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Is Microsoft too Focused on Kinect?

Will the company's drive to create 'the future of entertainment' leave its existing audience out in the cold?

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LOGICWINS3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

IMO, they're doing exactly what they need to do.

They realize that the majority of their hardcore audience are okay with the 360 being supported with two three major exclusive franchises(Gears, Forza, Halo) and COD.

^^THIS is the reality of things(even though the Internet disagrees). Gears 3 is the most pre-ordered game in the world at the moment and MW3(360 version) is outpacing Black Ops in pre-orders. Numbers don't lie.

Because they know they have the hardcore crowd covered..they can focus on the casual crowd. After investing $500 million in Kinect advertising ANY prudent, logical business person would focus on Kinect as much as possible.

Bumpmapping3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

Thanks for the laugh seriously I needed it.WTF does sales have to do with hardcore?! COD is not hardcore btw.Maybe you stop and think hmmm maybe GEOW3 sales are huge because you guys have not had any hardcore games to play.

LOGICWINS/Majority of COD sale are from casual gamers that's all they play is COD.Keep on that whole sales argument I find it hillarious.

LOGICWINS3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

"HAHA
Thanks for the laugh seriously I needed it.WTF does sales have to do with hardcore?! COD is not hardcore btw.Maybe you stop and think hmmm maybe GEOW3 sales are huge because you guys have not had any hardcore games to play."

1. You guys? Who said I had a 360?

2. So YOU determine what a hardcore game is? LOL, now YOUR the one whose making me laugh. Over 50 million COD players across the globe disagree with you.

3. Hardcore gamers buy hardcore games..which is why sales is a factor. People buy things they like. Hence, sales express what people want. The more sales a game gets, the more desired it is by the public.

MAJ0R3089d ago

what you said was true but that doesn't mean people aren't pissed off because of their casual focus, their not creating new IP's or anything beatifically to it's hardcore audience

my prediction is that MS will be the Nintendo of next gen and focus mainly on hardcore while still throwing the long time franchises at the people who play them

LOGICWINS3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

@Major- I agree. There ARE people out there who want more out of the 360s hardcore exclusive lineup. Heres the problem:

The majority of the 360s user base has shown that they don't care about more exclusives with their buying habits. I personally do see anything wrong with this.

People who aren't satisfied with the 360's library have MANY options out there for them.

1. Buy a PS3(doubles as a Blu-Ray player, large library of exclusive titles across most major genres)

2. Game on the PC which has 90+ exclusive games coming out this year.

And the people who ARE happy with the 360s hardcore exclusive library can play Gears 3, Forza 4, Halo Anniversary, Supremacy MMA, MW3, Saints Row 3, AC: Revelations, BF3, Fear 3 etc.

XRider3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

Kinect helps sell more 360's and 360 fans still have the core games coming out. MS isn't here to give you a rub in the tub. They sell products and they do it well. Which is probably why they are one of the riches corporations in the world. MS is outselling everyone by targeting two groups of gamers. How is that a bad thing? Please enlighten me.

Nicaragua3089d ago

50 million sales for the COD franchise does not equal 50 million players globally unless you are assuming that each new iteration of the game brings on 10 million brand new players - which would be nonsense.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 3089d ago
thugbob3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

I see your reasoning, but it could also be the fact that Microsoft aren't giving the games that suit THEIR hardcore crowd. Mircosoft tried with games like Alan Wake and JAP RPGs, but it's obvious that their audience don't like those type of games. Microsoft needs to find the type of games they like(which looks like shooters). I do agree that Mircosoft needs to focus on Kinect though. They can't just leave it alone. They need to show that they have faith in their product.

Edit: I'm not saying that they are not satisfied. I'm saying that Microsoft is not giving them more exclusive that they will like. Instead they just make sequels to the ones they know they do like.

LOGICWINS3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

"I see your reasoning, but it could also be the fact that Microsoft aren't giving the games that suit THEIR hardcore crowd."

