710°

Microsoft says ditching Kinect allows "10 per cent additional GPU performance".

"Yes, the additional resources allow access to up to 10 percent additional GPU performance," said a company representative. "We're committed to giving developers new tools and flexibility to make their Xbox One games even better by giving them the option to use the GPU reserve in whatever way is best for them and their games."

Read Full Story >>
eurogamer.net
mrpsychoticstalker3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

There's a lot devs can do with more power! Good moves by Microsoft. I am having fun with the Xbox games as they are, but if this makes them even better that's great news.

christocolus3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

Well a lot of them have been asking for this from the very beginning so let's see what they do it.

Mr Pumblechook3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

POLYGON report that the Xbox One is 10% more powerful which is great for gamers and basically means the death of Kinect exclusive games although it will still be used for voice control and OS navigation.

It's funny that Polygon make this their headline story and are pushing the benefits of their preferred platform.

Volkama3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

Not sure what you are getting at Pumblechook, the source is Microsoft.

NewMonday3704d ago

How does this work for those who have Kinect?

Gazondaily3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

@NewMonday

I assume it just means that games that utilise the Kinect won't benefit from this added 10% gpu performance.

"With this SDK, we will include new options for how developers can use the system reserve as well as more flexibility in our natural user interface reserve (voice and gesture). "

I don't think you will see any difference between the new Kinect-less Xbox One's and the original ones that shipped with the Kinect.

What is basically means is, ALL Xbox One's will get a 10% boost in GPU performance.

ZodTheRipper3704d ago

I'm glad that Microsoft was forced to ditch Kinect ...maybe they'll overthink their priorities now. I just don't expect any substantial sales growth from this. They actually raised the price for the box itself, it should have been under 400$.

u got owned3704d ago

@NewMonday

I dont know if you are serious... Common sense buddy, use it.

ZodTheRipper3704d ago

^If if's that easy you should be able to explain it. First the statements that make it complicated:

"Microsoft has confirmed that this boost in performance is in fact due to Kinect being stripped from the package."

"we're releasing a new SDK making it possible for developers to access additional GPU resources previously reserved for Kinect and system functions"

So what if you have Kinect connected but a game uses these 10% additional GPU power? Either Kinect won't work during that game (at all) or the game runs 10% worse than on a Xbox without Kinect or am I missing something?

Eonjay3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

@Mr Pumblechook

Polygon's article is extremely misleading and it doesn't do anything for Xbox One. They make it sound like people who already have an Xbox One wont get the power boost. And that is just not true.

They said:

"The upcoming Kinect-less Xbox One will receive a 10 percent boost in its performance due to the stripping out of the peripheral, Microsoft told Eurogamer."

They are just spreading confusion. And then they claim that Microsoft confirmed it. Which is even more misleading. You don't have to buy the new system to get the boost.

creatchee3704d ago

Simple answer: Xbox One games are no longer required to reserve a certain amount of processing power for some Kinect commands. This power can now be used for any other function that developers would like to use it for. It works this way, whether or not you have a Kinect and whether or not it is plugged in.

Anon19743704d ago

So will games be automatically dumbed down slightly for Xbox One with Kinect?

My guess is that devs will still develop for the lowest common denominator power wise (the Xbox One with Kinect) and simply let the Kinect-less Xbox One do it's own thing. Realistically, we're not suddenly going to see better games as devs retool their titles to take advantage of that extra sliver of power that's only going to be accessible to some users. It's going to be business as usual for devs, and if you want the extra power boost so games run slightly smoother, you'll just choose to go it without Kinect. That's my thought.

DragonKnight3704d ago

So basically Microsoft is perfectly fine with ditching all support for Kinect after saying they wouldn't and once again creating a development environment where there is a fractured userbase of people with Kinect, and people without Kinect.

Can they never stick to even one thing they've said?

Gazondaily3704d ago

@Dragon

We've kind of gone past that now. This is about improved performance of the X1 as a result of their decision to ship a Kinect-less X1.

DragonKnight3704d ago

@Septic: The point still remains though. If developers do a blanket development process of assuming that Kinect is not being used, then the people who DO use Kinect don't get to benefit from it. Of course, they probably could just NOT use their Kinect, but then they're left with an expensive paperweight.

It all boils down to the fact that Microsoft are still running around like a chicken with their heads cut off, trying to narrow a gap they never will be able to narrow.

NewMonday3704d ago

how does the OS operate without this 10%? snap? skyp? chat? multi-tasking?...etc

shouldn't journalists be asking these questions?

alexkoepp3704d ago

With Ryse already being the best looking console game ever released, I can't wait to see what more power is going to bring us!

u got owned3704d ago

Major Nelson tweet:

"Dear Media: The GPU change was developer facing. Unplugging Kinect does not get you more HP. Devs have to code to the new specs. "

that should clear all confusion.

sinspirit3704d ago

I thought they had already done this when they removed the mandatory Kinect connection.

Why would they dedicate any GPU functions to the Kinect anyways? UI voice commands sure, but those don't need 10% of a GPU, the developers should have had control over Kinect resource allocation in the first place.

SilentNegotiator3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

@NewMonday

Developers will have to develop games so that it works both ways, shut off Kinect entirely, or not use the supposed 10% boost at all.

