Wii U 'Has A Horrible, Slow CPU' Says Metro Last Light Dev

NowGamer: Wii U's tech specs aren't as impressive as initially thought and 4A Games won't be bringing Metro: Last Light to Nintendo's new console.

[NYC_Gamer]

4A games wouldn't make up bull shit when it comes to hardware specs.

[decrypt]

That's one developer that doesn't provide lip service :P

@bicfiness

We know the CPU is worse.

When you consider the GPU, realise for a GPU to flex its muscles no matter how powerful, it needs Memory bandwidth.

After yesterdays corrected reports Wii U only sports 12GB/s Memory bandwidth, which is pathetic really.

GTX 680 is about the best GPU on the market right now. For those of you that have the luxury of owning one, you could install MSIafterburner and downclock the Memory speed, No need to touch the GPU Speed. You will see the 680GTX brought to its knees.

Bottomline is no matter how powerful a GPU is without memory bandwidth it will be starved waiting for the next set of data to come, till then it will just sit there wasting cycles. Hence regardless of whatever GPU the Wii U has, i do not see how it can overcome the memory bandwidth issue. It might peddle along with the current gen consoles, but come next gen Wii U will be in trouble.

[bicfitness]

I don't know why you're schooling me, as I already stated that "everything else was worse". Or maybe I'm just misreading your tone. The memory bandwith is as abysmal as the rest of this hardware design.

[darthv72]

SNES had a slow cpu as compared to the genesis. And yet we were treated to such games like DK country.

Bottom line, speed as we know and love it is not relative to actual efficiency. That is why cpu companies like AMD and Intel sort of changed the selling point to how much their cpu's can do rather than how fast.

I have often heard it explained like this. Which is more efficient? Having 10 workers at a steady pace or 2 that are really fast.

The 10 can do more work in the same amount of time or less than the 2 that are having to run around and cover.

When companies started introducing multicore cpus is when the actual "speed" began to slow because now the workload could be spread over the multiple cores. And the amount of power and heat could be reduced.

Speed goes down but efficiency goes up. People are thinking nintendo is trying to surpass MS and Sony. That is an obvious thought but in reality Nintendo looking to continue the trend of surpassing themselves.

We consumers are pitting each company against each other but on the company side they know their biggest competition is their own product line.

@decrypt & bicfitness. Why do people think of these systems in the PC sense? I understand their performance is and development are more akin with PC but their design is intended to reduce as much bottleneck as possible.

Reducing the number of traces and getting away from a split design and more inline with an all inclusive design adds to the efficiency. The example of a PC gpu / cpu is understandable for PC's. Consoles are closed nature and dont follow the same guidelines.

So wouldnt it be sufficient to say that because of the nature of consoles, the PC way of thinking just doesnt work?

[bicfitness]

Darth, maybe you missed the part where its three enhanced broadway (Wii CPUs) stapled together. Bad CPU is bad. The low speed only adds to its fail. This isn't some genius, new-age, multi-threaded design, its a PPU core, which NO ONE uses anymore on account of its inefficiency.

[-Superman-]

Why should i buy Wii U, when i already have Xbox 360 and PS3?

Wii U has so much less players(multiplayer), grahpic is kinda same, game they release are already released and already played on X360 or PS3. Also, it dosent have hard drive and blu-ray player. Also, X360 and PS3 are cheaper too.

Its like i re-buy new PS3 plus 100 euros for having some exclusive games that look same as ps3 or xbox 360, when next year we going to have new ps4 and x720. NO REASON AT ALL

[kopicha]

and i think people are also forgetting that it needs to power 2 screens simultaneously. especially if someone is going to make something fancy to be displayed on the gamepad screen along with what is already on the big screen. the GPU will definitely struggle a little there with that given memory bandwidth. dont get me wrong. i do not hate Wii U. still have plans to get one later when there are games that actually interest me compare to the current line ups. too little reason to go for it now from a PS3 + 360 owner. but from technical standpoint, it is clear this isn't next gen. More like an upgraded Wii with a different innovation with it's controller.

@darthv72
as much as I would want to try to agree with you. but your DK theory there is not a worth comparison. unless i remembered wrongly, the game uses SA1 chip onboard of the game to improve the graphics capability. So you are talking about the already "slow" cpu but addon with a secondary co processor of something to improve the game visually. much like how you need the memory pak in order to play majora's mask on N64 with an exception that SA1 is build within the cartridge rather than something you need to purchase separately like the memory pak. from PCs standpoint, I do not disagree that GPU usually plays a more important part than CPU when come to gaming performance. but during all these years, consoles kinda make this theory not very true in a way. computers are upgradable. but consoles ain't. developers tend to have to use both the cpu and gpu in a more efficient way than those developers trying to develop on PCs. since consoles have stagnant hardware. where a weak cpu on Wii U can actually pose a problem in long run. take a look at some of the best looking console games out there like Uncharted, Heavy Rain, Last of Us and God of War and etc.. it is known that 360 has a more powerful GPU than PS3 but yet not a single 360 game actually reach the fidelity on those visuals from the games mentioned. so imo... good GPU theory still stands for PC gaming. but in consoles, you can't depend on GPU alone. both are just equally important

[T900]

Nintendo better hope the casuals bite this one, they just might have a hard sell on their hands. With gaming PCs 8-10 times as powerful selling around 500usd.

PS3 and Xbox 360 both simular in power but selling cheaper having a much bigger community and establish online.

Dont see how this will work for Nintendo.

[darx]

@ Darth, I'd take the two workers, it's better on my bottom line.

[bozebo]

Memory bandwidth isn't the issue: graphical resources can be cached in eDRAM (which will be significantly faster than the 360 or PS3's RAM - it's right on the substrate with the CPU and GPU), you can't make direct comparisons to PC hardware there. Think of eDRAM as the equivalent of VMEM in PC graphics cards - except it won't have the capacity to store all the resources at once so they have to be switched a few times each frame (this is where it's heavy on RAM but nowhere near as slow as accessing the RAM directly from the fragment shaders)

The Wii-U is probably capable of better graphics than the 360 or PS3 (shaders units are newer and hence more feature complete and numerous) but due to what 4A are saying about the CPU, it wont be able to compute complicated physics and AI at the same time so it will miss out on a lot of multiplats.

[Kingnichendrix]

I think you are behind in times the gtx690 is much more powerful than the 680 twice as powerful almost

[StanSmith]

Are we all talking about the same dev here?

Metro 2033 was poorly optimised. So anything these guys say, I'll take with a pinch of salt.

[DeadlyFire]

Nintendo is banking all of its money on the GPGPU to make up for the CPU power.

Its a complicated and new way to program things I believe, but when people learn to use it their way it could see much better than expected results, but I am doubtful CPU + GPGPU power will push games to a higher level than PS3/X360 with Physics, and AI capabilities and any other CPU heavy tasks. Doesn't mean we won't see a few great titles in its lifetime though. If any previous generation with less power has given you a game you love then its likely this one might as well at some point.

AMD could have given them an APU like AMD Llano and it would have been 100 times better for WiiU.

Only time will tell if developers can find an efficient way to utilize GPGPU+CPU power. Whatever amount there is under there.

[fatstarr]

Because when its a PS3 article about graphics and some one just happens to mention a pc its disagree central and everyone is put into a state of delusion...

shaking my head, when its a Nintendo thing its all agrees.

people are so fake man, I don't get why the hate for Nintendo runs so deep. Nintendo will make due with its hardware, its the beginning of the generation, if the zelda tech demo was anything they will splash that Nintendo magic and make it work.

-Mario Galaxy 2
-Mario Galaxy
-Monster Hunter 3
-The Last Story
-Xenoblade Chronicles
-Tatsunoko vs Capcom
-Twilight Princess
-Skyward Sword
-Rayman Origins
-Muramasa
-Sonic and the Black night + Colors

all visually impressive especially when you think of whats pulling it off, (the "inferior" specked wii)I cant wait to see the results of the wiiu come 2 years from now( don't dare forget the clay looking games from the 360's launch)

Remember "its about the studio, the engine and the time invested into making that platform shine" or at least that's what the fans of the hdtwins say. when it comes to the wii u though, automatically its specs this and that.

FYI friendly reminder 2x 260gtx and a quad core pretty much blow the 360 and the ps3 out of the water.

and call your self's hypocrites if you call out the wiiu( when its using all of these does all these graphics tricks that the ps3/360 are currently using) when its going against ps4/720 . also its really a generation leap from wii to wiiu

[Bladesfist]

@King the GTX690 is not a GPU it is a graphics card containing two GTX 680 GPUS. That's like me saying that 2 PS3s are more powerful than one.

[Sanquine90]

Conclusion: Ninty just want so sell us a console as cheap as possible... ANd have profit:P But because the screen is expensive ( OF the gamepad) even then they sale at a loss.

[Muerte2494]

You can't simply look a a console as a PC. People were laughing at Sony's memory bandwith yet ps3 has some of the most visually stunning games this gen. Also XBox360 cpu isn't as fast as the Cell in ps3, but Halo 4 is graphically intense and maintains it's 30fps throughout the game. I just think this is the case of not enough manpower. Also it's not like it can't be done, this is just another case of market share developers. I think they're looking at the time and money that would go into it. It's an unnecessary expense when Wii U's market share is in it's infancy. But I'm 100% certain Wii U can run it with little to no problems.

[bicfitness]

They've (neogaf and Beyond 3D) have pegged it as a triple core, enhanced broadway chip - the same CPU found in the Wii.

The GPU is moderately better than last gen consoles, but everything else is worse except maybe disc read speed.

Kinda pathetic no matter which way you slice it.

