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270°

Phil Spencer would like to see Third-Parties pick up cloud computing for games

Phil Spencer like to see 3rd parties pick up the tech as well. Innovation moves more quickly as more games push what's possible.

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Sonyslave33172d ago

I hope 3rd party don't hold the xbox one back

TheGreatGamer3172d ago

Remember that 'no parity' hashtag that was going around earlier on this gen? I want that back because I don't want Xbox One versions held back if they could be made better in the cloud

bleedsoe9mm3172d ago

once people play a game where the city is completely destructible there will be no going back , if your game doesn't have it it will feel last gen and very old .

MasterCornholio3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Sounds like games would have to be exclusive to Xbox One in order for that to happen.

I can't imagine 3rd party's making two versions of game. One using the cloud and one without it. You can't just have one version with a fully destructable city while the others don't.

Anyways we have to wait and see what 3rd party's do with this.

joeorc3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Who's stopping them?
Does Microsoft has its own 1st party?
Does Microsoft have its largest server park in existence?
Is the Xbox one selling faster than the xbox360 was?

Again what's holding 3rd parties from Adopting Microsoft's fantastic cloud compute..

Just like last generation also, Sony was holding Microsoft's console back because it was poorly designed for "gaming"
Right?

Godmars2903172d ago

@joeorc:
What's stopping 3rd parties from using the cloud?

- The Ps4 is selling better.
- For all the benefits cloud distribution represents, it still adds a layer to the development process.
- What does it really add but improved particle effects? Frees up assets for other things like graphics, but does not improve graphics overall.
- Anything that uses it will have to be online only.

triple_c3172d ago

If the Xbox One is really capable of this then 3rd parties should take advantage of this. I would hate for the Xbox One to hold back the PS4 so the same rule should apply in vice versa. It's only fair.

kneon3172d ago

@bleedsoe9mm

I'm all for realistic destruction, but what we usually get in games is just moronic. Small arms fire won't take down a building and you can't hack through a door/fence/wall with a couple of whacks of a knife.

curtis923172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Believe it or not.. but I don't need a whole city to be destructible. destruction and physics can be awesome! But in no way do they directly correlate with how good a game is or isn't. Besides, a few hours of blowing up buildings and you'll be done with it. but will you have a good game left to enjoy after the destruction?

The cloud is impressive and the tech works... that doesn't automatically equal a good game. So far crackdown 3 is nothing more than a tech demo at best. But then again the first one was just a trojan horse for halo 3 beta and the 2nd one did poorly in sales as far as 1st party exclusives go.

Lamboomington3172d ago

@Godmars290
"What does it really add but improved particle effects? Frees up assets for other things like graphics, but does not improve graphics overall."

Whaaa ?
100% destruction of incredibly complex structures with amazing detail and persistence. That is not just 'particle effects'. Every one of those pieces is physical and real within the game world.

Agree with the rest of your points though.

Ezz20133172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@TheGreatGamer

I'm with you
"No Parity" should be in full effect
developers use ps4 for it full power and don't hold Ps4 back in graphics or effects to make both consoles look equal when they are clearly not.

and you can have the Cloud in Online only.

See...everyone wins :)

Edit: @gangsta_red

But it's not just "Slight" edge in Res
I don't get how 1080p vs 900p or 720p is just "Slight" edge lol

Also it's not just Res
I mean in overrall graphics and effects...graphics is not just Res.

The tech they showed for the cloud didn't show any other featuers or better AI ...just destruction...so i don't know what you are talking about

Also, even if they bring Cloud to Ps4..i still would not care for it since i only play single player and never play online on consoles.

gangsta_red3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@Ezz

"developers use ps4 for it full power and don't hold Ps4 back in graphics or effects"

Hasn't that already been happening? And even then the comparisons in games are minimal.

If you want the "no parity" for your PS4 just to have a slight edge in resolution then I guess that's your business. But to have more features, better AI and anything else that could effect actual gameplay for the better sounds a whole lot more appealing to me as a gamer.

donthate3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Truth of the matter is in a twist of irony, the PS4 will hold back the Xbox One.

First party (extending to second party) will take advantage of this. Third party will only implement this if it can be licensed from someone else. That is at least a 3-4 years from now and we already in a new console cycle by then.

This is likely to be Xbox One and Windows 10 exclusive this generation.

@Ezz2013:

It is s a slight resolution advantage that is barely beneficial. In fact, even PC gamers only roughly 30% of them use 1080p. Put the games side by side and people can barely tell. The only reason they care is because it is a number they can latch onto. Heck, in some instances the frame rate is more stable on the lower resolution which has a bigger payoff. The resolution debate has actually hurt the PS4 gaming experience, because 1080p is a selling point with minimal advantages.

But Xbox Live Cloud Compute, anyone can see the major difference it makes. We already saw how rock solid Titanfall's reliance on the cloud made the multiplayer game amazingly fast online. This is the next step, and the step after that is going beyond just physics but aiding in rendering techniques that aren't frame sensitive.

Genuine-User3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

You continuously showcase a complete lack of objectivity.

The hashtag demanded no-parity because there's a significant real world hardware difference.

Cloud compute is irrelevant in this particular matter. We have not seen how it'll perform when 100.000+ gamers hit those servers.

gangsta_red3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@Ezz

"I don't get how 1080p vs 900p or 720p is just "Slight" edge lol"

When you and others are patiently waiting for Digital Foundry to compare (and tell you) each version side by side and all the comments that follow are the clouds seem brighter, the rocks have smoother edges then yes, it's slight a edge.

"I mean in overrall graphics and effects...graphics is not just Res."

And there hasn't been any if at all differences in graphics or effects, so exactly what are you talking about or expecting? There hasn't been any indication that the graphics or effects in any 3rd party game were compromised just because it also appeared on Xbox One.

"The tech they showed for the cloud didn't show any other featuers or better AI ...just destruction...so i don't know what you are talking about"

How about you read other articles regarding this tech and what it could possibly do then maybe you'll have a better understanding of what it can do. This way maybe you would like to see this in more games instead of trying to get my PSN gamertag.

"i still would not care for it since i only play single player and never play online on consoles."

Somehow I doubt that but what if they could bring better physics, better AI or anything else to a SP game that would require you being online. Or do you also shut off your ethernet cable when playing your SP games on your PS4?

Ezz20133172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@gangsta_red

Lol, i don't need DF to tell me what i can see with my own eyes...they just confirm what i see as well
and of course you think the edge is "slight"...i'm not really shocked that you of all people say say that.

And i read the articles..but i have yet to see any thing in action
no any better AI or better features other than destruction in Crackdown 3....so unless you have something to prove that the cloud indeed offer better AI or the other features you are talking about ...then you have nothing to talk about.
and yes, i shut off me ethernet cable from my consoles
I never use it unless i want to get new updates for games or downloaing games.

and i will always call you out on your Ps4 "PSN".
I could go online right now for you on ps4...Let's go ;)

gangsta_red3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@Ezz
"Lol, i don't need DF to tell me what i can see with my own eyes...they just confirm what i see as well"

Lmao, that's what they all say right? You rely on DF because you can't see or tell for yourself. You wait for the article to come out and then post what you saw in that article. And even the differences you might point out are very minimal.

Please skip over my other points about res and graphics, because so far you haven't proven anything (no examples, no links, nothing) that would merit a reason why a "no parity" from developers should be enforced.

I'm curious exactly what you and others want devs to add to the PS4 that couldn't be accomplished on the Xbox One besides resolution? What type of added content, gameplay or design can only the power of the PS4 accomplish through no parity that has been left out due to the game also appearing on Xbox One? Please explain that.

And you can stop trying to get my PSN gamertag, no way would I give that out to some random angry person on the internet just to prove to him I have a PS4. It's not that serious, but I'm flattered you want it so bad. ;)

Ezz20133172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@gangsta_red

Lol, i could give you repay with the links you want
But since you chocked out the moment i asked you about you so called "ps4 psn"
i will hold my reply till you post it

i will post my Psn now for ps4
have nothing to hide
don't need to pretened to own something i don't have ...unlike you.

Deal ?!

PhucSeeker3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@Godmars290:
"What does it really add but improved particle effects? Frees up assets for other things like graphics, but does not improve graphics overall."

So what ? The destructible environment is not just eye-candy, it also adds new layers to the gameplay, Like Battlefield Bad Companny 2 or Red Faction Guerrilla.

@kneon:
In the demo, they pumped up the gun fire power to easily destroy building.

Also i think 3rd-party wont' be jumping on this. At least until they can see what M$'s servers have to offer.

maniacmayhem3172d ago

@Ezz

What a cop out.

He specifically asked what more could the PS4 due for games if they weren't held back from this "parity" that everyone keeps yelling.

I would love to hear some examples of games that would have been better and by better what more could have been added if the developers used the full power of the PS4.

Something tells me that even you don't know the answer to this and I bet you'll ask for my psn gamertag too instead of answering the question.

gangsta_red3171d ago (Edited 3171d ago )

@maniac

Exactly, you nailed it 100%. A lot of people love to think that one system is holding another back but when asked what it's specifically holding back, people always go quiet.

The only differences so far in these multiplat games has been resolution. There has been nothing changed about gameplay, design or anything else. Where some of these posters think what extra power the PS4 has will do for these games really has me curious.

