Layers of Fear Dev: [Backwards Compatibility] Is ‘Not A Selling Feature For Me’

Bloober Team's Rafał Basaj discusses the personal appeal of PS2 emulation.

[Neonridr]

Of course it's not a selling feature, who wants to pay to replay an older game that they may still own. Free BC is where it is at.

[Genuine-User]

BC is not a selling feature on either system, in my opinion. Especially if games perform worse than on thier original hardware.

_____________________________ _______________

Clickbait title as usual.

Layers of Fear developer:

“To be honest, I actually don’t care about it that much. I have never sold a console after its time, and I come back to my GameCube quite regularly. It’s just not a selling feature for me.”

[Neonridr]

lots of games on XB1 perform fine. Yeah some have issues, but a lot of those are being patched.

It's not a selling feature no, but you can't sit there and say that it makes a console worse off by having it.

The Wii or Wii U were never criticized because they came with the ability to play the previous machines games for free.

[Genuine-User]

I didn't say including BC makes a console worse off.

Almost every game that I have tried performs worse on Xbox One than 360.

Gears 2, 3 and Judgement
Assassins Creed 2
Counter Strike GO
Shadow Complex

Games that I haven't tried but I know perform worse on Xbox One:

Halo Reach
Deus Ex Human Revolution
Mass Effect

[Ezz2013]

BC On Any Console Is ‘Not A Selling Feature For Me’
Never used it on Ps3 since i still own my Ps1 and Ps2 consoles
and will never use it on Ps4.

One thing for sure
I'm NOT with Sony on selling Ps2 games to people who already own them because they can't use their owned ps2 games on ps4
That's about the only thing i would praise Microsoft for
they made BC free
This is only my opinion though.

EDIT: Dat clickbait headline though o_O

[Genuine-User]

@Ezz

I agree. Sony should offer a discount to those that already own the original, better yet make it free out of good will.

[yomfweeee]

Not sure if they already changed the title... but the current title certainly isn't click bait. That is basically what the dev said.

[AngelicIceDiamond]

@Genuine Besides Reach those games performed fine for for me.

[Christopher]

***Deus Ex Human Revolution ***

Have played it. Performs same if not better on XBO than 360.

Having said that, Stick of Truth has horrible syncing issues on XBO. Doesn't affect much, but it's there.

[travestyj]

Exactly. PS3 had actual full backwards compatibility unlike Xbox One and PS4 and no one really cared at the time. It may be a worthwhile feature at launch but not two years later.

Also I would never get rid of my old consoles again unless every game or even over 80% of my games were available and right now that is no where near the case for Xbox One. Still tons of my Xbox 360 games missing.

[Maddens Raiders]

I love PS gaming and consoles, but BC for me doesn't matter one bit. I've got all of my old consoles handy, so if I really want to play a classic in all of it's late 90's or early 2k glory, I just have to change inputs on the Bravia.

I think BC has become way too overblown of an argument because it's not really a "make or break" console decision imho.

[Genuine-User]

@AngelicIceDiamond

They all perform worse than their 360 counterparts mate.

@Christopher

Deus Ex Human Revolution performs worse on Xbox One mate - https://www.youtube.com/wat...

http://i.cubeupload.com/jRM...
http://i.cubeupload.com/VVq...

My own experience with Counter Strike and Gears of War:

http://www.dailymotion.com/...
http://www.dailymotion.com/...

[Christopher]

I'll take my own experience over that of someone else's. Trust me, the game plays just as well as the 360 if not better (boss fight with lots of explosions stuttered for me on 360, nothing like that on XBO), and your video even proves how close it is by the fraction of difference in average framerates being so minor and likely having more to do with read disc speed than anything else.

But, having said that, how does this make BC bad? I mean, your comments about it "being worse" have zero to do with it being a selling point, which people aren't even trying to make as a main selling point. But, what it is, is a way to expand the potential library of a single console by taking into account older games. Older games, by the way, that I'm playing more of right now than I am current gen games.

Are they so bad that you can't enjoy the games? Because, so far, that is far from the case for me.

[Genuine-User]

@Christopher

Talking one's experience into consideration against analysed data creates confusion, in my opinon.

If you feel that it plays just as well on the Xbox One, stating that is your prerogative.

Having said that, my experience is dissimilar to that of yours, and several technical analysis are in agreement.

I don't see how my comment is not relevant for those that have an interest in playing older games on their current-gen consoles.

You're the second person to ask me about BC being bad? I said no such thing.

I can't enjoy older games that run worse than their 360 or PS3/2 counterparts.