Only Nintendo can get away with this crap. That's like Apple releasing a new phone with an A3 chip in it and an SD screen - they would be murdered.

[Abdou23]

If Apple did that it will sell like crazy, fanboys are blind.

[SkullBlade169]

Apple DOES get away with it, check out how powerful their macs are vs similar priced high end PCs...

Many people still try to say they're better.

[darthv72]

with the broadway design initially? It certainly got the job done for the wii so the idea of enhancing it for the wii-u seems the most logical.

It isnt like they took the same chip and made it faster. they took the chip and tripled it and made it faster.

so unless there was something completely wrong with the original idea behind broadway to begin with, there shouldnt be any reason to think this new super broadway is bad.

i know this has nothing to do with the PS3 but there have been many that say sony should keep the cell and improve on it for the ps4. If they did, would that not be the same case for them as it seems to be for nintendo?

It certainly makes sense from a cost perspective.

[bicfitness]

PPU is an awful, dated architecture - particularly the 7XX variant that the Wii and Wii U are using. What aren't you gettting, Darth? Not only that, but its underclocked to all Hell to keep heat and power consumption down. The average Nokia cell phone has a better - significantly better - CPU, and I'm not exaggerating.

I'm out of bubbles, and I don't think you understand the chip very well, so read up on PPU architecture and the Wii chip and you'll understand a bit better.

[kopicha]

@darthv72

not that I have a problem with you. but you do make yourself sound like Apple die hard follower. Maybe you should take a look at how fast Apple discontinue their iPad3 and release a new one. If there is nothing wrong, they should have stick to their standard time line in replacing their hardware. Remember how they brag that it is 3x faster than Tegra. Yet a 6 months life span? Something that work previously does not mean it will work again.

[metroid32]

Then how an earth is black ops on wiiu in720p and gamepad on release with better textures and framerate shadows an lighting all on day 1 its because the power is in the gpgpu it hardly needs a cpu to make next gen games you coul say with wiiu having a cpu quite powerful is a bonus when the gpgpu takes care of mostly everything.

Its why randy pithford says the wiiu is a proper next gen system its just more powerful END OF.It supports UE4/CE3/Unity4/Retros new engine Hmmmmmm It can handle Metro with 10% of that GPGPU alone and the ram.

[cyhm3112]

the GPU isn't moderately better than last gen's, it just have more edrams, it is actually worse.

[darthv72]

i didnt even know apple fans had a particular sound to them.

i guess you could apply your logic to any type of fan. including star wars fans (to which i am). As every movie that comes out (good or bad) i have to see otherwise i cant really call myself a fan.

I can voice my concerns after but I have to do myself justice and at least see the movies for myself.

Now as to what a company does, that is their own thing and by no means are you obligated to follow them for every thing they do. That is personal choice. although I did say i am a fan of SW so i do follow that. go figure.

The lifespan of Pc hardware used to be something like over a year between cpu and graphic chip releases. then it became a competition to see who could get to 1000MHz first and it was AMD. So naturally you had similar competitions between chip makers like 3dfx and ATI and nvidia.

so yeah the 6mo cycle as it relates to Pc hardware....way more common than your example of apple and their ipad. By the time i save up to get a great graphics card for my pc it is now a so-so because it has been surpassed by something else within the 6-12mo time frame.

Its like the analogy of a new car. The second you drive it off the lot it is now lost its value. So when these consoles go into the R&D they are probably pretty good. Up until launch day then they are considered slow and outdated.

[Computersaysno]

Nintendo may as well have stuck a modern ARM processor in there to be honest. If it is really just a triple core overclocked version of Wii's CPU then it is a piece of crap relative to modern designs.

Nintendo properly cheaped out here. They could have chosen literally any CPU design they wanted. Any ARM, any AMD x86. Any of IBM's modern parts.

But no. They looked at the ancient chip inside Wii and decided to trick it out with some wheel spinners and chrome paint and put it alongside a DX10 class GPU.

Muppets.

[smoothdude]

Its called the iPad mini! LMFAO.

[bigfish]

.

[shivvy24]

agreed

[Persistantthug]

The Wii U(nderpowered).

Sorry...couldn't resist.
:P

[zebramocha]

Dude!that's hella funny.

[nirwanda]

They should have named it the wii
. .
n
With the amount of people unhappy with the specs but nintendo will do what they always do and make unique games you cant play anywhere else, and will do unique things with the screen.
I bet the first add on to the controller will a camera for augmented reality around the house.

[Sp1d3ynut]

Or...The Wii U (fell for it AGAIN).

[CryingFreeman87]

If you read the article it sounds like they haven't even tried to develop for the Wii U. They clearly haven't got any dev kits and the way they say they had an "early look" suggests they didn't think it was worth all the extra work to port this title to the Wii U. They've obviously already done some dev work on the PS/360 versions and havent got the man power/skill to develop with a new console at the same time. So maybe they're not the sort to BS, but it really doesn't help if all you look at is the headline. There's always more to the story and considering how many studios say that Wii U is powerful I would say they're just making excuses for not broadening their demographic.

[Megaplaynate]

You could also say that the devs saying the Wii U is powerful, are actually saying that so people buy the console. You wouldn't speak bad about a new console you are developing for.

[Rivitur]

They actauly listed metro on the Wii U at 2011 e3 but then after some research into the tech they decided to scratch the project so the only THQ game to release on the wii u was darksiders 2.

[-Superman-]

You can have most powerful video/grahpic card on world, and have 12GB ram, but if CPU is slow and bad, then machine is not so powerful.

Im really interested to see what happens to Wii U, when PS4 and X720 comes out.

Wii won war by having cheapest console, and something new, but Wii U, is nothing special really, just a little bit upgrade grahpic, but it will be outdated when next year we see new console/consoles.

[wishingW3L]

This is not the 90's anymore. GPUs these days are the most important part on a PC, even more so than the CPU. Having a good CPU is only important when you're dependant on an integrated card alone.

Depending on how powerful the GPU on the Wii U is devs will have to program GPGPU implementations to make up for the weak CPU like it has been happening on the PC front for quite some time now. But it has to be a pretty powerful GPU though.

[kopicha]

@wishingW3L

sorry I have already covered that portion earlier. your GPU more important than CPU theory unfortunately maybe applicable for PCs but not consoles. I wouldn't want to waste my time repeating the lengthy post. Maybe you should scroll up and re-read what I said.

[profgerbik]

Thank you someone who realizes the importance of a CPU.

I mean I am not trying to be an ass if you like the games on Wii U have at it.

I am just more of a hardware whore now that I have become older and to me I like to make sure I have the fastest, most powerful and functional gadgets around.

Mainly cause I am broke, if I could spend money and just toss it around I guess I would have everything.. but that is not the case and I have to be picky.

I also don't really like much of what the Wii U has to offer so that is just my personal taste.

[Trago1337]

Wow, this comment section is unbelievable. If anyone here only plans on owning a Wii U for the next generation of games, then you SHOULD be worried about the specs.

For the rest of you who weren't even planning on getting the thing, or plan on having multiple platforms next gen, grow up.

We've known that the Wii U wouldn't be a powerhouse for a VERY long time now. Why does this news come as some stunning revelation to most of you? The majority of you guys in the comments have already stated that you'll own a ps4 or 720, so WHO cares about the specs?

i'm getting it for Exclusives, like most of the people here, NOT multiplats, so Specs are IRRELEVANT.

[Slapshot82]

I think it stems from the fact that Nintendo recently came out stating, "The Wii U is absolutely starting the next generation of home consoles."

[dredgewalker]

I'm not against the Wii U but Nintendo is now more open to 3rd party developers and if it is really a bit underpowered then it won't do well with new games. Then again developers these days aren't aiming for too much graphical improvements since development costs also become higher with better graphics. In the end we can only wait and see.

[kopicha]

@Trago1337

well for whatever reason. I think it is right for people to have concern be it already own one or planning to or even if they do not. Every release of a system can directly / indirectly affect how the next gen would be. Also would you expect Apple to replace their iPad in 6mths given to their iDevices track record? What if Nintendo did the same thing? No that I am saying Nintendo would abandon the Wii U for whatever reason especially given that it just got release. But what I am trying to put across is that there is nothing wrong with people having concern be it they are coming from which direction. It is not a matter of growing up or not.

[N4g_null]

True it's slow yet these guys are the new crytek. They don't really run optimized code they run high end code for certain cards only inorder to use brand new visual tech that frankly needs more from the CPU.

The true speed of the CPU is an i3 vs Celeron moment. You will understand when the pushing starts but just for a taste. We have ps3, x360 code running on a chip way slower after watching these chips push out 4ghz.

Plus games don't need all of that speed and power in the CPU, they need a balance going toward bandwidth and gpu. The bandwidth is a good guess so far.

The ps2 used the same idea.

Hopfully the other two do not over shoot tech wise. Just like the ps2 you must meet current trends in content creation verse price of production of said content.

[Bladesfist]

"They don't really run optimized code they run high end code for certain cards only inorder to use brand new visual tech that frankly needs more from the CPU."

Have you ever wrote code in your life?

You can change your data types, reduce iteration and assignment as much as possible but you cannot magically make your code run on weak hardware without going further than optimization to the point of hacking at it with an axe.

[N4g_null]

Yep I've wrote code before. If you want to write optimized code you need to fully understand the compiler and the bottlenecks of the system. It is safe to say these guys have never wrote code for a true CPU/gpu setup. Simply put some silicon actually has routines hardwired into the chip. You simply provide the values or the data.

