IGN says, "Halo Infinite’s delay is a setback for Microsoft in the short term for both its flagship franchise and its Xbox Series X console launch, but it is ultimately the right move."
Must have been a hard decision for them with all the negative feedback they got. Not to mention the memes. I’m just surprised at how many people who said it was in good shape and just needed lighting are now saying it needs more time? Hopefully it’s only one delay and not multiple.
The sad thing is the whole lighting argument actually came directly from Digital Foundry's Alex Battaglia who should be objective and honest but constantly just plays to one side.
Alex presented a detailed analysis to support his argument. He also provided examples from other titles that can be adversely affected by real-time lighting issues. That being said, Alex also pointed out that some effects need to be improved. Plus, the object pop-in needs to be resolved.
The whole article is a defence piece of Microsoft and sales pitch for Xbox Series One. I get that Ryan McCaffrey is the IGN Xbox editor but he should be more objective, he is not a journalist.
If ray tracing and time of day are preventing your game, running on a custom built from the ground up next gen engine, from looking like a next gen title...then your game is not a next gen title. End of story.
So, all this being said, which game will make it to the line up?? Forza highly doubted, doesn't even have a name or gameplay. First 3 months post launch are crucial..ouch Now they're selling the 1000 of launch titles, due to BC 😂🤦🏻♂️ 🤦♂️🤦♂️
Alex is a biased fanboy who in hell makes a 1h video explaining why something looks ok when it clearly doesn't...
I like DF but not that Alex guy. He has xbox fanboy written on his forehead it's that obvious.
Alex is a fanboy and need to be careful to not discredit DF to a point of no return.
Yeah, the foundry is really no different, they just use more tech speak in their biases.
Yeah I've said it before as a long time fan of DF they really started being less harsh on Microsoft when they suddenly got invited to Redmond for a hands on with the Scorpio so not saying they are in the take....but they are in the take and the lighting video was an absolute disgrace even the comments were critical of the analysis and work of Alex I feel he's a puppet in a way the bosses asked for him to do damage control on Halo and he did. The defence of halo was an absolute insult to long time fans seriously I watched it the entire way it wasn't an analysis of the clearly bad issues they were only mentioned in the last thirty seconds if the 20 minute video. The pop in the clipping your space ship ran through a tree with no impact and disappeared. MC gun cast a reflection in the water 60 metered away easily at the start when he leaves the ship and Alex was blaming lightning it's more than lighting. I'll stick around for retro but I'm done with them outside of that.
I know I have old man eyes but I actually thought it looked good in motion. It wasnt until people paused and still framed some of the shots that it looks bland. I would never have even noticed the brutes face had it not been paused. Overall though, it ran smooth and I liked the new particle effects and detail in various points of interest but I can see where this is the sort of game that you are generally focused on where you are facing because everything else moves by in a blurred state (I think they call it depth of field). Like in racing games. you are focused on the road and not so much on what goes wizzing by. Maybe this game will get a photo mode like others have, and in that mode is where the stills are meant to look their best? The only things I really noticed in motion was pop in. So that told me it was still early and not optimized. Ive seen some early footage of other non optimized games for next gen and noticed pop in as well. Delays are needed if more time is needed. Better to delay and fix things than try and fix them after the fact. WAY too many games are guilty of that last part.
@morganfell, if a game runs on og xbone its not a next gen game.
Your biased opinion in Alex. If he didn't back his argument with substantial evidence then I would agree. But if you recall they do mention that halo looks flat due to the time of day and because of the lack of static lighting which he showed examples of. Nothing digital foundry said was off the mark. To think otherwise is pure bias. As he didn't say what they showed looked good or next gen. Simply that there is a stark contrast of detail from certain moments in the demo they showed...so he went to analyze why that might be. And if they implemented static lighting the game would benefit greatly....that by itself would take a lot of time, hence the delay.
@ Mr Pumblechook Agree.