[Christopher]

***Talking one's experience into consideration against analysed data creates confusion, in my opinon. ***

Analyzed data of just 10 minutes of gameplay versus me having played the whole game. Again, I'll stick to what I said, especially when the data you provided supports an average framerate on both that is not even worth complaining about.

***I don't see how my comment is not relevant for those that have an interest in playing older games on their current-gen consoles. ***

Nor do I see mine as being any less relevant considering only one of us has actually played and completed the game in question. That goes for the person who did the analysis of the beginning of the game as well.

***You're the second person to ask me about BC being bad? I said no such thing.***

As it relates to the conversation at hand, there's really no other way to take your meaning. IMHO, at least. You go "it's not a selling point" and then "and old games run worse on it anyway". How is that not seen as BC being bad compared to just playing it on old hardware?

***I can't enjoy older games that run worse than their 360 or PS3/2 counterparts.***

Seems like that's your loss.

I don't have the space to keep 7 consoles connected and ready nor do I want to drag out an old console when I feel like playing an older game. As it is, I have zero space for my PS3 now, yet I have such a huge backlog of games on it.

---

Edit: I think the problem here is how people have turned too much into analysts over how they learn to enjoy games. I love to analyze things, but I'm not going to let that analysis get in the way of enjoying a game. Especially when the game is far from unplayable or incapable of being enjoyed, as is the case here. And, even then, people listen to what others tell them versus what they experience themselves. It's the same with game reviews, too many people listen to the opinion of others than experiencing things themselves.

@below: ***I think a consistent drop of 3-7 frames in various scenarios should be taken into consideration. Especially if the game is capped at 30 frames per second.***

Your screenshots prove that it's an average drop of 1fps. So, bringing up "3-7" frames here when the same has to happen in the other game as well isn't really selling me on anything. Don't ignore all the information from the video just to highlight the worst element of the one.

And, my comments here are here to say that the analysis is not the end-all-be-all. From someone who actually played it. Regardless of your desire to be as critical as you are of game performance or being fine with moving hardware back and forth, I hope others who are like me will at least not just listen to your comments and think "boy, BC sucks on XBO, I shouldn't even bother."

[Genuine-User]

I think a consistent drop of 3-7 frames in various scenarios should be taken into consideration. Especially if the game is capped at 30 frames per second.

I believe he analyzed more than 10 minutes of footage.

You can stick to your experience. But it doesn't change the analysed data at hand.

Your argument isn't any less relevant but its purely based on what You have experienced.

My original comment - "BC is not a selling feature on either system, in my opinion. Especially if games perform worse than on their original hardware."

There isn't any underlying hidden agenda or meaning to what I initially argued. Take it as it's said.

I don't see how I am at loss for not enjoying something I know I won't enjoy.

I rather plug in my old consoles to play their respective games.

---

There's a difference between forming an opinion around a technical analysis and being able to experience the drop in frames and screen tearing.

I can notice frame drops and screen tearing. I don't need DF to tell me what I can already perceive.

[3-4-5]

* BC on 3DS is amazing though, as I get to play 1,000 DS games.

Works amazing on there.

* BC on the Xbox 360 worked well to as a ton of Original Xbox games worked well.

* BC works good on Wii U getting to play Wii games as well.

* BC on XB1 + PS4 is very limited, but at least it's there.

[garrettbobbyferguson]

This. People say it's not a selling point? I didn't purchase the DSi specifically because it didn't play gameboy advance games. I still have my Phat Ps3 with backwards compatibility also.

[DarkHeroZX]

Lol BC has never been a selling point, atleast as far as last gen on foward is concerned. If it was then Sony would have never succeeded with the PS3 after the fact they removed native BC. Fact is people would rather have an affordable console with its own unique library.

[rainslacker]

While I don't think BC is as big of a selling feature as some around here state based on how no one seemed to care before it became a fan boy talking point, I think the quote referred to free BC that you talk about, and not the current solutions which aren't actually BC. MS has a solution which is somewhat like BC, but it isn't BC. However, sales don't indicate that people are rushing out to get the X1 for it's pseudo BC solution, nor do sales of the PS4 indicate that people in general are fussed about it's exclusion.

It may have been more important at the beginning of the gen to help people move on, but at this point, it's probably not that important...particularly on X1 since 360 isn't getting as many new releases as PS3 is still getting...and yes, I do mean 3rd party games.

[KwietStorm_BLM]

It said backward compatibility, but that was cute what you did. PS4 has been selling like every unit is a limited edition, so obviously BC is not a selling feature, however it is done.

[Fatal-Aim]

Of course its not. Those are just peanuts. I remember having this and I think I used it like 3 to 5 times until the current generation library got robust enough, and then I never used it again.

