Killzone 3 removes the 'lag' but keeps the 'weight'

"Much has been made of Killzone 3's controls and the removal of the notorious lag. Many gamers, myself included, were worried that the heavy, weighty feeling of the game were in danger by the removal of what some call "lag", but senior producer Steven Ter Heide says that we've got it wrong -- the lag and the weight are two separate issues, and while the former is eradicated, the latter remains."

[49erguy]

I hope everyone who bitches about the controls reads the last sentence of the article.

[Saint-Revlot]

Get bubbles.

[blitz0623]

Notorious lag in kz2? I thought it was fine, but if they got rid of it anyway then it's even better.

Edit: nvm I thought it was kz2, apparently it's kz3. Guess it's about the beta

[FlatulentGhost]

"Notorious lag in kz2?"

It was the final bit of lies the Xbox fans in the press were able to come up to try to smear the game.

They first tried to smear the game by editing Jack Tretton talking about Resistance over the original Killzone 2 E3 trailer so they could claim "Sony lies about Killzone 2!"

Then Sony showed off realtime Killzone 2 footage that surpassed the claimed 'impossible CGI level graphics"

So the smears switched to trying to claim that if the graphics are that amazing the actual games 'obviously' sucks. Then GG showed off amazing and unprecedented AI in the single player game.

So the smears switched to well then the online play must suck. And then the online beta started and people in were saying it was the best or one of the best fps games they ever played online.

Finally the Xbox fans in the press came up with the lies about the controls. It was something very easy to lie about since you can't just post a screenshot or something to easily refute the lie.

So after months of gamers raving about the online beta suddenly out of the blue its only some Xbox fans in the gaming press who find this supposed glaring 'lag'.

What a pathetic joke.

[Red_Orange_Juice]

the "weight" is like a Killzone's trademark, the fans love it

[The-Tentacle]

Well said.

Luckily the Xbox fans have been so pre-occupied defending Kinect that they forgot to start a smear campaign for KZ3.

People might give this one a fair chance now, which is great as it's easily gonna be one of the best shooters in 2011.

[BARF]

are you fucking kidding me???? xbox fans made this up??? yeah right. what a pathetic attempt to pass blame. xbox fans werent the ones not playing kz2 it was ps3 users. the fact that this moron above me agrees with you just shows how stupid you fanboys are.

i played kz2 from the start. kz2 had control lag for the first couple of weeks it was out. it was later patched. GG even admitted to it. if you choose to deny and ignore it, you are an idiot or a fanboy (most likely both).

@idiot below me
give the spin a rest. go check on youtube and you will see it. better yet ill give you a damn video http://www.youtube.com/watc...
the lag in the vid was later patched out. why would they patch it if nothing was wrong?
keep on trying to spin and blame 360 fanboys, but it wont work. i know arguing with a fanboy of your level wont work. the devs admitted it, but you wont. kinda pathetic, dont you think?

[FlatulentGhost]

BARF, give the lies a rest.

I was in the beta, played every night, read every Killzone forum.

Not a single mention of this lie about 'lag'. Ever.

It wasn't until after the game was released and some pathetic Xbox fanboy reviewer started the lie and all the Xbox fanboys and Call of Duty retards used to their kiddie/arcade fps games starting joining in because they got their asses handed to them by serious when they played Killzone 2 players.

[BARF]

this one even shows jumping lag
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

i can keep finding them for you, but im bored with this.

[nickjkl]

barf that video was released on February 6th 2009 one day after the demo released on February 5th 2009

killzone 2 wasn't released till
February 25, 2009 in Europe
February 26, 2009 in Australia
February 27, 2009 in the UK and US

also you can not find a single video on youtube showing input lag in the final release of killzone 2 their all from the demo that came out on the 5th

this is what i got from my research by the way unless you can disprove this by finding something thats from the final release of killzone 2 that doesnt have to do with the analog stick since that was fixed with the implementation of the high precission option in the main menu

[kraze07]

I have to agree with BARF. I've been a KZ fan since day one back on the PS2 and I'm pretty sure most of the complaining was coming from some of my fellow KZ fans.

[stevenhiggster]

Sorry but I'm a big fan of KZ2 and a current KZ3 beta participant and I'm afraid I agree with Barf. At the end of the day, GG wouldn't have patched it if there wasn't a problem!
The good thing is though, I can confirm the controls in KZ3 are pretty damn perfect in my opinion, still weighty but no lag whatsoever.

[Oner]

Digital Foundry shows the clearly evident input lag ~ http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

GG Dev themselves about it a while back ~ http://n4g.com/news/566566/...