Waking up this morning to a DF video backtracking a lot of Alex's comments without saying they were wrong just hey lighting is bad but yeah all of these other things were bad and we understand why the game is delayed. Our damage control video needed damage control itself and trust me it feels terrible for me to trash DF as a fan of their prior work and a bug fan of DF retro but I feel they have lost their way when it comes to Ms titles and bias. @scirius no he didn't present a detailed analysis he was wrong in many areas such as light source directions being blocked by object meanwhile in his examples chief had direct sunlight on him and completely ignored the missing flash from the muzzle present as far back as halo 3 and characters casting no shadow those were lighting issues he could of talked about but he chose to talk about spoke lighting and the sun's direction for far to long. His examples were tryi g to minimise the issues and it's clear they have been on the take since they went to get hands on with the unreleased Scorpio and xsx look at how they ignore issues in the gears 5 video while claiming it's a technical masterpiece they zoomed in once on an ear to highlight that light penetrated the ear which it really did not it was light bouncing off the top of the ear as if it was a reflection. And when Alex talked about the issues in halo 5 other than lighting it was in the final minute of the 20 minute video long after people stopped paying attention.
All the arm chair analysts should have seen this coming. We need a new article, "PlayStation gamers in uproar for being blinded sided by a decision to delay and continue working on game. Never in history has this been done before!" /s
Halo needs to be removed from the hands of 343i. They had 5 years and the game still looks awful. 343i have yet to make a solid game with both a great campaign and MP. Let them try something new and if they still fail to make a good game in a decent timeframe then it’s time to make decisions.
I'll tell you what adds insult to injury; Destiny 2 - a game evolved from Halo and by it's creators - will be XSX optimised. Something 343i couldn't achieve after 5 years and with a budget of 500 million dollars. It beggars belief.
Jin My question is where was that huge budget spent because the game sure looked like a cross gen title
They don't even have to make it a blame move if they want to save face. They could move all there franchise's around in the name of refreshment. Like Playground now doing Fable. I'd like a Halo game from Coalition or Ninja theory. A Banjo Kazooie from Double fine. Leave 343 to try some new. Something their own.
The 500 million is a compete rumor
It’s kind of funny that everyone is ripping into the game for the graphics. What if the campaign story is amazing? I know the multiplayer will be great like halo 5. If the campaign is great that’s 90 percent of what I care about. The graphics should be better for sure but it looked good enough for me as long as the story turned out good. Based on the leaks from people who worked there, it seems the management and workplace culture is more to blame than the actual talent of the devs. Good to be back btw
I believe that the devs seriously thought that it was in good shape, They thought that because it is "NATIVE" 4K and 60FPS people would not mind the last gen quality graphics.
I can't believe how games industry professional someone who actually makes games could think that this game was in good shape when us dumb gamers could see right away that it wasn't. I was so not surprised to hear about the developmental trouble behind the scenes.
It’s actually an insult to gamers intelligence. I blame xbox apologists
In a group Q&A session on Friday, 343 Industries studio head Chris Lee told Polygon and other press that fans should go back and watch the 4K stream to see Halo Infinite in its fuller glory. “I that that really lets our game show itself in full fidelity,” Lee said. This statement shows CHRIS LEE's FULL CONFIDENCE in what they showed.
Well, tbf, that is kind of the narrative they've been going with ever since X1X and the fans kinda seem to lap it up.
I think they also left room for handling ray tracing and apparently thought people would realize that, but failed miserably. But as someone else said, if the graphics have to look like this at the expense of 4k/60 and ray tracing, it isn't worth it.
And so did MS cous they showed in in the Xbox SeX event. They are both to blame. But MS takes the bigest blame here, thats a fact.
I would say more people said the gameplay itself was in good shape.
Yeah real Xbox fanboys saying that, but that was not the reality...
I disagree. The mechanics were good you can't argue that. I would agree visually disappointing
Yeah guys like kinda funny games saying how great it looked during the live reaction event then going back on there word after seeing what everyone said online about it just showed there true colours.
How come this wasn't accepted when most said the game wasn't ready and now those same gamers who were making baseless defense arguments are now accepting this and praising the delay. Cross gen clearly held back this game, held back the game engine and I just want to know where did that spend all that money yet after 5 years game looked so last gen
They had 5 years though 😂
This is what is troubling about all this. What have they been doing?
Games get delayed all the time. Even Last of Us 2 was delayed multiple times and look at how it ends up, outstanding game. Better to have a great delayed game later than a bad game now.
The difference is, Sony didn't show a poor build of the game months from release, go on to say that everything was going fine, then a couple weeks later make up an excuse as to why it was being delayed which used some topical thing going on to try and act like it wasn't their fault. When Sony delays a game, they say they're doing it to improve the game, usually well before it was to release, and more often than not, if they did show in game footage, that footage was still impressive or at least at an acceptable level. Sony spends its time defending what they show in this regard, because they don't set themselves up to have to defend what they show.
