Just How Badly Did The PS4 And Switch Outsell The Xbox One This Generation?

Forbes: With all this talk about the coming race between the PlayStation 5 and Xbox Series X, I thought it might be time to take a look back and remember what happened this past generation in the console race, and how that might inform the future.

[Sonyslave3]

Lol article fail talking about this gen and didn't mention the flop we call Wii u.

[SpaceRanger]

The fact that MS’ closest competitor Was the Wii U is hilarious lol I don’t think most would want that mentioned.

[Tross]

Especially considering the Wii U was actually outsold by the Vita. But, I guess that's irrelevant in a console only comparison. The only bigger insult would be to compare the XB1 to the Stadia and say "well, at least it sold better than the Stadia".

[Unspoken]

Hey, Forbes articles are a thing now!

[CrimsonIdol]

"The fact that MS’ closest competitor Was the Wii U is hilarious lol I don’t think most would want that mentioned."
well yeah, because it's not true. Wii U sold under 14 million in it's entire lifetime, Xbox One has been estimated to have sold around 47 million by the second quarter of 2019. Switch had officially sold 52 as of the end of December 2019. I'd say that makes the Switch the closest competitor don't you?

[FallenAngel1984]

How can you even say XO and Wii U are close? One is clearly a dead system while the other is still that flagship system of its manufacturer

[SpaceRanger]

@CrimsonIdol @FallenAngel

So I can’t tell if everyone wants the switch to be compared against the Xbox One or not?

If the switch is compared, the Xbox is getting beat. If it’s the Wii U, then yes 14 million is way closer to 47 million than 100+ million. Simple math my dudes.

[KillBill]

@SpaceRanger - you are messing your numbers up. Switch is not at 100+ million. That is PS4. Your point between comparing vs switch or Wii U would be a 14mil vs 52mil comparison. You erroneously tossed in PS4 numbers in your point.

[DJStotty]

@spaceranger

Actually the closest competitor is the switch, Wii U sold around 15 million globally.

[lalalala]

The Xbox 360 figures are probably realistically around what the Xbox One figures are because so many people had to buy more than one due to RRod. I had 3 myself due to rrod!

[Mulando]

WiiU sold ~11-14m while xbox one ~47-50m
This is a big difference. The WiiU was a commercial flop, the xbox one not. It hasn't sold as good as MS hoped, but still good enough for a healthy eco system.

[Neonridr]

like the Vita right?

[Prince-Ali]

The vita was released in 2011 before the gen started and isn't even a home console but nice try deflecting kid... 👍😂

[Fil101]

The veta was a really gd portable console but could av been amazing if it was supported enough, and yes ive been with ps since day 1 but ill be the first to admit that sony made the right choice and leaving the handheld console market because lets all be honestly here that nintendo games are better on a handheld console. And also i dont comment much but am kinda tired of all this bullshit about how more powerful or faster the xbox is, "it is what it is", its a quick fire pc end of the day. Where s the inovasion, nobody can say nintendo has none even there stupid carboard games wtf!!!. Lol. But like nintendo, sony have been inovating since day one and from what ive read about the hardware features of the ps5 it may be 3 tf slower or wtf it is, people are dumb enough to think that jus because it has a faster clock speed its gonna be btr lmfao.

[Rhythmattic]

Neonridr
I award you no points.............

[kayoss]

@Neonridr, did you compare it to the Vita, a handheld? For argument purposes. Lets compare the Vita to the xbox 360. Yep, the Xbox 360 is as sad as the Vita, probably even sadder because its a home console and have 3rd party support.

Does that make you a bit more happy that we just compared a full fledged home console to a hand held?

[bouzebbal]

How about Nokia Ngage while you're at it?

[Neonridr]

@Prince-Ali - what I am referring to is how the Vita did an admirable job against the 3DS and it's an underrated machine and yada-yada-yada. It was destroyed, no questions about it. My point was how you guys won't admit that but will easily say the Wii U failed against the XB1 and PS4.

[BehindTheRows]

Only you would try to spin this and still fail... the same guy that calls himself fair and balanced.

Newsflash - The discussion is about current gen consoles. The Wii U is this gen's biggest loser. Trying to beat down the Vita does not change that.

[Neonridr]

@BehindTheRows - and yet I own more than one system and can actually offer a fair and valid opinion. Unlike so many Sony bots on this site that only live and breathe one machine.

The Wii U was a commercial failure sales wise absolutely, I never once said that. I own one, played many games on it, had my good times with it.

my point was to highlight that so many people on this site won't acknowledge that the Vita was a failure. They say it's underrated or it's a great little machine or it sold enough when in comparison to the other hardware, it failed miserably. Sure it was a little off topic, but I just like to highlight the double standards that N4G offers.

Cheers.

[darthv72]

it is sad how the little wiiu has been forgotten. But in time it will be revered like the dreamcast or saturn.

[Saigon]

I actually liked the wii u; i think the name killed it.

[TheScotsman]

Probably better than calling it a wii me pmsfl

Seriously, I have loads of great stuff on the wii u and my girls still love to play it even though they got bigger and better Consoles

[bouzebbal]

Wiiu is an amazing device with great games.
Still playing it every single day. Mario Party, Splatoon, MK8, Bayo2, Xenoblade, mario tennis, maker etc..
Better luck with trolling next time...

[Silly gameAr]

It hasn't been forgotten here. I still have My WIi U and never getting rid of it. My Switch on the other hand, I gave to my little cousin for his birthday because he really wanted one.

