Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD Confusing Many

Blu-ray or HD-DVD?

The head-to-head battle that brings back memories of VHS vs. Betamax has played out for a year come November, so one would think the king of the next generation disc format might soon be crowned.

Blu-ray and HD-DVD formats target consumers who have high-definition television systems, and want to watch movies and other video content with the highest possible quality.

Toshiba and Microsoft head the field behind the HD-DVD format, while Sony, Pioneer and Dell are among the players pushing the Blu-ray format, which is a feature of Sony's PlayStation 3 game console.

[TriggerHappy]

Completely agree with this article, consumers summer from the constant wars been those two companies (Sony and Toshiba).

The average consumer only cares about getting the best that there is out there. They aren't so much into the specs. Having BD an HD DVD is confusing most consumers as well. Just hope this war wears out quickly.

[cuco33]

the consumer IS confused. hells even a lot of the tech savy AVS guys can get mixed up with facts and rumors

combined both formats are a blip in over all sales radar. and of this blip it's practically even (1.5:1 in favor of BD which is embarassing considering that there is 10x the players over HD DVD). the average consumer looks at 1 thing, price. and that is in favor of HD DVD (which only helps that the cheap China HD DVD players are confirmed for xmas). BD with it's unfinished specs, the fact you can get most BD only films via imports for HD DVD, cheaper player prices for HD DVD, etc only screams out that HD DVD is going to have a good holiday season

sadly i don't think it's the same for BD

[jujunogo]

once people are forced to buy digital tvs which mostly consist of hdtvs exept a few acceptions,in 2009 by fcc because the U.S. is switching from analog to digital 08 will be a critical year for both formats for consumers who make the switch to a digital tv AND WITH PS3'S with most of the blu ray players and the giant ps3 line up of o8 (mgs4,killzone2,ffxlll,gt4,and a established home) bluray should be the winner with the proposed ps3 price drop of 08......NOT A FANBOY I OWN A 360 AND A PS3!!!

[Rooftrellen]

I hope you do realize that most people who will be buying HD DVD/bluray in 2009 (and I've said for a while, that is when the war will end) will not be buying a gaming console. It will be a standalone bluray player or a standalong HD DVD player, not a 360 with HD DVD add on or PS3.

In fact, that's why its quite likely HD DVD will win, then. When people upgrade their old analog TVs to digital, most likely snagging an HD TV, the salesperson is going to say "how would you like to watch movies in HD too? We have our players right over here." HD DVD will likely be cheaper, and the person will buy that. If bluray is cheaper at that time, it will win.

It's all about cost in 2 years, most likely. Neither format is going anywhere until then.

Edit:

@1.3 I would agree, people won't sacrifice quality for price, within reason, but we're comparing HD DVD and bluray, so we're comparing equal quality (some say HD DVD has better quality, but I don't personally believe it), and it will come down totally to price, in that situation.

[Foliage]

I doubt people who are going to jump into the expensive High-Def era are going to sacrifice quality for the cheaper version. All the money invested into a High-Def television, and you think that the person is going to buy the obvious inferior product to save a few dollars?

Not likely.

[RadientFlux]

I think Blu-Ray is going to win, but won't replace DVD. Instead will end up like Laser Disc.

[Cosmo]

I don't think so, I think as people start buying there big 1080p TV, they want the best the best home theater experience, so they pick up the Blu-ray player. The quality difference is sensational,you do definitely notice it.

But although Blu-ray vs HD-DVD is being fought in the states, here in Australia there is no war. Its blu-ray only, good luck finding a disk HD-DVD little alone a player.

[Master of Menace]

Yep. You are so right. Hardly anyone is selling HD-DVD at retail. The Ezy-DVD shop sells twice as many HD-DVD titles than Blu-ray, only because it's about the only shop that sells them. Target, Big W, Harvey Norman, JB Hi-Fi etc are only selling Blu-ray.

[Kholinar]

I think you're right. These players may be marginalized. A lot of people are just getting replacements for their VHS collections. I really doubt a lot are going to start again willingly on HD formats. That's not to say that the formats couldn't be successful, they just may not replace DVD any more than SACD or Dolby discs replaced cds. (In spite of the number of people with surround sound systems.)

"The quality difference is sensational, you do definitely notice it."

This was also true of laserdiscs.

Everyone wants to think this is going to be quick. Even if these formats succeed completely, I really doubt it.