[NeoGamer232]

There is a lot of difference between the last two generations and previous generations. PS2 and PS3 had a lot of games in their libraries and lots of people bought games and didn't get a chance to play or finish them. BC gives them that ability even once they get rid of the old console.

I know that's not a big selling feature for the person who played 10-20 games all generation. But, for the ones where their collection is in the hundreds it can become a selling feature.

[Neonridr]

agreed, it's not like we are saying that you should go buy a console based on whether or not it has BC. It doesn't matter in that regard. But it is always a great bonus when you can sell your previous gen console knowing that all your games can still be played on the next console. The money you get from that console can be used to offset some of the cost of the next one.

Plus it's nice being able to play some of your older gems should you feel inclined.

[-Foxtrot]

Still waiting for those PS1 games...you know the ones I bought on my PS3 and kind of expected to be up and running on the PSN store within the first year of the PS4s release.

I'm not paying for them again put it that way

[I_am_Batman]

You bought them on your PS3. You can still play them on your PS3.

[-Foxtrot]

I sold my PS3 to buy a PS4...like a lot of people

[yewles1]

"I sold my PS3 to buy a PS4...like a lot of people"

*facedesk*

[-Foxtrot]

@yewles1

What's the problem? I didn't really have a choice, money doesn't grow from trees.

[2pacalypsenow]

"I sold my PS3 to buy a PS4...like a lot of people "

"What's the problem? I didn't really have a choice, money doesn't grow from trees. "

Is that Sony's fault? nowhere does it say they have to make a Ps3 game work on your Ps4, just because you don't have money doesn't mean they should loose theirs to make old games work on new tech.

[travestyj]

@Foxtrot

That is your own fault. You were never promised the ability to play any game you bought on PS3 will be playable on PS4, especially PS1 and PS2 games. If it were going to be available in the first year they would have announced it and try to use it as a way to market the console but they didn't.

[_-EDMIX-_]

Agreed Batman.

@Fox- why is that Sony or MS problem though? Do you not get how silly that is?

You know why I don't care if PS5 has BC or not? I don't plan on selling my PS4....

like ever lol.

I see me even getting a Slim after the PS5 releases.

Like I've stated so many times, if its really that valueable to you, don't sell your PS3, your basically saying the value of those titles was not enough to keep you from selling it.

Thus how great of a loss is it when you basically sold your PS3 by choice? Even if you have money issues, your again saying the PS3 wasn't worth waiting to get more money for a PS4.

I'm sorry but my PS3 is a value to me FOR REAL and its why it was never sold.

I'm playing Persona 4, FFIX and Dragon Age 1 right now on my PS3.

Value to me...thus never sold. I mean...would you sell your PS4 right now?

Your point gets very stale when revived you sold it in the first place. I would argue I value the feature more because I'm not willing to sell or get rid of it...thus kept my PS3.

[rainslacker]

I think if Sony makes them available to play on PS4, then people shouldn't be expected to have to pay for them again if they brought the digital version. Until that time comes, it seems like fox is jumping the gun expecting something that was never promised. I know Sony never promised it, but given how the software emulator is likely to work, I can't see why it shouldn't be possible, and it would be a nice show of faith to help push digital forward if people could have confidence their purchases didn't have expiration dates.

If they do the trophy thing, then people shouldn't expect to get those for free, but a discount would be nice for those who purchased it, and of course, publishers could just give them away if they really want to take care of their customers. However, they aren't required to do either.

Otherwise, people have been telling others to not expect to be able to play their content forever. New consoles, or simply them disappearing is what digital means. They were warned by me and many others, and all those people did was hit the disagree button.

I don't even know why Fox is discussing this. As of now, there is no PS1 emulation on the PS4, so it seems kind of silly to expect it when it was stated quite clearly it wouldn't be there before the console launched, and Sony hasn't even hinted at making one available. I can't imagine why they wouldn't make one available given the potential sales, but until then, it's complaining about nothing.

@Fox

Go buy a PSTV. You can get one for $30 with an 8GB memory card, which should be sufficient, and it's ultra portable. Then you can play your PS1 games to your hearts content, and have the benefit of the DS4, as well as have access to Vita games.

[I_am_Batman]

Honestly that's a problem with your expectations then.

[-Foxtrot]

How is it my fault

Sony should have the PS1 classics, the ones which were already on the PSN, on the PSN for the PS4

We'll end up waiting for years, finally get the ones we already had and by then the PS5 won't be far off.

Europe only got Spyro 1-3 the last year before the PS4 came out after years of waiting.

[yomfweeee]

Not sure what you don't understand about Batman's comment.