[generic-user-name]

It had a good library but that library has been absorbed by the Switch at this stage.

[Hellcat2020]

I loved my Wii U
It had some great titles which most ended up on Switch either way

[neutralgamer1992]

Neo sony Darth

Even as PS3 wasn't doing well Sony reported numbers not hours played but ms are the definition of front running the moment they got their ass handed to them they forgot what sales numbers are. People like major Nelson couldn't contain themselves last gen but this gen where they were outsold more than 2-1 and in some other countries 3-1 they forgot and we're all about giving other stats. Back in 2006-2008 this site had daily articles about doom of pa3 and Sony going out of business of console business and Xbox defense force had field day everyday. Now the same ones are crying foul that this site has more PlayStation fans and is pro PlayStation

2 out of 3 Xbox consoles have been failures in comparison to their competetion. Not one Xbox console has sold 100 million yet Xbox fanboys talk about it like it has been nothing but success. Both Sony and Nintendo have had consoles that sold 100+ million and set records

It's not sad because Nintendo came out with something new right away which outsold Xbox. Ms tried with Xbox X and it didn't make much of a difference

Btw Xbox brand isn't on the same level as Nintendo or PlayStation right now (during the 360 days the brand made some progress) but most of it was lost this gen. And once again the thing that will hold back next Xbox will be games

You can't say all our games will support all Xbox family consoles that means there is no way any developer can take full advantage of newest console

For a long time people with Ms thought games don't matter we can survive with halo, gears, Forza but they finally realized the reason Nintendo and Sony can succeed is because they offer must play games

So you buy the studios than you hold them back by making them working on versions of the games for the original Xbox one

This is why Sony sees no rush in revealing anything right now they must be sitting back laughing their asses off. Even when Ms try to do something right they can't get out of their own way

I for one am glad there will be actual exclusive games only available for ps5. This is the whole purpose of next gen if people want to play on PS4 and Xbox one than why even move forward

Ps5 will come out of the game with momentum and must have exclusives while Xbox series x will come out of the gate with games you can play on older Xbox consoles along with pc

You grow your brand by making games only available on that one platform. Nintendo has survived and thrived like that for decades

Ps5 $399
3-5 must have exclusives out the gate and more announced

Xbox series x $499

And you can play those games anywhere sure that will give gamers a reason to buy your machine

That's why many PC only gamers bought PS4 because Xbox fans were available on PC and looked/played better

[1Victor]

@neutralhamer Wow don’t bring them down to reality that fast or 🤯 .

[neutralgamer1992]

Victor

It's not that man it's the same skewed arguments again and again

[DEEHULK88]

Neutral
How are they forcing companies to work on old game when the new systems have 0 installed based? It makes sense to work on old versions. smh

[bouzebbal]

Or the flop you just posted? How about taking it? X1 is closer to wiiu in terms of sales than it is to the other two. Better now?

[DJStotty]

xbox one - 50+ million
Wii U - 14< million

errr... no... no its not

[KillBill]

Wii U was last gen... what are you trying to point out?

[TGGJustin]

By the time they're both done selling it will be close to 3:1 in PS4s favor. The importance of focusing on more than just people in the US and UK. The UK market is important but total console sales there account for a tiny amount of total sales. I don't even think the PS4 has sold 10 million there when it's probably at 110 million worldwide.

[skiggy34]

In the US the PS4 only outsold the Xbox One by a few million I think. PS4s are also sold in a ton more regions than Xbox so it should obviously sell more.
Because I could really care less I would like to see MS take some market back this next gen, competition is good for everyone

[Nacho_Z]

@skiggy34

It's always fun to see people leaving nonchalantly negative comments about a console like they're more or less indifferent, then to look at their comments and see they're a rabid fanboy for the opposition.

I think some people don't even realise they're doing it. Pretty sad.

[PhoenixUp]

“By the time they're both done selling it will be close to 3:1 in PS4s favor”

How is that possible? XO is close to 50 million, meaning PS4 would have to sell as well as PS2 and DS to get that 3-1 ratio

[TGGJustin]

The PS4 is at around 110 million or more. Meanwhile we don't even know if the Xbox One has done 50 million yet. The PS4 is outselling the Xbox One 3:1 pretty much on a weekly basis. Not hard to imagine that total sales could be close to 3:1 by the time they are done.

[PhoenixUp]

We know that XO sales are anywhere from 45-50 million, so PS4 would have to do extreme overtime to reach 135-150 million before XO can reach 50 million to achieve that absurd ratio

[FallenAngel1984]

@ TGG

For reference sake VGC currently has PS4 at 109.3 million and XO at 47.1 million which is a 2.3-1 ratio

As well as PS4 continues to sell, it’s absurd to believe it could sell 32-40 million more units before XO can sell another 3 million.

You’ve got to be out of your mind if you think that 3-1 ratio is realistically achievable.

[kayoss]

50 million is an estimate, all we know it could be a lot less or a lot more. Microsoft dont release their numbers.

@FallenAngel 3:1 is realistic. At the start of this gen, no one in their right mind would have predicted that the PS4 would out sell the xbox 360 2:1. But look at where we are now.

[Immagaiden]

Your math must be horrible in this regard if you suppose that 3-1 ratio to come true

Even if Xbox One were to sell 0 units from this day forward that ratio is unrealistic. XO is estimated at 46-47 million right now, which would mean PS4 would have to reach 138-141 million units yesterday just to accomplish that ratio at this exact moment.

