How Microsoft and Epic Are Discouraging Used Game Sales with Gears of War 2

Loot Ninja writes:

"We all know that developers and publishers aren't the biggest fans of used game sales. It cuts into their revenue stream, but makes GameStop and stores like it a ton of cash every year. Many publishers are finding ways to add value to the new game sales to discourage gamers from picking up used copies.

I recently read an article from Stephen Totilo over at MTV's Multiplayer Blog with his proposal on how developers and publishers can stop used game sales by adding Achievements/Trophies for purchasing a new copy of the game. While I like the idea, I realized that Microsoft and Epic had already implemented their own system when I opened my copy of Gears of War 2."

[greyishfox]

Great point. What happens when you get the RRoD? No more map pack for you? That would be very uncool.

[drunkpandas]

It's on your download list on Xbox Live, so you can always re-download it to whatever replacement console you get.

[Bnet343]

Like drunk pandas said, you can always re-download anything you ever downloaded. As for this, I applaud Epic for fighting used game sales. GameStop really sucks. I used to buy used games, but I don't anymore unless it's a very hard game to find or if it's from GameFly because their used games come in brand new cases and are way cheaper then Gamestop.

[joemayo76]

its a great strategy to promote buying new except for a MAJOR flaw, that being households that have more than 1 member that have LIVE. as the incentive to get the new game is nulled as only the individual redeeming the code can use it which is REALLY LAME, i guess the "genius" marketing strategizer found it hard to believe more than one person use the same xbox in a household :\. they should have put a cap like, "can be used on up to 2-3 LIVE accounts." this is one of the pluses of PSN, excellent game overall just wish i had the mappack

As it now isolates the consumer base of those who don't have the mappack, which are stuck now with other who don't have it either. Yes i know u can still play with anyone but if ur in a party that wants to play flashback ur left behind :(.

really annoying

[JasonXE]

its actually a post to promote anti privary since the the people who get them online can't download it. They'll be missing out on the whole game and not be able play with the million gamers online (when it comes to those maps).

[player911]

I'm sure they'll be free eventually. They're probably a timed release... then either charge a small fee or offer them free.

I really liked the extra's. I got the golden gun, 5 maps, and a free theme.

I'd like to see more games come with free themes and a special (colored) weapon. It's better then them offering them as downloads which cost extra money. I'd like to see them come with avatar icons and avatar accessories once NXE comes out.

It does offer extra incentive to go out and buy first day releases and new copies. There is nothing wrong with this at all.

I bet the golden hammerburst code would go for a nice penny on ebay

[majorsuave]

"households that have more than 1 member that have LIVE"
Games bought from Arcade are available to all users on a xbox, don't you think downloaded content would be too?

[joemayo76]

ur absolutely right arcade games do allow this, but i'm not talking about arcade games i'm talking about THIS particular DLC which EPIC stated would only be playable on the account that redeems it.

I understand it's to control people from sharing their code with friends but at the same time it screws over ppl that DO have more than one player per household on a system

[drunkpandas]

I'm all for added benefit for people who buy the games new. Giving away free content is a plus.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

I'm seconding drunk pandas. The reason games cost more is because gamestop as the middle man is eating up all the profits. Do we really need GameStop to fill the retail channel?

Most of the time, I find the games I want on sale and they are almost always cheaper than buying it from GS used! Why give my money to GS, when the developers are the one making the product I want. They are the ones taking the most risks.... Don't give your money to GS for used games, buy it new for a little over 10% more or just buy the game on sale. GS is just a greedy middleman....

[taz8080]

Free content s good, but I think they needed to make the game longer, it si a bit of a shame that you can blow through it in 10 hours or so.

[drunkpandas]

That's very true. Often you can find new games on sale for cheaper than a used copy at GameStop. I'd always rather give the money to the developer than a used game store.

[greyishfox]

it's unpleasant buying a used game with missing manual or a scratched disc. I've had it happen and it wasn't enjoyable. New game purchasers should be awarded.

[ChampIDC]

That's the purpose of the multiplyer. It's hard to make any kind of shooter that doesn't get stale after the 10 hour mark. Multiplayer is the lasting appeal of games like this.

[Megatron08]

And lets not forget that GS sell used games as news one anyways

[PS360PCROCKS]

Hmm I must suck, I am at about 14 hours and I am pretty sure I have a while to go.

[Halochampian]

You don't suck. It took me 15 hours to beat it on Hardcore.

People who claim to beat it in 10 hours or less are just playing on Casual and trying to run through it quickly, which is dumb.

[drunkpandas]

I hope more developers/publishers start doing things like this. I'm not a fan of GameStop anway

[Capt CHAOS]

Means I can pick up a second-hand copy for much cheaper!

CooL!

[taz8080]

No one likes Gamestop, not even their own employees.