You can emulate hardware or use the hardware provided. That is the true difference of optimizing... Which is where differed rendering stepped in or shader tech was moved off the CPU to the gpu. It is more than just data types. If it wasn't then I wouldn't mind being a coder lol. Once the middleware addresses the problem things will be fine.

The only difference is few had pushed the boardway that hard. People like factor 5 are needed here.

Like just think... There is a compression call in the kit. It does not work automatically. You have to go into your triangle setup and drop that compression tech in. If it isn't done early then that free compression will kill your CPU.

Just look at epics code running on high end pc before unreal 3. Suddenly they had spline deformers when they simply had problems transforming vertices in their last engine. Yet thanks to code that was setup with the hardware in mind they suddenly have this cool new trick.

I'm not saying the wiiu is a beast but it can hang right in there thanks to current tech and graphic designers. Please understand, there is no way a ps3 or xbox360 can display what a real pc game can right now for even the mid range. Yet no one wants to program or create art for it because it could potientialy bankrupt you.

The power race is a double edge sword. Gaming or console gaming only flirts with that so the wii u will be fine. After black ops two no one wants to playing in the waters of a 500 million dollar whale. You will get crushed.

[Bladesfist]

I disagree with using the word unoptimized in this case as you generally optimize for a target audience and that is what they did. Really high end computers. I'm not sure what you are getting at with your talk on optimization techniques when we do not have access to there source code and can not tell what they have or have not done.

[Donnieboi]

The Wii-U is underwhelming. I'm waiting for 720 and PS4

[WrAiTh Sp3cTr3]

There you have it folks.

[shutUpAndTakeMyMoney]

I can believe them.. 4A rocks!! on pc anyway..

If they don't know anything they know how to push hardware. So I will take take their word for it since they are awsome nerds.

All the nvidia physx in the trailer was awsome.

Incoming inevitable hate for 4A for telling the truth.

@1upgamer99 below

try reading the article.

" In an interview with CVG, Yerli said Wii U is "minimum on par with the current generation.""

http://www.ign.com/articles...

[kopicha]

actually I do believe in 4A's statement. At least I know they are creditable with their knowledge. I remember how Metro make my old laptop struggle but it still run incredibly great in both look and fps on 360.

[Knight_Crawler]

Being a die hard Nintendo gamer from the NES days this really makes me sad.

The Game Cube was a let down and Wii was the final x for me but I said you know what maybe Nintendo can find it in there heart as ask us loyal fans from day 1 for forgiveness and redeem there self with an high powered spec console but the Wii U is nothing more than a Wii.5

The sad part about this is that it will sell millions becuase the casual market will eat it up:(

Well Nintedno thanks for the memories but my respect for you is gone and I will make sure that my kids kids kids...do not by a console from you ever.

[jony_dols]

I wouldn't mind but the Gamecube was a relatively powerful console for it's time. I remember being blown away when I first saw Resi 4 in action!

Then Nintendo managed to capture a large portion of the largely untapped casual market with the Wii, which gave them a license to shamelessly sell under-powered hardware at the same price as the Microsoft's 360 core bundle.

However since then, iOS & Android have eroded most of their market share. And they've come crawling back to the hardcore fanbase with their 'new', already outdated hardware that will no doubt be easily outstripped by the 360 & PS3's successors in the next 18 months.

I can see the Wii U being the next Dreamcast, a product that initially sold well, but suffered an identity crisis & was eventually lost between console generations.

[darthv72]

the cube that let you down? i ask because as it relates to the n64, the cube was a significant step up. We all know the wii was an enhanced cube but that is the nature of evolutionary upgrades.

Snes was a better NES. Genesis was a better Master system. PS2 was a better ps1 and so on. All of these consoles since the 2600 (pong doesnt count as it was a single platform/game) have been evolutionary instead of revolutionary.

The revolutionary changes in gaming have come from instances of breaking the traditional ways of gaming. such as going from carts to optical or more recently the way we play with more interactive controls instead of traditional ones.

Gaming has never been an exclusive club but so many seem to think it was or should be.

[fatstarr]

Gamecube
wii=2.5 gamecubes
wiiu= 10wiis

Nintendo made the casual market,if they didn't exist the industry would be belly up because only they would buy the trashy games that they buy. or the mainstream cookie cut fps's

Nintendo gots this mayne. you think a company with over 1 billion ltd total combined software sales will go out with out a fight...

priming up the next gen of kids to become potential customers 10 years from now is what nintendo is doing.

[Dailynch]

And that's all the evidence I need. Cancel my pre-order. Bye-bye Wii U.

[esemce]

I cancelled mine on Sunday, I will wait for a big price cut and some actual decent 3d games like Zelda, Galaxy, Metroid, FZero.

Or in future if Dolphin can emulate it we can just buy the gamepad.

[chadboban]

But if you pre-ordered, wouldn't you have gotten it already? Seeing that the console was released 2 days ago and all. I never pre ordered a console before so if you could explain how that works, I'd appreciate it.

[live2play]

im not saying i believe him
he prolly never pre ordered

BUT the wii u came out in the US not everywhere else..so he can be from the uk i guess

[LiViNgLeGaCY]

Well, actually, if he pre-ordered it from a retail store, that doesn't mean he has to pick it up right? So he can just cancel his pre-order, get the money back or put it towards something else right?

[SnipeySnake]

Thought that if you preordered and they didn't have enough they would put you on a waiting list...least thats what happened to my friend.

[josephayal]

that sounds like a good idea

[1upgamer99]

Okay well again Gearbox says the Wii U IS powerful. Much better than PS3 and 360. http://www.nintendolife.com...
http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...
So can someone please explain how Gearbox says this, and also how come Crytek Says this.
http://www.ign.com/articles...
I just don't get it.

[Jinkies]

Yeah Gearbox is developing a game for it...they arn't going to bad mouth the console when they want Aliens CM to do just as well on there as the PS3/360 version...more platforms, means more sales, more sales means more money. If they said something bad about the Wii U then people would just stick to the PS3/360 versions and I'm guessing they would be cheaper aswell.

I guess the same goes for Crytek aswell, they probably have a curent gen game un announced being ported to the Wii U.

It's all about money at the end of the day.

[1upgamer99]

It is one thing for Gearbox to support the Wii U, but it is another for them to say the game will look and run better on Wii U due to the newer Tech. Why would Gearbox not just say something like, the Wii U version will look and run just the same as the other ports with added gamepad features.

[jony_dols]

@1upgamer99:

At the end of the day, Nintendo did skimp on the hardware. The Wii U may be slightly more powerful than the 360/PS3, but is it really that much of an achievement in 2012 to marginally best technology that dates back to 2006?

Hell even my 11-inch M11X netbook from 2010 kills the Wii U in terms of specs!

[neogeo]

Umm but your logic fails because Crytek has no WiiU game in developerment confirmed.

2. They said Aliens will look best on WiiU why would that be a lie? When the game comes out they would look like liars if not true.

If they wanted to stealth lie about the WiiU's power they would have said it like this.

"We are excited to bring Aliens to WiiU. With unique features we will add to the gamepad and as for the graphics it will be looking beautiful on all 3 consoles." <---see? They would beat around the bush if they thought WiiU was underpowered. In fact. saying it will look best on WiiU could lose them money by not giving credit to ps3/360.

[Jinkies]

@neogeo

and you obviously havent read my comment properly

"but your logic fails because Crytek has no WiiU game in developerment confirmed."

As I said above in my original comment

"they probably have a curent gen game un announced"

Keywords = Probably and Unannounced

"They said Aliens will look best on WiiU why would that be a lie? When the game comes out they would look like liars if not true"

I didn't say they were lying about how well it looks, I just said they are lying about how poweful it is, making it sound like it will be on the same level as the PS4/720

[ProjectVulcan]

It is the CPU. Wii U has a superior, more modern GPU than 360 and especially PS3. It is a fully unified part, at least a generation ahead of them.

However the CPU seems to be incredibly small, absolutely miniscule in fact next to the GPU. Usually you want all the money to be spent on the GPU and a less powerful CPU is not such a biggy, but the disparity appears to be really quite enormous.

For example 360's CPU is about half the number of transistors of its GPU, and the CELL in PS3 is nearly as big as RSX. In Wii U it appears that the GPU could be as much as 5-6 times larger.... http://images.tweaktown.com...

This has lead to rumours that Wii U's CPU actually derives from the Wii, which itself is derived from the gamecube. MORE than 10 year old architecture and technology.

Ok so the word on the street says IBM has probably massaged it a bit, made it multicore and pumped the clockspeeds. However it is fairly obvious that it would still be a pretty archaic architecture and underpowered weak spot of the machine. Somewhat unbalanced compared to its far more modern GPU counterpart.

This would certainly explain dev comments about the distinct lack of CPU performance from Wii U.

It probably won't cripple the machine, but it is likely to be a very limiting factor on games that rely on a bunch of CPU performance, like RTS for example. If you want a lot of enemies or units and so make more CPU calls in a game, then Wii U is gonna be hit hard.

[medziarz]

Sony i'd guess has a tradition to make their CPUs as big (transistor-wise) as their GPUs, i think the Vita follows that trend

[neogeo]

They already did this on tom's hardware. I will look for the article it later. Anyway they took the worst dual core AMD that is old and junk and put in a beast graphics card. Next they took a top of the line overclocked to 4.4 ghz intel i7 and put in a average GPU inside. Guess what won? The shitty CPU with the good graphics card DESTROYED the i7 in every test. I'm talking 30-40 fps better. So at the end of the day it's the GPU that counts. throw in some edram and presto!

[Norrison]

@neogeo
Wii U's GPU isn't a beast, and if the CPU is as bad as they say, we may see the CPU bottlenecking the GPU even if it's a beast.