And in THIS SPECIFIC ARTICLE we are all reading has Guerilla Games ADMITING Killzone 2 had input lag

Quote
by senior producer Steven Ter Heide ~

" "There still is some confusion about the ‘weighty’ feel and lag. Those two things are different. We removed the lag completely. This means that when you press a button or move a stick, things happen. This is instantaneous, as it should be.

***This was a problem with Killzone 2 that we in part remedied with a patch.***"

End Quote

Seriously what more f'ing proof do you need? The FACT is Killzone 2 had input lag. But people had mistaken that "lag" as weight, when they were 2 VERY different & separate things.

Anyone who is still stuck on saying it was all "Xbox fans" is 100% dead wrong and misinformed. Check my comment history for proof that I am not an "Xbox Fan", and I have been saying KZ2 had this problem since day 1 (and I can actually prove it via links here on N4G & the PS3 forums).

This issue was not about saying KZ2 sucked or whatever. It was to help IMPROVE the game to it's utmost ability in addition to all that it offered over it's competition. In order for a game to be the best & competitive it has to be accurate. ANY true gamer will agree.

Edit: The only additional thing GG could do to make this game hit the masses is allow custom button mapping. Other than that I am ready for KZ3 with my PS Move.

[120FPS]

Wow the cry babies are out in force today

[FlatulentGhost]

God I love it!

GG made fools of all the idiots like Oner babbling about 'teh lag' and they still don't know it! Hilarious!

After all the Xbox fanboys and Call of Duty retards who can't hit anything without massive amounts of auto-aim their kiddie fps have started crying their eyes out about 'teh controls' because they were getting destroyed by hardcore Killzone 2 players, they released a fake patch that did nothing to the controls.

All the idiots complaining suddenly started babbling about how it 'fixed' 'teh lag', no wait it fixed 'teh deadzone', no wait it fixed the input motion curve, and every other idiotic thing their lameass minds invented for sucking so hard in a hardcore fps.

Yeah retards, keep crying about 'teh lag'. Keep making fools of your sad little selves.

LOL! Oner keeps making a bigger and bigger fool of himself! This is fun to watch!

[Oner]

You really are an idiot. Probably the worst ever here on N4G...and that is saying a whole lot because there are MANY on here.

The proof is right there in their own words along with a visually verifiable reference from a strong valid source. Yet I am "the fool"? I really don't have much more to say other than this ~

Factually Verifiable Proof over biased & misinformed opinion wins every time. No matter what you say/think/believe to make yourself feel better...Grow Up.

Done.

[Dee_91]

lol the weight makes it so that you cant run around the entire map with akimbo shotguns shooting everybody

[ico92]

Im pro ps3 and all but theres no denying that the lag or weighty feel to KZ2 faced mixed reception, some reviewers even deducted points of KZ2 in reviews because of the Lag.

[Perjoss]

The fact they say that lag is removed is them practically admitting there were problems with KZ2 controls. I dont care which effect they are going for, they can call it 'weight' or whatever they like, lag is something that is NOT welcome in video game control methods.

Playstation enthisiasts will insist that KZ2 controls were perfect even though they had lag which I find hilarious.

[Immortal321]

nobody!

and what shoots like killzone
nobody!

and what looks like killzone
nobody!

and the band keeps playing on.

[Rekyyli]

36 agrees and counting.

Pretty much sums up the state of this site.

At this rate N4G will win the comedy site of the year -award very soon.

[radphil]

If people never complained, there wouldn't be improvements.

Though I have to agree that after playing the beta, they found the middle man in comparison to KZ2. Hated how in the 2nd one a simple pistol felt like 2 tons. The actual issue being was that they made every single weapon overweighted, and didn't balance that per gun.

This is the main problem though is that people complained about was the 'weight' system, which in some areas was legit.

[Terror_B]

So even a senior producer on KZ2 acknowledges that there was lag in the controls??? Mmmmm. What do you PS3 lames have to say about this now, i thought the whole lag thing was made up by xbox fans? You guys are truly the worst fans in the history of gaming, you're such liars its pathetic.

Please, could an intelligent PS3 and KZ2 owner now acknowledge that THERE WAS A PROBLEM WITH THE CONTROLS!!

[radphil]

"Please, could an intelligent PS3 and KZ2 owner now acknowledge that THERE WAS A PROBLEM WITH THE CONTROLS!!"

There was an issue, but it was people making a huge mountain out of a mole-hill.

They acted as if it was gamebreaking, in which it's not. It's an annoyance, yes, but not gamebreaking.

But please, don't start with the instigating.

[Perjoss]

I am not a fanboy, admittedly I use my 360 more than my ps3 but Uncharted 2 was still my GOTY for 09, and I think K2 controls were terrible, didnt even finish it. And thats even after the so called improved controls after that patch.