[drunkpandas]

Yeah I know a whole lot of current and former GameStop employees that have nothing good to say about that place.

[NaiNaiNai]

rock band 2 did something like this with the codes to get the 20 songs. *which really aren't that bad for some unknown artists*

i worked for gamestop for about a year.
1. pay sucked
2. hours sucked *you had to have alot of pre-orders to get hours*

the only thing i like was the fact i could get any game i wanted and borrow it new/used from the store. i got to try steel batalion out like that. MY GOD that game was awesome. thats also how i beat most of my ps2 games. XD
-nai-

[BRACHATTACK]

Stupid.

I rely on trading in games to fund part of my next purchase.

[ChampIDC]

That's fine for you, but the developers need to make a profit off of their games. Nobody says you have to buy it new. This is just incentive to do so, and the people that support the developer by buying new deserve something for it.

[Proxy]

What developers need is to make games capable of producing a profit on it's own. As in, make a game that people want to keep and not trade off to a friend (or GameStop) in 2 weeks.

How sad is this, "Yeah, I bought Gears 2 for 60$, and then sold it 2 weeks later for 20$." Shows how much he enjoyed the game.

[cjflora]

The developers are far from not getting paid because of used game sells. This is retarded, and just shows Microsoft's greed. The used game industry is not illegal and should not be something Microsoft needs to discourage. Piracy is illegal and their attempts to stop piracy would be warranted. The sale and purchase of used games is good for the economy and allows for businesses to provide extra value to a game. A gamer might sell a game to help fund his next new game, and the person who buys that used game is buying it because he can't afford the $60 price tag, or he's trying a game he was unsure he would like, and can justify getting it since it is cheaper.

We all know these games make the majority of their money during the initial release of the game. Gears has already sold more than 2 million copies. Many of the people who will be buying the game used will be buying it long after Microsoft or the developer have raked in what they expected out of the game.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

Buying used games aren't good for the economy other than fattening the pockets of GameStop. GameStop has huge profit margin on used games and pay their employees low wages.

If you buy a game in-store you are making a contribution to the developer that put their heart and soul into creating a creative and entertaining experience for you. In my opinion buying a used game is akin to say, thank you for the experience and I will reward the people that didn't make the game i.e. a slap in the face. As mentioned before, I frequently find my games cheaper brand new than used from GS.

An example is my friend whom bought a Wii from GS, then bought a crap load of accessories and a 2 games. He spent like $400+ and bought No More Heroes (within the last month) for at least $40 used. I bought that game months ago at $20 new! Most of the time people think they are saving money by trading in games at GS, but when you get a fraction of what you pay for the game new or used and then you pay a hefty premiun on a game, your net is at best zero if not a loss. Being a savvy consumer pays off! I only buy my games new.... Do whatever you want with your money, but I'm voting new with mine.

[DirtyLary]

The ability to sell games totally cripples the longevity of games on the XBOX. With the addition of gamer scores and achievements, this new generation of gamers are obsessed with a silly number next to their name rather than playing games for the love of the game. They race to get their achievements then sell the game as fast as they got it repeating the process with their next game.

It's sad how only a few games have a decent player base left.So many titles are the victim of this obsession.

God how I would love to see MS wipe gamer scores. But the screaming and crying might be overwhelming.

[drunkpandas]

There is absolutely no way Microsoft would consider wiping gamerscores. The Achievement system has been so widely accepted and successful that it would be an insanely bad business move on their part to reset everyone's scores

[ChampIDC]

Yeah, they'd never wipe the scores, but it would be amusing to watch all the achievement whores cry if they lost their score.

[Simon_Brezhnev]

used games not killing the xbox its all you xbox people who pirate all the games why do you think EA and other publishers make more software sales on the PS3 and not xbox

[Close_Second]

...that Digital Distribution will reign supreme in the future. If managed correctly then it alone will kill second hand game sales. It will also mean the end of many gaming stores and sections just like DD for music has seen the demise of many music stores around the world.

Obviously the technology and cost for DD of such large files (e.g. MGS4) is not quite there but give it 10 years. No doubt that the next Xbox will be more DD ready as they seem to be paving the way for games running off HDD with NXE.

[Deadman64]

Exactly. This also solves the issue of disc space, which is great too. Plus no more having to get in your car drive to a local store, buy the game, drive back and play. Just at midnight when the game comes out, press buy and download! We will just now a few TB's of HDD space though...

[Proxy]

With DD you'll have only one source for the game, no retail competition.

Currently, you could sell a game for 1$ and get many sales, but no profit. Or you could sell it for 1,000$ and sale almost none, but you still make good money on those copies you do sale. The question is the magic price that maximizes profit.