Did Sony ever say any purchases made on PS3 would work on PS4? No, they did not. So... if you expected that, that is your fault.

[Maddens Raiders]

Foxtrot -

Save your old consoles dude. They're classics! And there's nothing like playing the old games on the old hardware, with the old original startup sounds, and wires and memory cards to boot, just to bring back all the nostalgia. That's my two cents and how I play them.

[Automatic79]

You gonna wait a long time

[Kaneki-Ken]

Well is the fan fault because when the first PS3 had BC, nobody used the feature and it became underated, Sony lost money adding that features so the second version they took it out to cut cost. After that PlayStation decided that if they do BC again, they want to do something different like streaming which is called PSNOW which when they announced they mention PS1,2,3 games but later only PS3 games and...

[donwel]

Actually I believe one of the earlier model PS3s didn't have PS2 backwards compatibility. It was the 20GB model I think (though not 100% sure), I know the 60GB one definitely had it because that's the model I had.

[magiciandude]

Paying $10-15 for games you already own is not a good selling point at all.

[2pacalypsenow]

Remasters of Ps3 and Xbx 360 games at $40-$60 still sell very well

[freshslicepizza]

you mean those built from the ground up and not emulated? and please show me these $60 games because those are few and far between and often are bundles like uncharted which include 3 games and perform way better and look way better.

[2pacalypsenow]

They aren't built from the ground up, they are actually easier since they already have the trophies built in but still have to be made for different hardware then the modify the Resolution and Framerate to match the better hardware, takes more time to make the Ps2 ones since they have to make the trophies and test them along with making the game emulator stable since not even the PC Ps2 emulators are stable.

The last of us Remastered sold almost 5 million physical copies Uncharted over 3 million Gear of war sold over 2 million the Tomb Raider remaster sold over 1 million borderlands over 500k god of war 3 over 500k most of those aren't $60 but they cost more than $15.

[freshslicepizza]

@2pacalypsenow
"They aren't built from the ground up, they are actually easier since they already have the trophies built in but still have to be made for different hardware then the modify the Resolution and Framerate to match the better hardware, takes more time to make the Ps2 ones since they have to make the trophies and test them along with making the game emulator stable since not even the PC Ps2 emulators are stable."

the point is people are more keen on an actual upgrade much like upgrading your movie collection from dvd to bluray. there is a substantial difference and the hardware makes it possible and why people buy new hardware. so when you see games like the last of us in 1080p and running at double the frame rate consumers can validate reburying those titles much more than paying $15 to emulate ps2 games that hardly have any improvements. how many ps2 titles will add extra scenery and detail?

[TFJWM]

@moldybread It is simple if people don't think it worth rebuying an enchanced PS2 game, guess what? Don't buy it. Sony or any other company doesn't owe you an improved version of a game you bought 10+ years ago...

[freshslicepizza]

@TFJWM
"It is simple if people don't think it worth rebuying an enchanced PS2 game, guess what? Don't buy it. Sony or any other company doesn't owe you an improved version of a game you bought 10+ years ago..."

where did i say they owe me anything? this is about selling feature article and i don't think $15 is a good gesture at all to counter backwards compatibility for minimal improvements. not when they also offer playstation now which these games should be included in.

funny how sony was the one who endorsed this selling feature on the ps2 and are the ones who are shying away from it the most while trying to gouge consumers in the process. they also don't want to allow its users to decide on services like ea access in favor of their own models.

[rainslacker]

I'm quite impressed how many people kept all these old games for so long despite not having the hardware to play them. I know a lot of hardcore gamers personally...and I mean a lot...and very few of them kept their PS2 games, or other games from generations past. Many of them even just sold me their collections on the cheap because they know I collect games.

But you come here, and it seems everyone...particularly those who seem to lean towards Xbox...have a plethora of PS2 and PS1 games just sitting there collecting dust next to their PS4 to be able to jump up and throw them in the second the PS4 gets the proper update. Quite odd really how many collectors there are on N4G, despite the fact they rarely talk about old games unless it's on some specific article about old games...and the only ones that seem to get any heat there are the ones that are for console exclusive reboots or remasters. Just odd that people only seem to care at certain times....why is that I wonder?

Seriously, go look up the articles that get released here often about old games that aren't about reboots and remasters, and you won't see the people commenting in there in these threads trying to discredit Sony.

I also never saw so many collectors congregate in one place outside of a collector's forum. Of all those hardcore gamers I know, very few of them keep games like this for that long, particularly without the hardware to play them.

