Developers working on games for PS5 and Xbox Series X weigh in on what we can expect from those new solid-state hard drives.
There will be a slight load, probably under 1 sec
There has to be an initial load, when starting from scratch.
Both consoles can fill the RAM in a matter of seconds so there shouldn't be much of a reason for traditional loading screens. A fade-out/fade-in transition should be enough even for the initial loading. Maybe devs will come up with some interesting animations to transition from the main menu to the loaded savegame. It's also possible that starting at a main menu won't even be that common anymore and instead you get into the game immediately.
Sure, there'll be a load. How else do you get data off the drive into memory? The question is if players will be able to notice it.
What I'm more curious of is how big of a difference will there be between XboxSX and PS5 for third party games... Not to add to the console war just curious.
It honestly depends on how well MS tools are and how their Xbox Velocity Architecture works in actual application. If devs can't utilize it as intended then Sony has the upper hand. It looks like Sony went with a more hardware solution for their SSD, while MS went both hardware and software based. Regardless I don't think it will be much of hindrance for either system with the only will noticeable difference being initial startup if COD loads in a second on PS5 then it will load in 3 or on Series X and no loading needed afterwards.
@amazing Software can be changed/improved over time, but you can't change the hardware once released. And Sony has double the I/O throughput of MS: 5.5 GB/s vs 2.4 GB/s raw and 8-9 GB/s vs 4.8 GB/s compressed.
We might see some advantages here and there like finer/less visable LOD transitions maybe even higher quality textures for quickly changing scenery. In certain situations it might have a similar effect as if the PS5 had more memory, because devs will be able to get more data on demand from the PS5 which means they might not need to have as much data pre-loaded into RAM. Anyting that is scalable and doesn't require specific optimisations will probably show the biggest differences in multiplats. Nanite might be a good example of that. Realistically most multiplatform devs won't bother to optimize beyond the Series X bandwidth for a while. The main reason for this is that these games will also have to run on PCs and they will take a while to catch up to the console I/O bandwidth. Before PC gamers jump at me, I'm talking about the mass market here. Games aren't usually developed for the high end PC market, although with the help of the consoles, requiring high speed m.2 bandwidth might actually become a more realistic target for multiplats even if they lose the majority of the target audience on PC. Building games from the ground up for the PS5 bandwidth will truly show the potential, which is why exclusives will potentially be even more important then they were this gen. What I'm most excited about is the unexpected ways in which devs might take advantage of the bandwidth.
I dint think there's gonna be much difference in 3rd party games, maybe an unnoticeable one. Unless a game is absolutely massive, then maybe
I think it really depends on the game. I think it is better to say that many traditional places where game reloading takes time will be drastically reduced or eliminated this generation. As developers push games forward they will find new bottlenecks.
There will be SIE logo, so this will load instantly and when logo is gone, game is loaded also instantly. Maybe game resume (I read something about context game start directly into saved game) will be under 1 sec...but come on...thats instantly - quickly fading dashboard out and fading game in and you wont recognize difference from instant.
There'll be a load.
Both boxes have touted virtually no loading so that says it all...there will be loading screens next gen. Might not be as insane as this gen was but they will be there
virtually no loading in game...
I'm wondering how it will affect cross gen/backwards compatible games, like got for example
How long it takes just depends on how much it needs to load to start the scene.
I think that the loading screens will just be masked better along with being short. Load times will exist. I have a NVME in my pc and loading times are still a thing but granted they are considerably shorter.
What is available on the PC is nothing like what you will see in the PS5. Also, games currently are not built to avail themselves of SSDs.
Current SSDs have a speed of 3.5GB/s while the PS5 will have 5.5GB/s. Clearly this is no quantum leap hardware wise. The other aspect is true though. Current games hardly ever have a data transfer rate of as much as 400MB/s, so if you are gaming on PC you don't even realize there is a difference between a regular SATA SSD (approx. 500MB/s) and a NVMe SSD (around 3.5GB/s). Theoretically, it should be possible to get rid of loading times this gen and I hope they will make much progress in this regard. I doubt it though, as every console generation has had its unique next-gen feature and they never really made a difference (remember the Cell processor?).
You are making the same mistake as everyone else. It isn't just raw speed. Pipes matter. Also the custom IO controller matters. https://www.youtube.com/wat... And we have already seen the value of the PS5 SSD and its associated supporting hardware with the R&C gameplay. Tip of the iceberg world hopping.