Because of retail competition, the lower price points are generally better. Remember, retailers compete, and this results in lower prices (and yes, this does happen with video games).

With DD, there is no retail competition, the equation changes, and now selling games for 100$ might be the best for maximum profits. Sure, fewer people will will buy the game, but those who do buy it will be paying more money, so it all works out.

This may not happen, but DD does open up the possibility for it to happen.

Can't turn to piracy out of spite either, because DD will surely bring with it online DRM schemes which are nearly impossible to break. "You were able to go online to buy the game, so it's reasonable that you have to be connected every time you play the game, even the SP."

[cjflora]

One thing that terrified me about the PS3 rumors while it was being developed was that Sony was going to try and make it that once a game was inserted into 1 PS3, it would be registered to that PS3 and only be playable on that PS3. Fortunately they didn't implement this option, but I was worried. This would destroy used game sales, and the ability to rent games from game rental businesses. Of course, Sony has also made suggestions that the next generation of Playstation may not have a disc drive. This would mean games would only be downloadable, thus the ability to rent or sell the game would not be possible. I suppose rentals may be possible this way, since the PSN does offer downloadable movie rentals. If this turned out to be the case, I would hope the price of games would come down at least a bit since the cost of producing discs, box art, and cases would be non existent, and the cost of making the game would be lower.

[Proxy]

No way prices would come down, and this is why I will oppose mandated digital distribution.

My bet is prices would stay the same, 60$. However, it will take a very long time for games to drop in price. Games that have been out for 18 months or so will be 50$.

[Arsenal4Ever]

i wish i could trade in games online.

[Close_Second]

If you buy a game on-line then MS and Sony should provide credits you can use for other on-line purchases. Depending on how old the game is you might get more points for the trade. Once you have traded you can no longer run the game for your console until, if you desire, you pay to unlock it again.

[thehitman]

IDK one publisher scared that there games are going to be traded ESPECIALLY AAA title games. Sounds like a bunch of crap to me.

[SketchCA]

Makes you wonder why Epic is so concerned about secondary market sales. Also, this emerging trend of leaving stuff out and putting it in through codes and stuff is really getting old. I don't like how the gaming market is fracturing into people that have certain things like game content and peripherals and some don't. Its like the whole XBOX Arcade and whatnot. I don't think that its really good for gaming. Every XBOX should be the same or at least capable of everything. Every game system before was like this and I think it worked to the advantage of the consumer. Just my opinion. Now get off my d@mn lawn you d@mn young kids!!

[360fanboysaregay]

smart move by MS and epic... good way too fight Gamestop from runing the world

[Proxy]

And so are used car salesmen.

Seriously people, don't be cheap, and don't buy used cars.

[GarandShooter]

I prefer to purchase new and support the developers. In fact, I pre-order all must have games for day one purchase (midnight launch for Gears 2), and read several reviews for 'maybe' titles. The only used games I purchase are out of print. I can't see any reason to pay $55.00 for a used copy of a $60.00 game.

I was speaking to a GameStop manager one day, who is a very nice, informed gamer, and whose store is free of fanboy employees. He told me that the repeated trade of a single copy of a game may net the store as much as $500.00 profit. Incredible.

[caladbolg777]

This is very bittersweet for me. On one hand, I applaud MS and Epic for offering perks to gamers who purchase new products. On the other, should this become a market trend, the discouragement of a secondary market, like sales/trades from person to person, is a bit scary.

How far will it go?

[kingme71]

I think rentals is a far bigger issue then used games. One rental disc has the potential to visit 20-30 homes in its lifetime. A used game probably will have 2 or 3 owners tops on average.

If it weren't for rentals there are tons of games I would never have played. Knowing if it's a stinker I can drop it back in the mail the next day gives me the chance to play alot of games I would never buy.

I'm very much not looking forward to digital distribution. All the cards are now in the publishers hands. Rentals and used games would shrivel up which I depend on to play games I wouldn't normally buy. I support the industry in buying new for games I want, but there are alot of games I have no intention of buying for $60.00 but are appealing at a lower price or as a rental.

With digital distribution, how are you going to get a manual? I don't want to look at an electric version of it and there are some games that a manual has value. How do you tell your family members to get you a certain game? If I told my mother to get me a digital copy of game X she would look at me like I was from another planet.

I like digital distribution for the arcade and cheaper style games that go for about $15.00 - $20.00. That works well as the price is low enough to experiment with and they would never sell in retail, but top tier games are a whole other story.

[Tony P]

I was just typing up this exact post more or less.

I'm not a fan of either side, but I do know that I don't want publishers in place to hold a monopoly over how we buy our games.

How far can it go? Will the next step be software keys and online registration ala MMOs so used copies can't be played at all? Mind you, I'm not levelling this at Epic whose decisions I can appreciate on a business level, but it also gives me a very real scare as to where we could be heading as a consumer.