Early adapters will get probably get screwed with a bunch of games that don't allow simultaneous "essential accessory" use or else developers will have the extra hurdle of spending more time developing it for two different situations.

4Sh0w3704d ago

-The Devils in the details:

"Yes, the additional resources allow access to up to 10 per cent additional GPU performance. We're committed to giving developers new tools and flexibility to make their Xbox One games even better by giving them the option to use the GPU reserve in whatever way is best for them and their games."

"GPU reserve" means the previous SDK partitioned 10% of the GPU for future Kinect functionality/games, this will NOT affect the current the UI functionality or current Kinect games as it wasn't being used anyway, just intentionally reserved for future Kinect based future plans/games. #1If you remember prior to X1 launch micro already stated that the Kinect based GPU resources along with the OS footprint will be reduced with new SDK's, no different than 360. #2 Again yes this will give devs who want it more power but I am dissapointed that this points to them not exploring bigger more advanced kinect implementation in future games.

aragon3704d ago

ok for everyone here wondering if xbone with kinect will be less powerful? the answer no, its now up to developers to develope their games using the 10 percent that was reserved for kinect also prior to launch they already statrd they had an extra 10 percent sitting around for kinect that was not being used and that they would hand it over to the devs. what it means is that all games that were developed before the 10 percent was freed up wont benefit from the extra power, so if u buy a wolfenstein new order with your kinectless xbone, wolfenstein wouldnt have got that extra 10 percent but games that are made with the extra 10 percent will have a little tiny boost, this is all just pr nonsense and polygon and eurogamer are trying to make ms look like even bigger douchebags in the publics eye because there articles insinuate that early adopters will get screwed out of power boost which is wrong. its now up to devs to use the extra 10 percent toward their game if they arent going to use kinect integration with the game they are making

Pro Racer3704d ago

As someone who has a PC and is into overclocking, I have to say that 10% is a pretty huge difference. Shame on MS for trying to force the use of Kinect at such an expense to the GPU.

Glad they have finally reconsidered on the mandatory Kinect issue.

BattleAxe3704d ago

It's a good move. People didn't like Kinect on the 360, and most people don't like it or need it on XBOX:One. Great news for better game performance on Xbox.

cooperdnizzle3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

@Pro Racer. Tell me one thing that 10% would do to one game other than maybe a couple of frames? I have A pc too, I mean pretty much every gamer has a pc gaming rig.

First there would be no way of knowing if your over clocking is actually giving you a 10% boost. Second, I really can't think of anything other then a couple of frames that over clocking helps you achieve. It doesn't give you the option to turn on any other graphical options there already available. Plus overclocking just burns up you graphics cards. Just saying your point is very far fetched.

RedDevils3704d ago

So in other word, Kinect is just another failure gimmick lmao

UltraNova3704d ago

aragon got it right.

All games made before this 10% reserve got freed up will not benefit from it, as console games are not coded for scale-ability but for a fixed platform, in short only games after this will benefit or in the highly unlikely case of a dev going back and re-optimizing their original code and release it via a patch.

Wizard_King3704d ago

So if the GPU is going to perform about 10% better does that mean Titanfall will be getting a patch to up the resolution from 792p? Or that future games might have a bees dick chance of seeing 1080/60 with AA turned on?

/s

doubt it

DevilOgreFish3703d ago

All this means is that future games will be able to utilize more of the GPU. that's great. kinect based games probably won't because they'll require the device.

so pretty much kinect-less games will benefit this.

mmcglasson3703d ago

@alexkoepp

Killzone looks better and plays much better than Ryse.

Infamous is even better. Both Killzone and Infamous have a lot more going on in the environment too.

+ Show (25) more repliesLast reply 3703d ago
Copen3704d ago

What a lot of people don't know is the majority of this 10 percent has been available since January of this year so this is nothing earth shattering or new. Even with this and DX12 the gap will only widen and MS won't catch Sony sorry it's the truth. MS needs to just stop trying to compete with the ps4 on a power level because it's a battle they simply can't win this gen. They need to focus on other things that set their console apart from the competition because the power difference will remain and the games have shown this is the biggest power disparity between consoles in well over a decade.

Deltaohio3704d ago

So because the xbox will will never be as powerful as the PS4 MS should quit giving developers more resource for their games? Yes. Logic at its finest.

Elit3Nick3704d ago

Lol how will the gap widen if the X1 is using more of its power and using a technique that the PS4 doesn't have(DX12) Microsoft are masters of software, if you seriously believe that a hardware company can come up with better optimizations, then you are yet another delusional fanboy

scotmacb3704d ago

You talk crap the worst one was ghosts everything else you need to pause a comparsion video to tell and some are the same

sinspirit3704d ago

@Elit3Nick

DX12 isn't a technique. It's an API. Just like OpenGL. But, OpenGL is less bloated, supports Window's, Mac, and Linux, as well as whatever products are designed to run it, like PS4. DX12 is doing what OpenGL already allowed us to do, but because DX is a leading standard for PC it is holding back OpenGL because not many developers take advantage of it.

Btw, X1 already has a low level API, a modified DX, that already delivers exactly what DX12 is supposed to do a year from now.

M1ST4K33704d ago

I have a PS4 and yet I can say your statement makes 0 sense...
Development should never stop! Improvement shouldn't either.