How do you know that? How do you know that the 360's hardcore crowd isn't being satisfied? Serious question btw. Give me numbers, give me statistics, give me evidence.

And no..seeing a couple of people complaining about the 360's lack of exclusives on N4G isn't sufficient.

SilentNegotiator3088d ago (Edited 3088d ago )

"They realize that the majority of their hardcore audience are okay with the 360 being supported with two three major exclusive franchises(Gears, Forza, Halo) and COD"

How do you know that? How do you know that the 360's hardcore crowd is being satisfied? Serious question btw. Give me numbers, give me statistics, give me evidence.

It's a two way street, sir.

Go ahead; PROVE that hardcore 360 gamers don't want 'hardcore' games in between Gears, Halo, and COD.

NewZealander3089d ago

people say MS focus too much on kinect, and people would also complain if MS didn't support kinect enough, i think the problem is they marketed kinect, showing all these cool gimmicks like scanning in objects etc, and it hasn't lived up to that hype, hell we in New Zealand STILL dont have voice command!

kinect has turned from cool idea, to just another motion controller for the kids, hell if i was a kid i would probably still prefer a decent platform game over the bollix they pump out for kinect.

3089d ago Replies(2)
Hicken3089d ago

Wrong, wrong, and wrong.

Addressing every issue I have with what you've said, in no particular order.

Sales don't mean a thing. For one, there are more casual gamers than hardcore gamers; any "hardcore" game that casuals play in droves(such as CoD, though I don't even consider it hardcore anymore) will have skewed sales numbers because of that. Likewise, there are just a handful of exclusives a hardcore gamer will play on the 360. The same can be said for casual gamers who branch out beyond their "gateway drug," CoD. So once you're done with Activision's entry, you then try Gears and Halo; thus the sales numbers for these titles are skewed as well.

The majority of ANYONE'S hardcore audience is NOT satisfied with a handful of exclusives. They want new, quality IPs on a regular basis. They want innovative, groundbreaking games that push the limits of their system's capabilities.

You keep quoting "numbers don't lie," and you're right. But there's something you're neglecting to mention: numbers can mean what you want them to. And so far, as you've done is say "the numbers say" MS is doing what they need to be doing. By your definition, that's abandoning the core audience that brought them their success (and stuck with them through a dismal system launch that would have been a deal-breaker for any other company) and sucking in more casuals.

The proof you keep asking for is readily evident if you pull your head out of your own ass and look around: PEOPLE ARE NOT HAPPY. Hell, you could say I'm a PS3 fanboy, and I STILL don't like the direction MS is taking with Kinect. When I go to work and people I've known for years ask me, "So what's good on the 360 these days?" I have nothing to point them to, because these people are not interested in Kinect. "Wait until September," is all I can tell them, or, "About time to get you a PS3."

I'll claim all day every day that the PS3 is a better system, and I can do more than use my opinion to say so. The "numbers don't lie" when I say the PS3 has outsold the 360. They don't lie when I start naming off exclusives. But, at the end of the day, a successful Microsoft means a more dedicated Sony.

What Microsoft is doing right now is not a long-term, successful business plan. It was folly for them to pour so much money into the casual market. After all, a casual gamer is someone who doesn't play a lot of games, or doesn't play often, or both; such an individual is NOT going to further the growth of your system, and when you pour money into a new IP or one of your exclusives, they're not as likely to buy it as hardcore gamers. If, by some chance, these casuals become hardcore, they'll want games that aren't casual; games that have been ignored in favor of kids games and exercise games.

Your argument from the start= FAIL. Why? Because you don't know what a hardcore gamer is, and you don't understand the relationship that any gaming company has with that audience. That is the one group you DON'T alienate, because that group will stay beside you, no matter what else happens.

3089d ago
Bigpappy3089d ago

Logicwins: Great name and good try. You try to use logic with this group, and you will loose every time.