Yeah... Whe saw that with Crackdown 3....😉
And here we go with all the contractually obligated defense articles that try to convince everyone that this is a good thing and xbox isn't in trouble and that none of this is Microsoft's fault or due to a string of bad decisions Phil has been making for years as head of xbox.
“Halo Infinite’s delay is a setback for Microsoft in the short term for both its flagship franchise and its Xbox Series X console launch” What about this says that MS isn’t in trouble? That’s in the description, didn’t even have to click the article to see that bit. Majority of opinions I’ve seen across N4G, Reddit and other forums have been remarkably similar - that it needed the delay (because it looks shit), but it’s bad news for the Series X and MS. Really not seeing much that says everything is fine
MS is in a bad position right now. Worse than the kinect 2.0 era
@ aconnellan You left out the last part of the quote which was “but it is ultimately the right move”. That sounds like the author is defending the decision and trying to make this out to be a good thing, which he does not know if the delay is a good thing. Not every delay automatically results in a quality game (I.e. Crackdown 3). So there is no way for the author to know if delaying the game was the right decision. It’s quite possible the delay can have an adverse effect, the longer the game is delayed the higher people’s expectations (due to longer development cycle). So if Halo Infinite is sub par even after a delay, it’s going to make matters worse. The author also made sure to assume the setback is “in the short term”, insinuating that there is no real trouble because there will be no long term effect. Don’t Microsoft apologists blame the Xbox One’s terrible sales on decisions made at the consoles launch? So isn’t it possible that this can be more than a “short term” set back? It seems the author is just trying to convince people everything will be alright.
@r2oB It is the right move for the sake of the game. It's really going to damage the launch of XSX, but even then it may be the right move in the long run. Would have been better to decide to delay it before showing it, but that can't be undone.
@r2oB “You left out the last part of the quote which was “but it is ultimately the right move”. That sounds like the author is defending the decision and trying to make this out to be a good thing” Obviously this was referring to Halo, not the Xbox brand. As you mentioned, a delay doesn’t automatically make a good game, but the fact is it would have been awful to launch infinite in the state it’s in, so for many that’s an improvement by default - it turns it from an almost-guaranteed flop into a *potentially* good game. I know which option I’d take any day of the week. In summary = good for Halo because now there’s potential to improve; bad for MS and Xbox because wtf is going on over there that they let this happen in the first place
Phil is just a mouthpiece, how Xbox gamers keep defending him is beyond reasonable. Remember Crackdown 3 got delayed and we all know how that turned out.
As I said before and repeat again, it's time to MS cease contract with Mr Phil and Aaron. These two are destroying an entire game community with impunity, and have a free pass from die hard fanboys. Yesterday was already too late, I hope someone with "cojones" from MS takes in time the right decisions and hopefully has the vision that both are too incompetent for the task in hands.
Halo is not the first game to be delayed and it eill kost surely not be the last.
Very true, quite a few games have been delayed this year.
Nah, those typos are just due my jittery hands after my morning training and not taking phome suggestions. Lol.
I think the delay itself is a good thing, or at least necessary to deliver a good product. I also think it's not good for the XSX launch. I also think if MS only way to have a successful launch was Halo being a great game, then they really aren't in a good position to begin with.
so it seems like it wasn't just the lightning that make Halo Infinite look pretty boring and ugly like Digital Foundry claimed ;)
Its also funny because Master Phil told the world that he feels confident after watching Sony show. - Worlds most powerful Console couldn't handle 1 first party demo - 343i said this demo was polished and took months - 5 year development with high budget ($500 million) - Greenberg said its an old build (lie) - Now they are blaming COVID-19 for a 5 year in dev game rather being transparent They disappointed not just the gamer but Craig himself. I think they are victims of their own hype. -_-
IGN being magnanimous by assuming it was a choice at all. Based on what I saw, I'd bet even a death march and a half wouldn't get Halo out the door in 3 months.
Yeah...3 months later will not see a launch. I seriously doubt this game is coming in February. They may have a MP beta in March or April but I do not expect this game before June.
"I’m thinking holiday 2021 now" I would agree on that before I believed Jan/Feb of 21
Based on experience, I'd say the game was 1 to 1-1/2 years away from being ready. There was more than the visuals to be dealt with. That time frame is assuming things were going smoothly, and I imagine right now, with Covid, things aren't going as smoothly as they could otherwise. But Covid wasn't the reason this game got delayed, nor is it the reason this game was in the state it was in at it's showing. It may have had some improvements for the demo, but no doubt this demo had a lot of attention being put on it. In fact, I'd say the production of this demo probably delayed that 1 to 1-1/2 years even more, as they probably spent at least a month on refining it, which calls into question just what the rest of the game is like.