[PS360WII]

I think DVD will be the winner. I believe the only reason the next gen of movie watching came out was because how cheap DVD's are now getting at retailers. When DVD's first came out they charged 30 bucks and sometimes more. Now new releases are 15 and even some of the older ones are 5-10 dollars. Then there is the medium average 20 dollar price. Why back that product when you can make a new format and charge the 30-40 dollar premium once again?

Either way it'll be another year or two before HD-DVD and Blueray choose which one steps aside but untill then we might as well stand back and enjoy the show.

[M1am1U]

I agree with the article. I don't think people are necessarily confused, but I do think they are very hesitant to buy into a format that isn't the clear cut winner. As long as studios keep jumping ship and changing their format allegiance, most people will do just like PS360WII said and keep buying DVD.

[Kholinar]

I'm going to have to disagree.

The largest population with 80-90 percent of the disposable income is baby boomers. These are the same people who can't set their vcr clocks.

They're not confused, they're lost completely. This will surely be an impediment to adoption.

[Master of Menace]

The fact is this. Wether or not people go for Blu-ray or HD-DVD, PS3's are going to continue to sell. Mark my words, they are going to sell in large numbers. And more and more people will have Blu-ray players. Now these people may or may not utilize the format. But this is a numbers game. The more players that are out there, the more chances people have of using them. Toshiba seems to be missing one vital point. If HD-DVD stand alone players are outselling Blu-ray players 7 to 1, and PS3 means nothing. Who the hell are buying Blu-ray Movies?

[Bolts]

The problem for HD DVD is the people who typically buy bottom price players are impluse buyers. While thats all fine and good, the format war usually scare off these buyers until they know for sure there are movies to watch them with.

Blu-ray on the other hand have a running start of more hardcore supporters who will continue to gobble up any content avialable for their favorite format. This is why Blu-ray is selling so well.

[Scrooge]

I read an article that said 90% of all Blu-ray discs were being played on PS3's. If that's the case, would the movie production companies really base their investments on a demograph that consists almost entirely of video-gamers? Probably not, this war is far from over.

[GnaM]

Fvck the format wars. I don't care.

[Capt CHAOS]

by just getting superbit and it's cheap. As for these format wars, I don't care and will stick to DVD for a long, long time..

[MK_Red]

Well, my biggest problem right now is Paramount's move. I had made up my mind to go with Blu but how can I live without HD Face Off (I've been waiting for this one for ages) and Transformers?

[freediro87]

Because people who work mainly at circuit city and best buy are poorly trained or just dont care, or are fanboys!
in the time i have worked at my job 6 months we have had 10 HD-DVD players but only 3 sold, then we got an order in of 20 (400$) blu-ray players that sold in 3 weeks, no joke not a fanboy of the wars but its true. plus blu-ray has won in Japan, Australia, Europe, and will soon take over in America/Canada, especially onc everyone gets their 1080p tv's they'll want the most out of their tv and thats blu-ray!

[sticky doja]

I even have a few buddies who are relativly tech savy that say things like "I heard only blu ray can show true HD picture" and things like that.

I wish we never had this war, all tech companies should ban together to come up one cingular format, instead of competing to push their own.

[cloud360]

HD-DVD confusing....
many becuase its called....
HD-DVD when bouth are HD-DVD.....

[Torch]

is the most accurate thing I've read about the format wars yet.

Many of us within these threads are able to distinguish the two formats. But try to have an decent conversation about the subject with one of your non-tech-savvy friends/family members/associates.

Chances are they'll reply with a blank, dumbfounded stare.

Other than we gamers, early adopters, pioneers, or those who have a vested interest in it, most everyone either doesn't care - or isn't even aware - that the two formats even exist.

I can't count how many times I've walked into a Blockbuster, and upon asking an employee about the status of their Blu-ray movies, they either have no idea what I'm talking about, or appear very confused about the subject. I've even been told on more than one occasion, that Blu-ray will never be available in Blockbuster Canada because they are "losing the war." It's a very awkward feeling to be compelled to tell the misguided Blockbuster employee that, contrary to their beliefs, their very own parent company (Blockbuster USA) has decided to carry Blu-ray exclusively.

And this is typical of what I continuously experience when walking into a Best Buy/Future Shop/Wal-mart: When asking about the location of their (ever-moving) Blu-ray section, they respond to the likes of, "yeah, I THINK we have some stuff over there, somewhere." (obscurely pointing in the general direction of the DVD's.)

