IGN: "Why We Love The Order's Length"

Marty Sliva writes: "The new era of Podcast Beyond begins now. Hosts Max Scoville and Marty Sliva are joined by Brian Altano and Jared Petty. Yes, things get as silly as you expect.

We talk about why we're excited that The Order errs on the short side, how hopeful we are about the Assassin's Creed movie, and offer up our idea for a gritty Gex reboot. Oh, also, we debut a brand-new segment.

Until next week…BEYOND!"

[LOL_WUT]

I haven't listened to the podcast yet but i'm willing to bet once the review process starts they'll find something else to nitpick like that one Pokemon game review... ;)

[Rimeskeem]

I can see it now

7.8

Too much black water

[Kevlar009]

9.9 for best facial hair

-0.1 because 5 seconds too short

[Dee_91]

6.5

My gaming chair smells like farts

-ign

[FarEastOrient]

-0.5 for trailers having preorder at the end.

[tekksin]

@FarEastOrient, ign isn't going - down - the - pooper - game - trailers. They don't let trivial things manage their perspectives like that joke of a bunch do.

Brandon Jones is the only thing on that site worth anything because of his incredibly soothing and articulate voice. ....I enjoy it as much as you think, I guess.

[thereapersson]

How most outlets will review the game:

-1 point for having a cohesive, well thought out story that isn't a massive jumble of ridiculous improbably survivable Hollywood set pieces ala Call of Duty.

-1 point for the developers being confident enough to own up to the fact that the game is meant to be a cinematic storytelling experience first and foremost, utilizing an AAA budget to provide as much polish as a feature-length film.

-1 point for not catering to every single gamer taste under the sun all at once with an open world and not being afraid to create what is effectively a niche gaming experience.

-1 point for lack of an uninspired, generic multiplayer mode that is only tacked on to appease the longevity freaks and is nothing that we haven't seen before, despite lambasting the single player campaign gameplay for being "unoriginal" and calling out for a multiplayer mode to flesh out the game's potential entertainment value.

Final score:

6/10 (being generous because we like the hipster moustache / steampunk aspect and because the graphics are pretty.)

[OB1Biker]

First review already said 'too much cinematic'
I can see the trend on many reviews even though its supposed to be a fundamental of the game

[lociefer]

7.5
- game too linear , we need everything to be open world even if it dosent make sense

-we already downplayed it at previews, we must keep our pride and not give it a fair score

- hard difficulty is hard

- trophies break the immersivness of the game

- i didnt have my morning coffe, so -.5 points

[gamertk421]

My girlfriend touches on length and other pressing issues.

[ion666]

@AndrewLB too funny I pissed myself. So so true

[KiwiViper85]

@AndrewLB

Hilarious, perfectly timed.

[chrismichaels04]

If some people want to speedrun this game in 5 hours...thats on them. I plan on taking my time an actually enjoying everything the campaign has to offer.

[crxss]

what about girth?

[solid_snake3656]

7.0

"Facial hair doesn't blow in the wind"

IGN

[Unspoken]

@AndrewLB

Thank you so much for posting that. That video is so true.

Oh, and length matters.

[DarXyde]

I think it'll be in IGN's "Okay" range, personally.

They gave some interesting reasons, one of which was my big one: I totally get people wanting bang for their buck, but no one is offering to pay more for longer games but complain when a game is too short.

Question is...what is worth $60 in terms of length?

I don't know, but I wanted to post this to try and clear the air of negative vibes coming from the length. I think, while short, it's meant to be a cinematic experience, as indicated by the black bars, soundtrack, production quality, linearity, QTEs, unskippable cutscenes, and yes, tapered length. A good movie knows when to end rather than drag it out.

We don't have to like it or even buy it, but I respect the developer's vision enough to let them do as they do. :0)

[generic-user-name]

Well said.

[Saithraphim]

Well said

[Dramacydal]

Said well.

[_LarZen_]

Bubbles for you good sir!

[morganfell]

"I totally get people wanting bang for their buck"

Can you define bang?

Edit: I agree with your comments but the definition of bang is at the heart of the matter.

[rdgneoz3]

"A good movie knows when to end rather than drag it out."

And that is exactly what the last Alien game was criticized for. It was a great game, but the ending just dragged on and on by several hours.

[DarXyde]

@Morganfell,

By "bang" I mean substance. And by substance, I mean things to do in game. To reiterate, "I totally get people wanting more things to do in game for their money". This is not aimed at The Order: 1886, but it serves as a general statement regarding any game. We all want enough to do in our games to justify the cost. Unless you're pressed for time or have other games to play, the more the better. Not specifically campaign length, but whatever extends the life of a game.

