Why Video Game piracy is killing itself

pwnordie.com: Lately I've been considering piracy, no, not the high seas plundering and looting, Jack Sparrow kind, but the kind where people are downloading game releases via torrent and other means. What these people don't seem to comprehend is that they are, in effect, bringing about their own destruction. Not by the way you might think, as in being caught or prosecuted against, but by the might of the games companies simply making it pointless.

[mpmaley]

Demigod
Legit: 18,000
Torrent Downloads: 102,000

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

[Sarcasm]

Ouch.

I'm curious about the ratio of Xbox360 games.

We know the legit sales numbers, but I wonder what percentage is the pirated copies.

[zagibu]

It's still a mistery to me how they count those "torrent downloads" in a peer to peer network.

[DominusRebellis]

I like to download and not seed it after...just because I can haha a$$holes

[evrfighter]

this games made for playing multiplayer. The lack of single player campaign makes it not even worth pirating...If this game's sales/pirated ratio is used in the future by developers as an explanation of why they are no longer making pc games. I wouldn't be upset. Most pc gamers need a reality check.

[Proxy]

Release on PC, you get pirated.

Release on console, you'll entertain the renters for a weekend.

Whatever happens, we'll always have indi developers on PC. :)

[FarEastOrient]

I'm surprised the PS3 hasn't been hacked yet!

[XxZxX]

hahahaha those guy never been to asia yet. China and south east asia esspecially, 98% pirate 2% legit. And the legits are viewed as stupid idiot.

[Diselage]

Demigod is just sad, makes me wanna go out and buy it just to support the poor guys.

[Software_Lover]

But I always buy them.

I downloaded Oblivion when it first came out. Played it for about 2 hours. I had rented the ps3 version and played it a little bit. Last Week I finally bought Oblivion (pc) goty edition once it reached my pricepoint. Now Im 20+ hours in. I love that game.

I also downloaded psp games, but only the ones that I had a disc for so that I could put them on a memory card and play them without having to keep all those discs with me all the time. All torrent downloads aren't a bad thing. They need to see why people are downloading them.

[mpmaley]

For people that download, I believe you're in the minority.

[Sarcasm]

You might just be the rare case.

I'm pretty sure there are hordes of people who download simply to not pay for the games.

And that's not exactly a hard thing to believe.

[STK026]

I usually buy my games (for PC, 360 and obviously PS3), but when it comes to the PSP, I just don't feel like it anymore. I've had one since launch (and actually bought another one when the slim launched) and bought games for it for years, about 50-60 of them, and most of them were hardly worth playing, so since about a month I've been downloading games for it, and I plan on only buying the really good ones like Dissidia and Persona.

[tlassanske]

By downloading a full version of the game (I don't think any demo gives you 2 hours of play), you added your download to the tally of "lost sales" due to piracy - even if you DID eventually buy a copy.

Also, you should consider the fact that the game developer makes most, if not all, of his profit off full-price sales (at bargain-bin $20 prices, everything goes to the retailer and the publisher). If the game had not been available to you through piracy, you may have actually decided to pay the full $50 to experience it (impulse buy). So you only stole $30, rather than the full $50 (due to eventually buying it) - it's still piracy.

[QQcrybaby]

If a company doesn't want you to be able to dl the game to try it out then you have no legal right to do so. Rationalize any way you want.

[UltimateIdiot911]

But without privacy, Software lover might not have bought the game. It works both way, piracy can also generate buzz aka free advertisement.

[agentace]

or i buy the game 1st(for a console) then DL for PC like godfather 2, all GTAs and stuff but i always buy the game the day it comes out at its full price so im not ripping them off..i hate ripping off companys that make great games,i brought Uncharted twice becuase it was so good lol and i Never buy 2nd hand games thats just a big kick in the nuts for devs

[Snatcher]

Who eats crap over webcam to get money aka Xbox owners, since they don't buy games, they pirate them. Mwahaha.

[TheMART]

I think you just got it twisted up in your mind.

The PS2 was pirated so much by PLAYSTATION fans, that one of the best games, God of War 2, only sold what 2 mln. copies or so while there are 120 mln. + PS2's out there.

Oh and

360 has a game attach rate of 8.3 or so
PS3 has something close to 5.6

Thus: it seems Playstation fans are either or into cheap pirating stuff a lot more, or just don't buying games if they can't pirate it (PS3)

[steve30x]

I used to argue that DRM was the main demon for Pirating but with Demigod being pirated so much I cant argue that any longer. I think people are just getting too greedy now. Theres no excuse not to buy DemiGod. Now Riddick is one case I will say Pirate the hell out of it until they fix that overkill DRM. I am willing to buy Dark Athena as soon as they patch the DRM or release a revocation tool.

All of the games I own I either got a demo for it or downloaded it from torrents because there was no demo and if I liked the game I bought it but if I didnt like the game I deleted it completely.

