"Do I think subscriptions are going to be the dominant model? I actually think we are going to see a diversity of business models. Even our Game Pass subscription is a combination of subscription and transaction. You have this subscription, you get access to the game, there's in-game transactions, but also you get a discount on the purchases, and if the game leaves Game Pass, you can choose to buy it. I see [Game Pass] as a product that has subscription in it, but includes other transactional business models. I think that is going to continue.
"And you'll see new business models, like advertising, like... people are talking a lot about NFTs as an alternative way to monetise."
"If the game leaves game pass, you can choose to buy it".
This is my number 1 biggest issue with subscription gaming, you HAVE been buying it on a monthly basis, the game hasn't been "free" that whole time.
If I'm 30 hours deep into a 200 hour RPG and it leaves gamepass, sure I can buy it afterwards, but you're still paying the sub every month on top of having to buy the game anyway, so why not just buy the games you like instead of paying a rental?
Maybe I'm just an old head, but I value ownership and preservation of games, I just can't stomach subscriptions being the future of gaming. (I'm not even going to get started on NFT's).
"If I'm 30 hours deep into a 200 hour RPG and it leaves gamepass, sure I can buy it afterwards, but you're still paying the sub every month on top of having to buy the game anyway, so why not just buy the games you like instead of paying a rental?"
-Because thats not gonna be the norm for every game you play in Gamepass. I also dont understand your logic, overtime if you really use Gamepass you will have played alot of games per year, that you either would have skipped because each game is a separate financial decision & most gamers have a budget and even if they have the money still smart shoppers can see they would have paid far more buying the games individually. Also you continue to have new games added, your comment sounds like if you pay for a game somehow youve been cheated, lol, come on, its a option, not mandatory, its a sub service. Its really a simple solution OF COURSE if you find yourself with 200 hrs into a game and its leaving Gamepass #1 you'd likely buy something like that upfront anyway #2 if not its gonna be a few dollars to purchase by then & are you honestly mad that a game you didnt expect to draw you in for 200+ hrs is gonna cost you dirt cheap years later???
I dont get how the USED GAME market was just championed by Sony & its fans last gen but suddenly ps fans only want to play games they will physically own for a lifetime now???? -Is that only because Microsoft is tge one letting you PLAY MORE GAMES for a bargain, not Sony?
Excellent deduction. The fans still won't get it and what services will do to the console industry. You got the fans buying less month after month but praise a service or wait for games to hit the service over buying. As if that's healthy for developers.
The only one that would profit from their service and nickel and diming is Microsoft at the top of the pyramid scheme. They wouldn't care if companies die or get bought because of reduced game sales. Because it's all about their service models.
"I dont get how the USED GAME market was just championed by Sony & its fans last gen but suddenly ps fans only want to play games they will physically own for a lifetime now????"
Make this make sense. PS fans championed the used game market, "but suddenly" PS fans only want to play games they will physically own? How is that inconsistent? Or were you attempting to push some bad faith, sleight of hand, straw-man argument to pretend fans preferring to own physical copies of their games argued they would never exercise their rights as owners of those copies to sell them?
"Is that only because Microsoft is tge one letting you PLAY MORE GAMES for a bargain, not Sony?"
Sony fans championing the used game market (which you're apparently holding a grudge over) had nothing to do with Sony letting anyone "PLAY MORE GAMES for a bargain" and everything to do with not wanting a console manufacturer to use their influence to kill off a market that people use to buy and sell their games, as exists with countless other products.
Well if you tend to play 200+ games one at a time I'm not sure why you are on Gamepass, it's not the service for you. On the other hand if you are not that type of gamer and like playing a selection of games some big some small then Gamepass would be a good deal, if you find a game that you like that takes longer than a month to play then you get a discount to buy and your saves don't go anywhere. Some people expect Gamepass to be the be all and end all and if it doesn't satisfy them in every way shouldn't exist, it's an option that you can take or leave, simple as that, purchasing games as we used to know hasn't gone anywhere. I love it and it's saved me a lot of money but you can't stomach it, fair enough don't use it.
RauLeCreuset "How is that inconsistent? Or were you attempting to push some bad faith, sleight of hand, straw-man argument to pretend fans preferring to own physical copies of their games argued they would never exercise their rights as owners of those copies to sell them?"
-Yes if you pay attention it is inconsistent with the general theme of the *criticsm Im seeing levied at Gamepass= ps folks keep screaming about how they only want to buy games to own them (as if for ever) yet the used game market was such a big deal to these same folks, which means the end result was a similar situation where alot more people got to play those games 2nd hand for cheap which is great Ive never had a problem that but the downside of that was worst than Gamepass for devs as they got no cut of used games sales= ex 3mil sold, 7-8mil total played because of used games. Now suddenly even though devs get paid up front for Gamepas + sales somehow its bad because we should care about owning every game forever, no wait because sales per copy is whats best for devs, no wait because waiting for a good deal instead of just buying a game you want makes you less of a gamer, lmfao ALL of these things are a part of what happens in the used game market but NOW oh no sony didnt do it first so its bad. Nothing but salt.
Nonsense. You're all over the place trying to attribute disparate attitudes within the gaming community on supporting developers to PS fans in response to someone who didn't say a single, solitary word expressing concern for developers in arguing why they prefer ownership over subscription.
"Yes if you pay attention it is inconsistent with the general theme of the *criticsm Im seeing levied at Gamepass= ps folks keep screaming about how they only want to buy games to own them (as if for ever) yet the used game market was such a big deal to these same folks, which means the end result was a similar situation where alot more people got to play those games 2nd hand for cheap which is great Ive never had a problem that but the downside of that was worst than Gamepass for devs as they got no cut of used games sales= ex 3mil sold, 7-8mil total played because of used games."
