Obsidian CEO Says Next-Gen Console RAM is 'Most Important' Improvement

TechRaptor Writes, "Obsidian CEO Feargus Urquhart is very much looking forward to the PlayStation 5 and Xbox Series X. One of the reasons is the next-gen console RAM — in his own words, it's the "most important" thing about the next generation of gaming."

[DEEBO]

Everybody is going to say this is best for next generation if it helps the people who writes their checks.
PC has been the king of ram so why not just build every system like a pc?

What really matters is developer's and a talent team.
I seen what Sony studios have produce since PlayStation one even when the console wasn't the strongest.
What the best game from these guys??
I never heard of their game of the year...

[ColdSin]

You don't need to talk down Obsidian because they are under Microsoft's banner now. They developed many memorable games like Fallout New Vegas (nominated for GOTY multiple times) and Alpha Protocol. Obsidian is one of the developers who usually innovate in RPGs (they have many RPG veterans like Tim Cain and Josh Sawyer).

They never had the opportunity to shine because of time and budget constraints.
For example, Fallout New Vegas would have been bigger in scope but Bethesda gave them less than 1.5 years to develop the game. They wanted you to be able to choose among a mutant, a ghoul, or a human. They wanted New Vegas to be bigger. They wanted to include massive battles between the Legion and the NCR. They couldn't achieve that in less than 1.5 years but what they achieved made people ask for another Fallout game developed by them.

[Eonjay]

It's not RAM though. The single most improvement is the CPU hands.

[bouzebbal]

Best thing is still talent.. Give a non talented studios 100GB GDDR6 they'll do nothing with it..
If ram was the most important improvement over the generations, then we'll never see bad games.

[ED-E]

Time and budget constraints is something every developer has to struggle with, this was never an Obsidian exclusive, but somehow treated as such.

Beth producers knew they would never delivered the multi race feature within these time/budget frame Obsidian agreed upon and talked them out of it for their own good. Bigger Vegas and massive battles, not possible with that engine on the console generation back then. This was delusional on their part. I mean they couldn't even managed to do that within the current generation on Outer Worlds (which had a similar team size).

Obsidian managed to get some good designers and writers for their projects (most of the time), but on the technical side, they really need to step up. Every game looks and plays like as if it was a remaster of a previous console generation.

[McToasty2077]

Exactly Obsidian are kings of RPG storytelling, KOTOR 2, Stick of Truth, and Pillars of Eternity are also top notch.

Honestly I’d put them above CDPR, really look forward to what they produce with adequate time and budget, something non of the listed titles have had the benefit off.

[RaidenBlack]

Whoa, whoa!
What's the best game from Obsidian? Really??
And you are following games from PSOne days? And at the same time talking about PC? Are you kidding me??
Look up Obsidian Entertainment, lad. Pre-MS acquisition. Their achievements and accomplishments. And no, not their Wikipedia page.

[PyroMessiah86]

Outer Worlds is great too.
If you don't have a clue about Obsidian, putting them down is foolish @DEEB0

[Fantangoooo]

True gamers know the caliber of what Obsidian is, i have played most of their games and i can tell you... those guys know how to make great games with top notch story telling.

[leejohnson222]

Exactly

[NeoGamer232]

No need to get into fanboyism on the article.

The amount of RAM in both consoles is the same and it is faster and 4 GB 25% more than the previous gen.

RAM is always one of the most important things for games but it is a high cost piece of the console. That's why they don't put a ton of RAM as compared to high end PCs in. You have to remember they are targeting a $399-599 price tag. Not a $1,000 PC price tag so just building a console exactly like big PC gaming rigs is not really an option.

As for team talent Obsidian has been a strong independent developer for over a decade. Then, they were bought by MS and now have a lot more resources at their disposal. I expect a lot from them going forward.

[Kribwalker]

lol. They made a game of the year contender last year, that was a great game, and it was only a 80 person team (of the 200 staff at the time) that made it. Just wait now with the budgets and time MS is giving them, they could have a beast coming up
https://mobile.twitter.com/...

[Melankolis]

Obsidian is a well respected developers. Only heard good things from them. Never play their games personally, their genre doesn't appeal to me.

