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Hiphopgamer VS The PC…Again

Torrence Davis of The Bitbag writes, "The one year argument continues as HHG, Jay Michaels and myself debate PC gaming."

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-Alpha3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

HHG's LOLgical arguments were not convincing and all he ever seems to do is flamboyantly over-exaggerate everything he talks about whether it's PC gaming being dead, Bayonetta being a great game, ModNation Racers being better than Mario Kart, etc.

His claim "PC gaming is dead" because of consoles is a fabrication. Developers may see more money in consoles, but PC gaming is far from dead.

Some of his weak (but main) arguments included the fact that you need to upgrade every year to get the best out of the PC graphics (even though the minimum settings look better than console games anyway and even though it's completely optional to get the best out of your PC). He also said you couldn't get games like God of War 3 on the PC. Apparently, that's his evidence of the PC not having great exclusives-- listing obvious console exclusives. I posted a link of a ton of games for the PC in 2009 alone which already matched the 360 for that year, a console. Apparently, PC gaming didn't have games like God of War, and that must mean the platform is inferior.

He never touches on the many benefits of the PC like cheaper games, mods and customization, superior graphics, etc

The funny thing with console gaming is that they always fight with each other and never dare mess with PC gaming because PC gaming has always been superior.

XBL is said to be the best online service, but Steam trumps it.
PS3 is said to have the best graphics, but PC trumps it.

That's why when anybody claims anything on consoles they make damn sure that they are talking about only consoles as if the PC doesn't exist. PS3 has the best CONSOLE Graphics, for example. Even though it's true, there seems to be a manipulation of facts for console fans to boost their own system. Console gamers don't care about PCs until they are needed to benefit console gamers: for example it's impossible to claim a game is a console exclusive if it's on PC.

Apparently, console graphics king can exist but not console exclusivity. I'm not a PC gamer, but the PC is far from dead, but it's often ignored by console gamers who are too busy trying to protect their console from the other console in their console wars.

Now sure, there are some benefits of console gaming over PC gaming (split screen local play, exclusives, etc) and vice versa but they are all very much alive and very much competing with each other.

I think developers have turned console gaming into such a tool: DLC, paying to play online, add-ons, hiding content only to release it for a price. You don't have this on PC gaming, though people like IW are trying to get it started.

@NotSoSilentBob

For $299 I can't, and I know that PC gaming is expensive, but (If I'm not mistaken) it's much easier and cheaper for people to build gaming PC's these days. I'm not completely in touch with PC gaming to be honest. I know that the appeal of console gaming is high, but that doesn't mean PC Gaming is dead. That was my main argument-- a rebuttal to HHG. Though it may be much easier to just pick up a console, many people have a great understanding of PC gaming and a great passion for it. I just question how HHG could say that it's dead when it's clearly not.

Like I said many devs love it because they can nickel and dime customers with add on content, DLC, hidden content, etc. All of which are available on PC for free. So yeah, I agree with you that console gaming has its appeal, but just because console gamers are more vocal with consoles doesn't mean the PC gaming audience doesn't exist or that it's "Dead".

NotSoSilentBob3176d ago

Alpha you forget to mention in your comment how PC gaming trumps LIVE and how PC gaming trumps the PS3 graphics is that in 2006/2005 when those systems released the PC didn't come close to anything either of those could do. Show me a Computer that for 299$ can play games like RE5, UT3, Call of Duty(MW/WAW/MW2) at the graphics level a console can. Because you can't. yes PC gaming CAN out due anything a console can but the price range is so much higher. That is the Selling point to a console is the price of everything. Yea you can change your PC over time and upgrade it as fast or slow as you want but any PC that was around in 2006 is not being used for games today because you have to upgrade it so much. So Yes PC gaming CAN be out due console graphics Years after the console comes out.

steve30x3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

He axed him LOL. HHG doesnt like the fact that he was proving him wrong. Also HHG seems to be an Xbox fanboy with his comments.

Also my computer is a year and a half old and I can still play almost all games at maximum settings.

SL1M DADDY3176d ago

Of consoles and not of the PC. I love my PC though will tell you that I don't buy a ton of games for it and more of my games are console purchases, the PC is still a great platform. HHG needs to simply embrace the roots of hardcore gaming and get a PC IMHO.