[ALFAxD_CENTAURO]

This are very old news.

Besides, people complaining about the controllers, are people without Skills and lazy to practice to master the controllers.

[BrianB]

if theres nothing wrong with KZ2's controls then why is it MW2 outsold KZ2 on the PS3 in a week despite the fact that KZ2 was released 9 months prior ?

face it you guys are hypocrites and you have the nerve, to call the lag a lie spun by 360 fanboys ? despite the fact that Guerilla Games admitted to putting lag in the game before and after its release ? they even released a patch, thats there way of saying "sorry we realised KZ2 has crappy controls hopefully this will fix it."

you guys are dellusional and you wonder why everyone calls you the worst fanboys

[Mr Tretton]

I think they've found the best middle ground they could, in the beta.

[raztad]

agree. There is some people b!tching tho. Hope GG stick to their vision.

[MarkyMarky]

This is what fallout new vegas should have looked like...

[Jack-Pyro]

Wow.....uh.....what a retarded comment....

[Genecalypse]

I understand the lag part but what is the "weight" hes refering

[RedDead]

I thought the weight was the lag...

[Graey]

the weight is more so the feel of the game...kinda relative to how they move...heavy armor slower moving type thing. I again would assume this is in relation to the guns as well.

Lag is more so when you press a button how long it takes to register on screen.

Some people didn't like the weight and confused that(i think) with the lag.

I played KZ2 single/multi. Personally I couldn't tell but then again I wasn't looking. I get my ass handed to me regardless of what FPS I'm playing...lol I just get all excited when I finally kill someone. I'm like 400/5 or however that works. I'm not all into the rankings and shit I just love shooting stuff. I'm what you would call a pawn or something. Though I can get serious with it, I just prefer to only do that when I can actually tweak the game to my specs.

I.e. for instance If I could make my own game rules. Hot Potato with pistols anyone...The potatoe is the bomb...10-20sec countdown...more so depending. You get a pistol so much ammo, and a knife. Say 5 lives or so.

[shovelface88]

I loved Killzone 2, played the hell out of it online, but if you honestly think that KZ2's controls weren't noticably slower and less responsive than most shooters, you must have been playing a different game. Even the developers are saying they want to "get rid of the lag".

Did it keep me from playing? No. Would I rather it be more responsive? Yeah, sure I would. It seems the developers are aiming to do that, I'm glad. :)

[Hideo_Kojima]

My pistol will have less weight than my rocket launcher than?

Meaning the pistol would accelerate faster when I turn it than my rocket launcher?

[felix88]

The realism argument is pathetic.

[XXXCouture]

well.. its more realism than other shooters

[rezzah]

Would you consider twitching around in a war realism?

I would....if you had shell shock. >.>

[dinkeldinkse]

LOL

[hellraiserpop]

The lag part they're talking about is the aiming in KZ2, where it took about a third of a second to move your gun around after pushing the analog stick. This will be pretty much removed in KZ3.

The weight part, i.e., the running, jumping, crouching, melee, etc will remain as it was in KZ2.

[mp1289]

didn't the weight part also have to do with the aiming? like you were also supposed to feel the weight of your weapon?

cause i thought the lag was just the part were you shoot someone and it takes half a second to hear the cool kill sound.

[Graey]

more with your statement. but i would add it on to Hellraiser. the weight of the gun I would think would also be their definition of lag when it was actually the weight. But the lag is when you actually push a button to shoot.

[hellraiserpop]

Well, if the lag on the guns was due to weight, then surely the pistols or other lighter weapons should have had much less "lag" than a rifle or the RPG? It was just lag, masked as weight.

[Bass_fisherman]

For i understand just put the gameplay more like KZ1 and im happy.

[Shikoro]

Killzone had some weight, too. And that's why I loved it. :)

[kraze07]

That's what I've been saying for a while now. And here I thought I was the only one who wants this to happen.

[M4ndat0ry_1nstall]

Killzone 3 removes the 'lag' but I will still keep my 'money'.

The weight in KZ2 (which feels more like lag in an online game) is what probably caused the 1.1 million people in Europe to cancel their pre-orders:

February 9, 2009
http://news.softpedia.com/n...

April 16, 2009
http://kotaku.com/5215424/k...

and the 38m+ PS3 owners to skip the game altogether.

Get it fixed GG or is the "weight" only their to stabilize performance, similar to how Mafia 2 had no grass and inferior cloth movement?

[mrv321]

Just like the 40 million Xbox owners who skipped alan wake? SWISH.

