340°

Nvidia's GTX680 gets thrashed by AMD's mid-range Radeon HD 7870 in GPU compute Source: The Inquirer

The Inquirer: WE'VE HEARD REPORTS about how the upcoming Nvidia GTX680, the very first Kepler 'GK104' GPU will beat all and sundry in everything, including AMD's top of the range Radeon HD 7970, despite the latter's new GCN architecture and 50 per cent wider memory buses and memory capacity.

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theinquirer.net
Letros4411d ago

Different compute languages for different cards, the Radeon would get "thrashed" in CUDA.

T9004410d ago (Edited 4410d ago )

I dont really care if the GTX 680 doesnt out perform the 7970, even if it is on par i would still go Nvidia.

This is purely because of better driver support from Nvidia.

You can have the best of hardware, however without driver support it will fail. Specially AMD has a record of not supporting hardware properly few years into its life.

I personally have 2 gaming laptops one which features Nvidia GTX 260m another with a HD5870. The laptop with the HD 5870 is 1 year newer. However there are many times games just run better on the GTX 260m this is purely because of better drivers. Hence you have an example of older hardware out performing newer hardware.

I am never buying another AMD product ever again, be it their CPUs or their GPUs.

forcefullpower4410d ago (Edited 4410d ago )

Thats all i ever here is ATI can out compute nvidia yet everytime i see real world test with games. The NVIDIA card always out perform the ATI ones.

Totally agree with you i hate the ATI drivers as well. NVIDIA always seem on the ball with releasing at lest beta drivers prior to games release yet always waiting for ATI nearly a month sometimes for them get there act together.

kneon4410d ago

But I find the Nvidia drivers to cause the most problems. Almost every Windows 7 failure I've seen was related to NVidia drivers. I have NVidia in my machine and I put ATi in my daughters. Hers never has problem whereas mine has on several occasions failed to boot and windows gets screwed up and it's always been the NVidia driver that's at fault.

MmaFan-Qc4410d ago

AMD and their "Bulldozer" against the Intel i5 was the same thing, the Bulldozer was supposed to rape intel latest cpu......but with factual tests, amd failed hard.

Arnon4410d ago

Agreed. Real world tests will result with NVIDIA pulling ahead, and these new 680's look fantastic.

I've owned AMD before, and I have to agree that I did not particularly like their driver support, or even drivers for that matter. I seemed to always run into stuttering issues. Right now, I'm running an NVIDIA GTX 560ti, and the first thing I noticed in improvements were their drivers.

Kakkoii4410d ago

Yeah, there are rumors that Nvidia has either capped the general computer performance on these cards, to sell Quadro's instead, or that the current drivers don't have proper OpenCL and DirectCompute for this new architecture.

In game performance this card is beating the 7970 almost all the time, sometimes in quite large leads. And in rare cases even beating dual 580's and 7970's.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 4410d ago
JsonHenry4410d ago

I've never had any trouble with Nvidia or AMD driver support. Not sure why so many people complain about one or the other.

I don't care what synthetic bench it gets. I want real performance numbers in GAMES. Then I will decide which one I get.

Lazy_Sunday4410d ago (Edited 4410d ago )

You do all know this is the Inquirer, right?

Lazy_Sunday4410d ago

You do know all know this is the Inquirer, right?

ATi_Elite4410d ago (Edited 4410d ago )

1. "Different compute languages for different cards"

They use the same language (DirectX or OpenGL) just different ways to perform the task. BUT the Api's used to get non gaming apps to use the GPU is different.

2. " the Radeon would get "thrashed" in CUDA."

Of course it would......seeing how CUDA is a parallel computing architecture developed by Nvidia for NVIDIA graphics cards to perform non Gaming functions!

Nvidia = CUDA
AMD = ATi Stream Technology

3. The guy said he doesn't have a Nvidia GTX680 card so how the hell is he running this test?

4. I'm gonna wait for Hardware Canucks to get a hold of a GTX680 and drool over their benchmarks. They do an excellent job and seem unbiased to either camp!

5. Nvidia = Top tier performance
AMD = Best bang for buck

FutureTechnologies4410d ago

AMD is no longer ati stream tech, but CGN cores (graphic core next)

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 4410d ago
Orpheus4411d ago

With Fuad gone to Fudzilla, theinquirer has lost its mind !!!

kaveti66164410d ago

I highly doubt it. The 680 has huge 40 percent performance gains over the 580.