-Alpha3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

Hey, HHG actually made a text reply in that video link and he sounded much better. First he admits PC Gaming is not dead (so his titles are continued to be proven to be flamebait), and he lays down his arguments straight. I wish he could do that in his videos more often because on text HHG doesn't sound so extravagantly biased:

"1luv and god bless and to the fans that I pissed off PC GAMING ISN’T DEAD but it’s not progression like how consoles are so technically my title may have been misleading but in a way when it comes down to just overall gaming market share, from game sales, exclusives, presence in the industry consoles are ahead by more than a mile so PC GAMING LIVES"

That's a far more better argument HHG, and I wish you could translate that into your videos.

Now, every point you make does not validly conclude to PC gaming being dead, but I think it's fair to conclude (from your arguments) that CONSOLE gaming is much more actively popular.

I STILL disagree with that but I can respect the fact that you managed to make a much less biased-sounding, intelligent argument.

I disagree because console gaming is ONLY so active on the internet because there is a console war going on. You know the saying about people yelling loudest always represent what they believe?

Take fundamentalism for example. Take the WTC bombings. Islam gets painted as a religion of absolute evil terror, when there are also Muslims who are peaceful.

Without getting into a religious overtone, the point is that whoever makes the biggest controversy also becomes the ones who represent it for the average person. Generalizations, vague assumptions, etc. dominate a particular ideal because loud and obnoxious people/gamers are the ones everybody pays attention to. Console wars is like that-- people are constantly arguing about the best exclusives, the best hardware, the best game, etc. It's all about console gaming, nobody cares for the PC, but that doesn't mean the PC is dead or non-existent. Not to say that PC fanboys don't exist, but when I come onto a place like N4G it's always something about the PS3 and 360 fighting over something and rarely ever about the PC.

That is why console gaming is rabid all over the internet: there are two warring factions and a ridiculous amount of fanboys siding with them.

Now in terms of the market, PC gaming is more successful than consoles: PS3 suffered (but now Sony is making profits, though not all on the consoles) and MS has crappy hardware that they need to support and fix.

In terms of games, again, the fanboys will hype and tout exclusives on consoles to the MOON. Not to say that console games are overhyped all the time, but come on, it's all part of the fact that console gaming is revolved around some stupid war of the fanboys.

Now, I agree that console games push technology like graphics, but they STILL can't touch something like Crysis (in terms of technical graphics alone, things like animations has been trumped by something like UC2).

However, console gaming also pushes stuff like 3-D gaming and motion control. I understand that it's marketable, but it's also something not everybody wants. PC Gaming is traditional and there is no more a bigger demand for motion control as there is for traditional gaming.

I agree that guys like Sony and MS are pushing the industry with things like motion control, but that doesn't mean traditional gaming is any less important.

As for the market, the developers squeeze money out of customers on consoles. Games are more expensive, and DLC and add-on content is overpriced and sold unfairly (for example, some devs are known to hide content).

Now, with all that said, yes console gaming is popular, but you have not proven that PC gaming is any less popular (and you may not intend to now, but originally you claimed PC gaming is dead). It may not be AS popular as console gaming, but it doesn't mean that it's not popular at all because there is a large amount of PC fans. Steam so far has 25 million subscribers, I believe that's as much as XBL if I'm not mistaken.

PrimordialSoupBase3176d ago

"YOU CLICK AH MOUSE"

This dude is just a comedy sketch. He has no idea what the hell he's talking about, but at least he can be enjoyed as a joke.

mikeslemonade3176d ago

I wish PC gaming would die. I don't like it.

Chubear3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

HHG holding it DOWN! Now that's a man. [email protected]*^ the BS, you know what you know and you call it as YOU see it. Not backing down cause you're going up against a popular crowd or out numbered.

He's right. PC gaming is BORING!!. You hardly find console gamers looking at exclusive PC games and wanting to buy a PC for it but more often than not PC gamers, especially this gen, are constantly interested in looking and discussing console game and even buying consoles for certain games they can't get on PC.

When was the last time an exclusive game on PC excited the console base? Tops Crysis and it was on the insane graphics you only get on a high end machine while it's gameplay was pretty plain.

You go on any gaming forum and the PC forum chatter is always low, why? cause there's not much there that's interesting to talk about. Only PC gamers are in awe of PC games.

