Why The Last Of Us Part II's Ending Was Perfect

Players around the world have been circulating discourse online about this thought-provoking game. From its themes to heart-wrenching scenes, it's no secret that this game is a masterpiece, but can the same be said about its ending? Does it open possibilities of a third installment?

[Battlestar23]

Revenge never solves anything it just brings more pain and more death.

[gerbintosh]

Seems to have solved everything for Abby so..

[Battlestar23]

Not really she felt guilt for what she did and the pain of losing her father didn't go away but also her revenge got all her friends killed. It's also the reason why she is protective of Lev as it is her way of redeeming herself for killing Joel. When Yara asked Abby why she was helping them she said it was for herself. So no revenge didn't solve anything for Abby.

[Game-ur]

@Battlestar23

nice take , but it's not part of the story told, you are rationalizing. that's one big issue with the narrative.

[LG_Fox_Brazil]

Evey time I watch a movie, read a book, play a game or listen to a song I rationalize about it... You know, the great stories are the ones who force you to do that inside a believable and mostly solid plot, which TLOU2 had.

If you are not rationalizing about a movie, book, game, song you are either consuming something that is already chewed out for a massive public, like summer blockbusters where you leave the brain out of the room or... well... or you are just too lazy to do it

[derek]

No, nobody who actually played the game would come away thinking Abby paid no price for getting her revenge.

[outsider1624]

"Seems to have solved everything for Abby so.."

Another example of not playing the game. Maybe you just watched it and went oh Abby's happy now.

I think it's about time you guys just quit it.

[Sunny12345]

Yup. It got all her friends killed. Revenge begets revenge.

[gamer7804]

yah exactly, one character learns the age old lesson, the other one gets exactly what she wants in the end, revenge and the boy saved...

[imtiyaz6]

Yeah Abby was perfectly fine with losing her friends (including a pregnant woman, her lover, being starved and tortured for months (probably even raped). It all turned out perfectly well for Abby. Next time play a game before talking about it.

[Phantom68]

People think she just changed her mind at the last minute due to a flashback. I believe Ellie was conflicted about revenge. against Abby, not at the beginning but later on. This is why she attempted to let go and live a life at the farm. She understood that Joel had caused pain to Abby and was willing to let go given Joel had killed Abby's dad. However, she was struggling with mental issues and she thought by finding Abby she would finally resolve those issues. When she finds Abby, tied to a pillar, emaciated, having being tortured, having lost a lot of weight she, exhausted herself about the violence, decided to free Abby. At the beach, it was only a flashback of Joel death that triggers her to fight Abby and a flashback of Joel before he died also is what it takes to make her realize that enough is enough, the cycle of violence has to end. It is irrelevant if that is what Joel wanted as it is what Ellie wanted. To kill Abby would have achieved nothing and left the little kid alone. People oversimply feelings and think life is black and white whereas it is not. There are so many shades of grey that it is impossible to look at a situation and be 100% sure of what the correct course of action should be. This game is about empathy, about understanding there are 2 faces to a medal. There are really no there's or villains here as at the beginning you are lead to believe Abby is the villain and in the end, you fell Elli is the villain.

[gerbintosh]

It would be one thing if Abby's dad was just passing along and Joel randomly killed him however Joel killed Abby's dad to save Ellie. Joel saved Ellie's life and now the person who killed him gets to get away? Makes no sense. It would have been a better story for Abby to kill Joel and then find out her dad was planning on killing Ellie and that is why he died. Hell, Abby apologizing, begging for her life, and explaining that she didn't know her dad was trying to kill Ellie and then Ellie choosing to forgive her would have been a better ending.

[GamingSinceForever]

What made Joel look bad is that he killed an unarmed man. We understood that he felt the need to save Ellie, but he went about it brutally, which is why Abby felt so angry.

I thought the story was great.

[outsider1624]

Oh you're right about that. But i felt joel should have those unarmed, harmless doctor in the leg or something. But that didn't happen. In Tlou1 story it showed us Joel killed him.

[sci4me]

@ Outsider - that was one thing of the game i couldnt rationalise. Up to that moment i could put myself in Joels shoes but that part felt unnecessary an extreme for his character, killing unarmed ppl in cold blood. I remember myself just sitting there waiting for another possible action to progress the game.

[Game-ur]

those conflicting flashbacks at that moment make no sense. in game time Ellie had months to contemplate everything. there is no narrative trigger to these flashbacks. just forced in to manipulate the audience. the character didn't go through real growth.

also you are saying that if Abby wasn't broken then Ellie wouldn't have changed. then that means her redemption wasn't real. just another forced plot shift.

