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Classic Gameplay Or An Outdated Formula?

Halo: Reach is just around the corner, but Bungie's popular shooter has always been a polarizing franchise for gamers. Players either love it or hate it, and I'm guessing that disagreement comes down to the gameplay mechanics. Despite each iteration adding new weapons, modes, and abilities, the core of Halo has remained the same throughout the years: No iron sights, floaty physics, a two weapon limit, and a recharging shield.

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big_silky3685d ago

*Sigh*

Who wants popcorn? I've got lite and movie theatre butter?

FURY__UNLEASHED3685d ago

On topic: I don't love or hate Halo. I think it's OK. I like all the game variants but I don't like how it takes so many bullets to kill people. Nor do I like the rhythm of "Grenade-Shoot-Melee" ;.

I recognize it's a good game, I just don't personally like it too much.

MisterNiwa3685d ago

Add extra sugar, please. Can't stand it salty.

8-bit3685d ago

I like my Pop Corn salty and my Sour Patch Kids sour, then sweet

MerkinMax3685d ago

Throw me some Milk Duds

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Dance3685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

and im sure armour abilities are new to series

RememberThe3573685d ago

We always need innovation, it leads to progression. Halo is no different, but I think that the foundation is still strong. Maybe in their next game that will try some new things but Bungie is a dev that knows what they are doing. They are not going to be the ones to mess with a formula that is proven. This is their last Halo game and it is looking to be their best, I wouldn't expect them to make too many changes. But I don't expect improvements.

SOAD3685d ago

It's not a broken philosophy. It's important not to fuck with every little aspect of the game just for the sake of saying you've innovated.

Some things are best left the way they are. Bungie isn't making games to appease people who never liked Halo, nor should they have to do so because they have a large fanbase. Their games sell millions.

That being said, if you read my longer post below you will see that I believe Bungie has made major changes to the gameplay in each iteration of the game. It's just that these changes feel so good and seamless that others don't notice them from just watching the videos. You might watch a gameplay vid of Halo 2 and compare it to a vid of Halo 3 and not see much of a difference, but the way the games handle has changed. You have to play it to know it.

STICKzophrenic3685d ago

"That being said, if you read my longer post below you will see that I believe Bungie has made major changes to the gameplay in each iteration of the game. It's just that these changes feel so good and seamless that others don't notice them from just watching the videos. You might watch a gameplay vid of Halo 2 and compare it to a vid of Halo 3 and not see much of a difference, but the way the games handle has changed. You have to play it to know it."

My first Halo game was Halo 3. I liked it so much, I eventually went back and played Halo: CE and Halo 2. Obviously I don't have many options for playing Halo: CE MP, but Halo 2's MP felt different from Halo 3 to me. The differences weren't huge, but it was a challenge to adjust, especially since I didn't play much of Halo 2.

BISHOP-BRASIL3685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

Personally the first Halo were the best for me. Halo 2 was ok and Halo 3 never made me jump in, although I were prepared to do it when it launched. I never was a big fan of the MP part of it, I like tactical shooters better. So in a way I agree with SOAD, we don't always need or like change, I didn't liked the way it went for SP, story didn't evolved well as the second game got less focus on it, it felt like they were so preoccupied to get the MP right that SP didn't get all the attention and polish it deserved.

That said, the gameplay itself evolved in Halo franchise and for the good. It wasn't a question of fixing as it was of tuning it rightly.

But fixing, innovating and evolving are 3 different things... No game is perfect and all of them could use some of one or all of those 3.

There isn't much to fix in Halo, it's not a broken game or a flawed gem as many new IPs we've seen this gen that made great second comings (Assassin's Creed for example), everything feels right to the porpose of the game.

Halo evolves well in some departments as gameplay, MP lobby and customization. While, for me at least, not so great in others as graphics, storytelling and progression.