Ezz20133171d ago (Edited 3171d ago )

@gangsta_red

Soo...just like i thought
you are a lier and don't own Ps4
i will make sure everyone know this the moment i see you in Ps4 article.

add to that please skip over me asking you to prove that the cloud offer better AI and other features (WTF are those?!)
Because you have no prove to back you up
just a punch of PR.

@maniacmayhem

The 2nd thing i notice after gameplay in 3rd party games
is how the graphics are lacking compared to Sony's ps4 exclusives like The Order 1886,Driveclub,Uncharted4,Hori zon,Killzone SF etc
I compare the graphics and see how much better they look and that makes me a little mad that 3rd party developers don't try and push ps4 like them

Ps4 can do much better textuers,light effects,details etc than it rival system thanks to the much more powerful GPU and Ram.

and that's thanks to developers who admit that they are going for parity.
Like Ubisoft for example with Unity.
http://www.videogamer.com/p...
and on top of that both Ps4 and pc owners had to suffer thanks to this.

as you want no parity for your cloud
then it's my right to ask the same and not just for Res or Fps
I want graphics that look at least close to Ps4 exclusives.

and i never said any thing about gameplay.

gangsta_red3171d ago

@Ezz

So basically the only thing that the PS4 can do better is resolution. Which I pretty much already said and told you it could.

I asked what can the PS4 do better in regards to gameplay, design and features. What could the PS4 with all of it's power do differently than the Xbox One that would warrant the "no parity" moniker you and others keep shouting.

You only proved that it can't do anything with it's extra power. Which I pretty much knew all along.

Resolution doesn't really mean much when games like The Order, Killzone and others like it get mediocre or below review scores right?

Oh and by the way AC:Unity suffered because of the weak CPU found in both systems.

http://www.extremetech.com/...

Sorry to burst your PS4 superior tech dream but looks like PC players suffered from both the PS4 and the Xbox One weak CPU.

Keep calling me out and ignoring the questions, every time you change the subject or spin it, it just proves how right I am.

Ezz20133171d ago (Edited 3171d ago )

@gangsta_red

*Facepalm*
So i just said the reasons why i want better graphics (not just better Res)
because Ps4 exclusives show what Ps4 can do in graphics in term of textuers,details,characters models,effects etc
while 3rd party developers are not even close to push Ps4 like Sony develops
and all you got from that ...is that i'm only talking about Res ?!
Dear god, you need help

Also, i didn't ask for your opinion about those games being good or not...

I said those games are pushing Ps4 and showing it true power in graphics...and you just run to "Oh but those are not good games"
keep going with your spin
I'm loving this

and again i didn't say anything about Gameplay in any of my comments
I only talked about graphics
try reading next time

As for ACU
That was AFTER the game come out and people have seen how bad it was on Pc and Ps4
Ubisoft tried to blame it on consoles
to save it face...but no one belived them.

Ps4 and PC owners suffered
Xbox version not so much
It's clear Ubisoft didn't optmize the game for Ps4 or Pc in first place

Ubisoft aimed for Parity but F***** Ps4/Pc owners.

also, keep ignore that i asked you to prove that the cloud offer better AI and other featuers ...other than punch of PR

I didn't spin a single thing..don't need to
and i will always call you out
you are a lier ...that's all.

gangsta_red3171d ago

@Ezz

See here's the thing, you have no idea the difference between graphics and resolution. You definitely don't understand the term power. Maniac and I asked you a specific question asking what could the power of the PS4 bring in terms of gameplay, design and features that could not be done on Xbox One. And all you did was repeat and repeat about graphics.

You spent more time insulting and trying to get my gamertag than actually reading what Maniac and I was asking.

"and you just run to "Oh but those are not good games""

You don't need to ask me for my opinion. I asked you a question and all I got was, "grafix rox!!". What's the point of graphics if the games are mediocre. No one is spinning anything. Just making an observation based on your repeated answer of graphics, graphics, graphics.

"I only talked about graphics"

And I answered you in my first comment. I had already said that the PS4 had the resolution edge. LMAO! But then I asked what else can "no parity" do? And you came back with nothing.

"That was AFTER the game come out and people have seen how bad it was on Pc and Ps4"

It was the TRUTH, doesn't matter if it was before or after. You purposely linked that article to have people believe it was the Xbox One's fault and this was not the case. Ubisoft not optimizing AC correctly has nothing to do with the Xbox One as you commented before. If you're going to provide a link trying to prove a point how about you provide the latest link that speaks the truth, not a link that supports your bias against MS/Xbox.

The Xbox version of AC:Unity was just as bad and had just as many issues! You seriously think Xbox owners didn't suffer the same glitches, bugs and framerate problems!? Lmao...credibility is now in the low negatives.

"also, keep ignore that i asked you to prove that the cloud offer better AI and other featuers ...other than punch of PR"

Lmao! How can I prove it when you have already come to the conclusion that it will all be PR. Dat logic!

Ezz20133171d ago (Edited 3171d ago )

@gangsta_red

*Epic facepalm*
Res is just a *part* of the graphics setting
I talked about the overrall graphics
which have Res,Fps,Textuers,Detailes,Foli ge,effects etc
and you keep repeat yourself like a broken record that i'm only talking about Res

and you have no clue what Power term means ..if all you think about is Res
I said i want developers to push Ps4 in overrall graphics ""Textuers,Detailes, Folige,effects etc)
not just Res or Fps
If xbox is getting med setting graphics
I want developers to push for High setting graphics on Ps4

and again you spin my comment about graphics into gameplay when
I never said anything about wanting developers to push for better gameplay on Ps4
i didn't even bring up gameplay in any of my comments.
Gameplay should remain the same on all systems..have nothing to do with power gap to me.

Dat spin
My comment about "no Parity" is only about graphics...which have nothing to do with those exclusives games being good or not
The talk here is about graphics ...not gameplay or those games reviews
Like i said keep going with your spin
I'm loving this

""And I answered you in my first comment. I had already said that the PS4 had the resolution edge. LMAO! But then I asked what else can "no parity" do? And you came back with nothing.""

and again i told you
I don't want just better Res...i want them to push ps4 in not just res but overrall graphics
like Sony exclusives

About ACU
You can believe them if you want...that's your problem not mine
and No xbox version didn't suffer like Ps4
Xbox version had better Fps and was more stable Than Ps4.
I don't remember any one complain about Xbox version as much as Pc/Ps4 version
and you don't have credibility to begin with

""Lmao! How can I prove it when you have already come to the conclusion that it will all be PR. Dat logic!""

Damn, you spin soooo much
Yes, you need to prove That cloud offer better AI and your other featuers..Since you are the one who brought that up in first place
if you don't have a prove ..then again you have nothing.
and again you are a lier...just like you lie about your So called "Ps4"

Also,
""Sorry to burst your PS4 superior tech dream""

Lol, did you just said that with a straight face ?!
Do you think that Ps4 don't have superior tech to Xbox one ?!
don't have a much better GPU/RAM ?!

DragonKnight3170d ago

It seems none of you remember what #NoParity was all about. The no parity wasn't about a 3rd party developer being forced to make an inferior game, it was about a 3rd party publisher gimping a game purposely, not because they had to but because they had this nonsense idea that they should.

It was all about Assassin's Creed Unity and how Ubisoft scaled down the PS4 version to match up with the Xbox One version.

And Crackdown 3 is a very unique situation. For one, you're all demanding that that level of Cloud compute be available for all games. Well, what about games that don't have environment destruction at all? What about the fact that this hasn't been tested in the wild and even the Gamescom demo was still in a controlled environment with a perfectly stable internet connection? There's also the fact that no one knows exactly how the multiplayer is going to be so even though we've seen a demonstration of what MS wants to have happen in terms of destruction for Crackdown 3 in multiplayer, the Milo Effect is still in play until the game releases and is thoroughly tested by gamers in real conditions.

You people are getting hyped up way too easily, and usually when that happens a lot of crow is eaten when that reality check slaps you in the face.

And really, you're all just arguing for MS' original vision of always online with the Xbox One, so turn up the hypocrisy for any one of you that complained about the initial launch of the Xbox One and yet now are demanding Cloud compute for every game.

_-EDMIX-_3170d ago

@DragonKnight- Agreed. Mind you, we don't really know how much of that is really "cloud" and could "only" be done with cloud.

That is sorta hard to believe, as Crackdown 3 looks a lot like 2 in HD. As we didn't see this last gen...well we didn't have the hardware last gen.

The real comparison is a game that would do it this gen, its not being done because it can't merely because its just currently not being done yet.

When another game comes out that is all about destruction and its NOT based on cloud, I really worry about how many will feel commenting on how its not feasible without "cloudz". I don't see how a low polycount game can't do this off of next gen hardware solely.

I mean...consider that the game that does this doesn't even need to look anything like Crackdown 3...

I don't see 3rd parties supporting it as many don't even support features like PS4's touch pad or even fully support PS4's hardware in terms of maxing it out.

As....its not as if we have Uncharted 4 and The Order looking games by 3rd parties yet the XONE version looks like a 360 game lol.

I agree with Ezzz on this one.

@G-Red- "The only differences so far in these multiplat games has been resolution"

Yes..that is true...because they are not making exclusives, they are not using 100% of the hardware as they are making multiplatform games. They can't have one version look like The Order then another version that looks like Haze on the PS3, its just no fair lol.

I get why they actually do that as they have no ode to just take longer on one platform then the other graphically making it look really different.

Its why games like Until Dawn, The Order, Uncharted 4 etc all look better then what would be a 3rd party game on PS4, its just due to the focus on the hardware solely.

https://psmedia.playstation...

and

http://www.kalot.com.mx/wp-...

and

http://cdn.bleedingcool.net...

