A Closer Look at How Xbox Series X|S Integrates Full AMD RDNA 2 Architecture - Xbox Wire

We here at Team Xbox would like to congratulate and celebrate our amazing partners at AMD on today’s announcement of the Radeon RX 6000 Series of RDNA 2 GPUs. It was incredible to see AMD demonstrate the power and potential that the new AMD RDNA 2 architecture can deliver to gamers around the globe.

[nickanasty206]

Lets hope optimized games will get us to 4k 60fps instead of the 4K 30 we have been seeing so much of again on this new gen. I know its a big ask for consoles, as GPU's that are double the cost can still have issues reaching 60 with everything turned up.

[darthv72]

Not every game needs 60 so its up to the developer if they want to go for that cinematic look. There will be more 60fps games this gen than previous so there is that peace of mind to look forward to.

[RaidenBlack]

Actually it might be misleading for some ...
"Xbox Series X|S are the only next-generation consoles with full hardware support for all the RDNA 2 capabilities AMD showcased today."
PlayStation cannot have hardware support for DirectX raytracing but virtue of it being only available via a Microsoft exclusive API: DirectX 12 Ultimate. It's just the software MS writes to utilize raytracing on the GPU.
SONY CAN use the hardware, JUST not the API. Sony writes their own.
Microsoft's statement was based entirely upon a presentation which featured primarily PC based features.
Similarly MS lacks the tempest engine. But has their own solution. They each have their own thing going and that's fine.

[Bender6502]

Not every single game needs to be @60, but every single game benefits from @60. As for 'cinematic look' that's just tosh. It's another term used to describe a game that doesn't make the grade. Just my humble opinion of course.

[nickanasty206]

True, as long as its a locked 30 im fine with it for console. If i ever want to be guaranteed more frames, i just hop on my pc.

[RaidenBlack]

"Through close collaboration and partnership between Xbox and AMD, not only have we delivered on this promise, we have gone even further introducing additional next-generation innovation such as hardware accelerated Machine Learning capabilities for better NPC intelligence, more lifelike animation, and improved visual quality via techniques such as ML powered super resolution."

[RaidenBlack]

Optimization is the key. Console optimization is more stringent since hardware variation is minimal.
Battlefield 4 ran on 256mb vram on PS3. PC required minimum 4GB (yes taking into account it ran on Windows but still, you get the difference. That's 32 times the increment). Emphasis on the word 'minimum'.
8GB for higher visual fidelity.

[RaidenBlack]

@TheLastRun
I agree. They're not available at the API level.
But they can write their own piece of, for say Mesh Shading, for the supported hardware.
Software is software. It takes advantage of hardware. Hardware has to be in the silicon. IF its in the silicon ANYONE can write software for it. That's how its been working. That's how proprietary game engine exists.
You can write your own game engine code or use license of an existing one.

[RazzerRedux]

@RaidenBlack

Exactly. Sony has been writing their own APIs for GPUs for quite some time now. Just because MS has a version of such things and put their own name on it doesn't mean Sony doesn't have the same stuff. You could also say XSX doesn't have the "Geometry Engine". So what? They have their own implementation.

[Christopher]

@TheLastRun: most of what you listed is based on NVidia tech, not DX12. Microsoft is continuing to add some of RDNA 2 to the DX12 to streamline its use in development, but as references/calls and not as unique to DX12 or because of DX12.

[gravedigger]

@TheLastRun

VRS is a standard feature of RDNA 2, not an MS tech. PS5 can have on their own. Mesh Shading = Geometry Engine.

Btw. ex PS5 engineer, now Principle Engineer at Roblox for a while now ( Roblox is an Xbox console exclusive btw. ) said this regarding VRS for PS5:

"Variable Rate Shading is nice for saving cycles, but VRS’ optimization capability doesn’t hold a handle to the Geometry Engine’s capabilities. VRS without GE means you’re still processing vertices you can/should eliminate in earlier stages to begin with. More free compute/memory."

https://twitter.com/syke/st...

Activision developer on Resetera regarding Matt Hargett tweet:

Processes in the GE happen before you even begin drawing cycles, which is where VRS comes into play. See NVIDIA Turing mesh shaders for a better idea at what’s happening here.

https://www.resetera.com/th...

or this :

https://segmentnext.com/202...

