CG writes: For those wondering who The Last Of Us Part 2 Abby model is based on in real life. Look no further as she is revealed to be Jocelyn Mettler VFX artist at renowned studio Beyond-FX.
Woah... real life Abby is hot.., just like in game Abby. I have to say... I much preferred to play Abby's story in the game. It was a lot more fun than Ellies.
In game Abby is built like a tank... and it's not the look i go for, but damn she was cute and likeable.
Exactly, I don't recall any fuss about 'kissing' scenes or expressions of love between Nate and Elena in Uncharted 4, but a similar scene between people of the same sex is no longer taken as a story element in TLoU2, it is now a political statement.
But ND and Druckmann have specifically come out for being progressive and admitted putting in more diverse elements in every consecutive game.
This goes from Neil doing his speech how female's with curves are bad (and therefore MUST be overly sexualized) to ND staff attacking people on twitter for not taking some LGBT rights for granted (and I'm not talking hate speech, more like the choice of adressing someone with a certain pronoun, instead of being forced to say the person's chosen pronoun - even if they aren't aware).
Body types are being changed (see model for Dina, and obviously taking the face and body type from 2 different people here for Abby), skin color is being changed (Nadine's capture model was white), 45kg women can somehow take down tanks of dudes 3 times their size without any issue (though it's a common thing in Hollywood, it's just ludonarrative dissonance for superheroes/special agents and such, so not that big of a deal).
Some recent elements in their games that were also noticeable: in Lost Legacy Sam Drake went from a sometimes bumbling, but capable adventurer in U4 to the joker, always being the butt of the joke. Nadine took the "typical male role" for most of the game, while Sam barely had any competent moments.
For LOU2 it already starts with the "bigot" sandwich, the trans actor kid that didn't have to do a casting but got hand picked by Druckmann to play Lev, the pride flag hanging out, and then some notes of erotic fanfic (same building as the flag) how a woman was satisfied at the sorority 'like no man could have done before'.
Anyhow, these are just a few things that are noticeable, but luckily haven't taken over the story, and are minor inconveniences at most, for those of us that even notice. However, I'm not a fan of the progression (excuse the pun) that ND has made in putting more of their personal politics and ideologies in their games. So, people that are currently completely dismissing LOU2 for the "divirse" elements, should indeed not be taken too seriously. It is however a worrying evolution if politics continue to be put forward more and more in (ND) games.
"45kg women can somehow take down tanks of dudes 3 times their size without any issue"
And? Just because a dude is big doesn't mean they're good in a fight. I'd buy that before a single person taking out an army worth of people and coming out alive in the end as countless games over generations have shown.
SunGod - just listing up the things that I noticed or read about. Seeing as I'm passionate about most ND games, it's natural that I'd be more inclined to research it more than the average game I own.
Back in the days, I was one of the first people to make Crushing walkthroughs for U2 and U3, but these are horribly outdated, without cuts and shot with my shitty external cam. Back then, the only thing getting me out of the experience was the unlucky series of events leading up to some insta-deaths due to the difficulty.
Unfortunately, over the years some of the agenda stuff gets me momentarily out of the experience. Off the top of the head, I thought this would be a concrete point to list them. Generally, they're minor enough not to be bothersome, but they're definitely present.
Dumahim - I ust said it was a trope that many Hollywood movies fall upon. Heck, even Nathan Drake's health has been said to be his "luck", as when that runs out, that's when the bullets actually hit him and he dies. But yes, the lone warrior overcoming 100's of enemies and coming out alive against all odds, is a trope that's just as bad and unbelievable, especially in games looking for realism.
But body/muscle mass is important in fights. Trigger points can play an active part in a smaller person taking down a bigger one. A huge difference in skill is usually needed though for a smaller person to reliably take down a bigger one.
Also, now that I think of it, saying 45kg I'm guessing you're talking about Ellie and she's clearly not 45kg. Also also, I may be wrong but I only remember the one fight with a tank sized dude and she got knocked around easily but fought back with explosives and guns while the dude had a wedge or maul type melee weapon. But yeah, a similar sized dude would easily shake off a mail to the chest. So unrealistic. /s
@dumahim - my mistake. I'm just saying the average Hollywood actress looks like 45-50kg and they're throwing around people of 90kg+ as if they're Steven Segal doing Aikido with his students :)
When trying to make that point, I wasn't referring to TLOU2 for the weight issue, more the inability to touch Nadine in U4 (though honestly she's probably 70kg+ of muscle), and her ability to outperform Nathan (who clearly has taken on "tanks" before, where even he would struggle and need to kick them in balls or use his surroundings for the advantage, as well as taken on 20+ pirates when kidnapped in U3). As such, my immersion in the story was lost in that moment, as you can't even land a single punch or even defend competently.