Ratchet and clank "world hopping" is just clever design. I bet they have multiple assets preloaded. Dont forget it's a cell shaded platform game
I'm mainly a pc gamer now but damn I hate the PC community sometimes. This is why LinusTechTips made an apology video. Thinking the PS5 or even Xbox Series X's SSDs are the same situation. 1 for series X. They can build a game that's optimized for it. So it'll load faster than a PC game does currently despite not even having a drive as fast as my 970pro nvme which clocks 3.5. Next, the ps5 is all around made to take advantage of those speeds. They have a built in decompresser that PC doesn't have the ability to use as it's not a built in feature. The SSD uses 6 lanes as opposed to 2, meaning it can do more at once. Effectively getting around 9gb of data compressed open and ready to go per second. You'll also see because 3 times the lanes it'll be pulling off alot of other things. Console hardware has always been able to pull way bigger feats with hardware that is basically a joke for PC. Because the ability to optimize for fixed hardware and all these special little extras in custom chips and controllers
@Teflon02, I grew up on PCs. I was a Vic64 kid. You are spot on. Instead of getting a bigger stick or hitting the wall with their head harder Cerny and Team have rethought the fundamentals. It makes me think of Faster Than Light travel. We know that as you approach the speed of light, your mass increases exponentially. As your mass increases more energy is required to accelerate your expanding mass. Theory says at the speed of light you would possess infinite mass and therefore require infinite energy to travel. So scientists and theorists are rethinking FTL travel and a way to bend the laws of the universe. At some point Sony realized the law of diminishing returns on simply throwing more raw power at the equation. It wasn't accelerating game development to truly new gamer experiences. Higher resolution and framerate, while bound to the current structure does not offer a true next generation gaming. It looks better, plays more responsive. But it is essentially the same game. What raw power offers doesn't fundamentally shift the tools the developers have to build new gaming experiences. Regarding PCs the first thing that will have to happen is motherboard manufacturers are going to need to agree to a standard of sorts regarding IO processes. The same for new drives. Then they will have to produce those boards and drives. Then enough of them will have to be out in the wild before major game developers build their games around the capability in a manner that goes beyond level loading. People think the PS5's SSD is only about loading times haven't been paying attention. It will allow a complete redesign and huge expansion of game worlds and the way we interact with them. It allows alteration of the game composition at a core conception level that even affects things like story telling because it vastly expands the tools the developers will have to tell that story in heretofore unseen ways. Ratchet and Clank is a 1st generation game in Alpha status. What they will be able to do a year or two from now is mind blowing.
"". It will allow a complete redesign and huge expansion of game worlds and the way we interact with them. It allows alteration of the game composition at a core conception level that even affects things like story telling because it vastly expands the tools the developers will have to tell that story in heretofore unseen ways."" I sincerely hope you're right, but I have a feeling your comment won't age very well. I watched Sony presentation and the most impressive game there, in terms of next gen design was R&C (almost seamless world transitions). The Horizon sequel was just a prettier, more detailed version of what came before, and both with the caveat of 30fps. Maybe you know something other people don't, but the proof will be in the pudding (or games in this case) to see if your grandiose claims will come to pass. I'm ready to be blown away by next gen, regardless.
@Sol4ris The key to some of this isn't just the tech. Its the last statement I made. All of what was shown was either Alpha or at a minimum Beta footage. Developers have to learn the system, and the system will get better through firmware and software updates. Developers have to amend how they conceptualize a game. They have to think differently. They have to realize the possibilities. I really hate to use the term think outside the box. They have to be able to conceive a game and its flow laterally. Corridor layout needs to go away. I do not mean games shouldn't have corridors but rather the sleight of hand that makes a game level seem quite large when it isn't. See through techniques that break immersion in order to channelize and prevent gamers from wandering over to an area that doesn't actually exist. Gamers know this and think "Come on." Do I think a company such as EA is going to take full advantage of the tech? Selectively. It depends on the base growth and to a degree how Sony develops the user tools. I definitely have faith in the latter. If there is one thing Sony is doing it is mowing the lawn and clearing a path for devs. This may be a situation where instead of paying for 30 days or 6 months of launch exclusivity Sony pays for a 3rd party company to push the system and build levels differently, more expansive and avail themselves of the tech. Remember in order to take full advantage of the system these things require design choices that differ radically from the layout that is available to other systems. We haven't seen those sorts of choices since the PS2/Xbox era. This is why Sony made the statement they are doubling down on exclusives. And realizing I am simply expounding upon what people like Cerny and other developers have already stated. One note about being proven right. First it doesn't matter what others think. And I am used to waiting. For over a decade I was called a liar because I told people here that developers were running Gears of War on the PS3 at Epic games including multiplayer and I was attacked non-stop. It took some time but that finally came out. When it comes to caring what others believe concerning me I am bulletproof.
I am aware that they design console hardware differently then pc hardware. Large reason for that is because currently consoles are a closed eco system so they make everything to work in conjunction. I understand all of that but I think people should just keep their expectations in check and that is including any expectations of how the series x will handle no loading screens. Don't mistake anything I've said as talking crap about next gen I am crazy excited for both systems I just don't think they'll ever completely get rid of loading screens. Like I said they'll just do a really good job of masking them much like how gears did with their loading screens. Honestly if I'm wrong then fantastic I'll eat crow. My only real concern is replacing the SSD on the ps5. It isn't going to be cheap because seemingly it'll have to be sony certified to get the most out of it. But like I said either way I'm stoked to pick one up later this year.