I can also say that on collector's forums, actual collector's don't complain about what Sony is doing the way it goes down here. Which leads me to believe that people's claims of having all these old games to be spurious at best. I think Hoffman is the only one who has proved his collection, and he's given good reasons why he wants BC which don't involve acting like you are a serious collector.

[Raziel893]

@rainslacker You know what's going on, fanboys trying to push their agenda's. I don't believe they have these so called collections either. Big time collectors like me and I have 5000 plus boxed games have plenty of systems to play these games on.

[maniacmayhem]

@Rainslacker

I'm also impressed how gamers, who mostly lean to the Sony side always seem to either never have old games from generation's past or keep their old systems to occasionally pull out of storage and play older games.

I'm a hardcore gamer and guess what, i have all my ps2 games and NO PS@. Want to know why, because my ps2 has long since broke. The disc tray doesn't work and the laser reader doesn't read the games. Which is a main reason why I went out of my way to get a ps3 fat to take advantage of its BC features.

***despite the fact they rarely talk about old games unless it's on some specific article about old games***

You're kidding right? Where else would you expect these people to talk about their old games? Would you talk about cooking french pastries in a Soccer match up article?

***and you won't see the people commenting in there in these threads trying to discredit Sony.***

No, will see Sony defenders claiming how BC isn't needed, how no one buys new consoles to play old games or how BC isn't a system seller or how people who own a VHS tape want a free blu-ray copy of the game. No one discrediting Sony, just downplaying people's interest in BC and the other companies that offer it like Nintendo and MS.

But of course it's all agendas and fanboys as once again these people have to prove to YOU if they are a true collector or not.

[Kal-V3]

You don't have to buy them and you can play the games you already own on their original systems.

I really don't know why people still use the ol' "I have to pay 10-15 dollars for game i already own" You don't have to do anything. Sony isn't forcing you to buy these games. I could have bought Rouge Galaxy, but i didn't because Sony isn't forcing me to buy anything.

I own Persona 3 and Digital Devil Saga 1+2 on PS3. If they come out on PS4, I don't have to buy them again. I can continue to play them on my PS3.

For those who sold their old consoles and still have the game with them (for some reason), Its not Sony's fault you sold your old console. Weather you buy a game digitally or physically, you are unable to play those games anymore without the system they belong to. So selling your PS3 with your digital PS2 games on them, then getting mad that the improved PS4 version isn't free for you is down right idiotic.

[travestyj]

If you own the games why wouldn't you own the platform the games are playable on? Pretty pointless to keep games and not the console. You also bought those games knowing they weren't going to be playable on future platforms and it was never promised either.

[nitus10]

For people who already own PS2 games and want to play those games on their PS4 then I guess you only have two choices , pay for the digital download or just play your owned game on the device that will play them.

Yes it would be nice if I could download those PS2 games I already own like a normal digital download or rip (could be a legal issue here) and authenticate by putting my original media in like you now do with the PS4 install by media. Oh well I still have my working BC PS3 and in the event it dies and is not economically repairable I can still play them under emulation.

Of course if I don't have a particular PS2 game that I really want to play the I do expect to pay for it. The thing is I do have games for the PS4 that I want to play as well and they do take precedence over older games.

[Walker]

But PS2 Emulation On PS4 Is ‘An Absolute Selling Feature For Me’

[nitus10]

I have over sixty PS2 games however the games that I have for the PS4 take precedence.

Not only that there are more games coming for the PS4 that I would also like to play. I even have PS3 games that I have not yet finished so PS1 and PS2 games that I would like to replay have a much lower priority.

Even if I could play my PS2 games on my PS4 for free I would still prefer playing PS4 games although I do get a nostalgia kick every few months, however considering I predominately play RPG's I can't really allocate that much time to play an RPG that I have previously played and finished.

[Pancit_Canton]

Playing PS4 games on the PS4 is the selling features for me.lol

[DragonDDark]

Exactly.

[Sonyslave3]

Well I guess the guyz at Sony Corps didn't get that memo because they believe Remaster ps3 games is a good thing and also charging u for PS Now which they hype up at E3 it was one of their mega bombs.

Sleeping Dogs: Definitive Edition
Nathan Drake Collection
God of War III
Heavenly Rain
Tomb Raider
Dark Sider 2
Devil May Cry 4
Dead Pool
Racthet and Clank
Resident Evil Zero HD
Dark Souls II
Devil May Cry: Definitive Edition
Dishonored: Definitive Edition
Saints Row IV: Re-Elected
The Last of Us

[_-EDMIX-_]

They? LMFAO!

Some of those titles you listed are not made by Sony.

Also hundreds of new games released in the last 2 years, you might have just listed 90% of the remasters soooooooo that point is pretty bad.