So, they include things in TLOU2 that exist within the world now, but it doesn't overtake the story, nor seem out of place, and it's worrying?
This kind of thing is exactly why I wasn't worried about it when it became an issue a while back for some people. It's why I gave ND the benefit of the doubt, because I felt they could actually do inclusion in realistic, and not agenda pushing ways. It may be that the directors have an agenda, or at least a desire to be inclusive, but if they aren't beating people over the head with it, and it fits without being forced, then that's OK. What I found in TLOU2 is that these were just character traits(mostly except maybe a bit with Lev where it was mostly moot anyways), and that despite these things, they were still presented as just people for you to connect to.
Hell, even the bigot sandwhich guy seemed remorseful for his remarks the night before, and was about how I'd expect someone who has bias, but tries to be tolerant but sometimes slips, behaves when they slip up and still have to be around someone they otherwise respect.
"45 kg women/person"
Someone who knows how to fight can take down a brute force brawler. Abby was basically a somewhat trained soilder. Ellie relied more on stealth or wildly flailing her knife around, or guns/explosives/molotavs. Nadine was a well trained soilder. Drake was much less likely to be able to take out trained mercenaries, some of which were displaced soilders from a countries army. Also, none of those women were 45kg. Maybe Ellie in the first game.
"over the years some of the agenda stuff gets me momentarily out of the experience"
Then I'd suggest you stop being influenced to automatically assume that inclusion means agenda. This is a result of going into defense mode because of everything that is happening with media, and companies today feeling they have to "check the boxes" to appear progressive. Sometimes, these things are not meant to be to push an agenda, but make people see that these are just people...which is an agenda, but not a bad one. Half the stuff you mention as an agenda seems like a stretch to begin with, but I noticed you didn't list Bill from the first game as some sort of agenda.
You did not hear a thing because they consider that normal, acceptable. They say when you have same sex kissing or in sex scenes or the book store and rainbow the devs are trying to force an agenda on them, yet when heteros are portrayed, based on their logic isn't that forcing an agenda(rhetorical). I am not gay, but I have no issue with people living their lives as they see fit, life, liberty, happiness, and I think what ND did in TLOU2 pushing boundaries and not apologizing for it, I appreciate, and will be celebrated by me.
There was an article about how Druckmann designed the character to make trans people have someone they can identify with. Google it and you’ll find that interview.
All I find is a saussageroll article that made everything up and they even say "anonymous sources" if you are actually basing your opinion on that then...wow
My arguement here is 'so what'?! Even if it was true that Druckmann wanted to include a more diverse cast of characters, why is this a bad thing, it wasnt to the detriment of the game. Any areas where race or sexuality might be touched on were handled beautifully as far as I could tell. Not once was it handled with a heavy touch, or forced or unrealistic, it was perfect.
Which takes me back to my point, why are some triggered by the inclusion of a kiss between two female characters, but not by the kissing between Nathan and Elena?
I guess the issue people have is it’s like noticeable agenda pushing. You have to understand people are used to certain things and then an inclusion of something front-and-centered that their not familiar with can induce the whole eye roll and push-back reaction.
I think Abby is a pretty interesting character and I find her portion of the story more compelling than Ellie’s pure “kill one person to another” act of revenge story.
You’re always going to get push back with stuff like this though just because people are going to ask, “What’s wrong with the way things were before?”
Abby didn't have trans traits. The lighting sometimes made her face object model look more masculine, and her ripped body is generally a characteristic of males, but she didn't act or think that she was a male in any sort of way. She had feminine features, sported a ponytail for most of the game, and exhibited motherly traits with both Lev and her crew. Since the source of this claim is from sausageroll, it's probably just false. They are well known to make up sources, or put out wild claims just to get clicks. If a good source for that existed, they wouldn't be talking to sausage roll, because that site has no journalists who seek sources, and it doesn't appear they have any real editorial staff that verifies anything that gets printed. How the site hasn't been sued into oblivion for libel is beyond me.
