'It's very flattering for us': Rocksteady on other games mimicking free-flow combat system

MMGN writes: Rocksteady's 2009 epic Batman: Arkham Asylum not only reinvented The Dark Knight for gamers, but also helped redefine third-person combat.

The "freeflow" combat system, in which players string together combos using precisely-timed counter-attacks and moves, is part of the Arkham series' addictive allure. Taking on hoards of enemies is now more than just button-mashing, with developer Rocksteady creating a smooth, accessible combat system that has set a new standard for the genre.

[GreetingsfromCanada]

It's an overrated button mashing system that is overused to point that I no longer find it enjoyable.

[nicksetzer1]

It is not that great, I agree. What I find even more rediculous though, is that this dev is acting as if it never existed before their game. They did not create that mechanic, frankly they didn't even perfect it IMO. Seems like a cocky statement to make, especially when the system existed well before any arkham game. (Maybe not with that name)

Something about this response just rubs me the wrong way.

[OhMyGandhi]

who did it before them? just an honest question.
I myself enjoy the system immensely, as the combat mechanic requires the player to be fully aware of their surroundings more then ever before. And one must admit that the incredible feeling of taking down a dozen men with counters and the like can feel incredible.
What about the free flow mechanic do you not like? how would you make it better?

[comebackkid9891]

Assassin's Creed called it wants it's auto-battle back.

[Moe-Gunz]

I remember that Jet Li game Rise to Honor doing it.

[dafegamer]

nobody did free flow combat before the arkham games. Tell me which ps2 or gamecube games did the combat.

[InTheLab]

Um.. the Mark of Kri predates Rise to honor and Death by Degrees and it's also closer to the Arkham style than either of those two. But these styles are all too simple to be compared to Arkham.

And to the Assassin's Creed fanboys... AC actually changed the combat 3 games in to mimic the Arkham games.

If there's in single game to take credit for the Arkham style combat, it's either The Mark of Kri or Spiderman 2 with the counter.

[Movieworld]

Why would you say such a thing but not name the game?

[Germany7]

Sure now that's cool to hate the Arkham games, but the combat system it's great and finally we had a great game about a comic book hero.
But anyway, let's pretend that's not true and hate the series, just to be trendy.

[GreetingsfromCanada]

I'm not being trendy, I'm sick of the combat system.

[CorndogBurglar]

Its not about being trendy. I still play the Batman games because i've been a big comic book fan my whole life.

However, i don't care much for this combat system. I would much prefer something more along the lines of Ninja Gaiden 1 and 2. A very technical and in depth system with 3 attack buttons rather than one attack button and a counter button.

Honestly, Batman, Assassin's Creed and Shadow of Mordor's feels pretty mindless in comparison. You just pound the attack button repeatedly and press in the direction of an enemy, then whe you see someone attacking you press triangle to counter them. Its very easy and doesn't take anything more than a pair of eyes and thumbs.

Ninja Gaiden forced you to really think about what you were doing, what combo would be best used at any given time, the skill to pull off those combos (some of which were pretty difficult), using your environment to your advantage, such as running up walls and things like that, all while battling the same amount of enemies that did more types of attacks than the thugs in Batman with their big startups and flashing arrows above their head, just in case you didn't see them getting ready to throw a punch.

Like i said, i play the Batman games and i played Shadow of Mordor, but i won't pretend that their fighting systems were anything great because they werent. Fun? Yes. Challenging? Absolutely not. I'll take fun AND challenging any day.

[comebackkid9891]

@CorndogBurglar
Agreed. Devil May Cry, Ninja Gaiden, and Bayonetta are light years beyond this casualized drivel.

[CorndogBurglar]

Also, why is it so hard to believe that people might actually prefer different fighting system? Its fine if you and others think this free-flow combat system is the end all, be all. But not everyone feels that way. Its expected when you have multiple types of games and gameplay.

Just because someone says they dont like Batman's doesn't mean they are just trying to be trendy. Believe it or not, people have different opinions.

[Volkama]

Worst part of the combat system is that sometimes the enemies have guns and you have to use stealth instead. I much prefer punching thugs over looking for gargoyles I can grapple to.

[Sureshot]

@corndog
I agree, ninja gaiden has incredible combat mechanics. No other game since (the original on xbox og and ps2) has come close to making feel like a bad ass! Fudge now I want a ninja gaiden 4!

[Roccetarius]

I agree with @CorndogBurglar and comebackkid9891. The Arkham combat system pales in comparison to Devil May Cry, Ninja Gaiden and Bayonetta.

Shadows of Mordor made it more passable because of supernatural abilities, but mostly it feels like a sluggish and simple system to use. God of War is also similarily only a stepping stone to better combat systems like the previous games mentioned.

