BioShock PS3 dev: 'Blu-ray hasn't made much difference'

Sony's Blu-ray technology "hasn't made much difference" to the upcoming PS3 version of stupendously great 360 and PC FPS BioShock, the game's associate producer has told VideoGamer.com.

[Le-mo]

Of course not, as a developer it's in their best interest to keep the versions the same.

[UNCyrus]

they got the quote wrong... "(we didn't utilize its potential, so) blu-ray hasn't made much difference"

[InMyOpinion]

"In terms of specific things, it hasn't made much difference. The original game fit on a 360 disk so it wasn't like we were in need of room. We've tried to do what we can to make sure that the PS3 looks just as great as the 360, but in terms of necessarily utilising something specific about Blu-ray, to my knowledge, Blu-ray hasn't necessarily made a huge difference."

[DARKKNIGHT]

LOL. thats because its a port. A port which was kept timed exclusive for a long time. why would they make it better? thy made their bread. I dont understand how people post this FUD. Why compare a port? lets compare heavyhitters this fall. then well see what the verdict is. I know the answer, but i wont state it due to it being my personal opinion and i dont wanna offend anyone.

edit: lookits the 3 amigos hitting disagree. I wonder who that is? mart/firstknight/pog= same person...

[Bangladesh]

It has more to do with devs being forced to use redundant data to compensate for the ps3's slow read speed. It would seem like if Sony had really wanted blu-ray to revolutionize gaming this gen, they would have put something better than a 2x speed BR player in the ps3. Sadly, instead gamers have gotten redundant data and mandarory installs(wtf 25gb of space on the disc), when they should have had epic 100-200 hr games.
http://www.joystiq.com/2007...
http://arstechnica.com/jour...

This isn't suprising because of the methods devs must take to make a game run properly on the ps3.

[Winter47th]

You think? porting a game from a last-gen format ' 9 gigs DVD' to a next-gen '50 gigs Blue-Ray' won't make much of a difference cause, well, your efforts are last-gen-ish.

[HowarthsNJ]

Redundant data can be found on DVD as well. Oblivion being a good example.

[DARKKNIGHT]

This is pointless. Like i said before, THIS FALL is where the show is at. Comparing 1 year old software is pretty worthless when the big guns are around the corner. publisher is either begging for hits or tryna start sumthin

[Idonthatejustcreate]

Bangladesh we are talking about the sheer amount of content you can put on the blueray disc not the speed of it. If they had utilize the blueray to the max they could have extended the gameplay of bioshock by approximetly 280%.

But here you are bashing on the ps3 again with every chance you get. Some people just can't be unbiased but I guess there's an ignore button for a reason...

[rexor0717]

Like they are going to do more than port it to have so much more. It will look better, but not so much better.

[Bangladesh]

Are you saying that no ps3 games have mandatory installs? Are you saying that the average ps3 game is an epic game of 25gb worth of space? Because it would be lieing if it is. 25gb!! That's 5 times more space than it takes to make an average game.

@just create
So you guys are talking about something that the ps3 can't possibly do? That doesn't make sense.

[Freckler]

Bangladesh is right mates, what he said has been common knowledge for over a year now. Some of you must be new to this generation.

[PopEmUp]

finally you have a decent post bubble for you but not yet I need to see more of those comments coming from you, not some fanboish comments you've made in the past

[Tweedy]

Can a guy make a point and back it up with proof and get bullied with disagrees.

Nice point Bangladesh.

[whoelse]

When its just a port with a few minor improvements, obviously Blu-ray is less important.

[HowarthsNJ]

No. I said Blu-ray being slow is a myth.

It's slightly slower than a single layer DVD 9, but equal to or slightly faster than a Double layer DVD 9.

Most if not all disc based 360 games are double layer DVD 9 with the game content not exceeding 6.7 GBs stored on the faster read areas of the DVD. MS's hidden files fill the rest of the disc.

Blu-ray can equal or better the performance of Dual layered DVD 9.

Ms Miller from 2K has been spouting the same mantra about Bioshock PS3 for months even though the game was passed on to another developer for the finishing touches.

I don't think she would be the one to go to about the final product on blu-ray. Even if they are able to lessen the compression by a few GBs that would be an improvement over DVD 9.

http://www.videogamer.com/n...

[Bangladesh]

I think that you are bending things alot.
http://www.maxconsole.net/?...

[iceman2885]

That quote from the article hit the nail on the head.

I've never heard of people talking about blu-ray improving the game by anything other than allowing the developer to include more data on a disc and thus make the game bigger, more detailed, etc...

So logically, if the game already fit onto a smaller disc, what benefit would the blu-ray provide? Unless the developer wants to go into the original game and add in more gameplay or detail than the orignal game, then the blu-ray really doesn't make that much of a difference.

I hope that made sense.

[DJ]

Let's see what Bethesda has to say about the "Redundant Data" blu-ray myth:

"Bethesda's Pete Hines also commented that recent reports of data duplication on the PS3 Oblivion disc have been exaggerated, and this technique isn't different from the Similar Strategy that was employed in the creation of the Xbox 360 Game last year."

http://www.gamespot.com/ps3...

Data duplication has been employed ever since the release of the PS1. If you have the space, use it.

[HowarthsNJ]

I used this guy's research:

http://forum.beyond3d.com/s...

Single Layer DVD is 1.57MB per second Faster than Single Layer Blu-ray at data transfer (on average).

Dual Layer DVD is 1.07MB per second Slower than Single Layer Blu-ray at data transfer (on average).

[Armyless]

I can't believe this article is "news" to anyone.

If you copy a "floppy" to a CD, the CD extra space hasn't made much difference.

Port.

I have 2 questions for the developer.
1) Why are you even using Blu-Ray to print your PORT of the game for the PS3? Why not just give them a DVD too?
2) If every console had next-gen storage, do you think the development of this game would have stopped at DVD capacity?

[BoBo33]

From what I've read and seen with my own two eyes, what Bangladesh posted is FACT. How many ps3 games do you have installed right now? The publically revealed reason for these installs is to help load times. And what is the cause of slow load times? A slow read speed. And what is another method besides installs to help load times? Duplicate data.

Hey atleast the ps3's puny 2x speed drive is whisper quiete.

[DJ]

Because every PS3 comes with an internal hard drive that developers can, and should use. Hard Drives stream data exponentially faster than disc-based media, whether you're talking about CDs, DVDs, or Blu-ray.

It essentially eliminates load times, the bane of videogames, while also retaining the graphical and audio fidelity that current-gen games require. Also Bobo, it's important to understand that Slow Load Times are only partially reliant on data streaming off a storage device.

The second factor is system architecture (bandwidth, CPU speed, etc).

The third factor is proper programming.

[Expy]

"It has more to do with devs being forced to use redundant data to compensate for the ps3's slow read speed. It would seem like if Sony had really wanted blu-ray to revolutionize gaming this gen, they would have put something better than a 2x speed BR player in the ps3. Sadly, instead gamers have gotten redundant data and mandarory installs(wtf 25gb of space on the disc), when they should have had epic 100-200 hr games."

John Carmack would completely disagree... which really puts you in the dust. You'll see, with his next game, RAGE, that the additional space will be an issue going down the road this gen, he's stated himself that Blu-Ray is PS3's big advantage.

[gameplayer]

Look, Blu-ray's strength is it's space. It's Achille's heel (at 2x Blu-ray speed vs 12x DVD speed) is it's read speed. Period. (It has nothing to do with the 2x being a smaller number than 12x for people that don't know much about the two standards)

1. Blu-ray is a Constant Linear Velocity device. This is done because the drive is only capable of reading data up to a certain threshold (DVD started it's life like this also) so the disc spins slower and slower as it reads data farther and farther out from the center of the disc. The big point here is that the disc has to physically spin faster and slower to read from different areas. It takes milliseconds for the read head to move to a different part of the disc but it takes dozens of milliseconds for the disc to speed up or slow down causing a lag for each file read. This is why developers are forced to replicate data all over the disc to physically put the data for each area of the game close together on the disc. This helps minimize the effect and keeps it from being hundreds of extra milliseconds vs dozens of extra milliseconds but those milliseconds add up, and quickly. It has forced many developers to install games on the ps3's hard drive instead. Ironically, the larger the level on a Blu-ray disc, the worse the data lag because it uses up a larger section of the disc.