[kingme71]

Yup, exactly. I think you put it more succinctely then I did... Cheers.

[MastaBlasta222]

First of all, there is nothing wrong with buying/selling used games. It's your property to sell if you want to. This is kind of same as DLC... as long as they are adding new stuff and not taking out stuff that would have been there to begin with(I doubt it).

[No Way]

This could also be used as a Greed factor, too, though. =/

This gives an extra reason for them to not lower the price on Gears2. Price is the biggest factor as to why people buy used games. So, if in order to get the extra maps, you'd have to buy new, so why would Epic lower Gears2 price?

And, also, goin back to what joemayo76 said. It's bad for households that have more than one xBox360..

But, nonetheless, it's a good idea. I think it just needs to be tweaked a bit..

[Enate]

Just because I don't like gamestop most of the time doesn't mean sometimes the price ain't right. There are games that come out an are not as great as you thought but you still might want to buy it though the price may take forever to drop. So sometimes it helps but most of the time I get new games anyway because if they arn't worth buying its either a rent or not being played at all. Though I would like to stress them trying to shut down the renting industry would be a mistake because that has gotten them tons of biz because me an all of my friends have on many occassions been undecided about a game an even after the demo weren't sure. Though after a rent it was a sure thing demos an rents are still very important to people who don't buy there games blindly on hype or what reviews it gets.

[Ps3Fanboy777]

Games are too expensive as is. 59.99 is just not worth it after years of buying games. I pick and choose games wisely or wait to they hit the bargain bin.

Launch day is usually filled with slow servers and tons of bugs anyhow so why bother.

[The Dude]

They are discouraging piracy thats what the download content is all about.

[Hypnotic]

I think it's a good idea. Kudos to Epic.

[truehunter]

I buy used games for the years i miss. Some game isnt worth my 60 dollar so i like to wait for drop price. If they do less Prints mainly like NISA, Atlus an low buget company they tend to become hard.
Used games are reliable for starting collection. I didnt start collecting till Fall of 2007.
At Fall of 2007 i only had 22 PS2 games.
Now today i have 89 games for PS2 and 30% of them was rare an hard to find.
I dont use online to buy sence i dont use CC.

To not having the games to become used, Developer need to make a game worth keeping. But not everyone is rich an there are ppl who has enought money to play it then trade it.

[djroberts]

Oh the irony... The company that is the most strict about copyright (MS) is the same company that screws you over when your XBox eventually bricks. They'll figure out to keep you from buying used games but not how to recover your "new" games...

[No Way]

What You Talking About..?

[funkysolo]

when I got my copy, I was thinking the same thing. I was like how come they just dont put it on the marketplace. The original maps look better anyway. I find that disturbing since we only have one 360 and my kids have their own account..Gears2 is a great game and after i'm done with it, I'm selling my new 360 holiday bundle. MS is not going to understand these tactics until we voice our opinion with our wallets

[JDW]

Used cars and old houses are big business too......so what, does everyone think that we should prohibit the sale of second hand cars and houses, just because car manufacturers and house builders can make more money.

If the first hand price was more realistic and reasonable, then people would not feel so inclined to purchase a second hand game, and therefore gamestop would not be able to sell so many used copies.

[rob6021]

It seems to me like they're trying to get more 'arcade' buyers to buy hard drives and xbox live rather than discourage used sales. Both of Which Microsoft actually makes a killing off of.

[zag]

While ok,

I couldn't see it stopping much after all the only people who'll be fussed are the ones who care about Achievements/Trophies.

[smokeymicpot]

Who would trade in Gears 2 already and if they don't want people to buy the game used they should at least let you buy the maps.

[snoopgg]

$10 giftcards with most new releases these days. I would rather buy it new at Circuitcity unwrapped for the same price as used at Gamestop. I am talking about new releases. Go buy from CircuitCity, they need are help right now.

[mariusmal]

i didnt get any code for downloading maps. some buyers in some forums are reporting this same problem. i already sent an email to play.com bah

[prof16440]

microsoft and their gimmicks though smart are oppressive not everyone has enough money to buy games on their release dates

[Skynetone]

but i do like to pick up a bargain, and knowing its only half a game means no more bargains to be had, which sucks

the only games i pay full price for are 10/10 games, picking up LBP during the week and will gladly pay full price for it, because it offers so much

id never pay full price for a medium game, and allways wait for it to hit the bargain bin,

[Rageanitus]

I prefer buying new games...... but I dont mind gamespot/egames selling used game.... There is obviously demand for used games so why not its a big business in the end. Its not like every game is worth its full price based on opinion.

Problem with most developers is they dont understand is if you truly want someone to buy a new product please make an exceptional game..... money is money is there is opportunity cost involved.