The end-result of the format wars matter to 'us', and 'we' know it exists. But, as it currently stands, the mass market (which has the most critical influence) either hasn't a clue or simply doesn't care. Remember that the HD camps are trying to create a demand for products that physically appear identical to the current (only recently fully-accepted) DVD standard. The obvious advantages of HD mediums over DVD, are not nearly as cut-and-dry as DVD compared to VHS for the average lay person. And this is further complicated by TWO mediums fighting for market share, where as DVD really had no contenders.

I have a very good friend who is currently employed by Disney, and who is contributing to their Blu-ray campagn. When asking about their opinion about Blu-ray and the so-called format wars, they were quite blunt by responding that for Disney, Blu-ray sales are nothing but lucrative gravy; that it's not something that's going to make-or-break the company. They even went on by admitting that he/she personally has difficulty in justifying the perceived superiority that Blu-ray has over standard DVD. (I personally beg to differ.)

What Master of Menace said earlier was spot-on. If there IS on thing that will put an end to (or at least heavily influence) this annoying format war, it's going to be the PS3. Although there's currently no evidence to prove that PS3 sales are going to surpass it's predecessor, there is absolutely no doubt that at least tens upon tens of MILLIONS of unit will be sold. And each unit sold, is no less than one full-fledged Blu-ray player that's brought into the household. In the very near future, consumers won't even be able to find a television that isn't of HD.

And from what I gather, people ain't gonna stop watching movies any time soon:

"Hey look!...Lil' Johnny's PS3 is already attached to our TV set! You mean all we have to do is pop in one of dems HD Blu-ray movies, and that's all there is to it???...OK, I'm sold!"

Let's just hope it happens sooner than later, because I want to rent my Blu-ray movies NOW!

[Master of Menace]

There has never been a truer word spoken. I just hope little Johnny remembers to set his PS3 to a higher definition. Standard definition is a default setting. And remember, DVD's also use to be stuck in a remote corner of the store before the were recognized!

[pilotpistolpete]

Both formats are very confusing. BUt I think froma tech savvy point, you can sum it up as

Hd-dvd: better software
BR: Better hardware.

I like the better hardware, since software is something that can change with time, while hardware, your "stuck" witht he technology you have.

I'm with torch about the store thing. I'd expect as much from Wal-MArt, but when Futureshop or bestbuy are all pushing their expensive HD tv and will try to see you the most expensive system, and all the HD disks are tucked away in a corner. I guess since they probably make less money per disk that reg. dvd, they don't bother adversiting since they don't make as much $.

[Master_Mind]

HD-DVD has been HD 1.0,1.1 and 2.0 complient since the start...All of sonys bluray players including the ps3 are not..so all early adopters and PS3 owners are in for a surprise come 2008 .....Look it up and see...
http://www.thebitbag.com/in...

[athlon770]

Master_Mind, it is exactly your type of posts which fuel the ignorance between the two formats! You are pulling quotes from a website that pulls quotes from BLOGS! Get real! The hardware is not going to change for support of newer revisions, please, it is what the people in the know call a wonderful little thing...Firmware Upgrade! Learn that phrase if you will please. BOTH hd-dvd and bd players come with a ethernet jack so you can connect them to your home network for system updates. Spreading wrong information trying to support "your" side is just throwing confusion to the masses.

HD-DVD has one thing going for it, and one thing only, it doesn't use JAVA for its menus so it is easier to set up for the distributors! BD is the better format! Get over the fact that Sony came up with it!

[Frankenberg]

This format war has brought the cost of a player from $1000 to $250 in one year. If we only had blue-ray, then I am sure it would still be $800. Competition is good for all. I just picked up the HD-DVD add on for the 360 because my prediction is that both formats will tie, kinda like DVD+R & DVD-R.

[pilotpistolpete]

I have a noob question:

Since the ps3 can play both br and dvd, would it enventually be possible on a pure software point of view for the ps3 to support HD-dvd ( i beleive the usual dvd red laser is used for hd-dvd). That would be nice to have as an update later down the road. ( yes i know its unlikely since Sony would rather sell their souls that support hd-dvd)

[malingenie]

It requires different hardware to read different angles of the laser. I wish the world was simpler.

[Ugly American]

We have both a PS3 and the HD-DVD add-on for the 360.

We were at Best Buy last night:

She knew WHERE the HD section of movies was.
She still had no idea what Blu-Ray or HD-DVD was and that doesn't even start to get into the differences.
And she is still learning about 720p vs 1080p vs 1080i.
She just wants to pretty TV.