Innovation is the biggest grip with the game... Halo constantly adds new features (except maybe for ODST, which I didn't played so I can't tell, but I'll assume it's basically the same options you get from Halo 3 as it was an expansion) and don't really matter if they are original or not as they are still new to the series and the fan base... But they usually are all MP related. Guys like me, that evaluate the SP experience of most games a lot more than the MP simply won't find enough new stuff to get excited about, at least as far as Halo 3 went, Halo Reach I'll have to wait and see, those jetpacks look like a worthy new addition, I just hope they don't do a Killzone 2's Exo, as soon as I was starting to dominate and enjoy my exoskeleton, the mission ended. Present me the damn thing earlier in the game and give me the chance to use it in some more battles, they could even hide some to make it all more enjoyable (that I expect for both Killzone 3 and Reach).

EDIT: That's one too big wall of text! Sorry! LOL

CombatEvolving3685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

That's a pretty stupid saying. There is always room for improvement, you just need to keep the foundation of a game the same. Floaty physics, twitch shooting, energy shields, and two weapon limits are what make Halo the game it is, there is so much building you can do from that foundation though and Reach proves it.

SOAD3685d ago

Twitch shooting? That's a Call of Duty characteristic. Halo is not known for twitch shooting, which is basically when a single burst of fire can kill an opponent.

UnSelf3685d ago

neither

next article...

StanLee3685d ago

That sad thing is, Halo isn't polorizing. It has a huge following and fanboy detractors who are in the minority.

Unicron3685d ago

Couldn't the same be said of any popular, well selling series though?

mastiffchild3685d ago

True, Uni, true, but Stan is totally wrong if he thinks Halo fans are the majority and deluded if he thinks it gets any more grief than any other big franchise that sells well today. the reason it seems to get attacked more is the same reason GT5 gets unreasonable amounts of FUD and BS attacking it: both games are SYNONYMOUS with the platforms they come out on. This does mean any perceived failing is going to be amplified by opposing fanboys and as both sets of fans(GT and Halo) are so over defensive the thrill for fanboys winding them up is never ending.

Whatever, it's fact that gamers who aren't fans of Halo WAY,WAY outnumber those that are fans of the game and maybe it's partially this sense if Halo being much bigger than it actually is(maybe because it's VERY important for Xbox/360 as platforms this mindset gets fostered)that fuels much of the over sensitivity Halo fans show these days. Seriously, it's got to the point where you can't suggest anything isn't perfect about the series without being called a fanboy or abused and that, in itself, isn't healthy at all. It gives out the message that Halo fans will accept anything they're given by the developers without question-and that isn't really true.

I think the only real issue the series has is that it's success stops Bungie from pushing as hard with new ideas as they would with a smaller fanbase. There were a few great ideas in ODST, for example, but they seem to have been forgotten for Reach and were never fully investigated first time round either and the additions to the MP in the Reach beta weren't far reaching and, to me, meant the game felt pretty much the same as it ever did. Striking a balance between not wanting to stagnate and fear of alienating your big fanbase must be hard and my only real fear is that whoever takes over from Bungie(I forget who's doing it)gets caught between putting their own stamp on the game and being overly safe, copying everything from last time out and delivering nothing of real merit.

Halo is a unique franchise given it's position for MS consoles but people shouldn't be so touchy about talking about it-some of us DO have constructive thoughts and saying a game isn't perfect doesn't mean you hate it! Personally, I'm really hoping the SP grabs us this time round as far too much focus, since Live came about, has been on the online MP and the experiments in the SP have never been fully implemented and it's become a tad stale in this dept as a result(IMH, obviously). Whatever, it's going nowhere so there's little point hating on it or worrying that the haters will hurt it-open discussions about the game seem nigh on impossible these days.

CombatEvolving3685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

I love it when someone wants all games in a genre to be exactly the same.

Convas3685d ago

Both. Which is why Bungie said "Alright guys, time to put this to bed". They realize that there can only be so much Halo. What 343 needs to do now is sit back for a bit, and look at what they can do to take the Halo Series in a new direction. The story is there, they just need a massive overhaul. Something drastic.

