Bungie Responds to 640p Claims

Bungie confirms that Halo 3 does indeed run natively at 640p and explains why this is so - simply, for their lighting engine:

"One item making the interwebs rounds this week was the scandalous revelation that Halo 3 runs at "640p" which isn't even technically a resolution. However, the interweb detectives did notice that Halo 3's vertical resolution, when captured from a frame buffer, is indeed 640 pixels. So what gives? Did we short change you 80 pixels?

Naturally it's more complicated than that. In fact, you could argue we gave you 1280 pixels of vertical resolution, since Halo 3 uses not one, but two frame buffers – both of which render at 1152x640 pixels. The reason we chose this slightly unorthodox resolution and this very complex use of two buffers is simple enough to see – lighting. We wanted to preserve as much dynamic range as possible – so we use one for the high dynamic range and one for the low dynamic range values. Both are combined to create the finished on screen image.

This ability to display a full range of HDR, combined with our advanced lighting, material and postprocessing engine, gives our scenes, large and small, a compelling, convincing and ultimately "real" feeling, and at a steady and smooth frame rate, which in the end was far more important to us than the ability to display a few extra pixels. Making this decision simpler still is the fact that the 360 scales the
"almost-720p" image effortlessly all the way up to 1080p if you so desire.

In fact, if you do a comparison shot between the native 1152x640 image and the scaled 1280x720, it's practically impossible to discern the difference. We would ignore it entirely were it not for the internet's propensity for drama where none exists. In fact the reason we haven't mentioned this before in weekly updates, is the simple fact that it would have distracted conversation away from more important aspects of the game, and given tinfoil hats some new gristle to chew on as they catalogued their toenail clippings."

[ShiftyLookingCow]

this whole quote is contained in Bungie's recent update http://www.n4g.com/xbox360/...

[TriggerHappy]

Yes...of course, but people won't know that unless this story is approved. If this fails...then instead another news site is going to pick up on it and publish it as it's own - and we'll see it in a couple of days.

N4g should be there first just like every other social site.

[stunt213]

lolololololololololol that is a low ass resolution and somehow ps3 always get bash for having 30FPS

[Lacarious]

You rock!

what's next... black bars on the side of the screen in co-op?

[SonySoldiers]

As easy as ABC:

A. Please hurt/attack the xbots psychologically the best you can till they get mad.

B. Do not talk about any xbot games, PS3 games are most important.

C. Praise Sony's ultimate console above anything else.

We'd like to thank y'all for your cooperation to fail the xbots and XCOW 360.
LETS PLAY B3YOND!

[C_SoL]

this game still looks like sh*t. and ive played it. but dont get me wrong it looks better than HALO 2. still the graphics are sh*tty.

[C_SoL]

this game still looks like sh*t. and ive played it. but dont get me wrong it looks better than HALO 2. still the graphics are sh*tty. by the way this reply has nothing to do with ur comment.

[ReBurn]

Does it affect your gaming experience? Or would you never had known if someone didn't let the drama llama loose on it?

[ShiftyLookingCow]

because of about 20% percent less quality my life wasn't changed like it was promised and I didn't get laid. I am going to sue Bungie

[jackdoe]

I agree, I personally am not quite techie enough to notice it.

[i Shank u]

i could careless bout the resolution; but is this the reason why there are jaggies all over the place? i love halo 3, play it as much as any halo-fiend should, but i dont think ive ever seen this many jaggies in a 360 game. anyone got an opinion on that? i play 37 in LCD 720p, anyone else see what im seeing?

[Azurite]

More like 184320 pixels short.

[WafflesID]

Drama llama....*spit* HAHAHa
oh cripes...now how am I going to clean this pop out of my keyboard...

[BulletToothtony]

because the 30fps on madden the ps3 was lacking was made one of the biggest news for a good couple of weeks..

ooooh it feels different when it's on your end doesn't it.

halo should've been better not because it's halo but because the fans deserved it and they knew they were gonna make 200 million dollar profit.. that's why

[wasted]

good comment wafflesid, a lazy job bugie have done in development just to bring in the money, they have lost my respect.

[ReBurn]

I never complained about Madden running in 30 FPS. I don't think that it detracted from the mediocrity of Madden 2008 in any way.

[power of Green]

Motive is importand I don't think this is post to help this wonderful site, this site is used as a platform for haters using this news as some sort of anti MSFT tool when infact NO ONE GIVES A SH*T. If it looks better it is better(HD rezs)...

Rather have the lighting it helps people miss and is more realistic...

[jcgamer]

but anything with something negative to say, or perceived negative, about Sony is instant spam...if it wasn't for Halo 3, there would hardly be any stories on N4G this week...and I OWN Halo 3, love the graphics, love the gameplay, and millions of others are playing a game already that isn't even a week old...wow...isn't Lair 1080p?...I wouldn't know...maybe they would like to play that...

[jaaz]

but this is clearly damage control on Bungie's part (if the post is true).

What I don't understand is why even respond to the 640p claim to do damage control? Do they really need to after selling a gazillion copies?

[ShiftyLookingCow]

its everywhere, from here to joystiq and some other places, probably even in their forums.

[BADBOYEK4]

It Realy Doesnt Matter weather Bungie Responded Or not,Halo 3 is a beautiful Game on my Samsung Running 1080P.

[bym051d]

Perhaps you can't tell the difference in 640p and 540p. Then, you can't tell the difference in 540p and 480p. Where does it end?

[WafflesID]

@4.3

Are you for real? Seriously, thats just the weakest argument I've ever heard.

[tonsoffun]

But to be honest, who cares?

It still is a great game, regardless of the 'native resolution'

For all the naysayers, stop b!tching and enjoy the game....

[bym051d]

Agreed. Quality of game > resoulution of game. At least the 360 owners can scale to 1080i whereas the PS3 owners can only downscale to 480p if their owners' tv doesn't support 720p.

[Armyless]

-

[m9105826]

Yeah... the 1080i issue got fixed... like a long while ago... when they enabled scaling.

[Marriot VP]

As soon as I found out that the game was 640p I stopped playing and threw the game into a fire so I'll never have to see it again.

Please, give me a break. You can't see the difference, so it doesn't matter. It's the same thing with 1080p vs. 720p. If people say the difference is barely noticable on HDTV's over 42 inches. Than why would you think 720p vs 640p matter at all.

[d3l33t]

i understand where you are coming from, but the 1080p vs. 720p vs 640p arugment isn't very valid. 1080p vs 640p, that's almost TWICE as many pixels on the screen, resulting in crystal clear, high resolution image. An image with 640 pixels, can even be considered standard by many means
http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

we are talking vertical and not horizontal, but I'm sure you understand what i mean.

[Marriot VP]

d3l33t,

If the difference between...720p and 1080p is minimal, than how much different will 640p vs. 1080p be? And considering only 1-3% of households have 1080p HDTVs, IT'S INSIGNIFICANT. It always will be.

[Adamalicious]

If you have a good 1080p television and decent eyesight the difference between 720p and 1080p is strikingly obvious. If you think that it isn't then you must be failing one of the aforementioned criteria.

Additionally, you got this backwards:

"If people say the difference is barely noticable on HDTV's over 42 inches. Than why would you think 720p vs 640p matter at all."

The general rule of thumb is that you can't see a difference between 1080p and 720p in HDTVS UNDER 40"s - but this is just silly anyway, because there just aren't any HDTVs under 40"s with native 1080 vertical lines of resolution. So of course you can't see the difference!

Anyway, you should go to a HiFi store or something and see what you're missing. Real 1080p is amazing.

[HateBoy]

What are you talking about adamlicious? I have a 37 samsung fullhd (1920x1080?)...
Anyways I could just not be getting the point cus I know zeeeero about tech stuff.

[TheExecutive]

I have a 61" 1080p TV. I have seen 720p tv's of the same size... there is a very noticable difference. 640p is a low resolution this generation, there is no denying it.

[Adamalicious]

The only Samsung 37" HDTV I know of is the LN-T375H which has a native resolution of 1,366 x 768 - which is not "full HD". One of the big reasons I went with a 40" was that I wanted 1080 vertical lines of resolution to avoid any scaling when viewing 1080p or 1080i content.

If that's not the model of TV you have let me know and I'll try to look it up.

http://www.samsung.com/us/c...

[power of Green]

You people have a nice weekend.

[the worst]

nintendo wii graphics
wow lololololol

[risk]

but bungie wheres the Anti-Aliasing the Xbox360 is supposed to be penalty free?

http://images.gamersyde.com...

[Blackmoon]

http://xbox360media.ign.com...

Right there.

[Marriot VP]

that is a really shotty pick, horrible resolution by the way. Might as well be SDTV or off screen.

give me a break

[HateFanboys]

Give me a break you two. The game does have aliasing problems, (it basically does have anti-aliasing turned off at the 720p res setting), and that picture you showed Blackmoon is just straight up bullshit! The games aliasing does look like Risk's picture when you're playing the game. And Cerula give me a break, with that weak @ss excuse. The fact is the most 360 games do BETTER anti-aliasing at the lower SDTV rez than at the higher rez'es, period! i can see that with my very own eyes, i dont need anyone to tell me that

[Jandre02]

But in a generation where EVERYTHING is about graphics, they cant get away with this BS.

The PS3 has been slammed all year for having 30FPS and since there graphics arent cutting edge enough. THis is Halo, the most anticipated game ever.

Its not acceptable. It hasnt nearly lived up to all the hype it was getting, and with all the game freezes, disc errors, and the loud noise thats coming from my xbox right now (hope it doesnt blow up) this game was a bust in terms of quality.

They could have packed Halo 2 in a Halo 3 box (which is kinda what they did lol) and they would have still gotten the same praise. THe games a bust, and once this hype dies down the xbox will begin its long 3 year roll down the hill. It did well for what it was though.

[ShiftyLookingCow]

bull

[Robeezy]

I would respond to that comment but i'm gonna go back to playing some more glorious Halo 3. Wait...

[rbanke]

I'm not a fan of halo, but i think it was a bit stupid for people to make anything from this '640p' business. If a game looks good, why do you care about the specifics?

[WafflesID]

I am absolutely with you on this one.

Not a huge fan of halo, and even I can see that people are being a bit ridiculous about this.

Personally I think the HDR is good enough to be worth the tradeoff.

[MrSwede]

I agree too! Why did they even make next gen consoles?

[Synex]

Is this kinda like the 30FPS games on PS3?

[d3l33t]

1080p only runs at 25-30fps on your TV anyways

[d3l33t]

disagree? http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Definition - Progressive (frames)
720 24, 30, 60; 25, 50
1080 24, 30; 25

[Ju]

Ninja Gaiden Sigma: 1080p @ 60fps
NBA 08: 1080p @ 60fps
GT Prolog: 1080p @ 60fps (30fps replay)
Ratched: 1080i @ 60fps
Ridge Racer: 1080p @ 60fps

[Adamalicious]

I think you are confusing 1080i and 1080p. They both run at 60Hz, the screen refreshed 60 times a second (I'm just talking about HDTVs here - not computer monitors with variable refresh rates). Anyway, the difference is that interlacing (the i in 1080i) draws 1 field (half of a frame - a frame being the whole screen) once every 60th of a second. The result is 30 full frames a second. 1080p however draws the entire frame once every 60th of a second - resulting in the famous 1080p 60FPS we've all heard so much about.

I suppose theoretically one could force a 1080p signal to display at other framerates by showing frames more than once, but it's still drawing the image 60 times a second regardless.

Put another way - your 1080p HDTV only displays 1080 vertical lines of resolution with a refresh rate of 60Hz no matter what you feed into it - like those crap SD cable channels we have to put up with until everyone goes HD.

Hope the helps!