[TheEnigma313]

Let’s get a go fund me so you can get your $60 back. You’re clearly still butt hurt on every article.

[Redemption-64]

I truly feel sorry for you. This game has seriously consumed you

[outsider1624]

@theenigma

He probably didn't even buy it. If he did then yeah, he should've definitely get his refund. He's still hurt he didnt get his revenge.

[rainslacker]

So....if I understand you correctly.....what you're saying is you aren't capable of connecting various disclosed character development points, or plot revelations to be able to figure out what's going on?

I mean, i'd think after everyone has explained all these things to you, in detail at times, you would have gotten it, yet here you are, continuously showing that you are incapable of a modicum of logical thought, or even a slight ability to learn anything when new information is presented.

Must be fun living in your mind.

[Yui_Suzumiya]

Agree 100% with you

[derek]

Though it went on too long after the first farm scene, Ellie was clearly looking for internal peace in killing Abby, but was conflicted as she had come to understand that killing Abby wouldn't give her what she wanted.

[Shezgear]

The doc shoulve had a bigger role in part 1. Back then I thought he was just a NPC. Kinda like the medic in mgsv gz.

[warriorcase]

I think that's sort of a point/theme in 2 though. Joel (us) saw him as just an NPC, an object between us and saving Ellie. 2 attempts to show the easy dismissal of what we cobsider enemies in order to reach our personal goals and objectives. Kinda makes sense.

[Shezgear]

They could've just made Abby darker and Marlenes sister or something. Maybe Nora instead of Abby. What about the other doctor? He was a nobody then?

[warriorcase]

@shezgear
Which other doctor?

[Shezgear]

@warriorcase There are like 3 doctors in that room in TLOU 1.. I killed all of them..
Druckman said he was inspired by MGS2. Won't be surprised if he was inspired by MGSV too. Doc and Medic.

[warriorcase]

@Shezgear
The other 2 were probably nurses or staff trained to be surgical assistance. Abby's farther is a Neuro surgeon which added much more weight and importance. They needed to tie the story to a guaranteed kill to make it work as you're not forced to kill the other 2 in the room.

It could of worked with Marlene's sister angle too, but ultimately would ve the same story anyway of family dying and revenege. Plus I don't think it would hold the same narrative weight as one of the few piving Neuro surgeons.

The MGS2 reference he says was misdirection in interviews and trailers to suprise players. In the original MGS2 pre-relese all gamplay showed playing as Snake.

[Shezgear]

@warriorcase nurses* I guess. But I killed them all. They were 3 in that room.

[warriorcase]

@Shezgear

But you're not forced too so if they wrote in all 3 killed have family that seek revenge then it would have been a break in continuity for those that let them live. Besides, in the flashback in part 2 we see the dead doctor (Abby's dad) as we were forced to kill him in 1 and then it never shows the other 2 after that, so you could reason they are alive or dead. All we see is Joel puck Ellie off the table and back put of the room.

Regardless is it was 1, 3, 5 medical staff in that room. It was the doctors daughter written in to seek revenge. Perhaps the other 2 in the room were left alive or died (in your case) and had no family or a loved one with the drive for vengence.

[rainslacker]

Using Marlene's sister wouldn't have worked. You were supposed to take Abby as a new character, with no connection to the first game. No one that played the first game connected with the doctor. He had 2-3 lines of dialogue. People had already formed opinions about Marlene, which would have translated to her sister.

The game wanted you to hate Abby at first. This was planned to have you want to feel the way Ellie did. You weren't supposed to know her motivations, even though it was obviously revenge. You were supposed to think she was just some person that Joel had wronged in his possible distant past that was mentioned several times in the first game.

[rainslacker]

He probably was in a throwaway NPC in the first game. They expanded his role for the 2nd game, but it works for what they wanted to do with the second game.

It was pretty well implied that Ellie hadn't consented, or given the operation to the operation in the first game. Otherwise, she would have known for sure Joel was lying. Marlene never disclosed the exact conversation she had with the doctor to Joel, just told him it was necessary. She was just another obstacle in his way, and if she hadn't tried to stop in the parking garage, he wouldn't have shot her.

I think he could have subdued the doctor without shooting him, but it is what it is and some people may be over analyzing that scene....although I have seen that topic broached well before this game was even announced.