There's one thing I can't believe Alan Wake came out this year, man they came dissapeared quicker than Crackdown 2. Even GOTY awards arn't mentioning it.

Atleast you have other great looking exclusives to compete with Uncharted, Killzone, GT5, like erm... Final Fantasy 13 which couldn't even do HD.

[Yo Mama]

I tend to agree. I've often theorized to myself that the only reason GG refuses to change the heavy weighty feeling of KillZone is because they simply can't without sacrificing visual quality. If the characters moved as fast as other FPS's, it would probably be unplayable.

PS- I hate the 360. PS3 only, baby. So you can't say I'm biased.

[Garnett]

If you asked a ps fanboy about the lag in KZ2, they would claim there was none, but the developers are finally fixing it! good, will make the game even better.

[theunleashed64]

& yet you'll still find some way to bash & nitpick
the game like other 360 fanboys do.

[NecrumSlavery]

I never noticed any lag in the game when I played it first go. It wasn't until recently that I replayed it after hearing the bitching about lag, that I noticed it. The KZ3 beta is awesome. I like the feel. If you play COD/HALO/UNREAL a lot, it take you a minute to adjust to KZ3. You move quickly but you don't flail around wildly. Nothing knocking other games, I just like KZ's unique feel.

[Panthers]

There was no lag in KZ2. They are talking about the aiming in KZ2 and the large dead zone that caused a "lag" from when you would turn the analog to the time it actually translated in movement on the screen.

Not the type of lag you are thinking of that happens in Halo all the time.

[gillri]

glasd they kept the wieght, that is why I love FPS's with a pad

you get that sense of inertia and weight you dont get with a KB/M

[acky1]

loved the weight in kz2...

Guess the weight wont be there in kz3 if playing with move...still looks fun tho.

[hardcorehippiez]

but that wasnt a game breaker by any means. the killzone3 beta is much more responsive and you dont need to empty a whole clip now to get a kill. if gg keep the controls as it is now this game is going to be awesome.the graphics are much better , the sound is fantastic {not that the sound in killzone 2 was bad) and the whole thing just plays much more fluidly . i for one cant wait to see the whole game and whatever more surprises gg might put into it. this has the potential to be the defining fps for the ps3 . roll on release :}

[Malicious]

The only weight you have is when you crouch and jump. Everything else feels like a twitchy, CoD clone, run & gun shooter. I'll stick to Killzone 2 for multiplayer. I'm only renting Killzone 3 for the campaign.

[-MoOkS-]

I've got the beta, and yes, the aiming/movement does feel better than kz2. It takes me a game or 2 to get used to it after ive been playing cod, though. I still think it feels worse than bad companies aiming and weight.

[Shok]

Perfect, although I didn't mind the lag in the first place.

[Masterchef2007]

KZ3 will be an incredible game and will be better than its predecessor.

[bviperz]

I don't know, I guess I feel differently than most gamers. I play the game and enjoy it as is. I try to master each game with whatever the developer provides. Did KZ2 feel different from most other shooters? Yes, it took more time to aim your weapon. Did it take away from my experience? No. I think most people who complained are the same folks who complain are those who want their aim to be the same as if you were running around and pointing at people with a stick. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy gaming that way too because I learn to adjust in every game instead of crying about it. The one thing I do dislike in any shooter is help with aiming. I can deal with any controls but hate auto aim/assist in any form.

[SuperbVillain]

sounds like recoil is coming back :)

[Paradise Lost]

I like the heavy feel of the weapons.

[Yo Mama]

I was a fan of KZ2. I played the MP immensely and have done just about all there is to do in it. Including placing in the top 3%.

But I will be renting KZ3 before buying it. I was not a fan of the weighty movement. To those who are saying "it's more realistic", I don't want realistic. I'm not really fighting a damn war against glowing eyed Helgast. I don't want to feel as if my character is running in molasses or that I'm so weighted down by body armor. I want an easy controllable game. And as much as some people hate to hear this, COD has become the standard in FPS's. It should control as good as that does. If KZ had the more popular and better controls, COD would have copied it, but it didn't. You don't see games coming out trying to have a heavy bogged down feel similar to KZ. And there's a reason. It sucks. IMO, KZ would be a lot more accessible to gamers and probably have more sales if it would stop trying to set itself apart from the most popular FPS series in the world and just concede that COD does it better and copies it.

[dinkeldinkse]

It plays nothing like COD. Turning the Killzone series into more like COD will just alienate real fans of the series and will quickly kill the franchise.

[koston3647]

its strange killzone 2 has been mentioned at least 5x more than killzone 3 in this comments section.
And being that this is a killzone 3 article thats a little strange.