This doesn’t even mention the reality that XO is still selling units. Even if XO were sell 3 million more units units for the rest of its lifetime, PS4 would have to sell 40 million more units just to achieve that ratio, which would put it into PS2 & DS territory.

Even 1 or 2 million more units sold from XO would require PS4 to sell 34-38 units at faster rate. Considering PS4 sold 20.2 million in one year during its peak performance in 2017 and it’s been on a downward incline ever since, I’m sure you can see how ridiculous your claim really is.

[PhoenixUp]

“And Nintendo, as ever, will quietly putter along, putting everyone else to shame.”

So we’re just going to ignore the Wii U?

[King_Noctis]

They had one flop amidst the success of the DS, 3DS, Wii, and the Switch. The DS outsold the PSP, the 3DS outsold the Vita, the Wii outsold the PS3/XB 360, the Wii U flopped, and the Switch is currently outselling the Xbox One.

[FallenAngel1984]

You’re not helping your case when you too are trying to sweep the Wii U’s failure under the rug. You’re just further validating the point of the OP

[brrdat]

the last time i checked, sony has 3 consoles in the top 5 best selling consoles of all time. nintendo has 2 handhelds in the top 5, which while impressive, is not even close to sony's level of success.

[DJStotty]

The switch is currently outselling the PS4 on a weekly basis.

[DJStotty]

@brrdat

It is easy to have a console in the top best selling of all time, when that console is released against minimal opposition.

Sony have not really had direct competition since the dreamcast, their only competition today is Microsoft.

[RazzerRedux]

@DJStotty

"The switch is currently outselling the PS4 on a weekly basis."

"Sony have not really had direct competition since the dreamcast, their only competition today is Microsoft."

Wow. Great job contradicting yourself there.

"It is easy to have a console in the top best selling of all time, when that console is released against minimal opposition."

That's just spin. PS1 dominated the N64 and Sega Saturn. PS2 dominated Xbox, Sega Dreamcast, and Gamecube. Those consoles were no slouches and were technically superior in many ways. PS just had the games, as always. Then there is the PS3 which lost to Wii. How is that "minimal opposition"?

Just silly posts, dude.

[DJStotty]

@Razzer,

Most of the comments in this thread are stating how well the PS4 is outselling the xbox one, negating the sales statistics of the Switch, no contradicting here, just facts.

The Switch has been the best selling console worldwide, for the past few weeks if not months - fact.

Lets have a look at Sony PS2 opposition (best selling console of all time) :-

Dreamcast - 9 million total sales, discontinued in 2001
Gamecube - 22 million total sales
Xbox - 24 million total sales

So yeah MINIMAL opposition, and none of that opposition is around today, apart from Microsoft, (Nintendo are indirect competition as they are more or less a gen behind tech-wise every console) so i stand by what i said "their only competition today is Microsoft."

And "It is easy to have a console in the top best selling of all time, when that console is released against minimal opposition."

Competition was different with the PS3/4, which is why they may not hit that figure again (if anyone will) unless there is minimal oppostion.

[RazzerRedux]

"Most of the comments in this thread are stating how well the PS4 is outselling the xbox one, negating the sales statistics of the Switch, no contradicting here, just facts."

Yes, Switch is currently outselling PS4 which directly contradicts your statement that Sony has not had "direct competition since the dreamcast" (not a fact).

"So yeah MINIMAL opposition"

Not at all. You are acting like the Xbox was Ouya or something. Xbox sales were directly hindered by PS2's dominance. So was Gamecube and Dreamcast. PS2 effectively killed Dreamcast and Sega's participation in the console market. If PS2 had not been made then Xbox, Gamecube, and Dreamcast would have had a lot more sales. PS2 simply dominated the market.

"and none of that opposition is around today, apart from Microsoft, (Nintendo are indirect competition as they are more or less a gen behind tech-wise every console) "

Only one of the four console makers of that gen are not making consoles: Sega. Nintendo is very much around as you just pointed out as they are currently outselling PS4. That is direct competition. You are referencing Switch as competition when it is convenient and dismissing them when it is not. Just nonsense.

"Competition was different with the PS3/4"

Again, you said there was no competition. Not since dreamcast.

[badz149]

@DJStotty

yeah? outselling a console that is over 3 years older and has already past its peak and will have its predecessor released this year is a huge deal now? LOL

[PhoenixUp]

This article was specifically talking about the 8th gen consoles while also including Switch.

If we’re going to be talking about the history of Nintendo systems as a whole then let’s not forget how Virtual Boy, N64 & GCN underperformed

The amount of success Nintendo has had does not make their misfires nonexistent.

[Neonridr]

so are we saying that the PS5 / XBSX are 50 million units behind the Switch then? Or is the Switch going to be last gen once those release?

you can't change your stories.

[PhoenixUp]

@ Neo

Yes PS5 & XSX are behind 50+ million behind other 9th gen system Switch. What of it?

@ gen

Yeah it’s a shame. Nintendo never even bothered dropping the price on the damn thing before it got discontinued. I had to wait a long while to get one after nintendo abandoned it just so I could finally replace my Wii.

