Forza Motorsport 4: Week in Review 8/12

We are getting close, yes we are. With each passing day Turn 10 gets a bit closer to putting the finishing touches on Forza Motorsport 4. The game will soon be in the hands of the mysterious folks at Microsoft who take our automotive bits and translate them into something that you’ll be able to pop into your Xbox 360 starting October 11 and play until you’ve got blisters. While we’d love to have you playing Forza 4 the second we sign off on it, unfortunately all that magic takes time.

[kingdoms]

This game is crazy looking.

[Majors]

This game is now a yearly cash cow.

[qwertyz]

forza 3 came out in 2009 so what are you talking about ? that was 2 years ago

[newleaf]

Maybe you should learn some maths or get the proper definition of yearly.

[FordGTGuy]

Forza 3 launched October 22, 2009
Forza 4 will launch October 11, 2011

[iamgoatman]

Got to laugh at his agrees and your disagrees, I knew the members of N4G where dumb, but DAMN!

[MintBerryCrunch]

DAMN those are some sexy M3's

[DigitalAnalog]

Why Forza 3 didn't look this good is beyond me.

-End statement

[kaveti6616]

Why Uncharted 1 didn't look as good as Uncharted 2 is beyond me.

-End mockery

[DigitalAnalog]

By this argument, we can say it took Forza this long to achieve at this point.

-End statement

[kaveti6616]

You are incoherent.

[units]

Bob Bondurant?

[ironwolf]

What? You don't know who he is?

[KingPin]

not to put forza down or anything. the game is good. no doubt about it <only fanboys think otherwise, to each his own> but can someone tell me what differs between this and forza 3 besides graphics. see, new car models only come out every 4-5 years. so what new car models are in this game that are not in forza3?

like i said, not putting the game down, i just dont think its necessary to make a game like this every 2-3 years. id rather they take 5-6 years to make it. not only will they have newer improved graphics and technologies in the game, they will also have new car models. lets face it, forza is filled with features that i think will keep people busy playing it for that amount of time anyways before moving onto the next one.

come to think of it, microsofts console life span isn't longer than 7 years. <give or take> making a forza every 5-6 years would mean 1 game per console gen. which wouldn't be very good business wise. guess now it all makes sense.

[FordGTGuy]

What Forza 4 has that Forza 3 doesn't...

*Takes a huge breathe*

16 cars on track

500+ cars at launch

80+ Manufacturers at launch

Multiple choice car rewards

Autovista mode including 10 hours of it's own content

Kinect support including head tracking

World Tour Mode

Brand new audio recording methods for every car

Top Gear Content

Jeremy Clarkson witty outbursts

over 1 million polygons per car

Completely new from scratch tire model(Pirelli)

Different time of day racing

Rivals Mode

Car Clubs

Real hosted lobbies

ability to important liveries from previous version

Kinect navigated menus with voice or gesture

two choices of wheels from Fanatec including one in the $700 range

Custom wireless tilt racing wheel

*face starts turning blue*

Bernese Alps race track

Indianapolis Motor Speedway

and a crap load of new cars!

Including the 1969 Oldsmobile 4-4-2

http://forums.n4g.com/The-F...

This is what we know so far and I believe I even left some things out that we already know.

[FordGTGuy]

nice I got two disagrees within a couple minutes for stating facts..........

[KingPin]

BREATHE BRO BREATHE :D

thanks for the reply man. but if you think about it, a lot of what you mentioned could be given as dlc for forza 3. the whole top gear/clarkson thing. the race tracks.the rewards and car clubs too. there really isnt a need to make another one. besides, how many people actually finished forza 3 100%. im sitting with forza 1 and im only 93% complete. maybe im slow, who knows. lol

EDIT: this is N4G.com. State facts with proof supporting that fact and you will lose bubbles and get disagrees. to survive on N4G, you pick a side <sony or microsoft> n defend a console at all costs now matter how much bullshit you have to make up.

[newleaf]

That my dear friend ought to shut up the haters. Very well said. Bubbles for being helpful.
Also it is ridiculous to claim that car models release every 4-5 years as if all the cars in Forza 3 were all in their first year when it released. There have been so so so many new models of so many different cars since 2009, like that matte finish Lambo or the new BMW M5 which isn't even out yet but is featured in the game. Lets not forget the new M1 or the Italia, so many cars. Not a valid question

[FordGTGuy]

That maybe so but you can't completely upgrade a graphics engine, physics engine and audio engine with DLC. Forza 4 is a completely different game then Forza 3 they share a common goal but there was a lot of effort put into Forza 4.