Here is the deal. PS3 fanboys are happy with PS3 because it has more exclusives that 360. They think all 360 owners should get rid of their 360's and join them in owning a PS3 and join them in not buying said exclusives. But the fact that Sony is making them makes them happy that they have a PS3 and can use that on all websites to fight with the 360 "rivals". That is all this 'Exclusive' hoopla is all about.

Now the question is: "Is Microsoft too Focused on Kinect?". I say no, and here is why. M$ is 6yrs into this gen and has very strong 3rd party support. Most 3rd party games sell better and perform better on the 360. Keep in mine that the PS2 did great because it had very strong 3rd party supported (Take2, Square, Kanami, ...). They have chosen not to rush to get a new console out there, but instead try and expand their base with an expensive add-on (Kinect). I has been on the market now for close to a year and has performed much better than anyone could have predicted (sold over 10mil is 6 months). At E3 they showned multiple ways it will be useful, this year and beyone. For casuals and core alike. If M$ had not done this, they would have said that M$ made a quick cash in and bailed on the add-on. But to the delight on millions, that is not the case. M$ has shown a commitment to the device, and has been able to get 3rd party to also invest their efforts in the device. Sony could only wish they had that type of support right now for the Move. This is not to say Kinect is better than Move or vice versa, but that M$ is getting better support for thier device, which will insure that it stays around and continue to grow a fanbase.

Any 360 only owner who say they have nothing to play on 360 because they do not have enough exclusives, need to explain whick exclusives M$ lossed that they can no longer play? With the great supply of great 3rd party games, why exactly do you need more exclusives? But if you do need the system with the most exclusives, there is the PS3 or the wii. There is nothing wrong with switching consoles if that is what you really want from a console. I personally did not buy many of the exclusives on the 360. But the ones I did buy were great and sold really well.

By the way COD is not as casual as God of war (hack and slash that promps you which button to press). COD is as "Hard Core" as they come.

Hicken3089d ago

Exclusives move systems. Exclusives SELL systems. Why buy a PS3? Cuz it has Uncharted. Why buy a 360? Cuz it's got Halo. Multiplatform games don't do that. Exclusives do.

Most multiplats DO play better on 360. Why? Because those are developed FIRST for 360, then for PS3; the former is easier to design for 9and Microsoft has deep pockets they're not afraid of reaching into).

The sales numbers for the Kinect are as skewed as the sales numbers for the 360 itself; whereas, for the latter, systems replaced during the RROD fiasco were included in their numbers, the former was bundled with the new 360s and the system itself was available ONLY as that bundle for months. If you wanted a 360, guess what? You'd have to shell out an extra hundred for one with Kinect, because that's all retailers had.

At E3, they showed sparse integration with a handful of games, and a bunch of stuff that's little better than the shovelware that makes up the majority of the Wii's library. Kinect inclusion for ME3, Forza, and Halo. Then there's a bunch of stuff hardcore gamers won't be bothered to even look at, all of which casual gamers will buy because the actual quality won't really matter. (Not turning this into a fanboy debate as you'd like, but look up the number of MOVE-optional games and MOVE games, total. There are about as many MOVE-optional games as Kinect only games, period.)

3rd party support is great. But 3rd party support isn't why you choose one system over another. It's great to have Sega or Square on board for games, but it's even more important that Sony is putting out games for the PS3, and that Microsoft is putting out titles for the 360. It shows loyalty to the customer: you bought our product, so here's a game only you can play.

A casual game can most easily be denoted by its demographic. Do lots of young kids play the game? Do lots of women(no offense) play this game? Is this game and/or one or two others like it all that a person owns? Chances are: its a casual.

The GoW demographic spans from teens to middle-age, mostly male. The majority of owners of a GoW game are likely to be into sports games, particularly football. They also tend to play Grand Theft and other 3rd person titles. (This is based on my experience as a seller of games and systems.)

CoD players tend to play MW2 and Black Ops. And Crysis. And are unsatisfied with anything else, as it's not fun (read:easy) enough.

Gimme your logic.

