow I taking cues Friday m games pass. It al goes around but this is something they’ve been working on most of the last decade.

Godmars2903d ago

@DeadManMMX:
Just like Kinect and using cloud servers for graphics weren't announced too early? Lived up to advertised hype?

conanlifts3d ago

Not exactly no. Game streaming suffers from latency issues. MS are trying to develop a way to stream games by massively reducing or even eliminating the latency issues. This is not currently being done. So yes streaming has been done, but the technology to stream without any lag/latency problems does not exist yet. This is what MS are trying to do.

The real question should be can they actually do it.

sinspirit3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

Deamdman
Conanlifts

Just listen to yourselves. MS is "innovating" by trying to get rid of latency for streaming? You're saying it "hasn't been done"? Seriously? You think no other streaming service is improving latency?? You just eat up MS PR like it's special.
Oh, and they're late to the game. Don't spin that as them waiting when the time is right.

How do we always have people act like everyone but MS is complacent, yet MS never delivers, has the worst track record, and always talks of innovation while not actually doing it.

conanlifts3d ago

@sinspirit

"How do we always have people act like everyone but MS is complacent, yet MS never delivers, has the worst track record, and always talks of innovation while not actually doing it."

You tagged me so I will respond. I never said anyone was complacent. As for ms innovating and you disagreeing I never said they were. But if they get rid of latency for streaming then it will be innovative, but they need to do it first. They are trying to do it, let's see if they can.
As for the final bit of your comment about ms never delivering. B/C for Xbox 360, original Xbox games, free X enhancements of older games, play anywhere are examples of them delivering. What they lack are games of the same quality that Sony produces.
So let's see if they can do this and if not then let's criticise this as an empty promise.

Zeref3d ago

wait where can i play halo and red dead redemption on my phone?

gangsta_red3d ago

@godmars

"The ones insisting ....."

Who are these people? Have you tried it yourself compared to the competition? Where is this hype as an "innovation"? Or is it just regular news reporting on a story?

Godmars2903d ago

@gangsta_red:
Regular news stories reporting on a something not yet released but set to upturn the industry. The exact same flavor of stories that surrounded the Kinect and cloud distribution - when the XB1 initial launch.

this is virtually a new article about MS's cloud distribution, only how it innovate streaming rather than graphics.

chiefJohn1173d ago

The delusions again lol someone must be intimidated. I haven't seen one person call it innovative

rainslacker3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

@Conan

And yet MS hasn't proficiently explained how they've reduced lag as lag is mostly a problem outside their control. Their servers are plenty fast, but so are PSNow servers. Do a tracert to the servers, and you see the problem exists not from their servers, but in all the network hops in the path to the user and the server.

MS said they have predictive technology on what will happen next, but have in no way explained how that is relevant to reducing lag, because the servers would still have to wait for the user data to reach the server before sending it back. Unless it's like MMO's, where what the user sees is rendered and drawn before user data is received or server data is sent back. For anyone that's played MMO's, they'd know that that often leads to glitches where what we see onscreen jumps around as the server updates with current variables, and the client catches up.

I dunno about anyone else, but this doesn't sound any better than the lag that is present in current implementations, as it leads to a cascading effect of corrective inputs to remedy, and isn't how games are typically played and could lead to actual detrimental experiences if those corrective actions end up with frustrating deaths for unintended results.

At least with the inperceivable lag that exists on a decent connection through PSNow, the issue of lag is usually not a hindrance to actual game play.

They've also not explained how they're going to push more video data over less bandwidth, as there has been no major advancement in compression or streaming technology, and if there were, every streaming service would be using it, as MS would already be selling it for lots of money, and not saving it for xCloud which is likely to net them less money in the short term.

Lots of things that MS claims they will provide, and the media happy to say its great, and some people more than willing to accept it at face value, but not a single person asking how they managed to actually do that, when there is no even a single piece of corollary technology available that could make it possible, and current technologies while maybe suitable to solve the lag issue, aren't necessarily as appealing as the alternative. There should be plenty of patents or technical journal discussion about new technologies, but there isn't.