[rainslacker]

PC is also the king of overhead. Lots of RAM is great, and the fast RAM is nice, but so long as you have the OS between the software and the hardware, it's always going to cause a bottleneck. Some things can use DMA, but even it's still handled by the OS, although significantly faster. Not many devs program for DMA on PC though, because it's not consistently reliable across different hardware setups, so they still use a higher level DMA interface, which kind of defeats the purpose.

RAM however is a big thing with the new consoles, although this past gen it wasn't terrible. RAM has been the biggest headache in game development for some time now, but the SSD's and ability to free up RAM by utilizing SSD as a type of virtual memory, or not requiring to load all or most of the games assets for run time, frees up a lot of space, and requires less memory management to be done by the developer.

[Computersaysno]

At this point you're talking about consoles that are giving up an entire CPU thread, a whole core and dedicating 3-4GB of their entire memory to their OS and background functionality. Consoles have had major OS overheads for quite some time now, that was one of PS3's weaknesses against the competition.

Consoles have had more and more overhead. Windows in particular has aimed to have less and less from a gaming perspective. Getting closer to the metal with each API improvement and hardware standardisation relative to history. The gap has narrowed significantly, quite simply.

Hence this is the reason why PC performance has moved comparably close to console hardware with similar performance. No longer does a console massively outperform a PC with comparable hardware. Right at the start of this generation you were seeing digital foundry put pretty mediocre PC hardware against PS4 and Xbox One and there was little issue in it matching or beating them when you went down to the fine details of settings and resolution comparisons.

This still holds true today as well, with pretty low end requirements seen for even PS4 exclusives like HZD or Death Stranding that matches up to what is seen pushed by console hardware.

When it comes to RAM in the 7 years since PS4 and Xbox One launched with 8GB, these new consoles only doubling it is the smallest increase by a long way in the history of generational console transitions. Every other generation has increased the amount by 16 times or even more.

Saying that RAM is extremely important to developers and they will take every shred of memory you give them.

[rainslacker]

The game space in consoles with through a hypervisor which isolates it from the OS. Data is read and written in a protected space outside the OS.

The os in consoles can still manage some tasks for the dev...like saving or matchmaking for instance, but when the game is running, the overhead is minimal to nonexistent depending on what the dev implements. On PC, this overhead always exist for every bit of data within the system memory space, or transferred through the bus. DMA is available to some degree on PC, but there is still OS level data protection which handles the hardware calls.

The amount of overhead for every bit of data on PC adds up to a lot more than the loss of a core or thread on the consoles. Most games don't even manage multicore or multithreading very well anyways on PC, and what you see tends to be OS assigned stuff which is more passive than what game devs will do on consoles.

[Sunny12345]

Pillars of eternity 1 and 2 are both great games. But honestly I don't understand how ram is the most important. Shouldn't it be gpu? Or cpu. Or everythin together including ssd ?

[VoiceMale]

clearly didnt read the article or you wouldn't have asked this.....

he said for the games they want to build:

"RAM means more NPCs, more trees... Your streaming point is out a little farther and all these little things"

he goes on a bit fuether:

"Of course technology is important to RPGs, but for us it is about characters, story, reactivity and player agency,"

[Sunny12345]

Actually I didn't read the article. But thanks for the explanation. I was thrown off by the title, and thought things work better in conjuction. But yeah, having more things on screen means having more ram.

[Marquinho]

Talking down on Obsidian now?... They're one of the most talented studios around. Created both Pillars of Eternity with medium budgets and now they have all the resources they need. If there's one studio Microsoft acquired I'm excited about, that's Obsidian.

They talk about RAM (and CPU power) because it's something more relevant to what they do. He talks about NPCs and lively worlds. You need RAM and Processing power for that. For comparison, the Series X DDR6 RAM is faster than almost anything on PC, and devs don't precisely take a 2080ti as a reference when making a game.

Also, he isn't saying anything outside the Series X. It's you guys automatically assuming he's downplaying the competition.