I'm fine not seeing 3rd parties have games like theses as I know its not feasible for them to just make 2 different versions at once. Your not seeing it not because it can't merely because its of no real cost benefit. I think many keep forgetting that their sole purpose is to sell games, not make games maxing out hardware features on both.

We didn't see all use 100% of Move, RSX, Kinect, Cell, sixaixs etc. I'm not sure why cloud would be any different, I'm not sure why PS4 better hardware would be any different.

Yes...you see some differences but only from resolution or frame, your not seeing it look like another game and no game on XONE looks anything like The Order, or Until Dawn, or Horizon etc. Its very clear PS4's GPU advantage can be seen with many titles and 3rd parties have no use for making one look better then the other, they need to make money on all.

http://images.pushsquare.co...

+ Show (24) more repliesLast reply 3170d ago
ZeroX98763172d ago

3rd parties could've put more effort into Kinect also, but most didn't. If cloud computing becomes an industry standard, then yes 3rd parties will profit from it.

Since cloud game stream was done on PC before, PSNow for PS4 and now this plus W10 local stream for the Xbox one, chances are we could see this kind of features being offered by all three in the upcoming years. Just like VR with Rift for windows, added compatibility with X1 and Morpheus with PS4, becoming industry standard will help 3rd parties considering supporting it.

As much as I prefer Playstation for my console of choice (Got a nice gaming PC also), the Xbox brand did great things over the years on console innovations feature wise. Every addition is welcomed and each company should always push the bar even further. We're the ones benefiting from it :)

lvl_headed_gmr3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

MS showed what their cloud can do and now lets hope 3rd parties will adopt it to make bigger and better games.

I just hope the PS4 doesn't hold back the Xbox One moving gaming forward. The PS4 wasn't designed around cloud computing like the Xbox One is so most likely 3rd parties won't be able to give the PS4 the same experience that would be on the XBox One. This may be an issue since developers try to make the same experience for all devices they build for....yet on the flip side, they always say they build to the strengths of all devices....

Either way, I expect the Xbox One version of all games will be held back because of PS4 basically designed hardware for out dated developing methods.

#NoParity

ninsigma3172d ago

There is no designing hardware around cloud. If the Console has Internet connection, it can do it. Just needs the servers.

Can't see multiplat third parties using cloud too much. It would effectively be making two versions of the game. That won't happen.

Haru3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Translation: I hope all thrid parties use our cloud technology so we could have control over all games and force people to connect online to our servers and bring our true vision for 'always online' to life!

I guess Microsoft never really gave up on their always online vision

Good thing that will never happen since Sony is in lead and thrid party publishers aren't blind and can see trough Microsoft evil plot

Mystogan3172d ago

Not sure if serious or...

*Disagreed just in case*

Mystogan3172d ago

Sony fanboys went from

1. cloud is not possible hahaha!
Crackdown 3 comes out.
2. Sony can do it too with Gaikai!
Gaikai is not a Platform it's software.
3. Well Microsoft will allow Sony to use Azure because they're such good buddies outside of gaming.

b1nary_B0SS3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@Mystogan:

b1nary_B0SS: "Gaikai is not a Platform it's software."... Correction, Gaikai is a platform. It is also hardware and software.Cloud computing can be achieved on the custom PS3 servers that are housed in Gakai datacenters.

Evidence of this dates back to 2005 with IBM's CELL Blade Server prototype, IBM's 'Gameframe' and Hoplon Infotainments launch of Taikodom in 2008 which uses those CELL Blade Severs to calculate physics, animation and A.I in realtime. Ken kutaragi also made reference to server-side computing in 2006.

5/13/2005 - Bruce D’Amora:
https://www.research.ibm.co...
*Slide 2 – Introduction - This demo is an example of a prototypical online game application running on a Cell based server… Our proposed solution leverages the Cell processor’s SPEs to perform some of the more computationally intensive processing required for a game server. We use the SPEs to perform a hybrid integration calculation required to compete rigid-body displacements in a multi-body game scene.

*Slide 3 – Performance - We were focusing on how a Cell Processor Based Blade Servers could be used to accelerate gameplay for MMOG… By streaming small integration workloads to all 8 SPEs and vectorizing the code we were able to achieve an overall integration speedup that was more than 8x that of a single processor solution. Since integration and collision detection accounted for the largest percentage of server side computational load, we concluded that Cell Processor Based Blade Servers could potentially be used to provide significant performance increase for online games that heavily relied on physical simulation.

6/19/2007 - Bruce D’Amora: http://sti.cc.gatech.edu/Sl...
*Slide 1 - Cell Based Servers for Next-Gen Games - Cell BE Online Game Prototype

*Slide 3 - Motivation: Server-side Physically Based Modeling - Enable the next generation MMOGs & virtual environments - Current online video games perform limited amount of physical simulation - Not enough client CPU resources - Bandwidth & Latency between processing nodes prohibitive to achieving real time performance

*Slide 7 - Collision Detection - All collision detection being moved to SPEs

*Slide 8 - Server Side Physics Loop - Runtime steps: 1 – 6

*Slide 24- Conclusions & Next Steps - SPEs are very fast and can provide significant speedup - Ultimately grouping, de-coupling and network scene management should be moved to SPEs - Add more destructible-body and soft-body dynamics

b1nary_B0SS3172d ago

Continue…

8/2007 - Page 1 - Joe Clabby: http://venturebeat.com/wp-c...
Introduction - … And by using Cell based servers, Hoplon can rapidly update the state of a player’s movements through virtual space by performing mathematically-intensive calculations rapidly.

4/2008 – Svend Erik Bach: ftp://public.dhe.ibm.com/softw are/emea/se/lsu/LSU_-_zAtlas_Sy stem_z_Roadmap_October-November _2007-3-handout.pdf
*Slide35 - IBM and Hoplon: ‘Gameframe’ Project

*Slide 36 - Why Taikodom on Cell - HPC for Motion and Collision Detection - Physics Simulation - Realist Animation - Artificial Intelligence

10/20/2008 - MasterShake: https://www.youtube.com/wat...
Taikodom Novo Gameplay 1/3

4/27/2009 - Tarquinio Teles: https://www.youtube.com/wat...
Hoplon Infotainment, Brazil startup and maker of Taikodom online video game.
@1:10 - …this game here you are seeing, very colorful, 3D, real physics runs from a mainframe…

6/13/2006 – Ken kutaragi: http://e-mpire.com/showthre...
… Users will be able to connect to Polyphony Digital's server. So I want it to be a Cell server, with the number of Cells at a thousand to several thousand. This would allow us to maintain an entire cyberworld, as long as our power supply holds up.

* CELL server - 10/28/2005 - Nikkei Electronics: http://techon.nikkeibp.co.j...
Kutaragi proposed a cluster server using the Cell as a future server environment. A rack design combining 16 units, each of which consists of eight 2.5 GHz Cell microprocessors…

* PlayStation Network/Gaikai - 1/17/2014 - Eurogamer: http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...
Sources who have been briefed on the project suggest that the new PlayStation 3 consists of eight custom console units built into a single rack server… Sony's engineers were able to mitigate both issues by shrinking the equivalent of eight PS3s onto a single motherboard, housed in a slimline server cabinet.

5/26/2012 - Eurogamer: http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...
…what many people forget is that PlayStation 3 already streams gameplay over IP and, in some respects, cloud is a natural extension of that… the fundamental technology is already there… A single SPU is capable of encoding 720p at 30FPS at 5mbps… So, custom PS3 datacenter servers need not be that expensive…

9/17/2014 - David Perry: http://www.gameinformer.com...
To be sitting on top of a real data center is fantastic for development. We can go downstairs and do anything we want to the servers and put new servers in…Just to be very clear, we only do two things for Sony…Remote play…and then of course the cloud stuff, which was all network based.

4/27/2007 - Ken Kutaragi: http://www.eetimes.com/docu...
The design concept of the Cell processor is the network processor.

TOTSUKO3172d ago

Crackdown 3 may have fully destructible environments but the game overall is bland and unappealing. I know that its still in early stages but Crackdown has no likeness or even a great background story but they expect people to buy it just because buildings blow up? The overall success of the franchise speaks for itself. It will take a whole lot more than the cloud to make a game great. Just saying.

sourav933172d ago

With me primarily being a PC and PS4 gamer, I hope all MS 1st party exclusives make use of cloud computing in one way or another, similar to Crackdown 3. In that case, it might convince me to pick up an Xbox One down the line. With 3rd party, if the devs have time, I say go for it. If the devs can add special Nvidia effects for PCs, and can allow the PS4 version of the game run at a higher resolution/framerate or with additional effects, the Xbox One versions could include cloud computing effects, of course ONLY if it doesn't compromise the development on other platforms. Screw parity.

Persistantthug3170d ago (Edited 3170d ago )

I think you'd need Microsoft's 1st parties to actually build and MAKE A GAME (not just tech demo) first before any 3rd parties do.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 3170d ago
Genuine-User3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Can someone explain how a third party game designed with cloud compute in mind, that also uses Microsoft Azure to offload destruction physics won't translate to the other system?

Immorals3172d ago

Because the azure cloud is limited to Microsoft platforms.

They are currently the only console company with the servers to offer said services.

Gazondaily3172d ago

Your links are confusing Genuine. I typed in Sony in the search bar and found nothing?