Try to run CPU intesive games with a 680 and a pentium and you're going to have shitty framerate; my friend was saying the gtx680 sucks because he had better framerates with his previous GPU, it was a bottleneck, he bought a 3770k and his framerate increased dramatically.

The Wii U may have a good GPU, but it won't use it's full potential if it's CPU is bad.

[darthv72]

sorry man but you make a very unrealistic example. We cant apply PC logic to a console situation.

The very nature of consoles being designed very closed and consistent prevents the variables that developers have to account for when designing their games.

So that is why that even with the 'limited' specs of the wii-u it will be able to deliver the best it can because developers wont have to make allowances for the same game being played on different hardware.

the pc world is very open and a dev essentially makes one game that has to adjust for the number of possible configurations. console devs....not so much.

[ProjectVulcan]

The best system is a balanced system. Some games will expose Wii U's lack of CPU performance, others you wouldn't even know it. It varies game to game.

It is true that the key component for a games system is really the GPU. I have said this countless times on here, no end of times.

But I have still pointed out that there is a limit to what you can do if you have a weak CPU. You are likely to see major bottlenecks or performance degradation on particular code that will only run happily on a CPU.

The closed environment of a console can really help if you want to shift tasks to the GPU.

BUT THERE ARE STILL A GREAT MANY THINGS A GPU CANNOT DO BY ITSELF.

Otherwise why even have a CPU. Why not just toss it in the bin. Its pure common sense, even if you are not a tech head.

So CPU performance does indeed still matter, no matter what anyone says or what you might read elsewhere. CPU matters on many PC games. Some games it matters, some it doesn't have a lot of impact. Variable.

The idea that Wii U is getting these ports designed from other consoles with potentially better CPU performance is possibly part of the reason we see Wii U not beating 360/PS3 comprehensively from the get go in every port despite having more memory and a better GPU.

[bozebo]

Exactly.

Games probably won't be able to show off great physics and AI at the same time as impressive graphics. I suppose that is fine, the entertainment factor often comes from game design not technical feats.

But with that quantity of RAM and the low bandiwdth, it won't really be able to take full advantage of high detailed textures - but it will be able to calculate smooth shadows and lighting as well as clear AA because they will use the eDRAM for those shader resources and the GPU should be quite capable.

That leads me to wonder what the quantity of RAM is for. A lot of 360 and PS3 optimization techniques at the moment reduce RAM usage while sacrificing CPU cycles, PC games often do the opposite. Also there will be fewer loading scenes. CPU cycles will be saved from having to decompress as many streamed resources in open world games too.

So, the CPU is not going to be under as much stress as in 360 and PS3 games, I'm not sure what that will result in though.

Also, if the eDRAM is big enough it could store some high res textures (if it's small or medium capacity, resources could be copied into eDRAM for things which share the same resources, then the next resource can be copied in - every frame. Less memory bandwidth would be used than addressing main memory from the shaders like the 360 does, hence it's memory bandwidth, it does have eDRAM but only about 10MB). The GPU might only be able to address the eDRAM, that would be interesting.

[Norrison]

@darthV
PC cases can apply to console cases because consoles are like PCs. They have a GPU, CPU, Motherboard, RAM, etc. And no, theres no way around bottlenecks other than an OC or buying a better CPU, because games are run by the CPU and GPU

[kneon]

4A was only commenting on the CPU, the Wii U GPU is certainly more powerful than the 360 or PS3.

[ABizzel1]

Yeah but having the CPU bottleneck the GPU makes it kind of pointless.

I guess the comment some dev. made a while ago was true.

"The Wii U's CPU is inferior to the PS3's Cell Processor and even the XBox 360's. But I guess you don't need intelligent AI or advance physics to make a Mario game."

Not my words his. But on top of that you have the console streaming data to the controller, so it takes another hit to the CPU.

Kind of disappointed, but we'll see where it goes in a year or 2.

[cyhm3112]

hahaha, believe or not, they lied.

[Donnieboi]

Now that the wii u is here, people can crack that sucker open to see what it's made of. Gear made their statement b4 the console was finalized. The same happened with Kinect. 3rd party's sung it's praise, but at last minute MS cut corners and now the kinect is not very responsive (due to a lack of having it's own cpu)

[fatstarr]

Different devs put different amounts of effort into making a game.

when you just port stuff you get meh results because your lazy cookie cut work doesnt play well with every system.

then you have devs that put in real effort and tailor the game for the console and its flaws

then you have nintendo3rd party effort which is to tone down graphics and blame the hardware instead of trying.

if a company hates Nintendo and actually doing real work they will bash them , shun them and vow never to make a Nintendo game until they see the sales then they make a casual sithware low-tier sell out port or stick figure game and either rake in the cash or complain that there's no 3rd party love on that console.

[MGRogue2017]

and... Here. We. Go.

[TimmyShire]

From what I hear of people around the internet it's not all a bed of roses for the Wii U. This won't help.

I've seen a lot of devs between the two opinions, so it's hard to say.

All I know is - if it's that difficult to know for certain - it's probably not worth the risk just yet.

[shackdaddy]

I'm really tired of all the back and forth talk that's been going on for over a year now. I think if you're on the fence about buying, then you should really just have a wait-n'-see attitude instead of listening to devs contradict each other over and over again...

[Xenofex]

Regardless of what other devs have said, it is a fact that the CPU in the Wii U is garbage. The die size is around 32mm2.... and it's also on a 45nm process. There's no chance of it being better than the PS3 or 360 CPU.

[Lovable]

Well 4A can shove their game up their asses then

[ronin4life]

That's not very loveable sounding man...

[Lovable]

Tell me about it dude...

@bubblebeam

This developers have been bitching about everything that they're not familiar with. You see if they want power, they could easily develop for the PS3, but no "TEH TECH ISSS TOOOOO COMPLICATEDDDD"...buzz off stop making excuses while other developers can push the system to its utmost limit...

[M83_]

Depends if you like things shoved up your arse I suppose

[Rivitur]

@Lovable

Say that after they release Last light on PS3 March 2013..

[bubblebeam]

Why would 4A Games be lying? You are the one missing out! Metro is heavy on post processing effects-the lighting and fog plays a big part. It's understandable why he would be frustrated. Unlike internet kids, developers aint fanboys.

[MidnytRain]

They ARE developing for the PS3.

[bubblebeam]

Correct MidnytRain.

I think "Lovable" isn't very lovable at all, he blew a mental gasket with that last comment lol.

4A games ARE making Last Light for the PS3, which is going to be great. They were talking about the PS3's cell around the release of Metro 2033, and what they could do with it. I hope they develop the 360 and PS3 games separately, to play to each consoles advantages.

"...buzz off stop making excuses while other developers can push the system to its utmost limit... "

You obviously haven't seen or heard about Metro 2033 running on a high end PC, as it is regarded as one of the best looking games ever made. Try harder. So much fail and kid rage.

[paddystan]

He has right according to a NeoGaf user who says that the CPU is 43% slower than the PS3 and 360s.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum...

[WrAiTh Sp3cTr3]

I don't know why you're getting so many agrees when it's not the cpu that neogaf is talking about in that link, it's about the RAM.

[paddystan]

Haha, Im sorry, I read too fast. :P

[shackdaddy]

For some reason N4G has gone into Nintendo hate mode. Every negative comment gets agreed and every positive comment gets disagreed along with a comment trying to belittle the good news.

Some of the negative comments coming out do make sense such as the annoying wait times on the OS, but most I've seen is just blatant hate like the person is on a mission or something...

[bicfitness]

Its a crap hardware design, shackdaddy. Nintendo should be called out for it. MS or Sony would be slaughtered in the press if they released a console like that.

[SilentNegotiator]

@shackdaddy

"Nintendo hate mode"? Maybe it seems that way because people are upset to find out how weak Nintendo's "next-gen" system is, how slow the OS is (despite having a GB of dedicated memory!), that the people with basic systems have to basically fill their internal HDD with a firmware, and that ZombiU is getting very mixed reviews (which likely means that less people will enjoy it than would a game with straight forward positive reviews).

You're confusing hate with disappointment.

[HappyCamper172]

@SilentNegotiator
"ZombiU is getting very mixed reviews (which likely means that less people will enjoy it than would a game with straight forward positive reviews)"

Why don't you start playing games from the simple feeling of --this could be fun to play-- you'll enjoy more game i guarantee.

If I would buy games based on the reviews i'd have too many overhyped games and sequels.

[SilentNegotiator]

@Happy

I'm talking statistically, not attitude.

If a bunch of people that normally give a "90" or higher to 90% of the games that they review give a "70" or lower to this game, it's likely that STATISTICALLY less of the amount of people that PLAY it will NOT CARE for it.

Unless English isn't your first language, you have no excuse for reading my comment as anything else.

[Locksus]

Oh, boy. Here we go.
To be honest, I was never expecting for the Wii U to directly compete with the PS360 and the next-gen consoles. To me, it has always seemed that Nintendo has always been doing their own thing. I wasn't expecting it to have killer specs.

The reason I'd buy the console would be for the 1st party lineup Nintendo has. I'm excited to see how the new LoZ will look like. I'd also love me some Xenoblade and another Mistwalker game.

[HappyCamper172]

I wasn't expecting it to be much better than ps/360 but i didn't expect it to be worse too.

I don't own ps3 or 360 and i don't want to have 2 consoles (wiiu and ps/360) or underpowered one that developers will avoid.

I just expected wii u to be as good as ps/360.

As a disappointed wii owner i have to say:
No more nintendo for me.