[L7CHAPEL]

fallout New Vegas and of course the outer worlds would be the most recent,
grounded is coming up...
as far as "what's best for game development"
all the different developers and technicians having enough time and space do the things they want to do ...
it won't be ram, it won't be SSD, it'll be the guys behind the steering wheel.

[Saijahn]

But this article is a nod to both consoles as both feature the same amount of RAM, 16gb gddr6. Sony isn’t signing a check to obsidian ...lol

It’s one dev’s opinion based on what he sees as paramount for the games he wants to make.

[Neonridr]

these are PC's though. Architecture, components, technology. They are closed system PCs.

[MadLad]

Key figures in Obsidian were involved in virtually every classic crpg series of the 90s and forward.
Pillars of Eternity series won a bunch of awards. Stick of Truth won a bunch of awards. New Vegas won a bunch of awards. Hell, they're the reason Fallout Even exists in the first place. Tyranny won awards.
Kotor 2 is considered superior to the original, but was held back due to a tight development cycle.
Even their weaker releases have a cult following.

They are legitimately one of the best in the RPG space, and the fact you can't see that just screams of personal bias.

[lelo2play]

Games... it's always about the games... that's the most important thing.

You can have a crap console, but if you have the games to back it, your set. Take the example of Nintendo...

[Saijahn]

That’s what he said ... tech is cool as it affords these devs to really craft the games they want...

[anubusgold]

i have 32 gb of ram not a problem for me.

[kryteris]

and not enough unless there is some secret sauce with the ssd.

[rainslacker]

There is always a limit, and any dev when asked will say they want more. But, the SSD's, "secret sauce" as you call it is not really secret, nor is it a golden ticket to infinity. It can, however, free up a significant amount of RAM by loading in less at start, and streaming or swapping assets as needed during run time. Since it can do this faster, it is a pretty big thing, which is why there is so much talk about it.

[Games1st]

If you want more ram wait for PS5 Pro in three years or so.

[Babadook7]

RAM size went up 2x. That seems like a small upgrade. But because RAM only needs to hold what you see on screen right now, (due to virtual RAM in ultra fast storage) it will actually act like it’s 4x more.

[SyntheticForm]

Different devs are excited about different things. This one's liking the RAM increase and I assume RAM type as well. I'm actually glad to be hearing them praising different aspects of these consoles.

I think these developers are just speaking to what's impacting the current projects they're working on most - in this case it happens to be RAM.

Good. Looking forward to seeing what they're working on.

[rainslacker]

Pretty sure any decent dev is going to always be happy about more RAM. Memory management is the most time consuming part of the software side of development. While there is more to memory management than just keeping it free, that is still a big issue for any game engineer or even graphic artist that has to get their assets to fit in a certain space, but still keep the quality as high as possible. If they dont have to keep an entire level in memory, it allows them to do more without as much sacrifice to the quality. This is one way that ssd can actually improve visuals beyond the basic increase in teraflops, because a teraflop can only be as good as the assets it has to work with.

[McToasty2077]

From memory the reason The Strip was divided into sections in New Vegas was console RAM limitations (mods on PC fix this issue), so they’ve had core features cut because of RAM limits in past

[ColdSin]

They didn't have the engineers that are able to free up the RAM and adequetly allocate memory (you see games like GTAV and Max Payne 3 that were able to squeeze everything out of the tech at the time). I wouldn't doubt that they are now able to get them (studios under Microsoft share engineers and technology like all other major publishers).

[FanboysKiller]

"Bethesda - Obsidian = Fallout 76"
That's pretty much the best way to describe the company .

[airshiraz]

im so insanely freaking hyped for this new gen. graphics will be insane .i do care about graphics .its gonna be a cool 7 yrs of gaming generation.i will enjoy this gen more than previous gens because i really worship great graphics

[Stanjara]

Certainly, from a dev that made a game on an ancient design... that everybody liked. Also with tiny tini bini font text.

[Father__Merrin]

Next console ram is far better than pc ram just look at the graphics on PS4 now imagine ps5

[Minute Man 721]

You guys are not looking at/taking customization into account

[Games1st]

What customization?

[TheHunter81]

Obsidian is looking forward to the PS5? As a player or developer? Lol

[ElementX]

Many devs own competing consoles. Phil has mentioned Playstation a few times.