ZeroX98763172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

http://www.polygon.com/2013...

It's not like microsoft is the only one to ever be able to do it. If it becomes an industry standard, then the others will follow.

That's why competition is good to have. One pushes the other to be better. Good times to be a gamer whichever console/PC/Handheld your gaming on :D

Gazondaily3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

I don't see why not. It would have to start with Yoshida and Cerny admitting they were wrong in their skepticism though and then, I don't know, approaching Microsoft, cap in hand, asking them to let them have use of the service or paying a premium?

That or MS could tell Sony to sod off. Why relinquish a key advantage over your competitors who are dominating the market? They can, and are well within their rights to withhold consent.

Insomnia_843172d ago

I say, wait and see until the game releases. This could go very bad from what I see.

Gazondaily3172d ago

@insomnia

AH yeah definitely, we should wait but with things like 2-4MB requirement and the demos shown off for a game, it doesn't seem so far fetched now.

My only wonder is, what if they run out of servers? If one session can involve multiple servers, will 300k servers be enough?

Genuine-User3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Why would Sony approach Microsoft for third party services?

The deal would probably take place between Microsoft and a third-party publisher.

Gazondaily3172d ago

@Genuine

You think Sony can piggy back off a third party publisher and stealthily make use of the serivice? Lol nah I don't see it happening mate.

Genuine-User3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@Septic

Piggy back off a third party?
Microsoft Azure is is an open, flexible, enterprise-grade cloud computing platform. If third-party pubs leverage cloud compute for destruction physics, who's to say they won't rent servers for the PS4 version.

Gazondaily3172d ago

You're saying Microsoft has no control over its cloud infrastructure? That allowing third parties to use it doesn't come with restrictions on who they can sub-let the service to? I almost guarantee you that there is a clause in their contract of services preventing blanket consent to third parties to allow others to use it.

Sony can't just benefit from it willy nilly and for free and no third party will front the cost on behalf of Sony.

Godmars2903172d ago

@Genuine-User:
Azure is as much, if not more, about general online information management as supporting game effects. MS didn't make it just for the XB0 but rather to compete with other such services. To become the main service.

jerethdagryphon3172d ago

Or you know sony could use there own server farm gaikai.

TFJWM3172d ago

If sony wanted to they could get the service from Amazon Web Service or Google Cloud, How much it would cost is a totally different story thou

Persistantthug3170d ago (Edited 3170d ago )

@Septic What was Cerny wrong about? He said that cloud couldn't improve graphics and he's still right.

+ Show (7) more repliesLast reply 3170d ago
TheGreatGamer3172d ago

People have explained this to you, many times already but hell, I'll try again. Microsoft can subsidise 3rd party devs if they're going to be using cloud computing in their XB1 versions of their games to allow them to take advantage of Microsoft's Azure infrastructure. This doesn't translate to the other system because of practicality, it will be costing Sony a lot of money to rent servers, licesenses etc. and it just isn't economically viable for them as a business to do this. Maybe in the future they'll find a partner but even then the cost-benefit ratio might be too high for Sony for many years to come.

Genuine-User3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

I hope you're not speaking about your embarrassingly inept explaination in your messages and relevant threads.

How will it cost Sony if it's a third-party game?

Third-party pubs would rent the servers, not Sony, as far as I'm aware.

TheGreatGamer3172d ago

Jesus are you being serious or are you trolling me? I feel like I'm being trolled but there's a part of me that thinks you might really believe the stuff you're saying pertaining to this topic. As I already said, Microsoft will likely subsidize 3rd party devs to use the cloud tech in their game and then PS4 versions will be different as they won't be using cloud tech because why would Microsoft allow Sony's system to take advantage of this if Sony aren't paying anything? lol you need to go to business school pal

Genuine-User3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

"because why would Microsoft allow Sony's system to take advantage of this"

Is that a serious question? Money.

"if Sony aren't paying anything?"

We are not speaking about first-party content. You seem to lack basic comprehension pal. Third-party pubs will invest in their connected games. It's not that hard to grasp.

Aenea3172d ago

MS is a business, their Cloud Services is a separate division from the console division, if a 3rd party developer contacts MS and ask about them wanting to use The Cloud for their game but also want to rent extra server capacity for the non-Xbox One versions do you really believe MS will say no to them?

I don't think they will.

How awesome would it be for Xbox One fans if they can claim that the PS4 version of a particular game would not have been possible without Microsoft's Cloud Services? ;)

triple_c3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@TheGreatGamer

I'm just going to say this, you better hope the PS4 Isn't capapable of cloud computing because if it turns out to be true, prepare to eat your words. I have a good memory so I'm going to remember you lol. You Xbox fans have been saying Sony and the PS4 can't do this and have been bragging about this constantly and rubbing it in peoples face, especially you so don't get upset if it turns out that the PS4 is actually capapable of this as well and PlayStation guys start rubbing it in your faces. You guys are really asking for it..

gangsta_red3172d ago

@triplec

Well for the longest time Xbox fans have been hearing that's it's impossible to have cloud compute, the internet can't handle it, it can only be done on a powerful PC and all other sorts of comments downplaying and calling what MS has in mind a lie.

So I find yours and other comments extremely ironic that now Sony fans are waiting for Sony to do the same thing after almost two years of not believing this type of tech could be done.

someOnecalled3171d ago

The point he is making is why would ms give sony their greatest advantage right now especially when is outpacing them in sales significantly.

Seriously why would the give their greatest advantage right now when they was getting dismissed by them with cloud and are still getting outsold in console sales. Like he said go to business school because doing that evn though would make ms money would be the death of xbone because their would be no more perks over ps4 beside some exclusives and xblive which its STILL being outsold. But I get it y'all want it too and that would make sony take the shine from ms.

It's obvious the two PS fanboys with all those bubz are not going to listen to logic. This is one industry where leasing out you advantage to your competition for money can kill ya. They focus on console and first party game sales, and online sub to make money so why would they want you to play on the competitors console besides theirs. Like people say if my console do everything the other do and better what the point and buying the other. Then I goes back to exclusives and infrastructure. The reasons I have brought a new console yet what's the point.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 3171d ago
Lennoxb633172d ago

A lot of people forget that you also need a certain type of hardware to take advantage of the cloud. Low latency hardware. PS4 has very high latency hardware. And using the cloud on the PS4 would make for a bad experience.

Aenea3172d ago

Care to elaborate there tho? Don't mention the 'move engines' since those do nothing for the Xbox One's cloud capabilities.

user99502793172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

I'm not interested in generating controversy, but one thing that came to mind from memory was the difference between GDDR5 and DDR3

"The memory is also fundamentally set up specifically for the application it uses:
System memory (DDR3) benefits from low latency (tight timings) at the expense of bandwidth, GDDR5's case is the opposite. "

"well said lol. you need faster memory for transferring larger amounts of data, that is why Gddr5 is used, but DDR3 is better for transferring smaller amounts of data. If you notice, DDR3 video cards have mainly 64bit memory bandwidth or 128 (64x2), while gddr5 cards have 256 or 384 bit memory bandwidths."

htt p://www.techspot.com/community /topics/whats-the-diffe rence-between-ddr3-memory-and- gddr5-memory.186408/

For instance, the tiny packets that come up and down in the case of cloud compute.

I mean, MS has been saying it all along and you would have to be ignorant not to at least recognize that XB1 is in some ways designed with the cloud in mind. It only takes a laymen to see that ESram and move engines are there to move around smaller packets of data. This has been known for some time (and constantly regarded as completely useless...).

All these factors together I think point to a pretty clear advantage for X1 as far as cloud processing. Not to say that it's impossible on PS4... that train of thought quickly broaches on speculation.

joeorc3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Yup its not like Sony's PS4, does not include Spur's or..wait a min..lol

Many people are going to look quite foolish, but that's another baiting thread later.

And you also have to keep in mind the PS4 was built for the cloud also, just applied cloud Direction's from each company are pretty much already set. Microsoft's is more CPU, While Sony's is More GPGPU centric. End result "both already employ cloud based compute centric hardware"

Deciding what to do with is the blunt point.

Microsoft = offloading compute tasks to the cloud

Sony = offloading from the cloud for steaming.

user99502793172d ago

Like I said, MS' configuration with DDR3 and ESram is clearly more conducive to moving small packages of data quickly in and out of the GPU. It is what it is. How you choose to rationalize that is up to you. Nobody ever said Sony's machine wasn't capable of leveraging the cloud. In fact, I said exactly the opposite. The configurations are different, and both offer advantages in certain situations. That's all. It is possible to discuss the advantages of MS' machine without slighting Sony's box.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 3172d ago
user99502793172d ago

The answer seems incredibly obvious to me, and it pained me enough that I needed to register to say this.

3rd party pubs like EA and Activision invest in their own cloud infrastructure to host dedicated servers, right? So, logically, if cloud compute really blows up, it makes sense for those same third parties to start early in building up their own advanced server infrastructure for things like compute.

When third parties have the infrastructure, no reason both consoles cant leverage it.

Probably a ways off, for now. But that's how it will happen.

SlavisH23172d ago

I thought azure servers were rented out so and third party could use the for PlayStation or Nintendo

Mystogan3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Nope they don't have to. They CAN but they can refuse too. They are competition. Just like Sony wouldn't put a PS4 game on Xbox. MS can refuse to give Sony Platforms access to Azure.

