Bamboo Shoots writes: Anyone who knows me knows I’m a big fan of stealth based gameplay. When I first started playing Skyrim and Deus Ex: Human Revolution I opted for stealthy, one hit kill, assassin type characters, and while they might not have been very optimal builds in terms of success in gameplay (You can’t sneak up on dragons and the boss fights in DE:HR still make me cry) they were very fun.
I didn’t bring this up to talk about those games however, and I didn’t mean this to be an opening for an article about MGS either. No, I wanted to talk to you a bit about the Thief game series.
Embracer Group AB (”Embracer”) has entered into an agreement to acquire the development studios Crystal Dynamics, Eidos-Montréal, Square Enix Montréal, and a catalogue of IPs including Tomb Raider, Deus Ex, Thief, Legacy of Kain and more than 50 back-catalogue games from SQUARE ENIX HOLDINGS CO., LTD. (“Square Enix Holdings”). In total, the acquisition includes ~1,100 employees across three studios and eight global locations.
Absolutely!
Square Enix says the transaction (which was 'only' $300 million) "enables the launch of new businesses by
moving forward with investments in fields including blockchain, AI, and the cloud."
SE still has Just Cause, Outriders, Life is Strange
And there jrpgs, feel like its a good thing cause they weren't doing anything with them.
So ya disagree and rather have square keep the ips and definitely not see another thief, deus ex etc again
@blackblades
it's probably some diehard SE FF fans who don't want to admit that square is eventually going to put blockchain in it for money's sake. The writing is literally on the monitor wall now. SE admits they want to do blockchain asap and is willing to let go of ip's that are fan favorites for a quicker cash in rather than working on quality. Or at least that's how i see it.
Interesting.... so this was all SE western stuff and none of the JP stuff. Is CD still assisting on Perfect Dark after this?
I said Square was going to do this months ago, they just have no real gains in Western development and they don't know what to do with those studios.
However, this was a dumb decision IMO to sell at this cost and at this time when someone like MS would have probably spent closer to $1 billion on them.
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Sony offers Square a Bungie-like deal at this point.
MS
If anything this is probably confirmation that Microsoft cannot buy any other publisher or developer for the rest of the year until they get confirmation that the Activision-Blizzard deal goes through, because otherwise, they would have easily been able to buy these studios for $1 billion and had all their content in GamePass by their June Showcase. Crystal is basically a hired developer for them right now on Perfect Dark, and Edios and Sqaure Montreal were both talented / good picks as well.
Embracer Group
This is great for Embracer Group, and goes to show that once again an acquisition is not just about who spends the most money, as there were plenty of companies that could have easily outbid them, yet Embracer was still the one to acquire these studios. They're becoming a gaming and entertainment powerhouse with Dark Horse comics, Gearbox (Borderlands / Brothers in Arms), Deep Silver (Saint's Row / Dead Island / Time Splitters now), Warhorse (Kingdom Come), Saber Interactive (Crysis Remastered / Co-developed a lot of Halo modes/content / Timeshift / and a bunch of mid but at least decent mid), THQ Nordic (Darksiders), and now Tomb Raider, Deus Ex, Legacy of Kain, and more.
SE
I also think this was best for SE as well, since they had awful projections on the success they expected from their western teams, and didn't have any idea what to do with them after throwing them to into Marvel devs and failing. This will allow them to focus significantly more on JRPGs the genre they're good at (however, they've been slipping here).
SE / Sony Acquisition
This also brings up another thing what does Square's Market Value look like now as it was just below $5 billion prior? And is Square the publisher people were claiming Sony was trying to buy. Realistically it makes sense, the two have had several exclusive AAA games, and Sony is about owning and expanding AAA IP and Final Fantasy is an ideal IP for that. Sony has an amazing partnership with not only Square but Disney and Marvel and Kingdom Hearts is a bridge there and if I remember correctly they didn't show what platforms it was coming to which makes no sense considering part 3 came to all of them. Final Fantasy games / movies, Kingdom Hearts games / movies, Dragon Quest anime seasons, Life is Strange Netflix series, etc....
I think this basically means that Sony is buying Square. I'm not sure about the rest.