[Schawk]

Goto youtube and get the reports from people playing cod, and this is people who own other systems, the wiiU is apparently the best version less slowdown and even smoother online play, look at the gameplay you will see for yourself, so the cpu isent bad as being reported

[Jobesy]

Yes, you WILL have better online play when ONLY < 600 people are playing at the same time. Increase that to >500,000, different story.

[Unlimax]

Let's see what the Wii U do with battlefield 4 Engine !

[Norrison]

COD isn't CPU intesive, I'm pretty sure the Wii U will have worse fps on more CPU intesive games. But we don't know yet, he may be talking about raw clock speeds which doesn't really matter if you have a good CPU architecture.

[cyhm3112]

according to some people on neogaf, the graphics is actually worse on WiiU

[Dgander]

I dont get it with some of these people.....
You told them what to do to (see for themselves) but they rather stay here and speculate like idiots. I have already seen livestreams and countless gameplay videos of Black Ops 2 for WiiU and i can state for a fact it looks a little better and surely runs better than the Xbox360 and PS3 versions. If the CPU really is worse than the PS3 and Xbox360 versions then Treyarch did a hell of a job hiding it.

[tehpees3]

Slow CPU = Less heat. That is a good thing for gamers.

I don't see what the disagrees are about. It means Wii U is unlikely to ever get a more serious problem like RROD because it uses less heat.

[sjaakiejj]

Yeah, lets put a Pentium 2 in the next Playstation and Xbox to ensure they don't overheat as well!

[Gazondaily]

Hey hey! Don't diss the Pentium 2!

[fossilfern]

No mate put an AMD K6 in that beast! 300mhz of POWA!

[DarkHeroZX]

There's a reason you have 1 bubble. Why use it if your not going to contribute anything good.

[despair]

great logic there tehpees3...LMAO..thanks for the laugh.

[SyWolf]

You can manage heat, you can't bump the processor speed up with an update once the design is finalized. Slower hardware is never good for games. The reason why Microsoft had so many hardware problems is because they didn't properly manage the heat. The PS3 generated more heat then the 360 at launch but Sony understands how to cool a system properly.

[LightofDarkness]

It's not all about CPU power with the WiiU, though. CPU power is important for 360 and PS3 because of their relatively under powered GPUs. The Wii U's GPU is many times more powerful than those found in the 360 and PS3.

Because the other two have been around so long (and devs know so many tricks regarding shifting workloads around from GPU to CPU and vice versa), console games are more aimed at utilising more CPU power and less GPU power. The opposite is true in the Wii U's case, so it's just about focusing more on the GPU rather than CPU when developing for it. This will come with time.

Remember when the PS3 first came out and everyone was crying about how none of the games looked like Gears of War and it was doomed? And even some developers (like Valve) called it a poorly designed POS that will never work? Yeah. Now look at how wrong they were.

[RevXM]

Ps3 and 360 have underpowered GPU's?
Compared to 2012 standards yes.

360 got the slightly superior GPU and the ps3's RSX is pretty much equal to the nvidia 7800 (or 7900) which at the time was the 3 most powerful nvidia card if Im not a bit mistaken and was targeted towards gamers with high demands and therefore labeled as HIGH END at a pricepoint of 400+ USD.

If anything Ps3 and 360 have undersized memory capacity.

[DarkHeroZX]

Lol wii u can have a great gpu but with crappy bandwidth it wont show obvious superiority to current Gen.

[RivetCityGhoul]

has anybody actually tore apart the wii u and compared the specs to a PS3 & 360. because you have some saying the wii u is more powerful and some saying its weaker. like cmon i can't this dude serious about the wii u when there is major inconsistencies all over the place.

[ronin4life]

Ok, your comment is a good segwey for me. Here is something few know because it is so... strange.

Nintendo is king of efficiency. They have ALWAYS made their consoles out of reletively outdated tech. But this isn't some messed up jigsaw puzzle contraption where none of the pieces fit: their machines end up like frankenstien monsters and always seem more capable(sometimes drastically more so) than the pieces appear on paper.

Example: 3ds. We all know it is weaker than vita. However, included in it is a special set of shading/lighting tech. Shadows are difficult to run and take a crapton of a consoles power, but the 3ds does this IN-HOUSE at little cost to efficiency. Which is why you have MH3U running at such great FR with those beutiful shadows in full 3d.
(I believe someone has even said the wiiU also has this, but I'm not sure...)

The wii was a graphical power house too: Zelda SS and especially MarioG are good examples of this. People were suprised to see such graphics because the wii was so weak... but Nintendo seems to have a knack for taking unimlressive parts and making them work beutifully together.

[Donnieboi]

Maybe so, but 3rd party companies don't need the headache of having to get around every knack of nintendo's hardware. They just want something that is relatively simple to port across all 3 platforms without needing too many different teams tweaking it for one particular console that is a pain to develop on.

[wampdog29]

Again though, this dev isn't taking into consideration the fact that the GPU is also capable (even more so than the competition) of GPGPU abilities. The fact that you can have both the CPU and GPU working on the same general-purpose processing (also from on the same chip due to being 'spliced' together) is something I don't think is being taken into account. Or, maybe it is, and the writer is looking for the usual anti-Nintendo sentiment. The dev even said that they are having a harder time with the PS3 version, so maybe trying to figure out yet another console just isn't in the cards.

[Hoje0308]

Learn how to read. No one said anything about the PS3 being hard to develop for. They only addressed the extra work that goes in to developing for an extra console, which would be the aforementioned PS3.

[jjank11]

There is no definitive answer yet. We don't even fully know the architecture of the system. TBH, a faster processor really doesn't mean better games. Its like saying i want a 3GHz quad core processor on my phone but that doesn't even make sense from simply a power consumption standpoint and heat generation, let alone wasted resources.

Since the beginning of this generation technology has become more efficient and we don't truly need raw power, its about efficiencies, more or less.

[joeorc]

100% exactly, you just cannot go by raw specs, its how the system is designed how each and every component works inside the system to provide its overall system level of performance. for instance they already did a SunSpider test twice now for the WiiU

1st test:

http://www.nintendolife.com...

2ND TEST:

http://images.anandtech.com...

HOW did it go further down the benchmark?

simple:

The browser is using an older version of WebKit, which is likely responsible for some of the not absolutely stellar performance here.

does that mean that it could not be updated? no, that the point, these test's are general guidelines as the API's further mature and tweaks to the system happen overtime the performance will increase.

that is just the way it is.

and PS:
software is another component to the system

[ape007]

that means a complex game like GTA V or even IV cannot run on it???, with all happening at once, car physics and euphoria physics etc.. ???

[chronoforce]

That's what the GPGPU is for,you can offload these tasks to the GPU. How well that would work is another question entirely.

[skyrimer]

Ouch, that's gonna hurt. And I don't know why a developer would troll about the console power, they hate the money they would makes from selling their games?

[Neonridr]

It's hard to understand how developers like Treyarch or Gearbox are able to make their games on par (in the case of Black Ops 2) or better (in the case of Aliens Colonial Marines), yet this developer has problems.

It just doesn't make sense how if the processor was so slow and "horrible" how can the Wii U even put out games like Madden, Fifa, ME3, Batman, Tekken, AC3, Black Ops 2, etc and they at THE WORST look EXACTLY like the 360 and PS3 versions.

If someone can explain to me how the Wii U can do all those fine, but for some reason this developer says they can't do it to match what's on the PS3/360 I would love to hear their so called expert explanation.

[wampdog29]

^this^ but also while running a second screen....

[ABizzel1]

It depends on the game.

Those games aren't heavy in A.I. and focus on over powered enemies (aka Aliens) or groups of enemies (Call of Duty) to make the games challenging.

Now take a RTS like Civilization where you have a computer AI that's basically a chess master that's reacting to your every move in real time. That takes a lot of CPU power vs. the GPU.

The easiest way to show it is to look at the fps of a gaming PC running multiple games.

If the PC doesn't have a good CPU then the fps drop significantly in A.I. heavy games. And the Wii-U is going to suffer with such games as RTS, Shooters like Crysis and Halo, and Dynasty Warriors for the sheer amount of things happening on screen.

The GPU is trying to remedy this, but the CPU is holding it back.

[SyWolf]

Games that require more processing power from the CPU such as Metro will suffer from the pack of power the Wii U has. Games that don't require a massive amount of CPU power like Boarderlands will be fine.

[quantae06]

It's called being a lazy developer. If other developers are figuring it out then something is wrong with the developer complaining.

[bubblebeam]

@quantao06

It's funny when fanboys act like the developers are either fanboys themselves, or just being lazy. Especially considering they released one of the best looking games on PC, and are known to be heavily relient on the CPU.

Play Metro, then make a judgement. Until then, I'll take the word of a respected developer over some internet kid.

[JokerFock]

lazy dev...go make it from zero if u have some...errr money??? :D

[Jdeee]

I got the wii u for their first party games, zelda, Mario, metroid ect. I have my xbox for all the other games

[ape007]

100% correct

[deafdani]

That's very nice of you, but not everyone has the time or money (or both) to own more than one console.

[wampdog29]

"...time..."???

[deafdani]

@wampdog:

Yes, "time". Even putting the money factor aside, some people may have a pretty busy life for various reasons (work, kids, etc) so they can't justify having more than one console to play.

Why is this so hard to understand?

[mrbojingles]

Even a Triple-Core Broadway @ 1.4Ghz would run circles around the Xenon at half the speed. Don't act like raw clock speeds are indicative of quality folks.

Also he says "early" which makes it sound like he hasn't touched a devkit for a long time. Numerous changes happened in the past year.

