Oddworld Dev: PS4 Is A "High End PC" With "Extra", Allows Developer Access to Entire Hardware

CEO of Just Add Water and Oddworld Inhabitants development director Stewart Gilray shares his thoughts about the PS4.

[kataloni10]

with all respect to PS4 but its not a High End PC

[Xsilver]

sooooooo you develop for it good to know

[ShinMaster]

Exactly. Even when it comes from multiple developers' mouth.

Out of the millions of PCs, only a small percentage are "high-end". Most gamers on Steam have integrated graphics.

PS4 will outperform 90% PCs out there and @ $399.

[Maximus Corruptor]

@kataloni10 So Stewart is lying? Why would he lie? I'm sorry you have more dev experience than him on the PS4 or gaming in general so you proved otherwise.

[PSN-JeRzYzFyNeSt]

why all the hate? I'm sureee the Devs know what they are talking about...

[jessupj]

Well I'm no expect, but more than 1 dev has said that even though the spec are weaker than a high end PC, because of the standard platform that built purely for gaming (plus apps) the Ps4 can be optimized to run comparable to a high end PC.

[B-radical]

Don't speak the truth on this site!

[zeal0us]

I think when developers say this they are not referring to specs but rather what they can do with it.

[ABizzel1]

A think a better saying among devs. is the PS4 aims for High End PC's, because the PS4 just doesn't have the Raw power to be considered a High-End PC.

The CPU is completely outclassed by an FX 8350
The GPU is completely outclassed by an HD 7970 GHZ

The PS4's one advantage is having 8GB of GDDR5, but that's slowly shrinking with GPU's using 6GB @ 288 GB/s (Titan), and 4GB @ 304 GB/s (9970).

High-end PC's are also capable of playing current-gen PC games in 4k, something the PS4 won't be able to do.

The games shown thus far are launch titles, and so they don't do the consoles complete justice and in 1 - 2 years the PS4 may very well be capable of releasing games with near high-end PC levels of performance, the problem is by then High-end gaming will be on another level with UHD GPU's hitting shelves.

The PS4 is a solid console, that will hold it's mid-range title for a good 2 - 3 years thanks to console overheads, but high-end it is not (well at least not compared to desktops, but compared to laptops then yes it's high end).

[ShinMaster]

More people will own PS4s than Titan GPUs.

PS4 will outperform 90% PCs out there. Out of the millions of PCs, only a small percentage are "high-end".

[starchild]

You're just pulling that 90% figure out of your @ss. If you are talking about every PC out there that can play games at all, then yeah, that's probably right.

But the people we would normally call PC gamers...the kind of people that frequent game sites...certainly have much higher spec machines.

[nunley33]

starchild first says shinmaster was making up facts then agree's with him lol. because of optimised hardware,graphics can be comparable.

[ABizzel1]

@SHinMaster

PS4 is a console that uses the same hardware for 5+ years.

PC hardware improves EVERY year. Usually every 2 years high-end cards drop to mid-range, mid-range drop to low, and low are the new APU's (and year 3 is when the jump takes place)

In the case of the PS4 pound for pound it's a Mid range gaming PC when compared to the HD 7000 series GPU's (as it's a 7000 series mobile GPU). The HD 9000 series launches this year with the top GPU 9970 rumored to be more powerful than a GTX Titan.

So you have the PS4 1.84 TFLOPS (2014) compared to a HD 9970 8.2 (2014) which has nearly 4.5x more TFLOPS than the PS4. That basically means multiplats will run on the PS4 in 1080p @ 30 - 60fps, while the 9970 will run them in 4k @ 30 - 60fps with better graphic quality than the PS4.

Then in 2015 the jump will take place as AMD moves to UHD 1000 cards where even low-end GPU's will be running games in at least 2k @ 30fps, while the high end will be pushing 4k @ 60fps.

No matter how much you 25 people want to disagree this is just the cycle of gaming.

@ShinMaster

No everyone won't have a Titan, but you're foolishly speaking as if PC gamers are stuck with Titan for the next 5+ years. Titan is being rivaled by the GTX 780 and likely surpassed by the HD 9970 both of which will be $600 cards by the end of the year all of which are 4x more powerful than the PS4. PC gamers only need to upgrade their GPU this gen and maybe RAM or SSD.