[Baka-akaB]

I agree with you , but do not forget one quite important thing .
Many reviewers or people who played it , think that the game is pretty but blows ...

Dawn of war 2 and Sin of a solar empire were even more pirated , and sold far more ... because they are very much beloved .

[xabmol]

Advertisers will shell out loads of cash to get there name and/or product out there to the masses. Modern games like GTA, Burnout, and Mirrors Edge can easily have in game adds without interrupting gameplay. Other games can do things like have a McDonald's loading screen or have power ups like The Doritos elixir or the Coca Cola healing potion.

There are lots of ways to turn piracy into just another means of profit. Imagine having the option to buy the game add free. Or download the game from a commercially sponsored site with lots of adds and some in game advertisements.

We just need a paradigm shift.

___________________________

As for the law about piracy right now. I think it should be based on yearly income.

For example:

If you make enough money to easily afford a few games, movies, and CD's every month you can go to jail and/or pay a fine for your act of high sea treachery.

If you barely have enough money to pay your bills and buy food(like me) you should be allowed to pillage a few wandering ships. Just don't go overboard.

There should also be a middle ground. For instance: I have a wall of DVD's that have been purchased legally but I also download a lot of movies too. I simply don't have the money to buy every move that is released. Heck there is more movies and TV shows being released every month than there is time to watch them.

[QQcrybaby]

Punishment based on yearly income? You're very, very ignorant.

[kingme71]

but what if you get a raise before you stole the item and that raise puts you above the threshold for going to jail, but you haven't yet gotten the paycheck so technically you are still below the threshold? Hmmm... I think if you can work out that kink your system is foolproof and should be sent to Washington for immediate enactment.

[xabmol]

Thanks for your input. Care to elaborate?

[leftbehindxp]

There's nothing to be explained...just plain ignorance

[xabmol]

But since I am obviously so very, very ignorant, maybe one of you kind, well educated, open minded people can enlighten me.

[willie6289]

yeah who would be dumb enough to do a system based on income??

*cough* government assistance programs *cough*

[xabmol]

The laws obviously go the other way round, because to more money you have the more you can get away with.

Excuse he for having a thought and an open mind, for meeting the "problem" halfway.

@illie6289

Those GAP's help millions of people survive. I'm not saying they're perfect. Far from it in fact, but without them lots of people would starve and/or be homeless.

[Baka-akaB]

Even though it's most of the time never done for philantropic and humanitarian reasons , I'll always thanks piracy for one or two things .

Like undub games ... for eons most jrpgs nuts wanted their game brough over quickly without dubs , those being awful anyway till this day .

But of course to this day , editors wont listen , aside for a few marketing the otaku niche , like atlus or NIS .

Anyway piracy meant that i could play my whole list of ps2 us owned game in their original splendor . Ever since they appeared , i just buy let's say persona 3 , persona 4 , dont even bother with the original , store it in a safe haven , and play the modified version with japanese voices .

It is more than some "stupid weaboo" antic , like some of you would most likely say , when some games like Ar Tornelico 2 arent even worth anything or playable in their us version .

The game is gimped and bugged , and official translation full of grammar error , translation errors . Thanks to amateurs , a version appeared based on the japanese game , bug free , with a new translation that makes sense .

And there is better , a lot's of game were never brought in the west ... like basically half of the namco's Tales games . Thanks to many dedicated people , we can finally play translated and patched versions of those games . I could finally play Persona 2 entirely , when atlus only released it's part 2 in usa .

I know the bad outweigh the good in piracy , but the good is still there .

[Kushan]

This article has a lot of inaccuracies in it. Any point it was trying to make has failed due to this.

For example:

"Atari's ST, the Commodore 64 and ZX Spectrum all fell due to the rampaging pirates because it no longer became viable to invest in development for the systems."

No, they "fell" because they were old technology and got replaced by newer machines. Not one of those is considered a "failure" and the C64 still has a sizable following today, albeit from a non-commercial perspective.

"The cartridge consoles brought us a speedy blue hedgehog and a hopping hideous plumber but also brought the pirates one hell of a headache. Cartridge production was expensive and difficult for technology at the time, as a result piracy all but disappeared because it was basically impossible. "

Piracy impossible? Ha! It was as easy as ever, there were all sorts of cheap devices you could plug into your Mega Drive or SNES that let you store games on simple Floppy disks. Google "Earthbound", it's a notable game because it contains checks to make sure it's not being pirated. Why would they go to all that trouble if piracy was "basically impossible"?

And here's a gem of a statement: "the PSX remained in production till 2006, so software publishing for it collapsed just half way through it's sales life."

Basically, he's trying to say that piracy killed the PSX. The PSX. You know that console that launched Sony into the number 1 spot for at least 10 years, if not longer? And what's his proof of this? That around 2000, less and less games were getting published for it. That wouldn't have anything to do with the PS2 or anything, would it?
And what about the N64? It actually suffered very little piracy (The cartridges were too big to be duplicated on a different medium, particularly since Flash Memory was in its infancy at the time), yet it didn't come close to the success of the PS1. So where's your piracy excuse there?