Perhaps if MSFT didn't announce the DX12 performance boost, Sony wouldn't put team ICE working on an improvement (this is just an example... Improvement leads to more improvement)

Just stop being in pain because the other console got better... what the hell!? It's not that PS4 got worse, it's the Xbox one that got better!

Elit3Nick3704d ago

@sinspirit Even the current low level APIs aren't capable of balanced multi-threading, that alone will yield a sizeable improvement in efficiency, but either way, it's still an improvement that will nudge the X1 closer to the PS4, the amount is yet to be determined.

Why are you and the fanboys here so driven to put down anything xbox related, it obviously doesn't concern yourselves if you're bashing, and it's simply ignorance to think that xbox won't have the more efficient optimizations. Think of it this way, an improvement in the X1's performance will yield better looking games on both platforms, since they start with the lowest denominator and scale it up to the others

sinspirit3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

@Elit3Nick

Balanced multi-threading? That's one of the benefits of DX12 on PC. It will be improved for X1 of course but it isn't new, so it's not actually a big performance gain. This already exists on consoles. Sony is working on improving their multi-threading on PS3 as well as PS4. I'm not bragging about Sony. I just think you should know that it isn't a Microsoft thing. Seriously, stop finding terms and blindly trying to justify something with terms you don't understand.

warczar3703d ago

@Elit3Nick

"Microsoft are masters of software"

Spoken like someone who has never used Windows NT, Windows Vista, or Windows 8. All perfect examples of how Microsoft sucks balls at software.

jackdaniels3703d ago

@war car

and yet MS are one the richest software companies on the planet...man it must pay well to suck balls eh :)

Deltaohio3701d ago

@warczar

"Masters" of software not masters of knowing wtf ppl want from software. There is a difference.

+ Show (7) more repliesLast reply 3701d ago
miyamoto3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

great news?

So what happened to these?

"Microsoft: "Absolutely no plans" to release Xbox One without Kinect
Phil Harrison squashes possibility of Kinect-less bundle of upcoming next-generation console."

"Absolutely no plans at all," Harrison said when asked if a Kinect-free bundle may be offered. "We think Kinect is an integral part of our platform. All of the magical experiences that you get, both as a games-player and also the way you navigate the system are made even more amazing because of Kinect."

Harrison said that because every Xbox One console will come with Kinect, developers can design projects for the "widest possible install base."

"Xbox One is Kinect," Harrison said at the time. "They are not separate systems. An Xbox One has chips, it has memory, it has Blu-ray, it has Kinect, it has a controller. These are all part of the platform ecosystem."

Source: http://metro.co.uk/2013/08/...

Again.
Microsoft: "no plans" to release an Xbox One without Kinect"

Speaking with Eurogamer yesterday ahead of the announcement of the first Xbox One price cut, Xbox UK marketing chief Harvey Eagle said Microsoft was sticking with Kinect because the company feels it's "integral to the Xbox One experience".

"[A Kinect-less Xbox One] is not in our plans at all," he stressed.

"As we've said from the very beginning, we believe Kinect is an absolutely integral part of the Xbox One experience."

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

So what happened to this:

"It was really all about consumer choice," Spencer said in an interview with CNET. "Like we would have said on 360, the best experience was with the biggest hard drive possible. On Xbox One, I think the best experience is with Kinect."

http://www.cnet.com/news/mi...

So how is getting a console with "the best experience" removed, great news?

How about fixing M$'s conflicting PR message disaster and actually growing a backbone...that will be great news?

creatchee3704d ago

@miyamoto

You can still buy a Kinect if you want to. You now just have an option not to if you don't want one. The buyer who chooses not to assumes the liability of not getting the intended "full" experience, but at a lower price of entry. Are we really at the point where having an option is a bad thing?

nix3704d ago

@creatchee:

what's the point of buying Kinect if they are planning to ditch it?

Belasco3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

Judging from your comment history, you have an obsessive hatred for Microsoft. You seem to be a Sony fanboy I guess, but your comments are 99% about MS or the Xbox One.Question, could MS do ANYTHING that pleases you? Seek help. OT this performance boost is something made available to the devs, Kinect will not be affected, what is so hard to understand about this?

Gambloid3704d ago

@miyamoto

Change the record FFS

gamer78043704d ago

You see. Change happens when you appoint a new head of a division....

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 3703d ago
Muffins12233704d ago

But I can guarantee you that every Microsoft first party game will use kinect in some way....so there goes that 10% for what games it actually matter for.

imt5583704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

Microsoft FREED UP EXISTING GPU RESOURCES with new SDK's, NOT ADDED NEW ONES!!!!

Total of 1.32 TFLOPS 10% were reserved for Kinect!!!!

Earth to Xbone fans!!!

Wizard_King3704d ago

Yeha it's not like suddenly the GPU got better or runs faster it's still the same GPU. Microtard just decided to drop the dead in the water Kinect and give the devs the locked up space for it.

Over all everyone who owns a launch unit should be pissed off at this. They bought the machine with MS PR going on about Kinect magic, integral part of the experience, blah blah bullshit. Now that part of the X1 is effectively dead and will see little to no further development. Expect the same cheap dance dance, sports fit and on the rails shooter games that's it.