Additionally I wonder if people complain and moan when the 720/PS4 have Quad-Core 1.8Ghz-2.4Ghz CPU's and flame Sony/MS for having them "clocked" lower than 360/PS3.

For reference, the Wii U has a separate ARM CPU for the OS (i think it controls OS) and a separate Sound processor instead of making the main CPU do all that.

[Neonridr]

it's like the Xenon chips today would run laps around the Xenon chip that is in the 360 from 2005. People don't seem to understand that chips get smaller and get more streamlined, thus they don't have to run at such a high clock speed to achieve the same result.

[ABizzel1]

Agreed, but this rumor about it being a modified version of the one used in the Wii is troubling, seeing how it's also the same one used in the gamecube.

Add to the fact that this is coming from a PC dev. who knows their $h!t, and it's not looking good.

[kesvalk]

since the beginning i would wait for the games to come (mainly metroid and smash) before i would buy a wii-U, also it's the first party that counts, for all the other games i have a gaming PC to play them.

that aside, metro is not a good game anyway, i don't understand all the praise this series have, cuz the game is very shallow, like the witcher series.

[HappyCamper172]

agree

And pc version of Metro had issues on 1500$ PCs not because the graphics looked amazing but because of poor implementation and optimization.

I question the ability of this team

[kesvalk]

it's not just implementation, the game was too linear, almost a Russian themed COD, the controls were strange, the weapons were innefective, completely bogus AI and don't even get me started on the "stealth" missions.

the game was VERY uncreative, lacking everything except mood.

[Jadedz]

Developers aren't experienced with the Wii U's hardware yet, so I can see why many of them are disappointed.

[joeorc]

"Developers aren't experienced with the Wii U's hardware yet, so I can see why many of them are disappointed."

that may be a part of it but its also many things that can and will effect your choice in making software. for instance pretty much within reason any game can be made or designed to work on pretty much any platform. but the game will not exactly be the same game on each platform, unless the hardware is designed exactly the same.

It may be close but there is other parts that can effect your game design because of one hardware platform may not have such a component that may be needed for your game. Many game engines are designed in the 3rd party area to be able to be scaled up or down to the hardware level, but they are not designed for the bare metal to take advantage of the core hardware level of that metal.

So if a developer states that there may be issues with the CPU or GPU level, you cannot say outright their just talking out their @ss if you will, it depends on many thing's like development team size, maybe their game engine would need to be reworked to work on such a platform's advantages and do not want to release a less than invested iP until their internal resources can handle such a project.

[miDnIghtEr20C_SfF]

If this was the PS3, all the talk would be about lazy devs.

[Jadedz]

you're right :P.

[millzy102]

assassins creed works fine is that not a big open world, enough said.

[joeorc]

"assassins creed works fine is that not a big open world, enough said.

if the game is fun why would it matter?

but you brought up a good point, but also there something you may not be taking into account

such as:

procedural synthesis vs unique render art assets

example:

Stateless Stable Arts for Game Development

http://awelonblue.wordpress...

just because its open world does not mean outright that the system can outright be better, the open world type game can be less unique art assets produced to less tax the system but the models look so close alike the environment would be stale and less unique. its not really a problem in the sense the game cannot be fun, it just means the same tree generated over and over again with slight texture mesh changes here and thare, is not as taxing on your system as if your putting multiple unique are asset's inside the environment. instead of procedural synthesis generation of course there is procedural synthesis generation that can tax the system heavy it just depends on what your trying to do with your game asset's.

[deafdani]

Not all games are developed equally. Just because Assassin's Creed 3 is a big open world game it doesn't mean that, development-wise, it would use the hardware in the same way that Metro does.

[beerkeg]

I won't be playing Metro Last Light on any of my consoles anyway, that pleasure belongs on my pc.

[DwightOwen]

Let's hope it's optimized better than 2033. That port was HORRIBLE.

[SpiralTear]

Is it just me or has this one developer in particular been extremely critical of the Wii U? I haven't heard much criticism from any other developers...

[GraveLord]

"That the Wii U struggles to render games (that run perfectly on the Xbox 360 and the PS3) is a worrying trend for Nintendo."

Bull. Do these games run at a constant 60 or 30FPS? I don't think so. Assassin's Creed 3, Black Ops 2..etc, these games don't run "perfect" on any system, so to expect it to run perfect on Wii U is asking way too much.

"
“We had an initial look at the Wii U, but given the size of the team and compared to where we were last time, just developing for the Playstation 3 is a significant addition.”"

Sadly, this will be the case for many, many multiplats. It's going to be chaotic when PS4/720 are on the market...

Anyway its great to hear raw, unfiltered opinion about the Wii U from developers...

[aquamala]

anyone with a gaming PC knows CPU isn't nearly as important as GPU. if you have a CPU from 4,5 years ago and pair it with a recent GPU you can still max out games.

[V0LT]

That is pretty much spot on... Its when you do it the OTHER way around it becomes a problem and a bottleneck is created.

[profgerbik]

I have one and I know that is not true.

CPU is very important I don't know what new age bus you just jumped off but the CPU will always be very important.

Now this is not necessarily about the Wii U but more about your comment.

I would love to see you use a single core CPU and pair it with a higher end video card. I would really love to because I know for a damn fact it will run like absolute crap and is actually almost impossible because you can't pair the best GPU's of now with CPU's from 5-4 years ago, you obviously don't know much about computers..

With each new jump in CPU comes a new pin which will need a new motherboard. Each new motherboard brings higher performance, each new motherboard supports better graphics cards, better RAM and the list goes on.

If you were to use old ass CPU's chances are your motherboard will be old as crap also, meaning your ram will be older, your graphics card won't be that extreme because it won't support the newest PCI Express, your RAM will be older, everything practically even if you say got a GTX 580, sure it will be acceptable, just like the Wii U is acceptable but would it be what a PC should be and does that mean the CPU will save it? No.

Hell I know that from experience, I have done that with single core CPU's 4-5 years old even dual core and it sucks. I live and breathe computers sadly and I have had ton's and built many.. I could literally build one right with random parts laying around or a couple for that matter..

GPU is crap compared to the CPU but of course having a decent GPU is necessary but CPU handles a huge majority of the work..

You would actually have much much better luck doing it the complete opposite and actually getting a higher end CPU and a newer but low memory graphics card that just has better memory and express 3.0.

You really can't have one or the other that sucks badly and expect to get a good experience out of it but unless you are just used to playing on garbage PC's I guess it's acceptable, but not with me.. PC is my top gaming machine.

Point is the CPU is definitely more important.

[aquamala]

CPUs from 5 years ago are not single core CPUs, were talking about a Core 2 dual or quad core CPU , pair that with a good recent GPU you can definitely max out games

A GPU from 5 years ago, we're talking about a Radeon 2000 series card, you can't even play recent games with that even if you pair it with a i7-3770k

[OC_MurphysLaw]

I think most of us all knew coming into the WiiU that it wasn't going to be bleeding edge next gen, but rather something akin to a step up compared to the current gen (360 & PS3).

I am not shocked at all that all the details coming out on the WiiU are not setting the world a fire. WiiU ultimately will fall in line with what the Wii did this gen, and that is being the lower spec machine of the current generation.

[Kos-Mos]

Who is 4agames?

[zebramocha]

If I remember right,they are the people who made metro 2033 based in Ukraine and where formed from the guys who made the stalker series of game(stalker clear skies,shadows of Chernobyl and call of Pripyat.)

[Thepcz]

lol i got to be honest, i see this news and get really drawn into the arguement. i even start to feel a bit annoyed at nintendo..

but then, i remember its not all about the graphics. its not all about polygon pushing speed or resolution count. its all about the games. i think many here have got it twisted and simply lost their way.

they have fallen into the technology trap, instead of becoming immersed in the game.

its sort of like a movie fan HATING a movie because of the camera the film was shot with. as if the quality of the camera determines the quality of the film.

you people getting wound up about the hardware, and getting into a fury over the specs are not gamers, thats for sure.

stop ruining GAMING!!!!!

[ChickeyCantor]

I used to care about all the specs and what not back in the gamecube/ps2/xbox days. Last couple of years i've been playing lots of PC games and so the argument for specs on a console always fall flat.

Yes consoles have unique exclusives you won't see anywhere else.

Mainly the reason I don't care for all of this. I need my zelda/metroid/F-zero(A game nintendo failed to give us on the Wii, so i'm eager to see what they do on the Wii U) needs.

If Nintendo goes bankrupt I won't have the games I love so much. So there really is no point in complaining about it. And ill be damned to miss out the games.

Also if they keep pulling more exclusives in like Bayonetta 2...

[megamanX2]

"Also if they keep pulling more exclusives in like Bayonetta 2.."

lol yeah just a few weeks ago all these little girls were crying about that games like it was the second coming or something. Sorry losers you will never get that game.....only on nintendo.

[rainslacker]

@megaman

Believe it or not, most people really didn't even care about bayonetta only being on the Wii U because they didn't care about it on the PS3/360. Don't take a vocal minority as the voice of the entire market.

[wishingW3L]

they are selling this console for $350 with weaker specs than a console from 6 years ago and it still doesn't offers an HDD nor blu-ray playback. This is the very definition of overpriced!

[lilbroRx]

People seem to forget that the Wii U has a GPGPU, not a regular GPU like the PS3 and 360. It can do things on its GPU that CPU's do. That is the trade off for the low clocked CPU.

This dev clearly doesn't know how to program for the CPU and GPGPU in unison.

[JokerFock]

one of 3rd party dev that can deal with wii u (still can't max out the console yet)

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

[Schawk]

This is gonna be awesome on the wiiU, the version to have

[wishingW3L]

Wii U has GPGPU implementations on the GPU but what you're talking about is a GPGPU chip. GPGPU chips are still in development since Intel's Larrabee was a failure.