[dantesparda]

Adamlicious is absolutely correct about the whole 1080i only showing either the even or odd lines every 1/60th of a second. And both standards doing 60Hz, therefore resulting in 1080i doing only 30fps while 1080p doing 60fps at the same refresh rate. What i wanna know now is why do they still insist on only using 60Hz? so flickerish! especially in interlaced mode (btw, i hate the term "progressive scan", it used to be called "non-interlaced" back in the 80's, i guess that term just wasnt "marketable" enough)

[risk]

@dante

hz nolonger matter on LCD's they only mattered on CRT (cathode ray tube) monitor/tv's the only time more hertz are needed are when you want 3d images. that is when an lcd will be pushed up to 120hz, 60hz for the left eye, 60hz for the right eye resulting in a proper 3d image @ 60 fps. if you do it to a 60hz lcd you'll have ghosting/lagg on the 3d image.

"Much of the discussion of refresh rate does not apply to LCD monitors. This is because while a phosphor on a CRT will begin to dim as soon as the electron beam passes it, LCD cells open to pass a continuous stream of light, and do not dim until instructed to produce a darker color. Pertaining to LCDs, see also response time and Input lag."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

[Adamalicious]

While 60Hz is totally "flickerish" on CRTs (computer monitors), and gives me a headache - it's totally fine for LCD panels. Beyond that there are diminishing returns so it doesn't really make sense for developers to try and push beyond that since they could put the necessary horsepower to better use elsewhere.

[dantesparda]

You's are right, i know that LCDs dont flicker in quite the same way that CRTs do. But aint the response time on LCDs directly related to the refresh rate/hz? In other words, dont they need to up the refresh rate in order to make the response times faster (lower ms)? Cuz i know it takes time for that pixel to go from black to white and black again, and the faster they can refresh the screen the faster they can make that transition happen (actually its more commonly measured from gray-to-gray nowadays, but i consider that cheating). Also, on the PC the higher the refresh rate/hz on the LCD monitor the better/less tearing you get.

[IBLEEDBLU]

u bots are soo retarded - how many of u complained about PS3 games not being 1080p lol look at ur biggest title - 640p LOL!!!! and you guys make fun of heavenly sword being to short - then i guess u havent played halo3 hahahahaha

u ppl just get owned and owned over and over - 360 is having a tought time keeping up with the onslaught of AAA titles that the PS3 is producing in the first year of its life - it can only get worse for the 360

u ppl are sooo quick to bash a PS3 title but fail 2 realize in 2 years this is what ur so call amazing 360 console is producing hahahaha

enjoy ur halo 2.5 - ill be playing a true NEXT-GEN console PS3

[Blackmoon]

I want your autograph, I've been reading and laughing at SDF for so long. I'm like your biggest fan!

[hotshot1237]

its not gonna get much better then what your seeing. dev kits got out late to ps3 devs and there still producing better games, technical wise, if the ps3 cuts its price november, i expect 360 to lose its lead the end of 08, ps3 cuts its price march, i expect ps3 to take over march of 09, either way ps3 will win. because ps3 is doing just as good as 360 in UK with a higher price. its slaughtering 360 in japan and spain. the last place left is america. and to think ps3 has only been out in europe for 5 months. and i find it funny how 360 fanboys talk about the wii killing the ps3 but then when comparing it to the wii, they say the wii doesnt count.lol ps3 ftw

[7ero H3LL]

I guess heavenly is not at all god like after all.

[Close_Second]

...how could I have been so wrong in buying a 360. Hell, why did I buy a console that lets me play some fantastic games when I could have paid top dollar for a console that will deliver on its potential in a couple of years.

I dare say many 360 owners will get a PS3 when they are more affordable. You can't limit yourself to one console if you want to experience the best that gaming has to offer. Hell, if I only ever owned Sony I never would have played Halo, Gears of War, Project Gotham Racing, Rallisport Challenge, etc...so, why not get off your soap box and leave the real gaming to those who arn't as narrow minded as yourself.

[QuietMan69]

From the silly comments, it must suck to be a PS3 fan about now.
They will latch on about anything negative about Halo3 no matter how stupid it might be.... I guess the millions of people enjoying the game dosen't count for much then........LOL........Keep it up I enjoy laughing

Thanks

[Meus Renaissance]

Are they admitting the claim or not? Because it sounds like, from what I read, that they did not specifically refer to whether or not it was true but instead talked about how good the game looks.

Is it 640p or not? Not that it matters ofcourse, I just thought they'd confirm this seeing as they "responded" to it.

[tfur]

640p confirmed...

They are just explaining why its a "good thing" in this article... and why the lack of anti aliasing is good...

This was all born out of the Neogaf post... Most of the developers and graphics people consider this unacceptable... along with the smug response...

I personally only slightly care, although I do like to keep up with the technology discussions...

[Close_Second]

...I was a little harsh towards Halo 3's graphics in previous posts however, after further play I must admit some of the graphics are utterly incredible. Sure, they are not perfect but with so much going on around you its simply awe inspiring.

Do they look as good as Gears of War...in some ways yes, in others no. However, this game plays 10 times better than Gears of War did.

I for one give Halo 3 a solid 9.5/10. I just wish it was not the last one...maybe a prequel to the original Halo????

[mesh1]

dude i wa sliek u when i 1st put on the halo 3 the 1st stage was a bit likemm not to cool but after playing this game 40 mtches in opvp and finishing the game an starting again this game has some amazing grapics we xbox oowners know this the multi player maps have amazin visuals end of the attention to deatail is crazy the game hdr/effects and game pyhsics have never been done on ps3 before they wish to get this type of game play its liek ur in a movie man

[m9105826]

I don't normally comment without something to add to the discussion... but dude above me ^^... please take some English classes and grammar lessons, and for the love of god, don't breed until after you have done so. Seriously, I nearly had a seizure during the first line.

[SpenserTracy]

Yet again. Eating the same old crap. Always defending....hm.

The graphics are not that good. The 360 can handle 720p or can it not?
You will not see the diffrence? If you scale up a 640i to 720i its ok?

Now think about it. GT5 will be in 1920*1080p, 60fps, full RGB. No faking here!!! That is a hell of a diffrense in the amount of data the system can handle.

[d3l33t]

preach on brotha

[Premonition]

I hope when Killzone 2 comes out they dont start knocking it cause it only runs 720p at 30FPS ,and everyone who read all those articles about all the lightings that went into that game knows now that 720p is looking pretty good about now, so im gonna save this page, cause Halo 3 fans before laughed at the fact KZ2 couldnt do 1080p 60fps blah blah blah, but dont like it when news of their greatest game in history gets exposed for not running true 720p and scales to 1080p. So a warning, you want to crack jokes on KZ2 next time, take a look at this news right here submitted here today.

[367 To Your Ass]

you guys sound like the 12 million people who like MS more than Sony are already selling out to get some thing they don't want. 5 million may hate 360 but 12 million people like and own a 360.

[Marceles]

Busted...oh well *goes back to playing Halo since it's too late, bought it already, they made their money, and really dont care anyways

[swuth1]

Lets face it. Any 480i Live action TV show looks more realistic than any game out there right now. If Bungie want to achieve more realism in their lighting by going to a lower res than thats fine. Higher Resolution does not equal better graphics people. Better lighting for sure does and if it means sacrificing a few precious pixels to acheive it (and maintain a good framerate) then so be it. Maybe if the Lair developers had tried something like this then maybe a lot of the game would have run better than a slideshow (but they were 1080p)
Go and get your f**cking shineboxes.

[Bathyj]

To be honest, I dont really care, but with all of M$'s crap about 720p being the "sweetspot" its seems strange they could reach that.

720p isn't the sweetspot, its the bear minimum nowadays and anything better is just a bonus. Technically anything under 720p isn't even considered High Definition since 720p is the LOWEST hi Def resolution.

[mesh1]

hey stop lieingto ur self u guys dont knwio anything about games ive playd games for 15yrs now mostly pc gaming ungrading my pc as offten to keep up to tech and i can say 1080 is very simialr to 720 very we pc this is why uy se a lot of ppl opting to use monitors instead of buying massive hdtv as 720 reselution is awsome when i play warcraft or css or farcry i cant ntoice the defference the only way to notice is if u actually count the pixel so son fanboys move on and u guys why seny what the article says ? iy says the 360 scales it to 1080 if u need so whtas the problem here?.

[Lumbo]

First of all, Mesh, PLEASE for heavens sake use a spell checker next time, it was hard work reading through your blabber due to the horrible spelling. N4g even offers a button on the upper right corner of the comment box to spell check your writing, USE IT.

On your post(as far as it was understandable):
A little matrix for you, so you actually know what we are talking here.
1080p = 2073600 pixel on screen per frame
720p = 921600 pixel on screen per frame
near 720p(Bungie style) = 737280 pixel on screen per frame

If you are physically unable to see a difference between 2 million pixel and 0.9 million pixel you should consider getting glasses. 1080p offers more than double the screen resolution 720p does, and about 3 times the amount Bungie uses for Halo3.

The obvious quality of the GAME Halo3 is not an issue here, at least not to me. Maybe i shall write it in plain words so that you can understand it:

-------> Halo3 is a great game - period. <--------

Having a scaler means nothing for quality, sure i could connect an Atari2600 system to my HDTV and it would display in fullscreen, so following your reasoning in 1080p, but it would not look like 1080p, neither does an upconverted 640p image look like 1080p only cause you pumped it up to fit the size.
But even that is not a point. The one and only point being presented in this and the other topic is: they stated that 720p is HD, and that they have 720p, but they failed at getting 720p in the game. For performance reasons they HAD TO reduce the rendering to 640p.

And before that the most rancid "x-bots" claimed that 720p on the PS3 was turd, cause hey, they said 1080p(120fps), but the most expensive and most advertised game of their camp did not even hit that "ugly low" screenres. And all of a sudden the VERY same people who claimed that native 720p on the PS3 is ugly and low rez, now claim that 640p on the xbox360 is not an issue, cause .. cause .. its the xbox360.

So basically this is not even directed at Bungie for making a great game. But at the blabbering fancrowd that disses EVERYTHING on the other system, and ignores the same issues on their own.(this statement works both ways by the way)

720p screen rez for a PS3 game appears ->

x-bot:"nananananaaaana, last gen low rez hahaha blabbber blabber real next gen systems like the godlike 360 can display games in 1080p bwahahaha"
Sony droid:"pah, 1080p is not everything, you don't see the difference between 720p and 1080p blabla, gameplay is only one important"
X-Bot:"xenon blablabla nextgen graphics > all bla Waitstation bla wait beyond"
sony droid:" RRoD blabla 'fill in random future titles'"

next week, same place:
"negative" tiny factoid about X-box360 game graphics appears ->
X-bot: "lies lies, made up by Sony Droids"
sony droid:"bwaha, x-break360 haha, in repair instead of in game, RRoD, last gen graphics, could be done on the Wii"
-> Developer confirms it ->
x-bot "blah, graphics are not everything, you don't see the difference between 640p and 1080p, gameplay is the only important thing, bla bla wait beyond"
sony droid:"nananananaaaana, last gen low rez hahaha blabbber blabber real next gen systems like the godlike PS3 can render games in real 720p bwahahaha"
x-bot:"Wait beyond blabber Mass effect blabla 'insert random upcoming title here'"

THAT is what pisses me off on n4g, the never ending kiddo playground fight over who's Dad is stronger, better, BurgerKing. Mixed with half-truth, mis presented snippets out of interviews to fit ones own agenda and a constant pissing on the others parade. And added into that ugly brew a handful of Blueray-hddvd blabber.

YUCK

[JasonPC360PS3Wii]

How does it feel droids to be cornholed in the ass by Bungie (again)?

[nambo]

Not as bad as how you feel about getting screwed by Sony. I can tell because All you Sony fanboys being so interested in the 360 is a clear sign of your insecurity. Cry and moan all you want if it makes you feel better: it's not convincing anyone who owns a 360 because we know we have the better games, and all the experts agree.

Hope you enjoy your wait.