You know, I'm all for admitting that piracy does harm the industry, but its affects are vastly overblown. Both the PS1 and the PS2 were pirated to hell and yet they're still huge successes. The 360 has a serious and well organised pirating issue, yet its sales and attach rates are still up there.
Why don't we focus on the real issue - games are expensive. Not only that, but now publishers want to charge exorbitant amounts for pathetically lacklustre DLC. When I pay £40 for a game, I expect to get my monies worth, not have to pay another £8 for what basically surmounts to about 5% of the content of the game (if that). If you sold games at say £20, they'd easily sell more than twice as much. Sell those map packs for £2 each and people wont mind paying for them. Beat piracy by offering people real value, not by raising your prices. If anything, that just makes people feel more justified.

[Baka-akaB]

many would argue that a big part of the success of the psx , ps2 and possibly the 360 are the way it's easy to pirate .

of course it's the other way around with the psp (or the dreamcast) .
But look at the DS , it's even easier to pirate yet doesnt suffer .

Most likely a platform easily piratable WITH many popular hits will be enjoying an happy life .
While piracy would harm a console struggling to get many hit games

[Kushan]

If you read what you said carefully, it essentially boils down to whether a platform has hits or not. Piracy doesn't really come into it.

If it's easily pirated and has no hits, it's a failure.
If it's not easily pirated and has no hits, it's a failure.

If it's easily pirated and has hits, it's a success.
If it's not easily pirated and has hits...it's still a success.

[Baka-akaB]

Precisely ... it only really harms those that are already down in the gutter . It's a finishing blow to losers

[TheMART]

A comment from a user:

"If you barely have enough money to pay your bills and buy food(like me) you should be allowed to pillage a few wandering ships. Just don't go overboard.

There should also be a middle ground. For instance: I have a wall of DVD's that have been purchased legally but I also download a lot of movies too. I simply don't have the money to buy every move that is released. Heck there is more movies and TV shows being released every month than there is time to watch them."

Right. If you don't have the money for something, you just can't have it. Isn't it simple as that?

Or are you gonna steal a Ferrari also because you can't pay it? And they should punish a homeless person that steals a Ferrari different then a wealthy guy that does the same?

They both steal. You don't have the money don't buy. Or take two jobs so you can buy stuff.

[zagibu]

Piracy is NOT theft. If you steal a Ferrari, someone has one less Ferrari. This doesn't happen with software piracy. Piracy is also a stupid expression to describe the matter, because real piracy includes theft, assassination, rape, etc.

[TheMART]

It IS theft. Just saying its not like a physical thing you steal, you do take someones work not true the legal way, thats buying it.

Thus if you download/pirate thats one less sale that could/would have been made otherwise.

And please, don't say: "I wouldn't buy it, I just use it because I can pirate it, I would never buy it".

Saying you don't 'take' anything... Well why don't you hack a banking system then, not taking anyones money, but just digitally change your account. You create money, you don't steal from anyone its like 'printing' extra money digitally right.

Come on. Its the same as stealing idea's, which can be worth a lot of money. It remains stealing either way you twist it. Although it can be digitally multiplied without taking the original doesn't change the core of using something that's paid for free.

[ambientFLIER]

"facepalm"

Piracy IS theft, you idiot. You are making a copy of something that is copy protected. I don't know how much clearer that can get. It makes no difference whether or not the original is left.

If you hack into a Government computer and take social security numbers, you are STEALING data, even if you left the originals.

I'm just so sick of thieves trying to justify this crap.

[zagibu]

Oh, it IS theft, eh? So why is it handled differently in courts? Because it is NOT theft, it is fraud, copyrights infringement, illegal use, whatever, but it is NOT handled as theft, because it isn't theft. Theft is when you take something away from someone. They no longer have it, but you do. In software piracy, you either make an illegal copy, or you use a service without the provider's agreement. You don't steal anything, period. It's the same with all the examples you provided, they are also not theft and are not handled as theft in courts. Stealing ideas? Are you serious? Do you really think you can sue someone who "stole" an idea from you? Obviously, you have no idea about legal systems...

BTW: I'm not condoning piracy, it DOES harm the industry. I like games, this is why I buy all games I play. But I also don't like the aggressive stance of the copyright holders. Piracy is a false expression, people talking about theft is wrong as well.

[Gun_Senshi]

Where I live a new release game costs USD 95

[BlackCountryBob]

An interesting spin on the collapse of PS1 game releases. Another more rational and less inclined towards twisting the truth would suggest that the reason game releases fell so much in 2000 and 2001 was the release of the PS2.

[rcortesb]

ps3 for online games, xbox 360 for free games... that's the reality in my third world country...