More bad faith nonsense. That quote is like a clinic in how to arrive at a conclusion, through a series of flawed assumptions, prompted by a premise based on mischaracterization, in order to attack a straw-man argument rather than what the person you're responding to actually argued. Welshy's post didn't state anything about supporting devs or owning the game forever, though an obvious perk of ownership is being able to maintain ownership or relinquish it if desired. You're working overtime to manufacture an issue.
Your entire argument is like someone proceeding to do a series of equations that require having correctly solved for x after failing to correctly solve for x.
I do understand your logic and that precisely my problem with services like Game Pass... I'd rather buy my games and that's it, why subscribe to a service to end up buying the games I paid via subscription?
I have so many things going on in my life that now I play games at my own pace, Wife, Kids, Friends, Family, trips, job, laziness, etc... It's more affordable and practical to just own my games without having to pay for Game Pass.
No one owns a game, regardless of media, you buy a license to play the software, and what happens when servers are closed? the game/disc is not even worth the plastic it is printed on.
Buying a game physical or digital grants you identical rights for the license.
@4show
Exactly, for me personally, it is saving me 100's if not 1000's per year, even after paying the subscription fee. Sure i still buy games outside of the service, but there are a lot of games i have played and finished via the service, without shelling out 60/70 for each game.
"You got the fans buying less month after month but praise a service or wait for games to hit the service over buying. As if that's healthy for developers.
The only one that would profit from their service and nickel and diming is Microsoft at the top of the pyramid scheme. They wouldn't care if companies die or get bought because of reduced game sales. Because it's all about their service models."
The more and more 3rd party publishers jumping on board and hosting their games on gamepass day 1, seems to disagree with this statement. If there was no profitability for developers/publishers, the subscription would not be increasing in userbase, let alone game quality.
"More bad faith nonsense. That quote is like a clinic in how to arrive at a conclusion, through a series of flawed assumptions"
-Its funny you try to pretend Im making up this narrative about how ps folks are throwing salt because Xbox fans dont *have to buy specific games and or are waiting for them to come to Gamepass, thus through their twisted logic attempting paint xbox gamers & the service in a negative light. lol, just READ the comments on this thread. Its not assumptions or jumping to conclusions many have literally said just that, heres 1 example of many:
ApocalypseShadow "You got the fans buying less month after month but praise a service or wait for games to hit the service over buying. As if that's healthy for developers."
Finally, #1 he clearly doesnt understand that devs are compensated for thier games upfront for any Gamepass deal, #2 Like I said there is a obvious correlation that can be made here to the used game market which limited total sales because the market itself is proped up by gamers *waiting for a low cost used copy, which the devs themselves do not profit from -lol, but go ahead pretend Im just making shiii up, people can read & see for themselves, no amount of salt will change that.
Also gamers will probably spend more on subs and in game purchases etc over buying 1 game a month (12 a year) So we the gamer will end up spending more than we did when we bought physical. Its so easy to add skins, weapons, in game currency without realising it compared to a one off purchase. We think £10/15 a month is awesome but if you check your bank account statement at the end of the year you'll find you've spent more on gaming. My friend racked up £5,000 on Google play with in game gems over 3 years and never even realised until I checked his history when repairing his phone.
It's not limited to Xbox. I have discovered a load of posts pertaining to how glorious MS Edge is in comparison to the likes of Fire Fox and other browsers via Reddit. Their promotion campaign must be supercharged!
Well it is the 20th Anniversary celebration of Xbox today, I know you probably dont care but then the obvious question is why do ps folks find all the Xbox news....I mean you literally have to read it, click on it, and this part is crazy= start commenting about it instead of perhaps spending that time on ps news you do care about.
So whats your point? This is a gaming news site last I checked and Xbox has more gaming news at the moment, most sites have something to say about that. I mean next up, water is wet.
Perhaps you need to take a break, he literally just asked what's with all the Xbox news and you called him a Playstation fan and told him he shouldn't even come in here.
I get it, being on the front lines of a console war can be tiring but everyone here is not your enemy.
Frontlines?, lol I like good Xbox news, you dont see me trolling good or bad ps news. Youre on a Xbox thread littered with negative ps folks comments, its a free country so sure its all good, they can comment all they want. I actually dont mind reading their twisted logic & responding when I choose, either way dont get mad and lecture ME for making fun of it all....its a dumb question for anyone online browsing a gaming specific news site like n4g, especially if you can read.
Magatsuhi. v Why the hell do you care if this site has alot of *good Xbox gaming news? Sure doesnt *sound like the gamer you're pretending to be now???
Why do you assume I'm a ps fan boy? Are you that insecure that you're now starting to jump to conclusions? And what does the 20th anniversary have to do with all the Xbox good articles that has been happening for months now?
Who the hell wants to constantly read false headlines on how Xbox is revolutionary or how it has gone beyond the console war? Why are you so adamant about defending Xbox? So far you have shown that you love Microsoft and you can't stand whenever someone speaks negatively about them and you wana call me a fanboy?
Yes we do. You must be the Sherlock Holmes of Gaming....thats cool just keep that same energy when Sony has a celebratory event. lol, you guys are so funny.
"Do I think subscriptions are going to be the dominant model? I actually think we are going to see a diversity of business models. Even our Game Pass subscription is a combination of subscription and transaction. You have this subscription, you get access to the game, there's in-game transactions, but also you get a discount on the purchases, and if the game leaves Game Pass, you can choose to buy it. I see [Game Pass] as a product that has subscription in it, but includes other transactional business models. I think that is going to continue.
"And you'll see new business models, like advertising, like... people are talking a lot about NFTs as an alternative way to monetise."
Well there you go. 😳
What's with all the Xbox good articles?