Nicaragua3089d ago

So your criteria for a game being casual or hardcore is whether or not it has QTE or on screen button prompts? - utter bollocks.

Vanquish, Ninja Gaiden, and Bayonetta all have these kind of button prompts and i would hardly refer to them as casual.

Even Black Ops (from the series you claim dosnt have button prompts) has button prompts so that pretty much pisses on your theory.

gamingdroid3089d ago

"Exclusives move systems. Exclusives SELL systems."

You are partially wrong there. Exclusives do help systems move initially, but after that it's contribution is negligent. Why do you think Xbox 360 still sells after all these years considering RROD and lack of exclusives?

People buy consoles, because they want to play games period and not just exclusive games!

"Most multiplats DO play better on 360. Why? Because those are developed FIRST for 360, then for PS3; the former is easier to design for 9and Microsoft has deep pockets they're not afraid of reaching into)."

What about the fact that PS3 uses an obscure architecture? Nobody really uses multiple mini-cores (if you can even call it that) with severely restricted memory access?

Development tools do matter and one quick look at XNA and you know the tools are good, very good.

"3rd party support is great. But 3rd party support isn't why you choose one system over another. It's great to have Sega or Square on board for games, but it's even more important that Sony is putting out games for the PS3, and that Microsoft is putting out titles for the 360. It shows loyalty to the customer: you bought our product, so here's a game only you can play."

What about Gears of War? How about Call of Duty? GTA? All third party games and all sell very well!

"At E3, they showed sparse integration with a handful of games, and a bunch of stuff that's little better than the shovelware that makes up the majority of the Wii's library."

It's shovelware for you, but for the casual crowd they would buy that up like Big Macs. Dance Central and Kinect Sports sells almost as well as PS3 exclusives!

"Kinect inclusion for ME3, Forza, and Halo. Then there's a bunch of stuff hardcore gamers won't be bothered to even look at, all of which casual gamers will buy because the actual quality won't really matter."

That really remains to be seen as I don't think hardcore games on Kinect have even had a chance yet.

"(Not turning this into a fanboy debate as you'd like, but look up the number of MOVE-optional games and MOVE games, total. There are about as many MOVE-optional games as Kinect only games, period.)"

Yes, and why does that even matter? With as many games, does it sell? Do people care? As far as I can tell, the PS Move integration is nothing more than what Wii has already done for ages and nobody cared then either.

If anything, Kinect is actually less intrusive when it comes to motion control, because the PS Move wand actually replaces the controller, but Kinect can be used in addition to the controller.

"It shows loyalty to the customer: you bought our product, so here's a game only you can play."

No, it shows the seller is making money. It is naive to believe that a company is some kind of charity for their fans. Never has been and never will be.

After reading your analsysis, I'm sorry to say, but it seems clouded by PS bias. Why is PS Move games fine, but Kinect not? You are explaining away Xbox 360 sales when convenient, but ignores other platforms do the same thing.

2v13089d ago

how would you know any of this if you dont have a 360!

gamingdroid3089d ago

Historically hardcore meant the people that play a lot, not fanatics. By that measure, CoD, Halo and potentially Gears is in that crowd as the most bought and most games played (as seen via monthly Xbox Live statistics).

To claim CoD isn't hardcore is just plain ridiculous.

Now if you defined hardcore as niche games that require patience, then yeah, I can see CoD being non-hardcore, but for all intensive purposes CoD gets played by a lot of people, doesn't appeal to your mom, get's played a lot and do require skill! That fits almost all definitions of a hardcore game.

jdfoster003088d ago

COD isn't a fucking exclusive! And doesn't have a lead platform!!! Only thing 360 has is TIMED exclusive. (actually mw2 was running in higher res on ps3- r bowling comment from twitter)

3088d ago
jdfoster003088d ago

How can you include COD in their? Cod is multiplatform... And is the same on ps3 and pc as on 360 only thing 360 has is TIMED DLC ... Rem

Anon19743088d ago

I don't think Microsoft is too focused on Kinect. While I don't play Kinect (tried it, didn't do anything for me) Microsoft has hit a home run with Kinect. From a business standpoint, I see no reason why Microsoft wouldn't push Kinect. Personally, I just wish there could be more of a balance for the company between focusing on Kinect and their core gamers who made the system what it is today.