[vox]

"Advertisers will shell out loads of cash to get there name and/or product out there to the masses. Modern games like GTA, Burnout, and Mirrors Edge can easily have in game adds without interrupting gameplay. Other games can do things like have a McDonald's loading screen or have power ups like The Doritos elixir or the Coca Cola healing potion."

this is exactly what I was saying, if people want to pay for games sure let them have the game w/o sponsorship
but now games are throwing in sponsors and there's no change in price, it's not fair
I know I would not mind watching ads in games for a more affordable price, why can TV be free but games can't? TV shows cost $1 mil or more per ep on networks usually , if games have to be shorter and release in episodes I'm all for that too

If devs/publishers are so afraid of piracy, why not crack down on used games sales even harder too. If so many games are for younger audiences doesn't that mean parents are buying a lot of games? I don't think the kids or parents are pirating in that case. And it's a hell of a lot easier for someone not so tech savvy to go to a store and pay less than it is for them to learn how to pirate. People who buy used games get a free pass but if you're a pirate you're suddenly scum

if companies stop being able to afford games (and that has more to do with rising dev costs than it does piracy but it won't happen any time soon, not everyone is a pirate) then maybe they should reexamine their business model or create some incentives for owning games that don't involve being able to trade them in and let some third party steal their profit while ripping off the customers

[xabmol]

The business model just needs some minor tweaks and Boom-Bam "problem" solved.

P.S.
Mind putting the source after that quote? Or you could have just hit the reply button. xP

[QQcrybaby]

So much rationalization going on in this thread. Even if the effects of piracy are overblown (which I don't think they are) piracy is still illegal and no one has any right to dl a game unless they paid for it. How on earth can someone be OK with stealing a game when they consider how much hard work and effort a developer put into the game. Only to have it stolen by some zit faced kid? Give me a break. I hope DRM gets so crushing that priacy is dealt a huge blow. And everyone note; pirates are 100% responsible for DRM.

[Baka-akaB]

lol Funny thing is your wish will only crush the legal owners , as shown 100% of the time with DRMs.

[jerethdagryphon]

is the act of taking something thats not yours

i also have a wall o dvds including full sets of tv series
i also have terabytes of harddrive space
i dl the copys of the ilms and such so i dont have to run from disc thus ensuring the disc longevity
i make isos of all programs i buy and run from virtual drives
am i i pirate because i dl products or am i a lazy bastard who cant be bothered making the divxs and avis myself (probobly cause i cant work it out0

[Baka-akaB]

Imo , you and i , and a yet undetailled and vague minority , just arent .

I own my games and videos and dont have to respond anywhere to anyone about downloading an easier to handle version or better version .

[Jovatov]

I get the point but when I buy 1-2 games a month and simply don't have enough money to buy more. There's no way in hell that I can be hurting the industries if I also download.

[xabmol]

Lets say 5 games release every month, but I can only afford to buy two a month.

If I follow the law and play only the games I can afford then 2 Devs get my money and I can only play 2 games.

If I buy the 2 games I can afford and download the other 3 then 2 Devs get my money and I can play 5 games.

Who does this hurt?

[LastDance]

haha! I love reading people attempt to justify stealing.....

[jsc249jobal]

that when people download games it is such a huge problem but no one seems to care about people on ebay or gamestop who actually make a profit off of someone elses work. is that not a legal way of robbing the industry? gamestop encourages it with used games.

[Baka-akaB]

Indeed , used games are actually harmful .
And i aint talking about some dude reselling a game to a friend . But entire companies getting profits from it .

[steve30x]

If downloading a game torrent is Illegal then isnt Gamestop etc. dooing the same thing by selling used games. Why arent these companies brought to court and given heavy fines for their PIRACY? Yes selling used games is piracy in my mind also and its being done in just as large a scale as torrents. These companies that are developing games arent doing anything about second hand games but are running after those who cant afford every new game they want. This argument over piracy is silly.

[jsc249jobal]

at gamestops annual profits over the last five years and you tell me that is not a sizeable chunk out of developers profit. now they even have a moviestop...and no association has said a word against them...bunch of hypocrits i say lol

[clichegamertag]

Your comment ignores the fact that, when I sell my used game, I forfeit my use of it. I no longer have any right to the game. The pirate gives away the download but keeps a copy for himself. That is what is wrong.

If Gamestop were keeping copies for itself, then it would be immoral and illegal. but they don't do that. (If they are selling used games as new ones, then they are engaged in false advertising.)

But there is a huge difference between selling used items and pirating them.

[Mr Face Creamer]

Each once in a while, a company points out some BS take out of their @$$ as that there are "millions" of pirates downloading their games (although this is just a wild estimate).

Piracy will never go away no matter how hard you try, piracy can be fought easily if the right security is used, Microsoft can tighten security on their next console, Sony can actually put security into their next PSP, and developers can go easy on DRM limits and include a heavy protection system such as the one in Mass Effect or Chronicles Of Riddick: Assault On Dark Athena.