That being said, Halo's gameplay is NOT broken in any way. So whilst it may be becoming outdated, it's not dysfunctional.

SOAD3685d ago

Outdated gameplay? The gameplay mechanics have been changing with each iteration of Halo. I know this to be true because last week a friend and I played a few matches of Halo 2 and realized how different it was from Halo 3. The physics have changed greatly. The area of effect for the grenades is completely different. The jump physics are different. The weapon layout is a lot more generous in Halo 2.

These changes combined make a big difference in how the gameplay feels.

And for the record, Bungie listens to their fans a good deal, so if the fans of Halo want something to change, Bungie does it to a degree.

In contrast, so many people I talk to about Killzone 2, outside of this website, have had problems with it. They don't like the controls. They think it's dated. They keep bringing up CoD. Guerrilla Games tried to make their game different than Halo and CoD but they got a lot of complaints. 2.5 million people bought Killzone. How many of them liked the controls? And how many complained? It's clear now that GG listened to the criticisms because they're changing the control physics a little.

Halo's gameplay isn't outdated because it's always changing. People who don't play Halo 3 now and have only played Halo CE or Halo 2 keep talking shit about Halo today, on this site. They don't like it when something that they don't like is popular. It affects them psychologically. So they try to downplay it by finding little negative things to say about it, like, "It looks like Power Rangers" or "It's the same game as Halo 2 and Halo 3" or "The graphics suck."

It's always the same complaints. Millions of people are happy with Halo. The few who complain about it aren't worth changing the entire game for because then the millions who are happy with it would be neglected.

deadreckoning6663685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

@SOAD- Bubbles. We need more 100% brutal honesty on this site. For the record, I LOVED Killzone 2's controls, but there is a general consensus in the industry that many people had problems with it. If these problems weren't legitimate, then GG wouldn't have taken the time to tweak them in KZ2 firmware updates AND KZ3.

"They don't like it when something that they don't like is popular. It affects them psychologically. So they try to downplay it by finding little negative things to say about it, like, "It looks like Power Rangers" or "It's the same game as Halo 2 and Halo 3" or "The graphics suck." "

EXACTLY! The majority of people on this site LOVE to frown on anything thats popular no matter how good many gamers believe it is. Like you said...millions of people are still playing Halo and they are happy with it. If you don't like Halo..thats perfectly fine, but why keep downplaying it over and over like a broken record?

Its a shame that the majority of people on this site are so incredibly immature that it hurts/offends them when something they don't like gains praise. This reminds of the constant Bayonetta bashing by GOW fanboys when it received so much critical acclaim. Its truly pathetic that they can't see that Halo and Killzone can coexist..just as Bayonetta and God of War can coexist.

APOFISBORICUA3685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

that 360 fanboys talk about KILLZONE 2 has outdated gameplay but yet for you each new Halo game has innovative gameplay. OHH THE IRONY.

Its just a two sided story. I dont see nothing negative in the Halo REACH gameplay. Its all you want from a HALO game if you are a HALO fan. The truth is that if you played every HALO game before REACH you are hardly going to find it different. Its a true classic and wining formula. That said some of us get tired of it. By no means it is a bad game but I find other games more apealing. I know its a matter of opinion but to me KILLZONE 2 for example is better, but that doesnt mean HALO SUCKS. As a gamer I enjoy both but Im not here comparing KILLZONE and REACH. Im here complaining just about the same formula Halo's being doing since the first.

A formula that other game without the HALO name on it would be punished for not enough innovation after all this years. The irony is 360 gamers complained for the gameplay of games they are not going to enjoy no matter how great they are. They complaint about KZ2, GOW3, Metal GEAR and others...yet for them HALO is the most innovative game series ever created. Try harder dudes... we gamers have tastes for all games not just the most hyped exclusive for each console.

PEACE AND GAMING!!

SOAD3685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

I'm not a fanboy, so your first mistake was beginning your incoherent post with that remark. Your post just goes downhill from there.