[JasonPC360PS3Wii]

I'm a hardcore Xbot, I'm not a Droid dude.

Bungie pwned Sony fans with the truth.

[Bonsai1214]

before you guys flame me, disagree, and remove my bubbles, this is what i initially garnered from that quote at the top of the page... it is in no way fact or truth, just my thoughts on it

it seems that bungie's engine couldn't run smoothly with postprocessing and HDR lighting in 720p. does it seem like that for anyone else?

"This ability to display a full range of HDR, combined with our advanced lighting, material and postprocessing engine, gives our scenes, large and small, a compelling, convincing and ultimately “real” feeling, and at a steady and smooth frame rate, which in the end was far more important to us than the ability to display a few extra pixels"

that quote seems to tell me, our engine couldn't handle 720p smoothly, so we took away some of the screen size by using vertical pillars, then it went smoothly...

again, just my opinion from what i read.

[DJ]

And the lighting isn't even all that spectacular. While most people that bought Halo 3 aren't going to care about this, the fact that Microsoft's flagship title doesn't even render at HD quality is a very bad sign. Microsoft stated that the power difference between PS3 and 360 "is a wash", yet that's not what we're seeing. PS3 games do multiple rendering passes as well (usually 4 passes in order to get proper motion blur and anti-aliasing), so the information that Bungie/Microsoft posted was basically misleading.

But it isn't Bungie's fault.

It's pretty obvious that they're pushing the 360 to its limits, and it simply can't keep up with the requirements of developers. They had to do a 640p 2x anti-aliased game because they ate up a lot of the available system resources. Reviewers are unanimous on the fact that Halo 3 has more physics interactions and more characters onscreen than any other 360 title to date, but despite all this it barely compares to Resistance: Fall of Man, a PS3 launch title.

Pop-in, an inconsistent framerate, below-HD resolution, 2x anti-aliasing (which is worthless, btw), and yet it scored 9s and 10s in the graphics department. Maybe the reviewers aren't biased. Maybe this is truly the pinnacle of what Xbox 360 is going to achieve within its lifetime. If so, it doesn't stand a chance against Playstation 3.

[BIadestarX]

Bonsai1214, did you play Halo 3 yet? I was amazed by how many things are going on. Did you noticed how huge the game feels? One can shoot enemies from great distances and lighting has a lot to do with this. All ingame and dynamically rendered. Most games never do this.... Games like gears though look great.. maps are designed on room basis which allow the game to be very detailed and HDR lighting to be limited to a small area. Did you noticed the loading time on Halo 3? The game feels open ended and without invisible barriers like most games. When another game on the xbox 360 let alone on the PS3 does something like this and look at good as halo 3 then we can talk about how much halo 3 sucks in terms of resolution.

I know you are not flaming Halo 3... and that you are just analising what they said the best you can.. based on your understanding... "that quote seems to tell me, our engine couldn't handle 720p smoothly, so we took away some of the screen size by using vertical pillars" but one must take under consideration distance when you speak of light and graphics... for a game a open ended as Halo 3 and with so many things going on.. great enemy AI... physics... to look like Halo 3 or Kill Zone.. it would probably need 3 times the amount of memory available on the xbox 360 and the PS3. Assets do need to be loaded into memory before they can be use... you people understand that right?
Wait until Kill Zone 2 comes out and you will see how the battle, distance and lighting are limited to a small area with constant loading and cust scenes between small areas.... like Gears... not that it's a bad thing if the game story borrows... but Halo 3 story required the world to feel big and spacious.. so if taking a few pixels and dumming down the graphics did the trick then be it.
No one is complaining about the game as far as gameplay or fun... people playing the game now... love it.
By the way... there is a part that field of view is limited... crash site... look like the organs of a alien ship... looks very detailed there...

[Bonsai1214]

i completely understand what you're saying. i haven't played it yet, but i have seen friends play it. (drunk, none the less)

so i don't really know how spacious everything is. but it does look pretty good, though not the best.

:-( someone debubbled me...

[techie]

Bladestar...you really haven't played Heavenly Sword have you. That has massive vistats stretching for miles. With how mcuh going on? Well hell of a lot actually...upto 2000 enemies on screen at the same time. AND it has a comparable (if not better) HDR lighting engine than Halo 3....AND it has 4xAA to get rid of those nasty jaggies.

ANd it runs in 720p...so all this talk about the lighting not being as good, or having to be in confined areas, is bullshit.

[darx]

Kinda sux for you guys then. A small % of HALO3 players/fans could careless. While a large % of Sony fans care.

[chino3xl]

so what halo 3 sold a million but the thing is what are you gettin out of the deal we brag so much bout dumb stuff as if you gonna get half, you compare games that are different from each other it must be 13 yr olds in here and as for heavenly sword thats a damn good game, im not gonna bash halo cause i dont have it and dont care for it but to eaches own just play the damn games and stop the childs play

[Blackmoon]

To explain to some people who are whinnying about Halo 3 running at 640p allow me to point out the difference between an upscaled 640p image to 720p and a true 720p image

The following Image is a unaltered 1280x720 screenshot of Gears of War:

http://xboxmedia.gamespy.co...

I've now taken that image and downscaled it to 1138x640: (Which is actually slightly lower than 1152x640 which is what bungie is using)

http://img215.imageshack.us...

Now I've taken the above 640 image and upscaled it to 1280x720:

http://img206.imageshack.us...

Comparing the upscaled 720 version to the true 720 version you can rather easily see how very small the difference is. Seriously if you care about that much graphical detail you need to get yourself some fresh air.

[vickers500]

Show gameplay resolution comparisons, not cut scenes. Show the actual game being played in 720p, to the actual game being played in 640p, and not even in an image, do it in a video, because images are not a very good representation of what you are going to actually see.

Then you can reasonably argue whether or not it makes a difference.

[Blackmoon]

Using a video would allow video encoding to effect the quality of the screenshot.

[nurayi]

25.1 is on the right track. but to truly see the difference then you've got to be viewing that image on a screen 40+in. if you've invested in a large HDTV like I have then it really is quite a difference going from an image that has been blown up, to a nice clear image at 1:1 ratio. The larger the TV the bigger the kick in the pants.

[WafflesID]

In a video you are going to see even LESS of a difference. Especially during gameplay when you are focused on aiming and shooting.

How are you going to count steps while it's moving :)

80 pixels people...

[WafflesID]

edit.

nevermind.

[pilotpistolpete]

Then by your (flawed) logic, why didn't we just stick with ps2 and xbox? The graphics were fine at 420, right? Oh yeah, according to Bungie, we would have awesome things such as "lighting" effects.

[m9105826]

Obviously SOMEONE noticed it or they never would have bothered to even measure the pixels in the first place. Also, the response by Bungie sounds like a cop-out excuse for "the hardware just couldn't do what we wanted it to". Which is a bad thing. Halo 3 = Great FPS; this news, however, does not bode well for the 360 hardware as a whole. You know MS gave Bungie their top-of-the-line dev tools, and butt-loads of money. You know Bungie's work is the pinnacle of what can be done on the 360 technically right now. And if Bungie couldn't squeeze 720p out of the 360 hardware, the future looks rather grim for a system that is supposed to get better for the next 4 or 5 years.

[Adamalicious]

You can't just make the image smaller and say it's a "downscaled" comparison. You would need to make it smaller and then make it larger - the same size it was before. You would also need to do this without using any of photoshops amazing image scaling algorithms. If you did that the difference, I can confidently say, would be quite noticeable.

[kenjix]

That's some powerful hardware :)

[vickers500]

I am not bashing Halo or anything, but I am really dissapointed in at Bungie for making this move. Technical limitations may have been a problem, but for all the money and hype thats been thrown at this game, it is unacceptable.

It does take away from the experience, at least IMO anyway. I bought this game before I even heard about this 640p crap, and the day before I bought this game, I purchased a brand new Sony Bravia 32 inch lcd tv, 720p and 1080i resolutions. When I started playing, I noticed that most of the visuals are incredibly jagged, and left something to be desired. The actual textures and effects are incredible, but why couldnt they fix the "jaggies".

Technical limitations are no excuse, as I have just stated. Oh well, its still a fun game with great gameplay, which is what matters the most, but it is still very dissapointing to look at Halo 3 and wonder what it could have been.

[mikeslemonade]

360 is basically fully unlocked then. There's really no more progression to be made in future games if the top game couldn't get it to 720p at a steady frame rate. So is xbox 720 coming out sooner than later? If so then who is the one who is charging more money for there system. PS3 isn't even close to being fully unlocked. Uncharted, which is coming out in December is only using 50% or under of the systems power.

[Fux4Bux]

Hmmm that might explain why it looks horribly jaggy on my monitor compared to regular TVs. Seriously it's really terrible even on my small 24" screen. Same thing happens with a lot of multiplats too from PS3 and 360.

[OmegaKulu]

meh...at least we know for sure and why now... personally i dont think this matters that much... BUT does this mean 360 have hit their hardware limit? now, thats the question i want to know

[gnothe1]

regardless of what limitation you guys say the 360 hit, the Ps3's best looking game LAIR doesnt look better than the 360's best looking game GOW. you guys say that UT3 look better than gears!! tell me, how do you know!! the game isnt out yet to compare. you cant go off posted screen shots. what until the game is here then talk about the goodness of the graphics, thats why I cant understand why you guys keep bringing up LBP,haze,killzone an uncharted.

[OmegaKulu]

lair looks like junk.... HS is so much better -.-

[DJ]

though other people say MGS4, FFXIII, Gran Turismo, or Uncharted. They all look amazing. But Lair?...nah.

[P1MPDADDY]

I have been reading all over the internet that both the PS3 and 360 have games that dont run in either 720P or 1080P Native resolution. They are scaled from lower native resolutions and then outputed to either 720P or 1080P. If nobody said anything about this 640 resolution for Halo 3 nobody would have noticed or even cared. It looks fantastic on my 40" Samsung 1080P LCD HDTV using an HDMI cable. All I care is about what I see on the screen not some BS tech specs that none of us know a damn thing about.

To the 360 haters who havent played Halo 3 go spread your FUD elsewhere and "Wait Beyond" with your Blu-Ray player I mean um Delaystation, I mean um shouldnt you guys be returning your Lair and Heavenly Sword rentals already and curing Cancer again???

To the people who have *supposedly* played Halo 3 and are knocking this game. Even if I were to believe you, which I dont, you never would have noticed SH!T if it werent for these internet sites spreading FUD. If it really bothers you so much that the game is 640 native resolution, stop playing it you big babies.

To the rest of us who just enjoy playing videogames and dont get caught up in the tech spec flame wars. Enjoy this game. Halo 3 Rocks!!! If you own a PS3 I suggest Warhawk. It Rocks too.

[Bathyj]

Pimp, I agree with you.

This really isn't a big deal. While not the best looking game around it still looks great. The low res is not stopping me from enjoying this game what so ever. BUT...

All I want is for Xbox fans to remember this and maybe learn a little humilty. When killzone 2 come out at 720p@30fps I hope feverish haters dont just all over it and carry on like this somehow wrecks the game. There were plenty of people doing this when KZ's rez was announced. Hell they even gave Resistance crap and thats a launch game and runs smooth as butter with any amount of action going on. "What I though it would be 1080p@120fps, bla bla bla bla bla 4D. Enoughs, enough, and people need to realise if they dont stop it will just go back and forth.

Enjoy the game for what it is. If you worry more about the things you hate more than the things you like, you will never be a very happy person.

[SofaKingReetodded]

it looks like you pluck your eyebrows. tisk tisk...lol

[MRMagoo123]

What r u talking bout pimp nobody would of noticed if ppl didnt bring up the fact that its 640p well ur wrong the day the game came out ppl where saying how it didnt look that good that it wasnt HD and that there where too many jaggies all that these ppl have done is explained why the game looks as bad as it does so yes ppl did notice before the 640p stuff was discussed

[Meus Renaissance]

I find it curious how some people, annoyed by their ignorance, criticise and dismiss fanboys and then go on to behave like fanboys themselves. All in one post.