It's like comparing Vista and Windows 7.

[Boody-Bandit]

The only problem with that list for hardcore sim fans is "no mention of wheel support". In other words Turn 10 is not putting any efforts into making this game work as good on a 900 degree wheel as they are a standard gaming pad and now Kinect.

When I would say I was disappointed that Turn 10 was supporting Kinect people would cry fanboy or troll at me. Why does it matter as long as it's not a requirement and they are just adding more to an already great game? Because Forza, although it works solid with a wheel, SCREAMS true wheel dedication. Any hardcore sim and wheel fan knows this. The time wasted implementing Kinect would have been better served dedicated to making refinements to wheel users.

Although because of Kinect support, that is how Turn 10 took the graphics to another level. Anyone that has followed Forza 4's development knows that the view a car mode render and lighting engine is completely different then the in game engine. Or so it was until Turn 10 decided to take the view a car mode graphics engine into the actual gameplay engine.

So for graphics whores this game is going to be a thing of beauty but I would've prefer top notch wheel support instead.

I know you're a hardcore Forza fan. I have seen you in hundreds of Forza thread the past few years. I want true dedicated 900 degrees rotation wheel support. So good that it puts wheel and pad racers on an equal playing field. The pad rules the roost in Forza, and from the looks of things, it always will.

But it's an absolute 1st day must have purchase for me and I will probably play it more than any other title being released over the next several months. I will also own a Fanatec CSR Elite from the first batch released. If Thomas would only start accept preorders already! DAMN. I check his blog and site every day and still nothing. One thing is for sure. It wont be out in time for Forza 4. Guess I will have to tough it out with my GT2 wheel for now.

[ironwolf]

Wheel support by Turn 10 is very good; for those manufacturers who have purchased licensing rights to make products for the 360. If a company (hear me, LogiTech?) is so stupid as to ignore fully half a potential market (high end consoles) by not purchasing licensing rights, I have to wonder just how dedicated they are to producing quality equipment in the first place. Fanatec can't keep their products in stock, Mad Catz did very well with a low end non-force feedback rig, and appears poised to take the market in the mid-range (under $300) force feedback market. Others could do it as well; with a willingness to invest.

[Boody-Bandit]

Ironwolf
Working with a wheel and true wheel support are entirely two different things.

You're going to sit and blame Logitech because they don't way too pay over priced license fees? They don't pay Sony, why should they MS? MS could care less who does and does not support their console with peripherals. The only thing they care about is making money off of every single thing that has to do with their hardware.

MS themselves stop building wheels.

Look at the difference in price between the Fanatec GT2 and GT3 RS V2. That's because of that MS fee. And Fanatec doesn't have a hard time keeping wheels in stock, they have a hard time producing them because they are such a small company. Fanatec wheels make up the single digit percentage of Forza consumers. <- That is why Turn 10 does not go out of their way to tweak and add additional refinements to wheel users.

Know of which you speak before you speak it. Sorry but nobody on this site is a bigger fan of Forza than me. Equal too maybe but not bigger. You need to do some research and then come back.

BTW, Logitech isn't missing half of anything. Logitech wheels are FAR AND AWAY the most sold wheel on the market. All the other manufacturers combined dont come close to equaling how many wheels Logitech has sold over the years.

[Boody-Bandit]

Watch interviews with Turn 10 on Forza 4 and they specifically say they main focus is pad and Kinect users, not wheel players, since the majority or Foza fans use a standard controller. They put next to no efforts into wheel support and did not focus on wheels with Forza 4. Their main focus was Kinect and new tire physics.

Working on a wheel and a developer putting effort into that device are two entirely different things.

@Ironwolf below
No you don't know. I'm not talking about Logitech and it's relationship with PS consumers, I am talking about as a whole. More PC gamers own wheels than do console gamers. Logitech makes just as much, if not more, from the PC gaming market as they do console gamers.

It's not like Logitech is the only name in the game either. Why doesn't any other top tier wheel manufacturer like Thrustmaster support the 360 or Original XBox? License fees.

All companies don't do it (charge for license or certification on everything the way MS does).
Nearly any bluetooth or usb device works on the PS3. Sony isn't charging for fees for everything or making money on everything that can be used on their console. Logitech, Thrustmaster, or no other company wants to pay those fees or go through MS's pain staking process of certification.

As far as Fanatec.
They are an extremely small company with horrendous CS and serious issues with their first 360 compatible wheel. Now that Darrin from ISR took over their PR/CS department maybe things will turn around but I'm not holding my breath.