I would be in favor of a full refund for everyone with a launch unit upset with this, pending a class action lawsuit guaranteeing the refunds to all.

agame9143704d ago

I don't understand how ditching a camera adds a 10% boost to the gpu. So does that mean when I have my xbox hooked up with kinect my graphics will be 10% less then a person without kinect?? So when I unplug my camera for my ps4 I'll get a 10% increase???

Obscured

Belasco3704d ago

Breathtaking amount of disagrees, must mean it's not true.

Smokeeye1233704d ago

The fact that 94 people downvoted your comment shows how much Sony fans makeup this site. N4PO (News for playstation owners)

Welshy3704d ago

The problem being, anywhere up to 5 million people already have Kinect since it was bundled with their console.

XB1 is already lagging noticeably behind PS4, are they really going to have those 5 million with Kinect have even WORSE versions of games since they won't have this "10% GPU boost"?

Of course this won't be utilised, if I was an early adopter of the XB1 who was FORCED to have a Kinect, I'd already be pissed that the device I had forced upon me was getting significantly reduced support, let alone being 10% down on performance for future titles.

ITPython3704d ago

10% of nothing is still nothing.

Also didn't MS give the devs access to 8% of the Kinects reserves a long time ago? If so, this means devs are only going to see a 2% boost.

Ghost_Nappa3704d ago

107 disarees? Seriously people wtf? Is it a crime to like xbox?

imuze3704d ago

you just went full retard.

TOTSUKO3704d ago

Im going to miss saying "Xbox, Go Home"

+ Show (10) more repliesLast reply 3701d ago
aceitman3704d ago

Ok so last time they optimized x1 the boost increased by 10 percent, so in other words not much of a difference with and without kinect.

tuglu_pati3704d ago

Huh? 10% is a nice boost.This could be used for better framerates or better resolution.

GUTZnPAPERCUTZ3704d ago

No, That was Overall system performance boost. This is 10% just for GPU, so it will be noticed more visually in games.

Neonridr3704d ago

Interesting news no doubt. Hopefully devs can put that extra power to use.

ginsunuva3704d ago

They can't.
Some people will still have Kinect connected, so they have to cater to the lowest common denominator.

kneon3704d ago

No, the dev can disable Kinect when their game is running so that they can use all the power available on the device.

marlinfan103704d ago

its already confirmed it has nothing to do with the kinect

snookiegamer3703d ago

10% GPU gain can only be a good thing....but surely MS didn't use the term 'Ditched', as that would seem disrespectful to those early adopters would bought into the Kinect vision.

truefan13704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

I just don't think anyone reads these days. Phil Spencer as direct as possible tweeted the June update allows for 10% more GPU performance. The way article after article has worded it makes it sound like it's for the kinect less XB1 only.

psycho I know you didn't write it, but the title and premise of the article is very misleading. Below is the exact quote, where does he mention kinect less.

Phil Spencer @XboxP3 · 22h

June #XboxOne software dev kit gives devs access to more GPU bandwidth. More performance, new tools and flexibility to make games better

@kayant Agreed.

Kayant3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

"Phil Spencer as direct as possible tweeted the June update allows for 10% more GPU performance." - No he give no info on the measurable reserve being freed up. All he said was more gpu bandwidth being available.
https://twitter.com/XboxP3/...
It was eurogamer with their inquiry that found it was related to the kinect reserve.

"In June we're releasing a new SDK making it possible for developers to access additional GPU resources previously reserved for Kinect and system functions. The team is continually calibrating the system to determine how we can give developers more capabilities. With this SDK, we will include new options for how developers can use the system reserve as well as more flexibility in our natural user interface reserve (voice and gesture)" - Not all of it is going they still need it for system function (snap, etc).

But yh I don't know why Polygon are being misleading here and putting it only for kinectless Xbox when if they bothered to quote the whole update from eurogamer it's a general thing for all variants of XB1.

Rockefellow3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

I think it's the way they're wording it. It applies to ALL Xbox Ones, but the 10% increase is obtained by allocating resources previously designated to Kinect-- as referenced in that tweet of Phil's. This means that even people with Kinects will be able to get this power boost in games that utilize it-- they'll just have to unplug (or disable) their Kinect.

To most people, that would mean a "Kinect-less Xbox One"; you have Kinect, but it's not being used, so the X1 is Kinect-less. It might be a little hard for some people around here to understand, I know.

Dudebro903704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

No one needs to unplug their Kinect.

Its simple. Microsoft reserved 10% of the gpu for Kinect to be used in all games, even if it didn't use Kinect.

Now that 10% is not forced. Period.

Brim3704d ago

idk why you're getting disagrees .. i completely agree that's the only reason why i clicked on this particular story.

OrangePowerz3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

"The additional resources allow access to up to 10 per cent additional GPU performance."

It's not for Kinectless X1 only, but it is resources that are allocated to Kinect previously. So yeah the title is rather wrong.

GW2123704d ago

Yeah, I literally read the title and had a sh*t. So I buy a launch day edition and get screwed for doing so? That would be a complete disaster.

I think you're right though, it will be up to the software developers as to how to use the Kinect bandwidth. I love the Kinect for "out of game" stuff like turning it on, snapping, starting apps, etc. I'm not a huge fan of actual games that use Kinect so I'd rather they "shut off" the Kinect in-game in order to get better performance.