@blackblades
Each studio is allegedly up for sell, but that doesn't guarantee the IP's. So I agree with you to an extent that if it's just the talent / studio name Sony is the most likely buyer. But considering they're being sold individually and how AT&T is all about money / shares / and expansion of IP I don't think Sony is buying all of them, especially when they denied MS for $4 billion allegedly back in 2020.
Really only Rocksteady, Netheralm, Monolith, and Avalanche (the Harry Potter dev, not the Contraband dev) make sense IMO.
Rocksteady is hands down the best developer there with their experience with Batman Arkham franchise and working on an upcoming multiplayer Suicide Squad (aka progressing to live-action). So, they are a perfect fit to add to Sony's Marvel exclusives. They would make a killer Daredevil / Black Panther / X-Men co-op / etc...
Netherealm has proven they can make good / great fighting games with Mortal Kombat being back in high demand, and Injustice is a good 2nd option. Sony owns EVO, getting them and having them make two exclusive fighting games makes sense.
Monolith did make FEAR, the upcoming Wonder Woman, and Middle-Earth which IMO puts them a step above Avalanche until we see Harry Potter for a similar genre, but also having diversity with shooters.
Avalanche just had a solo state of play for a multiplat-game, which I believe is the first ever. While the combat of Harry Potter looks....acceptable, what truly looks great about the game is the world / setting and the creativity and scale of everything. Now allow this developer creative freedom to make a WRPG with a Fantasy setting and better gameplay, and they're a potential AAA studio in the making.
TT makes Lego games which isn't a fit for PS outside of maybe working on Astro spin-offs. And WB Games Montreal is basically the B-tier after Rocksteady by making the less popular Batman games, but they're still a solid developer (Arkham Knight Wii U, Batman Origins, and upcoming Gotham Knights).
WB doesnt matter all their Ips are rented out from someone else. Even mortal kombat will be lost and can WB sell Mortal Kombat and take it away from Netherrealm because they dont on their IP.
Yeah for 300 million I'm super surprised no one else went for them to be honest.
I hope they embrace Classic Tomb Raider
I think most of the big players don't want to generate additional regulatory scrutiny after their big purchases (Sony - Bungie, Microsoft - Activision). They want to fly under the radar until the deals have been approved. I am assuming that the recent announcements of both Xbox and Sony hiring people to find new acquisition targets means as soon as these deals are in the bag, they will move forward with further acquisitions.
Otherwise I agree with you, this would have been easy pickings for either company.
i rather have a new legacy of kain, or a complete remake if a new game cant be justified or something.
On the surface it may seem like a good deal but they’re also buying all their debt.
Asa subsidiary they wouldn't have any debt, no? Square enix would've been the ones taking the losses.
We don't know the wholse story (we may never will), 300m for all those assets seems too good to be true without it's downside...
"These are some of the best PC IPs of all time and SE somehow has no idea how to make them successful according to their ballooned expectations. Please sell." ~ Digital Foundry's comment on the news.
Here's hoping we get a Sleeping Dogs sequel and Legacy of Kain revival.
*forgot to add: a proper new Thief title as well.
A Sleeping Dogs sequel would be great!
I personally had much more fun with that than GTA V.
I hope the Sleeping Dogs IP is included, they bought over 50 IP from SE's back catalog so it's likely.
True, Thief started off as a great series back in the day!
I feel as if we had been....wait for it....robbed of a proper sequel up until now!
Good news for which side? I personally am more happy that money going to fund eidos IP is now going to Square IP.
I have been meh on the recent Eidos games and i don't really place the blame on Square.
What a steal honestly, wouldve preffered sony or microsoft to be the ones buying but hey atleast its not tencent.
I have all 3 consoles so makes no difference to me which if the big 3 get them.
My fear with embracer group is whats to stop them from jumping into the console space now?
They have the devs and game ips, the console would certainly have enough exclusives.
Last thing i want is a group big enough to jump into the console space, 3 is enough.
You really think an unknown company most people dont know about would go into a console space just like that pshh
Flawlessmic
Who CARES what consoles you have?