ABizzel13088d ago

@ Logicwins

You pretty much said everything I was going to say. MS knows they already have as much of the hardcore audience that really need, and so now their focusing on scooping up some of the Wii audience with Kinect since many of them are probably ready for the next thing. The thing is the Xbox 360 has been out for a while now, so will Wii owners look at it as something new, or skim past it and wait for the Wii U (I saw a perfect example in Gamestop yesterday where they had the E3 conferences up and the Wii U came up, and the family seemed excited to get it when it came out since it worked with everything the Wii already has).

Moving back to MS, I think it sucks for the hardcore. It shows MS focus on them is second now that they're pushing Kinect as much as possible. This year is an amazing year for 3rd parties with tons of the best franchises receiving new releases and MS has a few exclusives. And that's all you can hope for next year. Get a PS3 or Wii if you're looking for new experiences, because MS's focused on Kinect, recycling current franchises, and 3rd party so they can get ready to launch the Xbox 720 soon.

Jinxstar3088d ago

I don't doubt your numbers are off at all Logic but if your going to make "factual" statements like "Gears 3 is the most pre ordered game in the world" provide a link from some kind of credible source. Not just "gamestop says on twitter" or something like that because... I have never seen that kind of information divulged to the opublic. Worldwide preorder numbers from every retailer?...

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firemassacre3089d ago

Because they know they have the hardcore crowd covered

that part made me laugh

LOGICWINS3089d ago

As I said, numbers don't lie.

lashes2ashes3089d ago

numbers have nothing to do with it. gears and modern warfare 3 will come and go shortly and outside of halo4 the core line up on 360 is crap. i own both systems and dont really feel like there is much for me on 360 anymore. i used to play most games on 360 and now i very really use it. im looking forward for some hardcore kinect games but Microsoft showed they hardcore kinect games are like the star wars kinect game. i think i will pass on that crap.

LOGICWINS3089d ago (Edited 3089d ago )

"i own both systems and dont really feel like there is much for me on 360 anymore. i used to play most games on 360 and now i very really use it."

And I know half a dozen people who think the opposite. Most of my friends, except me(I only own a PS3) have both consoles and they prefer their 360 over their PS3 hands down.

Everyone has opinions.

"gears and modern warfare 3 will come and go shortly"

What exactly do you mean by that? Don't ALL games come and go?

firemassacre3089d ago

NUMBERS DONT LIE.

then farmville is the greatest game of all time.

(. ) ( . )

Rainstorm813089d ago

fire massacre dont forget Wii sports and Wii Fit some of gamings greats cause numbers dont lie....O_o

Aarix3088d ago

Hate to say logic, but logic doesn't count when dealing with ps3 fanboys

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death2smoochie3089d ago

I just want to see how MS is going to implement Kinect in the Next Xbox.
Well it be built in?

aviator1893089d ago

I'm wondering the same thing. That'd actually be pretty great if ms does indeed go down that route. Well, great for me and my kids at least.

BrianG3089d ago

I'm half tempted to say hopefully not.

Do you want to put your Nextbox on top of your TV? Or dead center in front of your TV for optimal performance of the embedded camera?

They could always ship a smaller, slimmed downed, possible upgraded version with each console though. Sort of like a second "controller", with controller in " " for obvious reasons haha.

Solid_Dave3089d ago

All I want to say is, Gears Of War is better than COD. Oh, and I think that Kinect is pretty cool.

Gen0ne3089d ago

Yeah, I kinda agree with both those things. I like Gears better than COD and Child of Eden is proof that the Kinect ( can ) be cool.

Der_Kommandant3089d ago

Focused in miking the shit out of kinect

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