MCTJim3704d ago (Edited 3704d ago )

Trufan, I got it and get it, the new SDK allows you to ignore the reserve for Kinect and utilize it somewhere else. The Kinect can still be used like it always does without affecting performance..ie the reserve for it being used in games..if the game developer doesnt use it, then they gain that %...so easy to understand...but I see on other sites they twisted the words to make it seem like people with Kinect were getting screwed and losing that performance gain. So its not a misunderstanding, its just poor use of wording in articles..with intent to cause confusion and spread FUD.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 3704d ago
incendy353704d ago

Polygon are masters at click bait haha. Using misleading headlines to rise a stir and get users to see their ads. Personally not going to click on it and encourage them, especially since we all know the reserves exist on all Xbox One's.

Show all comments (218)
340°

Microsoft Responds To Latest FTC Filing, Calls It Misleading

Microsoft was quick to fire back against the FTC’s latest claim

Read Full Story >>
gamersocialclub.ca
Sonyslave37d ago

It a warp lol ftc is need but this case against Ms is over.
😭😭

lelo2play6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

All the whiners 😭 complaining about Gamepass, where were they when Sony increased their prices and introduced several tiers for PS Plus membership?
When Sony does it, it's perfectly acceptable. When Microsoft does it, all hell breaks loose...
Hypocrites 🤡 much!

BTW, I bet most whiners 😭 complaining don't have or even care about Gamepass. They whine simply because it's Microsoft.

isarai6d ago

We were very vocal and many people including myself cancelled their subs. Tf are you talking about? 🤣

outsider16246d ago

As isarai..said. even i cancelled it when they raised their prices. Im enjoying single player games now.

shaenoide6d ago

It's not the price increase the main problem. It's the removal of day one releases for console users while PC user are safe (for now). It's a weird message being send to console fan ( "You should have bought a PC bro !)

Reaper22_6d ago

Well said! They truly are huge hypocrites.

Einhander19726d ago

This has nothing to do with PlayStation, this is about Microsoft breaking its promises.

Bringing up PlayStation is just a petty deflection attempt to not take responsibility for their own actions.

People are unhappy because this has caused thousands of people to lose their jobs, four studio closures and xbox owners should be mad about price increases and the fact that Microsoft paywalled day one games breaking their promise to their own consumers. Now even if you don't want Call of Duty you're paying for it.

The xboners like you who keep defending this type of stuff are actually making things worse for yourselves because you keep sending the message that no matter how much Microsoft bends you over by breaking their promises you're still going to defend them.

Xbox gamers make gaming worse for everyone every time they defend this type of crap.

lelo2play6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

@Einhander1972

When ponies like you accept anything Sony does without complaining, that's the major problem here...

Sony can do anything they want, and people like you will simply take it with a smile.

Einhander19726d ago

This has nothing to do with Sony.

It just shows how weak the argument is when the best you and Microsoft can can do is deflect with whataboutism's.

This is about Microsoft buying a huge publisher then going to court and saying things they knew weren't true, then going back on their own word. They went into court and knew telling the truth wouldn't be popular with either the court or the public so they lied in court. That is what is being judged here, not anything that Sony did.

You claim we are defending a price increase, but you are defending outright lies that have caused studio closures job losses and your own price increases and new games are paywalled to a higher tier.

And what did you get? Games that you were already going to get without buying these publishers. And on top of that now regardless of if someone actually wanted the games they are forced to pay extra for them.

The scale difference between our two arguments is huge.

MetroidFREAK216d ago

I canceled my yearly subscription after the price increase :)

Outside_ofthe_Box6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

"Sony can do anything they want, and people like you will simply take it with a smile"

Isn't that what you are doing with Microsoft's price increase you hypocrite? I bet you were the first to complain about Sony's increase, but not surprisingly first to defend Microsoft's increase because you are a hypocrite.

GamerRN6d ago

They didn't "remove day one" for console users, they created a tier that doesn't get them. They basically brought back Live Gold with GamePass games instead of monthly drops.

Profchaos6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

Yeah I complained when Sony increased their prices it was dramatic and they didn't even comment on why it was fine and I'll complain here to

In fact there was a huge outcry just because you missed it doesn't mean it didn't happen

StormSnooper6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

It wasn’t the same thing. Sony’s tiers didn’t take anything away from people. Two of the tiers already existed. No promise was broken. Xbox tiers are breaking promises MS has made regarding day one, while also increasing price.

Angyobangyo6d ago

People were complaining and pissed. Only you seem to think Sony gamers graciously accepted it. You sure do whine a lot don't you

Hotpot6d ago

Nope, I cancelled my PS Plus already.

Your turn, criticize MS yourself, right now.

Outside_ofthe_Box5d ago (Edited 5d ago )

^^^^
@Hotpot

"Your turn, criticize MS yourself, right now."

He's a hypocrite so he won't. He's going to simply take it with a smile on his face like the pic in his avi 😭

+ Show (13) more repliesLast reply 5d ago
XiNatsuDragnel6d ago

No it ain't mate essentially ftc has a case here

CrimsonWing696d ago

I’m not trying to be an ass here when asking this, I just genuinely want to understand more. What’s the case that the FTC have?

XiNatsuDragnel5d ago

@crismon
Microsoft said to courts when they purchased Activision they wouldn't raise the price with gamepass but they did after they got Activision.