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 3170d ago
Sonyslave33172d ago

Here Sony Shu the Head of Sony Corp in June
Sony: 'of course' PS4 can do cloud computing

But what about Sony's next-gen machine? Sure, it can stream games via the cloud-powered Gaikai. But can it also follow Microsoft's step in offloading computation to the cloud? "Of course," Sony's Shuhei Yoshida said.

"Linking, matchmaking... there are already many computations being done on the cloud side," Yoshida told Polygon. And although PS4 won't require an internet connection to use, Yoshida said that "if your title needs [an] online connection to provide some online features: Go for it."

http://www.shacknews.com/ar...

Here Sony Shu In Nov that year
Yoshida 'totally doesn't understand' Xbox One's cloud computing

We've been clear on what cloud gaming means, and that's getting games to run on the server and sending that video signal to a distant device," Yoshida told GamesIndustry.biz.
The way they are using cloud computing seems very different and I totally don't understand what they mean by that. So we can't react to what they are saying because we don't understand."
Yoshida admits that he had to read an article produced by tech experts Digital Foundry to get an understanding of Microsoft's plans, but suggests that he still doesn't fully understand how it will work.

"[Digital Foundry] went through all the computing tasks a game goes through," Yoshida continued, "and for each one they checked off if it can actually be done on the server versus the client, and most of the tasks a game has to perform, they said, cannot be done on the server because of the huge latency and the bandwidth.

"There's so much data going back and forth between the CPU and memory and GPU inside the console compared to going through the internet... There were maybe four or five tasks that actually could be done on the server. So that was very educational to me. After reading the article, the Microsoft message was even more confusing to me."

Microsoft claims that it is able to offload local CPU processes to the cloud in order to improve visual fidelity and offer advanced AI.

The first Xbox One game to make the use of the cloud appears to be Forza Motorsport 5, which pulls data from the cloud to create 'Drivatars', a form of AI driver based on player behaviour.

Titanfall is also said to use the cloud to create "a bigger world, more physics, lots of AI, and potentially a lot more than that".

http://www.videogamer.com/n...

But you right sony can do it too even though the head ceo doesn't even understand ms cloud computing.

yarbie10003172d ago

I'll take your CEO article and raise you the architect http://www.dualshockers.com...

Gazondaily3172d ago

Well Yoshida and Cerny will surely have to hold their hands up and admit they were wrong about this. But then again, their statements were carefully worded.

Yoshida said he was confused so now he can say "Confusion cleared :) Shine Get!"

Cerny was talking about resolution and so could come out and say "ah yes, good use of the tech".

Well, really we know they were dismissive about it doing anything other than what they are doing with it now but they'll slowly come around (assuming the cloud doesn't fall flat on its face in the real world).

Aenea3172d ago

And that DualShockers article proves what exactly?

What in that quote of Cerny states that the PS4 can't do this or that they don't understand what MS is doing with Cloud Compute?

The Cloud will not suddenly make the Xbox One perform a lot better, it will be able to use The Cloud in new ways tho that makes the games more interesting that's true.

Monkey5213172d ago

@Septic... I am really confused by your constant "Yoshida and Cerny must admit they were wrong" line. They were never 'wrong'. From the quote, Cerny says that it's possible to do computing in the cloud. Everything you saw from the Crackdown demo was physics based (computing) which has nothing to do with graphical fidelity.

Let's all admit that the Crackdown demo was awesome and move on. You are adding to all the fanboy crap going on.

BitbyDeath3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

@Monkey521, Exactly.
All the servers (cloud) do are offer extended CPU functionality, nothing more, nothing less.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 3172d ago
joeorc3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

http://www.investopedia.com...

Low cost to build, maintain and run servers for Arm Powered Chips! By Also Arm Powered Chips.

As quite the contrary, Sony understands this quite well, game consoles are not a or the largest Compute format for the living room, and as for back end server farming, its not about compute its about streaming! For Sony, why would you use compute instead of streaming anyway to device's that work with the DNLA of the PS4.

Yes The ps4 can Infact do cloud compute, but it would have to rent someone's rather large server park or find another partner, if they even have the money to do so.

So why would Sony try to compete with Microsoft's server compute paradigm, instead just keep pushing streaming content instead. For one it operations would be far cheaper, and not everyone has a strong wired network access even in the united states cities have many areas with not very strong reliable network connection.

One concentrates to turn

The consumer electronics market to just another branch under the windows is tree.

While the other

In the consumer electronics sonybas well does Microsoft knows its not the PC market, its not like the Good O'l Wintel alliance, this is the consumer electronics market.

Where the #1 chipsets used for consumer electronics is Arm!

Sony's direction is to make sure Arm chipsets can be the recipient of games streamed from Server back end or local ps4 to Arm SOC's that are powered driectly into the TV, tablets smartphones top set boxes.

But also your phone, tablet. And using a standard dual shock3/4 or hell using even a Nexus player Bluetooth game pad you can click on the TV and play games streamed from the cloud or games remote placed from your PS4 on any Android Powered TV, mobile phone , tablet, streaming box.

Lennoxb633172d ago

I hope they make a Tron game using the cloud. Pieces of data would break apart realistically when defeating your opponent. Or another Burnout. Imagine windows breaking correctly and metal crumpling in the right places. So many possibilities.

343_Guilty_Spark3172d ago

Mass Effect with Cloud Compute....oh my...

poppinslops3172d ago

Blasting holes through walls with the mako, burying mercenaries in the debris... using biotics to tear a ledge out from beneath your enemies' feet as Krogan charge through rubble like butter.

That warrants a Takai 'Oh My'.

green3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Why didn'y Microsoft acquire Bioware when they had the chance? :-(

poppinslops3172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

I'm sure they regret it... besides, Mass Effect and Dragon Age would've made Xbox unbeatable and competition's a good thing.

Microsoft's hunger has been great for XO owners and we still get to play Bioware's games, so really it's a win-win... That said, I think Microsoft should be doing everything in their power to make 'Cyberpunk 2077' an Xbox/Win10 exclusive.

Lamboomington3172d ago

@green

Thank God that didn't happen. Would hate to see that franchise become an exclusive. lol

Spectre_StatusN73172d ago (Edited 3172d ago )

Mass Effect is over. Andromeda might as well be a new ip, real ME fans know what I'm talking about....

Show all comments (114)
340°

2024 Is A Chance At Redemption For Xbox & Microsoft Gaming CEO Phil Spencer

Xbox has been lagging behind PlayStation in terms of 1st party content, but 2024 offers the platform and Phil Spencer a chance at redemption.

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Community12d ago
isarai12d ago (Edited 12d ago )

Nah, that time has passed for many, and with their words on future plans, i really don't see it ever happening.

shinoff218312d ago

It's a wrap. Now is the time they are slowly going to move on as to not to kill the base as is. Titles will slowly drip onto ps and Nintendo consoles, etc. Those 4 already had to of been in development for awhile already cause two of them released really soon after the announcement

VenomUK12d ago (Edited 12d ago )

There is no ‘last chance redemption’ for Phil Spencer - he’s going straight to hell for tanking the Xbox console platform.

_SilverHawk_12d ago

"2024 Is A Chance At Redemption For Xbox & Microsoft Gaming CEO Phil Spencer"

I thought that was supposed to be a decade ago

Ironmike11d ago

U do rel7se ps5 is at thr moment only getting g those titles that were mentioned nothing else as of yet

Obscure_Observer12d ago

"Nah, that time has passed for many, and with their words on future plans, i really don't see it ever happening."

Xbox has PLENTY of first party games this year while Playstation has none!

There´s more first party games from Xbox Games Studios on PS5 this year than Playstation Studios own games.

Those are the *facts* and if those facts is not something to Sony be ashamed of, they can´t feel shame at all.

VersusDMC12d ago

Granblue Fantasy versus, FF7REBIRTH, Helldivers 2, Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade will have launched on PS5 and not on Xbox by the time Hellblade 2 launches.

This only first party games count is cope.

And as a bonus meme...Microsoft will have published 3 first party games on PS5 (Hifi rush, Grounded and sea of thieves) before their first for the year on Xbox(hellblade 2). Glad they have their priorities straight...

lodossrage12d ago

It's funny when people like to say xbox has more games coming to playstation this year than sony does.

YET, they leave out the context that Microsoft literally bought the biggest (Activision) third party publisher and Bethesday (another big one). So congrats on having to buy giants in order to compete?

On topic, wasn't Starfield the "last chance" for redemption?

Am I to assume that if the games they have coming this year don't get positive, feedback then 2025 will be the year of redemption?

Obscure_Observer12d ago

@VersusDMC

"Granblue Fantasy versus, FF7REBIRTH, Helldivers 2, Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade will have launched on PS5 and not on Xbox by the time Hellblade 2 launches."

None of the games you mentioned are first party. None. There´re more Xbox first party games on PS5 this year then Playstation´s own first party games, undeniable fact!

The real bonus meme is Sea of Thieves a game which PS fanboys used to sh!t on

"And as a bonus meme...Microsoft will have published 3 first party games on PS5 (Hifi rush, Grounded and sea of thieves) before their first for the year on Xbox(hellblade 2). Glad they have their priorities straight..."

Imo, the real meme is Sea of Thieves, a 6 year Xbox first party game which diehard fanboys used to mock and sh!t on, making to the top of the most pre-ordered game at PS Store in a year where Playstation has zero first party games.

https://twitter.com/BenjiSa...