[hkgamer]

it is a crappy system, but the combat systems we had from devs who had no clue what to do had even worse combat. For some reason, japanese devs seems to handle combat systems a lot better but thats probably because I havent played the crappy japanese action games.

[Khajiit86]

Button mash in any Arkham game and you will not get too far. It takes timing, and theres a certain ways you have to take certain people down so you kind of have to know who is attacking you and how to attack or how to defend. Someone has a knife? try to block their slashes like you would someone that doesnt and see how long you last.

[WizzroSupreme]

It's sure a great system and one of the reasons I love their Arkham games as much as I do, at least for me. I'm excited to see how much Arkham Knight polishes it, because even Arkham City's take on it got a bit laggy sometimes.

[WeAreLegion]

As much as I love it, I feel Rise to Honor did it better a generation before Arkham Asylum came out. It was certainly more interactive.

[mrmarvel29]

Rise to honor had a great combat system! Loved that game!

[OhMyGandhi]

totally forgot about that game. wildly underrated.

[Moe-Gunz]

Ah I replied to a comment higher up mentioning Rise to Honor. Yeah this was done before the Batman games and better IMO.

[Daggerjack]

Really don't like this combat at all. Part of the reason i could never get into the arkham series.

[ironfist92]

Lol, they mimicked Assassins Creed first.

[InTheLab]

You need to go back and play AC 1 and 2. The combat is just you standing there waiting to parry. Later AC games adopted the Arkham style.

They did steal eagle vision though.

[Vegamyster]

Never really cared for the combat in the Arkham games, not because its bad though, it's very flashy and smooth but very simplistic/button mashy. I did enjoy Shadow of Mordors more as a whole, the upgrades offered new abilities over just more damage ect plus there was the bow/stealth mechanics.

[Bathyj]

The most overatted part of the Arkham games. I dont understand why people go on about it. I dont enjoy the combat at all. Hit hit counter, rinse repeat. Hit at a character right across the screen and he dances off after him.

Prince of Persia did it way better way earlier.

[hkgamer]

I think the capable devs can make a better combat system easily. but the less capable devs that want a more simple combat mechanic should go arkham style because the low budget action games before were terrible.

[Volkama]

There's really nothing "simple" about it from a dev perspective. Context-sensitive combat that is intuitive to the player and transitions between animations smoothly is probably more complex than a traditional system that directly maps inputs to specific actions.

Maybe it is simple from a player persective, but that certainly doesn't mean "less capable" devs can do it well.

[Meltic]

i really hope that there will be more Epic boss battles in arkham Knight. Arkham origins had Epic boss battles

[Viryu]

When I first saw Batman Arkham Asylum's gameplay, I thought it was a linear Batman themed Assassin's Creed.

[goldwyncq]

The Arkham games wouldn't be what they are without the combat system. Some say it's very simplistic but it works and being simple isn't a bad thing at all. It feels great dispatching a group of thugs without breaking your combo.

[slappy508]

The only unprecedented thing coming from them is the $40 season pass. Pretty soon other companies will follow suit and charge equal or higher for dlc.

[joel01]

It's simple and efficient , it works and feels satisfactory and that's all I care about. Love the free flow combat , can't wait for Arkham Knight.
@viryu Seriously Assasins Creed ? why cause both of them are open world and has combat ? I guess to you then farcry is assasins creed with a first person view , gta is assasins creed with cars..a lots of them and just cause is assasins creed with a parachute.

[Hanso]

wow cant believe what im reading here..
I love the combat system 1 of the main reasons i like the Arkham games so much.

[InTheLab]

I think a lot of you just button mash your way through the Arkham games. Try racking up a 500 hit combo in the challenge room or using all of you take downs and gadgets in a single combo, then tell me how simple it is.

Also, most of you are completely ignoring the stealth innovative just to complain about the "simple" combat.

As for who did it first, some of the games you guys are listing have barely anything in common with the Arkham combat system. You guys are only focusing on moving from one enemy to the next and forgetting about the take downs and gadgets. That is what people are stealing.

If it's just about moving from one dude to the next, The Mark of Kri came out before Prince of Persia TSoT and Rise to honor.

[thricetold]

It's a button masher only if you're the type to mindlessly mash buttons. It is a very simple system to use yet hard as hell to master. There are a number of enemies that you can't just "hit" which means you're not just standing there mashing buttons like a moron.

I'd love to see gameplay from someone who just button mashed the entire game as i know you didn't beat the game because there are enemies who won't let you just hit the same buttons overe and over like some of you are implying.

Funny thing is these same people who hate this combat system thinks skyrim has awesome combat, more than likely