It's not a knock against the PS4 it's just being real, and not having bias, or fanboy goggles on. A $400 console is not going to outperform a $1,000+ PC. PS4 games will look great and acceptable, but they won't rival a high-end PC PERIOD.

Devs, are hyping up their games simple as that.

[xKugo]

Do they even have 4k monitors available because the highest I've seen is 1440p.

[ABizzel1]

@xKugo

you need a new monitor then, there's 1080p, 2k, and 4k monitors. 8k are in the works.

1080
http://www.amazon.com/VS228...

2k
http://www.amazon.com/PB278...

4k
http://www.amazon.com/ASUS-...

[ShinMaster]

@starchild

The most popular GPU on Steam is integrated.

[vigilante_man]

You will not find a PC as powerful as the PS4 (& DS4) with optimised gaming inputs (mouse/keyboard) for the same price. Or anywhere near.

It is purpose built for gaming with a gaming OS.

A toaster is a toaster, A PS4 is a gaming consle, as is a XB1 and a PC is a multi-purpose computing device with thrown together parts and multi-purpose OS.

Do not compare apples with oranges.

[addictgamer]

Everyone knows it's the pixie dust and rainbow glitter that makes the ps4 a dedicated gaming machine and the lack of it that relegates the PC to being a multipurpose computing device.

[user7402931]

what games have you made to state that? do you know how they customized the system? were you there? its like a regular guy discrediting a nasa engineer and not providing scientific evidence.

[blackmagic]

His statement is correct if you are looking at the whole world of PCs. There are literally hundreds of millions of computers actively being used in the world and PS4 will likely outperform 90% of them which would qualify for calling it a high end system.

However, the definition of a high end pc is completely different for an enthusiast. For an enthusiast, the bare bones, budget, entry level pc would outperform 85% of the PCs being used in the world.

[Aceman18]

I didn't think this statement would go over well with some people Lol.

[nunley33]

well @golding89 is an honest troll, i respect that. and i like seeing the reactions too. many devs have said this so lets wait till after its out then the graphics comparisons will ensue.

[Xsilver]

PC gamer shitstorm incoming

[Fishy Fingers]

Oh here we go, the same tired old chest beating comments, my platforms better than your platform! Yeah and my dad could beat up your dad!!

[Neixus]

My dad beats your dad

[SpinalRemains138]

My dad is a dwarf.

[tuglu_pati]

@SpinalRemains138

Tyrion Lannister?

[xKugo]

My fav character!!

[Majin-vegeta]

I agree xD.

http://youtu.be/AF-L8RLBo-w

[windblowsagain]

Because your experts and you know the PS4 hardware Inside and out.

It’s a high-end PC with extras, by that I mean the DDR5 RAM, the fact it doesn’t have an OS such as Windows on it taking up MUCH of the system resources, leaving us developers access to pretty much the entire hardware, meaning we can do more at with better performance than an equivalent PC spec.”

[Pain_Killer]

Go read something about the difference between GDDR5 and DDR5 then come back to replying me.

As for no bulky OS of PlayStation 4, tell me why won't Sony officially share the amount of memory reserved for the system and graphics lead? This is an official response from them:

We have no comment to make on the amount of memory reserved by the system or what it is used for.

Why can't they comment, first the pump tell people that the memory is primary used for gaming on the other hand they get a hard time claiming if the whole memory is exclusive for game or OS. Promised 8 GB for gamers but can't even confirm what amount they officially give out to developers.

[xKugo]

DDR5 doesn't exist idiot as DDR4 was just released this January. Do you even know what GDDR5 stands for? I'm assuming not...

[Pain_Killer]

@xKugo, you are such a fucking retard. That reply was directed towards windblowsagain and 90$ of the consoles boys who think they are getting DDR5 ram on the PS4.

You think im not aware of the fact that DDR4 isnt even available to consumers at the moment? You think i don't know DDR5 is a 2017 part.

DDR5 won't be available to anyone until 2017 when mass produced by Samsung and TSMC. GDDR5 (Graphics Dual Data Rate x5) has been available on PCs since 2008, Consoles got it now since it has become the standard memory while hardare makers such as NVIDIA an AMD are moving towards the next step. Stacked Memory, HUMA, Cross-Link are the future.