[morganfell]

I do disagree on that because things to do doesn't necessarily translate to bang. Ask anyone that spent time in Assassins Creed collecting feathers. With the movie analogy you are correct and that is what I want. I want to forget I am in a game. I want to be immersed and transported to another place, another time. I want to be thinking about that game for more than 5 minutes when it ends. I want to be invested in the characters and their fate. Bang is different for various people but with the movie analogy it isn't about things to do but about the existence in the place where the expereince takes you.

[360ICE]

I love how the Pokémon review is being held up as a universal example of nitpicking and illegitimate arguments.

People will say things like "Of course there's water and many water Pokémon. It's set in an island region"

Yeah. It being set to an island region is part of the problem then, according to the reviewer.

Never mind that having a Pikachu makes you overpowered through 80% of the game, this game's fictional setting is supposed to have an exact amount of water!

Poor whoever wrote that review.

Anyway, I agree with IGN on this. Journey was short, but worth pretty much all the money I could throw at it.

[Nitrowolf2]

I remember a review for Little Big Planet that one of the cons and markdowns was it had too much content

[360ICE]

@Nitrowolf2
Good thing they added water later on or we'd never see an end to this meme.

[joab777]

This is a great point. Why aren't we clamoring to pay more for games that we play for 1000 hrs. Or even 100 hrs? Should we pay a $1/hr. So 120 for DA and 10 for The Order?

Guess what happens then. Less time is spent in vision and more on time filler.

[_-EDMIX-_]

LMFAO!^ Collectathons!!!! Nintendo would have a field day!

[Visiblemarc]

We can't forget all the criticism this game will receive for not introducing "mindblowing shifts in how we perceive the concept of gameplay itself."

With the exception of a few critic favs, most current gen games are weighed down by the heavy expectation of providing "next gen gameplay." Which, btw, does not exist.

Gameplay has been evolving very slowly for a long time, for a reason, inventing revolutionary new styles is incredibly hard and a major risk.

I don't remember the last time I read a revolutionary game review. Why aren't these hipsters following their own advice and blowing our minds?

[PSN_ZeroOnyx]

The hipsters will make a AAA that has 8-bit graphics and uses no more than 2 buttons the entire game. Consider Mind blown!!!

[Bobby Kotex]

All I know is the game is 2 days away and there are no legit reviews.

[Scatpants]

I think I read reviews are embargoed until Thursday.

[imt558]

I do not consider reviews valid anymore. But this IGN comments smells like 8 for the Order.

[Dhampir]

Bet it gets a 9.5. IGN has a lot of bloodborne exclusives. Four of their staff just quit. Someone is getting paid well.

[lizard81288]

I agree. I shrug off professional reviews now. I'd rather see a review from someone on youtube who isn't getting paid to tell me a game is amazing when it is terrible.

[littlezizu]

RAD did an awesome job with Order. Street date has been broken here in India, it's been available in black market on 16th itself. I'm little more than Half way thru the game and i already clocked 10hours into it. I still can't believe a guy finished this game in 5 hours where as i took 10hours thus far and not completed the game yet.Maybe I'm not that good.
Anyway the Game doesn't have that much QTE's event like in many articles it only was there in beginning after that it was eased out. The game will benefit greatly from photo mode as you want to take pic every time.
Only concern was One button stealth kill, It would have benefit from last of us style stealth kills.

[WeirdShroom]

Good ole IGN. Still got their hands firmly planted in Sony's pants. The defense of this game in light of facts and past behavior of those defending is sickening. 180's everywhere.

[Griever]

Oh yeah! The hate is not sickening but the defense is sickening. :-/ You haters are burning up inside on how the opinions have changed. You people were having so much fun looking forward to having a Sony exclusive flop but now it is ruined with the positive news and defense, right? You are some really sick people. Go have some poisonous shrooms and leave us in peace please.

[JoGam]

So its clear you want this game to fail. Lol. I don't understand you people. Why get mad at the fact that ign didn't say anything negative? I was happy to hear what they said. You Just don't make since to me. Backwards.

[kenshiro100]

You're clearly not a gamer.

Why don't you go troll somewhere else and leave the people who ARE interested in this game alone, eh?

[Muzikguy]

180s and Sony..... You really do have some weird shrooms

[Ninver]

When its all said and done, i will be enjoying the crap outta this game while the naysayers scrumble for the next hate article. Happy gaming to you all! How does it feel to know all your invested time to derail people from buying this interesting game failed? Preorders dont lie.

[Elda]

Absolutely agree!!..my copy is paid for & will be picked up before work Friday...Friday night will be a blast!

