Why the ex-Rare devs behind Yooka-Laylee didn't roll their own engine

You would think that with loads of Kickstarter cash, the minds behind Yooka-Laylee might have decided to roll their own game engine. Here's why they didn't.

[RonsonPL]

Well, it was clearly a bad choice anyway.
- game runs at 30fps on most popular platforms (consoles)
- game got awful reception, in large part, because of 30fps.

Platform games, with many things to collect, must offer an interesting world, which is fun to explore. Exploring at 30fps, or even at 60 when using a display which blurs image in motion, is NOT FUN. Simple as that.
30fps killed that game in terms of reception and financial success.

Meanwhile it runs at stable 120fps on 2011 CPU + 2013 GPU, at high settings, and even stable 2x 60fps in stereoscopic 3D, in which this game looks really, really good.

It's a good game. Not very. It's too infantile, some things are done badly, there are many simple and easy to fix things that could've been improved, but it doesn't deserve the bad reception it gets, but the console port is a mirror reflection of PC ports that were ruined, like Batman or AC:U. When you outsource the port to some unskilled team, it always ends like that. The game was designed with Wii:U capabilities in mind. How the f.. could it end up at 30fps on Xone/PS4 is beyond me. Someone f..d up. Big time.

[Sciurus_vulgaris]

Unity Engine is well known to lack efficiency, especially on consoles. The Engine is popular because it is cheap to license for development.

[RonsonPL]

I know. But good team, with veterans, could re-write parts of the code to make it work on consoles. But anyway, they shouldn't use Unity for the consoles OR they should've delay the console version to avoid what actually happened - the flood of reviews got loose, and most based on not only flawed console version, but also a bugged pre-release version. They made a mistake there. Just like Trine 3, the team deserved a financial success, but they f..d something along the way.
I'm equally sad and angry about it. I wish the genre returned to AAA budgets again, abandoned the mandatory platform game? = for kids requirement etc. so we could get another Conker or J&D level games. But this was a PR disaster and probably buried the chances.

[maybelovehate]

Ori was built with Unity and runs at 60fps and looks and plays a million times better.

[JackTheLiz]

lol, 30 fps is NOT the reason why it wasn't that well-received. Get off your PC high horse.

[RonsonPL]

I've got a weak PC. Just 2500K + gtx780 (OC'ed). I play on consoles since 1992. I'm not a fanboy.
But I know what I'm talking about.
Let me tell you a story about what happened when I played first PS3 Ratchet & Clank game, Tools of Destruction.
I had to force myself to finish it. I assumed that I simply got bored with the mechanics after finishing all 3 R&C games on PS2, and maybe it's not as funny for me anymore.
Then it just happened I've acquired a good VGA box for PS2/PS3. I connected the PS3 over VGA cable to my second monitor. It was 24" Sony CRT. Previously, just 2 days ago, I finished the game on 24" LCD (which has 2" bigger screen than 24" CRT).
I was curious how the game looks without motion blur.
Guess what.
The same day I finished the whole game.
Next day I was playing the DLC again.
Suddenly all the joy from playing returned.

Clear motion IS VERY important for games like that. It makes you admire the world, it immerses you into it way more, it makes searching for secrets much more enjoyable. And that's just 60fps blurred vs. 60fps not blurred. With 30fps you also get crappy controls and slow-looking gameplay (I know it's not really slower in terms of true slow motion, but you know what I meant).

The SAME thing happened when I played other games. For example Rayman Legends. With blurred motion this game is just a good game. With low persistence it starts to be awesome.
99% of gamers have crap instead of gaming displays and look around. Suddenly gamers say that most important part of games is.. the story.
Sure, cause if you fu...ck up the joy you can get from actual gameplay, what's left?
And both 30fps and motion blur ruins the fun factor. It's a VERY diffucult thing to understand, and if you even get to test this topic by yourself, by playing on two monitors and switching between them back and forth, you will still forget about it after a few months of playing on blur-infested display. That's really a complicated thing from psychology point of view. Even I fell for it. But the thing is - when you are back to clear motion gaming, it ALWAYS blows your head off. People just quickly forget what they're missing. You don't conciously analyze what parts of the game make it fun for you to play, do you? Exactly. So you just play a game and then say it's not fun.
Take future racers for example.
It's "meh" for me at 30fps.
It's "awesome" for me at 60fps without motion blur.
But it's still WAY more fun at 120fps without motion blur.
How many gamers will realize that while playing?
up to 100km/h 30fps is OK.
up to 200-300km/h 60fps is OK.
Only at 600km/h you really need more than 60fps.