And Elite360, please stop spamming the forums. You could get banned as you've done this consistently.

[IRONMAN_X57]

its just more of bungie denying thier f*ck ups AGAIN

[7ero H3LL]

and games like gears of war,lost planet,bioshock,and mass effect prove only one thing 360 can still out perform most pc's .

even the one i have.

it has a geforce 8600 in there it cost me $1,800.

[Komrad]

as we'll prolly will never know what halo 3 720p looks like.. Can't argue but i'll take it, and move on.

[Ps3Fanboy777]

LMAO!

Wow two years and the best game you guys have is Gears, atleast thats a great game!

Too funny! Hey atleast you have that upscaler ... No wonder it looked like raw booty.

RFOM looked and ran better... FACT

[Ju]

...and that engine now runs in its second generation at 1080i @ 60fps. Available in late October.

[pilotpistolpete]

Why didnt they just drop a few more pixels are release it on the original xbox? I mean, who would even know the difference right?

[Tone]

The funny thing i find is this... all the people slagging off resolutions etc..

I bet they do not own a HDTV, they say they have.. but i bet they dont.. i dont know of many teenagers that have a HDTV in their bedrooms, let alone Adults, out of all my friends i have.. only two own a HDTV, most just do not see the point in it just now till there are more HD programs on.

And another thing.. i will be quite shocked if someone says they are .. say 25+, own a HDTV etc, but acting like a pure fanboy.. MS or Sony.. i say this.. grow up and get a life eh and act your bloody age!

[pilotpistolpete]

I'm laughting at the resolution. I'm 23 and have a 42" HD tv. So i guess I can speak?

[ALMIGHTYPS3]

when negative facts are stated about the xbox360 or games you people always just try to blow it off as no big deal.Your behavior is defined as IN DENIAL.

PLAY~B3YOND

[NextGen24Gamer]

"we gave you 1280 pixels of vertical resolution, since Halo 3 uses not one, but two frame buffers – both of which render at 1152x640 pixels. The reason we chose this slightly unorthodox resolution and this very complex use of two buffers is simple enough to see – lighting. "

Most games use One frame buffer at 1280x720p

Halo 3 uses 2 frame buffers at 1152x640p otherwise a staggering.......2304x1280p

So Halo 3 has twice the resolution of games like Resistence and Motorstorm.

Its simple Math and I appreciate Bungie clarifying it. Not that it matters to anyone who has played the game. Its a Fantstic game and deserves all the 9.5's its averaging. Its more so for all the rabid sony fanboys who enjoy bashing the biggest game of our generation.

[DJ]

1152x640 times two is 1152x1280. But they did state that they split the visual information into High Dynamic Range pixels and Low Dynamic Range pixels. This isn't anything special though since the majority of PS3 titles are doing not just two render passes, but four.

Killzone 2 for instance dedicates 32MB to its 720p Deferred Rendered framebuffer, which is 2.5x greater than Forward Rendered framebuffers @ 720p with 4x MSAA. Halo 3 only has 2x MSAA.

"So Halo 3 has twice the resolution of games like Resistence and Motorstorm" Actually no, since it's really just doing multiple passes on the exact same rasterized data. You can't simply multiply the number "640" time two and expect that you're getting twice the visual data. It has to do with algebra and area calculations. For example, 1080p is 2.5x the number of pixels as 720p. As you increase vertical height, you also have to increase horizontal length.

[mesh1]

DJ shush stop talkign abotu games that are not released its getting boring killzone 2 looks like meda, of honor airborne and its not even released 360 fans talk about games that are out and owning ps3 u guys talk about games that are releassing nextr year with ofc new tech lets wait for alan wake /ninjagainden/gears of war 2 and see haha talking anbout killzonelike its out anytime soon plz prolly wil, get delayed

[Antan]

"2304x1280p"

Elite i like your comments most of the time but please check your figures and read up about what frame buffers are and what they do.

[techie]

Simple math...indeed.

Noone's doubtin what a great game it is Elite - and of course that it's 640p shouldn't matter. Right?

"Oh, thats right...its only 720p and 30fps....WOW..."

That's what you said about Motorstorm Elite. So it must matter to you...so I can say "Oh, that's right....it's only 640p and 30fps...WOW..." - or can I...I'm not quite sure of your standards.

"If Microsoft says its native 1080p...I believe it." Is what you said to me.

That's the definition of a fanboy - or I'd like to be polite - I'd call you a "yes man" Elite.

"I favor the superior console. I own all of them."

Yes MAN.

ps. be careful what you PM me.

[Ju]

At least PS3 owners can have fun with Halo, too, now :)

[JokesOnYou]

ha ha I finished the fight yesterday, the campaign was fkn awesome, lots of fun, Master Chief is one badass motherfckr and now I've been online playing with some bud's, and whoever, damm Halo3 is the most fun I've had gaming in the last few yrs, its so addictive I was up 'til 2am,

It's funny those that I talk to online are all saying how great the game looks, I told a few of them about this site, I haven't checked for the latest news, but I said I garuantee its filled with a bunch of Halo3 haters, ha ha 360 owners care more about the games, thats why Halo3 and many others sell well on 360, we buy and play great games sonykids love talk tech they just want the box to say 1080p even if it turns out like Lair, "wow look the box says it 1080p", that stuff gets sonykids excited but at the end of the day the end result is what counts= Halo3 looks amazing, if Bungie had to drop a few pixels and use two framebuffers, to get the great hdr lighting and make Halo3 look so good with so much going on then, how can you knock them with everything else they have added to this game, I'll take it vs having 80 pixels more that you won't notice a difference anyway, so what? how petty can sonykids get? the OWNERS/GAMERS like what Bungie delivered, sonykids are just jealous of all of Halo3's success= oh shiii, wow Halo3 just scored another 10/10 and they clearly say the graphics wont blow you away in the review however he said its still a beautiful looking game, ha ha sonykids is that was bothering you, you think if the graphics are NOT the BEST ever then it should NOT score a 10, well eat this=

ztgamedomain:

"Halo 3 is a great game, but the sum of all of it’s parts make it a classic and a must-own title for all fans of the action genre."=

Halo3 another 10/10= wow, that must really hurt sonykids as much as they talk shiii but no ones listening, they 're just playing Halo3 and having fun while you kids WAIT, and WAIT or play some Halo3 on your SMART friends 360=

JOY

[THC CELL]

aww u was up till 2 am. mate i can get u a full team that used to play Wolfie till 6am and on

this game is like halo 2 a let down

the fun will last 6 weeks

cheater modders the lot are playing there part soon
lol i found halo 3 pro owned yesterday in game station yes mine

[hardcorehippiez]

to achieve it they had to sacrifice in other areas. if this was ps3 it would be getting pulled apart by now bt yet the hyped game still manages to score full marks . i myself play 360 bt am not blinded by fanboyism to not recognise the systems limitations and that the 360 has reached them.

[Xbox is the BEST]

that Bungie hasn't figured on the 360 hardware yet. The first trailer of Halo 3 when Master Chief was walking in the desert that's what Bungie promised people. Well the graphics are good just not the target trailer.

[Mu5afir]

It's 80 pixels multiplied by 1152, Halo 3 has 92,160 pixels per frame less then a typical 720p game. But the reason given is legit, and as I had explained in my previous posts. The 360s bandwidth limits it's capacity to do 720p with HDR lighting effects etc.. This is also why Halo has 2xMSAA sample rather then the standard 4xMSAA that the "eDRAM" should have provided for "free".

The 360 limit has been reached, and now developers are trying to work around it.

[Bordel_1900]

Isn't standard HD 720p resolution something like 1280x720 or 1366x720...?

[Adamalicious]

bubbles for taking the time to do the math.

[Mu5afir]

It's 1280 x 720, but the point is there are over a hundred thousand pixels missing per frame. And if they aren't going to do standard high def, why not at least take the effort to do 4xMSAA?

[SofaKingReetodded]

we have to listen to idiots like "The Mart" "JasoGX" " "Bladestar" call the PS3 the "bottleneck 3" because a few developers have had poor showings on a radically new hardware platform. We told em back then that the 360 is a poorly designed and underpowered console and now that their long predicted PS3 destroyer has arrived it ends up showing more of the 360's weaknesses than anything else.

"I told you so" just doesn't quite cut it at the moment.

[Wii60_FTW]

this article just owned every last sony dog. halo 3 is gorgeous, and certainly looks better than any 4D ps3 game.

EDIT: to the guy below,

this is a random screenshot I took from the game a few days ago:

http://img222.imageshack.us...

regardless of resolution, how can you say that looks anything less than amazing? and that's nothing compared to the rest of the game. just wait until I get the time to take some better shots. it looks amazing. period.

[shysun]

No halo3 is not gorgeous.Sorry but Gears,UT3,COD4,MOH:ABA hell even Heavenly sword all look much better than Halo3.It looks dated.You guys need to wake up and stop drinking that hype juice!

[shysun]

Funny how I have 2 disagrees but not one of them have the balls to show their face and say Halo3 looks better than any of the games I named!Show your fanboy faces!!

[Thursday]

I personally have not played Halo 3, and considering these actually rather disturbing news, I'm probably not going to be buying it. I have a 1080p-projector, and a 130" screen, so the difference would actually be very noticeable for me.

What saddens me about this is that it does really seem like the Xbox 360 has reached its peak, performance wise. Just look at Blue Dragon, that game is rendered in 1080p, and you get lag and slow-down all the time. It's a bit to heavy for the Xbox 360 hardware, as it seems. And now, Halo 3 sort of proves that if you want all the goodies, resolution has to suffer. No one can really deny that this game is in fact NOT in HD. I think that is too bad, I really do, since I own all three next-gen consoles.

This MIGHT be a matter of using the hardware properly, and hopefully they will learn how to do this better in the future. But I'm not holding my breath...

[SofaKingReetodded]

that Halo is a first party title right?

support doesn't get any better than that, money or talent wise, like one person here said many months ago when the BETA came out and many of us had that Scooby Doo "huuhhh" looks on our faces. "If this what has achieved with over 3 years, a MASSIVE budget and over a 150 developers than the 360 is truly in trouble". Well it looks like they were right and all you ignorant xbot fanboys were wrong.

[Bordel_1900]

I think if Halo 3 looks good on-screen running, it doesn't matter too much if it's 1280x720p or 1156x640p.

The only thing this confirms to me, as a PS3 fan, is that the PS3 probably is a lot more powerful than the 360 at rendering at high resolutions (PS3 games are rendered at 720p, 1080i and 1080p natively). MS made a smart move by including HW upscaling in the box, else they'd actually be in trouble.

For the record; I really don't like FPS games. I couldn't care less about Halo or Haze or any other fps.

[shysun]

I just played the game for the first time and damn does it look bad.Split screen forgetaboutit.3waysplit screen on a 37'hdtv it looks like a Xbox1 game.Why do those unfunny ass midget aliens talk so damn much?It's not funny Bungie!This was the most over hyped POS I've played it a long time!

MOH:ABA/Skate looked really nice on 360 though.

[Salvadore]

Dont be hating.

[shysun]

Your title and your comment don't match, please try again. :(

[Adamalicious]

OK - I don't really care about what resolution Halo 3 is or is not running at, but I'm calling shenanigans. This response is a serious steaming pile.

"Did we short change you 80 pixels?"

"This ability to display a full range of HDR, combined with our advanced lighting, material and postprocessing engine, gives our scenes, large and small, a compelling, convincing and ultimately “real” feeling, and at a steady and smooth frame rate, which in the end was far more important to us than the ability to display a few extra pixels."

80 pixels?? A few extra pixels?? Do they have any idea how screen resolutions work? Do they really think that we don't?