2. DVD is a Constant Angular Velocity device. It always spins at the same speed so data is read faster as you move closer to the outside of the disc. This eliminates the extra lag created by having to speed up and slow down how fast the disc is spinning. The problem with the fanboys is they always compare blu-ray to the AVERAGE read speed of DVD. This is retarded. Games are MASTERED. This means that the game data for levels are placed at the outside of the disc where the read speed is fastest and things like music, cutscenes, menus etc are placed along the inside of the disc where the read speed is slower. Furthermore, if a game is 6Gb instead of the full 8.5Gb capacity of the disc, then the inside area of the disc is filled with useless data so all of the game data is as far from the center as possible and the maximum read speed is >>ALWAYS<< reached. This is BASIC stuff guys. Mastering techniques have been used for almost as long as DVD has existed and if a developer didn't use them, it would be considered INCOMPETENT. Like fire my @ss I'm so eff'ing stupid incompetent.

There is no doubt in my mind that Blu-ray will become faster than DVD as the technology ramps up over time (actually I think that the next generation drives will in fact be faster) but the PS3 will always have a 2x Blu-ray drive and the 360 will always have a 12x DVD drive and a 2x Blu-ray drive will always be slower than a 12x DVD drive(disc mastering is a given assumption).

And for the love of god people, it's >>BLU-RAY<< not blueray or blue-ray .

Edit
DJ, data replication is a common mastering technique aswell which minimizes lag caused by minimizing movement of the read head (and changing disc speed for Blu-ray). Peter Hines didn't lie here, it is common industry practice.

[DJ]

Yeah, exactly what I was saying. It's a common industry practice that dates WAY back, and a clever one at that.

[Montrealien]

yet another article to get people up in arms for nothing. I`m just happy people that could not enjoy this game on the 360 will have a chance to on the PS3 now. We all know both consoles are very comparable in the gfx department, no storage medium will ever change that.

[thebudgetgamer]

so somebodys lying

[Montrealien]

Mr Carmack said he needed 3 discs for the same result and didn`t want to pay royalties for it, so someone is missunderstanding. ;D

[popup]

The fact that the dev says "The original game fit on a 360 disk so it wasn't like we were in need of room" said it all! If they had quadrupled the size of the game and added an hour of HD footage then I imagine it would be advantageous to have Blu-Ray for the PS3 version. This is called common sense if you understand this and delusional paranoia if you don't.

Can't everyone just save for all the consoles and just talk about the games instead? :)

[Ateanboy]

OFCOURSE it hasn't made much difference!!!
The game was initially created to fit on 1 DVD!!!
If the game where to have been made from scratch on the PS3, and it wasn't just a port, then they would be saying something quite different!

DUH!

[Beast_Master]

Wasn't the original game built using the unreal engine as well. Unreal and PS3 do not make a good match (Turok, Unreal 3) which is why so many developers are now either building their own engines or buying other ones other than epics.

[DaTruth]

Is 12x a unit of speed? Or is it 12* faster than original DVD speed. Isn't it possible that they didn't judge the Blu-ray disk speed from the original 1998 DVD speed and are actually judging it on the original BR-disk read speed, thus 2x 2006 tech speed.
Not to mention that the information is in a smaller space due to the size of the laser beam, so likely reading more at a slower speed which would explain why the read speeds are so close(not including X-box fanboy angry about HD-DVD information sites).

[iamtehpwn]

It was a game Designed for a single DVD9.
Of course bluray isn't making much of a difference in this case.
But as MGS4 proved, some games absolutely need bluray.

[princejb134]

of course it made no difference
the game was already made
its not like they extending the story in any way to make it a longer game

[pixelsword]

This article is a big win for PS3 owners
...if the whole game fit on a DVD, OF COURSE Blu-Ray won't make a difference. So how is this a big win for PS3 owners? For all of the Naysayers of the PS3 who always said the Blu-Ray had to copy the game multiple times for it to run on a Blu-Ray... The Bioshock Devs PROVED THEM WRONG.

[RadientFlux]

not surprising, since the original game did fit on a DVD, now if the PS3 had twice the ram as X360 you might see better textures.

edit: I am quite aware of how much ram the PS3 has, the only reason I mentioned it is usually how much ram a system/console has that dictates the quality of the textures. Espically when the environment isn't wide open.

[PirateThom]

The PS3 has the same amount of RAM as the 360, but half of it runs faster.

[PirateThom]

I'm honestly still trying to work out the disagrees from this...

XBox 360 - 512 MB GDDR3 RAM @700 MHz
PS3 - 256MB XDR Main RAM @3.2GHz and 256MB GDDR3 VRAM @700MHz

256 + 256 = 512, so that's the same....
3.2Ghz = 3200Mhz = 4.5 x 700Mhz = FASTER!

Really... do you people even THINK!?

[morganfell]

But you actually hit the nail on the head. The game was designed for DVD9. It isn't like they bothered using higher res textures for which there were plenty of room on Bluray. Or adding additional areas to the SP Campaign. They actually did a nose above the bare amount of work by adding challenge rooms.

A 757 isn't an advantage over a Cessna 172 if the airline is only going to sale the same number of seats on the 757 as are on the Cessna 172. Bluray is no different. If devs aren't going to avail themselves of the space, if they are going to choose to develop within the limits of last generation then of course there will be no advantage.

Look at modern graphics cards or even 3D acceleration. There has been a resurgence lately of titles that are something of a throwback in graphical terms. Are they still good games? Yes, for PSN and Live Arcade. Are they pushing the limits? No.

For a dev not to avail themselves of a modern technological advantage like Bluray is no different than a dev pushing modern consoles no farther than the N64.

I love this ridiculous argument I hear from certain people I have not yet blocked that goes something like this: "You don't need more space than DVD9. There are plenty of great games on DVD9." Really? By that moronic line of reasoning devs shouldn't push modern console any harder than the N64 since there were plenty of great games using that amount of storage medium. Great games on DVD9 is an epic fail as an argument against using Bluray.

[gameplayer]

piratethom, the ps3 has more memory reserved for system operating tasks than the 360. Yes, they have the same amount of ram but the ps3 has a little less available to the developer. Also, some would argue that being able to split 512MB into any proportion is an advantage over the 256+256 configuration so one is a little faster and one is a little more flexible... advantage - who knows? Probably depends on the game and what the developer wants to do.

edit, I'm not one of the people that hit disagree btw. Not my style, I just state my opinion instead of doing the phantom disagree. :)

[Bangladesh]

And if anyone needs to know, the reason the ps3 has less useable RAM is because it has a much larger OS footprint.

[DaTruth]

They could have streamed higher res uncompressed textures off the BR-disk. But than they would have to practically re-do the entire game, when it's already a decent title. And MS would have a heart attack they're insecure. Last Gen we never heard all this "we're making the games exactly the same" If the Xbox could handle more than often they would do more, instead we have burnout island free download that would have fit on the BR-Disk but MS would cry.

[DaTruth]

How much ram does it take to uncompress the highly compressed music and textures on the 360 that won't be compressed on the PS3? I know my computer can't play matroska video because it's too highly compressed.

[DevastationEve]

you're forgetting the 10mb edram

so

ps3 has 256mb + 256mb
360 has 512mb + 10mb

And that edram is many times over the speed of the xdr. If people say that having 256mb of xdr is like having 1gb of gddr3, then just imagine how much having 10mb of edram would compare to the xdr.

Now, on a side note it's not just so easy to say that the memory is "like" having more. The addresses end at "x", so there's no way to address more. They still need to anticipate that there is ONLY "x" memory and that's IT. The speed just means how much can EVENTUALLY be accessed, over "n" time. The more bandwidth, the sooner it can get to the next chunk of "x" memory.

[dro]

yep it did not make much difference because they did not plan to make the ps3 version look any different from the 360,if u want an example of a blu ray game just by MGS4...(-_-)

[bumnut]

we can't have 2 towelies!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!

[jojo319]

For MGS4, how much of the BR disc is taken up by movies, and how much of it is the actual game? does anybody know? I'm just curious.