[andibandit]

You going to a party after completing it?

[Dyldog69]

I have a ps4 and would not ever own an xboxone unless it was given to me in which case I would try to sell it asap, but I'm not going to defend the order 1886. Whoever executively decided to allocate 1/3 of the games potential to cutscenes needs to go. If a game with no multiplayer is 6 to 8 hours long and 2-3 hours of that is cutscenes that's a mistake, no matter how good the graphics or story are. Simple voice over narrative during actual gameplay would have sufficed for 1/2 of the cutscenes and not detracted from the story. It could have been added to the numerous unnecessary otherwise walking sequences. Duh

[LightDiego]

Because every game needs a multiplayer mode, haters are hilarious, i could name several single-player games only and titles like Bioshock 2 and Dead Space 2, whose multiplayer modes are irrelevant, but for what? It's cool to hate The Order:1886.

[VJGenova]

Bioshock 2 is about a 13 hour game, 15 if you include Minerva's den. How many cut scenes did that game have?

I agree, most games don't need, and really shouldn't focus on multiplayer. I prefer the single player experience to the multiplayer one. Though, I do still enjoy local co-op or a good sports/fighting game.

As far as Dead Space 2 goes, I can't tell you how long that the takes because the game crashes every time I go to launch it ...

[PaleMoonDeath]

Pre-ordered this morning, watching that timer tick away is awesome. Read the French review and got exactly what I hoped for, atmosphere above all much like Silent Hill 2 or REmake.

Not for everyone of course, then again neither was TLOU or Shadow of the Colossus.

[Volkama]

"watching that timer tick away is awesome."

lol.

Seriously, if watching a timer tick away is awesome then actually playing the order is going to blow your mind.

[PaleMoonDeath]

Ain't that the truth, soon!

[alb1899]

The problem isn't the length but what you do in that time.

[Predaking77]

Really funny how the xbox fans, the ones that will not even play the game, are the most worry. They are worry about the length, worry about the quality, worry about the value.

And the irony is that the game is not even on their consoles lol

[Moldiver]

Typical fanboy tosh. Who do you think been doing all the complaining about this games length other than people that have been playing it. Stop trying to pass the buck...this game has been getting ripped by PS fans, not xbox fans.

The delusion of PS fans on this sight ( Im a ps guy but I dont lump myself in with the likes of magicat/dimitri and that master cornhole, guy) has hit an all time high. You should listen to yourselves. everything is one big conspiracy to you guys. SMFH.

[ShadowWolf712]

Site
Sight is vision, site is a website.

Just an FYI.

[Moldiver]

@ShadowWolf712

Minor oversight. didnt even notice till you pointed that out, nor is a mistake I make often. Want a cookie? Feel a bit smarter?

[rawrock]

I disagree, length is just as important as quality in a $60 game. A game that is too short is very disappointing...

[ShadowWolf712]

What determines "too short" though? Provided the game feels satisfying and tells the tale it wants to tell without feeling rushed, is it then too short? How would you then improve on the issue without the game feeling artificially lengthened or unnaturally extended?

These are questions I don't see anyone asking.

[Ashby_JC]

The thing with games in general is that your never going to satisfy the masses.

What I like and you like will differ.

Take BF4 SP...I actually liked it...but thought it ended abruptly I wanted more!! But I then dumped 385 hours into the MP. If the game had been SP only I would have been pissed.

So the ORDER there is never going to be a right answer when it comes to length, SOme going to love what RAD did with the game and others not so much.

Take heavy rain ....I was interested but after playing it ...I decided it wasnt what I was looking for...my friend and his GF loved it. I didnt go online and bash it...just moved on to the next game.

I wish that people who are interested and looking forward to the ORder would realize that anything bad said against the game isnt people being haters. They simply dont like what they have seen, heard or even played.

[ion666]

I thought alien isolation was perfect. and the extras it had were phenomonal. From what I'm hearing and from what I saw. Its a one time event. Thats a no no in my book. If its gonna be short.You'd better pack it with a ton of extras like resident evil 2.

[RevXM]

I agree except that I think the DLC's packs are overpriced. they are all decent and good, but doesnt taste as much as they cost. The nostromo dlc was like 10 minutes.

Main game is pretty amazing in my opinion.

[strickers]

Like Ico? No. Not at all. Some of us are grown up, have disposable income and little time. Quality matters more than perceived value....... Everytime (to me)

[ion666]

I never played ICO but I played the hell out of shadow of colossus. I will wait for the order 1887 when we will see next gen gameplay.