[Coach_McGuirk]

don't fall for the hype

[ZHZ90]

Intersting.

[fsfsxii]

According to the developers of N4G its a mid to very low pc
This guy is lying. End of story

[iamgoatman]

No one is calling it very low-end, but I'd say high end refers to a minimum of a 7970ghz/GTX770 all the way up to duel-GPU set-ups, and if you think it can compete with such systems in terms of power you're delusional. Going with 'oh but the devs say it's this' when they're trying to sell you the system is stupid.

[fsfsxii]

Sorry but i'm not into tech bullshit.

[fsfsxii]

Forgot the /s
I guess people don't realize you're joking unless you label it as a joke

[ramtah]

okei can we stop thsi shitt we know ps4 is good but high end pc coem on .. first comes the pc everyone has one, then the ps4 which is more powerfull then the xfail 1 so stop it ..

[christrules0041]

There is 3 things to consider with this article.

1) Developers don't make games for high end PCs because not everybody who games on PC has a high end PC. To make that level of detail the development costs go up while the number of people who can buy the game goes down. They don't make games specifically for high end PCs because it would simply make there studio go into bankruptcy.

2) It's a striped down operating system on consoles so developers have access to more of the consoles RAM then PCs. A high end PC is good if you run multiple tabs while playing a game and getting a better frame rate.

3)Since every console is the same they can optimize for it and squeeze every inche of power out of it. You can look at games like Call of Juerez Gunslinger or Tomb Raider.

[starchild]

It's funny you mention Tomb Raider because that game has so many extra graphical features and higher quality assets on PC than on consoles that it looks vastly better on PC.

Being able to run better looking games at a better frame rate and with better image quality is what the extra power of PCs allows for. You act like the extra power just goes to waste, but that really isn't true.

Multiplatform games are so much better on PC, especially multiplatform games that have more advanced core graphical elements on PC like Tomb Raider, Far Cry 3, Metro 2033, Metro Last Light, Crysis 2, Crysis 3, Bioshock Infinite, The Witcher 2, Deus Ex Human Revolution, Sleeping Dogs, Splinter Cell Blacklist, Max Payne, Battlefield 3, Assassin's Creed 3, etc.

Games like that really look significantly better on PC than on consoles and on top of those better core graphics we also can run those games at much higher frame rates and display resolutions, with better anti-aliasing and texture filtering, than on consoles.

So, no, the power in PCs does not go to waste, and developers are making more advanced versions of many games to take advantage of the extra power afforded by gaming PCs.

[christrules0041]

Wow stupid comment.
Read this again, "3)Since every console is the same they can optimize for it and squeeze every inche of power out of it. You can look at games like Call of Juerez Gunslinger or Tomb Raider."

I picked out Tomb Raider because it does look good on consoles. Did I say there aren't any graphical improvements on the PC version? No. Or did I say that because of every console being the same they can optimize it. My point was Tomb Raider wouldn't even be on consoles if they were all different like PCs are.

That is the point of a console to optimize it to squeeze out every spec of power. You would have one crappy Tomb Raider on a PC the same as the PS3/360 is power wise. Plus add on the OS which takes up a lot of the memory so take some of the weapons out of the game plus some of the features. Worse AI and the crap load because of the OS. So what they lost a couple of graphical differences. But honestly only graphic whores really cares about that.

People on consoles buy the game and I've talked to many people who love the game but they don't know that the PC version is graphically better. Why? Because they don't care they like having a console where they don't have to know about the specs. You put the game disc in and play it. Only thing is HDD space that they have to know about.

It's stupid how everyone always turns everything into a PC VS console war when I didn't even mention it unless you bent the three of my points together.

[nunley33]

your pc vs ps3/360 graphics comparison isn't valid when it's PS4/XB1 that is being discussed. a tomb raider port on PS4 or even XB1 would be comparable to PC.

[windblowsagain]

That was my point.

"'meaning we can do more at with better performance than an equivalent PC spec.”

Meaning it can more then a 580gtx graphically.

You'll see this at gamescon.

Obviously it's not got to run at any higher then 1080p.

[MasterCornholio]

I know that some PC gamers brag about 4k resolutions but even the best GPUs on the market cant handle Crysis 3 at 4k resolution at a steady 30FPS. In my opinion 1080P is more than enough for consoles.