I will never understand why people disagree with questions.

[INehalemEXI]

I would say 85% is taken up by game and assets. 15% FMV and its pretty close to using up the whole dual layer BD. The movies have semi-interactive qualitys as well. For example during the mission brief you can explore using the MK II. Another example would be snake peeping Naomi's assets at certain points in a cinematic you may have the ability to press a button and alter your view point.

[mindedone]

That the scenes are not prerendered. Prerendered scenes take up much more space than those that are not. What would take up a lot of space is the music, voice acting, SFX, etc.

[The_EE_God]

Well, you're wrong. The entire game is 33.2 GB. About 26.56 of them are uncompressed audio.

[LiquifiedArt]

Ofcourse it doesn't. They arent pushing the limits of it. lol. What a retarted comment. And a horrible article just to start a flame war.

[spunnups]

This article should be deleted but it's N4G, anything goes!

[AuburnTiger]

"Graphical quality our goal was always to make sure everything looked just as good as on Xbox 360. So there was never anybody who could say, hey, why didn't I get this on 360 originally, because I don't feel like it's up to the visual quality. We're just trying to make sure that everybody is happy."

This is a perfect example how one game was held back because of another's limitations.

[TheExecutive]

uhhh.... they developed the game for the lowest common denominator, of course a BETTER technology didnt make a difference how would it?

EDIT: ugh. To the disagrees, I am not talking about the 360vsPS3 I am talking about DVD and Bluray.

[Andor_Trask]

which basically is 360vsPS3 lol....but I know what you meant lol

[thor]

I don't see how using blu-ray on a game that only takes up a single DVD in the first place is going to make it look any better. Pretty much the only way it could is to use uncompressed, or not-so-compressed textures and audio files. But they probably weren't compressed so as to reduce the visual/audial fidelity in the first place so hardly anyone will notice. The only other thing is being able to make the game longer, I know they are adding some new stuff but nothing particularly substantial to require the use of blu-ray. I suppose the only advantage it has is that no one has hacked it (as of yet).

[felidae]

why should it make a difference?

bs article

[Time Lord]

-

[TheExecutive]

why wouldnt I expect it on the PS3? By the time bioshock 2 comes out the ps3 will have a larger user base than the 360. It makes fiscal sense for 2k to release it multiplatform.

[Nemo88]

Its coming dude..weep it!

[felidae]

what makes you say that nonsense?

of course BS2 will come to the PS3 and MAYBE it will look a little bit better than the 360 version .. who knows?

[PopEmUp]

next time around 360 will take the port instead of PS3

[Too_Hyped]

If anything, I'd say you can expect it more on PS3 than on 360. By the time it comes, the PS3 will have a much larger install base than the 360.

If the Xbox is dying now, as it is in Japan and in Europe, you can guess it could be completely dead when bioshock 2 comes out.

[Drealmcc0y]

Bu Blu Ray :(
Bu Cell :(

[juuken]

And the 360 fanbaby flaps in the wind.

[rawd]

Don't you have some mediocre rated games to defend somewhere?

Help me Kevin Perreira, your my only hope

[spoon]

I reportd this article.

u shud to the same. they got the quote wrong . fake article

quote is : but in terms of necessarily utilising something specific about Blu-ray.

[theKiller]

just because of this sentence sales of bioshock on ps3 will FLOP just like it did with PC and 360!!

people wants to see and hears a lot of things this game can do that couldnt on the 360, if it is the same or similar then wats the point to buy it on ps3?? yes only those who only own ps3 and never played cracked PC game will buy it but other than that no one will buy it!!

stupid Devs!!! they should learn a little bit of marketing at least!! or were they payed to say that? or maybe they were bots them self's!!

why so serious bioshock devs??

[Kleptic]

so how exactly would blu ray make a difference on a UE3 based game already made to fit on DVD?...I am seriously just wondering...what did anyone else expect?...

you get this either eay from every dev...if they are starting development with the PS3 in mined, the BD space is said to be 'invaluable'...if its a multiplatform game, or even leading on the 360, its not a big deal...whatever...

[Pain]

It would be Much different.

DX 9/DVD 9 FTL.

[KBDuB]

Blu Ray really won't make much of a difference.. The only thing it will do is allow extra space for more content and such, and no compression.

But, for the actual game.. Blu Ray won't make much of a difference.

[Dyingduck]

This game was made like back in the days - BR wasn't even mainstreamed back then...stupid...let's talk about the future: RAGE

[theKiller]

cant make a game better, it only makes it better if the Devs utilize it well!!!

when the devs says blue ray didnt help it means they didnt use the extra space!!

they so so dump!!

[pixelsword]

...if the whole game fit on a DVD, OF COURSE Blu-Ray won't make a difference. So how is this a big win for PS3 owners? For all of the Naysayers of the PS3 who always said the Blu-Ray had to copy the game multiple times... The Bioshock Devs PROVED THEM WRONG.

[HadeShade]

Its a port from a DVD game. So this is article is full of fail. Anyhow, I played the game on PC for a while but never finished it. Looking forward to the PS3 version.

[dro]

its going to be a timed exlusive just like the firs one..i think!!!

[spunnups]

2K made the decision themselves to create the game only for the 360, because of initially slow PS3 sales, but now that the PS3 is catching up in sales extremely fast, they made the economical choice. And, in order for people to buy the game, assuming most people have already played it whether on the 360 or PC, they added a few features and possibly tweaked the graphics. I for one think this person should have never came out and said such a dumb quote, it just makes their company look stupid. Who comes out and admits they didn't utilize the potential of Blu Ray? Expect to see a Multiplatform release of Bioshock 2 at launch. And if they create the game on the PS3 first, it's gonna look even better.

[kspraydad]

I truly was expecting 5 times the coding to be done.

On a positive note I guess BD's 'slower' speed didn't make a difference either.

[juuken]

...Maybe if you would have utilized it...?
I mean, no sh*t? It's coming from the 360 and that uses DVD9 if I'm not mistaken...?

Gotta love the fanbabies slamming disagree buttons!

[straightpiff420]

wow whoever wrote the title of this article is a idiot and totally turned the whole qoute around lol

[sajj316]

Nice twist ... I'm dizzy with spin :)

When asked if the Blu-ray format had provided any advantages to the development team, Miller replied: "In terms of specific things, it hasn't made much difference. The original game fit on a 360 disk so it wasn't like we were in need of room. We've tried to do what we can to make sure that the PS3 looks just as great as the 360, but in terms of necessarily utilising something specific about Blu-ray, to my knowledge, Blu-ray hasn't necessarily made a huge difference."

Not sure if they could utilize the potential of Blu Ray if all they are doing is making DVD9 fit into a 25GB disc. If they improve every texture in the game and utilize texture streaming a la Uncharted then I could see them going past 10 GB on a single disc.

[dkgshiz]

Its not like they added 100s of hours of new gameplay. Its pretty much the same game, except on the ps3. This is just a useless article. I bet the bots will be here shortly. Blu-ray does make a difference, but Bioshock isn't going to have tons of new content, so it doesn't really matter.

[Chubear]

Oh thank the gaming gods there are still people with brains in the gaming community.

[Lost_My_600_Dollar]

I know they didn't add anything , but the framerate issue is still exist or maybe worse than any version

Life goes on

[Sir_Ken_Kutaragi]

WHO CARES??? I just want 'KillZone 2' which NEEDS Blu-ray!!! ;-P

[Drealmcc0y]

Yh who wants AAA games?
/sarcasm

[spoon]

Sir Ken Kutaragi heres some good news for u. xobx suck assss

I once was a 360 fanboy and hated ps3. i had to much bad experince. PS3 all the way now

P S 3 . KING OF ALL THINGS GAMING

[Sir_Ken_Kutaragi]

Nice one;) Welcome to the PlayStation Family!!!;-D
PS3 is really excellent;) It gets better and better to ;-P

[zapass]

@ken: yeah, no offense to the bots but we have bigger fish to fry than their overhyped PC ported circle jerkoffs

dudes release an unreal based game with a descent art direction and we're supposed to care about their technical wisdom?

lol

@spoon: welcome to the dark side buddy

[Sir_Ken_Kutaragi]

I see the cheating xBots on this have got you down to 1 Bubble :-/
You should start up a new name!!! They CHEAT. Because i don't understand why 'pp' can go on every PS3 News and STILL??? have 5 Bubbles??? And the Mod's do F-ALL about it??? Hmm
Bubble for you mate, hope you get them back.