[MajorLazer]

PS4 will end up #3 in the all time list and I believe the PS5 will outsell the PS4

[Starman69]

Ps5 (and xbsx) are going to be sick!! Ssu will make a huge difference for the gamer. Super smooth, fast loading and speedy navigation takes all the ballache out of the current gen, which is already awsome where it matters the most, games! ! 😊

[Elda]

Real bad!! Hopefully MS/XB has learned their lesson. I don't care about how much of a slight increase of horsepower the XBSX has I'm interested in seeing what new original next gen AAA games will release on the system.If these games turn out to be must have to play,there's a strong possibility that PS4 & Switch owners that didn't buy an XBO will buy a XBSX.

[Zarock]

The Switch is targeting a totally different market which is mobile gaming and it failed to beat Apple/ios and Google/android the switch didn't sell shit compared to those two.

Only the PS4 can be compared to Xbox sales number.

[Tross]

A game system, as in a device centered purely around entertainment, hasn't sold as well as cell phones and tablets, the former of which is something a functional adult in modern Western society should have, and the latter of which is invested in en masse for its various practical functions? I'm shocked! I can accept the notion that Nintendo has gone a different route, and has done its best to appeal to the on-the-go gamer too, but I don't think they ever had any delusions of outselling devices that many people just have to have for various reasons.

[DJStotty]

Switch is a console, so yeah, it gets compared to consoles on the market, not mobile.

[Tross]

I doubt it. MS has a huge uphill battle if they want to convince PS4 and Switch gamers to check out their system. They tend to double down on power because that's the only ace they have in the hole, and it really only gets them so far. That said, I am glad for their sake that they're at least trying to do better. I'm sure as heck not expecting a huge departure from what we got with the XB1 though. That will probably work just fine for some people, especially the loyal Xbox fanbase, but it's not for me.

If I'm going to pick one of what will ultimately be two very similar systems, I'm of course going to go with the one that has the better exclusives; and as my secondary system I'll stick with the one that's different enough from my primary system (and also has a great lineup of exclusives, and excellent indie support to boot). I also have a PC for its exclusives, and I can easily use it for "console exclusives". MS really has their work cut out for them if they want to convince me that an Xbox is a must-have alongside all of the above. It will take true XSX exclusives, and enough quality and quantity thereof to convince someone like myself who has potentially played thousands of games in my lifetime to feel as though I'm missing out on something truly special.

[Elda]

I hear you. PS consoles are my main consoles to play first party games including some multi-plats & mainly my go to games are AAA titles. I would like to have a 2nd go to console but when it comes to the Switch most of their AAA titles just don't capture my interest. When it came to the XBO they had the power but they also had no exclusive AAA titles that captured my interest including the fact that this gen they had a lack of AAA exclusives for the past few years. When it comes to MS & Nintendo I would like to see MS finally come out with some big budget original interesting exclusives that will make me say.."I've got to play that game!!!" Otherwise I'll continue to stick with my main console that always satisfies my gaming needs & that next console will be the PS5.

[Chris12]

Saying MS double down on power is probably disingenuous.

At the start of the gen it was the PS4 that was more powerful (and didn't we hear all about it for years from PS fans on N4G). MS on the other hand had a less powerful system, which was more expensive to buy due to Kinect. It had a shit DRM plan, had cut back on studios and focused too much on TV. The power advantage only swung late in the gen but by then it was too late.

Compare to the start of this gen. They do have the more powerful console from the start, and no Kinect! They have bought studios and they are focusing on games. Gamepass is a great service and their messaging since the first reveal has been spot on.

There is no way Xbox will overtake sales of PlayStation, they just don't have that reach. But they have done enough to satisfy Xbox fans (so far) and attract some new buyers IMO. It should be a great gen , that's for sure.

[kayoss]

@Chris, you're right that xbox 360 when launched was weaker than the PS4. But did you forget the PR for the "Power of the cloud"? Claiming that it will make the 360 4x more powerful?
History has shown us that power is a small variable that determine if a console do well. The bigger variable that makes an impact is the first party games and support for the console. Nintendo is a prime example of this. Their console are the weakest out of the three and yet they are very successful. PS4 success didnt come from how powerful the console is. The success came from the game support and how the system was utilized to show case its potential. Xbox 360 this gen mainly relied on 3rd party support to provide their fans with games. Even when they have exclusives, their exclusives didnt really show case what their console is capable of.

[FallenAngel1984]

“Xbox One left a bad taste in many gamers’ mouths after a very, very rocky launch”

How many times is this topic going to be repeated? Like it’s that major a reason Xbox One performed the way it did.

Xbox One still sold more at launch than Xbox 360 just like how PS3 also sold more at launch than 360 despite people’s divisive opinion about it out of the gate. Despite all this you rarely see people talking negative about 360’s launch sales, even though it sold less than the other two starting out. Xbox One still sold at a faster rate than its predecessor for 3 1/2 years. That’s long enough to show that the launch isn’t that major a factor in contributing to XO’s overall sales. Yes the original policies were absurd but what’s even more absurd is neglecting how it still sold at a better rate than its predecessor for 3.5 years.

Also also a controversial launch doesn’t automatically spell doom and gloom for a system. As I said earlier many like to bash PS3’s launch for differing reasons yet it still ended up being one of the best selling systems of all time. Regardless of how Xbox One was received it wasn’t going to perform as well as its predecessor since it wouldn’t have as many advantages. I doubt even Xbox Series X will perform as well commercially as Xbox 360.