Piracy can easily be heavily reduced if developers and companies try harder, and no matter how much a game will be pirated, there will always be good sales for that game. (unless its $h1t)

[xabmol]

If it is indeed a good game people will want the physical product, with the case, booklet, and game. If that game is great people will buy the limited edition, strategy guide, and merchandise.

Bad Developers are killing themselves. Good Developers will always profit. Piracy or not.

[CaulkSlap]

It's their own damned fault. Publishers are clinging to an outdated distribution format and price point. Digital download services are great and how I buy most games now. Problem is unless there's some special sale they cost MORE than buying a hard copy.

And who want's to buy a disc version filled with tons of BS DRM? Hackers break that within days of a game releasing and upload a pre-hacked torrent. DRM is futile and only punishes legitimate buyers.

BTW Torrent downloads DO NOT EQUAL LOST SALES! Pretty much everything I have ever gotten on a torrent I had no intention of ever buying if it wasn't available for free. Still buy plenty of games and movies if they're worth it to me.

[Jecht]

But it was always really hard to get games or imported stuff like FFX International.

I can understand why people would want to though. I bought SFIV from EB Games and it set me back nearly $80. Games haven't been that expensive since the SNES days. With the way the economy is, people have few options available to them. They either need good jobs, quit their hobby, or pirate.

[BackDoorMoi]

Lower the games price to $20, and the pirates will go down to hell. I recently purchase on "Steam" Team fortress 2 for 20 bucks, Red Orchestra for $5, CS:S + Dod:Source + HL2D for $20, all this games have a huge community online, just for that keep the price low and you developer gonna sell more.

[Mantiz]

If I download a game I would NEVER have bought who's sales am I stealing exactly ? Also if I let a friend borrow my copy of say "Uncharted" and play till he's done but he didn't pay for it is that stealing ? what if I let anyone who wants to borrow it ? but instead I make a copy and send it to him because he lives somewhere else and I don't wanna ship it ? now are we pirates ? what if I love everyone and want them all to be able to "borrow" my game but there's only so much time so I make alotta copies so everyone can "Borrow" it simultaneously ? you see how semantic it becomes ? A model similar to what Xabmol mentions is more Viable, also as Vox points out television ( and notably most of the internet ) has existed profitably for some time on this model, face facts folk Intellectual Property is illusory and anyone who disagrees can watch Steal This Movie.

[Evocation]

This generation of console has the best anti-piracy so far.

People that own a wii, are nitty fanboys, or kids/oap
people would be to scared to void the warranty
and nobody can be bothered with the ps3. ^^

Piracy is one thing, but if you were to take 3 different people, one has a love films accounts.. gets to play 4 games a month for £2.50 each, one buys pre-owned games, and one just hackes away... in the end none of them really help developers.

the overheads for the physical produce of games isn't anywhere near as large as the data they carry, games would sell hell of alot more if they cut prices in half. It doesn't work so much when the hype dies down.

[tawak]

i personally brought 360 just for this reason and i know most people too

[The Milkman]

Piracy a benefit? HAHAHA... Please give me a logical reason as to how that is, or I'm going to continue to laugh at those kinds of remarks. Video games take alot of investment and ingame add will not make them alot of profit. If you expect to see an improved sequel they would need to see bigger game sells for a bigger investment. It's all common since! We shouldnt be making such lame excuses as to why game piracy is good. I see both sides of the story but its obvious which side is right.

[tawak]

in this troubled times..
this is why most people prefer xbox 360 over ps3..
cheap price and cheap games (its not affordable its just no need to buy games now thats cheap)

[DarkSniper]

Piracy is one of the determining factors of Xbox 360's eventual demise. Microsoft's shoddy design has come back to shoot them in the foot twentyfold after developing their platform in sole fear of PLAYSTATION®3. During Microsoft's console development cycle, the simplest intangibles were overlooked because of Sony's console rising above like the Phoenix.

Factors such as durability, disc preservation, standard hard drives and piracy protection are all key features the XBox 360 lacks but the original Xbox included, piracy being the only exception. Microsoft's self proclaimed "AAA" lineup loses money to each online download that thieves use to enhance their gaming experience at a low cost.

Dark Sniper would do the same. He would never be caught buying an XBox 360 title at retail price. He knows that he's getting a poor product that will pale in comparison to the PLAYSTATION®3 counterpart. Those funds could be allocated towards investing more in modern day gaming technology with his PLAYSTATION®3 Home Computer Terminal.

All Microslaves, save your money and purchase your XBox 360 content through the black market. Save yourselves time and money by not wasting it on such piss-poor products.