What I want to see before I'm willing to give MS the benefit of the doubt on this topic is some explanation on how they are actually going to achieve this. Or at least, see it in action to see if it actually works as well as they claim it will. I feel the actual market for it, and it's viability is about as relevant as it is for any other similar service, so my opinions on that are the same.

Also, why do people presume that Sony isn't doing anything to reduce lag issues? You think they just started the servers, and didn't do anything after? That's kind of a silly thing to think. But all Sony can do to reduce actual lag is work with ISP's and internet backbone providers to make sure their network paths are as direct as possible.

Sony doesn't need servers that are as robust or ubiquitous as MS. They just need enough to provide the service in a reasonable fashion to as many people as want to use it. Azure is a huge cloud server. It is a better server overall. But there is nothing wrong with PSNow servers, and they've grown it far beyond what Gaikai had. Gaikai was brought for their technology, not their servers. Sony created their own servers, and they've spent more than the initial price on Gaikai, and some marketing + R&D dollars on cursory technologies to make it work.

xenz3d ago

Latency will always be there and will always depend on how good connection you have. Image quality will also always be compressed. These are my reason for not wanting to stream my games.

conanlifts3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

@rainslacker.
I agree with you what have said. My point is simply that ms are supposedly working on eliminating lag. If they do as they claim it will be a first ( unless someone else gets there first). For me I am willing to hold off on the criticism until they release their streaming service. If it fails to achieve the results they claim then I will certainly be pointing it out. But what they are aiming for is a step forward for game streaming. The question is will it work?

Switch4One3d ago

"Just like Kinect and using cloud servers for graphics weren't announced too early? Lived up to advertised hype?"

Yes exactly like that. Nobody is claiming that MS has never jumped the gun when it comes to releasing gaming tech. But that does not take away from the fact that that's what happened to Sony and Gaikai/PS Now.
It's so childish that whenever someone is critical of Sony you people bring up irrelevant instances of MS as if it somehow nullifies Sony's shortcomings.

I mean seriously what does Kinect have to do with a conversation about game streaming and how Sony may have released their version prematurely? Does the failure of Kinect to live up to hype/expectation mean people cannot say anything adverse towards Sony's gaming streaming efforts in an article about game streaming?

Your fanatism for a corporation truly hinders your ability to make logical arguments. It's kinda sad.

Godmars2903d ago (Edited 3d ago )

"I mean seriously what does Kinect have to do with a conversation about game streaming and how Sony may have released their version prematurely?"

Because Kinect wasn't just presented as something MS was doing, but rather something that was going to change the whole of the industry. Now again they - or rather their supporters - are going on and on about how MS will reinvent the game streaming wheel where Sony just put one out.

Whether its Kinect, Zune Internet Explorer or whatever it or anything Windows is called now, MS has a bad habit of making an overambitious statements, showing something off on bleed edge tech meant for general use, saying they'll redefine something only to fall well short. Needing years more to actually develop something if then.

And we are talking about a MS "product". One which the MS fan base are again making excuses for.

Also, I don't give a damn about Sony. Have begun to actually hate the overall direction they've gone with gaming.

StormSnooper3d ago

It wouldn’t be the first time MS does something and makes it sound like it’s never been done before or that what they are doing is something different from what everyone else is also doing.

Realms3d ago

@ DeadManMMX

No they are not what new technology is MS supposedly using? The reason they what to get in on it now is because streaming is becoming more viable with 5G coming but MS hasn't done jack. The proof is that PSNow has improved tremendously but streaming games still has a long way to go if it ever wants to become the main way gamers play games. Sorry folks we are still far from being able to just stream games without any hiccups these MS fanboys always do the same thing MS isn't doing anything innovative other than throwing their hat in the race that has been started long ago.

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GottaBjimmyb3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

Yea, not sure how anyone could say nintendo is doing this. That said, MS is going towards what seems like maybe a netflix style business model on this, which if the content matches the quality and quantity and value of netflix, could be an amazing change in landscape.