Why is it you try to sound so respectful in some posts but so aggressive in others? Your comment history is appalling.

APOFISBORICUA3685d ago (Edited 3685d ago )

I said 360 fanboys... why you included yourself? Hmm...interesting. Tell me what is so "incoherent" in my comment? what you dont understand? Its simple: Halo Reach a good game, gameplay the same since Halo, fanboys the same as always, their mind the same as always, Halo for them is the most innovative game the others just have outdated gameplay.

So whats wrong? Did my comment was dissrespectfull to any of those disagrees and for you? ... unless you are obviously a fanboy... that I believe you arent... am I wrong?

Ohh and the next time tell me in gaming languaje why you disagree, not just because you dont like my comment history or believe Im agressive.

PEACE AND GAMING

jdktech20103685d ago

I'm sorry, I don't seem to remember SOAD saying Halo was innovative but he did say they have tweaked the gameplay enough to where it's quite different throughout each iteration.

Me thinks you put words in his mouth (or I didn't read well enough) but I'm going with the first option.

NO FPS is innovative at this point. It's either COD style, KZ style or Halo style....though Bulletstorm does look cool and flat out fun. By the way, I'm a 360 gamer but I could play those games you mentioned and have played GOW3 (working on others...college takes some income out of ya) because I own both. Yay for gross generalizations that are pointless.

ukilnme3685d ago

Your words are 100% accurate SOAD. You too deadreckoning666. Bubble to you both.

mastiffchild3685d ago

I'd say that Halo did what KZ3 SHOULD do-it's stuck, basically, to it's original guns. Sure the gameplay has been tweaked a little between iterations but I'd still say that on the SP side of things every experiment they tried they failed to implement fully and I think that might be for fear of messing up what they already have and as most people play it for the MP I think they should have been a little braver in the campaigns, no? They could then be using the SP to try things out for future MP while pleasing people along the way by breathing new life not only into their own series but FPS in general. I think that's one of the duties of really big, influential franchises like Halo and also the way for them to remain relevant long after the initial method of success has waned(not saying we're there yet, mind!).

Anyway, about KZ-GG shouldn't listen to the people who complained about the controls AT ALL. Why? Because these were not the same people who loved them in the Beta and would have formed the basis of a big fanbase in the future. No, these were people who basically didn't want to learn anything new and would be off the minute the next COD landed anyway. If anything the beta controls were weightier than the final build so why were there so few issues with what I still consider the best run beta on console this generation? Where were the moaners then? Playing COD4 at a guess and trying to copy COD will only end up with GG losing all KZ's ID, flavour and what made it unique-just how they managed to kill the MP with THAT patch last time round and it seems they think going after the same kind of thing this time will work and it just won't.

They need to make their own game and not worry about anyone else because playing COD at it's own successful game only ends up with KZ3 looking generic and losing as a series. Sure, there's room for COD, Halo and Killzone but only as long as they feel and play differently and I fear GG don't understand this and are playing to the wrong crowd, one that doesn't really care if Killzone3 is great because they will only ever be using it to fill the wait between CODs. I just think that minor tweaks which work for both Halo and COD(shooter fans are very conservative which is why such minor changes are the norm for games like Halo and big changes seen as a massive risk)should have been GG's aim rather than what, seems to me,they're doing in trying to be TOO COD. The weight and heft of the weapons SUITED the oppressive atmosphere of the KZ games, having a longer learning curve was great and another thing making the game more unique but now they're going for things which suit another series rather than theirs. A series that already HAS the big fanbase that sees no reason to move long term-and giving them what might amount to, in their eyes, a bare imitation of the game they're already fans of won't cut any ice.

Who would fans rather watch:The Beatles or the Bootleg Beatles? Exactly. However, what was wrong with Killzone trying to be the Stones instead? Room for both as long as they aren't the same, no? Anyway, good posts SOAD, even if I'd have liked the changes to Halo to be slightly more pronounced myself your point is still fair and lucid. Are we actually having an open discussion involving Halo without the knives coming out!

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