Well it did look like crap, so its the right move. But it couldnt have come as a surprise for 343 and MS. Somebody there fucked upp big time and tried to push a half assed product!
Yeah, without question the right move. Had that been Sony and say SSM showing off God of Wars sequel for PS5, and the visuals looked like crap, and lacking behind even the previous game on PS4, you better believe they'd be hearing the disappointment & complaints from millions of fans. I'd be extremely disappointed. Gosh, that'd be so embarrassing, and hopefully Microsoft & 343 feel that with that poor Halo demo. You better correct this, for yourselves, but also, for your fans. In the end, only blind fanboys would defend something so lazy and unimpressive as what Microsoft & 343 studios displayed.
Series x launch lineup is abysmal now. Glad they delayed it, but now it’s just scorn and medium. Ps5 launch lineup is not great, but at least there’s something in miles morales. Given how great Spider-Man is, that’s a guaranteed hit even if it’s a smaller experience. God fall is the unknown. Still day one purchase for both however. Need to play cyberpunk and Valhalla in the best way possible
I agree, but not that Spider-Man on PS5 is a "smaller experience" though. They've confirmed that outside of the main Miles Morales story, it also comes with the original story fully redone to benefit from PS5's SSD and improved graphical capabilities. That's a huge amount of content, especially if you haven't got the original, like me!
I really hope the give us a new trophy list for the original game, I'd love to get another platinum in that game, what a superb game.
God this is ridiculous. "It requires a whole lot of entrepreneurial courage to do what they just did* How about the fact they tried to pull the wool over our eyes? They bragged about this game when they knew it was crap. When we complained they blamed covid, lighting, old builds, everything but the obvious mismanagement and incompetence of the studio. they just deflected assuring everything was fine and their apologist did it as well. Now that they're finally done the right thing it's entrepreneurial courage. Yes it's very brave. Because the ramifications are staggering. Let me first say this is actually great news for Halo. And it's devastating for Xbox. This console is going to miss the starting gun and big last out of the gate and considering it won't sell as fast as the PS5 even with halo you don't want to be starting from behind at the beginning. This has basically insured this Gen will go to Sony again which obviously I am fine with. They are the only ones point in gaming in a good direction. This to me is worse then the Don mattrick days of DRM always online and no game sharing. It's just hilarious listen to oldies podcasts now making excuses and everyone's saying it's a good call when it should have never gotten to this stage. This should have stood out months ago. I just want to know if someone is finally going to hold Phil Spencer accountable for xbox's lackluster position instead of always going on what a nice guy he is and he's a gamer just like us. He's done nothing that has bettered gaming since he arrived and I think it's time people really started putting him under the microscope.
Phil Spencer is a mouth piece in a pop culture t- shirt and suit jacket. He is an appointed web personality and nothing more. I can guarantee all Xbox decisions are being made over his head. Microsoft have had this vision for a long time and they're taking that route no matter what. Just be glad its biting them in the ass time and again
Super fair comment, and I agree with pretty much everything. I don’t expect them to say something like “our game looks bad, so it is what it is”, but man they were writing blog posts the week before the demo talking about how they poured their heart and soul in to make it a graphical showcase - then what they showed was anything but. It had to be delayed, but I’m shocked that the decision only came after the public saw it and freaked out. It’s very worrying that it didn’t seem to have occurred before then within either 343 or MS
I feel we should have a word of sympathy to all hard working people of 343, I am sure they're making their best following the directives of their superiors. It's not funny to ear all the backslash coming from the community, it's very stressful and embarrassing (I wouldn't like to have Halo Infinite in my CV) A word to Ms should be, clean your house, get the job at hands seriously and start to make redundant Phil and Aaron asap.
You know what disgusted me? They not only blamed covid again like they're the only ones in the world that have dealt with it, but they hinted that they are trying to avoid developer crunch as well. I mean that's not a bad thing. But it's just an excuse. They latch onto anything that is topical to suit their own narrative. They are so bloody disingenuous. This game has been this managed from the start and from the sounds of it 343 just don't have the talent and avoiding developer crunch has had nothing to do with it.