Markusb3312d ago

and all will end up on playstation, and nintendo, if xbox was doing amazing they would not need ps or nintendo, if gp was amazing they wouldnt need pc. PS has multiple first party games in development that we dont know about. Look at how halo was treated, look at redfall, and look at starfield. Its fine to be loyal and prefer one platoform but to be wilfully ignorant about it just ridiculas.

badz14912d ago

LOL se we are moving from "exclusives" to "console exclusives" to now only "1st party exclusives" matters just after MS has bought 2 publishers for $77B??

Moving goalpost to always favor MS i. Your argument is getting tiring! Exclusives are exclusives! 1st or 3rd party, they are still exclusives. You do remember the PS2 literally killed the Dreamcast, Gamecube and the first xbox due to mostly 3rd party exclusives, right?

InUrFoxHole12d ago

Observe is actually correct. Sony paid to play. But we don't mention when they do it. When they do it we're totally cool with it. N4G 4lyfe!

Skuletor12d ago

Are they still counted as first party though?

fr0sty12d ago

“This notion that Xbox can only be this one device that plugs into a television isn’t something we see in the Gen Z research. Because nothing else is like that for them.

Some of them will have an iPhone, some will have an Android, but all the games and everything is the same. I can still get to TikTok on both of them, at least for now." - Phil Spencer

Read it and weep... all Xbox games are coming to as many platforms as they can put them on, and this is the first step towards them getting out of hardware entirely, just like Sega did.

Xbox has been Dreamcast out of the industry. You can deny it all you like, but it's happening.

northpaws12d ago

@Obscure_Observer

You certainly have more faith in Xbox than Phil Spencer does, I will give you that.

rpvenom12d ago

It's actually quite impressive watching you defend xbox. I respect the loyalty

wiz719112d ago

@VersusDMC here yall Sony fans go moving the goalpost again lol now this only first party things is a cope when yall was the one who started that crap in the first place. When Sony had all the first party games and Xbox was relying on third party , yall was shouting they had no first party games. Now the tables turn and suddenly it’s a cope. lol

wiz719112d ago

@lodossrage and so it’s also funny that the majority of Xbox first party games this year aren’t coming from any of those big studios lol except for Indy .. the biggest one this year is coming from a studio that Sony left and almost let that studio die after releasing two big exclusives on their console first. Now MS swoop in and saved them , then here they are with the best looking game this generation. Now that’s ironic , but you mention buying studios like Sony biggest studios weren’t BOUGHT my brother.

Yall need to be more worried about Sony closing studio after studio , the PSVR 2 dying , Sony losing billions , and the fact that yall biggest game this year as in Stellar Blade was once being developed as a multi platform game until Sony paid for them to be a second party studio. lol but you want to mention things being bought , your delusional

Crows9012d ago

Shame in the competitor buying up tons of dev teams in order to make that a reality? Yeah...there's no shame in that on the PlayStation side....

andy8512d ago

So now you're shifting the goal posts so only first party exclusives count. Amazing 😂

Profchaos12d ago

There's probably tons of games exclusive to Xbox that won't be on PS because of their early access clause.

However list the games that count helldivers 2 I'd argue has done more for gaming this year than any other title will.
It could be their only game and it would still be a great year because it was that unexpectedly good even haters of love service games are playing it

TheTony31611d ago

Still at it? Doesn't matter at this point. The games will eventually launch on PS5.

mkis00711d ago (Edited 11d ago )

I see you ignored his" only first party games count" line as if preordained. Is it on xbox? No...then it is ammunition. Meanwhile sony gets to passively soak up 30% of all ms game studios sales.

1Victor11d ago (Edited 11d ago )

@obscured: “There´s more first party games from Xbox Games Studios on PS5 this year than Playstation Studios own games.

Those are the *facts* and if those facts is not something to Sony be ashamed of, they can´t feel shame at all.”
That says more about Xbox than PlayStation that they have to release games on rival consoles to stay afloat, Microsoft and YOU SHOULD NOT BE ASHAMED OF THAT FACT.

Edit After thought: it took Microsoft 6 years to finally fix their sea of bugs just in time to release it on PlayStation 🤷🏿

S2Killinit11d ago (Edited 11d ago )

On topic:
MS’s last chance was Starfield…
How many last chances are there?

@Osbscure
You’re moving the goal posts into places that have no basis in reality anymore.

+ Show (17) more repliesLast reply 11d ago
darthv7212d ago

Life is too short to hold onto grudges. Grudges against a console, game or company is just petty.

isarai12d ago (Edited 12d ago )

Has nothing to do with a grudge. Ive been waiting 12yrs for them to get back to their greatness, im done waiting and have moved onto just watching that ship sink as i play on literally every other platform

darthv7212d ago

^^... I still play on it, as well as the other platforms. Which is why I am not someone who dwells on the negativity like others do. there is always something for me to enjoy in this hobby.

isarai12d ago (Edited 12d ago )

@darth

Again, not dwelling on negativity, they legit haven't made anything i want to play since like gears 3 and halo reach. I did play Crackdown 3 and gears 5 cause i had hope given i was a huge fan of the older games, but that was a dud on both cases.

You're thinking it's way deeper than it is 🤣 make something worth playing and ill play it, i was hoping starfield would be that but again, dud.

darthv7212d ago

^^...I never said YOU were doing that... but its obvious others (here) do. Its all they seem to do is dwell on negativity, especially if its XB related. all im saying is there is more to enjoy than there is to complain about. And this is exactly why I play all the platforms instead of just one. You say you do the same... so just enjoy it.

neomahi12d ago

It's fanbots making their last stand in an attempt to save the Xbox, what more can one expect that the most optimism they've ever had. Xbox can't get a lock in Japan, still, and Europe is about to abandon it as well. What're you gonna do? And what happens IF Japanese generates interest? They'll see Europe losing interest and decide it's not worth it either. And it's not just Xbox, Microsoft as a whole is losing their footing. They've backed on subscriptions with everything they have to offer and it's tanking. Xbox needs to port to PlayStation and Nintendo while they can stay relevant and try to stay relevant, the longer they delay, we could see a complete Microsoft nose dive

S2Killinit11d ago (Edited 11d ago )

And you think MS fans are just dandy? Besides, is it a grudge if MS continues to give reasons for people to despise them?

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 11d ago
Markusb3312d ago

when you cant make enough from your own platform and pc and you have to go to ps and nintendo you know its a slow transition to 3rd party publishing, and that is fine. Xb never had the thurst or ambition after the 360

JackBNimble11d ago

The second they decided to put exclusives on the ps5 they blew any chance of redemption

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-Foxtrot12d ago

Even if they managed to get a win this year it dosent overthrow 10 years of mostly disappointments from Phil’s leadership.

RaidenBlack12d ago (Edited 12d ago )

Then this way, no company can redeem themselves. The very concept of redemption arc becomes impossible if the past is refused to be forgiven, even if the company manages to better themselves.
Then the now popular redemption arc of No Mans Sky or Phantom Liberty wouldn't exist in the gaming community if the same logic is also applied there.
Not defending anyone here but I want gaming to improve, companies to better themselves and most importantly competition to exist so that we get offered the best products to enjoy.
(I know in typical N4G fashion, this comment will be downvoted to oblivion, but I want good games offered from every studios irrespective of publishers.)

staticall12d ago

@RaidenBlack
IMO, what @-Foxtrot means, one years doesn't mean much. It's a start, yes, but they need more, much more.

Look at your own example, No Mans Sky - they didn't just release one patch and everyone started praising them, no. They've been doing this consistently. If Microsoft will start releasing good games consistently, that'll be great, no ifs and/or buts! But hyping them up in advance (no worthy releases yet is what i mean) - dunno, i might be wrong, but i don't think it's healthy or helps anyone.

rippermcrip12d ago

Your analogies are terrible. A company releasing a single game that failed to meet expectations.

Isn't the same as Phil Spencer making mistake after mistake after mistake after mistake, telling lie after lie after lie after lie for 10+ years.

isarai12d ago

Your whole comparison makes no sense. It literally took years for both of those to "redeem" themselves in the container of a single game. MS has been lacking for 12yrs starting with the halo/gears/forza criticism begining in the latter half of the 360. So even by YOUR logic, he's right, it's gonna take a lot more than one game to be redeemed ESPECIALLY after fumbling what many were already holding as their chance at redemption with starfield

Chevalier12d ago

It's not Playstation or Nintendos fault that Xbox poses no competition. They've had more support and more money behind them than Playstation and Nintendo combined!

You say you aren't defending Xbox, but, you kind of are. Xbox has been completely mediocre for decades. The last time Xbox was competitive was the 360 era. My 360 collection absolutely demolishes my Xbox One collection and so far Series X hasn't had much reason for me to jump to a purchase.

Can you honestly say Xbox is 'competitive'?! I would say not even close.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 12d ago
Silly Mammo12d ago

With the gaming media, Xbox is always just one game away from redemption and success. It's willful ignorance that they think there's a 'magic bullet' that will somehow erase all the moves by Phil & the gang of the last 2 console generations.

"Well there's always next year!" Should be the official Xbox slogan

Chocoburger11d ago (Edited 11d ago )

100% this Mammo!

They've been screwing up for over a decade! Even if they release a game that's of the highest quality, that's nothing in the grand scheme things.

It also doesn't un-do Kinect (with lies based advertising).

Or Kinect 2 (forcing people to spend $100 extra for something they didn't even want!).

Or releasing two consoles with nothing noteworthy twice in a row (One X, Series S|X).