More reliable sources have proven this because they have actually collected data from side by side tests.

The article is funny in that the writer happens to be in Shenzhen, the very place where the cards are manufactured.

LightofDarkness4410d ago

'tis because this is not the GK110 flagship. This is a 560 Ti replacement with higher clocks than intended, because the 7970 turned out to be non-competitive with the GK110, and sold as a flagship (because Nvidia enjoy money).

Besides, compute performance isn't a thing gamers need to be concerned with in general Civ 5 benchmarks are still quite largely in Nvidia's favour, and that's the only game where it seems to matter even a little.

JsonHenry4410d ago

Exactly. This isn't the GK110. It is the GK104 and they just named it 680 because it competes with 7970 directly.

So it looks like I will be waiting until mid summer to get my hands on the real GK110. :/

Kakkoii4410d ago

That's not really why. All indications show that this card should do general computing MUCH faster than a 580. But for some reason OpenCL and DirectCompute are being severally capped on this card. Read Anandtech's breakdown of the architecture.

pucpop4410d ago

its amd, not ati folks. also, the 680 is leagues above amd. next...

FlameBaitGod4410d ago

Am I the only one that thinks ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ that is epic fail?

johnnyvegas4410d ago

I think YOU are the one that actually epic failed since you failed to realize what he writes is true. AMD dropped the ATI name a while ago.

http://m.zdnet.com/blog/har...

Solid_Snake374410d ago

You do know that AMD owns the Radeon ATI cards right?

johnnyvegas4410d ago

Actually, if you want to get technical AMD dropped the ATI name a year or two ago. So the new Radeons are no longer called "ATI Radeons HD xxxx," but rather called "AMD Radeon xxxx" or just simply "Radeon HD xxxx."

Pandamobile4410d ago

The ATI brand was dissolved a few years ago. It's just AMD now.

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330°

Nvidia DLSS 3.7 drives a further nail in the coffin of native performance

Nvidia DLSS 3.7 is the latest update to the long-running AI upscaling technology, and it further shows native performance doesn't matter.

DustMan6d ago

I think hardware development is at a point where they need to figure out how to draw less power, These beefy high end cards eat wattage, and I'm curious if using DLSS & AI in general will lower the power draw. It would seem like the days of just adding more VRAM & horsepower is over. Law of diminishing returns. Pretty soon DLSS/FSR will be incorporated into everything, and eventually the tech will be good enough to hardly notice a difference if at all. AI is the future and it would be foolish to turn around and not incorporate it at all. Reliance on AI is only going to pick up more & more.

Tapani5d ago (Edited 5d ago )

DLSS certainly lowers power consumption. Also, the numbers such as the 4090 at 450W does not tell you everything, most of the time the GPU stays between 200-350W in gameplay, which is not too different from the highest end GPU of 10 years ago. Plus, today you can undervolt + OC GPUs by a good margin to keep stock performance while utilizing 80% of the power limit.

You can make the 4090 extremely power efficient and keep 90% of its performance at 320W.

However, in today's world the chip manufacturing is limited by physics and we will have power increases in the next 5-10 years at the very least to keep the technology moving forward at a pace that satisfies both businesses and consumers.

Maybe in 10 years we have new tech coming to the markets which we are yet to invent or perhaps we can solve existing technologies problems with manufacturing or cost of production.

On the other hand, if we were to solve the energy problem on earth by utilizing fusion and solar etc. it would not matter how much these chips require. That being said, in the next 30-40 years that is a pipedream.

MrBaskerville5d ago

I don't think fusion is the way forward. It will mosy likely be too late when it's finally ready, meaning it will probably never be ready. Something else might arrive before though and then it becomes viable.

Firebird3605d ago

We need to stop the smear campaign on nuclear energy.
We could power everything forever if we wanted too.

Tacoboto6d ago

PS4 Pro had dedicated hardware in it for supporting checkerboard rendering that was used significantly in PS4 first party titles, so you don't need to look to PC or even modern PC gaming. The first RTX cards released nearly 6 years ago, so how many nails does this coffin need?

InUrFoxHole6d ago

Well... its a coffin man. So atleast 4?