So there is somebody who has the technology in their own home, and they still don't understand it. Go figure.

[Master_Mind]

Including the PS3 player..That one is the also not 1.1 complient..And there isnt a complient player going to be out for almost a year..Dennon will be releasing one in about a year as it got pushed back.. HD-DVD's HDI software owrks Much better than BD-J..In fact its being talked about as being hard to program for , hmm seems like sony like to make things hard on them selves..And to the above comment by TORCH..What are all these people including the PS3 owners going to do when they find out that later BD movies wont play on there makeines cuzz hte HDware cant play them anymore...Thats when class action suites will hit sony hard for again doing what they do best..LIES LIES and more lies sonys best trait...I dont know why people still think sony is what they were back when they made the walkman..Its a good thing sony doesnt make cars cuzz they would give japanese cars a bad name too...
http://www.thebitbag.com/in...

[IRONMAN_357X]

yea exactly, move to the future ppl, BLURAY is next gen

ABOVE ME
Its a rip because you cant afford one, blu ray gives better quality, extra features and 25GB's right, so wtf are you on

[Gondee]

There have been very few movies if not none that have whent over in to dual layer Bd or surpassed the HD-DVD data limit. calm down. you cant realy tell a diffrence. so shut it

[Rooftrellen]

DVD

smaller, much better quality, very very little loss of data over time, ability for extra features

VHS

larger, quality dependant on multiple factors but generally much worse, loss of data over time, no ability for extra features

Now compare this to bluray or HD DVD. They're the same size as DVDs, so there is no benefit in storage. Quality is better, but its not near the upgrade you saw from VHS to DVD. DVD's last long enough that we can easily say they don't lose data, so that's not a factor. We could add in more extra features with the extra space, but its getting to the point of so much space it doesn't matter.

HD DVD or bluray, neither one can stand up to why DVD overcame VHS. But, in the end, the only way you can full overcome the old format is if you stop supporting it. If VHS players were still plentyful, and you could go to the store and find any movie on VHS, most people would actually still have them, and I would be among those people, no doubt.

The biggest change will come when one studio stops making DVDs, because that's the only way either format can fully win over DVD in the near future (5 years or so).

[NextGen24Gamer]

"Other speakers at the conference emphasized the format's "ever growing list of worldwide supporters," its affordability, its lead in stand-alone player sales, and its higher attach rates, (4 discs per player, 7 times that of BD).

"The HD format is about stand-alone players, not game systems. We don’t think gamers will buy movies," said HD DVD Promo Group co-chairman Ken Graffeo."

So while in the format wars infancy....The ps3 has given the illusion that Blu ray is going to win. While in the short term it bas boosted Blu ray movie sales slightly above HD dvd total movie sales....In all actuality HD dvd stand alones are selling 3 to 1 over Blu ray stand alones and more importantly the attatch rate is much higher for HD dvd than Blu ray. 7 times more.

This Christmas when you can walk into Walmart and buy HD dvd players for under 200 dollars and pick up movies from Warner, Paramount, Universal, and Dreamworks.....Movies like Transformers and Shrek 3...the two biggest movies of the summer....WOW...thats when you will see HD dvd take off. While the Ps3 helps blu ray sales.....it can't carry blu ray. There would need to be over 100 million ps3's sold for it to make any difference in the format war. Anything less than that will not matter in the long run.

And to be honest....the ps3 can't sell over 100 million unless it can drop the price one day to under 199. And by that time....will we already have a format winner? Interesting indeed.

http://hddvd.highdefdigest....

[Master of Menace]

HD-DVD has higher attach rates, more stand alone units are being sold. 4 times this, 7 times that. Toshiba says PS3 is not part of the picture. Shouldn't HD-DVD sales be overtaking Blu-ray? It's not happening. So either the figures are wrong, or PS3 gamers are buying Blu-ray movies. You choose. And Shrek 3? I'm enjoying the great range of Disney titles. And yes, I own a PS3.

[NextGen24Gamer]

I'm not saying it. I'm quoting from the link I provided. I assume that they are including the ps3's sold in the attatch ratio. Which is why HD dvd's attatch ratio is 7 times that of blu ray. It makes the point that Standalones are the only true way to judge a format war...not game consoles. People buy standalone players with the sole purpose but to buy movies....with the ps3....its not the case...it just blu ray a temporary impression of winning. Stand alones have always been the deciding factor....Not movie studio support...not video game consoles....Stand alone players. People just aren't buying blu ray stand alone players. Thats not good if Sony wants blu ray to win. Not good at all.