100% agree with HHG on this one. Hate and bubble down all you want you know it's true cause no console gamer is going "Wow, the WOW DLC or Starcraft 2 is looking INSANE, I HAVE TO GET A PC for this game!"

GO on gametrialers, trailers for PC games are routinely rated in the low 4s and 5s cause they just aren't exciting. Apart from Crysis, what's been so exciting that a console gamer could get crazy about with PCs?

Hey games are games and if PCs do it for you then enjoy but to me, it's ture, PC games just aren't as exciting or social as console gaming.

BattleAxe3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

Torence is a complete fool. HHG has got this one right. There is nothing to get excited about when it comes to PC gaming these days as far as new games are concerned. Most of the good games are on either 360 or PS3, and If theres an XBOX 360 game thats not available on PS3, I can buy it for PC.

Torence, the point HHG was making was that GoW3 is new to the PS3, which means it has a new engine and better graphics along with more gameplay elements, whereas StarCraft 2 is more of the same.

Also torence, your little buddy there who figures that if people see the graphical differences between the PC versions of a game vs the versions available on consoles, that people will "flock" to the PC version, all I have to say is wait until Crysis2 comes out. The whole arguement that you and your buddy were putting forward was just plain stupid.

@ Steve

Read my comment again, I am refering to sales. When Crysis 2 comes out it is gonna sell far more on consoles, by a landslide. On PC its going to get more pirated copies by a landslide.

steve30x3176d ago

We have already seen the difference betrween the PC and console version of Crysis 2 and the PC version is superior in Physics and graphics,

led10903176d ago

Hey Chubear i don't know what you're smoking but for your kind info there are more games on PC than consoles and you know why? Because most multiplatform games are on PC and many games that are exclusive to one console are there on PC. Plus we have games like stalker and the large number of strategy games. Add to that the MMO's and you have a huge collection of games. And if you're talking bout market share, then any idiot would know that checking vgchartz or charttrack does not give an accurate representation of PC sales because the majority of PC sales are from digital distribution. Steam alone has 25 million members. You don't notice the games on the PC cause you play those on your console and don't care for whats there on the PC. And then you come here and crib your heart out. So when you get the Pot out of the system read this post.

Charmers3176d ago

"GoW3 is new to the PS3, which means it has a new engine and better graphics along with more gameplay elements, whereas StarCraft 2 is more of the same."

Erm you could say the exact same about starcraft 2, that uses a new engine it has better graphics along with more gameplay elements, yet GOW3 seems more of the same to me.

-Alpha3176d ago

Exactly!

Bubbles to you, though your full to the brim with it.

As for Chubear, lol. Telling yourself PC gaming is boring and trying to make it sound like a fact are two different things.

Immortal3213176d ago

oh no! you brought hip hop in gaming!

that could good or bad!

quiet frankly I wouldn't tell the difference!

nnotdead3176d ago

if you have a PC at home right now, you could eaily upgrade it to play the games you listed for arounf $300. not only will it play the games, but it will look and play better.

cheap AM3 board-$50-65
HD4850 graphics card- $100
AMD Anthlon II X4- $100
2GB DDR3 Ram-$50

ape0073176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

pc gamers, keep playing and be happy playing your pc and imo I prefer console gaming, cause consoles have the sweetspot between gfx, quantity and quality

and one thing that hhg really don't realize, the QUALITY, man this word have so many meanings, he just point out at gfx as "quality", there is graphical quality, gameplay quality, control quality

hhg would ignore a game like borderlands or new super mario bros but look at their gameplay quality, pretty mind blowing

and mass effect and uncharted 2 are totally different games, saying uncharted 2 has better quality and full stop is a crime to say as a gamer, you should be more specific, uncharted 2 has better grphical quality, while ME2 has depth, length, upgrades, decision making gameplay and rpg elements

don't point to gfx as "QUALITY" and if you truly believe in that then crysis 2 would be the best game ever to you hhg, because(by your logic) it has more quality than kz2,uncharted,gow3,me2,halo reach,alan wake and heavy rain......right ??

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GiantEnemyCrab3176d ago

PC gaming is not dead but it's on the floor barely breathing and in need of someone who has some CPR training..

PrimordialSoupBase3176d ago

Steam's 25 million users say hi. Not to mention saving plenty of money in the long run.