Or releasing unpolished games such as Re:Core, Sea of Thieves, Halo: MCC, Halo Infinite, Redfall, and Starfield.

Let's not forget canceling games as well such as Scalebound,Project Spark, and the Phantom Dust remake.

Finally let's remember the broken promises of vaporware games, languishing in development Hell, such as Perfect Dark, Fable, Everwild, what else am I forgetting?

Redemption is far far FAR AWAY for Microsoft. It'll take a full decade of only making smart pro-consumer decisions and releasing plenty of amazing games in order to make up for it all.

2024? It ain't gonna do squat on its own.

Rols12d ago

It was the same old story in 2020, 2021,2022 and 2023. XBox has never delivered this gen.

Brazz12d ago (Edited 12d ago )

Xbox360, the last time they delivered the goods, over 10 years Ago.

Skuletor12d ago

This headline just reminds me of the "wait 'til E3" comments we'd hear every year, before it was cancelled.

LG_Fox_Brazil12d ago

I wonder if the 2025's version of this article is already written, probably I would say

lodossrage12d ago

That's the same point I was trying to convey when I replied to Obscure

Hofstaderman12d ago (Edited 12d ago )

#wait till e3 2024

Aloymetal12d ago

''2024 Is A Chance At Redemption For Xbox & Microsoft Gaming CEO Phil Spencer''
We've been hearing and reading the same crap since the xbone launch, these shills/journos need to come up with something new. Good thing is most gamers know this is all BS, they all read ''"Step right up folks and hold out your money or sub to our service. You don't know what you are going to get, but like always, take our word for it" Signed Lord Phil.

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580°

Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes.

Spencer said publicly traded companies have to show constant growth or else nobody will give them money. "I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business"

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LG_Fox_Brazil17d ago

I don't know Phil... You've being running, and some will say ruining, the Xbox brand for 10 years now, you know?

Profchaos17d ago

I'd say he'sade the best out of a tremendous cluster fk of a situation he was thrown into after Don tanked the Xbox brand from Kinect to the launch of the X1.

The only reason Xbox isn't in the Ms graveyard right now is because of Phil.

So I don't agree with everything he's done but I can see why these drastic pivots and moves have been made

VenomUK16d ago (Edited 16d ago )

You don’t hear Nintendo CEO Shuntaro Furukawa blame capitalism for the phenomenal success of the Switch.

You don’t hear now-departed PlayStation CEO Jim Ryan blame capitalism for the roaring success of the PS5.

Cockney16d ago

He was head of games back in don mattricks day so he should be held accountable for his involvement, the back half of the 360 gen and start of xbone lack of games was all him

Rynxie16d ago

The reason Xbox is not in the Ms graveyard is because of the money they are throwing around to keep the brand alive. Don was just a yes man, the stupidity of the Xbox one was MS doing.

romulus2316d ago

We are well past Don Mattrick at this point, people need to stop using that tired excsue. The issues with xbox for nearly the last ten years have been solely on Phil.

Plague-Doctor2716d ago

The PS3 tanked Sony and they recovered during the same generation. The Wii U tanked Nintendo and they delivered a record setting console only a few years later. At the launch of X1 it was keeping pace with the PS4 and in the US was occasionally beating it.

jwillj2k416d ago (Edited 16d ago )

All he had to do was say “the way forward is to make great games.”, drop the mic and make it happen by any means necessary. If you listen to the interview he gave after redfall came out, you’ll hear him say he thought the game was good to go and the internal team rated the game 85 out of 100. 85!! This shows how out of touch he is. He’s literally an empty vessel just collecting his check, running the division off of data-driven analytics, he doesn’t care about xbox and now pulls a Trump, blaming the clouds for his failures.

Cacabunga16d ago

Says the biggest capitalist company.. this moron should stop talking

sinspirit16d ago (Edited 16d ago )

No.. Phil was in charge of European studios and Kinect implementation since 2008. Those European studios he was in charge of were then full time Kinect developers as he was now in charge of all XBox game studios in 2010. This is why game quality has sucked ever since he was in charge and directly why the legendary Lionhead and the actual Rare devs are not there anymore. Phil is actually more to blame than anyone for the bad game quality and the Kinect push. And especially for the terrible XBox One launch.

He was the spearhead implemented employee for Kinect and Microsoft's new vision. The others were the talking heads appointed by XBox. And, honestly watching some of those old interviews it seemed like those XBox employees were possibly maliciously complient by telling exactly what Microsoft's new agenda was with Kinect and always online without dressing it up.

And directly on topic. No, Phil. Capitalism is voting with your wallet. XBox doing bad financially is in fact because of bad products, disappointments, failed deadlines, and especially lying, misleading, and broken promises for products. If you just released really good games and tried to innovate then you'd had a lot of sales.. oh and GamePass is losing out on a ton of sales which can not be recovered from a few microtransaction purchases, monthly sub costs, or even whales. The math is simple when you could have sold a $70 game 5 million times but instead maybe sold 1 million tops and now have to recoup a quarter billion of revenue from lost sales potential of the one title alone. But now you also don't want to release a lot of first party titles because of the direct loss in sales revenue from day 1 GamePass, and you don't want them to release really good games that take a little more time and money to make because you want them to be cost effective for GamePass release. So you intentionally plan to release a lot of AAA shortcomings at this point because the AAA badge is needed but you can't do it too well or GamePass will never actually profit. Even though they had said GamePass is profitable, it is absolutely not by much and never will be. And, they said that Zune was profitable a long time ago but they combined it with an entire category of products when Zune itself was bleeding money. They lose far too many direct sales that even the most generous math can not see how they could be making much money if any at all to make up for this business practice. This is what happens when marketing and trend chasing fool a business into pursuing the wrong thing to stay relevant when the clear answer all along was that they always did good when they just supported developers making genuinely full and good games.

Babadook716d ago (Edited 16d ago )

I kind of agree with you, but Phil is partly to blame.

I blame Peter Moore (for leaving). Everything went to pot soon after.

PapaBop15d ago

How many years ago was this now? I'll give him some credit for what he inherited but lets be honest, he hasn't exactly done anything praise worthy and has done a terrible job managing the studios Microsoft owns.

+ Show (7) more repliesLast reply 15d ago
Eonjay16d ago

I thought he said it was Gen Z. I can't keep up.

Hofstaderman16d ago

Its Gen Z who are extremely capitilist. Lol, Phil is a clown of note.

16d ago
fr0sty16d ago (Edited 16d ago )

He's kinda right, shareholders expect constant growth, which is unsustainable, but it is what they expect nonetheless. That's why, even though the games industry is healthy as it has ever been, because it isn't growing, everyone in the industry is panicking. Even though we're still selling just as many consoles as ever, they expect each generation to just keep on growing and growing, and when that doesn't happen, they start to freak out.

This is true of any industry, and it's why anytime a company goes public, their products usually end up going to shit. The shareholders expect more and more and more growth, cuz they want that stock price to keep climbing, and so eventually corners start getting cut, wages start getting cut, employees start getting cut, they start cutting away everywhere they can to try to squeeze a little bit more money out of the product, until they ruin it, and then they move on to the next product.

buffig16d ago

Yeah, but everyone knows how capitalism works. This part didn't need explaining. The problem is that they bought massive plublishers for a gazillion dollars, to the detriment of the industry and now he's acting like he has no choice but to fire thousands of people because he just found out about nasty capitalism

TheEnigma31316d ago

Why I'm glad companies like Valve stayed private.

SyntheticForm16d ago

He'd never blame himself, so he's trying to score points with the kids by blaming capitalism. One of the biggest capitalists is blaming capitalism for his and Xbox's failure.

fr0sty15d ago

I agree with you, which is why I said he's "kinda" right... he's right in the fact that capitalism is behind a lot of investors freaking out that the games industry, while still healthy, is not continually growing unsustainably, but he's also being hypocritical in the same breath after buying half the industry and then laying off thousands of them, and using his own business practices as an excuse to cover for his failures.

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mandf17d ago

It won't be until halo and gears are on playstation that xbox fans see phil for who he is. A snake fighting only for himself. The video game industry means nothing to him just his paycheck to those who believe phil is passionate and loves video games you are part of the problem. You never hold ms accountable.

Minute Man 72117d ago

Halo and Gears only when Microsoft drops outta the console market

-Foxtrot17d ago

They don't need to drop out of the market for that to happen

They will always have some kind of console going forward but Halo and Gears could only be a few years away at this rate.

Next gen might look completely different

Tacoboto16d ago

I'd actually hope for Halo to come to PS and Nintendo at this point.

The community rejected a mictotransaction option so MCC is no longer maintained - no new revenue streams and Microsoft listened. Infinite is on Content Updates now instead of Seasons - dwindling playerbase and less excitement. If MS wants the franchise to thrive, that's free money and the same could essentially be said for Gears bringing them abroad.

FinalFantasyFanatic16d ago

@Tacoboto,
To be fair, Halo Infinite had a rocky start to begin with, I think they improved for a while, but fell behind again.

shinoff218316d ago

The writings on the all in huge fking letters. Just read it.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 16d ago
phoenixwing17d ago

I don't blame Phil for that in the slightest. If you were offered to be an executive of a company 9 out of 10 ppl would take the job for the salary and give little crap about how they feel about any given product they sell. He's not wrong that capitalism drives greedy companies but you have to take the good with the bad.

staticall16d ago

@phoenixwing
But the person is doing a bad job and the company (including customers) are suffering because of that, how can you not blame him? The reason for high paying is the decisions you make and the responsibility you take for your actions steering the company in the right direction (if company is doing bad, it's your fault; if company is doing good, it's because of your decisions).