It is much better for all gamers that they remain multi platforms so that everyone can enjoy those IPs.
I literally explained why lol or cant u guys read. I stated i own all 3 so my first comment would make sense as i obviously wpuldnt miss out on the games if it was sony or ms.
I said my fear is they will own so much that surely the idea of making there own console or service where its only available there will come at some point hence its going exclusive anyway, onky difference is its either another cobsole on top of 3 players we have already or yet another subcription service.
Probs wont happen but like i said just a fear.
And also just like u guys dont care, i dont care if you or other people wont be able to play certain games, sounds like a you problem 🤙
300 million for all that is a great deal for embracer and I mean what are you thinking SE? Those are some valuable IP's
I really thought they were the acquisition Sony would have made but now I am puzzled by this. So many publishers would have paid more than 300 million for all that. I mean Sony paid over 3.5 billion for Bungie(and before someone comes in and says Sony over paid, Bungie can make Sony a FPS that can compete and beat halo and compete in live service market)
Sony still wayyyyyyyyyy overpaid for bungie no matter how you slice it.
Beating halo aint that hard these days so its not saying much.
I wouldve taken this purchase over bungie all day, everyday and twice on sunday and have a cool 3 billion left over to buy konamis ip or konami whole and would probs still have more money left over to bu even more ips or devs.
Instead we got bungie with 1, i repeat 1 ip and its nothing special.
That bungie deal sucked ass for sony simple as that.
I agree, over 10x that for bloody bungie and destiny, and they are keeping everything multiplat (ms not doing the same with Bethesda), it just makes me laugh, such an awful deal.
Jim and Herman seem obsessed with cramming PS players with live service games, did they forget what brought the huge success last gen?
@soul warrior
I hear ya mate, 3.6 bill for bungie was laughable while giving them complete autonomy like what did they even pay for then if sony cant even have a say if push came to shove.
Add in the fact sony probs overpaid for haven which hasnt even done a single thing then throw in the other billion wasted on the metaverse.
Unfortunantly its looks like there going down the same road as everyelse now, crummy live service games = easy money for unfinished games that lack content, dont have a decent story or top shelf graphics, which is what sony is known for.
Hate this new direction sony are going, its honestly the first time in 26 years since iv started gaming that im starting to doubt them and the games there gonna provide.
Iv always owned majority of the consoles released between ps1 and now but playstation has always been the day 1 never a doubt.
Hope im wrong but i think those days are over.
@flawlessmic yeah bungie for me is 500-800m at best with just destiny franchise(even with the knowledge of live service). But maybe sony knows something that we dont? I'll take this deal over bungie, That deal is OP
To you & I that seems like an overprice for Bungie but Sony is a billion-dollar business & they must have had good business reasons to buy Bungie at that price,evidently knowing something that we don't know.
I don't think they overpaid. Destiny is one of the top 5 lucrative game in the world I think. It gives them a huge IP to counter COD, Fallout and TES (not Halo, they don't care about that).
sony didnt just pay 3.6 billion for the company and the destiny ip. they paid for bungie's tech and knowledge in the gaas world. over 1 billion of the 3.6 billion purchase price went specifically to the people who actually made the game. they wanted to make sure they werent going anywhere for 5 yrs so they could use there expertise to help then jumpstart gaas for other playstation studios. im not a big fan of gaas in general, but with the right ip i will definitely jump in with both feet. i am especially interested in the last of us game and the rumored insomniac marvel gaas game. bungie is a major money maker and they are going to show sony how do do it properly. seems like a lot of money now, but they will quickly recoup the money with bungie's help.
Yea because apparently there no other completely online games with succesfull online strcutures right?? Bungie must be geniuses to have the first online game ever.
Ive heard that rubbish regurgitated so many times about the talent and online structure.
Like i said u can try swing it anyway u want but bungie aint close to being worth 3.5 billion.
There were much better deals to be made out there with much more talented devs.
This deal proves that, the deal for insomniac proves it, the deal for bethesda proves it, thats what you call good value for talented devs, multiple studios and multiple valuable ips.
Destiny is a good game at best, dont know why you defenders come put acting like they have created gamings masterpiece to be so overvalued.