[Inception]

I can smell decent to bad review from IGN. The same could be said for Bloodborne. They praised / hype up specific game and than suddenly gave a decent or even bad review before the game release. It's their trick to gain hits and i don't know why some people still believe / waiting their reviews.

[ENSABAHNUR]

Too many idiots here on N4G ( other sites as well ) some of these people cried about alien iso's length being too long, now it's the order's too short ( without playing it even )... You can't make morons like these happy... Funny how it's always been don't knock the game until you've played it but now a days, games get instant hate months before release... When did this standard change??? I swear common sense has died in the gaming community...

[kenshiro100]

Common sense really has died. People no longer judge games for themselves. They rely on biased media to tell them how to spend their money.

[BlackTar187]

Amen,

People are so full of hate it's sad to come to site on the internet anymore. Everyone has nothing better to do then bash something they haven't even played. Some had no intention of playing.

people who hate are just posinious to themselves and everyone around them.

[ShadowWolf712]

"Why We Love The Order's Length"

You're practically begging for dirty jokes at that point.

[Artemidorus]

Wonder how much IGN got paid for making such a stupid statement. They are not to be trusted.

[Big_Game_Hunters]

look at IGN nothing but the order adds

[EvilWay]

Because Sony paid you to say it.

Somethings need to be stated. Sony and Readt at Dawn are not letting people release reviews until after launch because of all the negative press already. The game is short Idc if he guys walkthrough was a speed run, maybe add a hour to that time. 6 hours is ridiculous from any linear game this generation because they have so much more to work with. I would honestly rather devs lower the graphics quality a bit and give us a more immerse experience. It seems they are focusing heavily on graphics and not so much on the game itself (which is why games are being released broken)

I think a linear game should be atleast 12 hours. My problem with The Order is the same I have with MGS I don't feel like I am getting my money's worth because I am watching more than I am playing. Cutscenes are fine but when they are your focal point that is a problem to me. There is other ways to tell a story through gameplay and character dialogue instead of 30 minute cutscenes

[DarXyde]

A few things...

First, one outlet saying they like something that's come under scrutiny doesn't mean they're paid off. Could they be? Maybe, but that's very presumptuous of you.

Second, a review was released already. It's literally on the front page.

Third, a game's length can be augmented by this generation's hardware, but that all depends where your resources go. Fighting games are easy to clear and always have been, some RPGs have gotten shorter with each generation. Has a game like Sunset Overdrive or infamous gotten longer this generation? Not at all.

Fourth, don't be a length nazi and start handing down acceptable length parameters. I am not the golden goose of opinions, and neither are you, but we can always vote with our wallets. If you don't like it, don't buy it. You can have an opinion on it, but to say what's acceptable is silly.

Fifth, Metal Gear solid had a rather impressive following, myself being one of the very passionate fans. People enjoy the way the games are done for a reason. I can understand you not being able to get into them, but you're tampering with developer vision here. At the very least, V has much shorter cinematics.

[Batnut00]

Review Embargo is being lifted on THURSDAY, not Friday when the game releases. That's plenty of time for people to read the reviews and cancel preorders if they don't like what they see.

[hammix]

Simply awesome game

[Ryan741]

Marty Silva is a strange dude, he completely derails conversations with complete nonsense that makes no sense. He is not even remotely funny, I actually think he perhaps has some form of autism and that is perhaps why nobody pulls him up on the strange nonsensical interruptions.

[Jozinho]

is the Order worth 60$

For me, 60 bucks on 6 hours or more of entertainment is well worth it. Why ? If i go to the movies with my wife and get some popcorn and watch a 2 hour movie. it will cost me around 50 bucks. Lets say I want to watch it again i need to buy the DVD or wait for it on Netflix. So all together that 2 hour movie will equal roughly 60 bucks.

Here is a game that its trying something new and has nothing to hide. The Dev have been honest from the beginning. Its a new IP and for anybody that loves games should at least appreciate that. Its not a recycled game. Its something new. Something different. Something a lot of casual gamers are not familiar with. I'm not saying this is for the hardcore gamers but for the last couple years all we saw is a bunch of recycles and little improvements to none. So Yes I'm excited and yes I will throw 60 bucks to support it. I will also support the devs that try something new.

Anyway, if you can't afford the game or you feel your not getting your moneys worth. You should have no reason to bash it. Its not like you bought the game and then found it there is no MP or it is short. I'm buying it to support the new IP and the devs. Also, excited for the story and setting.

I miss the PS2 days when every game was a new IP. Plus, we weren't surrounded by a bunch of cry babies and fan boys.