Motion clarity and framerate are surprisingly complicated things. I got fascinated by this like 10-15 years ago.Now I can say I know this stuff. And when I, a platform game genre veteran, tell you that 30fps ruins huge part of the fun factor of platform games, you can either agree or disagree and do your own research (and then agree anyway ;) ).
That's why 1080p with low persistence (called also backlight strobe/scan) is far better choice for gaming than 4K TV without it. Unless you only play 30fps games on consoles, then it doesn't matter cause you won't see details in motion anyway.

Don't know what's low persistence? Go and read articles and examples here:
http://www.blurbusters.com/

[spinnyjoy]

"Suddenly gamers say that most important part of games is.. the story." Oh the fucking irony you graphics whore. Go on, type up another big wall of nothing that's supposed to lecture me on why I'm "wrong" LOL

[JackTheLiz]

lol, the ridiculously long post down below. What does all of this have to do with Yooka-Laylee? You want to flaunt how your monitor is superior to 'casual' monitors, be my guest and do that on another thread. The end thing is still that Yooka-Laylee being 30 FPS on consoles is NOT the reason why it was mixed, I know cause I have had personal experience with a glitch that prevents me from hitting 100% completion and surprise, alot of PC users complained of the same issue too. 120 FPS isn't gonna fix that son.

[RonsonPL]

First. You perceive what I wrote however you want to. Based on previous experiences. And are dead wrong while doing so. I wasn't flaunting about my monitor, lol. What it has to do with Y-L? I already explained that enough I think.

How can you judge if what I talk about is important, if you cannot SEE what difference does it make?
I wrote above - noone has to agree with me. Even better if somone doesn't. Just check for yourself. Do the test/experiment. Play on blur-free display with everything required for crystal-clear image in motion provided. Play a few hours. Switch back. Play for few hours. Switch again and then, and only then, have your opinion.
And I wrote about 120fps just as a "shocker" to underline how huge gap is between what's popular opinion versus surprising facts. I didn't see 600km/h vehicle in Yooka-Laylee yet, if you thought it was related ;)

@spinnyjoy
You just prooved my point. You are probably young and stupid with no gaming experience, judging by two facts: a) you understood nothing from what I wrote and b) you proceeded to personal attacks using the lowest level of street language. And you prooved that new generation completely doesn't understand gaming, dividing gamers into noobs who have opinion in even 1° other than "graphics don't matter, if you even mention it, you are an idiot" and the noble wise people who know that story is most important. It's not, unless it's a typical story game, which, newsflash, is one of many game genres, and doesn't even represent 10% of whole gaming, despite what current trends appear to suggest. Books. Movies. Theatres. Audiobooks. Those are mediums where story is the most important thing. But not games. Games are meant to be played. And some games are 100% based on story-unrelated stuff. Like this game, Yooka-Laylee. And it's here where things like framerate matters.

[JackTheLiz]

Responses like that is aren't going to win you any friends. Not going to comment anymore as you frankly don't deserve it.

[XiNatsuDragnel]

Interesting

[RonsonPL]

Kickstarter backer's update just arrived:
"the dev team has been frogmarched back down into the development mines to uncover our next big game update, which will add significant improvements and introduce some of the most requested features.
That means stuff like the optional ability to skip dialogue faster, bypass cutscenes or reduce those pesky gibberish voices, which should please the speedrunners among us. We’ll also be adding a sprinkling of design polish throughout the adventure and by popular request, changes to how the camera operates (gif the image on this page a look).
You can expect a more detailed breakdown of the game update in the coming weeks, as we continue to tinker around with the coding furnace.""

:)

@JackTheLiz If my goal was to get new friends here, I would do something else than voicing a very unpopular opinion, don't you think? ;)
I don't care what people think about me. I care about games. About the industry and about helping others improve the way they play. Some might think about what I wrote and decide to buy a proper gaming display or uncover the treasure of motion blur-free gaming at 60fps (or more). Some might choose to get offended. And if that happened, I couldn't care less, really.