----------------------------- ------------------
http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

"GPGPU is the utilization of a graphics processing unit (GPU), which typically handles computation only for computer graphics, to perform computation in applications traditionally handled by the central processing unit (CPU)."
----------------------------- ------------------

This is a double edge sword because now the GPU workload will be bigger due to the fact that it will be put to do CPU workloads. This mean that the GPU will have less resources for post-processing, anti-aliasing, etc. This is why we are seeing Wii U games under-performing compared to last gen consoles like the PS3 and Xbox. To fix this devs will have to be smart and come up with some magical optimizations.

A GPGPU chip: http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

[Psychonaughty]

To the person saying that the snes had a slower cpu than the megadrive (it was less than half the speed), and had better looking games, well that's true but not only did games ported to the snes have terrible framerates (robocod being one of many that come to mind) but also it quickly needed several different enhancement chips like the DSP-1 and super FX chip (designed in the UK!) for games like Super Mario Kart, StarFox and Super Mario World 2 as the console just wasn't up to the task.

Also that's all well and good for a cartridge based system but you can't really stick a chip on a dvd (sorry proprietary disk!)...

[Thepcz]

maybe nintendo should go back to cartridges lol

[megamanX2]

boy are you stupid not only did nintendo destroy sega they made they their bit**, and the fx chip was doing things sega could only dream of back then lol.

P.S: nobody cared about sports games on the snes, so its no surprise why they were better on the genesis.

[Psychonaughty]

Grow up kiddo and get an education.

[OneAboveAll]

Who cares what 4A has to say. They made like... what? Two games? They aren't even that well known.

[Xenofex]

Truth hurts doesn't it

[isyourhouseonfire]

Metro last light? No one has ever heard of this game and dev talks like he's earned something? Pffff, next article plz.

[chadboban]

Hey, I'm looking forward to Last Light and Metro: 2033 was actually a really good game. It also looked AMAZING on PC when it came out and it still does. Try to find a video of it with maxed out settings, it looks incredible. But I do think that they could make the game run on Wii U and look really good if they had the time, but the game has been delayed enough as it is already and adding another platform could further increase that delay.

[stuntman_mike]

I thought Metro 2033 was a bit boring to be honest, nice graphics though.

[Qrphe]

Not many in N4G at least, which is a casualfest of gamers anyhow.

[turgore]

When the Wii U will have a better looking game than the Last of Us and Halo 4 then we can talk.

EDIT: And when that happens, its gonna be too late since PS4 will be out.

[AngelicIceDiamond]

Maybe Nintendo doesn't have enough resources like Sony and MS to make up to date tech in their system?

[yavorsv]

Maybe if sony pulls out another $600 console they will be in trouble ?

[Qrphe]

Unless they're expecting to release a 4k bluray or something like that, don't count on such a high price tag.

[TenkoTAiLS]

Resources? Please..even after their 1st loss ever earlier in the year, they have more money aka resources than both Sony and Microsofts gaming divisions. This has been stated by numerous financial and stock reports over the last year.

Its even been said thet could take a fiscal loss for the next 30 years and still be in the black. So really there's no excuse for them to have not taken the risk and made more of a loss on console sales than they are currently and use better tech in their console.

[corrus]

No they have but they don't want to give it

[chadboban]

Eh, I was gonna play Last Light on my PC anyway. I expect to get my Wii U next year and my PS4 whenever that comes out. As always, fanboys can suck it.

[MonopolyRSV]

"We've created a better mousetrap" - Reggie Fils Aime

[spektical]

sub par CPU coupled with a small RAM at 2GB running at ~13GB/s...

I really thought Nintendo was going to blow the ps3 and 360 out of the water. The Ps3 was able to getaway with an inferior GPU by the use of multi-threading using the cell architecture. In other words, use a core to emulate a GPU.

But the WiiU... man I dont know how you can wiggle out of that one, your going to have lots of deadlock.

[SyWolf]

That's not how it works at all.

[AceofStaves]

For me, it's always been less about the hardware and more about what developers do with a console's resources. I doubt the average consumer is going to purchase a console based on its hardware specs. Brand recognition and customer loyalty are stronger motivating factors. As long as there are Mario/Zelda/Pokemon games, along with third-party exclusives like 'Bayonetta 2' available for it, the Wii U should sell well.

[MadMen]

News flash, the WiiU is weak - the only reason it looks reasonable is because its a step up from the Wii in comparison to tech in general, its weak for being a new system

However; weak means low build costs = greater revenue for Nin

[iNathan]

Wii U stils worse than Both.

Thats why i will never support Nintendo.

[DivineAssault]

I knew it.. Nintendo is always tight lipped about things & they like to cut corners using cheap tricks... Well, im not falling for it this time. Ill gladly wait for Orbis to come around.. Mario bros, zombiu, & nintendo land dont interest me in the slightest & even those titles arent scoring to great on metacritic..

Mario bros is the best game out for the thing & tho its the definitive NSMB game to date, theres nothing nx gen about it.. If anything its last gen in HD not even having gamepad features for single player.. smh

[Neonridr]

so because something scores great means it's a great game? IGN has given CoD like 9's and 9.5's for the past 5 years, does that make those games the greatest games ever? Since when was it only ok to play games that have good reviews?

Remember when we were kids (well me, you might only be a kid still) and we used to have to actually play games to determine if we liked them or not? We weren't trained to listen to what the media wants us to hear because there was no internet.

[TemplarDante]

*reads title*
Hear that Nintendo fanboys?
lol
That aint stardust and magic powering the Wii U :)
EDIT: Funny, just yesterday I said its no rumor, it really is three Broadway CPUs ductaped together, the Nintendo fanboys through a ton of disagrees my way, they said.. its.... *lol* an "upgraded IBM Power 7 Xenon" LOL , a super upgrade to the 360s cpu they said. How delusional!

[a411411]

Its funny how most people are talking as if they're the ones making the game for the system. Don't worry about the specs leave that to the developers its their problem not yours. Whats done is done if you feel as if its going to be a mediocre system then spread the word but in all honesty give them some time nintendo has a plan. -PS3 owner talking btw

[silkrevolver]

Lots of Wii U hate around here...

I'm having a blast with the thing.
Sue me.

[stuntman_mike]

Now-gamer is one of the biggest trolling website around. (even though I don't doubt that the guy from 4A said what he said.)

[animegamingnerd]

i have been saying this and will say it again don't ever expect to see what the console is truly capable of until it is at least a year old like for example compare call of duty 2 a launch title of the 360 to halo 4 and for the PS3 compare resistance to the last of us but also keep in mind most of the PS3 launch titles were sports games which are never graphically impressive and ports which were in this case the 360 versions were better cause the developers didn't know the hardware well enough yet

[MultiConsoleGamer]

Inferior hardware didn't hurt the ps1, the ps2 or the Wii.

In before fanboys throwing stones in their glass houses.

[MEsoJD]

The wii suffered pretty bad. While console sales and first party sales were good, that was rarely the case for third parties. While they were making games for ps3/360, they had to usually make completely new games for the wii(they couldn't simply port games like COD). Anyway this is part of the reason, wii has so much shuffle-ware.

[Nodoze]

I simply don't understand why so many people have their panties in a wad over the WiiU. If you don't want it, don't get it. If you don't think it has enough fill rate for COD 72, DON'T buy it.

Kids these days.

[TemplarDante]

8-10life cycle in the Wii U's 2002 CPU architecture? We'll see if you sing the same tune in 2020!

[easternbalboa]

If you buy the wii u it will wii on u

[megamanX2]

"Wii U 'Has A Horrible, Slow CPU'"

and this is coming form someone who made the failure of a game call metro? lol

"When the Wii U will have a better looking game than the Last of Us and Halo 4 then we can talk."

better looking doesn't account for better sales you people are idiots if you waste your money on anything like that just because of how it looks. In other news my not so new pc blows the ps3/xbox out of the water, and it's old tech in the pc world.

[BitbyDeath]

I guess 1080P is not going to happen for the Wii U then...

[V0LT]

Nothing but spec whores out there... Just enjoy gaming... I have a Wii U and I love it.

[GTAallday]

haha suck it U

[J86blum]

Kelso-"BURN!"

[BlaqMagiq24]

It's times like these is why I wait to buy any console.

[NotSoSilentBob]

People said the same thing about the PS3 GPU and there has been great games coming out. Give it time. The first few waves of games for a console are pretty much developers learning the hardware.

[pennywhyz]

Wow i remember when every1 was bashing the 360 like this when it first came out.

[Run_bare]

Doesn't surprise me, it's mostly the case with Nintendo to bring lack of technical prowes in their console. BUT that does not matter, my only grief on Wii is the lack of games that I want to play (less than 5 compare to PS3 or Xbox).

I don't mind buying a WiiU if they bring Fatal Frame Mask of the Lunar Eclipse on the western shores (or any Fatal Frame game).

[Plagasx]

This is just pathetic.

I mean, I'm happy for Nintendo finally going HD and I can't wait to play the next big Mario and Zelda in glorious 1080p but to have a "next gen" console that's basically LESS powerful than consoles that have been out for 6 years is so fucking dumb and pure laziness on Nintendo's part.

I want Nintendo to succeed, I really do. But they are making it insanely hard for me to cheer them on when they are already so far behind...

[deletingthis34675334]

Ouch, not good. Not good.

[swansong]

I will buy one and check it out for myself,when it drops to $99. Until then bring on Sony and Microsofts new consoles.