Seriously, I couldn't give a crap, but I'm sick of hearing about the 360's "scaler". If you have an HDTV with 1080 pixels of vertical resolution that supports 1080, 720, and 480 i and p resolutions (as I do) then you should know that your TV is INCAPABLE of displaying any less than 1080 vertical lines of resolution EVER. But, then how can I see all my 720p games from my PS3 or 480i from my DVR when neither has a "scaler"? THE TV DOES IT!!! ZOMG!! THAT'S CRAZY!!!

Sorry, sometimes you just gotta let it out, you know. :)

[MrSwede]

Does it say "720p 1080i 1080p" on the box? If so then they might as well put that on the old Xbox games. I call it false marketing. If this is considered ok why not put it on DVD´s and add the tiniest text "when played on a DVD-upscaler". Next gen meh, high definition meh, HDTV´s meh...Who needs it!

How come it doesn´t say 1080p on all PS3 and Xbox360 games?

Edit: If it does say 640p on the box I withdraw everything I just wrote.

[AngryTypingGuy]

"We would ignore it entirely were it not for the internet’s propensity for drama where none exists."

He hit the nail on the head. This is turning into a situation like Janet Jackson's "wardrobe malfunction" or Don Imus saying "nappy headed hos". It's making a mountain out of a mole hill, just like the rest of the stupid media.

Halo 3 is a great looking game - not the best - but great looking. The game play itself is very fun.

[mesh1]

shut ur mouth u reneck pig faced swine don amus shud b shot so shud u for saying that

[AngryTypingGuy]

Sissy douches like you are what's wrong with America. You don't have to like what Imus had to say, but he should have the right to say it. Everyone get so "offended" and "outraged" over everything. I put those words in quotes, because people don't really get offended and outraged. Small groups that represent a minority of people always complain or threaten to boycott, and then the rest of our entertainment suffers.

By the way sissy douche, I'm not a redneck. I just don't get offended by racial comedy. What Imus said was in the context of a live radio program that mixes politics and comedy. Comedy doesn't always have to be nice. I have heard worse come out of the mouths of Dave Chapelle, Carlos Mencia, Eddie Murphy, etc. For some reason it's not OK for an old white guy to say it.

[ApocalypseShadow]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=...

in order to make games on 360,you must "downgrade the experience" to keep the quality up.but it won't hold out much longer unless all games on 360 use UE3 like gears and bioshock.

the biggest game,the flagship game,gets the downgraded experience."

1080p/1080i?nope
720p?nope
below the sweet spot at 640p?yup

where's that extra free memory for antialiasing?

mag lev......................

[jazzmanb]

dj,again your a moron..halo3 has the best lighting ever to grace a videogame..play the freakin game than talk...the ps3 cant even render shaders properly,so stop with the bs...

[THC CELL]

i never want to see a xbox player diss a ps3 again after this,

[sak500]

HAHAHAH whatever. 640p halo3 kiks a$$ of anything POS3 has churned out so far.

[CrazzyMan]

NO, it`s just BLIND M$ fanboys are buying LOW quality products. =)))))))
They got used for paying for online, now will get used for LOW resolution. =)))

[mistertwoturbo]

seriously, you halo fanboys really suck balls. can you get it through your thick heads that halo 3's graphics aren't up to par? halo 3 is the biggest and most hyped game of all time. it's a good game. but face it, the graphics and resolution is a disappointment. i play it on my 46" samsung lnt4665f and the jaggies are more than noticeable.

[beardtm]

The lighting is damned impressive in this game, and Bungie gave a good reason for using this resolution.

So i'm fine with that.

Its a great game.

[Daz]

Its looks dame fine on my hdtv upscaled to 1080i. My tv dont go to 1080p.
Because a game has low resolution its automatically crap lol shows you havent played it.
If you have you would not of relized it anyway if it wasnt for some person picking the game apart spec by spec lol.

[Gibroon]

I was over at my chums who has a 46" Sony Bravia and altough some of the game looks great you definitely notice the jaggies and black lines round the border of some of the ships.

It probably doesn't look that bad on smaller tv's and when we plugged in my PS3 in to his tv and played motorstorm you definately notice more imperfections(I have a toshiba 32"). Halo probably isn't as bad on a smaller tv.

I now see why people want 1080p games because the difference between 720p and 1080p on larger tv's is noticeable.

Playing GTHD showed the difference between the 2 settings.

Warhawk looks fookin great on a big screen and splitscreen.

[DwightOwen]

The graphics are fine. If you see jaggies or any other "flaws" it's because you are actively looking for them.

Graphics whores, shut up and enjoy the game.

PS3 trolls, piss off and go play your games (no cracks because we all know they're bullshit to begin with).

I'll see the rest of you twats online.

[Lumbo]

I beg to differ:
If you see jaggies or any other "flaws" it's because you are actively looking for them.

nono, If you see jaggies or any other "flaws" it's because they ARE THERE.

Only fanboys claim that stuff that is there isn't or that stuf that is not there, is.

[DwightOwen]

OH NOES! HE CALLED ME "F" WORD!

Read my comment again. I didn't say they weren't there, I said you were LOOKING FOR THEM, you anal-retentive twat. The rest of us are too busy enjoying the game to care if the graphics aren't perfect.

[Bolts]

I'm sorry, but if we're gonna run games at 640p then there's no reason for buying a Xbox 360. We could all save a ton of money by switching to Wii. At least now we know why the game graphics isn't that impressive in the first place. Maybe some of the nextgen effects and details would be too obvious on the scaler so the game's art direction must use textures and designs that won't stand up too much when stretched.

In other words, the ceiling for the Xbox 360 has been reached. The console doesn't have enough horse power to run Halo 3 at 1080i so Bungie must use a lower res then up scale it to display at 1080i.

[gnothe1]

ok lets say Halo isnt the best game graphically!! but... just look at gears an bioshock. so now we know that the systems has balls. now with that being said, does the PS3 have a game out that looks better than anyone of those games. thats a big fat NO!! dont come here with that uncharted crap because its not out yet so we dont know. UT3 will be on the 360 as well. killzone 2 is not out yet. so what game out says the PS3 is more powerful. OH I KNOW!! WE HAVE TO WAIT TO SEE THESE GAMES!!

you guys can forget it, because theres nothing you guys can do to smear the image of Halo 3. the games have been SOLD an games are being PLAYED, so you sony fans really need to stop this crap!!

[THC CELL]

i dont give a crap what u say about x box anymore there best game is a fail to next gen they could of put this on the first x box

[mesh1]

Not TO MEntion that ut3 was developed from on the 360 and its clearly stated it will perform better on the 360 than the ps3 the unreal engine was made with the 360 and ut3 is the same u can search for the info on th enet cry more sony fan boy im gonna go get my chicken chow mein now holla!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[S1D3 EFFEC7]

"...since Halo 3 uses not one, but two frame buffers"

>__>

That explains it then. I dont mind the visuals anyways.

[TheMART]

"Naturally it’s more complicated than that. In fact, you could argue we gave you 1280 pixels of vertical resolution, since Halo 3 uses not one, but two frame buffers – both of which render at 1152x640 pixels. The reason we chose this slightly unorthodox resolution and this very complex use of two buffers is simple enough to see – lighting. We wanted to preserve as much dynamic range as possible – so we use one for the high dynamic range and one for the low dynamic range values. Both are combined to create the finished on screen image."

--> Two framebuffers @ 1152 x 640 pixes, dynamic lightning at the max. So one would see those 80 pixels difference = only PS3 fanboys.

We still have to see the first exclusive AAA title on the PS3 right guys?

"In fact, if you do a comparison shot between the native 1152x640 image and the scaled 1280x720, it’s practically impossible to discern the difference. We would ignore it entirely were it not for the internet’s propensity for drama where none exists. In fact the reason we haven’t mentioned this before in weekly updates, is the simple fact that it would have distracted conversation away from more important aspects of the game, and given tinfoil hats some new gristle to chew on as they catalogued their toenail clippings."

Exactly. Dramaqueens = PS3 kiddies

[Lumbo]

The world according to TheMart:

Sony marketing writes 720p on a box when its 640p (upsacaled to 720p) = "OMG SONY IS LIEING TO US THEY ARE THE EVIL liars overpromise, underdeliver"

Microsoft marketing writes 1080p on the box when its 640p (upscaled to 1080p) = "Its perfectly legit, nothing to see here, Bungie is doing all right its all SONYS fault blabla coverup"

[techie]

"So one would see those 80 pixels"

It's not 80pixels. It's 92,160 less pixels.

"Exactly. Dramaqueens" So who was the dramaqueen when they were screaming that most PS3 games weren't 1080p? Mart my little lady friend - it twas you! Deary me - who'd have thunked it.

But still...what about the free AA! What about the jaggies?! You pm'ed me, you swore at me, you called me a liar...when i said it wasn't free! You said all 360 games would be jaggie free. Yet you have Halo3 with no AA at 640p.

Do I care about Halo3 with no AA at 640p for the game itself? No it's still a great game. Do I care when I see hypocricy. Oh yes indeed.

[Azurite]

@Deep
Isn't it 184320?
You split 184320 in two, and would just like to know what I missed :)

[Bathyj]

DRAMA QUEENS?

I just want to know why the littlest thing on PS3 gets blown out of all proportion causing swearing, name calling and abuse to people who simply like PS3 while things on Xbox like abandoning 20 million customers, selling a few million broken consoles and a flagship title that isn't even technically High Definition (and incidently, short of that "sweetspot" of 720p the LOWEST HD resolution)is so easily dismissed as unimportant and not even worth talking about according to Bots like you.

So whats the reason Mart. Why is every slightly negative thing on PS3 a big deal while real issues (not that THIS really is one) on Xbox are just shrugged off.

My mental picture of an Xbot (I'm not talking about just the fans, you know if you're a bot or not) is a guy with his head in sand a la the Mohamand Southpark episode.

[tk]

Marty... the discussion is about technical aspects. Simply put...
Regardless of the spin and defenses - and even on if the game did turn out to be good - heck - Tetris was good - and was done on 320x240 resolution - and less with two colors monochrome...

The points made is technical - and are valid. The game runs in 640p natively. Despite the hype - a game like this cannot run on the XB360 in even 720p. It does not seem to matter really - but then again - the point is about the technical aspects - so it does not count. The point made - and inevitable questions is - despite the hype - the XB360 cannot handle 1080p with a FPS with AA - regardless of the EDRAM and supermogologolo GTX SuperHypedCharched GPU. Fact.

Can the PS3? Seems so. We should ask the guy that did the clever tests and caught this one out to do the same for the PS3 titles. Who knows - maybe we will find that it cannot - or that it can. I don't know yet.

----------------------------- ------------------------------- -----
MART = Microsoft Action Response Team...
Who else would man the boards 24/7 and defend any MS related content, attack every Sony related content and be able to play the games?
----------------------------- ------------------------------- -----

[FirstknighT]

Of course all this doesn't change the fact that this is one of the greatest games ever created, destroyed sales records, and CRUSHES anything on the ps3. Those are just the facts ladies. Stop your whimpering.

[techie]

"Of course all this doesn't change the fact that this is one of the greatest games ever created, destroyed sales records"

Correct - but we're not talking about that are we?

[Bullseye]

what does it matter to you? You are not the people playing the game! I'll wager right here and now there is nobody,i repeat nobody, that has actually played halo3 for more than 30mins,that is anything less than amazed by the lighting. It is truly beautiful and easily the best lighting engine i've seen on a next gen console game,period.Also, have any of you people actually sat in front of a HDTV and tried to spot the difference between 1080p and 720p at normal viewing distances? Well, i'll tell you now, it isn't easily done. I'm using the latest SONY, yes that's right SONY HDTV,and the difference is negligible.Halo 3 is an absolutely fantastic game and the environments feel, well, varied and realistic,also vast in scale. Of course, it's not perfect. I for one don't understand why there is no anti-aliasing, when many people have claimed this is for FREE on the 360. Clearly,it is not free otherwise it would have been used.I believe, Bungie have gone for a 'real' feel, rather than an a pretty render and have made the trade offs accordingly.For me, they have made all the right decisions,thanks Bungie and well done.