Xbox fans really need to stop spreading crap what PS5 has and what doesn't. Anyway, Xbox article clearly implies that XSX/S has of the shelf PC GPU RDNA 2 parts since they've mention AMD 6000 GPU. Sony as always created some stuff on their own for PS5 API. Remember y'all what happened this gen with DX12 crap 6 years ago? OMG, X1 has DX12, it will close the gap to PS4 ( base consoles, of course ). Of course, X1 with DX12 didn't closed the gap, instead gap has widened in some case between the base consoles.

[gravedigger]

Also, AMD makes PC parts first and foremost and Windows 10 is the most prevalent, and Xbox runs off the same architecture (the X stands for DirectX) so it makes sense.

[Ju]

Right. Sony doesn't have Direct Storage. It has a freaking custom HW controller which can DMA compressed data directly into texture memory with 0 CPU usage. Indeed. Not part of RDNA2
Or, mesh shaders; call it whatever you want.
Or even custom RT solution which might not be in RDNA2; because, you know, in all these launch titles that MS showed they were bleeding pixels with all that showcase RT. Oh wait, no that was R&C, GT7, Spiderman, ... which Series X game actually showed us RT? Was this under NDA what happened?
So, ya, Series X might just have all those RDNA2 features (and don't get me wrong, I'll probably get me a 6800 or even 6900XT eventually), but that doesn't mean Sony doesn't have features which can compete.
And yes, that looks to me that MS final came full cycle and made the Series X an embedded PC with a locked down version of windows.

[DJStotty]

@gravedigger

Hardly any games created on xbox one used Directx12 approx 33 games in total that got support added.

[SierraGuy]

I see more 4k 60 fps titles coming to ps5 vs series x right now.

Also rainbow 6 120hz bc has game breaking screen tear. Hope that's not the norm. It's ugly.

[subzero1992]

"Xbox Series X|S are the only next-generation consoles with full hardware support for all the RDNA 2 capabilities AMD showcased today."

[Atticus_finch]

Keywords is "showcased today"

[Bluemaster77]

Stop fussing over semantics. This confirms it, XSX is in a league of its own.

[ZeroBlue2]

@bluemaster77 It doesn't show...The reason they've barely shown any gameplay is because they don't have anything that doesn't look last gen compared to ratchet and clank.

[xHeavYx]

@Bluemaster
You are so blind that you don't even realize it.

[DarkZane]

The PS5 has RDNA 2 capabilities too and even have limited RDNA 3 capabilities, which the XSX doesn't have.

[WireMucks]

They showcased PS5 console exclusive,..So stop being morons xbox guys,..

If anything ,..how they were touting faster frequencies and ''smart shift'',..maybe PS5 is closer to big Navi then Series X,..

[NeoGamer232]

@Bluemaster77
After reading that article the only thing confirmed for me was that MS got a bit of a discount on chips made by AMD for a media plug. That article was fluffy at best.

[Ghostbob]

AS REDGAMING TECH said Literally, all of this is just confirming what we've said from the very beginning. PS5 is custom RDNA 2 with sony specific features. Xbox is RDNA 2 closer to desktop features

[PCpower]

And best part is the Xbox series X has 52 CU's and is only $499, but the announced 6800 GPU from AMD is 60 CU's and costs $579 for JUST the video card. It's obvious that the console is the better choice.

[NEXUS-6]

PCpower - the sad part about that is, ms 1st party aren't talented enough to make full use of all those CU's.

Do you think 3rd party devs are going to also?

Think back to PS3 and the difficulty 3rd party (and 1st party) had developing for it.

[StarLink]

@NEXUS-6 I know a wannabee non developer like you wouldn't be able to take full advance of anything so don't worry about real developers.

[RazzerRedux]

@PCpower

"And best part is the Xbox series X has 52 CU's and is only $499, but the announced 6800 GPU from AMD is 60 CU's and costs $579 for JUST the video card. It's obvious that the console is the better choice."

lol.....wow, you left out a ton of information, didn't you?

"Next up is the $579 Radeon RX 6800, which is aiming for Nvidia’s RTX 2080 Ti. According to AMD, it beats or matches Nvidia’s older card in the limited number of games that the company has tested in both 4K and 1440p. It comes equipped with 60 compute units, a 1815Mhz base clock, 2105Mhz boost clock, 16.17 teraflops of GPU performance, and 16GB of GDDR6 memory."

https://www.theverge.com/20...