[DevastationEve]

welcome to side of people who overcompensate by increasing their bubbles with their multiple accounts. and saying bad things about others when they say that they like a another console.

one less hope of peace.

[Nemo88]

Its not like they *tried* to make it better, and like she said they already fit the original on DVD- they were aiming for parity.

However strangely enough the latest IGN preview spoke of "better looking textures and water, using the space of Blu-ray" ... But I suppose that doesnt have to do with Blu-ray at all, perhaps just more time to tweak. We'll see in the end I suppose.

I dont know why people are still trying to write articles suggesting Blu-ray/space doesnt matter, when weve Rockstar, ID etc recently saying that DVD's are limiting.

More debate/hits I suppose.

[sajj316]

One thing I know for sure is that more space = room for better textures. When Blu Ray is utilized to its potential, you get games like Uncharted, Rachet, and MGS4. Its quite simple really.

[Drealmcc0y]

The only game that needs Blu Ray is MGS4, and its a very unique games that has 9 hours of cutscenes

[juuken]

...And you don't own a PS3 and you've never played it.
Go play some Flop Human and Infinite Undiscovery Flopnomics please.

[dkgshiz]

You would know, its more like 70 min total of cutscenes. Besides the game scored perfect 10s, its by far the best game this year. Or LBP. Either way your panties leaked red, so now your in need of a tampon. Thats why your on a little wiener rage. If MGS4 wasn't a PS3 exclusive you would be playing it like mad. Your just a sore loser.

[caffman]

and just ONE of the cutscenes is longer than 70 mins!

[juuken]

And the campaign is well worth it?

For a game that's just a movie...MGS4 sure got a lot of 10's and 9's...

[Lost_My_600_Dollar]

Set back and enjoy your Movie

[felidae]

another gamer who is afraid of the real next gen power that is ps3 ;-)

[PopEmUp]

lol he has a period you see

@5.5 you mean set back and let you watch the Red Ring

[caffman]

I wasn't saying it was a bad game (in fact it was the first I got on PS3), I was saying that it has a lot of cutscenes!

[ThatCanadianGuy]

LOL! Still bashing the MGS4 cut-scenes?? whats wrong kid?

You know you cant bash the graphics-best graphics on any game
You know you cant bash the gameplay it f*ckin rocks

So what do you do? whine and complain about the cut scenes
Booo hoooo :(
If your precious Halo 3 had that much visual bliss you'd be singing a different tune.

[Shane Kim]

I played Mass Effect the other day. Boy did that game have cutscenes...but I can't see any bots complaining about that.

[juuken]

And you couldn't just say it was a good game? The cutscenes informs people who *are not* familiar with the franchise on *what* the hell is going on!

Plus, you can *gasp* skip them!

WHO WOULDA THUNK!

Dumbass bots.

[Deadman64]

You say that like you never have bashed a game without playing it....

The point of this article is being everyone thought the game was gonna be so much 'better' because it was coming out on PS3, a year or so later even. In reality, PS3's blu-ray did not make much of a 'difference' here.

[KBDuB]

Did you seriously bring up Mass Effect into this discussion? Lol. You are even more of an idiot than I thought..

Mass Effect is an RPG.. Of course it's going to have a lot of cut scenes.

MGS4 is a shooter.. 'Nuff said.

[DevastationEve]

Mass Effect is an RPG, but it has a strong 3rdPS aspect to it. Now, can we say that its story sucked? Nope. Same thing with MGS4. I don't mind having a few hours of cinema IF the story doesn't suck.

I guess it's the compromise we make when these developers start thinking that shooters need explanations as to why they're shooting. I'm all for it, and besides if you want a PURE shooter experience just play a different game. I'm sorry to say this, but the genre has been so over-saturated that you can put down one game and pick up another and still feel like you were playing the first one.

Games like MGS4 and Mass Effect won't leave you feeling like you've already played something like it.

[dkgshiz]

This is from videogamer.com. Never heard of it. Just like half of the generic sources that are always on these articles.

[name]

I like how they left out the most important part of that quote. -_-

[Lost_My_600_Dollar]

Blu-ray is no good for games
not really a big improvement just waste of money

@ Juuken

Just let me show you what is the most stupid thing ever ??? you know what I mean .. the PS3 thats right , ps3 will never beat the 360 in graphics or performance

keep dreaming

[juuken]

You go back to school to learn English. You don't know our language very well. You very stoooopid bot!

[PopEmUp]

Uncharted and Heavenly sword say hi

[ozhuerta]

Want to know what a "waste of money" is? That incredible, future-proof hd-dvd add-on. Great!
Another idiot. They just won't die soon enough...

[Shane Kim]

Uncharted, MGS4, Heavenly Sword, GT5:P (even a "demo" kills everything on your crapbox) and soon to be Infamous, KZ2 (do i need to say more), Heavy Rain, R2 and so on. Even Lair looks better than anything on xbox except maybe for Gears.

[KBDuB]

Maybe English is not his first(1st) spoken language, ever think about that Mrs. TwoChin? You very stoooopid TwoChin!

"You go back to school to learn English." Go work on your grammar.

[buckethead_X]

You shouldn't worry too much about grammar on the internet. You never know where someone is from or what language they speak. KBDuB, have you ever seen juuken in real life? And I'm just wondering if you know what a comma splice is. Sorry. I thought it was time to criticize everyone's English :P

Anyway, Lost is entitled to his opinion, no matter how misinformed he is.

[dkgshiz]

Learn English than lets talk. If you read my post above were it talks about how Bioshock on the ps3 is the same game. You would know the reason the bioshock ps3 devs don't use the full potential of blu-ray, its because its almost the same game, maybe an extra 1 hour of content. A retard with half a brain could figure that one out. Guess you cant. Maybe your a retard with 1/4 of a brain.

[KBDuB]

Don't hate. You're English is not that great, either.

Go work on YOUR English and we'll talk.

Lol. You're a hypocrite. Good job, moron. =)

[divideby0]

N4G.....Please stop trunicating the article titles for sensationalism..

[jmare]

That's the title of the article. It's not N4G, it's videogamer.com.

[pp]

Hahahahahahahaha 'Blu-ray hasn't made much difference' Hahahahahhahahaha

[spoon]

Quote is wrong u liv a lie. i bet your mum and dad say they luv u and and made you

but really they adopted you. your real parents are fish mongers and they tried to get u adopted by donkey.donkeys dont adopt jackass's.

so your real father who is calld "D1ck Burns" threw u into a rivr and u ended up being adopted by ape family who hate you and lie to u as well and thats the best family u can get.

[PopEmUp]

no need for that. just let pp talk to himself you see he like one of those kids who usually talk to themselves, you know what I mean, he not a normal kid and just leave him alone

[ozhuerta]

I agree with you. Just let pp return to his corner.

[buckethead_X]

Does Blu-Ray not making much difference in a port really amuse you that much? What did Blu-Ray ever do to you? You're acting like Blu-Ray made it worse...

[agentace]

are they stupid it doesnt just magicaly become better when you put it on blu-ray, have to improved it and thats what the extra space is for.

i hate it when multi-platform games come out and people say the blu-ray didn`t make it any better, u have to make it better but devs wont make one game better for 1 console ovdr the other or it should just be exclusive then to the better console

[caffman]

this should be a must buy for PS3. It's fantastic on the 360 so really it should be just as good on PS3

[dro]

then someone just has to go....!!!!

there is only room for one towelie on N4G...

(-_-)

WANNA GET HIGH!!!!!

XD

[caffman]

why don't you both get a little high?

[Zerodin]

LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL!

[nieto]

From the article: "When asked if the Blu-ray format had provided any advantages to the development team, Miller replied: "In terms of specific things, it hasn't made much difference. The original game fit on a 360 disk so it wasn't like we were in need of room."

--Don't you get tired of getting OWNED Zerodin? you should look for other hobby beside trolling because you rally suck at it. Even with a "LOL" you get owned.