Sony, MS, Nintendo etc are making more new games, then remasters.

[Doabarrelroll]

First off, MS has as many remasters as Sony. Two of their "greatest line up ever games" were remasters. Ok and quite it with the whole MS victim hypocrisy already. Both sides of fanboys are guilty of it, no point trying to point it out every time.

[nitus10]

I do have some of those games that I already play on my PS3 so I am not really that interested in re buying them to play on my PS4.

One game I don't have is Dark Souls 2 which I was actually going to get for my PS4 however I need a PS+ subscription to get the network features. Of course I could get it for my PS3 and then that issue goes away.

The reason I don't have a PS+ subscription is that I would rarely make use of it since I have never been a fan of on-line games, especially on-line only, I don't see the value for me.

Yes I am well aware I can get "free" or cheaper digital downloads but I still prefer getting the game I want to play when I want it and not wait.

[MachuchalBrotha316]

You do know that some of those games are on Xbox aswell?

[Guyfamily999]

If I could pop any game in and play, that would be really cool. I know that that isn't feasible with the thousands of games released on PS2. It probably wouldn't be worth Sony's time though, especially if it didn't make them a profit. They aren't in the financial situation to spend money on features that not many will use. I've still got my PS2 if I've got the urge to replay something, it's just the convenience factor.

Wouldn't it be cool if they made an emulator that could play any PS2 game, but only the selectively optimized at a higher resolution?

[MCTJim]

PCSX2..cant see why Sony wont use it

[Guyfamily999]

Well, copyright reasons and such, but I know what you mean. Just that general type of thing. Pretty sure the PS4 is capable, it just wouldn't be profitable.

I just don't like the selective titles fiasco (which is needed for optimization). I'd prefer a system where all games are playable, and Sony selectively optimizes the games that they see garner the most interest. They could make money by charging a flat rate for the emulator (sounds horrible, but they need the money from somewhere).

[2pacalypsenow]

Because PCSX2 is unstable. Its not a priority for Sony since the amount of people who want BC is very small.

[rainslacker]

Having an emulator itself for what digital content is there but not upgraded with the extras could, and likely would, be a nice source of revenue. Once the emulator is complete, if they are working on a general one, then they could then sell the digital copies which were already on PS3 on the PS4, and I see no reason why the publishers wouldn't want that revenue stream as well.

It would make more sense to have an emulator for PSP or PS1 on the PS4 given how much content there is available for it. There aren't that many digital PS2 games available yet for either the PS3 or the PS4, but I'd imagine if an emulator became available then pubs would be willing to put up more PS2 games.

I find it rather rediculous that people are making such a big deal about it now, when it barely was a week long fan boy talking point last gen when Sony put the PS2 classics up on the PS3. PS1 was always BC though, regardless of PS3 model, so people didn't fuss about the digital versions costing money....and it would be nice if Sony could offer something along those lines, but there are hardware issues which serve up licensing issues so it is what it is. People wanted a cheap console, and you get what you pay for...in this case, less features.

[esmittystud101]

There is hardly any games on PS2 For PS4. The only one on there I would consider getting would be Twisted Metal Black. But they need to be more around the $7.99 range and not $9.99. Most of the older games they offer for Wii U is $7.99 and I'm talking about titles like Super Mario 64, Super Punch Out, Donkey Kong Country 1,2,3.

But on the other hand there is not one BC game I have been able to pop in and play on the Xbox One either. I get its only been out a little over two months but until they get the Bioshock Series and CoD World at War, and Black Ops 1 and 2, I'm not even going to use it.

[travestyj]

You should really get Dark Cloud 2. Amazing game.

[esmittystud101]

I'll actually check this out. Nice looking out bud.

[Realms]

BC is a niche feature consider the back catalog of current games now available and ask yourself if the average gamer and the more casual gamer care, 9 out of 10 times they only care about current or upcoming games. Unless you care because of the console war it really becomes just another feature nothing more nothing less.

Yes there is a percentage of people that care about BC but in the grand scheme of things they are a minority by enlarge.

[Tsunade]

BC is good for the first 4 to 5 months of a new console and even for that is not a selling point for me.

Microsoft sells you BC as the ultimate feature ever! Of course, they have to because their console is loosing the console war miserably and they need to sell you any dream in the cloud. But back to reality, BC has never been a selling point for any console in history.

[2pacalypsenow]

People seem to forget that MS gave up on BC on the 360 after 2 years because no one used it.

[Sonyslave3]

Dude the old xbox didn't really have any games lol compare to the xbox 360 it Bc collection is huge and plus the graphic on xbox 360 still hold up versus the old xbox original .