[TBONEJF]

their just a bunch of lazy ass DEV. why DON'T U LEARN TO USE THE CONSOLE itself and see how u can utilize its processor. I mean look at UBISOFT they put ASSASSINS CREED III & look at BATMAN ARMORED EDITION on the Wii it LOOKS SIMPLY AMAZING. Quit your btching and do what youre suppose to do.

[TotalSynthesisX]

Am I the only person here who is interested in the Wii U simply for the games and not about how fast it can manipulate 0s and 1s? All I want is Smash Bros 4 and (hopefully) Metroid Prime 4. Why? Because they're fun to play, not because I have an unhealthy obsession with processing power.

I'll save the performance lust for the X720/PS4.

[Stroke666]

one mediocore developer says something against the wiiu and everybody jumps on board. the games they have out look and play great. it'll take some time for developers to get the hang of the wiiu set up, and its obvious that some dev companies r gonna slack ass and blame the system for their lack of effort or comprhension of the system. but why can a plethora of dev companies do impressive work on the wii u then you get this one saying how horrible it is. to say the tech is worse than this gen is a big question mark as well or am i the only one to see the black ops comparisons. after 6-7 years dev companies have got a pretty good grasp on ps360 architecture yet it simply looks better on the wii u. its kinda like telling me that the car i drove a further distance than you in on one tank of gas has a worse engine than your car. its just not adding up to me. on paper you may have some pretty valid points however my friends who own the wii u have had only one complaint thus far about the update taking long.

[AO1JMM]

I truly do not care what they say. I did not buy a Nintendo system for "uber graphix".

Plus, Metro is far from a system selling game.

[PirateThom]

The truth is finally becoming evident. We all told you and now it's falling back on "I don't buy a Nintendo console for graphics" after MONTHS of how it was going to blow the PS3 and 360 away graphically and it has, so far, a worse CPU and worse memory bandwidth, let's see just how far this goes.

[Roccetarius]

It's definitely funny how things can turn around quickly. Let's see how fast the 3rd party support is gone when MS / Sony launches their consoles.

[nerdkiller]

if you want lots of horse power then companys have to take a huge loss.nintendo never was for that even though up until wii they had more horse power but things cost more now, so nintendo is going the cheaper rout. lets see how sony and msoft do things next gen, you gotta remeber sony is just making money after there huge loss this gen

[vallencer]

I think you all need to realize that not all "hardcore" gamers are as bad as the lot on n4g. Some people do like to play games *gasp*. Imagine that and guess what? They don't care about how powerful a system is, all they care about is if they have fun playing it. I could honestly not care any less about how powerful the system is. Miiverse is one of the greatest additions to online gaming and the second screen is awesome to stream games or netflix too. Why can't you all just play games to have fun instead of caring if the system is amazingly powerful. As plenty of people have already said if you want power then just buy a pc. Consoles will never be at the power level you want because they are meant to be affordable and compact and NOT upgradable aside from harddrive. Besides i don't want my console to have 6 fans on it.

[jbgamer]

YYAWWNN!! the sony and micro soft media, just don't give up.. THEY LOST.... NINJA GAIDEN IS SELLING OUT! ZOMBI U IS SELLING OUT. BAT MAN, COD.. THE HARD CORE GAMES ARE SELLING FOR THE WII U AND SO IS THE SYSTEMS, and the biased media cannot stop it!!! nintendo fans are the big winners!! they sony and microsoft, media cannot stand it!!they LOSE!! EPIC FAIL!!!!

[jbgamer]

oh and why didn't the other developers complain about this? ubisoft, activision? yeah sorry sony microsoft media, you are failing you boss pacher... once again EPIC FAIL!! NINTENDO RULES!! LIVE WITH IT!!

[DeadPixel]

Would a developer really say things like this?? i don't for one second believe any of this article. Where has all this hate towards Nintendo come from?? I think it's just a case of jumping on the bandwagon trying to get as many hits as possible, i'm waiting for an article that gives us 5 reason why Nintendo is really just Al'qaeda in disguise...

[GoldenElf]

Metro better be f*ing awesome on PS3 and X360 if they're going to run around bitching about the Wii U CPU. They're basically saying their game is too good for the console.

Big words.

[Master of Unlocking]

-Superman-
Why should i buy Wii U, when i already have Xbox 360 and PS3?
...Also, it dosent have hard drive and blu-ray player. ..
---------------
Are you kidding me? The Wii U doesn't have a HDD? What the frack is Nintendo thinking??? O_o
Also, I can somewhat understand Nintendo didn't want to pay royalties to Sony for BR discs but man.. can it at least play dvds?

[TheSaint]

If this article is true than what about in a few years time when true next gen games start releasing?

The Wii U gets left behind. Gathering dust just like the Wii.

[Robert14789]

TC-man Stated:

What an excuse!? The PS3 has the fastest CPU of all the three consoles PS3, Xbox 360 and Wii U, and yet most games runs way better on the Xbox 360. Why is that? Because they all have different design and architecture. The differences are like this:

PS3 = Fastest CPU + slow GPU
Xbox 360= Fast CPU + Fast GPU
Wii U = Slow CPU + Faster GPU

Xbox 360 and the Wii U are quite similar, both with a more advanced GPU that's way more programmable than the outdated RSX in PS3, which means the GPU in these two consoles actually can take over some task from the CPU. So on paper if you can make a game for Xbox 360 you can make it work on the Wii U; the Wii U can compensate the CPU's 'workload' with its faster GPU, but the developers need to rework the game in order to run on the Wii U, while optimizing the GPU to squeeze more performance out of it in the hope the game would run at playable speed and that takes time (time=money), and since the Xbox 360 version and PS3 version would sell way more (due to the already established user-base), the Wii U version has a much lower priority in development.

Remember, Metro 2033 (the prequel) was also canceled for the PS3. And why is that? Let's make a guess, guys...

All credit goes to TC-man

[ATi_Elite]

I don't know what to think in regards to the WiiU!

I haven't seen any hard specs yet and I really want to know what's up with the GPU!

I'm not too concerned with the 3 core CPU or it's speed cause today's games are all about the GPU! The CPU will not be doing any serious multitasking so it's not really an issue! 3 core 3ghz is fine!

The WiiU is supposed to use a R700 AMD GPu (a 4 year old design) but I'm curious of the Streaming Processing Unit count as well as the clock speed cause THAT INFO would tell me alot about the WiiU potential power!

Also Metro 2033 PS3 was canceled for some "LAME FINANCE" reason......I think Metro 2033 Devs had problems with the Cell so therefore a Dev dogging the WiiU when they have NO games on the PS3 doesn't really sit right with me!

I'll wait for hard WiiU specs or hear from a Dev who has done wonders on all 3 platforms before passing judgment!

[QuantumWake]

The Metro 2033 situation with the PS3 version is probably the same case that The Witcher 2 developers (CD Project RED) faced. They simply did not have the man-power, budget, or resources to develop both a PS3 & Xbox 360 version.

Being that the Xbox 360 is quite close to PC architecture, it should be pretty obvious why they chose not to develop a PS3 version. If they had, they probably would have done a pretty bad job with the PS3 version; resulting in a poor port.

I'm pretty sure since the release of Metro 2033, 4A Games have grown in staff and they now have a bigger budget to work with. Metro: Last Light is coming to PS3, Xbox 360, and PC.

As a side note:

"One thing to note is that we never ran Metro 2033 on PS3, we only architected for it. The studio has a lot of console gamers but not that many console developers, and Microsoft has put in a great effort to lower the entry barrier via their clearly superior tools, compilers, analysers, etc.

Overall, personally I think we both win. Our decision to architect for the "more difficult" platform paid off almost immediately. The whole game was ported to 360 in 19 working days. Although they weren't eight-hour days." - Oles Shishkovstov

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

[fatstarr]

"We didn't feel like learning a new console"

that's all I read

[spinbot_lv1]

the cell chip of ps3 was and is difficult (and very expensive) to program, the most frequent complaint by the developers was just this. This involves a huge investment and considerable human resources. But when it comes to power and capability of the cell no one has ever made ​​a complaint because in reality the cell is a monster of power. For the WiiU instead many developers are talking about an underpowered and slow cpu and a slower ram. a disaster! is wrong at this point looking at wiiu as a slouch? I also would like to know the real specs of the wii u gpu.

[quantae06]

I believe developers have to learn how to tap into the GPGPU to make up for the CPU. The GPGPU does some of the CPU's work unlike a regular GPU that doesn't. Nintendo put that GPGPU processor in there for that obvious reason. Developers also complained about the PS3's GPU, yet fanboys are quick to forget that. But the developers found out that tapping into the SPU's allowed for better graphics & performance. So, I wouldn't be quick to discount anything at this point. I just hope that developers use the GPGPU to do what it's supposed to do and not get lazy like they once did with the PS3.

[shempo]

this system is a failure
ps4 plz

[Dfooster]

So Nintendo have released a NEW console that can't play games that a seven year old console can, and of which everyone is ready to abandon as they ready the release of another more powerful machine.

That's kinda embarrassing, whether they hold their first party games in such high regards will be irrelevant given some of the incredible third party games coming out early next year which the wii u won't be getting.

They best hope the soccer mums pick up a wii u then or nintendos going under.

[Nattwenny]

Love my Wii U. I love them all and whatever the truth is behind it's power, I will still enjoy it as much as I currently am. Right along side my 360, PS3 and my PC. I love games and the fun that comes from them.

[DeadPixel]

"Huw Beynon, a global communications executive at THQ, told Eurogamer that the media coverage surrounding the quote has "spun" the truth of the matter for the purpose of bolstering website traffic numbers"

http://www.computerandvideo...