[Zerodin]

Go back to 4chan newf@g. The dev said it didn't provide any advantages, the only people who got owned were you yellowfaces.

[Obama]

You got owned Zerodin. And why are you so racist just like many of the bots there?

[caffman]

why don't you just get them out on the table and make caveman noises!

[jack who]

u farmboyz love them year old 360 leftovers dont you oh yes u do oh yes u do...

[QuackPot]

Seeing that Bioshock x360 was on a standard DVD then WTF.

Of course Bluray isn't going to make too much difference.

[PimpHandStrong]

likes my bigger disk size

lol

but really

Its not like the game was made on the PS3 so ofcourse blueray didnt make a difference

[PimpHandStrong]

do you understand graphics are info? The more time and info you put into the code the better it will look

Do you understand everything in a game is info?
Sounds
Music
color

anyway

i dont know what im talking about

im a computer idiot

but we already know storage space is important

the dev on that new RAGE game said as much

Just because this thread says it didnt make a differnece on a PC game made a year ago doesnt mean its not usefull

[shikwan]

How can you tards buy into this 'bluray is better for games' thing when:

1.Bluray does NOT provide better graphics but MORE storage space than a dvd-9.

2. If storage space of a BR disk makes games 'better' then why does PS3 games require INSTALLS?

3. If storage space beyond dvd-9's is needed then why aren't PC games showing 200+hour games with improved graphics and why do PC games still come on dvd-9 discs & not BR???

4. Why is it that PS3 has been out for 2 years and there STILL isn't one game proving BR alone makes games better??

Sony sold you a house that doesn't exist. Man up - admit it & move on.

[InMyOpinion]

Stop speaking the truth! It hurts!

How come Bioshock for the PS3 isn't running in 1080p when the cell is so powerful?

[bee2427]

actually MGS4 is one game.... but saying that blu-ray doesnt make a difference means that you dont understand shyt even if its just for storage... it means the developers dont have to compress anything so that the game can run much smoother, look better, sound better, why do you think blu-ray looks better then an unscaled dvd... get ure ish straight, the developer decided not to take advantage of blu-ray

[Fishy Fingers]

1. Nearly right, BR does allow for higher res textures, but as a whole no, will not improve visuals.

2. Part because of the BRs slower read speeds, but largely due to the developers taking the easy route. Naughty Dog showed nearly a year ago there are ways to combat the slow speeds withou the need for an install.

3. So wrong it's not even worth answering. But basically, compression, PC games require installs, after the install the disc is essentually redundant. Some games after installs when un-packed take up much more space than a DVD-9

4. MGS4, Rage etc etc, but BR doesnt offer anything the 360 cant do, it just means the 360 is forced to use multiple discs. So in that case, BR has shown an advantage. Not having to change discs. Also, audio is much better when it's not compressed.

[GoldenBoy]

So I guess you guys will be OK with the next Xbox being DVD9 then since Blu Ray is not needed and only causes difficulties with redundant data.

Don't reply I already have your answer..."the next xbox will have a higher speed BR drive so it will actually be able to leverage the extra space and not have to install data"...so do I congratulate MS for waiting or Sony for pushing the format so that they make money from everyone next gen......to this you respond "next gen will be DD only"....you see I can be like everyone here and have a conversation by myself and not listen to anyone else.

Having said all that I think Blu Ray can make a difference if leveraged properly. Also, the 360 is not crap because it is DVD9. I applaud the 360's gains this gen (huge leap in competitive performance) and look forward to what MS is goind to do. But that is not the point here. The Bioshock port didn't need to leverage the Blu Ray disc so they didn't. End of story.

[LastDance]

yeah dude.... coz if you add up all the disks in Age of empires 3 plus expansion, it equals Five disks.

nice argument.

[Lucreto]

Bubbles for you both. I couldn't say it better myself.

@Jenzo It is not on 1080p as the developers didn't want it to be. You can't buy a huge canvas and tell them to use it all even if they don't want to.

If you read the article they said they wanted to be on par with the 360. If they wanted they would make it bigger.

[PimpHandStrong]

why do you bring up PS3 installs then talk about PC games

every PC game i have ever played had a install!

EVERYONE I HAVE PLAYED!

When you have a harddrive built in why complain about installs!!!!!

Its silly just like your comment

[jlytle1234]

1) the better graphics come in the form of not having to use compression because of the large storage capacity. We arent to that point in game development yet, but we will be. We got too big for cd, we will get to big for dvd.
2)ps3 doesnt require installs. There are games that do nothing more than cache some data to the hard drive and some games do an outright install. Its common knowledge that installing data to a harddrive will make it load faster. This goes for 360 and ps3. Hence why microsoft plans on adding a disk install feature this next update. And pc games have always installed the games.
3)pc games have no moved to bluray because dvd is still the standard for it. A bluray drive is still way to expensive. Its the same when pcs went from cd to dvd as the standard. It takes time. Also pc since pc always installs data, they tend to just issue multiple discs.
4)bluray allowed ps3 users to have all the expansion packs for oblivion on one disc. MGS4 was larger than a dual layer dvd. Killzone 2 is supposed to be larger than a single dvd. The list can go on.

Youre missing the whole point. Games were on cds, then got too big and moved to dvds. Now they are starting to get too big for dvds and will move to bluray. Yes you can put games on multiple dvds. But if that is your logic, why dont we just put games on multple cds?

[MvmntInGrn]

The game fit on a DVD so no extra space was needed. Simple, they haven't revamped textures or anything so why would they need more space.

This doesn't mean that Bluray isn't an advantage to some games. FFXIII and RAGE will ship with at least 2 (more likely three) discs on the 360 compared to one on the PS3, it definitely has its advantages.

This is no surprise.

Also anyone who says Bioshock 2 won't hit PS3 is delusional, timed exclusive MAYBE but I really think it'll be simultaneous, why? THERE IS NOTHING SAYING OR HINTING OTHERWISE!

[Fishy Fingers]

Why would it? They designed the game to fit on a DVD so BR would make no difference.

[CrazyOrange]

blue ray dosn't effect games
if it is so 360 games max reslution will be about 480p ....

[jack who]

??_?? i dont get it

[spoon]

it effect game size. menaign it does effect games

also effect game limitations

[PopEmUp]

rage say hi

[jack who]

"all of the key scenes, the things anyone is going to take a screenshot of are going to look exactly the same on both platforms. They'll get the high quality compression."

Where the PS3 game will see a visual improvement is in the areas players won't usually be seeing.

boo ray is not needed.

[heyheyhey]

why would Blu-Ray make a big difference to a game that didn't need it in the first place?

BioShock on the 360 was 6.2gb and even though there is exclusive PS3 content- i doubt they were going to add freakin 19gb of extra content and improved graphics

[THC CELL]

they did not want to show xbox up buy using all the blu ray and cell

it would be very upsetting wont it now

F this game its not even worth it anyways
bring me Killzone and LBP

Dont u see xbots these dev team are LAzy they dont no S*it about blu ray even the cell why cause there noobs

all i have to say
METAL GEAR SOLID OHHHHHHHHHHH SMELL THAT LAZER HITTING THE BLU RAY DISK

[jack who]

nothin better than sittin tho 1hr of cut screen on MGS to show how needed the boo ray is

@ teh cell

using killzone to show anything about the ps3 with me = lolz...teh halo killer 5.5 xD

[Surfman]

of course blu-ray has'nt been used, its a 360 game. So if the game is 9Gb, it stays 9Gb. Why should they boost the game? They are only doing a port.

Blu-Ray is useful if the game is on the PS3 at the start.

[divideby0]

shikwan...your comment sounds like you dont have a PS3 and really do not understand....
...360 will have game installs....and PCs have game installs..does this help..
...compression is not the way to go...if you read what the developers are saying...Rockstar for one...they clearly have stated BR's storage is superior for games...
we own all the consoles and not trying to sell you just read some more

[xg-ei8ht]

shikwan - Sony sold blu-ray for movies, 1080p, best you can get, let alone blu-ray discs are the best you can get(physically). They are harder to scratch, quite frankly dvd's suck a$$ in this regard.