[Master of Menace]

Why buy a Blu-ray stand alone player when you can buy a PS3. Same quality, cheaper price, games machine, etc etc. Quite a lot of people are buying PS3 in favour of a stand alone unit. You can't discount it. And DVD sales did'nt catch fire until the PS2 came along. And this temporary lead has been going for a year now. What makes you think it's temporary?

[NextGen24Gamer]

Would that have undermined Microsoft?

It would have served its purpose and given developers more disc space as they claim thats the reason for blu ray in the ps3.

It would have been the logical advancement over the xbox 360....

Instead of dvd it uses the successor HD dvd....WOW....

Believe it or not...its blu ray that turns many people off in regards to the ps3. Sure its the selling point for a small amount of next gen gamers....But to many...including myself....it was a turn off. I still bought the ps3...but I was a little bitter that I was forced to support blu ray simply because I wanted to buy a video game console.

Different strokes for different folks....But, if the ps3 would have chosen HD dvd instead....WOW....I think it would have a better image than it does now...and I think the sales would be greater...Consumer confidence in sony formats are very very low....I'm not talking about sony die hards...I'm talking about every day consumers...they remember the previous format wars that Sony lost....

[PS360WII]

If you think about it HD-DVD has a better chance of winning the average consumer due to it's name. It has dvd right there in it so they know what it is/does. You say Blueray and you can easily get a blank stare. Most people are starting to figure out what HD means due to those large TV's in most retail stores now. So they can make the connection to HD-DVD as a dvd that is hd where as Blueray just means a ray that is blue to the average customer who doesn't know jack.

Anyway regardless if Blueray ends up not becoming the next format it'll still be used for PS3 games.

[NextGen24Gamer]

The price of the Ps3 at its cheapest is 500 dollars. Casual consumers who watch movies and don't play games.....WILL NOT buy a ps3 just for movies. PERIOD. Its not rocket science. (thats why its temporary...and it hasn't been a year buddy). HD dvd and blu ray movie sales account for 1% of total movie sales so far....It hasn't caught on fire yet.....at 200 and under....IT WILL)

Will the ps3 ever cost under 200 dollars? NO

When will casual movie consumers be able to pick up a player for under 200?

Well HD dvd players will be at and below 200 this christmas....compare that to the entry level ps3 at 500 to 600....

Can you see more clearly now? If not....I can't help you.

[Master of Menace]

With an attach rate 7 times that of Blu-ray, shouldn't HD-DVD already be overtaking sales? And people are still buying PS3's, more and more people have Blu-ray players in the home. Sorry, I really can't see HD-DVD going anywhere! Ps.. I think you will find they don't include PS3 in those figures.

[NextGen24Gamer]

How old are you? Because its common sense stuff here buddy.

For every stand alone HD dvd player...there are 4 movies sold.

For every Ps3 and stand alone blu ray player sold.....there is less than 1 movie sold. Not even ONE movie sold.

Understand yet?

Ps3's will never be bought by casual consumers for the sole purpose of watching blu ray movies. Its just too expensive for MOST movie watchers.... Under 200 is the sweet spot for most consumers who watch movies at home. Thats where HD dvd has the clear advantage and the main reason Paramount switched over to HD dvd exclusive.

HD dvd and blu ray movie sales combined only make up 1% of the movies sold. DVD is dominating by a gigantic margin.....That won't change until the price of a stand alone is under 200.

The ps3 will never be under 200.

Is the picture clear to you now? The problem is you have been tricked by SONY. You fell for it buddy. Blu ray wasn't needed and was forced onto unsuspecting customers....but in the end it won't matter. WHY? Because "no casual movie watchers" will buy a ps3 for the sole purpose of watching movies....

A matter of fact....the ps3 at most will only sell 30 to 40 million total when its all said and done.

Compare that to billions of stand alone dvd players thats been sold to date.

Is the picture more clear for you now? If not. I can't help you my friend.

[mikeslemonade]

HD-DVD has the name which is all it has going for. PS3 is the succesor of the PS2 how can it be that confusing?

[freediro87]

seriously, your obviously a huge fanboy, and from all your comments you obviously only and have a very small idea about anything your trying to talk about.

its people like you who truelly confuse people.

[NextGen24Gamer]

Its obvious huh? LOL

I own every console buddy. I have over 160 HD dvd titles and over 65 blu ray titles.