[Games1st]

"(RPG) is about characters, story, reactivity and player agency.""RAM means more NPCs, more trees... Your streaming point is out a little farther and all these little things."

More immediate density and detail for immersion.

[sampsonon]

Obsidian lol

[Fantangoooo]

lets play spot the pony...

[timotim]

Obsidian gone be a problem next-gen!!!

If RPGs are your go to genre, you'll going to want a SX.

[rainslacker]

Assuming people buy the games. Xbox doesnt have the best track record here.

[timotim]

LOL...Im not surprised Rain. First, lets remember that Microsoft doesnt rely on purchases through retail only for their games. We have Game Pass with xCloud coming online as well that give gamers more options to play XGS titles. Furthermore, why would we need worry, if the games are of quality? We had no problem buying and playing Morrowind...had no problem buying and playing Oblivion...not the Mass Effect series, not KotOR 1&2, not Fable...its because they were all of great quality. This is Obsidian we are talking about. Thats just as foolish as someone questioning ND when it comes to 3rd person action games haha. Yes...I will assume that RPG lovers will both buy and play Obsidian's future projects because Obsidian knows RPGs and are among the best in the industry at it. THEY'RE track record is whats more important here...

[rainslacker]

Yeah, let's remember that. The sales of RPGs on xbox has never been that great, which us why ms hasn't focused on them.

Doesnt matter what avenues they have to sell, if the games dont perform, then they wont get made. Not sure why you're expecting a huge change in the make up of xbox gaming habits, but seems like your putting the cart before the horse.

Obsidian is a really good dev. I have no doubt theyll deliver quality. But no doubt in the dev, doesnt mean I have faith in their customer base to support the games.

[timotim]

Rain, please understand that Microsoft acquired Playground Games, Inxile and Obsidian all based off their latest RPG concepts that the studios were pitching. The reason why Microsoft focused on acquiring RPG focused studios is because they see opportunities in the genre. The reason why they got away from them in the past is because they had no studios to produce high quality RPGs that would be appealing enough for its audience...thats no longer the case with the acquisitions. Ill say it again...we Xbox gamers have a rich history with buying and playing deep RPGs...we love them and have supported them by the millions over the years and generations. Every RPG I named sold well on Xbox platforms and is a counter to this picture you're trying to paint which simply isn't accurate. Maybe if you could give examples of RPGs in question when you say things like "The sales of RPGs on xbox has never been that great", would be very helpful Morrowind, Oblivion, Mass Effect, KotOR and Fable prove you statement is false.

"Obsidian is a really good dev. I have no doubt theyll deliver quality. But no doubt in the dev, doesnt mean I have faith in their customer base to support the games."

I appreciate your concern Rain. No need to worry about us though...we will be just fine...heard similar accusations thrown at Xbox customers when it came to Sea of Thieves...over two years later and the game is one of the most played games on any platform and a huge success. We dont worry about what others think.

[rainslacker]

I hope your right. My criticism isn't on MS on this. It's on the user base which hasn't had a history of supporting these games as well as they seem to do on other systems. There are the exceptions to the rule, and I don't doubt there is a good potential market there, but it doesn't change the track record that MS has when it comes to support of genres which don't do well, nor it's customer base.

[timotim]

Not sure what you speak of Rain...Morrowind, Oblivion, Mass Effect, Kotor and Fable were all million+ sellers on Xbox consoles. If their are titles you would like to bring up that you feel did not fair so well, please do at this time.

[rainslacker]

I guess I'm looking at RPG's as a wider genre

[timotim]

Oh ok...

[Bruh]

Why is this even a controversial statement? lol

If one of the things we're looking at is leaps in visual fidelity, faster and bigger RAM is going to get you there. A ultra fast SSD isn't going to help you attain higher resolution nor is it the single factor in producing worlds with more density and smarter functioning systems. A GPU is bottlenecked if it has a garbage RAM set up just look at the Xbox One base for this example. So how is what he said wrong?

[aquamala]

"next gen console RAM" is called GDDR6, been in PC graphics cards since 2018