In the bigger picture even if Microsoft did everything perfectly for XO from day one thei brand doesn’t have as strong appeal as Sony’s, so it’s not like they had that strong a chance to come out on top. The only brand Xbox has been able to outperform is Nintendo and even that track record is uneven.

Xbox’s peak performance is 84-86 million while PlayStation can more times than not surpass 100 million units. I doubt even Xbox Series X will perform as well commercially as Xbox 360. The best XO could’ve hoped for was to sell 50-70 million because it wouldn’t perform as well in NA(not even PS4 will sell as many units in NA as 360 did) and the Xbox brand still isn’t as strong in other markets. The same goes for XSX’s future performance.

[rlow1]

I like alot of what you said, but the Xbox360/PS3 is a hard one to go solely by numbers when all is said and done. Their are some big factors people gloss over on both companies during that generation that led to the end results.
People like to say, that Sony was inevitable to win that generation and that is not so. Alot of miss steps by both companies plus successes led to the end results. Of course people always like to forget Nintendo won that gen hands down in terms of hardware sold. But i agree the Playstation brand worldwide is stronger brand especially after this generation. MS is going to have dig real deep on the games side of things.

Games as a serivce on any device will really be the wildcard this generation. I always look back at the end of a gen towards its beginning to see how much has changed. I've found that alot of predictions on how everything would pan out fall woefully short. I'm excited to see this generation start and i'm not placing my bets on anyone pony(no pun intended).

[DEEHULK88]

Fallenangel
I get your point on brand, but with the same brand awareness advantages, ps3 was only able to beat 360 by just a measly 3 million.

[EasilyTheBest]

I recently heard from a UK Microsoft employee that Microsoft may announce how many Xbox One & Xbox One X consoles have sold in a tech event close to the Xbox Series X release.
Whether its true or not I don't know but he's been correct on some stuff before. He said the numbers are quite surprisingly higher than ppl think..

[waverider]

They are at another level. There isnt any Kind of competition in the numbers. Thats why Microsoft hide the numbers and talk about live. The number are world apart. I think that this gen Microsoft never sold more then the competition in any month. Right now is 4 to five times less....

[rlow1]

Your math is off. Go to VG Charts and you'll see it more of a 2:1,3:1 ratio which is huge. But going buy that 4 to 5 times that would put Xbox in the 15 to 25 million range. Or put Sony in close proximity to the PS2. Depending how you slant it.

[Software_Lover]

The switch is a different generation......

[MajorLazer]

Hmmmmm

[Tross]

I don't think Nintendo does gens in the same way.

[PyroMessiah86]

Just how badly do I not care about sales of a console I enjoy?

It's funny really, in the XSX vs PS5 war that's brewing often the Sony guys talk about sales....I literally couldn't care if PS4 has sold 50% extra over Xbox (or more) i'd take Xboxs Gamepass, xcloud, gold and live services every day over PSNow and PSN. It's proven time and time again to be a better service.

Also a common arguement "Halo, Gears and Forza Box" there's so much more to Xbox than that even now that when next gen comes along that will be even further from the truth.

I feel the whole gamers giving a damn about sales it's just lame. Sales don't equal a better machine or community. At the moment on N4G the PS community seems very toxic....yeah you sold more....well done. Xbox One fucked up out of the gate what do you expect? Xbox right now is going from strength to strength, there's a reason Sony use Microsoft's Azure services for PSNow....it's the best in th business.

[waverider]

Services. Keep telling that... The diference are games. Both old and New i.p. Amazing games and not empty wait for... services gsmes, bare Bones gsmes that no one cares. A full gen without a single major new game. But keep talking of services. In two months another major Hit is coming. New i.p. For this gen and not for next....

[PyroMessiah86]

Why do you care what I like or what Xbox fans like from Xbox? Why do you care about PS4 sales?

In terms of services Sony use Microsoft's services too like Azure. So what's your point exactly? This is a article about sales and not games specifically so your reply is rather pointless.

[WillyC009]

Lol sure, keep telling yourself that.

[PyroMessiah86]

Sales don't affect my enjoyment of a product. If they do yours then good for you :) 👍

[--bienio--]

What a pointless article! No one denied Xbox one WAS outsell buy Sony. Let’s talk about it after new generation arrives. Past Is a past. End of story.

[waverider]

This gen isnt over yet

[Lon3wolf]

No it isn't but I doubt much will change sales wise now with the new consoles so close to release and MSofts position in sales will still be the same by the time it does finish.

[Fishy Fingers]

Very....

Keeps me up at night.

[Software_Lover]

I'm like, why are we still doing this? Surely most gamers are adults now right?

I'm sure the car that I drive was not the best selling in it's class but I still enjoy it.

[galmi]

unfortunately gamers arent adults on n4g

[RazzerRedux]

"I'm like, why are we still doing this? "

So why are you? If market performance of a product is something you don't want to discuss then just don't don't discuss it. Suggesting this isn't a topic adults would/should be interested in is just nonsense. Just because you supposedly find no interest in it doesn't mean others cannot and that has nothing to do with being an adult.

"I'm sure the car that I drive was not the best selling in it's class but I still enjoy it."

And? Who is saying overall sales performance equates to personal satisfaction? It doesn't. That is a silly comparison.

[Imortus_san]

Nothing beats the PS Vita and Wii U.

[ApocalypseShadow]

This is an old conversation.

But I think what lot of Xbox fans miss with this ridiculous idea that "consoles sales don't matter" or "game sales don't matter"...it makes you look ignorant.