If they wanted to design a character to have someone trans people can identify with, it would be Lev, not Abby, and if they empathized with Abby, it was probably because of how they wrote the character.
Women can have muscles too you know. Saying that, you mustened have any yourself and feel a bit insecure about it. She's about as built as a woman can get. That's not the issue I have. The issue I have is where do you find the time, food, supplements, and the obvious steroids in a world where its dog eat dog (literally and figuratively) with zombies all over the place. What the fuck's wrong with the Ellen Ripley model of realistic strong women?
I actually lift. That’s why I know how hard it is to build muscle and maintain. You have to eat plenty, you have to work out plenty, you have to be very consistent to develop muscle and strength (two different things) so when I say “she throws me off” it’s because it’s hard for men to build muscle, it’s much much harder for women to build muscle naturally. So in a post apocalyptic world, you’re telling me a woman can look like a 145lbs female MMA fighter with all the limited resources at her hand? Steroids or not, it’s hard work. You don’t get that luxury in a world like The Last Of Us. But obviously realism was thrown out of the way in that aspect for the sake of the director’s vision. I have the right to question it
I have to wonder at people who pick apart something like Abbey's physique, it's a videogame with fungus growing out of peoples faces to act as a radar dish for echo location.......I mean, it's a piece of fiction for goodness sake.
Do these people pull appart every piece of fiction the consume, whether it is cinema, games or books?
I get your joke, my dude and I laughed. Ironically she is based on real women, but if you made this same joke about some underage looking anime waifu people would be upvoting you nonstop. Figures.
I just wish she wasnt on steroids during an appocalypse. Ruins my immersion she is so unrealistic.
Even if you based her off colleen fotsh. She is def a enhancement user. Cross fit checks are bs.
How is abby getting all those calories to support her muscle building? How is she built so much without extemely high testosterone levels? Doesn't make sense. Im sure they ration food and dont have supplements and hormones to pump.
Loved the game. Hated her body. She looks like she could bench 250lbs for a couple reps lol gimme a break. Even advanced female body builders does not look half as strong as her.
She actually says she can bench 185 during in game dialogue. 185 is a lot for a woman. When I ran in track and field, most of the female sprinters I knew could only bench 1/2 to 3/4s there own weight.
1/2 to 3/4ths your own weight is basically just a push-up depending on your form. It isn't much, even for a woman. Plus track and field has basically nothing to do with the bench press in the first place.
Women typically have %40 of the upper body strength of a man of similar size. Also, for sprint training, bench press was an encouraged exercise, as sprinting requires upper body strength.
185lb bench for a woman is elite body builder status even at 190lbs!!!!!!
Its impossible without juicing everyday and working out 10 hours a day. She would have to work like Arnold.
Google
"Female bench press standards" Throws away all arguments of realism.
I dont know many men who can trily bench 185. Most guys i know bench 185 and have worked out and built a good base of muscle. Ive never ever seen a woman bench 185 with my owj eyes
Maybe they just picked a big number without really thinking about it? 185 is high even for a male, so maybe they were just trying to use a number that was comparative. Her muscle mass didn't suggest she could bench that much. I looked up the averages, and an advanced weight lifter woman it says should be able to bench about 150. Abby was probably advanced, and 185 is not that far outside that number. If they went and said 130#, then some people would act like it's not that much.
Yes, Abby was built on the exaggerated side. But don’t you recall the WLF facility? It was well established. Her physique was within the realm of possibility. If the men could become buff in the game as presented, then why couldn’t Abby? Guarantee there are women out there that are stacked like that in real life. It’s plausible.
No not without juicing man. Im a regular gym goer. I can bench 100lb dumbells. I can squat 400lbs.
She could never get that size without juicing. In most scenes. Weirdly some scenes she looks closer to reality. Even my gf was upset with abbys character model. Its stupid. Its truly not plausible.
I don't think people aren't saying it's plausible. It's just that in the situation (future apocalypse with scarce resources and lack of regular modern supplements) it doesn't feel realistic that she can build that type of physique.
What's weird is why they decided to put that in the game without actually having it relevant to the story. I think they are just trying to buck the trend of "strong woman" figure types ie: Wonder Woman, Black Widow, etc.