$niper

[Fisherking]

I cannot see the harm in downloading older games for free that companies no longer support or sell like old arcade, n64, nes, snes, ps1 etc... because obviously the companies have already made their money on it and do not think that it is worth producing further. But I do see the problem in getting games that are still available from consoles that are still commercially in production like nds, ps2, ps3, psp, wii, and xbox360. Developing and producing games in general, even one game could cost at a minimal of around $5 million to develop and produce for a limited release. By pirating current gen console games it not only shoots the developers in the foot by having less funds to produce better games in the future. But it also hurts the gamers themselves that actually pay for the games by getting less and less high quality game releases due to lack of funds to develop and produce more high quality games, and it is also part of the developers fault for being greedy by charging for DLC that should have been originally in the game in the first place for people that actually pay for the game . But I also do agree that you should be able to try a game out for longer periods of time than the current 1 or 2 level demo to see if it is really worth buying, a perfect example for the type of demo of a game that I am talking about would be the game called doom, doom had a total of 3 episodes and the demo of that game let you play the first episode of that game(that is a third of the game), by the time that you were finished with the demo you were so into playing more of the game that you would probably more than likely bought doom if you liked it, and the length of that demo was probably one of the key factors on why the doom game was successful . You see by playing a third of a particular game(as a demo) you would obviously know if it was worth buying or not for the most part.

[Iceman100]

"I'm surprised the PS3 hasn't been hacked yet!"

that's because it's not worth it especially if i can buy the same things on ps2.

"If I download a game I would NEVER have bought who's sales am I stealing exactly?"

exactly right these companies are just full of shi*, and they don't complain when they steal people money making worthless games.

[spike]

You are an idiot Dark Sniper. Your comments are always retarded. Get a life.

[lizard81288]

mp3s, lime/frost wire, and movies.WAY more people probably download MP3s then video games.

i didn't know used games also hurt(i learned something new) i can agree with old games, good luck find super mario bros for the nes at your stores. older games i can see. also region locking too, if i can play say, a ps1 game on my computer region free; and my ps1 is region locked, well there are benefits.

plus VC games cost a lot too on the wii from what i've been told. my friend said it would be cheaper just to track down the actual game and buy it.

also emus have to be built too, if you want to play them on your computer, it takes a few years or so, the DC is still trying to be emulated well, and the DC died along time ago, well outside of japan that is.... yes, they are still making DC games in japan.

also arcade machines too, those things just gobble up money, but yet arcades in America are few and far between, so things like MAME are useful.

also emus can build up fans for a series too, and cult hits.

the only thing i can see, is if devs put something in their programs. like the world ends with you, doesn't work with no$GBA(best DS emu), there no press start option, so your stuck at the tittle screen, and it doesn't work on an r4 card either, at some point during a cut scene it freezes(although you can download a save for it, and i heard opening and closing the ds during the cut scene also makes it work)and Chrono Trigger doesn't work on an r4 card either.

[Crazywhitie]

If they make a great game it doesn't matter about pirating it'll still sell... Halo 3 sold 10 million, Pirated maybe 2-3 million... They don't make game worth the price anymore.. you maybe get one to 3 games a year that are worth the 59.99 price tag... Godfather 2 I'll use. 6hrs and i'm Done. SIX HOURS that's $10 an hour to play this games... I'd would have gotten a blow job from a hook.. at least i would have gotten off. Trade in Value $25 they'll sale for $54... It's almost not worth it to buy games unless it's a big Title that's been around awhile.. Game Company's should start a return program so we don't feel like wasting our money... you look at the games out right now and you can count them on your hands and toes the ones worth $59.99.. That's why Pirating is still around... They need to make 4 levels of game Prices .. You don't see Kia Trying to Sale cars at BMW Prices Do you

[DirtyLary]

Distributors will lower their game prices so people will buy them.

shell out $60.00 bucks or download for 2 hours. hmm easy decision for the masses of jobless and dropout gamers that flood our hobby.

XBOX and SONY need to drop achievements and trophies too.

Then the obsessed kids wont be so much in a hurry to download every game so they can get their precious unlocks.

[Lumbo]

Only that there is no way to download PS3 games for trophies, as downloaded PS3 games can not be played, and this now more than 2 years into the market. There is no piracy on the PS3 so no need to drop trophies at all.

[Lumbo]

For more than 20 years the industry has screamed how piracy would be the doom of gaming and how they will fold next week because of it, yet the legal games market has grown, and grown, and grown again. The claim that every downloaded copy of a game is a lost sale is bogus. Once you cut out the zero cash version you will see people still not buying the crap games. As the makers of Sins of a solar Empire stated (a game with no DRM protection) GOOD GAMES SELL, BAD GAMES DON'T

And while the industry has lied to us for years on how piracy is killing the market, they kept claiming that without any piracy the games could cost half of what they are "forced" to ask for them "today". Yet till today the public has seen the exact opposite of that. The words of the industry goons do not match their actions. The only system on the market today with zero piracy, the PS3, has the MOST EXPENSIVE games. While the systems with loads of warez have cheaper games.