[THAMMER1]

The community here on N4G is turning to crap faster than Rapture.

You 360 haters are failing.

[Lumbo]

Oh but Thammer, you should be really happy, cause from this day on NOBODY will ever call Halo3 "Halo 2.5 in HD" again.

[THAMMER1]

Hey look at it like this. I am fully aware of the motives of the haters in this thread and I am also aware of what if fueling those motives. The 360 and the PS3 have had their equal share of hate.

You know I'm glad the opinion of the few all out XBOX360 haters is corralled onto the Internet. People out side and in the real world see for them self that there is a section of PS3 fans that are a bit more than upset that the PS3 is under performing. Bashing Halo 3 is your out let then so be it.

But you need to stop to reflect on the fact that a hard-core PS3 fan has been told that the PS3 would not fully deliver on the promises made by Sony. This is true and that is now a public fact, also Sony is improving on the mistakes they have made which are good.

But I think the line is being crossed when Halo has obviously delivered on all promises and this level of hate is expected from this group of XBOX360 haters. So in a way you haters confirms that the 360 is worth it by the lengths you go through to stop it.

Then again what are you peoples true problem wit the 360. Some of you say you just want to prove to 360 owners that it is not all it is cracked up to be. But the console speaks for its self. I would not have to say one word and the truth would shine through.

Lets say you find the 360’s Achilles heel, then what? You will most differently not get a cookie or a medal or even a parade. So how about learning from your environment and enjoying the games for console.

Finally number do not lie, people do. Welcome to 3rd place. Hater.

P.S. I say the same to PS3 haters too.

Well if you disagree what do you dissagree with? Make your point strong and worth reading. IF not do not even bother to dissagree.

[Lumbo]

Oh poor bunny, so now you are the deciding factor when a "line is crossed"

Sorry, but who elected you to decide for all the rest when something "crossed the line"

Where have you been when the same crap was emptied over PS3 games, oh but i KNOW where you have been, you have been standing in the foremost place to fling crap. Like you always do.
So by clearly stating that i THINK Halo3 is a great game(i have no Xbox360, so i can't speak from a 1st hand point), i am a hater. Thats a novel approach to say the least.

Face the facts: YOU can't abide people saying ANYTHING however tiny "negative" against your holy cow of gaming, the X-Box 360. But at the same time you keep on putting hate and crap on the other Systems.
You are on the forefront of calling "fake, lie, BS" on any report not utterly positive on the X-box360, and after it has been approved by the devs them self you don't get back humbly on your error, NO you now blame other people for even bringing the issue up. Cause in your world, there should be a LAW against speaking even in the slightest critical about Microsoft or in this special case: Halo.

Need an example?
Original quote Thammer1: "when Halo has obviously delivered on all promises"
Bungie promise: "Halo3 will run at a steady 30fps minimum on 720p"
Microsoft Games promise "All games henceforward will required to be native 720 at least" (after the PGR 720p fake)
Bungie reality: "Halo runs at a steady 30fps on 640p, but but but actually this is good because we say so"

Why YES, completely and fully delivered. To quote your buddy TheMart: "overpromise, underdeliver, thats the Sony oops, Bungie style"

And when caught in the very act (after Microsoft grandly stated that all new games must be 720p at least to be aproved) of faking press "screenshots" while running the game at a 20% lower pixelcount they answer like "oh, but you wouldn't see it anyways"

??? Why produce FAKE native 720p press screenshots when we wouldn't see the difference anyways? THATS the question here. Either there is no difference, then the press "actual real ingame screenshots" at a higher resolution would have been pointless, or there is a obvious difference, then the fakes make a lot of sense.

Keep on spinning it, no matter what you do, its final, Halo3 at 30fps and 640p contrary to the promised 720p.

As said before, this does not make Halo3 a less great game, gameplay wise and i have NEVER so far called Halo3 crappy or bad, quite the contrary. Neither does it change anything on the $20 Million marketing overkill. But it shows that the self proclaimed "unbiased" fans like yourself still put 2 sets of measures on your scales. One, the harsh and unforgiving one on anything Sony related, and the ignoring and under the rug swiping one on anything Microsoft related.

Hypocrite much ?

I think so.

PS: i don't click on disagree out of principle, only when i actually disagree with someones comment. Thats what the system is for, if you can't stand that, don't let the door hit you in your back on the way out. PPS: i didn't click on disagree YET.

[THAMMER1]

Hypocrite much?

Takes one to know one. Were you this vocal when Sony was obviously trying to fool the public? Halo 3 is still a great game. It is not my Holy Cow. If you notice I have really stopped bashing the PS3 for weeks. I feel like if some gamers choose to be charity cases that is fine with me.

The PS3 is still a good console but it really has not lived up to the hype yet. What I am addressing is that fact the core PS3 fan base is full exhausting it resources to stop the 360. The reasons why are painfully obvious. Hey if I pissed you off so be it.

Halo 3 is my fovorite game...yes. Is that wrong or should I change my mind for your sake? Like I said Haters hate and player play. Number do not lie people do.

Halo 3 even at 640p out shines most all PS3 games. Is that a fact or opinon. I would say both. Lable me as you please.

[techie]

Lumbo you are coming up with Gold. The research and wit is spot on.

[kngri]

This site have some serious graphics whores, sony boys you got to get a grip and accept the fact that halo is pwning every thing your beloved machine owns. Stop trying to bring down a game that is a AAA already, oh yes i forgot you don't Know what that means, you don't have any. If graphics are so important to you sing out and go play your crappy good looking games lair and HS. I can believe sony boys dare to call yourself gamer shame on you, real gamer play games no matter on what side their from.

[calderra]

1- Halo pwns.
2- Nobody here has any clue whatsoever Bungie is talking about in this article. And nobody here wants to bother trying to figure it out, either. Why bother?
3- Purple banana ding-ding-ding. And that's more facts than you'll read in all the previous comments put together.

[wageslave]

"2- Nobody here has any clue whatsoever Bungie is talking about in this article. And nobody here wants to bother trying to figure it out, either. Why bother?"

Exactly. The fact remains the game looks as good as any game ever written. Dont take my word for it. Go read the reviews;

9.5/10 -average- from Editorially neutral reviewers.

http://www.metacritic.com/g...

What did Famitsu say? 10/9/9/9 or 37/40

The game is rated one of the best of all time, sold 2+ Million copies.

It is transparent the purpose of people in this forum in hysterics about Halo 3's graphics, but are they missing the real bottom line?

Yes. The Game is great. And no amount of sour grapes from them will can change that, and it _eats_ them up inside.

[ps1h1ch]

I love the game, like the game and been playing the game since it came out... I really don't care what did they do or how did they do it if the game is good.

PS: How strange that "Nasim" haven't spoken yet.

[7ero H3LL]

my favorite vehicle is the choper and the mongoose, (personal opinion) i am not going to get a ps3 yet until i see my favorite games on a different console.

[guerojose]

So this guy's explanation is that (1) Well it's not really 640p, it's more complicated than that; (2) Only an obsessed fanboy would even care.

First of all, remember this was the much-ballyhooed AAA title that had the unlimited budget, and was going to show once and for all the technical prowess of the 360. The mandate went out that it must run in 1080p, to fully demonstrate the system's potential (and justify the "me-too" HDMI redesign). He talks like this is the first game in history to use more than a single frame buffer, and tries to make the resolution numbers sound complicated. All spin aside, the inescapable fact is that the 360 cannot support games at higher resolutions with acceptable performance.

And I love this one: "In fact, if you do a comparison shot between the native 1152x640 image and the scaled 1280x720, it’s practically impossible to discern the difference." Well, DUH! Do these people even understand resolution, or upscaling, to begin with? Gee, an image upscaled to a slightly higher resolution looks the same - amazing! Of course, the real comparison is 1152x640 versus NON-UPSCALED 1920x1080. I guarantee that even the most loyal xbot would see a big difference. Then he goes on the offensive and insults anyone that would call them out on their obvious attempt to conceal having fallen far short of 1080p.

Based on many of the comments here, though, these spin tactics are somewhat successful on weaker minds.

[tk]

1) No - upscaling is not perfect - no matter how you spin it. If it is 640p, it will never be 1080p - or even 720p.
2) Seems like the XB360 is struggling with high native resolutions... it may show more obvious as this gen progresses.
3) Does it matter? Seems like it does not at the moment. It seems like the 640p saved them and got the frame rate where they wanted - with the lighting. So - even while this is interesting from a technical point of view - it is a moot point. Techies will point at the facts... and will be right. The XB360 is struggling to push the polygons at the HD def. The EDRAM does not what the hype promised. The scaler is not the secret weapon it was suggested to be. And still.. the clever techniques of the devs got around it and presented to the gamers what is acceptable to them. So - well done Bungie... you worked around the limitations, and presented a best selling product. Yes the tech heads will point out the flaws if you can call it that. What I call it is creative devs working around the limitations of the platform and still present a great game for those who like the franchise. Well done.

For the reviewers hyping all kinds of nonsense and giving it 10/10 - you twits. You ruined your reputation. It did not need your dishonesty to sell millions. You just allowed yourselves to be used and ruined your integrity.

Once again - well done Bungie. You rock.
(from a PS3 supporter who don't like XB360 or Halo)

[tee_bag242]

The reason your getting jaggies is because of the resolotion. If your lcd (or set) runs natively at 720p and the game does.. not worries because its pixel for pixel. Since halo 3 is running in a non-default resolution and stretching up to fix 720p it is causing the pixels to stretch.. Hence your jaggies.

Additionally the game has low anti-asiasing aswell.

Yeah Halo 3 is pretty sh#t too. Yes iv played it. Yes its the same as Halo 2... and Halo 1. WHAT the Hell did you some of you's expect anyway. ITS ONLY HALO ANYWAY!!!

Is xbox running out of steam ? A little bit ay boys!?
But respect still - The people that really liked Halo are loving life.
Meanwhile the no brainers who were sucked in and told they like it by the brainwash. Wake the F%ck up!

[SnakeCL]

The game actually has no anti-aliasing.

[DFresh]

Bad sign for MS.
This is their most anticipated game and they give us this low quality graphics for a AAA title.
Bungie you messed up bad because right now
Sony is just going to have edge on you with Ratchet & Clank Future, MGS4, Killzone 2, etc.
I'm sorry MS but I think this is going to make you lose to Sony this holiday season.
Not to mention with the 40gb bundle console coming out for $400 for Sony that will eat up Xbox 360 sales.
You better have Gears of War 2 if you're going to compete against Sony.
Yes, I'm a Sony fan but I have respect for all of the consoles capabilities they just need to deliver.

[DFresh]

PS3 is the best console available started off slow but is a lot bigger now.
I don't know if you have noticed the only games that have ever looked better for the 360 were EA Sports Games. Hello...Peter Moore owns EA games and he's the CEO of MS so it makes sense why he would make the PS3 games look bad.
Multi-platform games are now better on the PS3 now.
ex.) GRAW 2, Virtua Fighter 5, Elder Scrolls Oblivion, etc.
People are so negative about the PS3 because they can't admit it's better than anything they own.
MS had a 1 year head start on Sony which is the only reason why it's better in game physics and now things have changed.
Your Sony killer game has failed and Killzone 2 shall officially kill the Xbots forever.
MS is lazy.
You're actually going to tell me that a $70 billion dollar company can't fix those 360 problems?
Money shouldn't be the last thing you think about when making quality hardware think of the product first the money comes second.

By the end of the console war this will be the Champions.
1. Sony
2. Nintendo
3. MS
Sorry fan boys just stating the obvious of what's really happening.