More console sales leads to more support. Ask Sega. Leads to that system ending up being the lead platform to make games on. More games sold leads to possible sequels or exclusives to the platform Like Spider-Man. It's like you guys forget why they make hardware. It's to **SELL** it. Or why make it?

Who sold more consoles this gen? Sony. Who got more exclusives because of it? Sony. Who got more Japanese games? Sony. Who had more control on timed exclusives and 3rd party content? Sony. Who sold enough consoles to take risks on games like Dreams or Concrete Genie? Sony. Who sold enough consoles to take a risk on VR? Sony

***Stop drinking the Microsoft Kool-aid***

Tell you what. Tell Microsoft to not release hardware. Not that they aren't trying to go digital anyway. But watch what happens to their game sales with no hardware to play it on. Unless they piggyback off of other hardware platforms that do sell like Apple or Android phones, PC or Nintendo Switch.

See exactly what happens and why hardware sales are important. Is that Kool-aid cherry, orange or grape?

[Chris12]

What narrative are you pursuing today?

MS will never sell more than PS, that's the fact. However, they need to sell enough to make a viable business. Just because they are not the no 1 seller does not mean they won't be successful. Companies define success on their bottom line, not by comparing themselves to other companies. Would they like to be No 1? Of course. All they can do is plan better to achieve better than they have this gen.

The problem with having a sensible conversation on N4G is that the Sony fans jump straight in, pretend they all have amazing PC rigs and derail the conversation about playing games on PC and so the hardware discussion goes south. MS are making all the right moves at the start of this gen, and will hopefully have a better gen than the last one. That would then be considered successful.

[RazzerRedux]

"Companies define success on their bottom line, not by comparing themselves to other companies."

Success against their competition has a direct result on their bottom line.

"The problem with having a sensible conversation on N4G is that the Sony fans jump straight in, pretend they all have amazing PC rigs and derail the conversation about playing games on PC and so the hardware discussion goes south."

lol....oh, so "sensible conversation" means you get to brag about your console and anyone who has a gaming PC is just lying? That seems to be a common narrative among Xbox fans who simply don't like the fact that their mighty X isn't so mighty when compared to a lot of PCs out there. You can cry about it all you want and pretend PC gamers simply don't exist, but you are just delusional. Hell...just as easy for me to call bullshit on anyone who says they own a Xbox One X. But that's just stupid.

And when did ApocalypseShadow make any mention at all about having a PC rig? You just pulled that cliché argument out of thin air and yet somehow you want to yapp about "sensible conversations"? Please.

[Chris12]

@RazzerRedux - pathetic comeback as usual.

I didn't suggest Apocalypse had a PC did I. Equally I never bragged about any console either and it's also true when a conversation fires up about Xbox games, the same PS diehards jump over the thread talking about PC's. It's not a case they don't have a decent PC, it's a case that they just want to troll on every Xbox thread possible.

From an MS POV, they receive gaming income from both PC and Xbox, and the main money is made in software and services, not hardware, more so at the start of a gen.

If you don't understand this then unfortunately you are delusional.

So please, go cry

[RazzerRedux]

"I didn't suggest Apocalypse had a PC did I. "

Like I said, you pulled that argument out of your ass. Has nothing to do with anything being discussed.

"It's not a case they don't have a decent PC"

So stop yapping that PC owners are "pretending".

" it's a case that they just want to troll on every Xbox thread possible."

You mean like how you are trolling this thread with this bullshit that has nothing to do with the topic? Talk about crying. Seems you start whining and crying randomly about shit not even relevant to the conversation.

"From an MS POV, they receive gaming income from both PC and Xbox, and the main money is made in software and services, not hardware, more so at the start of a gen."

And? MS makes money off of games/services they sell on PC and Xbox. Yeah.....no shit.

[Chris12]

Wow, you really are crying. Perhaps lockdown hasn't helped you mentally. Time for a lay down before you explode.

[RazzerRedux]

lol....you think you are clever, don't you?

[Chris12]

Nope, you don't need to be when dealing with angry kids on the internet

[rlow1]

It always come down to two important factors. Price and of course games. If Xbox can turn around the games situation in a big way and nail the price, then they'll be competitive on the hardware side. I don't think they'll beat the PS5 in terms of overall hardware sales. That said, the wild card really for MS is the Netflicks idea to gaming. PSNow in it's current form isn't exactly the same thing, though that can change. But i doubt we would ever see (upcoming gen) simultaneous releases of Sony first party exclusives with a service like that. If MS's idea does take off in a big way then the total hardware sales won't be the most important barometer to go by. I agree the XSX probably won't outsell the 360, but the gaming as a service thing wasn't around then. The other interesting thing will be if MS follows the phone market in terms of frequency of hardware and upgraded equipment. I don't think they would, but having a shorter cycle between hardware could become a thing.

[waverider]

There Just a problem with services. The moment that the deals of 1,2,5 bucks end, because that doesnt give enough money to cover gamepass and Microsoft is forced to put 30 or 40 bucks a month... Do You think that putting day one Triple AAA games that cost 100, 200 million or more with marketing is profitable with services almost free... With 15 studios making games. Righ now Microsoft is already making less money with sales of games. Just a reminder. In europe a single game cost 59 or 69. Now Just think how many gamers they need with gamepass at 1,2 or 5 to cover that and remember that they stiil needs to pay to all 3rd party for having their games. Maybe when they reach 100 millon on gamepass... They can match a game selling millions in couple of days

[rlow1]

Well that's the point, they need to put up big concurrent subscription numbers. That's why it's a wildcard. If it takes off, then they'll reap the benefits. Yes, it needs to hit high numbers. But wether they need 20, 30, 50, or 100 million to turn a profit..... Well MS is the only one that really know the magic number. As for pricing, I don't believe they would ever bump it up $30-40 a month. That's not how those models work. But of course time will tell.