[Raziel893]

@sonyslave3 Well since this is about BC using disc the 360 has 1,162 disc base games released so your right it is huge. However the OG Xbox has 969 games released. Not too big of a gap like your trying to claim, but nice try though.

[rainslacker]

Their BC is probably a bit more relevant because 360 emulation is only one generation removed from this one. After all this time, I doubt PS2 and PS1 emulation is that important to as many people percentage wise as you see around here. I know 3 people personally who collect old games, but lots of other gamers through socializing, and most of them couldn't care less, because they don't own the older games. of those three people I know personally who have old games, they all have hardware that can play them. I've never, even in collector's forums, seen so many people who have games, yet miraculously have hardware that can't play them due to failure, or they sold it. It defies all logic there are so many failed systems after ten years, because if you can make it past 5 years with these old systems, they'll probably last forever.

When it comes to Sony's offering of PS2 games right now on PS4, this issue doesn't effect them, because if they went out and brought the games, it'd probably cost them more, and they wouldn't get the extras stuff like upgrades or trophy support.

I'm seriously starting to doubt anyone who claims they have lots of PS2 games they've been storing for the eventuality of the PS4 to get BC, and somehow went through all of last gen with a console that couldn't play them since those were a small percentage of the overall systems sold.

[MachuchalBrotha316]

Wrong!!! MS didt sell it as an ultimate feature. It was the number one feature that Xbox gamers wanted on feedback and MS delivered.

[MCTJim]

Exactly...the #1 requested feature. MS delivered. I love it and its shows MS was and is still listening to its fans.

I dont care who tries to spin it, MS gave us BC and from experience it is working great.

[gangsta_red]

BC IMO is a selling feature. It's just another feature added to an already list of great options/features a console should have.

And BC sure comes in handy when GwG releases a free 360 game that you can also dl and play on your Xbox One.

Anyways, I rather have a console with the option of BC or something equivalent than to not have any at all.

[nitus10]

BC IMHO is a value added feature not a selling feature.

[Christopher]

I agree with this statement. I love BC, but it's not a selling feature overall. Perhaps for _some_ people it is, but overall it's just value added. Majority of the market doesn't give a care for last gen games, they want the latest and greatest.

[gangsta_red]

I agree with that.

[MachuchalBrotha316]

To me its not a selling feature. If MS could garuantee that all games would work with BC then yeah. But for now, I agree with Nitus10 as it being more of a value feature.

[gangsta_red]

I can get behind that then.

[DragonbornZ]

It's subjective. Gave my 360 to my sister and niece so they could watch movies/Netflix, but even before that I considered BC a big deal. I still haven't played a ton of games from last gen (Red Dead, yeah I know i'm missing out D:) and i'd love to continue playing some mp games i played on the 360.

UUUUUUGH I need me some mw2 and bo2!

[lastking95]

I know right I need RDR

[rainslacker]

It is a great feature to have no doubt. Can't see why one would say they don't want it...even if they don't intend to use it.

However, being a great feature, and being a feature that people will buy the system for are two different things. Kind of like the TV stuff on the X1. Subjectively speaking, it's cool and all, but did anyone seriously buy their X1 for it?

Sony made it kind of a big deal on the PS2, and it was appreciated that they added it to the PS3 initially, but I think as the generation goes on, the selling feature of it really diminishes, and it just becomes a nice added value feature which some people may find desirable.

[oSHINSAo]

Plot twist "Sony announce Backwards Compatibility"... Wow, That´s a selling point to me, PS4 is the best console ever, Greatness awaits... (Sorry guys, didn´t want to do this, but editors always want to put down every hit that MS make )

[Sonyslave3]

I know right I remember all those articles about PsNow is going to be a game changer but soon as Ms announce their and it free oooh Bc doesn't matter to me anymore lol.

[rainslacker]

So basically we'll see Sony fans do what MS did in comparison to the pre-launch announcement where everyone on both sides said it wasn't a big deal, but now it is because X1 has a somewhat supported BC alternative?

Sounds fun, can't wait till the day when comments such as yours are the predominate talking point in the console war. Sad when the console war is more about calling out the users on the other side, instead of addressing the pointless hardware differences or subjective topic of games.

I can play the hypocrisy game too. Sorry, I didn't want to do this, but you forced my hand. I apologize it didn't work out for you this time.

If the time comes where Sony offers a solution which is acceptable, can't we all just be happy we're getting it from our preferred consoles, and stop trying to find ways to twist it into something to bash the other side?

I'm happy to have the feature on my X1. I'd love to have it on my PS4. If it wasn't on either, then it wouldn't change my thoughts on the consoles in any way, because I didn't buy either of them for BC, although I did know that I could play some 360 games on the X1.