[Violater]

My only problem with the whole debacle, is the games advertised output resolutions.
Which by the developers own confirmation is blatant misrepresentation of the fact and utter disregard for their consumers.

[gnothe1]

I know you guys are loving this, but the fact remains, until the PS3 can put out a game that looks better than the 360's best looking game an run ports the same or better than the 360, then you guys really need to get it together!! the 360 still has the highest bar set graphically. the Ps3 has YET to match!! an please dont say that developers dont know the system, because its a proven fact that EA an ubi has had dev kits since late 2004!!

Ps3 is stronger an better right!! well how come game built on a weaker system struggle to run decent on the more powerful system. games built for the 360 cant seem to run quite as good on the Ps3. but you can take a game built for the PS3 an make it run the same or better on the 360, now you figure that one out!! name 1 game that was built on the PS3 then ported to the 360 that runs like crap, but theres a ton that was built on the 360 that was ported or still trying to be ported to the PS3 that dont look as good or run as good.

[Ju]

Graw2 runs better on PS3 - better visuals
Dirt runs better on PS3 - steady frame rate
...

...and I don't need to mention Heavenly Sword, and even Lair (wouldn't they have screwed up the gameplay so badly - but where is a native 1080p game on the 360 which runs a steady 30fps?), btw, Ninja Gaiden 1080p@60Hz and future titles like Ratchet or Uncharted. And I also think Haze blows the socks out of Halo, visually and gameplay (because that's the closest the PS3 will have to Halo). CoD will be interesting to see, and UT3 is the first back port from PS3 to 360 (and in case Haze comes to 360, that, too).

I still believe the current multi platform engines do not really take advantage of the CELL as of yet (and even some first gen engines don't (didn't) so far, e.g. Resistance. They increased the performance of that engine about 4x since its launch last year). I give the companies one more year to move more and more code to the spu to optimize for the cell. I think we will see a significant performance increase by that time. None the less, the examples above show, that what the devs know now, can match to the latest "next gen" available.

[tee_bag242]

"PS3 is the best console available started off slow but is a lot bigger now.
I don't know if you have noticed the only games that have ever looked better for the 360 were EA Sports Games. Hello...Peter Moore owns EA games and he's the CEO of MS so it makes sense why he would make the PS3 games look bad.
Multi-platform games are now better on the PS3 now.
ex.) GRAW 2, Virtua Fighter 5, Elder Scrolls Oblivion, etc.
People are so negative about the PS3 because they can't admit it's better than anything they own.
MS had a 1 year head start on Sony which is the only reason why it's better in game physics and now things have changed.
Your Sony killer game has failed and Killzone 2 shall officially kill the Xbots forever.
MS is lazy.
You're actually going to tell me that a $70 billion dollar company can't fix those 360 problems?
Money shouldn't be the last thing you think about when making quality hardware think of the product first the money comes second.

By the end of the console war this will be the Champions.
1. Sony
2. Nintendo
3. MS
Sorry fan boys just stating the obvious of what's really happening."

Good points about the EA thing there. All true except 360 wont die. It just wont really grow too much more. Saw that sh#*&t coming a mile away but it doesnt really bother anyone that owns a 360. I have a ps3 and am still playing xbox 1 titles too + 7000plus emulated games from every other console and coin-opon its HDD.
The disappointing thing with the xbox was that it didnt have a big commercial lifespan. History looks similar with 360. They are too grabby and bring sh$t out quick to get hold of market share. Microsoft are good at this. Their business stratergies dont require Immidiate dividends.

[Meus Renaissance]

I don't think this matters to the game, but perhaps more so to the console or the developers. In other words, why didn't they push the system more considering the budget and expertise they had working on the flagship title?

Could the visuals have been better? Could Halo 3 have been even better?

Irrelevant, the game is great, people love it, everyone is playing it so this isnt really a concern although TechBuffs will take advantage of this to criticise the 360 as a hardware. And I find it hypocritical how some 360 fans were saying this isn't true - this is just FUD, and now its confirmed, they're defending it like it's nothing.

People need to get their perspective in order. Halo 3, clearly, was not intended to be a showcase for the 360, Gears has taken that role and so there can be no question of what the machine is capable of, especially when we've seen much better visuals in other games.

Peace

[wageslave]

Is there any corporate relationship between n4g and Kotaku?

[ChickeyCantor]

>_<

"This is their most anticipated game and they give us this low quality graphics for a AAA title.
"
READ what it says dude, they reduced the amount of pixels so it was possible to render better lightning, thats not LOWER QUALITY its just a smaller resolution>_<

i really don't get why this is soo upsetting?
The game looks good and there is no reason to bash the game because its running on a different resolution!

>_< this stupidity is prove you guys whine about BS.

[chrisin3]

I hear it, and I understand the motives behind it: Gears looks better than Halo; therefore, the xbox is capable of stellar graphics even if their flagship title is less than stunning graphically. Okay well, some people are omitting the main difference between Halo and Gears: Halo has bigger environments, along with more things going on the screen at one time.

Well, most gamers know it's hard to keep a steady framerate and high resolution while having a very large amount of things going on at once--it eats up resources. This is the very reason halo's resolution and graphics (though they're good) suffer. IF you made Halo with "less," you could achieve better graphics. The developers chose one over the other, and for halo, that's probably a good thing.

Even though I am sort of defending halo, I am not defending the Xbox. With all the hype over the Xbox’s hardware abilities, and arguments saying its hardware is better than the PS3s, I would think that halo should be able to achieve stunning graphics, lighting, framerate, and a large amount of things happening on the screen, all at a high HD resolution. Unfortunately, it has not achieved this.

This whole thing draws an interesting comparison to resistance: Insomiac's launch title had large amounts of things going on at one time, "good" graphics, a very steady framerate, all at 720p native. Here lies my main point: With a smaller budget, less developer support, brand new hardware, and obvious deadlines, a launch title achieved these things. What exactly do you think the PS3 has in store for us?

Sidenote: there are more things to games than graphics (this I know), but this is my way to draw a graphical comparison between halo, gears, and the (very near) potential of the PS3.

And also, since we're talking graphics, if you actually play heavenly sword (regardless of length), you cannot help but be impressed by the graphics and technical acheivements of the game. I see more great things to come . . .

[tee_bag242]

"People need to get their perspective in order. Halo 3, clearly, was not intended to be a showcase for the 360, Gears has taken that role and so there can be no question of what the machine is capable of, especially when we've seen much better visuals in other games. "

REQUOTE "was not intended to be a showcase for the 360"

This is not that important really.. but have you had your head up your arse? You couldn't be futher from the truth. It clearly was intended to be a showcase for the 360 but it didnt live up to the hype (SURPRISE SURPRISE)

[Ju]

You know, I could really care less - wouldn't it be the most over hyped game ever and I have to go thru 50-80% Halo3 news per day! That is quite an achievement. Yes, I think the visuals look amazing - and the scaler does a real good job for a low res game at 640p. But that's it.

I mean, this game gets 10/10 thru out the reviews. WTH? I have to admit, I have never played Halo, and I probably never will. Not after what I've seen so far. I think the visuals are the best of the game. I saw that opening scene. WTF is this? Running thru a jungle and just mowing every guy? Were is the strategy in that level? Where is the cover system? Where are the team commands?

That is the latest in next gen? Visually and game play wise? Deserves a 10/10? I peg to differ. I don't say its not a great game, it probably is. But not the holy grail, nor the definition where games should be heading.

Would that not be Halo or M$ or Bungie, that game would get an 8 max. Really. WTF. Are you guys all on the payroll or what? (Millions of flys can't be wrong. Eat Sh.t. Right?)

[SaMiR111]

jaaa i dont care i have halo 3 and have good graphics and its amazing FPS.... the multiplayer coool i have HDTV sharp 32 aquos and looks amazing.

halo 3 the best

[Jdoki]

Having just completed the solo campaign I'm thinking maybe this was just the best Bungie could do. Maybe another developer might have managed to squeeze more performance out of the 360. Just because Bungie have Microsoft's money doesn't mean they have the talent in every area of development.

Halo 3 is a fantastic FPS in terms of solid gamplay, near perfect controls and a great overall experience. Then throw in multiplayer and you DO get something special... but I don't think they have the same skill in terms of squeezing a higher level of performance from the hardware (or story telling for that matter).

If this is what Bungie needed to do to get the fantastic lighting, framerate and physics in the game, then I have no problems with it at all.

[DGDJB]

i don't really care about the nativelty res. just the freaking 2 black line on the side of my 60" bravia when i play co-op is real pissing. i paid for my tv and console and i expect to get everything out of it.

[Kwertie]

Given it's only 80 pixels, but it means upscaling regardless. I'd be pretty pissed off if I bought a console touted for it's HD gaming only to be short changed like that on one of the most hyped releases for it ever.

[u got owned]

the graphics in Halo 3 are awesome theonly thing thats bothers me is the jaggies, i think bungie should realese a patch to take care of this problem, but then since im not a developer i dont know if that would be posible. resolution doesnt bothers me its looks as good as GOW resolution wise.

[Anego Montoya FTMFW]

all of my 360 friends, have told me that HALO3 only does 6 on 6.

they haven`t been in a 16 player match yet.

and when they try, it kicks 4 out.

thats NOT good.

640p and 6 on 6 for the win. LOL.

[u got owned]

thats probably because theres not tooo many people playing big team battle. i think...

[Anego Montoya FTMFW]

possibly.

still thou, you should be able to JUMP or CREATE a 16 player match WHENEVER, don`t you agree?

[u got owned]

you can always get some friends and play a 8 vs 8 costum game... ; )

[SnakeCL]

Should be noted that by Bungie's definition of using two frame buffers, Killzone 2's use of multiple framebuffers and passes would have it being somewhere around a 2880p game.

[anh_duong]

can we just all get along.

[Xbox is the BEST]

Disappointed in the graphics Bungie. The gameplay is top notch but those jaggies. That $25 million bonus that you guys got from Microsoft use it to make a patch and patch the whole damn game. It did not look like the announcement trailer that you guys promised will be gameplay. Maybe you guys should start working for Sony.

[godofthunder10]

if sony fanboys was smart enough to read the whole damn articl they would have read that it's really 1280 because Halo 3 uses not one, but two frame buffers – both of which render at 1152x640 pixels. to top it off they said that Making this decision simpler still is the fact that the 360 scales the
“almost-720p” image effortlessly all the way up to 1080p if you so desire. so stop trying to discredit the 360 with your lies and stop listen to sonny and their lies.

[TriggerHappy]

And Killzone uses a similar method - but this time Killzone 2 uses 4 frame buffers - therefore an aggregate of 2880p. Do you think we can say Killzone will now run in 2880p? No, and neither can you say Halo3 is 1080p. Surprisingly, a lot of us have brains.

[Foliage]

Now that is what I call putting someone in their place.

[godofthunder10]

all the fanboys like the two of you are so damn brainwashed by sony.
the truth is that sony fanboys are so damn jealouse that they can't see straight.
the truth is that most game programers said that two systems are really equal in power,the only ones that claims the ps3 is more powerful is son,brain washed sony fanboys,and people that has money invested in it.so far about 90% of the games that's on both systems looks,and play better on the 360 and they recomend people buy the 360 version if they have both systems.
if halo was on the ps3 all the sony deadheads will be saying how great the game is and people must buy iy.when oblivion first came out on the 360 all the sony deadheads was saying that the game sux,it's over rated,and they wouldn't wast their money on it,but when it came out on the ps3 then all of a sudden they started saying how good the game is and people must buy it and they say that for every game.hell they are even saying that halo is the last game that is seller and they have nothin else,well i could name all kind of great games that's coming out this year and next year but they will say that they sux unless it's on a ps3 then it's great.
but what i realy like to know is how all of the brain wash sony dead heads feel after what the writers for game magazines in china said when i was watching the tgs on g4 when they asked them why is it that the 360 can't sale in japan with the games that's on it.their answer was that the japanese people are proud of their country and the companies in it so they buy from them so it can help their economy out and they just refuse to buy foriegn products especialy from the U.S.well if i was them i'll feel ashamed stupid doing the opposite,instead of doing like the japanese do the sony deadheads buy from a japan company and help their economy out and hope that an american company fails.i bet the japanese are laughing all the way to the bank at people that buy the ps3 saying how stupid they are and they don't have any pride for their country like the japanese do.
well i don't have to be ashamed because i buy american when i can to help the U.S economy out like the japanese people do.
years ago when they came out with the slogan buy american and american made they said that if people don't start supporting american companies and buy american products that the U.S wouldn't be the riches country in the world,well it came true now japan is thaks to people like sony dead heads that buy their products and hope that companies from the U.S fail.it is just going to get worse for the U.S because people like then don't give a damn,hell they own about a quarter of the U.S because people keep buying their stuff and it allows them to buy other buisnees.
this is the truth and i just put you in your place.by the way please get some help to get your head out of sonys a** so you could think for yourself instead of beliving sonys lies and repeating them before it's to late you retard.