If there are no loading screens, where am I going to get my helpful game hints such as "Try not to die in game. The leading cause of dying is death"
i too worry about this. "Reloading puts more bullets in your gun" will be missed
Omg I suck at video games and die all the time I am soooo sick of loading screens lmao
lol I remember those screens from Dragon Age: Inquisition. They show a tip screen for 2 seconds and then change it to a black screen for 40 seconds.
Once the game fades back in it will probably have these tips in a box or like subtitles on screen that fades away after 5 seconds. They will have to put the tips in the game after it loads up or load the game again but put you in the pause menu or a semi transparent pause screen where these can be displayed and you simply press a button to return to the game. However this reload pause screen should an optional toggle. Maybe just hold a button as the game fades to skip the pause screen all together. many possibilites. Im sure devs will figure these things out.
It's very realistic I can imagine going from dash to game within seconds. This is an area pc can never match imo
Can *never* match? lol....you're being silly.
Exactly.... It takes time to boot into windows then load steam uplay origin epic etc. Then load a game etc. Even with the fastest ssd there's no resume unless you use hibernate and you can't exit a game then jump into another
You missed the point. Yes, currently console SSD is superior to PC. That will not always be the case though. Those advancements in compression will make it to PC. Microsoft's DirectStorage is already there so it may even happen before consoles arrive.
PC will likely always be inhibited by the OS which controls the flow of data through the I/O bus. There is no real way around this as it keeps files secure. DMA helps some, but the system calls to hardware are still handled by the OS. This could potentially be overcome by a hardware solution on the main bridge, but the OS would have to support it...which MS would probably allow within a secured file space used while the application is running. Itll take time for that to happen though It doesnt mean that PC games cant be designed around ssd drives though. Just the benefits may have to be scaled back a touch.
It cannot currently, but it will.
While not when the consoles drops they probably won't. But you'll see next year or so PC games will start to take advantage of SSDs I'm sure. They already do make big differences. As most games for me currently only load as long as the transition takes lol
We asked devs, but all i can read is a Bloober dev which works on XSX exclusive The Medium.
they claim that no loading screen in most cases is cleverely hiding loading and not stopping the game, their game is also available on pc and a lot of pc users only has hdds, so they have designed the game in such a way that they could hide loading even when using hdds, this game does not fully utilize ssds.
It’s not just about the speed of the SSD drive. It’s the tech built around it that makes the difference, custom tech inside the ps5 will push the boundaries in all aspects.
Ppl don't understand this they derrange themselfs thinking it's load times only. Ye on pc that is but not on console
Do you ever stop thinking about PC?
I can imagine the next soulsborne type game (or demons souls) being able to invade in an instant , would be so cool !! Imagine the moment you invade or whatever your character just phases through a portal or everything around your character just instantly shifts into a new world .. I'm so stoked
Having realistic expectations I expect much less loadtimes than previous gens. If they can make that happen I will be happy.
They will both have less - to 0 loading screens. And don't compare what people have been saying about "well even in current gen when i move my games to an ssd they have load screens. Shorter but they have them" because current gen games were not built for ssd. They will both achieve the same things by going at it differently don't let fanboys try to convince you that i/o is all you need to know.
Ok. Then don't let people tell you "it's all about the tflops" either 😂 It's so fucking pathetic how the narrative has become "the only advantages that make a difference, are the ones that favour xbox". Now go spot yourself, fanboy.
.....It’s gunna be fast :)
This means console players will no longer get those 30 seconds of hints and tips that put them ahead of the PC players. /s
With PS5 I expect no loading at all and fast travel to be just that fast travel.
The larger the size of the assets, the more necessary loading would be. What you won't get on next gen consoles are explicit loading screens. Something like PS5's Ratchet & Clank data loading method is what I am thinking of (when jumping from dimension to another, there is a dimension in the middle).
There will still be loadi5imo just not to the egregious time of the 8th gen.
I recently picked up The Sinking City when it went on sale, so I guess I'm getting my fill of loading screens before next gen. I suppose I have to extra ensure I don't miss them at all. Yeah...this game is definitely accomplishing just that.
It's going to be harder in the years to come with improvements.
Its absolutely the last thing I care about
Well... that means we no longer get tips & tricks via loadingscreens ... So tutorials must contain more or less every little command that is a bit unreachable until you know it is there.
"There are quite a few tricks to load new data without the player noticing it," Zieba says."By making the character open a door slowly, or by squeezing through rocks, or walking slowly knee deep in mud, you not only add to the atmosphere, but also win precious seconds to load the rest of the level under the hood". hmm...I remember some games did that even during the PS1 era like Resident evil 1 the door scene while going to new rooms , Castlevania sotk , while running to the other zone :) .
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