Disney Votes for 51GB HD DVD Media Approval

Walt Disney Home Entertainment, a major Hollywood studio and one of the strongest backers of Blu-ray disc format, voted for approval of a preliminary specification of 51GB triple-layer HD DVD media, just like all the backers of HD DVD and unlike some other backers of Blu-ray Association within the DVD Forum, who typically abstain in HD DVD-related votes.

The fact that Walt Disney Home Entertainment, which official stance has always been strong Blu-ray support, may be an indicator that even members of the Blu-ray Association are potentially interested in the forthcoming versions of the HD DVD standard.

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Multigamer3986d ago

if hd dvd is cheaper and storage was blu rays only advantage then maybe u could see film companies goin neutral or even going exclusive to hd dvd, this war is not over yet

lawman11083986d ago

Just wait for the numbers on the A3 hd dvd player after it sells this week.

lawman11083986d ago

Just wait for the numbers on the A3 hd dvd player after it sells this week.

marinelife93986d ago

The problem with the triple layer disc is because the way it is made none of the current players can read it. Something to do with how the laser diode was made to read through the layers. A ten layer Blu-Ray disc would have the same shortcoming.

Kholinar3986d ago

This is not a troll, but I'd find a more reliable source. From later on in the thread (a conversation between a poster and the original article poster):

"Poster - "Uh.. a single layered Blue-Ray disk can hold 25GB of data. How can three layers hold 50GB?
And also, a triple-layered HD-DVD can only hold 45GB, so how can Toshiba "magically" make one that is 51GB? Then its not HD-DVD, its HD-DVD+ or something.

zekrahminator -Don't ask me, ask the news source I got this stuff off of :)."

If they're not even correct on br storage numbers, then I doubt we can trust any other data without collaboration.

marinelife93986d ago

Your okay Kohl. Ritek made the statement. They were stating that even their ten layer Blu-Ray disc (With the same technology applicable to HD DVD as well) would not be readable on current players.

blackmagic3986d ago

All articles concerning whether HD DVD players could read 51GB discs stemmed from this interview with Jim Armour, Engineer - Optical Disc Device Division, Toshiba, who was asked about whether players could read 3 layer 45Gb discs:

DVDTimes: Basically, not good enough to get anything out of, then?
Jim Armour, Toshiba: Not good enough to get information out of, WITHOUT this PRML circuitry, and the first drives don't have PRML circuitry built in. I don't think that even with a firmware upgrade, you'd be able to do it.
DVDTimes: Right, it's physical hardware then?
Jim Armour, Toshiba: Yeah, I think second or third generation hardware - fine, but not first-generation products.

Toshiba must feel confident about it now though because here is Jim Armour's outlook now:

The good news is that the 51GB discs should play in all HD DVD players currently on the market. We discussed this with James Armour from Toshiba's optical storage division at CeBIT this year, and were told that although the third layer would be harder to read, and generate more data errors, the player's error correction should be able to fix these problems without picture and sound problems.

Arutha3986d ago

Toshiba has packed the data better onto each layer which has allowed them to change it from 15 gigs a layer to 17 gigs a layer. That is how they are getting 51 Gigs for a Triple Layer. Also the original NEC Drive was spec'd for a 45Gig Triple Layer so there is a good possibility that the current player will be able to play the triple layer discs.

Time will tell to see what plays out.

kewlkat0073986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )

They give

1.Support to Blu-Ray
2.Sell content off Xbox Live
3.Backing HD-DVD technologies.

That's right, what they got to loose, NOTHING.

They are prepared.. to go whichever way.

Like I said I don't care so much for this war, seriously, I don't even own DVD's but its interesting to watch what develops, who pays who for unfinished formats, and temp deals.

Seems like Fanboys have more to loose in this war. Making declaration left and right. I went to Walmart yesterday and them DVD bins had plenty of hands in them looking for bargins.

Tru_Blu3985d ago

OMG!!!!!! Blu-ray is gonna make v1.1 discs? that will play in v1.0 players, without the extras? But HDvD is gonna make new 51gb discs that won't play in any current players?? The fanboy standard has been raised once again, just when you though it couldn't. Like Kewl said, they just want to be 100% on every outcome.