[guerojose]

Dude, c'mon. Don't be silly. Granted, not everyone knows everything about frame buffers, resolution, and upscaling. But those who don't know, usually have the common sense to keep quiet. No, the resolution is not 1280p. It's 640p, like Bungie said.

The way some of you are carrying on, it's like you've never heard of the concept of frame-buffering before, and that Bungie has invented some awesome new technology. But I guess that was their point: throw a smoke screen out there with a lame "explanation", and hope nobody notices. It seems to be working, somewhat.

Notice how they only came up with this excuse AFTER they called called out on it? I guess they were hoping no one would find out, at least for a good long time. Lame.

[Unknown]

Too many fan boys come on here with their emotions. Dude its just games. Who comes on this site and post on every thread about how they diss like the console and crap? I mean I see it from both camps. I check on here 3 times a day for good stories because I KNOW that we have some emotional cry babies on here that don't know how to give good comments or constructive comments on a given topic. I'm learing to develop games and I can tell ya..it ain't easy. Please have some sort of respect for even the crappiest games because its not like developer go out to create "crap" on purpose. I'm not saying HALO 3 is crap. I'm not saying that its not over hyped. H3ll I haven't even played it because of freaking RROD. But you know what? I STILL love my 360 and what MS has done with it. Do I bash on PS3? No I SHOW RESPECT FOR IT because the SONY camp is doing stuff that MS should do and vice versa. I like the way some of the games look on PS3. I post that because I'm not afraid to be real like that. But it seems as though posting rational statements gets your bubbles taken away. If someone was to go through all my posts, they would see that I RARELY make a crazy statement about a competitor's console. Yet I get bubbles taken away. Its a shake that babies on this site have to ask for more bubbles on this site to post more nonesense. I thought babies cried for bottles not bubbles.

[gnothe1]

whats a shame is the way fanboys are attacking all things Halo!! so what if the games runs at 640, it still looks great!! an you wanna know 1 more thing!! even at 640 Halo 3 still looks better than RFOM.so what do you sony boys have to say about that. tell me RFOM looks better than Halo 3 an everyone would call you for the blind fanboy you are!!

[IBLEEDBLU]

i just got back from futureshop where as soon as u walk in it was halo3 planet from game to xboxhalo3 360 with a huge 46" samsung display with halo on it...and let me tell u - the game LOOKS! brutal...i couldnt believe the jaggs on that game...how any1 could say the graphics are a 10/10 is beyond me - and it was connected by hdmi as i checked...the game looks like a$$. if this is what u xbots are praising then lol then its confirmed that at least 2million ppl in the word are retarded...

640p - jagged game - its honestly as bad as forza2 -

i still cant believe how bad this so called "beast of a game" is - WHOA!

anyways go 2 ur futureshop 2 see if for urself - im sure its like that everywhere as MS must be paying them 2 do that set-up

WHOA i still cant believe it

[JokesOnYou]

sonykids swear Halo3 looks terrible

360 fans swear it looks great

tech specs are important because they indicate a consoles potential to render and run all these amazing games we see today on screen

just as we have seen over and over this gen, sony camp hits you with all of their tech data, hype and parade's about how amazing their games WILL BE(in the future) yet the end result 360, 360 dev's and 360 games continue to impress by doing great things with what they have, Bungie made adjustments, rework the resolution and in the end made the game look beautiful, or they could have settled for the normal limits made it 720p without the absolute best lighting= Bungie made the right choice

sony dev's have all this potential in their hands with hardware that's suppose to do more(tech data) although I think the GPU will always be the "weakness" of the ps3 still sony only dev's always throw out big talk of the only possible with the cell, 22g of space, 300 sq. miles of sky, 10g of sound, native 1080p etc but the end result turns out like: meh, weak gameplay, weak controls, weak game design, no online or a few maps for a only online game, problems with trying to get online, its too repetitive, takes up lots of space but short game length, so much hype but why does all those big sony exclusives games seem so normal after 1 hr of play= THESE ARE BIG HITS ON THE GAME NOT SOMETHING YOU NEED A MAGNIFIER TO SEE, THEY EFFECT THE CORE GAME ITSELF AND IN SOME CASES MAKES IT BARELY ENJOYABLE TO PLAY(controls), but, but, but BUT HOLD ON ITs NATIVE 1080p, = wtf? OK, I'm impressed with your spec's resume sonykids thats great but come on don't you wish they would have fixed some of the glaring problems first or just tweaked the game so it would have more lasting appeal,

SONYKIDS FAIL AGAIN BECAUSE THEY ALWAYS MISS THE BIG PICTURE, they will tell you about spec data until you swear your loyalty to the sdf, but they conveniently dont want to face the reality= Halo3 at 640p its the best game available, for that matter what does sony have NOW better than Gears, Bioshock, and many multiplats that look better on 360 unless you wait 6 mo or a 1 yr?= ITS ABOUT THE GAMES=

THE TRUTH IS MY WEAPON THIS WAS A HEADSHOT

JOY

vvvvv a sonykid says Halo3 looks terrible= refer to my headline again, oh well I'm sure sonykids will never understand, so go ahead and rant off some more tech spec's of whats possible only on the ps3 *blank look on my face*

[artman]

well, there is a personal taste on the part you are talking about, some people like pop some people like rock, and other prefer r&b.
some like 3D fighting games, but I prefer 2D fighting games.

You may say that xbox & 360 games are better for you, but it doesn't mean the same for others, personally I prefer japanese games, and looking forward to play korean games, maybe bcoz I'm asian that's why... it just suited for our culture.

you may prefer violence games, but maybe we prefer more cartoonic with blood and a little bit of echi there.

but we are all excited about performance and graphic for sure, that's what we are expecting from a new nextgen console isn't it?

I bought xbox because the graphic are better than ps2, I bought 360 bcoz it's the earliest next gen console you can get, then I get ps3 its bcoz another nextgen console with more offers than 360.

The only thing is I haven't got any HDTV yet in my house, I'm waiting for OLED TV to sell later.

then you call it a choice. just enjoy the ride.
this is gonna be interesting after those PS3 promising game come out next year. I'm looking forward to it too.

[tee_bag242]

You dont really know what your taking about do you?

If your playing 640p and its upscaling to 720p it LOOKS CRAP!!! Just like stretching a 800x600 wallpaper onto your 1024x768 desktop
That where the jaggies that everyone is complaining about is coming from. And tight ass anti-aliasing.

All i can say is. DONT CRY GUYS, ITS ONLY HALO! haha
at 640p! Haha Maybe they accidently released the beta

[caffman]

If you have a PS3 and no 360 and no intention of getting one then why are you even reading this you droid twat? I love the game, I've got it running on my 1080p 42' toshiba and it looks great. If you are that concerned about res then you really have to much time on your hands. I know that HS only lasts 6 hours but do you really have to trawl the 360 news after completing it for the 4th time? Come back when you have a 360 or don't come back at all, cause you just look like fanboy pieces of crap

[Unknown]

you might want to be careful when talking about an alleged AAA SONY title or you might way up the next morning with 2 bubbles because these sheep(rabid fans) around here get to emotional. I totally agree, if the game is so horrible then why even take the time to dicpher it? Its like deep down inside you REALLY wish you had this game and you have to down it to make yourselves feel better. And for all you idiots who think that MS has shown all their cards are ignorant. They are way too smart for this. Mark my words...if you thought HALO 3 was the end and that KZ2 is YOUR claim to victory, then you got a $hit plate coming from MS real soon in the coming months. Remember, you heard it here first!

[athlon770]

Caffman...
I happen to own both the PS3 and a 360 (well two actually, purchased a prem in Nov of 06, and sold that to my stepson and just acquired a Elite 360). And I firmly belive that untill you have BOTH systems, you should not make one comment towards the unit you do not own!

With that being said, having both the PS3 and the 360 connected to a 52" JVC lCos display, I will tell you that the game is very nice looking but has jaggies. Get over yourself. And the jaggies are what this whole controversy was started over. The jaggies were so bad that some enterprising person decided to do the math and found that the advertised res of the game is not what is being displayed. This is not a PS3 is better than Xbox discussion, this is a "I spent $60.00 on a game that I feel I did not get my money's worth". Halo is the game which can be completed in 6hrs, not HS. If you played either, you would know this! And HS was ripped apart because its single player only lasted 10hrs! Halo on the other hand gets praised and awarded 9/10 and 10/10 scores. There is WAY too much hype around this game and the reviewers even got suckered into it. This is a 8.5/10 game at best, yet the reviewers gave it high marks for what? Original game play...NO, best in graphics...NO, gameplay in general...YES, multiplayer originality...MAYBE, sound...NO. The "truth" is, this is not the spectacular game the hype and MS/Bungie promised it would be. Do I feel cheated...Hell Yes! Do I still enjoy the game...Hell Yes!

Unknown...
Consider your words marked, you are out on the limb saying that MS will feed me a pile of $hit. You said it.

"Mark my words...if you thought HALO 3 was the end and that KZ2 is YOUR claim to victory, then you got a $hit plate coming from MS real soon in the coming months. Remember, you heard it here first!"

There, I even quoted you so you can't change your wording... :) Of course trying to get me to eat any of the $hit MS dishes out may prove to be something you will not be able to handle!

And when you say "you heard it here first!", are you talking about GOW2, or maybe Mass Effect? Yes, I hope those will be good/great games, but I didn't hear it from you first so I guess not. Yes both systems have great games coming out for them, sorry to say the PS3 does have more "high title" game coming out. And yes, if a game is released for both (multiplatform) I will be getting the 360 version over the PS3 version, not because it will be better on the 360, but because of the achievements...I am a achievement whore! The unfortunate thing is it has been my experiance that except for EA, anything created for both systems have been identical or in some cases better on the PS3. Not bashing here, and I will leave it up to your own resources to browse the wonderful web for a site that will show you side by side screenshots of mutliple games, but when a brand new system, fresh out of the gate, is already equal to or better than the other system which has multiple years...well, that should tell you something right there now shouldn't it?

[artman]

1mpx digital camera and 3mpx digital camera, then you gonna see the differences, or try 12mpx with 18mpx. you gonna see a huge differences.

[elitesupreme]

for those of you who don't have an HDTV that's +50" 1080p, let me say that 720p and 1080i upscaled to 1080p sucks. it washes out the sharpness and blurs everything over. I've seen it with Gears on my EliteX360 and with some of my other games for my PS3.

I did a side-by-side comparison with Gears running on a 22" LCD vs. my 56" HDTV, and it was much sharper on the LCD. anybody who says that it's not that big of a difference is blind or playing on a small, non-1080p HDTV.

btw, I AM getting Halo3 this weekend, used, only because i have friends who play it, and they pretty much ditched Gears.

[skynidas]

640p wtf that is a piece of sh1t

[d3l33t]

no joke