[ILostMyMind]

I still don't understand why they compare the Switch sales, the only handheld on the market, with those of the PS4 and XBO. It doesn't make sense to me.

[NLink0714]

Makes sense. Xbox one really had a rough start and was a console that didn't catch people. The PS4 was and remains wayyy more attractive. I was a huge 360 fan and had no interest in the Bone when they presented it. It only became more appealing after the One X and even still, I was too deep in the PS4 ecosystem to care (the gap between the pro and the one x is hardly alone to force people to change where they invest their monies for gaming).

I'm excited for the series X but recently found a niche in PC gaming. I can just get Game Pass for PC and play all of Microsoft FP games potentially at,

1. Higher resolution
2. Better frame rates
3. WITHOUT A FEE FOR XBOX LIVE. This is really bothersome. How can Microsoft give PC gamers the SAME PC game with online but charge Xbox players a fee to play online? It's not like there are dedicated Xbox servers. When I play COD I play with PS4 and PC players. Every major game has cheating, and most publishers implement standard anti-cheating measures. Yes GWG is a perk but most of the games on there are trash. Gold needs to come with more than just mediocre GWG games. Look at stadia pro, the service isn't the best BUT those games I get to keep even if i decide to stop paying for Stadia pro later. That's a game changer vs GWG for Bone games (360 games notwithstanding).

[Donnie81]

I wasn’t aware the switch is even a console much less the same generation as the ps4 and the x1. The switch is a complete turd hooked to a tv and you just know when the series x and the ps5 launch everyone will be talking about the massive lead it has already. You can’t forget the wiiu and you cannot have it both ways.i imagine the switch will be forgotten when the pretty new super powerful new systems launch.

[Donnie81]

This generation is the start of Xbox dominance of not just consoles but gaming period. In ten years when you think of gaming people will think of Xbox. Xcloud will bring console quality gaming to your phone anywhere on the planet. You will have the most powerful system in the series x then the best value in consoles with the capable yet affordable Lockhart. Mix in the ever growing gamepass and you have the formula for annihilating the competition. Keep bragging about making 10$ for selling each system Xbox is playing to win. Oh I forgot to mention the largest 1st party in gaming history that continues to grow. Xbox really doesn’t have any competition because Sony or Nintendo can’t afford to play the game they are playing

[Knushwood Butt]

In the meantime I'll be playing major new first party releases on my console of choice.

[Donnie81]

Cool man I’m not a hater

[Knushwood Butt]

Fair enough.

Stay safe.

[jimbost79]

Satire?

[Jonaspolos]

Nintendo never wore on a racing for console power. Instead, they’re focus was always to develop games that truly entertains the players and fulfil the hype we raised every time before we press start button. Wii U was a failure in terms of sales but with great games. PlayStation 4 does not have 1st party games better than Nintendo and will never have, it is not about graphics it is about nostalgia. Nintendo switch will outsell Sony console in 2 years.

[stonecold3]

No it won’t ps4 will be selling and continue once ps5 comes to the market but the switch will be getting a new console soon as well and it won’t be supported. Either U probably lucky to have switch to last to 2022 while ps4 be selling still and the switch won’t catch up

[Jonaspolos]

Nintendo Switch is the fastest-selling console of all time.
So it is not about power is about joy in playing console games that Nintendo is far better.

[Silly gameAr]

Does that somehow cancel out that the PS4 has sold over 100 million consoles? No? Ok then. Man, people complain about Playstation fans, but nintendo fans are on a whole different level of wtf.

[Tross]

Not badly enough for MS to have a Wii U or Vita situation, but badly enough that they sure got their butt handed to them.

[TheHateTheyGive]

This is not fair, switch is handheld taking advantage of 2 markets, why is everyone forgetting about nintendos final home console wii u? I said it before, mario, zelda couldn't save wii u so nintendo had kill off 3ds and used that market to inflate switch sales.

[seanpitt23]

I think it will be closer next gen in terms of sales. I think Microsoft has up there game.

[Cmoney007]

Sony: We still have a lot of quality games.

Nintendo: We have quality games to play also!

MS: We have some quality games, but it would be a good idea to wait till E3 for more info!

[Thundercat77]

Wow it has been such a terrible generation for Xbox one and they currently have the most powerful console in the galaxy. That's why I laugh every time a see someone believing Xbox series x is going to do any different.

The only time Xbox got closer to Playstation was by 1. Releasing a year before. 2. Reoccurring sales due to RRoD. And 3. By Sony doing and horrible job at the start of the PS3 generation.

And even with that, they failed!!! Keep praying for those 12 Teraflops.

[windblowsagain]

Those 12tflops are going to bring the sales. Or will people realize it's just MS again shouting numbers again.

Games Matter, first party matters. That's why PS4 sold and that's why Nintendo sells.