[Vanfernal]

Why are people so obsessed with the length? It's not the size of the boat! It's the motion in the ocean! XD

[BlackTar187]

Because it's all they have. Seriously some fans have nothing to play on the system they bought for like 6-7 months so they naturally gravitate towards hating on something to supplement the pathetic life they live outside of plastic worship

[JoeMcCallister]

There were some great arguments on here and I was surprised that I liked Altano's points as much as I did, in particular that we never call for a game to be more expensive if it's 200+ hours but only when it feels like it should be cheaper.

I was concerned about Beyond in particular as a podcast but had faith in Scoville. Good to see they're having some solid discussion on the first episode in a post-Miller/Moriarty world.

[James Vanderbeek]

graphics look too real 6.5

[kenwonobi]

Well that is a very good time to play a game not trying to look for anything, not dying, and skipping everything possible. I hold the record for beating Resident Evil 2 in 45 minutes unofficially. I didnt have youtube back then to post it online. So its a pretty good time. You could take your time to beat Resident evil games and Gears of War games and spend hours longer. You could rush through like me and beat in a just a few short hours. So to me 5 hours rushing along is fantastic.

[kenwonobi]

I meant Resident Evil part 1. Part 2 took at least a 1 hour and a half and never got to best the world record but got close.

[RpgSama]

With RE2 you could do the argument of having the 2 characters and Story A and Story B depending on which one you started first, but each individial story it was a very doable 2 or 3 hours playtrough, and that's the best Resident Evil ever, hands down (For Me).

With the 3rd you had a little more "replay value" with mercenaries (didn't interested me in the least), but the game was also a very quick speed run.

[RpgSama]

One of the best gaming experiences of my Life is playing ICO for Ps2 (also have the game for ps3), I paid 60$ for that game, a game you can absolutely finnish in under 3 hours (there is even a trophy for doing that on the ps3 version), So a 6 to 10 hours full priced game is not a problem for me (I guess you could even do 12 for the platinum).

You could make the same argument for the Original Resident Evil, you can totally speed run it in under 3 hours (also a trophy on the Ps3/Ps4 version), a game I bought full price in the ps1 era, and like these two there are countless others.

Vote with your wallet people, I didn't buy Evolve because of all the DLC and microtransactions pay walls, but I will buy The Order.

[AutoCad]

Well he is the head of PS Beyond now..

[NixonMonoxide]

Wait hang on, IGN is "credible" now right?

Especially if they say something you agree with.
A load of bollocks, but still a load of bollocks you agree with.

Cool story though. I'll stick with other sources if you don't mind.

[KnownAsEpic]

Gtfo

[u4one]

i don't really care about the length (within reason) as long as its fun. i know its going to look amazing but if i'm just sitting there watching game cinematics that tie into QTEs and then I'm not going to have that much fun. if its got some of that but lots of nice cover style shooting, exploring, puzzles etc - even if its like gears of war - then its probably going to be great..

i'm hoping reviews start cropping up soon to get a better, honest picture if its worth it or not.

[S2Killinit]

Hope they are not saying this just so that they can bash the game later and claim that it was objective. Whether true or not, I find IGN to be biased against Playstation, as much as I wish they would be an objective unbiased source, they are not. Unfortunately. they are however, very good at hiding the bias. For example, they will sandwich their very damaging report by two not so helpful but friendly reports. In other words, they will strike when it really hurts, (ex. before release as opposed to their more friendly reports months after release when the sales have already suffered). I hope that they stay objective, I hope that they do the right thing and take politics out of their reviews, but I am not hopeful that they will. Just my 2 cents. (I'm sure some would disagree, which is fine)

[Scatpants]

That's not the only "length" they love if you know what I mean... I'm talking about dicks.

[Doritos_Pope]

IGN review

7/10 Didnt give us advertising.

[joeorc]

1886 as a franchise before entering the multiplayer realm.

“We’re opening this one window into The Order, which is 1886, with this IP. At its core we knew we wanted to make a third-person action-adventure game, and then it was answering those questions like, ‘well, if we do that, should there be multiplayer?’ We talked about it but here’s the tricky part. When you don’t have something set in people’s minds as a new IP on your first game, it’s difficult to convince people this world exists in multiplayer. We’d love to do it and we want to do it but it’s not what we’re doing right now. Right now it’s about doing something that opened this world up.

its building of a franchise..just like Uncharted was!

[IWentBrokeForGaming]

I've been in this exact boat since I knew what I did of the game... Bioshock 2 is the stain on that franchise and that had Online... Online DONT make games better at all

[Ch1d0r1]

Good to see Max Scoville @ IGN he was awesome @ Destructoid