[Pain_Killer]

Back in the days, it was a hard time keeping up at 1080P with 8800GTX GPUs. Guess what? PC got Fermi/Kepler/GCN, etc.

Any mid-range GPU on the market currently can easily cope 1080P, i bet in a year's time when 4K monitors become cheaper and GPUs based on Maxwell and Volcanic Islands architecture arrive, 4K on the PC end would easily be made possible.

Plus, you are putting Crysis 3 in the equation. You must know that Crysis 3 along with Metro:LL are the most highest visual boasting games ever released? They were sacrificed visually down to toes just to get them to run on current Gen consoles. Obviously you would have seen the level of visuals they have to offer at 1080P or 1440P that is doable with modern graphic cards.

There are tons of other games that can easily be ran on 4K monitors. Tomb Raider, Bioshock Infinite, etc.

[SillyYou]

PS4 is better than every Gaming PC currently on the market.

-Period.

[golding89]

http://www.reactiongifs.com... lmao

[Drainage]

pc gamers cant play GTA5 when it release on consoles.

[SkullBlade169]

.... so?

[Sadist3]

It's obviously not going to make KillZone run any faster than 30FPS either. That's very high end PC like

[MrReeves]

Cant wait for my xbox

[Majin-vegeta]

Yea me either since it's the next water cooler i'm gonna set my PS4 on top of it to keep it from overheating xD.

OT:I just want my PS4 already.

[sarcastoid]

Oh PC gamers... can't see the forest for the trees.

[windblowsagain]

NO. Can't see the Crysis for the trees.

[gameseveryday]

We need to understand that with the proper optimization and excellent coding/programming techniques one can really harness the potential of consoles. Look what developers did with a mere 512 MB on the PS3.

[Coach_McGuirk]

we also need to understand that years and years of optimization won't trump raw power.

[Sevir]

I love it when people talk as if Consoles are just PCs... Seriously... They are 2 different platforms. Consoles are not used for word processing, excel spreadsheet and PowerPoint presentation and music editing and everything else a PC expense memory for while running an OS that eats ram.. PCs have 2 sets of Ram.

In performance and in terms of a streamlined OS and Design process, consoles especially now keep up with PCs, the PS4 and to some degree the X1 by virtue of not having to deal with anything but gaming can maximize the gpu and CPU in tandem with it's memory to keep up with pc games...

They aren't the sum of there parts. They didn't just take PC motherboards, CPUs, GPUs and Ram and just ship it. It's been coustomized specifically for gaming without the concession a general pc will make.

A general purpose PC with jaguar cores 4 gigs of DDR3 and an XB1 GPU and 4 gig or even 6gb of GDDR5 wouldn't be able to run a
The best Xbox One title at max setting... It'll choke...

So lets not pretend we know what developing on machines that only are made to extract the best for gaming and multimedia verses running everything under the sun...

And Once again, Resolutions don't make games next gen, It's Graphics, Gameplay innovations and advance in physics, and immersion, and it doesn't matter if it Runs at 4k resolution and 120 frames per second or locked 30 fps... Games like crysis melts faces on PC but nothing else and isn't Next generation by any means. So lets not kid ourselves...

[Pain_Killer]

And i love it when some console fan boy turns up like he knows everything about a PC and its architecture.

PC users have option to put anything they want on the OS. A gamers PC doesn't has half the apps you mentioned, it has either Steam or Origin. A PS/Xbox has their own online service which remains active almost every time when you play either offline or online.

PC has two sets of ram, one for the system and the other for graphics. Consoles doesn't, why? Sony nor Microsoft can use a discrete GPU solution with its own memory, its expensive for them. Hence they move to a cheaper and single memory pool that's linked to both CPU and GPU. PC already has enough memory to handle every single app tasked by the OS. Memory on the other hand has reached 2 GB to 4 GB GDDR5, while system memory accounts for 8 GB on any average house hold PC.

And customized is an absolutely wrong word, its been cheapened to an extent that allows manufacturer's (Sony/MS) to mass produce it with minimum losses. Half of the memory is reserved for the OS on the PS4, why won't Sony just officially debunk the rumor and tell that the complete 8 GB memory is available to developers? Because it simply doesn't have that much memory free, the OS is hoggy, Sony has been lying and im not saying this is only restricted to PS4, Xbox One has limited memory too.