[JeffGUNZ]

I am a PC gamer, but I do own an Xbox and PS4 (rarely use them anymore, unless naughty dog releases something haha) but to be fair, MS acquired an impressive amount of first-party studios a couple of years back. It takes time for them to make quality AAA games, no? I mean, look how long we have been waiting for the Last of Us Part II? I feel like people complain MS lacks exclusives, then they got out and acquire more first party studios, and people still complain about a lack of exclusives. It should be reasonable that it will take several years to get AAA games from them. If they don't release their new Xbox with a couple, or even within the first six months, it will be a weird move.

[derek]

I actually think Microsoft is in a worse position going into next gen than this gen.

[RamRod88]

What a baseless claim. Everything Xbox is doing now has put them in a better position than previous gen.

[PyroMessiah86]

Drivel.

[JeffGUNZ]

What world are you living in? As a PC gamer, I LOVE what MS is doing. The things that they have implemented this gen have been great. Play anywhere on any device has been great, Game Pass Ultimate is brilliant for PC gamers who enjoy MS games, they finally acquired numerous first-party studios, and they have built an impressive console for next-gen. As long as those studios have some solid exclusives coming for launch, they have literally done everything and more of what people asked for. PS is always going to be the top dog in sales and popularity, the PS1 and PS2 were just absolute gems and built such a following. MS doesn't need to "beat" Sony, MS just needs to keep beating their bottom line. It's websites like N4G that make people think if you are not number 1, you are dead. It's like saying BMW, Lexus, or Audi are crap because Mercedes outsold them.

[amazinglover]

Articles like this are truly pointless and only serve to flame the fanboy wars.

All three boasted of record profits in their video game divisions. So who cares who sold more when they all where success.

[DEEHULK88]

Xbox one is probably going to outsell SNES which is not that bad considering that the SNES is a classic system.

[DEEHULK88]

I understand that Playstation is a worldwide brand, but why did it the PS3 just beat 360 by just 3 million? I don't understand that and that tells me that if MS does things right, it can go toe to toe with Sony. I don't think that they can win because of Japan which was pretty much the difference in the 360 ps3 generation, but I think that they can keep it close.

[JayRyu]

Sony was selling the ps3 for 600 dollars for one. PSN wasn't as stable as Xbox live for another. Sony caught up with selling the ps3 much cheaper but that took years.

[DEEHULK88]

I understand that, but wouldn't those fans just wait to it became cheaper. There is no reason with all the advantages that xbox 360 should've been close.

[Felix313]

Don't forget the 360 had a 1 year headstart in the US and 1.5 years headstart in EU over the PS3 which allowed it to rack up a lot of sales before the PS3 launched.

[04STIBluByU]

Plus RROD kept it close too.

[DEEHULK88]

Don't want to hear thst RROD nonsense because my console got that and Microsoft just fixed it or gave another. Also, why didn't people just get a playstation then? There had to be a reason why they kept buying . 155 million Playstation fans would've just waited because they knew PS3 was coming out, so that definitely couldn't be a reason why.

[Dragonscale]

Seeing as ms stopped giving sales numbers, we'll probably never know.

[AK91]

Very badly

[gold_drake]

everyone keeps talking about the Vita or the WiiU.
Gurl, we are talking about the ps4, xbox1 and the swtich. lets concentrate on those.

Fact is, Xbox1 did poorly compared to PS4 and Switch.

even now i cant think of one or two games i would personally love to play on the xbox, since most of them are on the switch or ps4 aswell. their exclusives just arent as interesting, no matter what " BEAST " the console is going to be.

[DJStotty]

Sony about 2.2 - 1
Nintendo about 1.4 - 1

Not badly by any stretch, still made each company millions of dollars.

It's like saying "how much has iphone outsold samsung galaxy lolz"

What does it matter when both companies make billions of dollars.

[TheHan]

This just recks of click bait.

[ElementX]

A few weeks ago people were lambasting Forbes for their articles, everybody seems to love this one.

[DJStotty]

This just looks like an article to detract from the fact Microsoft will be showing next-gen games later today, with the most fanboy title ever read.

[Silly gameAr]

If that's the most fanboy title you've ever read, then you must be new to the site, which I know you're not.

Why would they need to make an article to detract from anything MS is going to do? MS has been the only company reacting because honestly, they need to get their fans behind them because they have the most to prove.

No one needs to react to MS, because no one is scared of MS. That's why Sony can stay quiet while MS wants the next gen to come as soon as possible hoping for a re-do.

[slavish0]

what about the wii u?

[S2Killinit]

Whats crazy is that last generation when PS3 was 2 million units behind after releasing one whole year later than xbox, we had all these doom and gloom articles and it felt like that was a huge gap. When you look at the numbers now, 2 million units is like chump change.

[Agent75]

Is the Switch a home console or a handheld? In my eyes, it's a handheld that can be connected to a TV, but Sony had this with the PSP back in 2005/06. How can you compare Switch sales to Xbox One and/or PS4 sales when they're different styles of console? Same situation with comparing 3DS sales against Xbox 360 and PS3. The Switch has replaced the 3DS, it hasn't replaced the Wii U, which Nintendo claims. Would you compare motorbike sales against car sales? A pointless exercise, as they're totally different forms of transport.

[Juancho51]

It's a good thing the console wars have been over for quite some time. Anyone arguing the Xbox is better is literally just not looking at facts. PS5 should be just as good.

[mastershredder]

“Badly outsell” ...I remember when Forbes was literate and followed trends. This looks like a research-less opinion piece by a 15 year old