Therefor i reach the conclusion, that piracy helps stopping the industry goons get to greedy. Cause if they charge way to much more people will pirate the stuff as they don't feel they get their moneys worth by buying it for the overblown prices. The systems where piracy is widely spread have the cheapest prices for games, wow what a coincidence, and how completely opposite of the fairy tale the industry PR blokes want you to believe.

IF games without piracy could in fact be half the price, why ain't PS3 games $25 cheaper than they are? There is NO piracy on the PS3, hence the repeated statement of the half price if only there was no piracy should come into action, ain't it so? Even if you cut an estimated $20 license fee per game out of the cost, thats still half of the remaining $50 that can be cut, right? RIGHT?

Wrong, on a system without piracy the industry will charge as much as they think they can get away with, as there is no natural barrier for people to start spilling over to the pirate sources if the price is out of line.

When companies realize that they will sell much more @$40 for a console game and that piracy will be a much less problem at that price they will understand the solution is not whining and spewing false claims, but delivering a quality product at a reasonable price.

[ironmonkey]

its not killing itself its killing the ones who pay to make the games like ms

[tawak]

the only one losing the green stuff here is the one who makes the games and
microsoft is actually getin money outta piracy
how can you play pirated games if you dont have the hardware to played it in

[REALgamer]

Many PC game series seem to be moving to console as console piracy is a lot less common than PC piracy. I know there's a fair bit of piracy on Xbox 360 but most people seem too scared to use downloaded games on 360 because Live is so integral in most games and Microsoft has been getting out their online ban hammer a fair bit recently.

Many of the most pirated games on console and PC are singleplayer (eg: Bioshock, Portal) because no unique ID / product key is needed to let you play online. Titles such as Halo 3 and CoD4 (and most major MMOs) with strong multiplayer components that are for many people the primary reason for owning the game have strong sales because most have copy-protection that prevent more than 1 person playing with a particular CD key.

It looks like mainly singleplayer PC games will be the ones to suffer most, with a move to console almost mandatory to turn a profit.

[FoxDragon]

I finally made an account JUST to comment on this issue.. because some of the comments were extremely upsetting, honestly.

I'm a computer animator in the game industry, I've worked on all types of games.. good, bad.. licensed, crap.. whatever. A paycheck is a paycheck, sometimes. To those who are actually trying to justify Piracy.. let me tell you.. you can't. You just have absolutely no idea how far the damage goes. There are FAR more people working on these games than "sony, MS Nintendo" or even the studios themselves like say bungie, or Id, or Blizzard. And if companies go under, for any reason.. it has a huge affect on the other businesses, workers themselves, and so forth. Cinematic studios, mo cap studios, effects houses, design houses.. There are so many more people involved than just "developer A + Publisher". Plus, if companies aren't recouping their losses.. then they're unwilling to take as many risks- at ANY capacity. Original new IP? No way! They'll stick to the boring franchise movie tie in's or well established franchises that they can just churn out over and over. Activision is already doing this. And if Piracy continues to run as rampant as it is- and is going.. well, it's only going to get worse, folks.

I see a whole lot of.. "if a game is great, then people will buy it! if it sucks, it fails!" yeah except that isn't reality. Psychonuats, Okami, Beyond good and Evil, Eternal Darkness.. Those games were all EXTREMELY good.. I don't expect to get many disagrees on that, right? Well their sales were god awful! Not because of piracy, mind you.. but just sales, period. Meanwhile, gems such as every Madden ever made.. 50 cent bulletproof, and so many crap movie tie in games.. that got slammed all over the place.. made billions. It would be NICE if quality meant profit, but it doesn't always.

This statement in particular made me register...

"Lets say 5 games release every month, but I can only afford to buy two a month.

If I follow the law and play only the games I can afford then 2 Devs get my money and I can only play 2 games.

If I buy the 2 games I can afford and download the other 3 then 2 Devs get my money and I can play 5 games.

Who does this hurt?"

Seriously? It hurts the 3 developers who you DIDN'T pay for! Oh sure you say that you would not have anyway.. but if you actually wanted to play the game.. then you might have, at same point. Maybe not that month, but hey maybe months down the line you'd buy it.. if there was a dead month of releases. Hey! No games this month.. hmm! werll I was gonna get game X.. may as well, now! Or hey, rent it! It doesn't go to the developer.. but it does go into a supplier of some kind (in this case, blockbuster or something). At least SOMETHING. When i was a kid and couldn't afford every single game that came out.. I would rent them.. simple. I barely bought games then.. because I couldn't afford it! PC.. not as simple. But I think we get the idea.. Now that you've played the game for free.. why would you EVER buy it? the interest is gone.

Then there are those saying that Piracy is better or just as bad as used games sales.. What? Don't you guys realize that someone HAD to have bought the game in the first place for them to even sell it to you, used? Whereas.. who exactly bought tbe game with piracy? anyone? lets say one cracked copy and that goes out to.. 100 people. Okay, out of that 100 people.. who played for the game at all? No one? Yeah.. And with a used game.. god help you if that went out to 100 people, but at least SOMEONE paid for it. I think a game would be dead after passing through about.. lets say 20-30 hands at most, though. Especially a disc game.