Its obvious to you because my opinion obvoiously differs from your tunnel vision opinion right?

My opinion is based off of me owning both formats and mostly common sense.

Video game consoles will not dictate who the format winner will be buddy.

It never has. Sure it helps boost them a tad...but there needs to be 500 million to 1 billion stand alones on the market for a format to prevail.

The ps3 will never even get over 50 million sold at the price range its set in.

200 and under is the sweet spot for electronics whether you like it or not. I'm sorry if that goes against you believing that the Ps3 will make a difference in the end. It won't buddy. It only makes a difference NOW. Prior to the 200 dollar sweet spot coming this holiday.

That is why Paramount switched buddy. WHY? Because they knew what was going to happen once the stand alones were priced at under 200.

I'm sorry if any of the facts I say offends your belief in your Ps3. But I personally could care less which formats wins. I own both. But I do have an opinion based on owning both. Where does your opinion stem from? Hmmmmmmmmm...

Fanboyism.....lol

[freediro87]

Paramount switched because they got payed off, BUDDY! they wanted to cash a paycheck and its was for 150 million, blu-ray players will be down to 200 area by this holiday season! blu-rays has already won in Japan and Australia, has most control in Europe, and is leading in America!

why did Paramount switch because they got bought!
what will happen if Universal gets bought? what are you gonna say then oh now blu-ray players are cheap so they decided to switch over.

please, the ps3 will go down in price over the years, and it was smart of Sony to include blu-ray, very smart!

by the way i own all systems also! buddy

[XLiveGamer]

SINCE WEN????????????

This its going to be a long war and HD-DVD its going to be the winner.
PS3 its the lowest Blu Ray Player in price out there and its not selling well PS3 FAN BOYZ Accept it!
PERIOD! PS3 ITS GOING TO THE DEATH CHAMBER THIS XMAS!!!

BIOSHOCK, HALO3, CALL OF DUTY 4, MASS EFFECT, EA SKATE, MADDEN, LOST ODYSSEY, BLUE DRAGON, ASSASINS CREED, TOO HUMAN, ORANGE BOX, EA Medal of Honor Airborne, EA PRO STREET, ETERNAL SONATA etc... NEW XboxElite (Falcon) out there for XMAS
OMG !!!
I CANT HAVE THEM ALL AT THE SAME TIME!!!!!
SO MANY GAMES FOR XMAS!!!!! AAAHHHH

so... SONY its depending on PS3 in this format war...

I Have a console for Videogaming I have a HD-DVD for Movies
Thank God Microsoft put the external HD-DVD for consumer option thats why $450-$300 pricepoint

PS3 $600-$500 <<<<< JA JA JA JA JA JA JA JA

[TruthBTold]

It's dumb fanboy comments...hahahhaa

[athlon770]

XLiveGamer, a larger fanboy there has not been! The listing of the games was a nice touch, not relavant to the discussion though. Nice pricing, I guess you were making a evaluation between the xbox with the hd-dvd expansion and the PS3...that argument has been made before, and lost, the PS3 was cheaper than the xbox with the hd attachment, oh and the xbox does not support "true" 1080 untill you get the elite with the HDMI output, oh and the xbox does not support "true" hd sound, just the 5.1 dolby. Whatever, enough with the consoles!

Hardware to hardware, both the hd and the bd players use a blue laser at the same frequency - 405nm, the main difference is the bd disks hold much more data...bd = 25GB (single-layer)/50GB (dual-layer)and hd = 15GB (single-layer)/30GB (dual-layer). Any true hd guru, will know that a full length movie in hd will push the 24gig level. HD is already running out of space.

Then there is the data transfer rate, HD hits a wall at 35.66mbps, while the bd players jump to 54mbps. What this means to you is when you are watching that hd movie with your standalone hd player, the hardware is already compressing that audio and video stream while the bd players will just keep dishing it out.

Codecs, well BOTH hd and bd players support the same audo and video codecs, sorry to burst anyones bubble there!

BD is the better choice, but as Elitegamer keeps pounding into the ground, the hd players will be cheaper come Christmas and there will be alot of people be swayed by that simple fact.

[jackdoe]

Sad that so many goddamned console fanboys are involved in this! I honestly only want Blu-Ray to win because I own a PS3. But that doesn't mean that I think HD-DVD is crap. Far from it. HD-DVD has its own plusses. Its got picture in picture which is a cool special feature. Let's face it. Both formats deliver the same picture quality so why worry. Enjoy your