[Sonyslave3]

Lol that guy said ps5 is rdna 3 like a couple of months ago. Take everything he say with a grain of salt .

[gravedigger]

Precisely that. Well, Xbox fans will see it differently, though.

[NEXUS-6]

StarLink - or 343i? Is that what your getting at? The 1st party studios at ms have proven their inability to produce quality games. Making it more complex is just going to bamboozle them. Craig says hi.

[FanboySpotter]

You shouldn't rely on people like rgt for tech stuff. Should've been crossed out as soon as he started mentioning rdna3 and ps5 in the same sentence.

[lifeisgamesok]

PS5 has shown the more impressive games IMO so until the XSX can show me the power in games I couldn't care less about these features

[Sonyslave3]

Well rumors have it ps5 was supposed to release last year and according to the leaks going back this ps5 development kit was ahead of xbx and it start to make sense now.

Remember that sony engineers who leak his Twitter tweets about ps5 being 1.5 rnda and not full Rdna 2 well like he was telling the truth.

[subzero1992]

"In our quest to put gamers and developers first we chose to wait for the most advanced technology from our partners at AMD before finalizing our architecture."

Microsoft waiting for AMD to complete its RDNA 2 engineering. As been said Sony was going to launch PS5 last years with some RDNA 2 features.

[FanboySpotter]

@lifeisgamesok I doubt it. Even if naughty dog was a xbox game studio you'd say the same thing. We'll see your reactions on future games ig.

[Atom666]

I can only imagine what the hive at Resetera are doing with this news.

Everything has pointed at this for awhile. From the rumored delays in the SX dev kits, to that PS engineer tweeting about how PS5 is "in between" RDNA 1 and 2 with some unique bits.

There is no mystery guys. If PS5 had full RDNA2 features, they'd say it exactly like that. But they stop short of it. Cerny will talk about how its based" on RDNA for a reason.

There's some custom solutions on their end, true. But the reality is that they went with RDNA 1, got some features of RDNA 2 as you'd expect, and implemented some of their own stuff where they could.

It's probably more cost effective, got them out sooner, and explains the high variable clocks. In practice, it won't matter too much for us. But there's no need to spin it in a different way.

[IRetrouk]

Its rdna 2 with stuff removed and added by cerny, this has been known since the ps5 dev talk. Both amd and sony have confirmed multiple times that the ps5 gpu is rdna 2. Just because its missing some features(or the ms related names atleast) that ms has does not make it an rdna 1 card, not even close, does the xbox have cache scrubbers? Isnt that also a new rdna 2 feature thats exclusive to the ps5? Does that make the xbox gpu rdna 1 too🤔

[lifeisgamesok]

PS5 most likely has the features from RDNA 2 that Sony felt they needed and everything else is customized to work better with Sony's engines and APIs

I still thinking anyone jumping on the power narrative will look silly this generation

[Sonyslave3]

Yup 100%

[Atom666]

@IRetrouk

No Xbox is actually RDNA5. They just took out the RDNA 5 features they didn't need and added others.

Thats what your basically saying too, right? Just think about it for a minute before involving your feelings.

[IRetrouk]

Is it🤔 are you sure?
No I'm literally repeating what cerny said, rdna 2 with stuff taken out they didn't want and stuff they did added in, like the cache scrubbers.....
Feelings? Nothing I wrote was to do with feelings, point out what I said that was wrong? Answer my question atleast🤣

This whole narrative that has been pushed by xbox fanboys(not xbox fans) about rdna 1 has long been proven wrong, multiple times now, its a custom rdna2 chip, like it, dont🤷‍♂️

#factsoverfeelings

[DJStotty]

@Atom666

It is quite simple, PS5 has a custom RDNA 2 GPU, Series X has a custom RDNA 2 GPU.

The key word here being "custom" with each GPU having differences. One will have things the other will not. One will add extra things, one may remove unnecessary features. Both GPU's are still based off RDNA 2 architecture.

[Atom666]

Haha. Oh, I have an agenda and feelings alright. Both lead me to laughing at the prophets on Era, Twitter, etc. who try so hard to see things that just aren't there. Time and time again.