The bungie deal stinks and you know hence why u need to cling to internet infrastructure, so called talented devs that have made 2 games since halo with a metacritic sitting around 80 at best. And my favorite one to hear is bungie has something hiding that we dont know about lol.
Bungie aint that talented, they skinned sonny for everything they could and came out on top.
They secured the talent at bungie which is more vital than the IP itself. If you remember something like 2 billion was paid to make sure the staff stays.
You are missing the point completely. Ms paid 45% above market value for Activision so the market has inflated. Another thing people miss in that 3.6 billion is about half of that is going towards making Bungie even bigger and retaining their current talent core
No doubt in a normal world Bungie would go for under 1 billion and Activision for around 45 billion but this no longer is normal
Flaw
Sony knows what they are working on and we don't
"Sony overpaid for Bungie Overcome Objection 101"
1. Made the 3rd and 4th best-selling FPS franchises of all time, with both earning over $4 billion in revenue.
2. Owns rights to said 3rd best-selling FPS franchise of all-time which earned over $4 billion in 2 games.
3. Said franchise earns an average of over $300 million per year in add-on content
4. Said franchise in its 4th year still sees several hundred thousand - 1 million players daily (other IPs are dead)
5. Said franchise is becoming a multi-media IP for gaming / film&TV / and eventually heavy merchandise
6. Expertise in Live-Service games (of which Sony has plenty to release and learn from)
Definitely not worth $3.6 billion.
Possibly the only independent developer at the time to have not one but 2 multi-billion dollar franchises to their name.
For comparison, every single-player game would need to sell 33+ million copies to hit multi-billion status but since PS5 games are now $70 Sony helped drop the goal down to a more achievable 28.5+ million copies for multi-billion status.
Every F2P game would have to earn $200,000,000 per year for the next 10 years, to achieve what Destiny does/did in just 3 - 4 years. That's if said multiplayer game is even able to achieve a 3 - 4 year lifespans while maintaining a 6 and 7-figure player counts daily. Meanwhile in reality player counts for anything not named Fortnite, Warzone, Apex haven't seen 6 figure player counts 6 months post launch.
That's why they paid for them. Bungie's games will pay the $3.6 billion on it's own over time. They also have a studio that can help their other live-service games hopefully see even 1/4 of the success Destiny has had which would be a huge financial win.
It's the same things as someone buying an investment home, yes for some people it could be 3% of their own overall value or 1/3 or 1/5 of your budget, but if your investment pans out you can make 2x or significantly more than you paid for the property to begin with.
In my eyes sony over paid for bungie it will take many years unless they make the next fortnite to get that money back. The only real reason I can see them paying that much is so they have talented devs at keeping online games running smoothly which may be worth all that money in Sony's eyes when it comes to their future in online games as a service.
I"n my eyes sony over paid for bungie it will take many years unless they make the next fortnite to get that money back"
You do realise Desinty 2 is still one of the most played games today right. Normally around a million players per day. They then have all sorts of DLC and MTs and I'm pretty sure it's not just one or two people out if them million players paying for silver to buy things. They must make a fair wack per day on MTs alone.
So I'm sure Sony know what they where doing when they paid that much for Bungie.
The Reticule team come together to share their thoughts and memories of the legendary Shalebridge Cradle level from Thief Deadly Shadows.
In a podcast with Wassup Conversations, Jordan Thomas, director and the writer of BioShock 2 reveals his initial ideas for a new rapture and how they were shut down by 2K.
"My first proposal was about a little sister, it was playing as a little sister and it was much more horror-oriented pace and about vulnerability, closer to Thief frankly, but I was told no, we want it to be our Gears of War, this need to be a big shooter franchise with an emphasis on the shooter element, and so what I think of the protagonist of a shooter as is a big lumbering sort of porthole on a stick with guns sticking out in front like you’re almost a vehicle."
And he also wanted it to be above the sea or in space. What a wasted opportunity.
It's surprising the game turned out to be good with this guy at the helm. The combat mechanics were actually the biggest improvement in the sequel as much as he wouldn't want to hear that, everything else was inferior.