On to games, It depends. Bioshock is a port. And depending on texture throughput,cutscenes etc.

I mean my m8 plays gears of war, but the texture load up even in multiplayer is poor, takes way to long. dvd not fast enough?

I'm sure if people wanted to wait longer, sony could have stuck a faster drive in, but even when the ps3 was being delayed, it was a diode problem.

At the end of the day, Blu-ray is good for Movies,additional space for large games, and if used corretly, i/.e uncharted. can be used perfectly for streaming.

Strangly enough i'm playing dmc4 on PC atm. Very nice game, and very nice looking, but textures could have been alot better, some are great other's aint.. unpacked on pc it's 7.25gb.

[InMyOpinion]

Cry-ray.

[juuken]

FLOP60.
Go cry some more.

[InMyOpinion]

lol! You just confirmed my statement with that comment.

[Obama]

Jenzo, confirmed what? That you like naked man in your avatar?

[THC CELL]

Jack who

Killzone nuff said wait 2 gig per level
Thats 4 levels on a xbox pfff

R2 A monster in that game at 300 feet tall is using a few gig

Wait wait i forget lol heavy Rain wow i bet they take advantage of the blue ray Play beyond

Btw Blu ray won the format war so there doing something right

I bet the main reason Getaway was canned cause blu ray was not completed yet

Bring on the 200 gig disc

[Cynical-Gamerzus]

Why would it? this is a PC port to a new parallel technology(PS3).
This isn't a new engine optimized ground up to take advantage of PS3 tech....
It is the dying Gen of first person shooters..LOL
I Just read about a amazing game called Heavy Rain this is a game that im looking forward to as well as of Course as Gran Tourismo 5..

Who need PC technology when we have PS3 technology..
Parralel is the future !! count your days right hand left keyboard geeks!!!

[karlostomy]

" our goal is to get it as good as the 360"

hmmm... as good as the 360?
I'd feel ripped off having spent $200 extra on a supposedly 'superior' ps3 with cell and bluray that was only *just* matching the 360 one year later.

[Too_Hyped]

Ah ah ah. Nothing like a desperate fanboy with no game spinning a sentence taken out of context.

MGS 4 > all the RRODbox games and Uncharted gfx > anything on crapbox.

You fail again (like your console). Your failure rate is way above 33% by the way.

[RAM MAGNUMS]

xbots are twisting the quote around. Why? They probly asked if it was difficult to develop for & quote.
carmack, houser & Kojima say hi.
What bothers me about ports & multiplatform games is the price.
seriously, my ps3 runs bluray games. These ports dont use half of the space thats on the disc.
why am I paying full price for that? Either bluray is real cheap or dvd is very expensive.
I think more people should consider that when it comes to ports & 3rd party.
psp & ds are different, they dont try to make those games equal & they are priced differently.
as a consumer, I think its the DVD that's ripping people off.

[GameDev]

a hackers forum back in like 2000 that I belonged to and one the day the conversation turned to consoles. Most felt that for the most part they were ok but now the MS was entering the fray they would bring with them a whole legion of morons who are too stupid to handle and configure their own pc's.

THIS, ladies and gents is the result of that. A legion of xbots who are so CLUELESS as to how this stuff works that it literally makes you whince to see them spouting nonsense like they have the runs cause nothing but CACA keeps coming out.

[N4GayFanturds]

I'm really sick of these 'console wars'. This is something I don't see either, so you can twist & manipulate words all you want but fact is fact; it is UNPROVEN that bluray is BETTER for games in ANY way especially in terms of content (PC still superior) and graphics (again PC is still superior).

Uncompressed data REALLY doesn't mean anything.

[xg-ei8ht]

So uncompressed sound and compressed sound are the same are they? uncompressed textures are the same as compressed?

Learn alittle will you.

You probably still think it still uses unreal 2.5. When infact they switched to unreal 3.0 long ago. For better shader fx.

Installed on pc, it takes 8gb. So any bigger would have been on 2discs. Get the point for blu-ray now. Was made to fit on 1 dvd for 360.

360 already uses a tremedous amount of compression on most of it's games, and that is being used extensively for gow2. But compression can only take you so far, why do you think carmack was ranting about it.

3 discs, doh

But you know what really makes me laugh, was a statement i read, and it's here, to do with the game.

Levine emphasized the enhanced water effects, which he claimed would be very impressive: "We've hired a water programmer and water artist, just for this game, and they're kicking ass and you've never seen water like this.

Erm, yes i've seen better water and better water i can interact with. it's called uncharted.

[PistolPumptMonk]

Why in the world should it make a difference? The only thing that blu-ray has anything to do with is storage space and if the game fit on a dvd then why would blu-ray make a difference? Stupid article...

[DJ]

The game was built to fit within 7 GB, and it's not like they're going to go back and create a huge amount of new content for the PS3 version.

This is simply how ports work.

[clintos59]

When u port a game your not going to take full advantage of what bluray and the ps3 has to offer because your just trying to deliver the same quality u made for the 360 version. Besides killzone 2 and heavy rain and many other ps3 games make this game look like out dated graphics anyways.

[hay]

Uhh, Bioshock isn't that heavy on megabytes to make a difference being on BD. Basically it's a port, they didn't improve visuals just added few things. And it's one year old.
What's this war about cause I don't get it. Fanboys got a fuel for another flame war?
It's funny to see a lot of comments when weaknesses of consoles are shown in news/articles. Either X or PS3. One of them is shown in darker light, flame bursts.

[xg-ei8ht]

Just read they've even dumbed down the consoles versions of farcry 2 because of the 360,lol

[IzKyD1331]

it would make no sense for them to utilize blu ray, its a port of a 9 GB game, so it should be 9 GB on blu ray too...

[Alcohog]

...and why would it for a game that was designed to fit on DVD-9?

[pwnsause]

uh oh, here comes the bots saying BD is not needed again, without realizing that the PS3 version is a port from the 360 version version. games built from the ground up exclusively on the PS3 shows BD's True potential. 3rd party companies are not going to do that unless they are in a deal with Sony to make their games exclusive.

[karlostomy]

And if it wasn't such a cutscene heavy game (almost like a CGI movie) then the BR wouldn't be required.

All those who disagree, did MGS not have a heaps of cutscenes and one in particular that was 70 minutes long?

hmmm .. guess I was right

[VampHuntD]

Duh? Port from DVD to BR and of course it won't.

[pain777pas]

It's a port so why would there be a need to take advantage of the bluray and the hardware for that matter they just have to get a comparable up and running well than ship it.

[plain rice]

It's a port! End of story.

[Lord Vader]

LOLZ !!!

BluRay is just a medium !!!

The only way it can make a game better is if you want hours & hours of CG, like MGS4 & RPGs.

LOLZ @ the fanboys !!!

[GarandShooter]

See if you can follow the progression and guess the next logical choice.

Floppy disc, multiple floppy discs, CD, multiple CDs, DVD, multiple DVDs...

Ready? Could it be ....Blu-ray?

Did games growing in size from floppy to CD or CD to DVD show an increase in CG only for the increase in size? Or were there improved graphics, AI, etc.? So why would it be different this time? You can find other ways to take cheap shots at MGS4 that don't look so foolish.

From henceforth ye shall be known as 'Lord Fanboy'.

[Bladestar]

I am willing to bet that this game will look same or worst than the xbox 360 version and yet it will probable use 2 times the capacity of the xbox 360 version... it's common for multiplafform game to take a lot more space than xbox 360 regardless of the quality... to compensate blu-ray reading speed...

and for those saying that blu-ray is a fast as standard dvd.. use your common sense... blu-ray drive has more room to cover than a DVD drive... it's not the same to search and read 50 names from a list 9,000... than to read 50 names 90,000... this is why blu-ray have to write the very same names all over in order to make them quicker to find...

[DJ]

Show us the proof! Oh that's right, you don't have any. Data Duplication has been used as far back as PS1 and Sega Saturn. Even Xbox 360 relies on it to combat seek times. Data Duplication is a standard industry practice.

If anything, Blu-ray gives developers an edge when using this method of reducing data seek times since they have so much more room to work with.