[lastking95]

Funny how roles reversed. What ever happened to fan service? Sony preventing features coming to the console so they can make money off an alternative smh. I understand they were going under and need as much money as they can get but damn...it just isn't the sony I remember.

[nitus10]

When did Sony or Microsoft for that matter promise backwards compatibility for the PS4 and XB1 at launch? Answer, they didn't.

Two years after both consoles launched Sony offers selective PS2 emulation and Microsoft offers Selective XBox360 emulation. Both of these are a value added service but they are not essential although to a vocal minority they maybe perceived as such.

[Realms]

I simply don't understand this mentality MS had been charging for trivial things since it first launched and by enlarge has been praised for their so called better online service that they have charged for years. Sony has had BC for three generations and no one ever made a big deal about it until now why?

Simple because the X1 is BC so what so is the WiiU so was the PS3 so have many other systems yet it's not a big deal you want to know why because many people don't care only those that buy into the console wars.

[Deltaguy]

Didn't buy a xbox one to play 360 games..so i agree idc at all about BC and as far as i can tell microsoft is 2yrs late on that feature..people dont care, and it didn't sell the console in 2015...

[Sonyslave3]

People don't care for Bc but Ps Now was one of Sony bomb shell announcement back at E3 and people where hype for it.

Now Ms come along with their answer to Bc and it doesn't charge you, all the sudden Bc doesn't matter

[Deltaguy]

ps Now was not advertised as BC..ps now is it's own service that you can choose to use or not...

[Realms]

I don't know any objective person saying that BC is not a fantastic feature to have, the problem is fanboy's trying so hard to make seem like BC is somehow so important that it's a system seller or difference maker when it's not. The average gamer and casual gamer just doesn't care and the PS4 numbers proof that.

[lastking95]

Damag control over 9000. Ps2 bc isn't a big deal but it's the principal of it. Stop trying to sweep it under the rug like people tried to do with ea access.

[tulholdren]

BC never been a system seller for me since I keep my old systems and the few people I know that have a one never talk about it. It only becauses a issue if you sold your old system I guess. The question I ask people is if Micro or Sony never said anything about it would people be this crazy about it?

[ironmonkey]

ps4 is for ps4 games thats all i wanted to pay and play it for. i was never even for playstation now either. when you buy brand new stuff your gonna want brand new content.

[jonrhoades87]

I got over it. Still have my little PS2 and it's far outlived the 80gb bc PS3 I had, which finally succumbed to ylod a few years ago. Sold all my PS3 games. Now I have a PS4 and couldn't care less it doesn't have legacy support.

I have the red Mario anniversary Wii and don't have a single gamecube game anymore (my old cube got stolen and I have no desire to rebuild my collection looking at asking prices nowadays). I care more about the GC controller sockets more than anything lol.

[Derpy]

I think bc is nice as long as it works as intended. I have so many systems in my game room that any time I can make extra space by retiring one because of bc, it opens up space for another. I'm also not one of those who think just because a game is old or has older graphics, it's no longer any good. I'll play any game from any generation if I find it fun. Anyone who bashes old games just because of their age regardless of gameplay is either very young or a casual gamer. There are a lot of people who enjoy their older games and a whole marketplace built around them. So to say that bc is not a selling point is very naive. It might not be for you, but that doesn't go for everyone.

[ShadowKing-]

its a nice feature, but that was not the reason i bought a next gen console

[Orionsangel]

SSX Tricky and SSX 3 on PS4 and will call it day :)

[Tito08]

As of late, I've been seeing reports from a dev of a game I've never heard of before, and the subject always seems to be about PS2 emulation on PS4, not really buying into that Gamingbolt bullcrap of reporting, smh.

[FlexLuger]

Is it a selling point? it is if you only own an Xbox 360...and there are a lot of those owners out there.

Is it a selling point to anybody else? no

But it IS a great feature. I was just playing skullgirls, metal slug and ikaruga earlier via BC and they work fantastically ( and also feel nicer to play thanks to the XB1 controller)

Most of my x360 games were digital, so its a nice surprise seeing titles being added every so often. I never did get wound to playing toy soldiers: cold war.....bought it ages ago. I can download it and play it once I finish the first toy soldiers, which I am also playing via BC.I like the feature and see it as a plus.

[Warshade]

True backwards compatibility is a great feature. When the PS3 came out and could play PS2 games I was happy enjoying my back log when there was a lack of titles for the system. In any early console life cycle I think it can really breath life into a system. Since most consoles have simply become PCs in sleek designed boxes so its really a software issue to create compatibility in future generations anyway.