Tacoboto6d ago

PSSR in the fall can assume that role.

anast5d ago

and those nails need to be replaced annually

Einhander19726d ago

I'm not sure what the point you're trying to make is, but PS4 Pro was before DLSS and FSR, and it still provides one of the highest performance uplifts while maintaining good image quality.

DLSS is it's own thing but checkerboarding om PS5 still is a rival to the likes of FSR2.

Tacoboto6d ago

Um. That is my point. That there have been so many nails in this "native performance" coffin and they've been getting hammered in for years, even on PS4 Pro before DLSS was even a thing.

RaidenBlack5d ago

Don't know what's OP's point is either but ... checkerboard rendering was good enough for its time but in terms of image quality its wayy behind what's DLSS 3 or FSR 3 is currently offering.
The main point of the article and what OP missed here is that DLSS 3.7 is soo good that its nearly undisguisable from native rendering and basically throws the "its still blurry and inferior to native rendering" debacle, (that's been going around in PC community since 2019), right out of the window.

Einhander19725d ago

RaidenBlack

DLSS is as i said a different thing from FSR and checkerboard.

But you're talking about FSR 3 which probably is better than checkerboard, but FSR 3 has only started to get games this year, so checkerboard which was the first hardware upscaling solution was and is still one of the best upscaling solutions.

Give credit where credit is due, PlayStation was first and they got it right from the get go, and PSSR will almost certainly be better than it will be given credit for, heck digital foundry is already spreading misinformation about the Pro.

Rhythmattic5d ago

Tacoboto
Yes... Its amazing how many talekd about KZ2 deferred rendering, pointing out the explosions were lower res than the frame itself..
And of course, Then the idea of checkerboard rendering, not being native....
For sure, maybe this tech makes it minimal while pixel counting, but alas, seems performance and close enough , and not native now matters.....
I want to see it run native without DLSS.. why not?

RonsonPL6d ago

Almost deaf person:
- lightweight portable 5$, speakers of 0,5cm diameter are the final nail in coffin of Hi-Fi audio!

Some people in 2010:
- smartphones are the final nain in the console gaming's coffin!

This is just the same.
AI upscalling is complete dogshit in terms of motion quality. The fact that someone is not aware of it (look at the deaf guy example) doesn't mean the flaws are not there. They are. And all it takes to see them, is to use a display that handles motion well, so either gets true 500fps at 500Hz LCD TN or OLED (or faster tech) or uses low persistence mode (check blurbusters.com if you don't know what it means) also known as Black Frame Insertion or backlight strobing.

Also, image ruined by any type of TAA is just as "native image" as chineese 0,5$ screwdriver is "high quality, heavy duty, for professional use". It's nowhere near it. But if you're an ignorant "journalist", you will publish crap like this article, just to flow with the current.

There's no coffin to native res quality and there never will be. Eventually, we'll have enough performance in rasterization to drive 500fps, which will be a game changer for motion quality while also adding other benefit - lower latency.
And at 500fps, the amount of time required for upscalling makes it completely useless.
This crap is only usable for cinematic stuff, like cutscenes and such. Not for gaming. Beware of ignorants on the internet. The TAA is not "native" and the shitty look of the modern games when you disable any TAA, is not "native" either as it's ruined by the developer's design choice - you can cheat by rendering every 4th pixel when you plan to put a smeary TAA pass on it later on. When you disable it, you will see a ruined image, horrible pixellation and other visual "glitches" but it is NOT what native would've looked like if you'd like to honestly compare the two.

Stay informed.

RaidenBlack5d ago

Main point of the article is how far DLSS has come with v3.7 since 2018. If this is what we're getting already, then imagine what we'll get within next ~3 years. Yes parity will obviously be there compared to the then native rendering tech but it'll slowly narrow down to the point it'll be indistinguishable.
Something similar is like the genAI Sora ... AI generative videos were turd back when they were introduced (the infamous Will Smith eating video) ... but now look at Sora, generating videos that just looks like real life.