BattleAxe3176d ago

If PC gaming isn't going down, then why is it increasingly hard to find a good selection of games at retail? Most retail businesses are getting out of the PC gaming market. A good example of that would be EB Games.

When someone who is uneducated about PC gaming is thinking about getting into PC gaming, they don't see Steam in a retail store.

Charmers3176d ago

Because PC gamers are not 10 year olds running to their local Game shop to buy the latest generic hack and slash game with their pocket money.

I haven't bought a game from a game shop in nearly 10 years, I buy all my stuff from steam or order it off the net and have it delivered to my door.

Don't for one minute think the lack of PC stock in retail shops has anything to do with the PC dying. It has more to do with retail shops dying.

led10903176d ago

@BattleAxe Thats because PC gaming is shifting towards digital distribution now. Do you know why the original Mass Effect was delayed on the PC and ME2 got a simultaneous release. Cause inspite of it having bombed at retail it sold extremely well digitally. And this is not me. Bioware themselves had announced it. Also inspite of Left4Dead having sold more than 3 million copies on the 360 Valve still say that most of their revenue comes from the steam sales of their games. Plus games like sins of a solar empire which had no publicity at all sold a million copies digitally cause that was the only way to get it. The PC market is shifting and since you're enjoying games on your console you just don't know about it. So quit trying to make foolish comments

-Alpha3176d ago

There's this thing called Steam.

Digital Distribution is what PC games has come to-- especially considering how laptops now can handle PC Gaming so PC gamers actually are on the Go now.

DMasta7183176d ago

Honestly, what sane PC gamer goes to Gamestop/EBgames for PC games? lol

Elven63176d ago

Not all Steam users actually buy games, Valve has never released sales figures for Steam games other than Top X, it's hard to judge how the sales actually are if they are never released.

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WLPowell3176d ago

It's been "WOW, Crysis, and wait for Starcraft 2" all day everyday from them. I'll take Heavy Rain, Alan Wake, WKC, and The Last Guardian over that anyday.

PrimordialSoupBase3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

I'll take the far superior version of every multiplatform release. Plus games like Stalker and The Witcher which haven't been watered down for the contarded masses.

Chubear3176d ago

... when you start touting superiority on multiplatform games, you got a problem. Anyone who doesn't see that Exclusives are what ultimately push your brand and product ahead of others is either dumb or purposely trying to ignore this fact.

PrimordialSoupBase3176d ago

What you fail to realise is that the PC is not a brand. Publishers make plenty of money on the platform because it's open - no exorbitant licensing fees like on consoles. It doesn't need enormous "exclusives" to push the platform because its in a medium but comfortable state as it is. The promise of mods, largely unrestricted online play, better graphics and superior controls are their own incentive.

There's plenty of platform only content too, just nothing that will make idiots like HHG spout hyperbole. Does that mean they are worthless games? Their challenge and quality suggest otherwise. Witcher, Risen, Stalker, Cryostasis, Tropico, etc.

DeathMetal3176d ago

review score 6.5 wow what a classic, don't forget about diablo, mmo's and better versions of every shooter there is and alan wake will come to the PC by the way and look much better and that's if the game is any good.Half the reason the consoles do good is beacuse you can re sell your games, something that the dev's are pissed off about.

Enate3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

Graphics, that argument has been done played out an over with get over it. An the majority of the time on these multiplatform games the difference is marginal at best with a few exceptions. Superior controls in FPS, RTS WRPG PC centric games Diablo of course. An we are talking PC keyboard an mouse versus console controller not no after market look what I can do bs. I will beat the hell out of anyone with a controller any day of the week when it comes to driving games if they are using a keyboard an mouse setup. An action adventure games like Uncharted 2, GTA and Tomb Raider all feel much more at home an better controlled on the console versus mouse an keyboard. An I'm not speaking from what I hear but what I know as I'm playing GTA IV on the PC now.

An don't even get me started on controlling a helicopter in GTA IV with a mouse an keyboard that's just hell. Now that was just examples of controller differences but at the end of the day either way works, an its about what you like. Unrestricted online play, I'm guessing your talking dedicated servers an the ability to do with them what you will. Its not like that for every game an to some it still doesn't even matter as the core gameplay experience is all they ever wanted. There are games like Killing floor on the pc that I love to play with a few friends on steam. An then their are games like Uncharted 2 an even MWII that I'd prefer to play on my PS3. Part of it is the cohesive experience of everyone being on one network.