It reminds me of that South Park Bill Owens parody ("Follow that egg" episode), a governor who wants all the money and recognition/respect, but doesn't want to take any responsibility, how backwards is that?!

Petebloodyonion16d ago

@Staticall
Agree but what are your metrics for doing a bad job?
Is Microsoft's share value tanking due to its decision?
Is brand awareness worse than in 2016?

As someone who works in investment, this is how I see it and why Spencer's still around.
1) Grow the Xbox brand awareness by including PC and Gamepass making it a stronger brand by name versus 2015.
2) Showed a plan to evolve profitability by having multiple sources of recurrent income with Gamepass, PC gaming, streaming, and now other platforms
3) made new market integration possible via PC and cloud.
4) Can make hard decisions for the good of the company like cutting jobs.

staticall15d ago

@Petebloodyonion
I would say, we shouldn't look at Microsoft themselves, they have a ton of revenue streams - Windows sales, hardware sales, Office sales, Azure, government contracts, certification programs, etc. We need to look at Xbox - hardware sales are in decline (Xbox 360 > Xbox One > Xbox Series S + X combined). GamePass subscribers aren't growing enough and, according to the Microsoft docs, are at plateau. Games sales are abysmal (both physical and digital, thanks to "Day one on GamePass"). Xbox exclusives doesn't exist anymore (every game is coming to PC). And it didn't start yesterday, this was happening for a long-long time.

In my eyes, brand recognition doesn't mean much, if it doesn't translate to console sales, because Phil took away every reason to buy Xbox console for a regular customer (i used to own Xbox 360 and saw 0 reasons to own Xbox One or Xbox Series).

I would also argue that he didn't make any hard decisions, at least when it comes to games: Crackdown 3, Redfall, Halo Infinite - he was saying that those games are looking fine only to be laughed at on presentation/release. But i would consider that a low blow, because he did cut some jobs. But not from top management (who are responsible for the decisions).

In my eyes, as a console owner/gamer, doing good job as a platform holder = supporting your console with high quality exclusive games (like Nintendo and Sony are doing). I'm fine with releasing the games afterwards on PC, but not right away (otherwise, what's the point of a console?!). Extra services are fine (like PS+ or GamePass, or cloud stuff), but they wouldn't be a reason to buy a console for me. Phil is overfocusing on extra services, not on games. And it doesn't work out and haven't worked out for what, 10 years already? Sorry, i feel like i'm rambling at this point.

Nooderus16d ago

He's a Microsoft executive. Duh

S2Killinit16d ago (Edited 16d ago )

Agree except I think the real snake is MS itself. They are a terrible company. This clown is just the hired man for the job.

phoenixwing16d ago (Edited 16d ago )

Thats basically what I'm trying to say and if you really want to get down to it. It's the board of directors for the company who makes this stuff happen.

jznrpg16d ago (Edited 16d ago )

@Phoenixeing it’s his job as the head of the division to tell those people I think you are wrong and for success we need to this - that’s literally his job. MS motto is a big problem and Phil going a long with it is also his fault. He’s the one guy who can say something.

Abear2116d ago

Agreed they are the problem.

M$ doesn’t care about the quality of the game, they care about the profitability of the game.

When you work for a Co. like M$ you know this. It’s all about money—not the “art” or what’s healthy in the industry for devs and/or the consumers.

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 15d ago
M3talDiamond17d ago

First its Gen Z now its capitalism but we can all agree that it definitely isn't Phil

JackBNimble16d ago (Edited 16d ago )

If it wasn't for capitalism there would be no xbox or Microsoft for that matter. But as the head of xbox division it is his responsibility no matter good or bad .... that's what it means to be the boss. If that's to much for him, then he needs to resign.

-Foxtrot17d ago

Kind of funny because when it comes to capitalism Microsoft is one of those great big American companies that just screams it.

They spent billions on Minecraft, Zenimax and Activision yet couldn't afford to save all those jobs they cut. With the money they make within a year they could have, someway.

PhillyDonJawn16d ago ShowReplies(3)
FinalFantasyFanatic16d ago

They've been swallowing up a lot of AI companies too and spending big on that area.

S2Killinit16d ago

If MS gets into AI they will cause the end of humanity the way they are causing the end of console gaming.

FinalFantasyFanatic15d ago

@S2Killinit,

It's between Microsoft and Google, the chances are one of those two will take the AI crown considering the amount of cash they're throwing at that sector. I suppose Microsoft might be the worst out of the two, but Google hasn't been exactly great compared to the old days when they threw around their old adage of "do no evil".

Silly Mammo16d ago

MS is making millions of dollars annually with the Xbox brand. Unfortunately, they're spending billions on acquisitions too

8bitAssassin16d ago

Game Pass games are not free.

Christopher16d ago

He also blames his bank account balance on capitalism.

PhillyDonJawn16d ago

I don't think it work like that. MS is the parent company. The branch has its own budget to maintain.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 15d ago
thorstein17d ago

Making millions, taking million dollar salaries and bonuses but it's the dev in the chair that's preventing profit?

Yeah okay, Phil.

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320°

Phil Spencer, long cast as Xbox's saviour, may be remembered as the man who killed it

Nathan Brown: "Phil Spencer spoke to the press at GDC last week, offering some context/spin on Microsoft’s recent manoeuvres, while dropping a few now-customary hints about the Xbox division’s future plans. I take one issue with this: I am no longer sure Xbox has much of a future to speak of. Moreover: I think Phil Spencer, for so long cast as Xbox’s saviour, may ultimately be remembered as the man who killed it."

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gold_drake19d ago

his decisions over the years were definitely questionable at best.

but MS let him be the head of xbox for this long, so they either dont have anyone else for the job or .. we'll i dont rly know any other reason haha.

-Foxtrot19d ago (Edited 19d ago )

Basically when we had that awful Xbox One reveal in 2013 and Don Mattrick was thrown under the bus as the companies scape goat Phil was pretty much the only one they had who wasn't a typical looking "corporate suit".

Despite the fact him being the head of Microsoft Game Studios and gladly going along with the lack of games nearing the end of the Xbox 360 life where it was basically Kinect, Sports, TV along with the same 3-4 IPs like Halo or Gears he was the best person they had for the job.

They didn't have anyone else basically and from that day onward he was seen as good guy Phil turning the studio around when all he was doing was reversing the silly decisions made and going along with whatever the higher ups or the board wanted for Xbox. Didn't make a difference in the end because everything they "reversed" with the awful Xbox One reveal ended up being implemented in small different ways surgically in recent years with Gamepass.

The guy apparently is such a huge gamer yet played Crackdown 3 and Redfall, thought they were good and released them anyway in those states.

PapaBop19d ago (Edited 19d ago )

Not a typical looking corporate suit? The guy straight up looks like a used car salesman lol. To be fair, after Mattrick, I think anyone with half a brain could succeed him and look semi decent, whenever I think of his name, I immediately remember that "this is how to share your games" video from Sony.

S2Killinit18d ago

when I look at him, its cringe. The guy dresses casually to fool people. But he is as corporate as it gets.

fr0sty18d ago

His cocky smirk I've always found to be incredibly annoying...

MrDead18d ago

I would say his "why bother making games when others are already" decision is what has lead them here. MS does this, but they just buy companies that they want to do a thing then asset strip it and dump it, you can't do that in gaming.

Tody_ZA18d ago

He's the head of Xbox because Microsoft isn't a gaming company and they haven't done anything for gaming in more than a decade. They're a parent company looking to buy more kids to raise as investments. They will profit off ownership, off their games releasing on other platforms, because they can't create anything themselves. Slowly they'll make Xbox as a console completely irrelevant under the mantra of play anywhere. That's why Phil is still there. He shares their corporate vision of making bucks and doing nothing for the gaming industry.

SubtilizZer19d ago

“If they don’t have a story these days they’ll make one”
Drake.

RhinoGamer8819d ago

Phil's top skill is keeping his job, growing his net worth to over $25million, all while underperforming...

SeTTriP18d ago

Gotta respect it, he went from a gaming studio head to making 70billion dollar deals...he is the main character I gotta admit.he looks fun to hang around too.

MrDead18d ago

...why do I feel like I need a shower after reading that? One of the grossest thing I've heard, S tier blowing bubbles grovelling.

jznrpg18d ago (Edited 18d ago )

I don’t respect moves that make gaming worse long term

XBManiac18d ago (Edited 18d ago )

(Phil 'wait for next year' Spencer)
Microsoft made the 71,933 millions deal because it was already started and, with Microsoft, it is not possible to go back and stop it. Does anybody think that deal would be an option in 2023 or 2024, with the nowadays sitiation of the industry? And in 2022? No, nobody would pay that money for Activision-blizzard-king... because it would not be recovered in more than 20 years of really hard and good work. Everybody are selling for less, not buying for more (Embracer, Tencent...). But bad decisions in a company like Microsoft are impossible to fix. It is like a very big Ministery, where if something starts, it can't be stopped. It happened before and Microsoft will do the same again, as they have enough money to burn... well... I hope, because if Microsoft dies... it will be the end of our known world. What could substitute it?

_Decadent_Descent18d ago

I mean, that does take a certain skill. lol

FinalFantasyFanatic18d ago

I guess he has skill as a salesman, look how long he managed to get people to wait on Xbox.

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