They will never be a mainstream perp company unless they find investors and expand in a big way. I don't see that happening any time soon.

Between the 911 S and GT2 I highly doubt Fanatec cracked the 100k built. Single digit percent Forza fans use a wheel.

As far as Turn 10 supporting a wheel or designing Forza 4 for specific focus on wheels? It isn't going to happen. They have already gone on record stating that. Look at the developer interviews yourself. Watch the one with ISR when Darrin specifically ask them about wheel support and implementation.

His answer, Forza 4 has wheel support but are primary focus is on pad players and the implementation of Kinect because the MAJORITY of Forza fans use a standard controller. I don't know how other it need be said before it registers. That isn't some made up bullshit but what they themselves said about wheel implementation and support for Forza 4.

[ironwolf]

Actually I do know quite a bit about it. I work for HP, which partners with Microsoft. I deal with MS engineers directly on a daily basis. In addition, my brother-in-law works for Microsoft, for a time, in the Entertainment division; he was on the development team for the 360 for a couple of years.

Microsoft licenses the development code for peripherals. This is something that is a common business practice for companies manufacturing items that can have after market additions. All the code that's needed to make a given type of controller is included with the license. Logitech may have made and sold a huge number of wheels for the PS3 but they would instantly double their market by licensing from MS. You don't think the sales increase would cover the fees? What about the multiplicity of companies that manufacture peripherals now, usually at a lower price point than those made by MS.

As to Fanatec not being able to maintain stock. Yes they are a small company, and as a result the demand outstrips the supply. That is not a hit against Fanatec, that just shows that the demand for a well built top of the line wheel is there (and oddly enough their wheels are fully supported in the game). The small numbers they produce also makes the licensing fee a larger percentage of the price, but it certainly doesn’t seem to have adversely affected demand.

Mad Catz appears ready to take the market segment that could have belonged to Logitech with a well built wheel in the $250 dollar range. Sadly, it lacks a clutch pedal, and whether or not it has 900° of travel has (so far as I am aware) not yet been announced.

MS’s dropping of their own wheel is sad, but every company tends to have some short sightedness in its marketing department. They seem to be concentrating a bit too much on Kinect at the expense of other products, and that will probably bite them, in the short run at least. On the other hand, Sony has left itself out of potential profits in the peripheral market twice, first by not charging a licensing fee and secondly by not manufacturing specialized peripherals themselves. So, no matter where you stand you have to realize that the people making corporate decisions are human and thus fallible.

Perhaps Turn 10's first focus is not on wheel support, (I doubt the makers of GT5 place wheel support first either; you play to the market) but I do not for a minute believe that Turn 10’s support for both the Fanatec and the Mad Catz wheels will be anything less than stellar. And I’m sure the same will be the case for any other manufacturer that sees fit to take up the gauntlet.

[FlyShootRaceSims]

Based on what I've read so far, the polygons on each car has grown threefold compared to Forza 3, more wheel aftermarket support, improved tire physics (Forza has one if not the best tire physics to begin with), etc.

5 to 6 yrs in-between iterations is kinda too long IMHO. Every two yrs is just right. Besides there's always the option to download later model cars that didn't make it at release anyways. That is if you are willing to part with your ms points, you're choice really.

All I wish for is more real world tracks. I want those Australian V8 tracks. Bathurst for instance. Or the other Euro tracks like Zaandvort, etc.

[FordGTGuy]

So far they are being very hush hush about tracks.

EDIT - I'm with you on both complaints, I hope we see the return of some of the tracks from the first game.

[FlyShootRaceSims]

@ FordGTGuy, tell me about it, lol. It's killing me with anticipation though. If I have one or two small complaints with the Forza series, it's the tracks and the lack of open-wheelers.

[MOTY]

Well there you have it. Forza 4 is a masterpiece and is continuing the trend with being the best racing sim/driving sim on the market this gen on consoles. Now we even see individuals in the real racing world coming to test drive Forza. Forza is becoming the name racers are starting to acknowledge. Forza is converting the once dominating GT consumer base from console drivers to real life drivers....AND TRAINERS.

Thank you Turn 10 for this Awesome Franchise where you continue to raise the bar in what is to be expected in an actual sim....and a shout out to FordGTGuy for that excellent list of new Features that are in Forza 4. You saved me the time to have to list them all.

[ironwolf]

The Dacia Sandero. Hoo-Ahhh! Arf! Good news!

[ironwolf]

Take care, there may be honey badgers on the track.