Regardless of steams 25 million registered accounts not everyone is on that one network. Nor does a community of 5million people matter to me on a game I no longer play. The online for PC can still be quite fragmented community wise with so many different avenues of communication its both a strength and a weakness. The way it feels to play on PS3 versus my PC is quite different. An its not just things like friends list but sometimes the amount of registrations an backdoor bs you have to go through sometimes on PC just to get a patch and or DLC of which might be free on the PC (legally).

Now as far as mods go obviously PC has got this in a choke hold. Provided the game actually gets supported well by the modding community which isn't always the case. Though obviously when it is the results can be great. For example things like GTA IV an its car modding an handle lines and Fallout 3's many overhauls an tunings an add ons. There are plenty of good things about both sides, so don't sit here an act like everything the PC puts out is gold an in kind the same won't be presumed the other way around.

They both have good games to that of which is arguable as I personally didn't like the Witcher at all an couldn't believe I even bothered to waste bandwidth on Risen. As far as Cryostasis an Stalker go for one I'm not into FPS games like that an I can't speak on either. I know Cryostasis uses the hell out of phsyx as it came with a free download with my EVGA 275GTX but its just not my kind of game. I've been considering checking out Stalker after all the hype but after looking at few vids the other day its not for me.

That's not to say that my PC doesn't give me amazing games because it does. I'm just showing u that spouting out what you think is top tier doesn't necessarily mean its gonna appeal to someone else. I am currently playing Dawn of war II and loving it along side Mass Effect 2 an I always get in some Killing Floor as well as Sins of a solar empire. At the same time though their are games my PS3 gives me that can't be had anywhere else just the same, like Uncharted 2, LBP, MGS4 an upcoming titles like Heavy Rain an God of War III. An games I'd rather play on my PS3 like Burnout Paradise and ACII. At the end of this long post I hope you understand one thing that no matter what its about preference.

ATi_Elite3176d ago

AND I'll take

STALKER Call of Pripyat - Directx 11
Natural Selection 2
Arma II ACE MOD 2- photo realistic graphics
Stalker Shadow of Chernobyl Complete 2009 mod
Black Mesa (Half life mod w/ Half life 2 graphics
Dirt 2 Direcxt 11
Command & Conquer 4
Star Wars: The Old republic
Deaus EX 3
Starcraft 2
Diablo III

All PC exclusives and too powerful for the limited capabilities of any console.

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Odion3176d ago

Why are they asking someone who doesn't know anything about PC gaming to talk about it?

WoW and its x-pacs are far more then "more levels" The amount of content in each one is equal to an RPG title. With new gameplay features, new abilities, new zones, new quests, new everything.

He also has no idea about RTS, there is nothing that is more fun then an instence and back and forth war between you and other players, sorry but if you want to talk mass market appeal SC's 16 million buyers and Diablo 2 11 would like to say hi.

3176d ago
PotNoodle3176d ago (Edited 3176d ago )

What a complete idiot.

He is saying Starcraft 2 won't be a success... it'll wipe the floor with most of the console games he mentioned. I'm not a fan of starcraft, but wow..

Oh and did you know Diablo is a RTS? lolol.

You know nothing about PC gaming HHG, please don't try to argue against it. NOTHING.. upgrade every 6 months? There are cards that are as old as the PS3 that offer you better graphics for cheaper.

I don't have god of war 3 and all this on PC? You're right, i don't, thats why i own a PS3, i don't have halo or gears 2 on PC? Thats right, which is why i own a 360.

But exclusives are not half as common as multiplatform games, so:

PC: Multiplatform and the good exclusives only possible on PC, including the older games that still have better communities than the console games

360: The odd exclusive that comes along
PS3: The exclusives and one or two multiplatform games.

I know PC isn't the best, while compatibility is greatly exaggerated, along with price, there is absolutely no problem with that on consoles - one good point.

But there is a good reason for those problems, and that is the better graphics, better control and better performance, along with the modding communities, so more content!

steve30x3175d ago

Where is he getting of in saying Halo is an Xbox exclusive? Halo 1 and Halo 2 is also on the PC lol. Does that mean people are flocking to thye PC because of Halo being on the PC.

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