You think the 15 min video recording is being offloaded to virtually nothing? You think that the online services (Friends/Achievements) aren't being offloaded to anything? You think the multiplayer components aren't being offloaded to anything? There
s a limited amount of memory which would hurt both consoles in the future, PC on the other hand is upgradable as a user prefers.

If 4K and 120 Hz/ 120 FPS is not considered next gen and story/gameplay plays such a vital role, then why the braging by PS4 fans and Xbox One fans that RYSE or Shadow Fall are such a killer in graphics department? Tell me one good reason the Killzone demo at E3 looked any better compared to COD in any department? The generic action gameplay? Oh what a joy.

As for the so called general purpose PC, you realzie that Kabini/Temash (based on Jaguar) are powering low power tablet and netbooks? It isn't even a proper desktop replacement chip, It isn't the 8 core Jaguar that's showing miracle on the consoles, its the GCN based Radeon chip which is the only thing that can keep the consoles up to a low-level PC.

And regarding the APU, if you think they are not on level with upcoming consoles. Kaveri APU is coming, it will cost sub $150 and it will not be based on a low power Jaguar core but a full x86 Steamroller core architecture and a Volcanic Islands Radeon iGP. Its the closest thing in terms or design close to a console but its much more powerful.

On the other hand, you say stuff like innovation, physics and immersion are what games better. PC has been doing that since the day it came to being. PhysX/OpenCL/Cuda/AVX/3DVision /Eyefinity/VirtualReality, all begins from the PC.

And what did the console do so awesome in the last 5 years? Oh yes i remember, Kinect/Wii/Move.. What a success in terms of technology and immersion.

[Melankolis]

High End PC or not, i don't care i want a system good enough for affordable price and games! yeah games!

I don't know how many PC fanboys seem cynical -cmiiw- about consoles. Are they just jealous that so many AAA games released exclusively on consoles?

I personally want to buy high end PC (not that high actually), but not for playing PC games, but playing emulators, playing Xenoblade and Dragon Quest VIII in HD is still in my dream.....

[Coach_McGuirk]

If these articles weren't titled "PS4 is a high-end PC" then we wouldn't have to come in here and set things straight.

[Melankolis]

“........, the fact it doesn’t have an OS such as Windows on it taking up MUCH of the system resources, leaving us developers access to pretty much the entire hardware, meaning we can do more at with better performance than an equivalent PC spec.”

Uhmm, don't blame the article, the dev said that, it's just an opinion. I take it that he meant is the CONVENIENCE in developing game for PS4 is a "high-end PC standard"

[SkullBlade169]

If you want affordable, go buy a Wii or an Ouya...

[starchild]

Exactly. You pay more to get more.

If price is so damn important then we should all be buying the Wii U since it's the cheapest console.

It is a very poor argument. These guys choose to get a PS4 over a Wii U even though it costs more simply because they think it is better. Well, I will pay more to get a PC (if I didn't already have one) because I think it is better.

A good gaming PC costs more than a console up front, but the cost of gaming on a PC over the long run is a lot cheaper than gaming on a console due to the cheaper games and not having to pay $50 or $60 a month to game online.

[SkullBlade169]

@starchild

I agree, I have a decent PC (Not highest end though) i5 2500k OC, GTX680, 12GB RAM

I don't mind paying a little hardware premium to get a more powerful system with better graphics and smoother running games, the argument we use for buying a PC instead of a console is the exact same as their reasoning for getting a PS4 over the Wii-U, in our eyes, it's better.

Besides the "consoles are cheaper" is overrated anyway, games are generally more expensive for consoles and you need to pay to play any game online, and there's the inevitable hardware failure. There is probably no or little difference in cost in the long term anyhow.

[sorane]

Yet all these "next gen" games look better on PCs out today. If they were truly high end they'd at least look "as good" but as we've already seen with the likes of Watchdogs, the new COD, the elemental demo etc they just can't seem to get the same graphics level.

[AD705]

Yet it can't even run killzone at 60 fps?

[Pain_Killer]

and Battlefield 4 in 720P, so much for next gen!

[MadLad]

Pretty much.
Very high-end there.