1Victor6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

@slave3: “It a warp lol ftc is need but this case against Ms is over.
😭😭”
Well at least PLAYSTATION GET ALL Xbox FORMER “EXCLUSIVES”.
GEAR is next on the list of lubricants before they ram the big HALO on PlayStation.
So enjoy winning that FTC battle to badly loose the war 😭😭.
Edited for typos

ThinkThink7d ago

I mean, yeah.. if any of these tier options aren't right for you, you can always just buy your games the old fashioned way.

XiNatsuDragnel6d ago

Fair but this is about lying to the courts not lovely options

ChasterMies6d ago

You can buy games the old fashioned way now. Microsoft’s end game is releasing Call of Duty exclusivity on Game Pass.

Rude-ro6d ago

For now.
I can assure you, Microsoft wants subscriptions to access their games.
Just a matter of when not if or optional.

XiNatsuDragnel7d ago

Lol still lying about not raising prices in court eh? Can we address that plz

TheNamelessOne7d ago

If the price raise was attributed to the acquisition. Nobody can make that claim, and every sub service has been raising their prices. Sony made a massive one not long ago.

lodossrage7d ago (Edited 7d ago )

The problem is Gamepass price was already raised last year, just for them to raise it again this year. That right there will help the FTC's argument

It's only gets magnified when Spencer's words don't match what the company does. He said publically gamepass wouldn't change as a result of COD. He said the price wouldn't change. Both of those things were clearly untrue. Among other things

Einhander19726d ago (Edited 6d ago )

They didn't just raise the price though, they also removed day one games from the standard tier and paywalled new games behind a more expensive tier which they also raised the price on.

And the FTC's appeal also brings up the job losses and studio closures as evidence that this deal should have been blocked.

Einhander19727d ago

Well, one thing is for sure Microsoft knows more than anyone about misleading people.

The fact is Microsoft said they wouldn't raise prices due to the merger then they did including making a new tier of game pass. They said they wouldn't fire people and they did. And they also closed studios so it's hard to argue that the effect on the consumer and the industry hasn't been negative.

This is a incredibly weak rebuttal.

XiNatsuDragnel7d ago

Exactly ftc has every right to fight this

Reaper22_6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

Go and google the FTC case against Sony for misleading it's customers about the PS Vita. Then come back and discuss who knows more than anyone about misleading people.

What you claim Microsoft said is just lies. They never said they wouldn't raise prices or fire anyone. And even if they did it's their right. You statement is pretty weak and proves nothing but you have a bias just like so many other people here. You guys are just butt hurt that Microsoft won this case and it backfired in Sony's face because they threw stones and thought their own deals would not be a factor but they were. As a matter of fact it was one of the factors that helped MS win the case. Just take the L because it's a done deal. It seems the only effects from this deal is upset playstation only fans who thought the deal was never going to happen. Microsoft won. Get over it. Stop worrying about things we have no control of. Just play games you like and don't focus so much on who made it and all that petty stuff.

Doomeduk6d ago (Edited 6d ago )

You're here again Sony grrrr in a MICROSOFT article
Just chuffed you've given up the obsession with Jim Ryan with just a few more sessions and you'll be able to comment on the actual article you can do it reaper the community is right behind you
Chin up

Einhander19726d ago

https://n4g.com/user/home/l...

You don't understand.

Sony is not part of this appeal at all. Sony wasn't even a part of the original FTC case. The FTC brought this case aledging that Micrsofts buyout of ABK would have a negative impact on the industry. They claimed that it would cause job loss and and that the consumer and the industry would be negativly effected from the buy out including from price increases to game pass.

Sony was only there to provide testimony on how they expected the buyour to negativly effect thier buisness.

They did not file the suit.

This appeal is of the ruling that blocked their injunction, and the FTC is presenting evidence that the buyout has in fact had the negative impact that they said it would and which was the basis for their injunction call.

The fact that you and Microsoft need to keep bringing up Sony instead of actually defending the actions themselves shows that you don't actually have a defense at all.

6d ago Replies(1)
Show all comments (57)
390°

FTC Calls Xbox Game Pass Price Hike 'Exactly The Sort Of Consumer Harm' It Tried To Stop

Despite losing its lawsuit seeking an injunction to freeze Microsoft’s purchase of Activision Blizzard in July 2023, the FTC appealed the decision with the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit. While it awaits a final decision from those justices, the FTC’s been filing additional evidence to support its claims that the merger would hurt competition in gaming and hurt customers, including a letter from earlier this year after Microsoft laid off nearly 2,000 employees across the newly acquired teams.

lelo2play8d ago

FTC never heard of inflation. Did they expect Gampass to remain the same price forever?
Would be funny if Gampass remained at 10€ fifty years from now...

Einhander19728d ago

"Microsoft insists Game Pass prices ‘will not increase as a result of Activision merger"
https://www.videogameschron...

"It says a price rise “would be counter-productive as it would increase subscriber churn rates”

8d ago
lelo2play7d ago (Edited 7d ago )

"Game Pass prices will not increase as a result of the Merger"

Gamepass wouldn't increase in result of the merger... but it doesn't mean it wouldn't increase due to other reasons, like inflation, extra expenses, etc. Do you expect Gamepass to remain the same price forever?

All other online services have been increasing prices.

boing17d ago

I cancelled my Ultimate sub after the announcement, so they were right. And yet, they still did it. That is so MS.