+ Show (6) more repliesLast reply 3985d ago
Zhuk3986d ago

With recent strong sales of HD DVD in Europe and the US combined with growing support for the format, I think that many companies are rethinking their stance on HD DVD and considering dropping exclusivity with Blu Ray to support both formats.

marinelife93986d ago

Your entire post just got dismissed once you stated the words and I quote "I think".

Kholinar3986d ago

"Your entire post just got dismissed once you stated the words and I quote "I think"."

Pffft. I disagree with Zhuk most of the time, but what you've just stated is department of redundancy department material.

Everyone here just states what they "think"/opinions occasionally backed up with numbers from corporations with vested interests or media/statistic companies trying to sell stat analysis...

Even if it was complete facts without Zhuk stating "I think," people would ignore it because they're too wrapped up in what "they think."

GrizAdams3986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )


At the very least, it's probably best that he included 'I think.'

So many people state their opinions as fact, yet Zhuk stated an opinion - disguised in no way as fact. There's no reason to criticize that.

demolitionX3986d ago

for players that will not read the 51GB discs, and will be thrown in the nearest garbage if this 51GB get released!!!! keep dreaming!!!!

marinelife93986d ago

I'm glad we've established that you put a lot more stock into what someone thinks on a message board than I do. If you think his hunch about what a movie exec may or may not be speculating is valid there is nothing I can do to stop you. As for me I decided that unless he had a quote or proof his opinion didn't count for much. But that's just me.

Kholinar3986d ago

"If you think his hunch about what a movie exec may or may not be speculating is valid there is nothing I can do to stop you. As for me I decided that unless he had a quote or proof his opinion didn't count for much. But that's just me."

Glad to hear your opinion. :p

I'm not sure exactly where I stated that his opinion meant anything to me. I just stated that, as a comment, it's no different than 99% of the other comments. So your statement is a little unnecessary.

GrizAdams3986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )

I don't necessarily agree with Zhuk's sentiments, but I do think it fair that he be able to state an opinion as an opinion.

If you want to see the opposite, where opinion (if even that) is stated as fact, look no further than demoltitionx's post.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 3986d ago
BIoodmask3986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )

to manufacture these new 51 GB disks there really won't be any difference bw Bluray and HD DVD. I know that Blu-ray has the higher content per layer on the disk, but 51 GB is more than sufficient for movies. Anything greater would more than likely be used for PC storage, but with the large HDDs coming out now it really isn't necessary.

I have to laugh at Disney though. It seems like they are playing everyone. They support Blu-ray exclusively, then they approve the new HD DVD standard, "and" they also have movies out on XBLM. LOL

Altis13986d ago

Most corporations will do that.

Mu5afir3986d ago

First off, HD-DVD needs 3 layers to reach 51gb. Blu-Ray gets 75gb at 3 layers and 50gb at 2 layers. You can never have too much space, as evident by the fact that most HD-DVDs don't even carry HIGH DEFINITION audio.

The Blu-Ray vs. HD-DVD war is OVER, Ps3 sales roughly 400 thousand units a month. In two months of Ps3 sales, the numbers totals all HD-DVD sales (including HD-DVD addon for Xbox 360).

The only excuse most people make is the "stand alone players", as if they want some type of "handicap" victory. If you weren't supporting Xbox 360 / Ps3 I am sure you would want to support the best format out there.

As a CONSUMER, I want the best format not DVD v2.. so I support the Blu-Ray format.

bootsielon3986d ago

There's never enough space. DVD9 is too small for games just as HD-DVD is too small for HD movies. The fact that games and movies can be made for these formats doesn't mean they are ideal. I'm not saying that Blu-ray is ideal either; even Kojima said that 50 GB won't be enough for MGS4.

There is a trilogy announced for Blu-ray and it comes in a single disc. It would be awesome to get the whole LOTR trilogy in HD in a single disc (It's not a fanboy dream, as I said, there's already a trilogy in production for blu-ray, I think it's encounters of the 3rd kind but I'm not sure). It would also be awesome to have a whole TV season of your favorite program in a single disc instead of five like the current model. I would pay more.

Even then, there would be a limit, whether it's 200 Gigabyte, 3.9 Terabytes, or 1.1 Petabytes. Resolution on TVs will keep increasing (Ultra Hi-Vision anyone?), and it won't be feasible to keep making new formats and HDDs. That's why content on demand will be king; but that won't happen until 2035 or so when most people have Gigabit Ethernet.