I don't think the doctor really needed a bigger role in the first game. It wasn't really that important to the overall story, and may have added a plot point that was counter to what the game was trying to achieve at a time it was coming to a climax. Marlene's exposition at that point was enough to convey the jist of it.

[AK91]

https://www.youtube.com/wat...

[PCgamer98]

The ending was pretty open ended and there was no resolution to joel's death heck it's not even known if ellie is still going to be the main protag of the third game.

[JEECE]

I hope there is no third game. Hopefully they go back to straightforward Uncharted games where the hero wins and the bad guys lose. That's all anyone seems to be equipped to handle.

[zeuanimals]

Yup. Good job gamers, we've shown the industry what we think about games that stray from being feel good power fantasies.

[rainslacker]

I think death is its own resolution. The story wasn't trying to resolve Joel's death to bring closure to everyone who was upset about it. It was trying to bring closure to Ellie's grief. This is a distinction that many stories fail at. Endings are usually there to satisfy the player, reader, or watcher. As consumers of these stories, we like endings that give us closure, whether good or bad. But, this story brought closure to the character's story arc. That was indeed very open to interpretation. That is great IMIO, because that was one of the best parts of the first game that led to some of the best discussions I've ever had about a single game, where different opinions on the interpretation were respected, and no one was really wrong.

I think like the first game, this game doesn't need a sequel. I hope if they do one though, that it tries to surprise us, and try to do something great. I'd rather devs try for greatness and fail, than stick with the mediocre.

[Bigman4k]

Not true

[Magatsuhi]

They're really going to milk these articles huh?

[mandingo]

It wasn’t

[Imalwaysright]

It was perfectly nonsensical.

[gamer7804]

love it when an article starts with a subjective premise, not everyone thinks its a masterpeice. I think its a poorly written, frustratingly brutal, with characters acting out of character quite often without the necessary character development to warrant the change. but thats my opinion.

[TFJWM]

I agree with some of that but can you give specific examples of when "characters acting out of character quite often without the necessary character development to warrant the change. "

[anast]

I'm sure gamer7 can't do that or doesn't want to. I have still, yet, to see any solid criticism. People say pacing issues, but can't say what "pace" is. Others say, it's "disjointed", but fail to compare it to other non-linear stories to show how it's "disjointed." People say it's "poorly written", but have yet to compare it to something that is well written and so forth.

[gamer7804]

Sure, Joel trusts a group of people he barely knows, ridiculous he knows better. It’s just there to drive the narrative to end Joel’s life. That’s just one, there are many other obviously manipulative moments druckman uses force the player to feel a certain way, but it’s forced so never made me feel anything but “wow this feels fake” . This may seem critical but it’s only cause I cared about the first game.

[TFJWM]

I guess you really didn't play it and just watched some cut scenes or read stuff online...Abby already knows who Joel is cause Tommy told her earlier. His identity is already know at that point so why would he make up a name?

Since your first point is false can you supply any other things that "made me feel anything but “wow this feels fake” ." or " characters acting out of character quite often without the necessary character development to warrant the change"

[gamer7804]

Sure there are lots. Having people yell their names of others as you kill kill them ALL the time is really forced and you can tell it’s there to manipulate you. Also they force the humanization of Abby and the brutalization of Ellie by making you kill dogs or atleast the main one while they force you to play fetch and play with the dog as Abby. It’s so transparent what druckman is doing. I hope the previous and these other two examples are enough for you.

[TFJWM]

" Having people yell their names of others as you kill kill them ALL the time is really forced and you can tell it’s there to manipulate you. "

Isn't this just added realism and usually not done only to save money on voice acting? If you are in a group hunting and you see your friend shot are you not going to use their name? Or if you come on their dead body why would you not call out they killed (NPC name)?

"Also they force the humanization of Abby and the brutalization of Ellie by making you kill dogs or atleast the main one while they force you to play fetch and play with the dog as Abby."

Yes they use dogs to hunt people why would that not make sense? And how is having a dog and playing with it is forced?

"I hope the previous and these other two examples are enough for you."

Enough for what? You haven't proven anything or even made enough sense to back up what you have stated.

If "Sure there are lots." and "characters acting out of character quite often without the necessary character development to warrant the change." then please continue. You have given one false example of that.

[gamer7804]

I don’t have time to reply to everything. But when so many of the npcs call out names sooo often it feels forced to me. Keep in mind these are just my opinions you can totally disagree and that’s fine it’s a very polarizing game.