I would say the biggest comparison is that Sony literally already has this technology and implementation and if it works well could change their business model to match MS almost overnight. However, Sony is sticking with standard video game sales model and moving them to streaming after the majority of sales are done, which frankly, I hardly see them changing that policy, as they very clearly put far more investment into game development than MS and it shows.

MS seems to be going this route to justify/lessen risk with their game dev budget, though, they may also simultaneously cannibalize their biggest title's profit in doing so. Curious to see how it goes. Think they are hoping for 20 million subscribers vs 2 million purchasers per game. (Random numbers but the general idea)

ProLogY4d ago

Depends on latency.. if it works well it’s much more convenient than the switch.

I carry my phone with me everywhere. I don’t carry my switch everywhere. Being able to play full console quality games without graphical compromise on my phone at anytime is appealing.

Still.. the question of latency remains. So we’ll see.

Eidolon4d ago

Latency is always going to be a problem unless you live and commute in a city with a municipal wireless network, or or a cell data towers everywhere.

conanlifts3d ago

This is what they are trying to solve with compression techniques and predictive algorithms. The tech doesn't exist yet, so they are investing to make it happen. To quote ProLogY "Still.. the question of latency remains. So we’ll see". Only time will tell if they can actually solve the problem.

sprinterboy3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

I couldn't wait until my xperia phone could do remote play, worked fine but the screen with most games I tried was just too small, sounds good on paper but in reality not so much. Tablets, tv sets and laptops I agree but phones was a no no for me. Racing games was too difficult on a phone as was arkham, worked well with platformers though.

Eidolon3d ago

Oh yeah, try playing crash on remote play haha

rainslacker3d ago

Some games are fine on a phone. They can even look great on a small screen. But for some games, I agree, for a game meant for a bigger screen, even if its a small TV, the phone screen can just make everything kind of a jumbled mess.

jukins3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

That's where Microsoft should have the lead with its place in the cloud market its numerous and massive data centers and servers. Even as a huge playstation fan an ps now subscriber I feel Microsoft is better suited to eliminate lag and other issues to a better degree than sony

rainslacker3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

Why do you feel that? How will MS influence the internet providers to give priority to their data, and route their data more directly? Money? That's possible now given net neutrality. But Sony also has the ability to work with ISP's or internet backbone companies to speed up their service. They probably already do, because for streaming services, it actually reduces the overall bandwidth on the internet if certain kinds of data are prioritized over more direct paths.

There is only so much that can be done on the servers themselves, and it's a fallacy that MS can just be faster because of the size of their company. Sony's servers are more than sufficient to provide the content at a reasonable speed. They've proven this. What hasn't been proven is that MS can actually provide a more lag free experience, and MS hasn't explained how they've managed to reduce lag using a predictive algorithm, since the problem has never been the speed of the game on the servers. They haven't explained how they've managed to have a better video streaming algorithm than Sony, and Sony are actually ahead of MS on this front through many other technologies that they have in the company itself. Sony is quite literally a company that invents this kind of stuff. They have a fully fledged and fleshed out video streaming service which is just as good, if not better than anything else out there. Yet some people are saying that MS somehow has a video streaming tech which can push more data through less bandwidth? That makes no sense, and I think a lot of people actually neglect that fact about Sony, because they can't look past PlayStation.

wonderfulmonkeyman3d ago

Don't forget the question of battery drain, too.
Most phones just aren't built for the kinds of console games we play, unlike the switch.

ProLogY3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

xCloud is a streaming service, the phone itself isn’t rendering the game. So I would expect the battery to last roughly as long as it does when you stream Netflix or YouTube on your phone.

Zeref3d ago

Also you know Red Dead Redemption 2 is not coming to the Switch. With this* you can get all these impossible AAA games on the Switch. Thats what I'm most excited about,

*There are strong rumors that it is coming to the Switch

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 3d ago
slavish04d ago

Lmao... Basically, you don't want Nintendo to have competition.😖... Got it😱

Zeref3d ago

It's not even that. This service is heavily rumored to launch on the Switch as well lol

slavish03d ago (Edited 3d ago )

Lol... Ok 🙄
U know rumors are different than facts🤔