@Sarcasm I get you, but I wouldn't necessarily say irrelevant. I still think winding up in that type of post apocalyptic situation, you'd be doing what you could to stay fit, especially physically. And having done so, provided us a character to play that was a bit different than Ellie. I did not like how emaciated they made Ellie towards the end. Talk about an opposite extreme.
@Dirtnapstor True, at least it did contrast the two characters. It was pretty crazy where Abby would snap necks, vs Ellie using a knife to stab during stealth kills.
“ What's weird is why they decided to put that in the game without actually having it relevant to the story.”
It kinda was though in the end. **SPOILERS** Abby loses all her gains while in captivity. Can be seen as one more thing she lost. Crucified on the pillar, thin af, no longer able to dominate Ellie like she used to. Lost a lot of hair too. Shades of Samson, making her sympathetic in some ways. She totally got screwed, worse than had Ellie killed her.
"within the realm of possibility." Without steroids and marching around all day with heavy gear on patrol for miles? There is no way. I was a track runner and in the Marines for 4 years and also worked out with bodybuilders in college who could bench twice my weight. There is no freaking way someone does infantry work all day and holds on all that mass unless she is juicing heavily. Body builders eat huge amounts of calories in several small meals per day and have to sleep quite a bit, probably at least 8 to 10 hours per night. This just isn't compatible with daily infantry/ wartime duties. You can get strong and ripped as hell but not hold that type of excessive mass running around all day, which burns tons of calories.
When I did weight training for sprinting in my youth and “prime”, I could bench 90-100 pounds over my body weight. Some of my larger sprinter friends were much stronger than myself. They were capable of benching twice their own weight! I have however seen a 5’10 160 pound, lean woman bench about 135 pounds, and she was really pushing herself.
The crossfit body is not BS. I've been going for 8 months and I've already packed on 7 lbs of muscle (male, 6'2, 215)
Realistically speaking, her body somatype is Mesomorph, as am I, and it's like fitness is on easy mode. A weight training routine that progressively overloads the muscles and a strategy for recovery would build strength. A surplus in calories / high daily protein intake would build additional muscle leading to that "jacked" look.
If you think crossfit chicks are BS, head to your local crossfit box with female coaches and see it with your own eyes. The ones at my gym are jacked and aren't juicing. Just working hard, eating right and keeping a consistent routine.
I assume you are okay with monsters that throw acid, others that have fungus growing out of their head which acts as a radar dish for their echo location......but having a muscular character is a stretch too far for you.
This kind of bullshit cracks me up....I have news for you, you are not a marine fighting monsters, but you still connected with Marcus Pheonix who's physical appearance bordered on the cartoonish. You still connected with an anthropomorphic hedgehog despite not being a hedgehog yourself. You connected with a cop fighting against a horde of zombies despite never being a cop and having never shot a zombie (I assume that's the case anyway 😂).
Not liking Abbey because she killed Joel is one thing, but your reasoning smacks of insecurity to me chum.
@Dr. Death How old are you? When I was in high school me and some other guys where able to max 300lb. I don't know about the other guys but I didn't need steroids to do that. It's totally believable for a woman as motivated as Abby to bench 185 or more. Genetics also help. Maybe she worked out a couple of hours a day and ate a lot. Being an elite solder she was probably given lots of rations. There was plenty of livestock and food at their HQ.
In the game the Wolves have an extensive gymnasium and a large canteen where they are all well fed, combine that with the extreme physicality of what they do day in day out and a highly motivated individual I don't see it as unusual at all. Also I have seen female power lifters who are as big as her and remember we are dealing with a world where everyone is an advanced mma fighter with incredible weapon skills who all happen to be parkour experts and gymnasts, getting too freaked out at Abby's physique just makes no sense.
Only the face, the body is based on Colleen Fotsch.
And there are people out there trying to establish the "Agenda" of a transgender... oh my... how delusional do you have to be
I don't feel so bad for taking screen shots during the sex scene now.
The body is based on Triple H
I just wish she wasnt on steroids during an appocalypse. Ruins my immersion she is so unrealistic.
Even if you based her off colleen fotsh. She is def a enhancement user. Cross fit checks are bs.
How is abby getting all those calories to support her muscle building? How is she built so much without extemely high testosterone levels? Doesn't make sense. Im sure they ration food and dont have supplements and hormones to pump.
Loved the game. Hated her body. She looks like she could bench 250lbs for a couple reps lol gimme a break. Even advanced female body builders does not look half as strong as her.