[Bladestar]

show proof? there is plenty... just look at all the multiplatform games that currently require mandatory installs + are larger on the PS3 disc and do not show any advantage to the xbox 360 version as far as loading... the proof is right on your face DJ.. you are just too blind to admit it...

[GarandShooter]

I think DJ meant quantifable proof or at least 'Expert Opinion' as opposed to just opinion.

[Figboy]

the devs are making Bioshock exactly the same on the PS3 compared to it's 360 counterpart.

the 360 Bioshock fit on a DVD.

WHY would an EXACT PORT utilize the 25-50 gigs Blu Ray utilizes?

why are we even having this conversation when there are already games out there that DO utilize Blu Ray (Ratchet is over 20 gigs, Uncharted is 24gigs, Metal Gear Solid is on a dual layer, 50gig disc)?

BIOSHOCK. IS. A. PORT.

and a port of a year old game at that.

*GASP!* a year old game isn't utilizing the latest in gaming technology!

Bioshock's design was set years ago. it's design was based around a DVD, and it's maximum capacity, 9 gigs, as well as being designed to be installed on a PC hard drive.

this isn't 2006 anymore, when it was a valid argument to question Blu Ray's benefits to gaming.

just ask Id, a developer that's working on a NEW game, not a year old port, and see what they have to say about the usefulness of more disc space.

this is a non-story, and a non-issue. why are people still debating this? it's not like Blu Ray is adding an insane amount of cost to the PS3 anymore.

[ScottEFresh]

This just in...Xbox doesn't even have Blu-Ray or ANY next gen format available...so what are we talking about here?

[IaMs12]

i think its funny if your statement is true... the Xbox 360 is still putting out pretty freaking awesome graphics compared to MOST PS3 games (not all but most)... so if the 360 is so last-gen, i think its sad on the PS3's half that a last gen console is keeping up with the "next gen" one...

[nieto]

In other word he is saying that the X360 has last-gen hardware so to make it both versions the same they don't need to utilize any of the new technologies that the ps3 brings, in this case the space of the blu-ray.

The massive space on a blu-ray disc it's not necessary for a game that was made specifically with the specs of a DVD9 in mind.

[nieto]

In other word he is saying that the X360 has inferior hardware so to make both versions the same they don't need to utilize any of the new technologies that the ps3 brings, in this case the space of the blu-ray.

The massive space on a blu-ray disc it's not necessary for a game that was made specifically with the specs of a DVD9 in mind.

[smurfie4]

What do you expect if their only goal is to port the game? Look to exclusives like LBP, R2, Killzone 2, Infamous, and Motorstorm PR, to take advantage of blue-ray.

[IaMs12]

If they are putting the Game on Blu-Ray (which is pointless no need to) i believe sony might have had a hand in it to promote the BR even more... MS isnt the only one to throw money around...

And BR maybe slower but it has a constant speed but it is slower...

where there are pros there are cons... where someone has failed the other will succeed..

[mt]

ok i get it .. cuz basically the game made to fit on DVD so it will basically will fit on blu-ray if no big changed has been added.

[DFresh]

They made a port they didn't start on the PS3 first w/ this game so they don't have the right to say it doesn't matter w/ blu-ray when they didn't start on that console in the first place as their main platform for this game.
Whatever graphics might look the same cuz it's a port but PS3 Users still get exclusive features not found in the 360 or PC Version and we get trophies.
All really good things.
I don't care I still want the game anyways for my PS3.

[hadouken007]

it not supposed to make much difference,its for more store capacity nuttsacks. .shakes head.

[-SIXAXIS-]

That is so stupid. Obviously there will be no need for Blu-Ray if you kept the graphics the same and didn't up the texture resolutions. Also, I think it's very stupid of them to not add a graphical improvement. Come on, PS3 owners waited a full year and deserve something more than a crappy new game mode. They say it's to keep everybody happy, but WTF? It's been a year and 360 owners don't give a rat's a** whether it's better or not. They already beat the game.

P.S. Sorry about some of my language. I'm kind of pissed of at 2K. Anyways, I still have my PC version.

[Silent]

its a port wats new? 360 to PS3 is cake, if its PS3 to 360 then well we have a problem.

[easytouch77]

When I was watching the PS3 press conference, a developer from 2K Marin specifically said Blu-ray allowed the development process to be much easier. So either the press conference that was shown to everyone was giving false information, or some random article is trying to get people's attention. It's a tough one but I call BS on this. Why would 2K say there isn't much difference between this version and the 360 version a couple months before it releases? Come on guys be smarter then this.

[SyphonFilter]

of course it didn't make a difference if there focus is just to port it. If they did take advantage of it like mgs 4 then you will notice a difference.

[great games]

Uncharted,MGS4,Killzone 2,and Motorstorm all exclusive to ps3 and looks high tech. While the x360 fans only uses 1 game (gears of war) to boast about graphics, yet gears came out in 2006 and hasn't been top by another x360 exclusive yet. Then comes gears 2 which look just like the 1st and what does that mean. I think he just trying to make the ps3 look bad, or they didn't use blu-ray.

Wait a min doesn't gears of war use the unreal engine 3 which is a multiplat engine which means it can be done on the ps3?

and why do devs go around saying blu-ray wasn't needed, when they cant even come close to games like Killzone 2 without the game being exclusive to the ps3 like heavy rain. just say u didn't use blu ray and u used dvd9 instead.

[WengYong]

Of course Multi Plats (FF13 & Rage excluded) arent going to use Blu Ray to the fullest. To make it even they have to utilise DVD, not Blu Ray. And Being that its a port then of course it wouldnt make a diference. Cant wait to play this game though

[Eiffel]

They are just getting bioshock after its been on the 360 for over a year, great timing sony like always.

[Droid]

poor droids. too bad one of the greatest looking and playing games of all time simply doesn't need blur ray.

poor droids.

[MetalProxy]

you guys keep thinking that it dont matter.

I guess your not old enough to now that data space is super important. Remember when 8 meg Genisis games where the bomb? Thought so. How do you think we ended up with GIGS? Man ignorence is bliss.

[NanoGeekTech]

Will be utilizing the power of the "Blu"............... ..

It would not be in the best interest for EA to remake Bio-shock and make it look far better than the original...They have to leave something for the sequel....

Every time there is anything posted about Blu-ray many people become virtual IT geeks....DRAM, RAM, 2X speed, 12X speed, BS, WTF, GDDR3....

Hey Blu-ray is a good thing for gaming just look at maybe just one game: Uncharted...then thank a quick look at another...MGS4......and tell me when do the speed of Blu-ray interfere with an experience like MGS4 and Uncharted..\

All this talk about speed..and DVD is faster blah..blah..blah...Blu-ray has never impend my gaming experience on my PS3..I believe it has greatly enhance it....

[highps3]

200 comments over what? Blu Ray being needed was confirmed upon having to use two discs+ on the 360. FACT.

As far as Bioshock, its a single player only game that was designed for DVD, doesnt take a genious.

200 Comments? WTF

[slave2Dcontroller]

This will be appicable to ANY multi plat game and this is is why PS3 Exclusives PWN. I thought we all knew this already though.

[Sanzee]

No, I had no idea that "we knew this already". I respect your opinion but both console's can have great exclusives. One console doesn't have lead over another in terms of "exclusives". That makes little sense. I seek no conflict as you know. I am just stating my opinion. Thanks again.

[slave2Dcontroller]

I meant that PS3 Exclusive are are better than multi plats because they tend to utilize the strenths of the PS3. I wasnt making a comparsion between the PS3 and 360. Thats not really my style. I should have worded it better perhaps. We knew Bioshock wouldnt benefit from BR because its original disc format is DVD9. No harm done XD

[zodiac909]

well thats not a surprise seeing that it can fit on a 360 on 1 disk, and its not like they are adding another 10 hours to it!

[arngrim229]

duh it wudnt do a difference only when it comes to saving money on multiple disc and not having to cut content cuz it wont fit, thats only diff with blu ray, bioshock wasnt pushing limits like mgs4 so they didnt have to worry

[Vo_Cal]

Blah BLah Blah... Im a sony troll...........

[devilhunterx]

but you got a face of an xb0t

[tom9177]

They just don't want to piss off Microsoft.Wait till Bioshock 2 comes out and you'll see the difference in the consoles, when they can develop right from the start for the PS3.