And saying "it has all of the features of ______, but chose to remove some features only to replace them is as foolish as it sounds. Sorry.

All of this info is going to come out soon enough, I guess. I'd say it's best not to double down on your feelings about it just yet, but it's understandable if you want to do so.

And not sure what questions I'm supposed to answer. I think XB and PS5's solutions for clearing cache/throughput are equally nteresting. Not drinking either of the Cerny or XVA kool aid just yet, but it'll be interesting to see what gets more traction in the PC space.

[IRetrouk]

🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️

[elazz]

Obviously referring to Directx and microsoft apis which are available in the Rx 6000 series. Doesn't mean nvidia or sony alternative are better or worse.

[Ghostbob]

You speak common sense now lets hope the fanboys can learn some!

[RaidenBlack]

This news is being covered by some tech sites.
And the PC and Xbox fans are just wrecking the PS fanboys in the comment section.

[FGHFGHFGH]

When Nvidia demoed the 3080 on Doom, it was running on vulkan. If direct x gave a better result I think they would have used it.

[Bender6502]

No, I'm sure you are correct. It certainly doesn't mean Sony's version will be better or worse, but, and it's an important but. Directx12 ultimate will be seemlessly used across xbox ecosystem including Windows PC's. Sony's won't. That's a big advantage for developers right there. And BTW, when developers work on Nvidia cards for PC,they will also be using DX12 ultimate. DirectX is a standard. While other options exist DX is the most popular by far

[Sayai jin]

Who said that weren't?

[IRetrouk]

Here we go again🤣

[NEXUS-6]

Phil 'I'm excited for what we haven't shown' Spencer will start with the bullish claims once again.

[Outside_ofthe_Box]

Got to give it up to their marketing team lol

[RazzerRedux]

What? You don't completely believe Microsoft PR when it comes to what they say about their competition?

You are so untrusting, bud.

;)

[IRetrouk]

I dont😏 fool me twice n all that...

[Bender6502]

We believe in generations! C'mon they're both as bad.

[RazzerRedux]

Of course they are. And I gave Sony all kinds of shit for backtracking on that "generations" nonsense. Not sure how any of this is relevant.

[I_am_Batman]

It seems like the architectural differences between the Series X and an RDNA2/Zen2 based gaming PC will be minimal. I wonder if MS can get the API to a level where the PC versions of games will just work without the need to do a port at all. I wonder if they would allow console players to fiddle around with graphical settings though.

[Bender6502]

I'm wondering the same. But whatever, it should be be relatively easy to go back and forth.

[Bluemaster77]

So much sodium over the truth.

[crazyCoconuts]

So PS5 is running with less CUs, lower TF, and I'm inferring you believe that they've implemented less of the RDNA2 architecture. So what's your prediction on 3rd party games XSX vs. PS5? Resolution / frame rate will be ____% greater on the XSX on average across 3rd party titles?

[Bluemaster77]

I can't say, but its set up to be pretty substantial. We're talking PS5 not having numerous efficiency techniques at their disposal.

[Bender6502]

I'll say. If your'e referring to 4K @60 that are pushing H/W easily 85% will have more stable frame rates on SX. 4K @30 0% difference. Of course, it's never that easy in reality ,because series X has a superior set of RDNA2 features to play with.

[crazyCoconuts]

Not how many titles will have better frame rates or resolution, but what percent better will they be? 20% more pixels?

[NXFather]

Raytracing on or off plus 4k60.

[RGB]

"set up to be pretty substantial"
Considering every major 3rd party launching on PS5 and XSX are showing the exact same resolution and frame-rate, I can tell you this is nonsense.

[Binarycode]

Microsoft at it's marketing game again.

PS5 has far more advanced features in it's whole system then xbsx. It's just facts.

This is evident in games already shown, let alone what's to come.

Microsoft are pushing Dirt that doesn't even look next gen because Halo was a Shambles, while Sony has Exclusives already with extensive amounts of Ray-tracing, Quality at 4k.

Microsoft is just about Gamespass, wake up. All they keep going on about is Gears 5. lol

[Bender6502]

Oh dear.

[gravedigger]

So, XSX/S has of the shelf PC GPU RDNA 2 since they mentioned AMD 6000 card in article