For now, the most viable solution should be Blu-ray. Its price isn't that far from HD-DVD anymore, especially if you consider PS3. Since most people don't have an HDTV now, the war has a long time from being over. First the great majority people would have to have an HDTV. By then, Blu-ray will be as cheap as HD-DVD, but with superior technology.

For those reasons, and for the fact that I want to burn all of my information on big ass discs (ones that are comercially supported), I want Blu-ray to win, until there are other better than BD solutions.

blackmagic3986d ago (Edited 3985d ago )

You forgot to mention that 55% of all Blu-ray releases are on 25GB discs and that 30% of all Blu-ray releases use Dolby Digital streams with a max bitrate of 640 kb/s.

90% of HD DVD releases use Dolby Digital Plus with a max bitrate of 3000 kb/s, 20% have lossless streams and NO releases use the lowly Dolby Digital CODEC.

Edit: I might add that Disney/Beuna Vista, who stated they needed the space as the reason to go Blu-ray, has released 20 films out of 45 total releases on 25 GB discs.

Edit 2: Thanks Kholinar!

Kholinar3986d ago

very impressive links...

Mu5afir3986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )

Please, don't misinform people with "max" bit rates. Just because the codec can encode at 3000kbs doesn't mean the encode will happen at 3000kbs. Secondly, the coding process is left to the studios it isn't ruled on by the Blu-Ray association.

I highly doubt few if ANY HD-DVDs are coded at 3000kbs, you can always prove me wrong. I won't bother going into the technical specs of why a typical HD-DVD disk can't have lossless audio and video, but I think you get the point.

Blu-Ray loosless: 59.50% .
HD-DVD loosless: 19.72%

This is from YOUR SOURCES, so there. :)

blackmagic3986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )

You need to read up before you speak up bud. The Dolby Digital and Dolby Digital Plus CODECs support variable bitrates. Because Dolby Digital is an old (created in 1992), ineffiecient CODEC compared to Dolby Digital Plus and because it also caps out at 640kb/s on Blu-ray, most encodes are set at a constant maximum of 640kb/s throughout the whole film. For Dolby Digital Plus on HD DVD, most encodes are set up for 1500 kb/s variable bitrate which means that in complex sound sections the full 3000kb/s is used but the AVERAGE bitrate is kept at 1500kb/s. Anybody with a rudimentary understanding of these CODECs would understand this however some people that don't take the time to educate themselves often make fools of themselves, throwing around insults and bullying other members when they actually don't have a clue.

Now it is completely true (and I was and continue to be fully aware of this) that 60% of Blu-ray releases are lossless but this does not change the fact that 30% are using the dated, inefficient low bitrate Dolby Digital CODEC and it doesn't change the fact that >EVERY< HD DVD release is using a better CODEC than the Dolby Digital CODEC.

It is also debatable whether a lossless stream is perceptively better than a DD+ stream ESPECIALLY when not using audiophile level equipment in a tuned listening environment. Even then I think you would need a trained ear to percieve it.

If you are going to claim clear audio superiority over HD DVD then you need to back it up with concise evidence because based on the level of knowledge shown in your comments I am certainly not going to take your word for it and I am not talking about anecdotal evidence either.

Perhaps next time you can make a comment that adds value to the site instead of attacking anyone that doesn't agree with your uninformed opinion.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 3986d ago
MikeMichaels3986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )

For the next news post about and hour from now saying, "Disney: We never said anything about HD-DVD blah blah blah"

...thats pretty much the way things go around here. *rolls eyes*

Fanboys, save your self the embarrassment and just read the news without beating your chest for one company or the other.

Neo-Delta3986d ago

Meh it's so obviously that HD-DVD only use this 51GB disc as a marketing ploy I mean they can only manage to squeese 1GB higher then a dual layered Blu-Ray? I'm sure thay could have went higher. I mean if they manage 51GB on a triple layer what can blu-ray manage?

Danja3986d ago (Edited 3986d ago )

umm dude not saying wrong but..but I don't think Blu-ray has a 75GB..I Thought it would have been 100GB..and they are working on specs for the 200GB..!!

question can most HD-DVD player even manage the 51GB disc's without breaking..?

Mu5afir3986d ago

It's 25gb per layer at 3x layer times 25gb = 75gbs. At 4 layers it's 100gb and at 8 layers it's 200gb. Blu-Ray has a constant read speed, so it won't slow down between layers. ;)