Lastly.. we all have very valid concerns over price. Games are way too expensive.. as are the systems. But you know who's fault that mainly is? The consumer HD freaks. The people who.. when a game is released on PS3 or 360.. you actually spent the time to analyze screenshots and break down WHICH has better graphics. The graphic obsessed HD population is responsible for this mess.. and because you ALL want super amazing HD graphics with movie quality cinematics and a full orchestral score and god only knows what else.. Game budgets are THROUGH THE ROOF. So they HAVE to charge higher than hell prices to even come close to recouping their losses! And i'm referring to the middleground devs here, not the ones like Epic or Bungie who sold 4 million copies and made billions. Those people are the minority. A VERY small minority. The rest of the dev's can be dead in the water if one single games flops.. because cost of making them is so damn high. And so! We're back to square one! they won't take risks! And this will kill originality

The author of this article is dead on point that piracy is digging it's own grave, and it's incredibly sad to see all the comments here defending it, when I and so many others in the industry.. bust our tails- even on the most crappy of games sometimes. The hardest i've ever worked, was for the Incredibles CD rom game.. a no nothing easy cash in title. I'm not saying that game should have done amazing- though it PROBABLY did because it was "the incredibles!" But there are hard working people everywhere who get screwed a little more each time.. and every time people steal our games.

You can't justify it. If you want to be straight up truthful and say "well I can't afford it.. so..yeah.." then fine. But don't try to justify bankrupting companies who work their tails off for you guys. Because you can't. And yes.. when games sales fail, companies close. happens all the time. You might not even know about it! I can probably even name 3 companies you guys have never heard of who've been on the brink of closing due to companies unwilling to take as many risks. They don't all get into those problems BECAUSE of piracy. But piracy is just more fuel to the fire.

[CBaoth]

I love to read the piracy articles here. You're always bound to read some hair-brained excuses in the posts that follow. I love how ironic it is for thieves to spend $1500k on a gaming rig (initial cost), spend another $360-1000 annually for an ISP, and another $200 on storage mediums a year YET come here and say a $60 game is too expensive to justify stealing. The sense of entitlement here is overwhelming at times. I even had a poster here once PM me to argue that pedophilia should be legalized and even provided pics. Gotta love N4G.

[caffman]

with a switch to turn the mod off and on. But thats because the moddified media player was top notch

[NeloRisi]

Man, I shake my head at all the guys here *justifying* piracy.. "Yeah, its the bakers fault that I steal his bread !!"

People have always been greedy bastards and people will always BE greedy bastards. What should be done is that companies need to start earning money in different ways - if you create a game you know has a high chance of being pirated, then you put in a lot of in-game ads.

Look at Burnout Paradise, IIRC the Obama campaign paid a ton of cash to have their ads in that game. Work like that or think up something even better. You survive by adapting.

[dj55555555]

put everything on blu-ray

[darkjanus]

Pirates have always existed. No matter what you do games and music will always be pirated, its impossible to eliminate completely. While it does have a negative effect on the industry why is it every time a game doesnt sell well its because of pirates. I think they have just become a scapegoat for shoddy developers. rather than admit no-one wants your game you blame pirates.

I will admit i HAVE downloaded games. I know full well it is illegal but i do it regardless. Im not going to justify it with a load of BS, ill say it staight, its free and i wasnt really that excited about the game anyway.

Games cost £45 on release here in the UK, as a student i simply cant afford to buy every release. If i feel a game justifys that price then im happy to pay it. There a few releases im waiting for which ill be down there on day one to buy. (inFamous, Dragonage origins and several others)

If a developer wants me to shell out that kind of money for a game then it had better be worth it. I simply am not going to pay good money for a game if i cinsider it to be sub-par

DLC doesnt help either. Some developer do make good DLC(ie Bethesda)but many are now charging us consumer for stuff taht really should be included with the game. How many games have been released with the promise of patches to fix issues.

So many Developers have gotton lazy. They are happy to release mediocre games which in this tough financial times people simply arent willing to pay for.Companies which ARE making high quality games arent struggling. Im not just talking about good graphics i mean i GOOD GAME. Take Stardocks Galactic Civ, the graphics are hugely outdated but the gameplay is fantastic. Stop focusing on the eyecandy.

Bottom line its a capitalist economy. Companies in every sector go under, thats just the way it is. I wonder how many removal firms went under this year, dont hear you b****ing about that. Its simple competition, the strong survive and the weak go under.

If you want me to pay a premium price for your game then it had better be worth it. If not ill simply get it free. As i have said i kmow its illegal but if ive torrented it i simply didnt think it was worth the price you were asking. So stop blaming pirates. If no-one buys you game its your fault not ours

[whooda]

wow