[Snukadaman_]

This news blows all you droids up...its not needed...it does not change games and stop blasting us with the propaganda about how blu-ray is needed...here is more proof that some of us who has not purchased a ps3 knew all along...poor droids are mad as f*ck with this news to....roflmao.

[MetalProxy]

Look at the agrees and disagrees. This proof that there is just as many xbox fanboys as there is PS3 fanboys. So no more cry'n about this place being run over by PS3 fanboys.

[Sanzee]

Now Blu-Ray is a great technology. But it wouldn't make Bioshock look better or more amazing. It utilizes 2K's same game engine they used to make the 360 & PC version (though the engine may have new updates by now).

Blu-Ray is just there to fit content on a game disc. There's no way it could make it look "better" in terms of visually or anything.

[CrizzleC24]

Two cars,

One the 360

One the Ps3

Does anybody expect a bigger gas tank to add to the appearance of the car?
Of course not, so why then, do all Ps3 l-users think that having a bigger disc capacity makes a better looking game.

Same engine, same hardware only difference is storage space(and a goofey name for the ps3's processor).

[SpartanZero]

I knew this was coming poor Droids :D

[Toixer]

@Gameplayer
I guess blu-ray games are also mastered, so the "important" information must be close to center. Assuming that a blu-ray game has the same amount of data as a dual layer dvd, it will take only aprox 1/6 of disc space.
So my conclusion is, that it doesn't change rpm as drastically as a dvd drive with clv, also considering the slow speed of 2x. So I think there won't be that much of a lag.
I was also wondering, if the declared read speed of the 360 drive is max peak speed or average speed, cause I read somewhere, that the reading transfer rate at the inner tracks of a disc is much lower than at the edge.
Please enlighten me someone, if I'm wrong, cause I'm just assuming something.

[Zorik4]

http://forum.beyond3d.com/s...

2x Blu-ray Drive (72Mbps(9MB/s))
Single Layer (2x CLV) - Constant Linear Velocity (Same speed across entire disk)
Entire Blu-ray Disk is read at 9MB/s.

12x DVD-Rom Drive SL (9.25MB/S-15.85MB/s(AVG ~8x(10.57MB/s)
DL (4.36MB/s-10.57MB/s(AVG ~6x(7.93MB/s)
SL(DVD-5) 12x Max (5-12x Full CAV) - Constant Angular Velocity (Speed Varies from edge to edge)
DL(DVD-9) 8x Max (3.3-8x Full CAV) - Constant Angular Velocity (Speed Varies from edge to edge)

SL DVD is 1.57MB/s > SL Blu-ray
DL DVD is 1.07MB/s < SL Blu-ray

Majority of 360 games are on DVD-9.

[N-R-G]

360 games come on DL disks only, none of them are released on SL disks.

The DVD drive in the 360 is not a 'standard' 12x DVD drive, which on the PC means 12x for SL. The specs clearly state that it is 12x for DL disks, meaning it would be a 16x DVD drive if it was on the PC (16x for SL).

Look up the official specs for the 360 and you'll find the following;

http://xbox.about.com/od/xb...

"12x dual-layer DVD-ROM"

That's 12x for DL disks, not 8x as some like to claim.

that's why numerous devs have said the DVD drive in the 360 is faster than the Blu-ray drive in the PS3, and we've seen this for ourselves in games where the load times are quicker on the 360 unless gamers use the option to install to the HDD on the PS3.

The recent release of Soul Calibur IV is further proof, where the load times on the identical PS3 version is twice that of the 360 version unless the HDD is used;

http://d.hatena.ne.jp/yoda-...

[JD_Shadow]

1. It's a damn PORT!! Why in the hell would people think that changing code and medium would make any difference.
2. It's not just the Blu-Ray that makes the PS3 exclusives what they are. It's also the processors and that. There is a reason why Kojima said that MGS4 was optimized for the PS3. There are more differences between the 360 and the PS3 than just the medium that the games are stored upon.

[Darkwolf]

but did you notice she said "we wanted to make it as close to the 360 version as possible"..in other words microcrap paid them to keep it the same instead of utilising the ps3's full potential..blu-ray would have made a difference if they had of fully optimised the graphics to its full potential as well..microcrap just doesnt want its bots feeling inferior for owing a 360..

[Skynetone]

bluray is for hd movies and the mgs of this world

not for stupid ports from an outdated system

[CrizzleC24]

One wheel does not make a car.

Nor does MGS4 make a console sell.

[KrimsonKody]

Did everyone forget that it's a "'PORT'"?
...A copy?
...A duplication of the original?
...Not at all enhanced!?
LOL.
I think some devs for starting to limbo under that high-@$$ bar that SONY has set.
It's like if I give you a broken T.V, then make fun of you because it don't work :-|

[Ri0tSquad]

I really didn't expect Blu-ray to make a difference unless there adding a lot extra crap.

[JD_Shadow]

This will be yet ANOTHER thing that 360 fanboys will go to as "proof" that the PS3 "doesn't perform well". I can almost guarantee they will pounce on this one and ignore any other details.

[Bathyj]

You know there have been many times where Bots have made me scratch my head and really question whether I'm talking to reasonable adults, or at least teenagers with a little savvy. Somethimes I just have to shake my head and wonder if I'm killing my own brain cells by remaining part of a demographic that can be so technically proficiant and yet so adverse to simple logic.

So I'll repeat what 3 or 4 dozen other people have already said in this thread.

How can a game planned, conceived, developed and released for DVD possible benifit from suddenly being ported to BluRay? The whole idea is games for BluRay need to start life with BR in mind or else whats the point.

I have a 10 inch oven. It can fit a 10 inch Pizza in it. I make the Pizza. I'm just about to put it in when someone says "hey, heres a 20 inch oven, you're Pizza will be much bigger now." Er no i says, I've already made it. Putting it in a bigger oven NOW will have no benifit. There is no advantage over my small oven. Had I know a 20 inch was going to be available (you see where I'm going with this, I'm making it pretty simple) I could have made a 20 inch Pizza and then the bigger oven would have been some use to me.

I used Pizza cos I figured some of you might identify with it.

Porting a 9GB game to a 50GB disc isn't going to make to game suddenly bigger or better unless they scrap it and start right from the beginning with a 20 inch base. Its that simple. Bots trying to latch onto this like it matters somehow are just showing how pathetic they are and frankly its embarrassing. I dont remember PS2 owners last gen being so concerned because XB was a technically more powerful machine. We were just happy with our games we had and I used to actually get all my Multiplats on Xbox. This gen you all act like you've seen your Dad in the shower and you're ashamed you dont measure up.

And you know what, its just dawned on me why all Sony's devs who are mostly actually independent stay with them. Sure Sony is a great publisher, and very supportive, but also, ask any of them if they would like to go back to DVD now, after having 2 or 3 BR games under their belts. Why go through that drama. No one buys Ferrari, and then trades it in because they miss their Ford. EVER.

[redsymphony]

ITS A DAMN PORT!!!!!!!!!!!

[Neo604]

future Next Gen games will make bioshock looks like nintendo.

[sl4y4]

Who cares? I just want to play it XD

[Toixer]

Thanks Zorik4. Interesting info and somehow as I expected. I wonder how Gameplayer would argue, when he might read that^^.

I also wonder, how significant the decompression of dvd data affect the speed. I think most of the blu-ray games don't use any compression. But I might be wrong.

[Bordel_1900]

"BioShock PS3 dev: 'Blu-ray hasn't made much difference'"

Talk about taking a quote out of context.

Moron X360 fanboys hold on to quotes like this for their life. They don't understand that for this port BD won't make much of a differnece. They're sticking to duplicating the X360 version, they're not expanding on the original game.

[thematrix1298]

That Mellisa needs to get pwn3d in her ass. I'll ask her who owns you now? She'll scream PS3!!!! lmao

[neonchez]

my first though when reading the headline was "duh, it's a port. the game wasn't designed w/ blu-ray in mind."

then this quote "The original game fit on a 360 disk so it wasn't like we were in need of room" confirmed what i thought. the reason blu-ray isn't needed for bioshock is because it was designed for the 360 not the ps3.