Einhander19727d ago

Inflation is down since they made that statement.

They also call into question the 2000+ people Microsoft has fired from the developers they bought.

And again, this is contradictory to what Microsoft said they would do.

They lied in court.

Reaper22_7d ago

Lol...they never said gamepass wouldn't increase and they never said it would because of the merger. And even they did it's their right to do so. So what's your point?

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 7d ago
Inverno8d ago

So we blaming this on inflation now? Lol ok

lelo2play7d ago (Edited 7d ago )

Sony and other streaming services (Netflix, HBO, ...) have been increasing prices and altering their services. Do you expect Gamepass to remain the same price forever?
Others can increase prices and alter their services, but Microsoft can't?

Hypocrite much!

DarXyde7d ago

Absolutely.

Ego inflation.

IRetrouk7d ago

Lelo, they upped the price last year, along with their xboxs......

waderae7d ago

I believe they call it mental gymnastics.

Profchaos7d ago

Exactly let's not forget this deal was done under the same economic climate this was predictable yet they maintained they would not be increasing prices yet now the merger is done they increased prices and split tiers to avoid further scrutiny.

This is and always has been how Microsoft do business deflect blame and increase profits

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 7d ago
andy858d ago

Inflation doesn't double something in a few months.

anast8d ago

You are correct. It's actually lower. It was around 7% in 2021 and now it's around 3%, which is ideal.

REDDURT8d ago

Dude they are lying. That inflation low keeps getting silly and silly.

gold_drake7d ago

inflation aint the same thing as to lock stuff behind a paywall that was previously not. lol

Hotpot7d ago

*activate clown vision*
*everything looks exactly the same*

KwietStorm_BLM7d ago

Yeah you're right. It's just a coincidence that this happened after spending billions of dollars buying up the industry. And closing studios. And firing thousands of people. All while barely being able to give away Xboxes. It's all because of inflation. LOL

XiNatsuDragnel7d ago

Fanboyism bro this is pure fanboyism, it's bs we all know it so stop defending Microsoft.

thorstein7d ago

You said it all, my friend, you said it all.

jznrpg7d ago

But inflation has gone down in the U.S.

ChasterMies7d ago

Except $/mb of broadband, $/mb of storage, and $/compute power only gets cheaper over time. As Microsoft’s overhead has gone down, it’s prices have gone up.

1Victor7d ago

@lelo: “FTC never heard of inflation. Did they expect Gampass to remain the same price forever?
Would be funny if Gampass remained at 10€ fifty years from now...”
I see you got the industrial size chapstick truck from Microsoft and put it into use already.
Add one more backpedaling to Microsoft and Phil rhetorics

VincentVanBro7d ago

Look in the mirror. You’re a clown 🤡

shinoff21837d ago

Gamepass price was going up regardless of inflation or not and you know it. Hey atleast you guys have an excuse to ride for a little bit

7d ago
PRIMORDUS7d ago

Need I remind you of how much MS is worth? There was no need to let anyone go or any studio. MS are just cancer and should leave the industry.

+ Show (15) more repliesLast reply 7d ago
8d ago Replies(1)
GamerRN7d ago

Apparently it's ok that they raised PSN prices, but Xbox can't compete?!

The "Standard" is just a rebranded Xbox Live. Not expected but not crazy since they didn't really have a proper entry level subscription to match PSNs entry level.

IRetrouk7d ago

Xbox raised their prices last year too though, their entry level was core or gamepass console.

-Foxtrot7d ago

The whole "Bu bu but Sony" thing with the PSN doesn't take into consideration Microsofts whole argument to the FTC during the entire Activision merger court case is that they wouldn't raise prices due to the merger, nothing would change.

Sony never said shit about raising prices and the like so while we can think it's scummy the FTC won't have an issue with it because the argument wasn't towards them, they never swore against anything.

If the Activision merger never happened and Microsoft raised their prices as a standard thing, like Sony with the PSN or even how Netflix has done it with their subscription it would have been business as usual.

GamerRN2d ago

I'm so tired of the Sony defense team. Pay off me thinks a lot of these comments come from Sony shills

RhinoGamer888d ago

All the judges on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit just got a free windows 11 upgrade!

badz1497d ago

Err...W11 upgrade was always free

GamerRN7d ago

The price hike just brings it closer in line to PSN, yet it still has greater value. The standard sub matches the lowest PSN sub.

FTC trying to seem relevant. Claiming their multi million dollar case was to stop a $3 dollar price hike is a stupid argument and embarrassing for them.

Einhander19727d ago

PS+
$80 per year cheaper
More total games
Retro Games - Added monthly
VR games - Added Monthly
Ubisoft + Classics
4 k Streaming of nearly all games including ones you own digital not on the service. (xbox 1080p series s)
Sony Pictures Catalog
Anime from Crunchyroll
Full Game Trials with Trophy Support

GamerRN7d ago

PSN absolutely does not have more total games. I have PSN Ultimate or whatever it's called.

They don't get day one exclusives.
They don't even have Last of Us 2 Remake on there yet! Or Last of Us Part 1!!
You get Ubisoft classics, so does Xbox. But w Xbox also get EA games!
VR games don't matter to me, but Xbox also gets PC games that don't matter to me.
Both have classic games.
Streaming means nothing to me, it's still a failed concept, Digital Foundry tests it often, and it's not there yet for "serious gamers". The lag is intense!
Sony pictures and anime are neat, I'll give ya that.
Full game trials are cool, but Xbox gets the full game day one, so.... 🤷

I haven't had a good game in PSN since HellDivers, this year has been dead.