5d ago
Yui_Suzumiya5d ago

How much VRAM is standard today? My laptop has a 1080p QLED display but only an Intel Iris Xe with 128MB of VRAM. I currently do all my gaming on it but certain titles do suffer because of it. I plan on getting a Steam Deck OLED soon to play the newer and more demanding titles.

purple1015d ago

Maybe better to get a budget gaming laptop and link a dualsense to it

= Portable console with far better graphics than a steam deck! + bigger screen and able to use it for work / etc

170°

Why I'm worried about the Nvidia RTX 50 series

Aleksha writes: "Nvidia has established itself as a dominant force in the world of AI, but I can't shake the worry of what this means for the RTX 50 series."

Tal1699d ago

Echo sentiment here - I think the way GPUs are going, gaming could be secondary to deep learning. Wonder if the 40 series was the last true generation of GPUs?

Number1TailzFan9d ago

No.. Jensen believes GPUs should stay expensive. Those wanting a top end GPU will have to splash out for it, or play at just 1080p and 60fps or something if you can only afford a low end option.

On the other hand if you don't care about RT or AI performance then there's always AMD that are doing ok at the mid range.

Christopher8d ago

***or play at just 1080p and 60fps or something***

My over 2-year-old laptop GPU still runs fine. I think this is more a reason why GPUs are going to other things in priority, because the market reach for new users is shrinking as more PC gamers focus less on replacing older and still working parts that run RT/AI fine enough as it is. Not to say there aren't people who still do it, but I think the market is shrinking for having the latest and greatest like it has been the past two decades. Problem is we aren't growing things at a rate as we were, we're reaching the the flattening of that exponential curve in regards to advancement. We need another major technological advancement to restart that curve.

D0nkeyBoi9d ago

The irremoval ad makes it impossible to read article

Tzuno8d ago (Edited 8d ago )

I hope Intel takes some lead and do a big dent to nvidia sales

Jingsing8d ago

You also need to consider that NVIDIA are heavily invested in cloud gaming. So they are likely going to make moves to push you into yet another life subscription service.

Kayser818d ago

NVIDIA will never change their price point until AMD or intel makes a GPU that is comparable and cheaper than them .
it happend before in the days of gtx280 which they changed the price from 650$ to 450$ in a matter of 2 weeks because of rx4870 which is being sold at 380$.

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230°

Nvidia AI Demo Unwittingly Proves that Human Voice Actors, Artists, and Writers are Irreplaceable

Nvidia presented Covert Protocol, a tech demo aiming to showcase the "power" of the Nvidia Ace technology applied to video game characters.

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techraptor.net
Eonjay29d ago (Edited 29d ago )

They look like they are in pain. Almost begging to be put down. It was uncomfortable to watch.

PRIMORDUS29d ago

The tech. is too early. Come back in 10+yrs and see what it can do then.

N3mzor29d ago

That presentation sounds like it was written by an AI using corporate buzzwords.

CS729d ago

I don’t know why people keep thinking of it as AI vs no AI.

A much more likely scenario is the use of AI alongside human work.

Eg. AI voices used during side quests or banter to boost the lines of dialog.

AI generating additional pre determined branches in dialog tree options for more freedom in conversations with NPCs

Smellsforfree29d ago

"AI generating additional pre determined branches in dialog tree options for more freedom in conversations with NPCs"

I'm wondering about that last one. Will that make a game more fun or more immersive? In the end, how can it possibly be more than filler content and then if it is filler content how much do I really want to engage with conversing with it if I know it will lead no where?

MrBaskerville29d ago

It's one of those things that sounds cool on paper. But will probably get old fast.

DivineHand12529d ago

The tech is now available, and it is up to creators to create something unique with it.

Profchaos29d ago (Edited 29d ago )

The biggest thing to talk about here is that every interaction requires communication to inworld servers so there's three big impacts here
1) games are always online no question about it
2) delays in processing on inworld servers, outages or unexpected load as a result of some astronomically popular game will cause real time game delays ever wait for a chat got response this will be similar as the context must be pulled via the llm.

Now as for the other impact the artistic one no I don't think writers can be replaced I've mentioned before often AI generated writing is word soup I still standby that it's also evident in the video to.
AI can not convery accurately human emotions and I don't think ever will.

I know publishers are looking to cut down on development costs but what happens when inworld decide to charge per interaction or update their pricing a year after your game goes live you have no choice but pay it or shutter it.

Ive felt for a while that we are heading towards this place of games being disposable entertainment and now it's feeling more and more accurate

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