Honestly, once Xbox starts dumping all these exclusives on to GamePass, it's gonna be a flood of great titles

Einhander19727d ago

It's $80 cheaper, you're paying $240 a year in hopes of getting Microsoft games, and things aren't looking great on the development side of things beyond all the stuff they started 5 years ago. There is no guarantee that some of these studios will even exist going forward.

No, game pass does not offer Ubisoft Classics, and you only need Extra unlike EA Play which requires Ultimate.

And it doesn't matter what you don't want, xbox isn't offering it for people who do. Those things add value for a lot of people.

What digital foundry found was that PS+ Streaming was vastly superior to xcloud.

Full Game Trials include 3'rd party games.

PlayStation get's "good games" all the time that aren't on xbox,GranBlue Fantasy Relink, Final Fantasy, Helldivers, Rise of the Ronin, Stellar Blade, Zenless Zone Zero, Pacific Drive ect. every week something new comes out or is announced for PlayStation that's not on xbox.

And you're bragging about day one but that keep proving to be unsustainable. That's why studios got closed, 5000+ people got fired, games got ported to PlayStation, the reward system got gutted, prices were increased multiple times and those new games got removed from game pass and paywalled to a more expensive tier.

MrNinosan7d ago

@GamerRN
I guess you don't subscribe to both services.
PS+ Premium has close to 1000 games.
GPU has less than 500.

GPU doesn't come with Ubisoft Classic.
However, the do have EA Play instead.

GamerRN3d ago (Edited 3d ago )

I pay 120$ a year by using cdkeys.com for GamePass Ultimate

And I definitely have both... My main gripe is PSN extreme or whatever it's called is u don't have all the 1st party stuff I want. That being said I just started up Death Standing Directors cut (terrible game, cool story)... I really want Last of Us Part 1 and Part 2.... Other than that, I don't think I have access to Ubisoft games? Where do I access those? Are there any good ones? The menu system is very confusing trying to go to classic games, PSN collection, etc etc etc

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 3d ago
TheColbertinator7d ago

The FTC should give up. Microsoft owns the US Government and then someday the world and all its useless masses.

Eonjay7d ago

When they run out of fish of course!

The_Hooligan7d ago

So long and thanks for all the fish lol

S2Killinit7d ago

Sounds strange coming from a MS die hard.

Show all comments (80)
150°

Xbox Game Pass Only Has 3 More Games Coming in July 2024

The low number of new games coming to Xbox Game Pass as part of July 2024's Wave 2 lineup couldn't have come at a worse time for Microsoft. Just recently, Microsoft raised the price of Xbox Game Pass, and not only that, but it's announced that major day one releases will be locked behind Game Pass Ultimate. These decisions have understandably upset longtime Xbox Game Pass subscribers, with analysts predicting that another price hike and perhaps an ad-based tier could potentially be introduced down the line.

Read Full Story >>
gamerant.com
10d ago
OtterX9d ago (Edited 9d ago )

You'd think they would have packed the lineup after announcing an impending price increase in Sept.

Bathyj9d ago

That would just be throwing good money after bad at this point. Microsoft needs to just drop this failed experiment altogether, leave Xbox in the wind and become the biggest 3rd party publisher on the planet. It's the only way they will ever be successful in gaming.

darthv729d ago

They already were successful in gaming before joining the console space. And they already are the biggest 3rd party publisher on the planet. They are in this to make $$ from all fronts. So suggesting they bow out and only focus on one area is a stupid idea. They make $$ from all of them, some more than others... but they all make $$.

Bathyj9d ago

The console, and gamepass is just costing them money and splitting their focus. They would make more money simply being a publisher, not a platform holder, and SELLING their games, like publishers are supposed to.

They wouldn't be acting like they are if that wasn't true. Xbox is the red headed step child of Microsoft's gaming portfolio now. Just sell games. You've bought enough Dev's and IP now to do that.

Petebloodyonion9d ago

Rumors are circulating that Microsoft may add Modern Warfare 3 to Game Pass this month, as suggested by the current game release schedule, which lists only five games instead of the usual seven.

OtterX9d ago

That would be a smarter move on their part.

TheColbertinator9d ago (Edited 9d ago )

I welcome that. I could use fresh meat for MW3.

--Onilink--9d ago (Edited 9d ago )

They released 8 games during Wave 1 for July… and the 3 coming now are all actually quite interesting.

Flintlock: The Siege of Dawn (Cloud/PC/Xbox Series X) - July 18
Dungeons of Hinterberg (Cloud/PC/Xbox Series X) - July 18
Kunitsu-Gami: Path of the Goddess (Cloud/Consoles/PC) - July 19

I’d say releasing 11 games in 1 month for gamepass should be enough…

ChasterMies9d ago

The reason for the price increase is the same as the reason for procuring fewer games from their parties; more profit.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 9d ago
anast9d ago

The PS+ model was always the end goal. I'm sure they got a few before closing he net.

TwoPicklesGood9d ago

To be fair, the July releases on Game Pass are great. I'd rather have today on my ps5 then the junk we are given.